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BS: What Do Women Want???...

Bobert 30 Jul 04 - 11:16 PM
MAG 30 Jul 04 - 11:40 PM
Big Mick 30 Jul 04 - 11:44 PM
Peace 30 Jul 04 - 11:57 PM
GUEST,frustrated woman 31 Jul 04 - 12:59 AM
CarolC 31 Jul 04 - 01:04 AM
mg 31 Jul 04 - 01:38 AM
Blackcatter 31 Jul 04 - 02:01 AM
Nerd 31 Jul 04 - 02:28 AM
The Fooles Troupe 31 Jul 04 - 02:53 AM
The Fooles Troupe 31 Jul 04 - 02:58 AM
Georgiansilver 31 Jul 04 - 03:59 AM
Dave Hanson 31 Jul 04 - 04:17 AM
C-flat 31 Jul 04 - 05:05 AM
Bobert 31 Jul 04 - 08:54 AM
SINSULL 31 Jul 04 - 10:15 AM
Dave Hanson 31 Jul 04 - 10:35 AM
MAG 31 Jul 04 - 10:50 AM
Liz the Squeak 31 Jul 04 - 10:52 AM
Little Hawk 31 Jul 04 - 12:06 PM
Bill D 31 Jul 04 - 12:06 PM
kendall 31 Jul 04 - 12:12 PM
GUEST 31 Jul 04 - 12:27 PM
GUEST,first things first 31 Jul 04 - 12:40 PM
CarolC 31 Jul 04 - 12:45 PM
Little Hawk 31 Jul 04 - 01:05 PM
GUEST,pedeecee 31 Jul 04 - 01:31 PM
GUEST,SueB 31 Jul 04 - 01:52 PM
Nerd 31 Jul 04 - 02:49 PM
Nerd 31 Jul 04 - 02:58 PM
Deda 31 Jul 04 - 03:38 PM
GUEST,peedeecee 31 Jul 04 - 03:49 PM
GUEST,Kendall 31 Jul 04 - 04:22 PM
Amos 31 Jul 04 - 04:41 PM
freightdawg 31 Jul 04 - 05:47 PM
Deckman 31 Jul 04 - 06:09 PM
GUEST,peedeecee 31 Jul 04 - 06:09 PM
jacqui.c 31 Jul 04 - 06:56 PM
katlaughing 01 Aug 04 - 10:23 AM
Georgiansilver 01 Aug 04 - 10:36 AM
jacqui.c 01 Aug 04 - 10:44 AM
Georgiansilver 01 Aug 04 - 11:21 AM
freda underhill 01 Aug 04 - 12:31 PM
Bobert 01 Aug 04 - 05:32 PM
GUEST,casual observer 01 Aug 04 - 05:48 PM
mg 01 Aug 04 - 08:32 PM
Amergin 01 Aug 04 - 09:34 PM
GUEST,William Shatner 01 Aug 04 - 09:54 PM
Bobert 01 Aug 04 - 11:03 PM
GUEST,William Shatner 02 Aug 04 - 12:01 AM
Ellenpoly 02 Aug 04 - 05:33 AM
Liz the Squeak 02 Aug 04 - 05:45 AM
Pied Piper 02 Aug 04 - 06:29 AM
el ted 02 Aug 04 - 06:38 AM
kendall 02 Aug 04 - 08:27 AM
SINSULL 02 Aug 04 - 09:11 AM
SINSULL 02 Aug 04 - 09:16 AM
Ellenpoly 02 Aug 04 - 09:19 AM
Amos 02 Aug 04 - 10:05 AM
Kim C 02 Aug 04 - 10:24 AM
SINSULL 02 Aug 04 - 11:02 AM
kendall 02 Aug 04 - 11:08 AM
Nerd 02 Aug 04 - 01:26 PM
Kim C 02 Aug 04 - 01:43 PM
GUEST,weerover 02 Aug 04 - 02:03 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 02:06 PM
Kim C 02 Aug 04 - 03:05 PM
MAG 02 Aug 04 - 03:07 PM
GUEST,weerover 02 Aug 04 - 03:34 PM
GUEST 02 Aug 04 - 03:42 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 04:04 PM
Georgiansilver 02 Aug 04 - 04:18 PM
Nerd 02 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM
InOBU 02 Aug 04 - 04:27 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 04:29 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 04:33 PM
GUEST,shy guy 02 Aug 04 - 04:37 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 04:43 PM
mg 02 Aug 04 - 04:48 PM
GUEST,shy guy 02 Aug 04 - 04:52 PM
Georgiansilver 02 Aug 04 - 05:06 PM
GUEST,TTCM 02 Aug 04 - 05:16 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 05:27 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 05:37 PM
MAG 02 Aug 04 - 05:57 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 06:04 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 06:08 PM
MAG 02 Aug 04 - 06:13 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 06:20 PM
kendall 02 Aug 04 - 07:19 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 07:25 PM
Pogo 02 Aug 04 - 07:35 PM
TheBigPinkLad 02 Aug 04 - 07:40 PM
GUEST 02 Aug 04 - 07:41 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 07:43 PM
Amos 02 Aug 04 - 07:57 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 08:51 PM
The Fooles Troupe 02 Aug 04 - 09:15 PM
Amos 02 Aug 04 - 09:16 PM
Peace 02 Aug 04 - 09:25 PM
Bobert 02 Aug 04 - 09:30 PM
Little Hawk 02 Aug 04 - 10:54 PM
Kaleea 03 Aug 04 - 12:08 AM
The Fooles Troupe 03 Aug 04 - 02:21 AM
GUEST,Ellenpoly 03 Aug 04 - 10:49 AM
GUEST 03 Aug 04 - 11:26 AM
CarolC 03 Aug 04 - 01:53 PM
GUEST,weerover 03 Aug 04 - 02:04 PM
Bobert 03 Aug 04 - 03:19 PM
GUEST,TTCM 03 Aug 04 - 03:40 PM
GUEST,weerover 03 Aug 04 - 03:45 PM
mg 03 Aug 04 - 03:49 PM
GUEST,SueB 03 Aug 04 - 10:08 PM
Bobert 03 Aug 04 - 10:15 PM
Cluin 03 Aug 04 - 11:29 PM
Bobert 03 Aug 04 - 11:32 PM
GUEST 04 Aug 04 - 12:42 AM
GUEST,peedeecee 04 Aug 04 - 01:05 AM
jacqui.c 04 Aug 04 - 01:50 AM
GUEST,SueB 04 Aug 04 - 02:38 AM
Cluin 04 Aug 04 - 03:14 AM
Georgiansilver 04 Aug 04 - 03:54 AM
Kim C 04 Aug 04 - 10:34 AM
mg 04 Aug 04 - 12:23 PM
CarolC 04 Aug 04 - 12:46 PM
Georgiansilver 04 Aug 04 - 01:28 PM
Nerd 04 Aug 04 - 01:39 PM
Liz the Squeak 04 Aug 04 - 01:47 PM
TheBigPinkLad 04 Aug 04 - 02:07 PM
kendall 04 Aug 04 - 02:37 PM
Kim C 04 Aug 04 - 02:46 PM
SINSULL 04 Aug 04 - 03:21 PM
Blackcatter 04 Aug 04 - 04:10 PM
Liz the Squeak 04 Aug 04 - 06:20 PM
Cluin 04 Aug 04 - 07:41 PM
Bobert 04 Aug 04 - 10:48 PM
Amos 04 Aug 04 - 10:58 PM
Bobert 04 Aug 04 - 11:10 PM
GUEST,Fifi 05 Aug 04 - 12:49 AM
Georgiansilver 05 Aug 04 - 05:08 AM
Nerd 05 Aug 04 - 09:27 PM
The Fooles Troupe 05 Aug 04 - 10:31 PM
Bobert 05 Aug 04 - 10:44 PM
Nerd 05 Aug 04 - 11:55 PM
bflat 06 Aug 04 - 10:41 AM
Bobert 07 Aug 04 - 08:53 AM
GUEST,Desdemona 07 Aug 04 - 09:27 AM
freda underhill 07 Aug 04 - 09:56 AM
Nerd 07 Aug 04 - 12:18 PM
GUEST,Desdemona 07 Aug 04 - 01:10 PM
kendall 07 Aug 04 - 01:21 PM
jacqui.c 07 Aug 04 - 05:50 PM
SINSULL 07 Aug 04 - 05:55 PM
jacqui.c 07 Aug 04 - 06:05 PM
MAG 07 Aug 04 - 08:41 PM
SINSULL 07 Aug 04 - 10:47 PM
Bobert 07 Aug 04 - 10:51 PM
Nerd 07 Aug 04 - 10:56 PM
SINSULL 07 Aug 04 - 11:02 PM
Nerd 07 Aug 04 - 11:28 PM
GUEST 08 Aug 04 - 05:26 AM
MAG 08 Aug 04 - 09:23 AM
Nerd 08 Aug 04 - 03:56 PM
GUEST,SueB 08 Aug 04 - 04:09 PM
GUEST,SueB 08 Aug 04 - 05:35 PM
GUEST,Desdemona 08 Aug 04 - 05:49 PM
Bobert 08 Aug 04 - 07:53 PM
SINSULL 09 Aug 04 - 08:31 AM
Bobert 09 Aug 04 - 08:53 AM
Ellenpoly 09 Aug 04 - 01:55 PM
beardedbruce 09 Aug 04 - 02:02 PM
jacqui.c 09 Aug 04 - 02:43 PM
mg 09 Aug 04 - 02:46 PM
beardedbruce 09 Aug 04 - 02:51 PM
Ellenpoly 09 Aug 04 - 02:54 PM
beardedbruce 09 Aug 04 - 03:07 PM
open mike 09 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM
Ellenpoly 09 Aug 04 - 04:23 PM
Peace 09 Aug 04 - 04:53 PM
SINSULL 09 Aug 04 - 05:02 PM
Nerd 09 Aug 04 - 05:12 PM
mg 09 Aug 04 - 07:19 PM
mg 09 Aug 04 - 07:35 PM
kendall 09 Aug 04 - 10:18 PM
open mike 10 Aug 04 - 01:42 AM
Ellenpoly 10 Aug 04 - 07:01 AM
jacqui.c 10 Aug 04 - 07:28 AM
GUEST 11 Aug 04 - 04:26 AM
GUEST,Desdemona 11 Aug 04 - 11:00 AM
el ted 11 Aug 04 - 11:13 AM
GUEST,amused 11 Aug 04 - 02:01 PM
jacqui.c 11 Aug 04 - 02:56 PM
mg 11 Aug 04 - 03:42 PM
kendall 11 Aug 04 - 05:08 PM
SINSULL 11 Aug 04 - 06:18 PM
harpgirl 11 Aug 04 - 10:19 PM
el ted 12 Aug 04 - 03:54 AM
el ted 12 Aug 04 - 05:15 AM
el ted 12 Aug 04 - 05:16 AM
el ted 12 Aug 04 - 05:16 AM
open mike 14 Aug 04 - 01:03 AM
Peace 14 Aug 04 - 02:26 AM
open mike 14 Aug 04 - 03:04 AM
Peace 14 Aug 04 - 03:52 AM
freda underhill 14 Aug 04 - 06:18 AM
Peace 14 Aug 04 - 02:46 PM
Cluin 14 Aug 04 - 03:07 PM
shepherdlass 14 Aug 04 - 04:01 PM
Peace 14 Aug 04 - 04:05 PM
JennyO 14 Aug 04 - 11:07 PM
Liz the Squeak 15 Aug 04 - 03:38 AM
bflat 15 Aug 04 - 10:24 AM
Matt_R 15 Aug 04 - 12:01 PM
beardedbruce 15 Aug 04 - 12:02 PM
Amos 15 Aug 04 - 12:05 PM
Georgiansilver 15 Aug 04 - 05:20 PM
JennyO 15 Aug 04 - 10:37 PM
Matt_R 16 Aug 04 - 12:13 AM
Liz the Squeak 16 Aug 04 - 02:36 AM
GUEST,noddy 16 Aug 04 - 12:00 PM
shepherdlass 16 Aug 04 - 05:45 PM
Peace 16 Aug 04 - 09:33 PM
Ellenpoly 17 Aug 04 - 03:11 AM
open mike 17 Aug 04 - 04:06 AM
kendall 17 Aug 04 - 07:22 AM
GUEST,noddy 17 Aug 04 - 08:00 AM
Ellenpoly 17 Aug 04 - 11:14 AM
SINSULL 17 Aug 04 - 04:03 PM
Peace 17 Aug 04 - 04:10 PM
Georgiansilver 17 Aug 04 - 04:14 PM
Peace 17 Aug 04 - 04:15 PM
Peace 17 Aug 04 - 04:16 PM
Ellenpoly 17 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM
Peace 17 Aug 04 - 04:23 PM
Georgiansilver 17 Aug 04 - 04:23 PM
open mike 17 Aug 04 - 04:26 PM
Ellenpoly 17 Aug 04 - 04:29 PM
Georgiansilver 17 Aug 04 - 04:34 PM
Ellenpoly 17 Aug 04 - 04:37 PM
Amos 17 Aug 04 - 04:39 PM
Georgiansilver 17 Aug 04 - 04:40 PM
Bill D 17 Aug 04 - 10:44 PM
beardedbruce 18 Aug 04 - 06:19 AM
GUEST,noddy 18 Aug 04 - 07:33 AM
GUEST,noddy 18 Aug 04 - 07:33 AM
GUEST 18 Aug 04 - 09:19 AM
Little Hawk 18 Aug 04 - 11:07 AM
Peace 18 Aug 04 - 02:34 PM
MAG 18 Aug 04 - 03:43 PM
kendall 18 Aug 04 - 03:49 PM
Peace 18 Aug 04 - 03:50 PM
MAG 18 Aug 04 - 04:11 PM
Little Hawk 18 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM
MAG 18 Aug 04 - 04:40 PM
kendall 18 Aug 04 - 05:15 PM
MAG 19 Aug 04 - 05:36 PM
Peace 19 Aug 04 - 06:09 PM
MAG 19 Aug 04 - 07:09 PM
Cluin 19 Aug 04 - 07:19 PM
Peace 20 Aug 04 - 06:58 PM
the fence 21 Aug 04 - 06:59 PM
kendall 21 Aug 04 - 07:01 PM
GUEST 21 Aug 04 - 07:46 PM
Ellenpoly 21 Aug 04 - 07:57 PM
kendall 22 Aug 04 - 07:15 AM
Cluin 22 Aug 04 - 08:46 PM
GUEST 23 Aug 04 - 01:32 AM
Bert 23 Aug 04 - 01:40 AM
Amos 23 Aug 04 - 09:49 AM
Cluin 23 Aug 04 - 12:31 PM
Peace 23 Aug 04 - 01:08 PM

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Subject: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 11:16 PM

Okay, this ain't about me but I got this friend...

But, gol danged!...

So, ahhhh, I, I mean my friend's wife comes to him last weekend and says "Either find a place fir us to go fir a week where we won't have any work to do or yer gonna end up where my ex-husband is..."

Like, that's a heck of a way to say, "Honey, we need to get away."

But that ain't my, I mean my friend's question. Like my friend and his wife get home after a nice mellow week in a cabin way back in the Wes Ginny mountains and my wife, I mean his wife gets all mad at him 'cause he couldn't read her mind and go out and water the veegie garden.

I mean like what gives? Men is supposed to be like mind readers, 'er what? Hey, if the P-Vine, I mean my friend's wife, wants me to water the veggie garden why not just ask me, 'er whoever, to water the danged garden. But, no! Has to turn into a danged "situation"...

So what gives?

Why don't womenz come out and ask what they want?

And why do womenz expect men to not only guess what they is thinking, but also go out and do it?

And, while we're at it, when do men get to win one? Hey, Iz ain't asking to win a bunch. One would do just fine, thank you....

That's my question...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 11:40 PM

King Arthur found out the answer to your question centuries ago, Bobert. Freud would not have needed to ask it again if he had been paying attention.

Women (we) want some control over our own lives.

In other words, how many times had the sweet woman pointed out that the garden was croaking???


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Big Mick
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 11:44 PM

They would really like men to REALLY be interested when they ask this question.

Mick


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 30 Jul 04 - 11:57 PM

Fools go where angels fear to tread. That is my contribution to this thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,frustrated woman
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:59 AM

If you've been away for a week, OF COURSE the veggie garden needs watering. "Your friend" might have seen this for himself if he had looked. Grrrrr!

Maybe we would like - just once - for men to notice what needs doing without us having to take all the responsibility for noticing it and having to point it out to them. Our kids are grown up. We don't want to be mummy any more.

Okay, rant over. Have a nice day.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: CarolC
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 01:04 AM

So where did her ex-husband end up?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 01:38 AM

I'd say it depends on whether the vegetable garden is necessary to your economic survival or is a mutually agreeable joint hobby or is her baby and you are dragged into it. If #1, you do have a responsibility for it unless you have both agreed that you will do more of the wage earning and she will do more of the gardening. If #2 you have less responsibility but probably should have noticed. If it is her thing and she just wants you to help out, and you are otherwise contributing fully to the family enterprise, either financially or domestically, then I can't see what you did wrong. You were willing to help when asked but since it is not your thing (if that is the case) and you are agreeable to it but not totally enthused, then she is being unreasonable. If the family is going to suffer without both of you constantly watching the water situation of the garden, then you screwed up.

mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Blackcatter
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 02:01 AM

They can create life in their bellies. They think that makes them special. Good thing we men have been controlling their lives for over 4000 years!

I know, I'm ducking and running for cover.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 02:28 AM

MAG's interpretation of what Arthur found out is very new-agey. "Some control over our own lives" is not how any of the Arthurian ladies expresses it. What women want in the Arthurian texts is to rule over men, to control them and their property.

In The Wedding of Gawain and Dame Ragnell, what Arthur found out was literally that a woman wanted "sovereignty over all of a man's body and goods"; "To have the rule over the manliest men." Same in the Wife of Bath's Tale, essentially.

Sound familiar, Bobert?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 02:53 AM

If one of your male drinking buddies - a good friend - said "I'm going away for a week - please feed my hunting dog" - you'd try to remember.

So you forget these things because your wife is not a good friend? !!!

Simple, set your mobile phone reminders, put notes up in obvious places, or in PC reminder calendar, or ask your drinking buddies or your workmates to remind you.

Wife gets home, is deluded that you remembered what she asked you because she thinks you really treat her as a friend and care to remember what she says to you. Wife may then be inspired to do nice things for you! It's purely selfish, I know mate! But isn't that what we guys are?

:-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 02:58 AM

Oh, and she MUST have asked you - they always do mate.... :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 03:59 AM

Might have been better to ask what women don't want...could have been a shorter thread....Best wishes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 04:17 AM

Man- whats the matter darling ?
Woman- well if you don't know I'm not telling you!!!

nuff said.
eric


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: C-flat
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 05:05 AM

Bobert, you're looking for answers that don't exist. The apparent air of discontent displayed by your friends' partner has nothing to do with how wet or dry their vegetables are. In all likelyhood she has no idea what she wants or why she's so irritable but feels the need to demonstrate her discomfort by taking it out of the man in her life.
It has taken me three marriages to arrive at one certainty with regard to the female species;

SHOES!


That's it!


SHOES!


A woman has many wants and needs but none as great as her need for SHOES.
Armed with this vital piece of information you can safely navigate through the perils of a relationship in the sure and certain knowledge that however tough things get you can always take her shopping for SHOES and that everything will be made alright.

If I had my time over I would have bought a shoe shop.

C-flat.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 08:54 AM

mary g: #3! Not only is the veggie garden her hobby but when you figgure up what we get out of it in the way of food compared to what it costs to have it, we're way behind...

Fencing and post; $500.00
Compost tumbler: %500.00
Soil ammendments per year: $75.00
Orgainic pest control stuff: $50.00 per year
Tiller: $300.00

Total: $1425.00

Other information: Percentage of $$$'s I, I mean my friend earns: 90%
                   Percentage of $$$'s his wife earns 10%

Other, other information: Average yield per year $200 in veggies.

C-Flat,

My friend's wife has a closet full of' the danged things now, ain't one of them prissy types no ways... But, hey, my friend is listenin'...

Nerd,

I think yer on thr right trail, here...

CarolC,

Don't ask... But it ain't purdy...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 10:15 AM

I can't answer for all womenkind but as for me - I just want someone to think that I am the most special person on the face of the earth. Presumably then he will water the garden without a reminder.

Now you know why I am single.
SINS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 10:35 AM

Serves you glad.
eric


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 10:50 AM

Nerd: the exact word was "sovreinty." (?sp)

ie, as much right to call the shots as men. Don't try to argue THAT story with me.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 10:52 AM

I've always hated 'well if you don't know I'm not telling' line. If you ask me what's wrong, I'll tell you. Don't blame me if you get all eggy about the answer.

Neither will I keep telling you. If I've told you already then there shouldn't be any need to keep repeating it.

And as for what this woman wants.... £4million on the lottery, a scout hut in Hastings and a bar of chocolate a week. I figure with the £4mil, I can lure Sean Connery and Hugh Jackman over for a week each.

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:06 PM

My guess, Carol, is that her ex-husband ended up in Schenectady. There is no worse fate.

To think that any particular woman is the "most special person on the face of the Earth" requires a temporary suspension of sanity. :-) And that, of course, is exactly what happens when one falls in love.

What if one fell in love with everyone simultaneously? That would be a whole different dynamic, and it could be quite interesting, but it falls outside the parameters of conventional marriage.

Anyway, I avoided this common conundrum to some extent by never getting married, but I did have girlfriends and, yes, these problems did come up from time to time. They just weren't permanent, that's all. If they had been, I would probably be in Schenectady.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bill D
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:06 PM

cain't generalize nohow, women are not all the same..but almost everyone comes to something like this question eventually, and the only way to deal with it is to find out what YOUR woman really wants...and whether you are willing to offer her some reasonable % of it.

Note...not all MEN are the same either. Some are more ...ummm...'sensitive' to women's wants than others. It helps if you even sound like you are looking honestly at her concerns, rather than just looking offended and/or confused.

I dunno, it may be the real question is "why are you doing THAT*, when you haven't weeded the garden?"

(*playing guitar, typing on Mudcat again...and again...and again...*grin*)

Was there any previous agreement about who would weed...and how much? How many other issues besides the garden surface regulatly, and is the garden just a cover for general upset with life? If so, maybe this batch of 'experts' here at Mudcat is not the place to be askin'.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:12 PM

10 to 1 it wasn't really about the friggin' garden.
Question, why is it vital that HE water the garden? Is she in a cheelchair?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:27 PM

when one partner starts ordering another one around, its not a relationship. Its a hierarchy.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,first things first
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:40 PM

what she really wants is an orgasm.

Install an automatic sprinkler system in the garden and spend some time with her!

drip lines are wonderful time savers. is her "wasband" gone? or dead?

i hope you had a wonderful time on your vacation.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: CarolC
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 12:45 PM

Oh, man. Not Schenectady. Watch out, Bobert! Don't let her send you to Schenectady!

Seriously though, all of those kinds of situations happen in relationships, and that kind of behavior is not gender specific. It's people specific. People have behavior patterns that are not always constructive, and that they usually aren't even aware of (including your friend). And those patterns, when they intrude into a relationship (as they will, if they aren't corrected), cause friction, as you have shown us yourself in the story of your friend.

It has nothing whatever to do with what women want and everything to do with the specific, counterproductive behavior patterns that your friend's wife brought into the relationship. The only way your friend can change the dynamic of the relationship with regard to those patterns, is to respond in a way that doesn't reinforce the behavior. Your friend needs to break the pattern by responding in a new way that his wife doesn't already have a programmed response to, that is emotionally neutral rather than emotionally charged, and most importantly, that doesn't reinforce the behavior.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 01:05 PM

Now that sounds sensible to me.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,pedeecee
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 01:31 PM

You have to go back to Bobert's initial thread and see what the situation was when the wife got mad. They had just arrived home from vacation. What was she doing -- unpacking? Preparing dinner? Doing other chores? And what was he doing? Chores? Scratching his belly and saying ahhhh, good to be home? Drinking beer? Hitting the hammock?

The other aspect of the situation involves the money thing -- he with 90%, her with 10%. It's unfortunate, it stinks, but it's reality that money calls the shots. If you look at her garden in terms of cost and profit only, why bother watering it? Why should Mr. big 90% water it?

Also, notice another poster suggests "take her" shopping for shoes. Money thing again -- he gets to "take" her shopping. I don't know one woman who would not prefer to have the financial autonomy to make her own decisions on whether or when to shop shoes or anything else.

One final, rather unpleasant note. Men and women seem to see things differently -- selectively? Women see what needs to be done, IMO; men don't, and teenagers don't.

End of lecture.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 01:52 PM

Oh for goodness sake, Bobert, get your self-absorbed head out of your friend's butt - wait a minute, I mean get your friend's self absorbed head out of your butt and - wait, no, that wasn't right either...

Look, you and your friend both, if you're typical middle-aged men you're probably walking around treating this woman like she's some kind of stage prop in the drama that is Your Life. (And the older men are, the worse they are - an example would be Kendall, bless his heart, getting all indignant when the grocery store checkout clerk didn't fall to her knees gasping with laughter at his tired old joke about the price of groceries that she's heard several hundred times before...)

Bobert, dear, I love you to pieces, but if your wife is acting like something is wrong, and you don't know what it is, you probably haven't been paying attention.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 02:49 PM

MAG,

I'm afraid I must argue THAT story with you. Where you go wrong is that the answer was not one word. It was encompassed in a number of passages, which make it clear that it is the sovereignty over men that is desired.

The two relevant passages of the most complete text, The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnell are lines 467-472:

I say no more, but above all things
women desire sovereignty, for that is their liking
and that is their most desire
to have the rule of the manliest men
and then are they well. Thus they me did ken   [ie teach]
to rule thee, Gromer Sir.



and lines 697-698:

and also he should give me the sovereignty
of all his body and goods, surely

(The translations from Middle English above are mine, but I used modern cognates so the changes are primarily to the spelling of words).

In the ballad version (Child 31), she is said only to want "her will," which is an ironic "trick answer" ("her will" merely means "what she wants," so the riddle becomes a tautology, "she wants what she wants.") It is often a characteristic in stories containing "neck riddles" (a riddle which you must answer or be killed) that the answer is some kind of trick.

Were you thinking of other versions of this tale, MAG?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 02:58 PM

Oh, and Chaucer's version:

"Women desire to have sovereignty
over her husband as well as her lover
and for to be in mastery above him."


(Lines 1038-1040, Wife of Bath's Tale)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Deda
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 03:38 PM

Actually, any woman who has ever had sovereignty over a man will tell you that it is a horrible position to be in. That's true regardless of gender. What if someone else says to you, "You are now in charge of me entirely -- all my dreams and aspirations, my actions, my will, my ambitions are in your hands." Well, YUCH. Gag me with a scepter! What kind of a partnership is THAT? Give me a free-standing, free-thinking, separate individual any time!

Now, having all control over the guy's worldly goods -- well, that's a different proposition entirely!!

Bobert, here's a script for you. Translate it into your own native Wess Ginny language and memorize it:
"Oh, sweetheart! I am really sorry that I didn't water that garden for you. You were probably counting on me to do that, and now the veggies are all dry. What a bummer for you! You must have felt (frustrated / irritated / angry -- pick one or insert your own). I know how much you love that garden. Now, is it taken care of, because I can run out right now (or in 20 minutes, whatever) and do it. And let's figure out a good reminder system so that I don't forget next time."

Even in translation, this should not take more than 5 minutes to deliver. I offer you this peace-making speech for free -- and it comes with an iron-clad, money-back guarantee that   it WILL WORK -- 100%.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,peedeecee
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 03:49 PM

"What do women want"? A famous historical question that men have asked each other through the ages. Freud is the most famed for the query, although many other well-known men have discussed that question for centuries.

Let's have a good look at the question. There are several implications in it, i.e., that it's men asking the question, that whatever it is that "they" (other) want, "we" (the norm) will give it to them if we agree with it, that women, being generic, all must want the same thing. There is a sense of frustration in the question, i.e., we don't understand them, what the hell do they want?

Although Freud was the most famous for asking this question, it has been discussed by men in groups for centuries; it has been the subject of cartoons, jokes, studies, theories, etc. etc. etc. It has been resolved by recourse to the womb (Victorian era, male doctors), the "burden" of education on women, the natural fragility, both physical and mental, of women, and the tendency to hysteria (Greek hyster- meaning womb).

No one has ever asked "what do men want"? For one thing, it has never been necessary, and for another, no one would lump all men into one set of wants, identical for all.

The one common aspect of this question, if I'm not mistaken, is that despite the long centuries it's been asked, despite the wise minds that have asked it, despite the discussions invoked, not once has this question been addressed to women.

Idiocy.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Kendall
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 04:22 PM

Sue, I did not get indignant, I simply noted that there was no reaction at all. I might well have said "You knickers are on fire." These robots that work in grocery stores, the young ones, seem to have no sense of humor and they don't appreciate anyone trying to cheer them up.Maybe I should act like other men my age and just give them grief.

Peedeecee, actually, women see things that THEY WANT DONE. You hear it all the time, "You need to pick up your room" or "You need to put your socks in the hamper". What they really mean is "I need you to".. etc.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 04:41 PM

Women want excitement; they love to gamble, but rather than gamble with money, they place their stakes on marriage partners.

And like all gamblers, they want to win, and if possible to win BIG.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: freightdawg
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 05:47 PM

Mrs. Freightdawg: Honey, can you take out the trash?


Freightdawg:(watching football game on tv) Sure.



(hours go by)



Mrs. Freightdawg: Hey, I thought you said you would take out the trash like I asked you to!


Freightdawg: Nope, you asked if I could take out the trash. It was a question about my physical ability to perform a simple task. I responded in the affirmative, stating that, yes, I was physically able to take out the trash. You never asked me if I would take out the trash. There is a significant difference.


Freightdawg is last seen rummaging in the trash can for his tv remote control.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Deckman
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 06:09 PM

ANY man that would respond to this thread would have to be a complete IDIOT. So ... I'm not going to respond to this thread. I mean, after all, what do you take me for ... a complete idiot? CHEERS, Bob(deckman)Nelson


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,peedeecee
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 06:09 PM

Things that women "want" done are usually those that "need" doing, but then it's a matter of perspective. I'm sure some bachelors think their apartments are just fine they way they are! ;)

I think women today are getting what they want, at least in the industrialized world. When I was a kid, women had no or few choices --teacher, nurse, secretary, or little jobettes to hold them till they married. No credit for what they did. Little money for what they did. Worked harder than hell as housewives, and people viewed them as being "supported" by their husbands.

Like all people, women wanted choices, and we now have some.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 31 Jul 04 - 06:56 PM

From a personal point of view I want to be treated as an individual rather than as a woman. I want, and have, a man who doesn't make me feel that I need to be 'looked after', provided for or treated like an alien from another planet. For me a partnership has to be on the basis that we both bring different things to the mix and acknowledge that each of us is able to contribute to that mix in their own way.

The key is communication. So many people seem to be unable to talk about what ails them in their relationship to the person that matters most - their partner. Maybe if they were a little less afraid of what an honest discussion of the issues involved might do to the relationship and a little more concerned with what NOT discussing those issues might lead to life might be just a little more relaxed.

And Sue - believe me - Kendall is one of the few men I have met who DOESN'T treat a woman like a stage prop.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 10:23 AM

No one gnereally has to ask we women to do what needs doing.

It'd be nice not to have to ask men to do what needs doing.

It'd be even nicer if one did not have to repeat oneself 2-3 times when we do ask, as we've been told "all you have to do is ask!"

Most importantly LISTEN!! Both o'youse!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 10:36 AM

jacqui.c...getting to like you! You show a pretty good grasp on the man/woman thing but don't get too bigheaded, I don't always agree with what you say. Best wishes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 10:44 AM

GS - I don't think I've got much chance of becoming big headed - there are so many very clever people on Mudcat who keep me well grounded.

As my man says - nobody's opinions are wrong, even if you don't agree with them. We all have our own individual point of view, based on life experience and, since that is always different for everyone, we are all going to have a different take on some things!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 11:21 AM

Seem to remember saying that myself on another thread. Best wishes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: freda underhill
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 12:31 PM

what does your friend want, Bobert? let her know -

to be spoken to with courtesy, as I'm sure you..r friend speaks to his woman.

to be treated with respect.

if your friend's gal likes giving orders - tell her to join the army.

anti female? nup, its just that Ive been on the receiving end of the orders, and its a pain. democracy starts in the house. the personal is political. all two people need to make it work are interestd in common, similar intellect, and courtesy.

neither has the right to assume the mantle of Colonel.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 05:32 PM

Well, gol danged... Maybe too much advice fir this Wes Ginny to process... Well, I'm sure my friend knows exactly what needs to be done and I'll be the first to say that he works his boney butt off 'round the house and in the gardens and vaccums and dusts an plays some fine music fir his wife on the rear deck in the evening. He's even good lookin', 'er that's what my friend's wife says... Heck, don't don nuthin' fir me...

But now really... Here's how I, I mean my friend, reacted and, sure it was prolly all wrong and all but he said "Hey, I ain't no mind reader. All ya gotta do is ask but don't go gettin' mad 'cause I didn't guess what you wanted done and therefore didn't do it." Well, somethin' like that. Bad answer? Hunh? Not sensitive enuff? Hmmmmm? Hey, when ya been away fri a danged 4 days and ya get home there's always lots of stuff to do. Like unpack the car, which I, I mean my friend still had to do during this little altercation. Like get the danged cricks out of the bad knee from driving all day. Like go to the bathroom, fir gosh sakes... But, no, not home a minute and this...???...

Well, I reckon the "mind reader" thing musta worked okay 'cause my frined and my wife, I mean me and my friend's wife are getting along much better now...

But I know this is gonna come up again so I want to be better prepared next time 'round...

And other that warm and fuzzy sensitive stuff there must be some common nugget of truth that you womenz ain't tellin' 'cause I know fir a fact that you all have a vast female conspiracy aginst us poor ignorant men and are all swored to secrecy...

That's the way I heared it anyway...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,casual observer
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 05:48 PM

Meow! Thwaaaaaacccccckkkkk!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 08:32 PM

Sit her down and tell her that you want her to be happy and you want to be supportive but you didn't appreciate being nagged and/or threatened. You have a right to go to the bathroom, and you have a right to sufficient rest for your needs, which might not be the same as her needs. You have a right to hire work out if it is too much for either of you. I'll say something, if you used that fake accent on me more than once...oh I shouldn't say fake..but if it is fake and you used it it would drive me up the wall.

If you are pulling your weight, and it certainly sounds like you are, you might have just married a demanding, unreasonable woman. There are plenty. People who have the choice, stay clear or marry with full knowledge of what the future could be.

And men and women are thought to have different responses to coming home, for evolutionary reasons. Men really want to relax once they hit the door and make sure everything is safe (and drop all keys, packages etc. at the door so arms are free to fight any intruders). Women might see the home as their base of operations, as opposed to the wild world, regardless of how engaged they are outside the home.
There is a whole book I read on this subject. Can't remember what it was though.

mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amergin
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 09:34 PM

well, Bobert, just remember that your wife...uh I mena your friend's wife is always right....if you keep that in mind you, uh I mena your friend, will be fine.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,William Shatner
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 09:54 PM

What do women want? Aha! A subject dear to my heart. My years in the entertainment business have taught me everything there is to know about this, but should I share ALL my secrets? Perhaps not...

I'll say this much. Women want to be appreciated. They want to feel beautiful, valuable, and desirable. They want to be that one special person that you care for above all others, the one you dream of, the one you can't imagine being without, the one for whom you would swim across a raging river full of ravening crocodiles.

Dramatic, isn't it? (grin) The trick is...you either actually feel this way (which can happen)...or...you get darned good at faking it! It would be safe to say that I have done both of the above, but I am not going to specify the instances or tally up the totals. No siree.

Why? Because another thing women want is a man who is a bit enigmatic, a bit mysterious, yet willing to share his feelings at the same time. If you can't really BE sincere, by golly ACT sincere! Go for the Oscar. It's showtime!

If caught in a flagrant bit of dishonesty or unfaithfullness...deny! If that doesn't work apologize and beg for forgiveness. Women love a good, heartfelt apology. If even that doesn't work, shrug and grin...there's a lot more fish in the sea.

Women also want a man who demonstrates independence and self-confidence, not to mention an inclination to spend money freely and have a good time. Women detest a penny-pincher, and who doesn't?

So my advice is, find a way to earn big bucks, dress well, entertain lavishly, travel to exotic locations, have fun, and always keep her guessing just a bit.

Making love in a private plane that's flying on autopilot works great too. I got that one from Howard Hughes.

Drives 'em wild. Is it all worth it? You bet it is! What's better at the end of a long life...a bank account full of unspent money or a hall full of hundreds of weeping ex-lovers who remember you as the best time they ever had? No contest.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Aug 04 - 11:03 PM

Well, gol danged... Makin' love in a private plane with Howard Hughes? Iz imprssed. Were his finger nails really like 2 inches long?

But seriously, I took my wife up in a Cesna and we got up to about, ahhhh, a hunner feet and she absolutely freeked out. Had to circle and put it down and get the poor girl outtta it... Too bad 'cause I reckon this is gonna make it tough to talk her into a zesty session in the back seat of one with the auto-pilot on....

Ahhhh, sorry, mary G, 'bout the accent but, hey, if you were to meet me you'd prolly not unnerstand nuthin' I was sayin'... Oh sure, I got another hat and can put it on and sound like other folks but when I don't gotta do it I sure nuff don't... My friend's wife like my accent and, tell ya the truth, when I get it going... I drives the womenz crazy. I mean, sho nuff crazy... Ain't no fake... Fake is what I do when I gotta go play "smart hillbilly" which is kinda like when others fake a British accent to sound intellegenter... Maybe its good that we didn't hook up 'er we'd be'd deevorcerated a long time ago....

Yo, Shat.... You really do that wid the auto pilot on???

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,William Shatner
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 12:01 AM

Well...yes. But not with Howard Hughes, needless to say. We have never met. Too bad. I could have given him some good advice on personal grooming and combatting depression. I have real confidence in technology, but you have to get a woman who either feels the same way or is turned on by high risk situations. Some are. Some aren't. I didn't do all those Star Trek shows for nothing. If you've locked lips with a Romulan princess while plummeting toward the rocky surface of a hostile planet in an out-of-control shuttlecraft that is disintegrating around you piece by piece amid sparking electrical explosions...this sort of thing is child's play.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:33 AM

It's not so much about what we want...





...as what we get.







And that's the same for men, isn't it?




..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:45 AM

I'm sorry, I can't take advice from a bloke who kissed green women and shagged everything that ever said, in a seductive voice 'tell me about this thing you Hu-mans call luuuuuuuuuuuurvvvve'

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Pied Piper
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 06:29 AM

Hmmm "What do wwomen wan't?"

Their cake and eat it.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: el ted
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 06:38 AM

A good seeing to on a regular basis.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 08:27 AM

To be heard and validated. Simple, eh?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:11 AM

This has been going thru my mind for two weeks now. From "I, Claudius":
"I want to be a goddess, Claudius."

That's about right.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:16 AM

To be heard and validated????? This from the man who says that "Women who are against abortion are usually too old or too ugly to get pregnant"!

SINS, hiding in the hedges.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:19 AM

Did he really, Sinsull?

Kendall!!!!!

As for wanting to be a "goddess", I'd settle to being elevated to "man's best friend"


Dream on, Ellen


..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 10:05 AM

ELlenpoly:

Raise your sights, darlin' -- that role's been taken by a quadruped!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Kim C
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 10:24 AM

Some women, myself included, have cultivated the skill of asking for what they want or need. Sometimes this is hard to do, because assertive women are often still seen as being bitchy; and who wants to be thought of as a bitch or a nag?

For myself personally, I still want bras that actually fit and pantyhose that stay up. Jeans that fit would be nice too.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 11:02 AM

Success Kim. A bra company is finally coming out with half cup sizes. A decent fit will soon be a reality. Mine are a feat of engineering but they finally come in colors.

And "Yes, Ellen". Not only did he say it but he did so on the Mudcat! On his behalf I have to add that he did apologize...sort of.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 11:08 AM

I just got sick and tired of that same old bullshit and decided to stir the pot a little. Most people got the black humor. Now, let it lay.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 01:26 PM

Damn funny, too, Kendall...not that I (or you) really believe it.

(Sorry I couldn't let lay those who couldn't get laid.)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Kim C
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 01:43 PM

I think everyone wants to be heard and validated, not just women.

I'm keeping an eye out for those half-size bras! Why do you reckon it took some Jenius SO long to think of that? I know Playtex had the Thank Goodness it Fits line, and I tried a couple of those... they were all right, but not fantastic. The fit was mediocre and the styles were dull.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,weerover
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 02:03 PM

Further to Freightdawg's linguistic point, and speaking as one who replied to "Could you take me to the supermarket?" with "Yes, I could" and no indication of moving...well, let's just say it only happened once.

wr.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 02:06 PM

They want the same things men want: respect, consideration, thoughtfulness from other people, a fair hearing, like that. I don't think there's a magic formula or a secret about it.

Some want material things, just like men. Some want love, just like men. Some are greedy, just like men. IMO, women and men want what people want. No rocket science there.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Kim C
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 03:05 PM

Brucie's right - I think the sticking point is that men and women simply process information a little differently, which sometimes leads to misunderstandings.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 03:07 PM

From me that would have gotten one;s beer snatched and poured on your head, wr.

and I wonder why I'm single ...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,weerover
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 03:34 PM

Brucie,

I can't agree that men and women generally want the same things in all respects: yeah, friends, money, job satisfaction, respect, all that, but a significant enough number want different things from relationships and situations (and interpret situations differently) to say the sexes are different in what they are looking for.

"No, actually I don't particularly like the colour of that new outfit" does not mean the same thing as "You are a bad person and I hate you": why should (many) women want it to be so?

"Tell me what's wrong" does not mean "I know what's wrong but I'm going to pretend that I don't so as not to admit that it's my fault".
Any other guys out there been in this sort of situation?

Sitting back and waiting to be lambasted...

wr.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 03:42 PM

They want a pecker bigger than Martin Gibson's or at least that is what his wife told me after I porked her in the arse.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:04 PM

weerover: KimC said: "I think the sticking point is that men and women simply process information a little differently, which sometimes leads to misunderstandings." Truer words were never spoke.

GUEST: I don't think you should worry so much about Marty's masculinity. You seem to have issues here, but no doubt that's what you're doing on this thread. Keep reading. Eventually you'll find out.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:18 PM

Women know what women want...Men know what women want..but somehow the twain do not meet too well...as the divorce rate testifies.
Best wishes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM

As they say in my neighborhood, GUEST, Daaaaaaaaaaaaaammmmmmmmmnnnnnnnnnnnnnn!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: InOBU
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:27 PM

What most women want is the latest Lorcan Otway CD! The Best Of Lorcan Otway Is Yet To Come! Available for a resonable price through PM to InOBU@aol.com. Title the email, SEND ME MUSIC!!!! Yes this never devorced folk singer sings for the women of the world!!! Queen Elizabeth of Britain declairs, "He employs far fewer bad words than does John Otway... I danced about the palace nearly stepping on my dear corgies!... Pray tell us, where IS Bangladesh?"
YES! This CD (5 cents extra for the royal seal... $1 extra for the Bobby Seale...) is ready to play on all the best holidays (see Happy July 4th to the world...)
So there you all, sisters of the planit, what women realy want - on sale NOW NOW NOW (National Organization of Woman...)
Cheers
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:29 PM

The thinking thing is different, and there is no doubt about that in my experience. However, I think we have to bear in mind that some stuff we attribute to people as being fundamental to the way they are because of their sex (gender) may just be the people. My ex would host a party and prepare, say, sandwiches. They would be cut into those little triangles and the crusts lopped off and each slice of bread would be buttered and carefully arranged with assorted stuff. I would host a part and put a few loaves of bread on the table with stuff and tell people to make their own. My ex would ask if anyone wanted more wine or beer. I would tell folks it was in the fridge (which was in the kitchen). My ex didn't read road maps worth a damn. She never could. I am a guy. I didn't read them at all. Each of us got us lots many times. How much of this is gender related and how much is people I don't know.

I see nothing wrong with putting clothes in a washer. My ex wanted the stuff separated first. (Whites, mixed, etc.) I just put it all in. How the hell was I supposed to know that her new $325 fancy wool sweater from her mother would shrink in a hot water wash? I ask you. And who knows that bleach does that to new shirts? Like, if people find this stuff out, they should let other people know, right? I'm a friggin' teacher/fire fighter, not a chemist.

Folding laundry. I did it in basic because my sergeant said I had to. I ain't in basic anymore. Who the hell folds underwear? My ass will make the wrinkles disappear for gawd sake. The wrinkles in my ass concern me more. And what is this fetish people have with ironing? Guys and gals. If the shirt is comfortable, WEAR IT! The wrinkles will get taken out when you was the thing.

Vacuuming. If vacuum cleaners are worth what ya paid for 'em, then once over a spot should do it. If the speck of whatever doesn't want to get sucked up, then you need a new vacuum cleaner. This 'go over the same spot a few times' routine really gets me ticked.

Dishes: I agree that they should be washed. No question. But some of us--male and female--don't feel that a soak time of a few days is unreasonable.

I am really rambling here. Let me close with this: It's all about expectations.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:33 PM

Sorry abuot the tpyos.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,shy guy
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:37 PM

It's simple.

Women have a nearly inexhaustable supply of what men crave. Yet, while they apparently crave it as well, they are the ones how control it. It's surprising to me that date rape isn't even more common than it is.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:43 PM

That's the philosophy that got the US into Iraq. "You got it; I want it; therefore, it's my right to take it." That blames the victim. Rape in any form is about power and the abuse of power.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:48 PM

Brucie, I am your sort of housekeeper. mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,shy guy
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 04:52 PM

this coming from a guy who fucks goats


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:06 PM

Martin Gibson is alive and well I reckon!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,TTCM
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:16 PM

Shy Guy knows this because he was the goat.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:27 PM

It was a girl goat. I know the difference, ya jackoff. You have some serious sexual identity issues, and maybe sometime soon you should get you ashes hauled by a competent workin' gal or guy. It's likely my goat would walk away from you. But then, I doubt you've had anyone in you life but your hand. Try the other had, and you'll think it's someone else you racist piece of shit.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:37 PM

The above post was directed to GUEST who mentioned dear, dear Esmerelda.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 05:57 PM

I see nothing wrong with putting clothes in a washer. My ex wanted the stuff separated first. (Whites, mixed, etc.) I just put it all in. How the hell was I supposed to know that her new $325 fancy wool sweater from her mother would shrink in a hot water wash? I ask you. And who knows that bleach does that to new shirts

My most recent ex did this crap, even when I asked him, nicely, to please leave my clothes alone. He ruined my crepe dress slacks and I nicely asked him to not try to "help" me anymore with laundry.

He showed up every night for a week wanting to take me out for a little bit, when I nicely explained I had a program to prepare for, and threw a hissy fit when I finally said no (nicely).

He refused to leave when I nicely told him I needed privacy for a call to my shrink, and got mad when I nicely asked him why he needed to eavesdrop on my need to discuss feeling smothered. Then he got mad, and I said I didn't give a flying fuck.

Can't live with 'em, ... can't live with 'em.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 06:04 PM

That's the beauty of his/her piles.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 06:08 PM

So, MAG, you want to be listened to. We are making progress here.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 06:13 PM

Brucie, I think what I need is to be a better judge of people.

This same guy promised to learn how to dance for me, and it was a lie. He gave new meaning to the term passive-aggressive.

Now I can't dance anymore but wouldn't mind the occasional good neck and shoulder rub, with reciprocity, of course.

I'm with Liz; winning the lotto so I wouldn't be stressed about the mortgage all the time wouldn't be bad. Not having to work so I could read and practice and garden. (11 years, and counting ...)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 06:20 PM

I hear you, MAG. Thanks for sharing.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:19 PM

The thing to do is not blame inappropriate people, but to get in touch with why we are attracted to the wrong partners. Sorry to have to say it, but it is not ALL their fault. Sometimes our energies are just not compatible. It's too bad that we all live in a society where someone has to be to blame, and it's always the "Other" person. Makes it easier to avoid examining our own "shit". The problem with that is, we never get beyong that stuck place and we keep making the same stupid mistakes over and over. The definition of insanity is "Performing the same task over and over the same way, hoping for a different outcome." I'm sure as hell guilty, anyone else care to admit it?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:25 PM

Story of my life, Kendall.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Pogo
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:35 PM

what do women want???

*cough* just taking a guess here...but top of the list would probably be " for men to stop asking silly questions like 'What do women want?' "

...and of course put the toliet seat down

;OD {O)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:40 PM

Toilet seats are supposed to be up. Else why would there be a hinge?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:41 PM

My ex wanted the stuff separated first. (Whites, mixed, etc.) I just put it all in. How the hell was I supposed to know that her new $325 fancy wool sweater from her mother would shrink in a hot water wash?

Another wimp who left his mother to find a substitute.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:43 PM

GUEST: You likely are still with your mother. Tell your dad to use condoms; we don't want too many more of you around.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 07:57 PM

I would suggest if you don't know how to operate a washing machine safely, just as eith an automobile, you leave it the hell alone. Justifying your stupidity by being arrogant about it is just making you look dumber.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 08:51 PM

And that ius in reference to what, Amos?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:15 PM

"Toilet seats are supposed to be up. Else why would there be a hinge?"

Flushing the toilet with the seat up creates an aerosol, which contains whatever was in the water. You really want that shit sprayed around for you to breathe?

Put the bloody lid down when you flush!

Robin
O->


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:16 PM

Brucie:

It was in reference to the post by someone who couldn't be bothered to learn what hot water does to cardigans...sorry pal, but I assume you had your tongue in your cheek. If not... see my last post. 'Course, it is also true that someone could have bothered to teach you....

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:25 PM

Gotcha. I was foolin' around. I did once put bleach in with a new bright-red T-shirt. Wore pink underwear for a while. However, the rest of that is bologna. Received a PM from one gal who liked it. Made my day for me.

Later,

Bruce


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 09:30 PM

Actually, according to the Central Missouri Hygenical Institute (CMHI -Division III football but up and coming) the toilet seat should be kept in the upright position when not in use. This prevents harmfull bacteria from growing between the underside of the seat and the bowl. Jus' thought I'd throw that little tidbit into the fray... I was sure glad to read that study 'cause me and Wes Ginny Slide Rule have had that issue in our Top 10 on the Worry List for years....

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 Aug 04 - 10:54 PM

Sure. That makes sense. It's not hard to put a seat down, is it? If the seat is up, you can see if the toilet rim needs cleaning. This is a good thing.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Kaleea
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 12:08 AM

Now, Bobert, the answer is so simple that most men miss it.
    I could tell you about my standard jokes I always say in jest: I need a roadie to carry all of my instruments-or one with enough $$ to hire it done. ///// OR: 50-something, good looking, independently wealthy, worships the ground I walk on.   uh, (Don Adams voice)would you believe, somewhere between legal age & death, I don't care what he looks like, it'd be nice if he had a job & sorta likes me.

    BUT: my older brother summed it all up--in public & in my presence no less--when speaking to a younger man only couple years married. "Son, if you want to please your woman, you only need to remember two little words:
>>>>>

>>>
    >>>>>>
       YES, MA'AM!!!!!!!!"   
   
Uh, Bobert, do you understand the answer to your question now?

   Uh, but seriously folks, um . . .actually, I DO really need a roadie cause I have so many Musical Instruments I can't take all I want to play to a jam or gig. [be sure to fax your applications & include a complete financial report in triplicate, along with 3 references . . . ummmm, men only please, cause I ain't that other kinda gal] ah . . .hahahahahahahahah, HA HA!   :) !


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 02:21 AM

Kaleea,

Ah! another Mult-instrumentalist! And I too am looking for someone like you. I mean, er, a roadie.... um... to help me get may gear off, um, er, to a gig, like....

Robin


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Ellenpoly
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 10:49 AM

I just caught up on this thread.

Damn, brucie! Half my once-white clothes are a nice shade of pink by now!

I often point people to the frig and figure my job is done.

Life is too short for dainty little sandwiches made by moi.

I enjoy reading a map, give directions to whoever wants them and fold my laundry (but really, DOES anyone fold their underwear??)

And of course you soak the dishes! Less elbow grease needed (though over night at most...days? I do like to get to them before the cockroaches decide it's smorgasbord time.)

And Amos-"that role's been taken by a quadruped" was my whole POINT!

So it just goes to show, there are no hard and fast rules when it comes to who wants what and how things are done according to our gender...and being best of friends means the gates of communication stay open, WIDE open-even when it sometimes hurts.

If we didn't make mistake along the way, we'd never learn, but for me, the point is to be allowed to make those mistakes, and not to think making them will be the end of the world.

We're all flawed, fragile and and singular creatures. Just being nice to each other goes a long long way.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 11:26 AM

CarolC ...your 31July 12:45pm post: The behavioristic psychology approach you suggest is intriguing, but I'm having trouble envisioning an example. Care to provide one, hypothetical or otherwise, to illustrate your point? Thanks,

GUEST


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 01:53 PM

Hmmm...

Obviously every situation is different, but one thing Bobert's friend could try would be to work on not feeling victimized when his wife gets angry because he didn't read her mind. He could try to remain emotionally neutral and either go water the plants without responding to her anger, or to carry on as he was doing without responding to her anger.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,weerover
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 02:04 PM

Let her water her own damn plants.

wr.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 03:19 PM

Okay, now you all realy got me going on this women thing. Laundry!!!. Yup, I don't do it but I would if asked but I do hang it up on the line and here is where the real rub is: The P-Vine, I mean my friend's wife, is of Irish descent and thinks that there are clothes line monitors that come around an' grade you on yer danged clothes line skills. These grades are forwarded off to St. Peter who pulls them up on Judgement Day and is atnding therre at the danged Pearly Gate with a thick three ring binder filled with these clothes lines reports...

"Ahhhh, we're rea; sorry, Bobert, but yer gonna have to do a couple hunner years on the pergatory bench fir hangin' the teeshirts from the top rather than the bottom. And here's another report where the socks weren't hung in matching pairs. That's gonna cost youa couple more hundred years! And look at this bed sheet... And pants are hung from the waist part down rather than the cuffs... Hummmm, as long as yer gonna have on the bench you might as well just pick Hell because they can take you right away... Awwwww, what's this? Hmmmmm. we see you were a blues player, too! We'll call down for them to come up and get you. Sorry. Better luck in the next life..."

I mean, gol danged! Is this az woman thing too. Heck, like who cares as long as the stuff dries. Ain't like a sock ain't gonna dry 'cause its a black sock and is pinned with a blue one. Right?

Black sock to Bobert: "I ain't dryin' 'cause I don't particularly like the company... You know how them blue socks is. Never matching nuthin' and think they're so danged purdy. Nope, I ain't dryin' fir nuthin'...."

Nevermind...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,TTCM
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 03:40 PM

Women want to be ruled by their males and made to obey. Sometimes with a slap in the face, sometimes with a mere spanking, but always thhey know secretly in their hearts, that they want to be punished for anything they do wrong. They want to be made to follow the rules.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,weerover
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 03:45 PM

...and I'm just willing to bet someone out there is so ready to go off on one that they take GUEST,TTCM seriously...

wr.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 03:49 PM

the clothesline is an example of obsessive compulsive behavior. Darned if I knew Irish had it because I hang clothes willy nilly. There are several approaches: One is to hang your own clothes and do your own laundry. Another is to offer to hang all the clothes your way, but neatly etc. Another is to discuss the oc component and say you are willing to do the necessary work but not the obsessive component. I refuse to do dishwasher loading for people who are compulsive about it. If I am helping and I do it reasonably, I will do it how I want to do it. They really get compulsive about loading dishwashers. Also folding baby diapers. You honestly don't need to ever ever ever fold baby diapers. Also you don't need to heat up baby milk...assuming you have a strong healthy baby. I don't know about unhealthy babies... mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 10:08 PM

Sorry, there, Kendall and Jacqui, I obviously picked a bad example of the condition I sometimes refer to as Old-Fogeyism. As you can see, I have a few "buttons" and "issues" that sometimes get inadvertantly pushed, and in that thread about how young people have no sense of humour, I mistook you for one of those geezers that has to be humoured, or else. I think I stayed out of that thread, because I didn't want to offend, and I shouldn't have brought it up in this context. (Banging forehead with shoe, repeatedly.)

As far as the rest of my remarks go, I hope Bobert didn't take them too seriously. I never set out with the intention of offending people, honest. I just say what I'm thinking, and whoops! there I went again.

As far as laundry is concerned, there is a right way and a wrong way to do everything, and laundry is no exception. Hanging socks up in pairs makes perfect sense to me - saves trouble later. Hanging up teeshirts from the bottom also has its logic - I'd rather have the hem stretched or marked by the clothespins than the shoulders. Sometimes we're especially particular about the little things that we do have control over because it takes our minds off the scary big stuff that we have no control over at all. Also it's possible that your friend's wife is suffering from the same disease I am - the "If you want anything done right you have to do it yourself" syndrome, and one of the symptoms is a nagging sensation of resentment...

No cure for that.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 10:15 PM

SueB: I think you is related to the P-Vine, I mean my friend's wife (this is getting tiresome but a guy's got to keep his pride, don't he??? nevermind)... Well, gol danged, that clothes line etiquet does make some sense now that its been explainerated to me and my frined should just get over it... Heck, ain't like nuthin' kinky 'er like votin' fir Bush 'er nuthin so he oughtta jus' get over it, hang 'um up Irish style and pick a battle, should there be any, that he can win...

That's his story and Iz stickin' to it...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 11:29 PM

Me.

I can't help it. That's just the way it is.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Aug 04 - 11:32 PM

and then Cluin woke up....

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 12:42 AM

So CarolC, if I understand correctly, you are saying that by removing the emotional response to ... for argument's sake let's stick with your example ....

...you are saying that in response to not being able to read person X's mind with regard to watering the plants...

... if person Y, who didn't read person X's mind, removed the feeling of victimization from the response, the behavior of expecting person Y to read person X's mind would diminish?......

...even if person Y went ahead and watered the plants anyway? Wouldn't the response of watering the plants - with or without the feeling of victimization - reinforce the expectation for person Y to read person X's mind?

I can sort of see how the behavior would diminish if person Y removed the feeling of victimization and did not read person X's mind and didn't water the plants.

The behavioral model predicts that the behavior would eventually become extinct (but allowing for other dynamics operating at the same time that the model doesn't take into account, other negative behaviors might arise to take its place. We can leave speculation about what shape those negative behaviors might take up to the individual's imagination)....

I was always fascinated with behavioral psychology, but wondered how well it would work in situations such as relationships where many daynamics are operating.

Boring, dry, dull, technical stuff. But if someone could come up with a therapy or whatever that would be applicable across many situations in which any number of dynamics might be working at any time, then.........???


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,peedeecee
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 01:05 AM

What women really want is a closet relationship -- that is, a guy they keep in the closet until they feel like having some time with a guy. Then back into the closet with him.

(My husband is on sabbatical, and he's HERE all the time! He retires next year - aagh!)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 01:50 AM

Sue - no problem. I agree with you about hanging clothes and, yes, I get that feeling of do it yourself to get it done right, so I did when I was married. Resentment - when it happens take a few deep breaths and work out WHY you feel that way, then do something about it. If it's down to your own attitudes and expectations are they right? Working down that route finally showed me that the marriage I was in was not working and, due to very different expectations, wasn't going to. So I got out of it. He's remarried someone who is much more his idea of what a wife should be and I've now found someone who accepts me as I am, not as he would like me to be. It was a bit drastic but necessary for the situation. However, if other parts of the relationship are good then TALKING about the things that iritate, without bringing too much emotion into play, can work wonders. If you can't keep the emotion out of it - try a marriage counsellor - to preserve something you cherish it's worth it.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 02:38 AM

That stuff about "If you want it done right, do it yourself" syndrome etc was meant to be sort of tongue-in-cheek, I was kind of poking fun at myself. I yam what I yam, what can I do? That sort of thing.

Actually the best way to do laundry, bar none, is to haul it across the street in a pillow case and pick it up the next day washed, folded and wrapped in white butcher paper like some kind of enormously large roast. I really miss that little laundry drop-off service across from my first little apartment in Cambridge, Mass.
Sometimes you would get back an odd sock that you had never seen before, which was like getting a little zen puzzle to ponder over. Also, I once lost a shirt I didn't like, but several weeks later gained a really cool Grateful Dead t-shirt that I slept in for a week and then returned with the dirty laundry. It didn't come back to me. I guess it was just a loaner.

And Cluin, you're absolutely right. Now that you mention it, I do want you. Desperately. But alas, I am promised to another. Farewell, my love.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 03:14 AM

Ah, if I had a dollar for every time I heard that, Sue...

(I could get a new set of guitar strings)

That's okay. I'm promised too. Never mind. We'll always have Paris.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 03:54 AM

Four things a woman wants:-
1)A husband who will be there for her whatever.
2)A hot lover who satisfies her every physical need.
3)A man she can talk to about anything, whenever.
4)For the three of them never to meet.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Kim C
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 10:34 AM

Well, I think Georgiansilver pretty much hit it Right Smack on the Head, right there. If they can All Three be the Same Person, that's the ideal... but let's be realistic, shall we?

Anyhow, I have another solution for Bobert, I mean, Bobert's friend. Buy a crystal ball. I got one from the Barnes & Noble for $15. Now I have no excuse not to know what's going on, unless for some reason it doesn't show up in the crystal ball. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 12:23 PM

I think deep down inside for most, not all, women, and certainly for me, is a rock-solid knowledge that he will protect them against all danger. I honestly can not understand the toilet seat and hanging laundry stuff. I want the saber-tooth tiger burglar in the night stuff. And fixing things like cars is quite wonderful. There's millions of years of evolution going on and it isn't kind to some men (and some women). Men who forget there are other women in the world and don't notice them if they should walk by naked are preferable. An all-round responsible, decent man is the bottom line for me at least. He could leave the toilet seat up or down..I don't care. Could hang clothes inside out and drooping low enough for dogs to snatch them off the line with lint in the pockets besides. mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: CarolC
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 12:46 PM

... if person Y, who didn't read person X's mind, removed the feeling of victimization from the response, the behavior of expecting person Y to read person X's mind would diminish?......

...even if person Y went ahead and watered the plants anyway? Wouldn't the response of watering the plants - with or without the feeling of victimization - reinforce the expectation for person Y to read person X's mind?


If person Y felt that watering the plants was important, even though person X was being unreasonable in the way he or she brought it to Y's attention, then watering the plants might be a good thing to do. If person Y avoided doing something he or she felt was important just because of the behavior of person X, person Y would still be allowing his or her behavior to be dictated by person X. So the healthiest thing person Y could do would be to do whatever he or she thought was the best thing to do with regard to watering the plants, but to do it because he or she felt it was a good thing to do (or not do), and without feeling victimized by person X's behavior.

Boring, dry, dull, technical stuff. But if someone could come up with a therapy or whatever that would be applicable across many situations in which any number of dynamics might be working at any time, then.........???

Then they would be Dr. Phil.

(Just kidding)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 01:28 PM

Wake up Guest...You're dreaming!! Wake up wake up!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 01:39 PM

DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMN, TTCM. You kiss Martin Gibson's Wife with that mouth?

BTW, is TTCM pronounced "Tit Seam?" Just wondering.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 01:47 PM

"Flushing the toilet with the seat up creates an aerosol, which contains whatever was in the water. You really want that shit sprayed around for you to breathe?"

Flushing with the lid down creates a greater spread of that aerosol shit (think of it as the thumb over the end of the hosepipe), whereas, leaving the seat or lid up creates a lesser spread.

Laundry. The majority of clothing comes with little tags on it that have a code - this code tells you how you are supposed to treat it. It's like reading the code on an electrical item or a mechanical manual. You can learn one, learn the other! And that goes for women too... my mother was brilliant at dividing laundry, trouble was, she wasn't that good at remembering which was the delicate pile.... My favourite multicoloured sweater ended up doll sized on the one occasion I let her wash it.

Actually, the majority of shrinkage these days, occurs when the item is tumble dried. The heat produced in the drying cycle is often much greater than that of the average wash.

Mary has it right. A partner who will protect and nurture, respect and entertain... and it goes for either sex.

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 02:07 PM

I'm pretty sure it varies from woman to woman. Mine wants me to paint the basement ceiling.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 02:37 PM

Nothing is good or bad. Thinking, makes them so. (Shakespere)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Kim C
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 02:46 PM

Besides what I already mentioned, I want a pony.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 03:21 PM

"Actually, the majority of shrinkage these days, occurs when the item is tumble dried. The heat produced in the drying cycle is often much greater than that of the average wash."

really?????

And just how does Viagra work to combat that?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Blackcatter
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 04:10 PM

From the Coors/Molson thread

Wet Pussy recipe

1 oz Chambord Raspberry Liqueur
2 oz Irish Cream
6 oz Milk

Pour the chambord, irish cream, and milk or cream into a shaker with ice. Shake, strain and pour into a champagne saucer.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 06:20 PM

Alternate recipe. Take one cat. Take one pond.....

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 07:41 PM

Ooooh, all this dirty talk!


Keep it up and I may be called upon to unfurl Mr. Wiggly.


Or is that statement redundant?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 10:48 PM

Cluin and Mr Wiggly,

Hang in there, fellas. We're gonna get you all cyber-laid if it takes all night and day...

Ladies?

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 10:58 PM

Take one pint Irish cream and one 5-pound sack of ice cubes.
Combine and let sit until just liquid; do not let warming above 34 degrees F. occur.
Pour on Mister Wiggly.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Aug 04 - 11:10 PM

How kind...I was gonna suggest a ballpeen hammer and an anvil, myself, Amos. Works every time...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Fifi
Date: 05 Aug 04 - 12:49 AM

We 'ave 'eard about you boy from Ontario. You must unfold your ting. Ow do you do dat widout 'urting yourself? Don't be shy. I will 'elp you. After the firs twelve inch, the res jus slip in like whoosh. Drop me your line when you 'ave a few day to spare. Your loving Fifi.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 05 Aug 04 - 05:08 AM

Fifi sat almost in a haze in front of her computer, as she remembered the days before the operation, when she was known as "Cyril". Those days had been difficult to say the least, being as he thought then a woman trapped in a mans body. The operation was supposed to solve all Cyrils problems and he had so looked forward to being Fifi, a newly liberated woman.
However, In spite of the operation, Fifi never regained confidence in herself and felt confused about her identity, so when she/he came on Mudcat, she/he could only appear as a guest.
What made it worse was the new found anger and anguish that she/he was feeling and it came out on the Cat as expletives and putting others down....known on the Cat as the MG type (not Mary Garvey of course). What made it even worse still, was the fact that she/he now no longer understood what either a man or a woman wanted and could only summon up some sort of perverted imagination as the their needs.
Sad to say, Fifi was destined to disappear into obscurity after making her presence felt.
(no offence intended here, just a bit of imagination)
Best wishes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Aug 04 - 09:27 PM

Hey, someone removed a post from this thread in which TTCM claimed to have had sex with MG's wife. I bring this up only because my post of 04 Aug 04 - 01:39 PM makes no sense without TTCM's post. TTCM was rather filthy, so I guess I can see why it was deleted, but I feel a bit of a fool being left hanging; could the clones just delete mine, too?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 05 Aug 04 - 10:31 PM

I suppose then they will have to delete the post previous to this one of mine, which is one of yours asking for another one of yours to be deleted because it refers to a previous post of TTCM's which was deleted? (That should have gone in the TOMSQT thread, sorry!)

But then, won't it be necessary to delete this post too because it then won't make sense? Not that any of my posts HAVE to make sense I suppose....

You are a Guy aren't you Nerd?

:-)

Robin


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 05 Aug 04 - 10:44 PM

Yo, Nerd...

Ya' gotta loosen up there, pal... Makin' sense ain't a desirable quality in this joint so... turn up the radio...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 05 Aug 04 - 11:55 PM

Sorry, guys, lost my head there for a moment!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: bflat
Date: 06 Aug 04 - 10:41 AM

Bobert, I know you said it didn't have anything to do with the way she approached you about getting away but I think you have to go back to that point and perhaps further to ask why she felt she could talk to you that way in the first place. I think Frieda, LTS, Mary Garvey and a few others mentioned respect in their posts. It seems to me that the real question should be why is there a lack of respect in this relationship.

Find out the background to that question and build upon it.

Best Wishes,
Ellen


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 08:53 AM

I get no respect, Ellen! Awww, jus' funnin'... Actually, since that day, the P-Vine has been much better... Being diagnose with a heart condition might have something to do with it but, either way, I think we're making progress...

And I am asking her several times a day if there is any thing I can do. Plus I'm not the type to sit around much. I'm always doing something. The worst habit I have is playing on this pudder thing which accounts fir a couple hours a day total. She don't like that but, hey, it's down from the 3 or 4 hours a couple years ago when I half figgured out how to use it...

R.E.S...P.E.C.T.... Yup, little goes a long way, fir sure...

BObert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 09:27 AM

The Wife of Bath told us, over 600 years ago: sovereignty!!

D


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: freda underhill
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 09:56 AM

What Do Women Want???...














.......grated cheese!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 12:18 PM

Desdemona,

we've been through the Wife of Bath/Wedding of Sir Gawain answer back toward the thread's beginning. To simply say "sovereignty" is misleading; some 'catters were claiming that sovereignty meant simply "some measure of control over their own lives," making these women seem only reasonable. But as I pointed out, "sovereignty" is clearly stated, in the extant versions of that story, to mean "control over men's bodies and property." In other words, they don't just want to be equal, but to replace men as the masters in relationships.

In the Wife of Bath's Tale, this is expressed thus:

"Women desire to have sovereignty
over her husband as well as her lover
and for to be in mastery above him."


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 01:10 PM

I *know* (I'm a mediaevalist by trade)!!!!

D


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 01:21 PM

Equality is all they ever get from me.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 05:50 PM

From GS's 'four things that women want' - I've got all three - don't need the fourth 'cause it's all in one package!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 05:55 PM

GS? Is that the Girl Scouts Handbook, Jacqui? I thought they taught "Be prepared"?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 06:05 PM

No - Georgiansilver's post 4.8 @ 3.54. I never got into the Girl Guides - they didn't seem to think I was suitable.

I certainly wasn't prepared for this, but it was a nice surprise!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 08:41 PM

"Some Catters" was me, Nerd; in spite of our apparent political agreements I am not spending time on this until you look up "sovreignty" in the dictionary. And then go find what Goia
Timpanelli had to say on the subject.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 10:47 PM

"sovreignty"s not in the dictionary. Now what?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 10:51 PM

"i" before "e", except after "c"??? Maybe that will help, Sins... I don't know spellin' too gud...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 10:56 PM

Sorry, Desdemona. I knew you were a medievalist but had forgotten!

Sorry if my comment rubbed you the wrong way, MAG. I had honestly forgotten who had posted before, and since I now download the threads in chunks of 50 posts, it's on another screen. But I don't really need to know what Goia Timpanelli said about it, and I know what sovereignty means.

If you are referring to the storyteller Gioia Timpanelli, modern professional storytellers are great for entertaining and enlightening fun, but generally unreliable as analysts of tales from different times and places. Their opinions certainly can't change the texts themselves. Like Desdemona, I have sufficient training in medieval English literature to interperet these texts for myself, though two of my degrees are in Folklore. In any case it's not something that bears much interpretation considering the explicitness of the extant texts, which as I demonstrated express quite amply that what women want is mastery over men, not merely some measure of control over their own lives. The relevant quotations are posted earlier in this thread.

By the way, if you refuse to support your argument by saying that I need to do the background reading to be worthy of your time, I and everyone else will likely take it as a tacit admission that you're wrong. I could as easily have said "your interpretation is wrong but I won't tell you why until you look up the quotations from 'The Wedding of Sir Gawain and dame Ragnell' and 'The Wife of Bath's Tale.'" Instead, I did spend the time, looked up the quotations myself, and provided them for you.

So why not just tell me what Gioia Timpanelli said? That would be a discussion.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 11:02 PM

Sovriengty - still no luck, Bobert. I checked some old threads, Bob. You used to speak in a fairly normal pattern. What up?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 07 Aug 04 - 11:28 PM

From the OED:

sovereignty

The quality or condition of being sovereign.

    1. Supremacy or pre-eminence in respect of excellence or efficacy.

c1340 HAMPOLE Prose Tr. 14 {Th}e ende and {th}e soueraynte of perfeccione standes in a verray anehede of Godd. c1403 LYDG. Curia Sap. (Caxton) aij, I symple shall extoll theyr soueraynte And my rudenes shall shewe theyr subtylyte. 1430-40 {emem} Bochas IV. Prol., Which..dyd excel In Rethorike by suffreinte of style. 1567 J. MAPLET Gr. Forest 4b, His sufferaigntie is, that being..borne aboute a man, [it] keepeth him safe. 1588 SHAKES. L.L.L. IV. iii. 234 Of all complexions the cul'd soueraignty, Doe meet as at a faire in her faire cheeke. 1601 {emem} All's Well I. iii. 230 Some prescriptions Of rare and prou'd effects, such as his reading..had collected For generall soueraigntie. 1610 J. GUILLIM Heraldry II. iii. (1660) 53 By the soveraignty of these partitions being interposed between them.


    2. Supremacy in respect of power, domination, or rank; supreme dominion, authority, or rule.

{alpha} c1374 CHAUCER Troylus III. 171 Ye shul no more have sovereynte Of my love, than right in this cas is. 1390 GOWER Conf. I. 104 Till I hadde wonne The love and sovereinete Of what knyht that..Alle othre passeth. c1430 LYDG. Min. Poems (Percy Soc.) 46 Crafft may shewe a foreyn apparence; But nature ay must have the sovereynte. 1475 Bk. Noblesse (Roxb.) 51 God hathe gyve that souvereynte in mannys soule. 1530 PALSGR. 273/2 Soveraynte that a lorde or a superiour hath, sovuerainté. 1570-6 LAMBARDE Peramb. Kent (1826) 143 The Pryor of Christes Church pretended to have..a Soverainty over St. Martines.

(...)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 05:26 AM

SOVEREIGNTY


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 09:23 AM

thank you, Nerd. As you can all see, Sovereignty means the right to rule.

Gioia Timpanelli, who is far from you garden variety revival storyteller, researches all variants of a story back down to their roots.

I will have to dig that particular book out, but her argument goes roughly thus:

The story goes back to a time when women were displaced as having the right to rule: the right to be sovereigns. Their right to be equal with men.

Having been an English Major in a former life, I am quite familiar with the Chaucer and the ballads.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 03:56 PM

Mag, not to drag this hread into a purely personal dispute, but your first characterization of the Arthurian answer to this question was:

Women (we) want some control over our own lives.

Your second was:

Nerd: the exact word was "sovreinty." (?sp)

ie, as much right to call the shots as men.


To which you added testily:

Don't try to argue THAT story with me.

Now, we have established that

1) sovereignty does NOT mean "as much right to call the shots" but rather "Supremacy in respect of power, domination, or rank; supreme dominion, authority, or rule." Somehow, you took this definition as support for your position, but it in fact contradicts your position. Note also that women do not merely want the right to possibly attain supreme power, which is what your characterization of Timpanelli suggests, but actual supreme power. Finally, in Europe in the middle ages women COULD be sovereigns, so I'm not sure how valid Timpanelli's point is.

2) it was not merely sovereignty, but sovereignty OVER MEN'S LIVES AND PROPERTY that is explicitly desired in these stories. In other words, women do NOT want to be equal but to be supreme rulers over men. This is stated outright in the versions of this tale that I've provided earlier in the thread.

There's a certain tendency in modern scholarship to understand the past in terms of the present: eg. The Wife of Bath is a feminist, therefore she must want equality. But she doesn't SAY she wants equality, she says she wants supreme power and dominance. So you may not personally agree with the medieval women in this story, but this is what THEY want, not "equal rights" or any other innocuous, modern ideological notion.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 04:09 PM

Sorry to hear about the heart condition thing, Bobert - that's why I hate doctors, on account of they're always scaring the heck out of all my friends.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 05:35 PM

Hey, Nerd? You may be right, you may be wrong, I really don't know, but I wonder if your efforts are going to lead to the desired result here, literary works being subject to interpretation as they are. You know what they say about choosing your battles.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 05:49 PM

The point is well taken about the attribution of modern motivations, outlooks and feelings to people from other times ("historical fiction", films and the like being particularly grievous offenders, in that they encourage readers/audiences to think of historical characters as "us in funny outfits", which they are most assuredly NOT!).

The Wife of Bath is *not* a feminist, any more than Joan of Arc is a feminist (or a "proto-Protestant", religious reformer, as she's sometimes ridiculously interpreted), because feminism was not an extant concept in the late medieval period. The Wife of Bath is a quasi-comic figure who has some very entertaining and amusing ways of looking at the world; no doubt there are grains of many real 14th century Englishwomen in her, and she remains so appealing 600 years later because she has qualities we can identify with. She's strong-minded, sure of herself, and pretty independent, despite the fact that she is identified by her oft-married status ("Welcome the sixte, whan that evere he shal"!)...but these are HUMAN qualities, not necessarily "feminist", or belonging to any other retroactively applied, modern construct.

She *definitely* wants "sovereignt" to indicate that the woman is superior in power, control, and "auctoritee"!

D


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 08 Aug 04 - 07:53 PM

Sinsull:

I don't know... Maybe I got alzhiemers 'er maybe jsut too much cheap beer catchin' up wid me... You sure that I use to sound different? Oh yeah. I remember. That was when I first got here, had spell check, and thought that if folks found out I was just some boney hillbilly that you'd throw me out the door so I came in wearin' my "city hat"... Hey, that might have somethin' to do wid it... I retired about 16 months ago and don't gotta be Mr. Responsible anymore so maybe Iz just bein' who I am....

Ahhhh, some folks think that the way I write is an' act but it ain't. If you was to meet me you'd find that Iz talk purdy much the way I write...

Has it really got worse recently?

I thought it had leveled out some but if it's still on a downward spitil than maybe it's time fir a little Betty Ford, 'er spell check, 'er go back to the real world... Danged, those would be terrible...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 08:31 AM

I don't think it's much worse, Bobert. Just had me confused - and it doesn't take much to do that. Somewhere along the line I thought I saw pictures of you restoring an old caboose but couldn't find them when I did a Bobert search. I did however see that you once wrote in what can only be described as "normal". I was pulling your leg about "sovereignty". My dictionary is upstairs and I was too lazy to go get it. I don't want sovereignty as I am already lady of my domain. But i would like someone to interpret your postings and those of the Scots when they get going. So now we can add multi-dialect to the "What Women Want" list.

Sorry about the heart condition. Check with Spaw, Kendall, Curmudgeon and countless others here for advice.

SINS, wondering if she should now start affecting a Maine accent, AYUH.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 08:53 AM

Well, Sins, it weren't a caboose. It *is* an English double decker bus. Ahhh, I haven't exactly restored it but by hook and crook wiggled into a wooded area on my property, set it up on a foundation, builf a front porch fir it and built out the inside as a guest cottage. Maybe that's what you are thinking about?

Yeah, the heart thing don't make a lick o' sense to me and is a real bummer. I mean, I've always watched my diet, have low blood pressure, and weigh only 175 pounds on a 6'1" frame? Go figure. Plus I don't smoke? Like I said, go figure...

More tests on Thursday. CT scan of heart and sonigram of neck. Hope they find just one place they can fix 'cause I played music yesterday at the farm and flea market fir 2 hours and it wored me out big time. Slept 10 hours last night...

As fir the bad spellin', I'll just blame it on my heart fir now...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 01:55 PM

At this moment?

Someone to scratch my back.


;-)

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 02:02 PM

scratch, scratch...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 02:43 PM

There - doesn't that feel better EP?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 02:46 PM

at this moment, someone to tell me what the wierd noise in my car is and then to take me out to lunch. (women can do that too if they want).


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 02:51 PM

what type of noise?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 02:54 PM

Thanks, BB, a virtual scratch is better than nuthin!

;-D

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 03:07 PM

and what kind of car...


Ellenpoly,
I do not have enough bandwidth to offer more... But I should be at the FSGW Getaway...

Reality has an infinite bandwidth.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: open mike
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM

HONESTY...
and to NOT experience the drama that I was a part of this morning:
as I was leaving my boy friend's place, another woman came in the
door and announced that she had been sleeping with him TOO unbeknownst
to me...she seemed to know all about me but i did not know that she existed....
yes i think i will give up sex and just go for cheese..
it just may win out!!
(see other thread about grated cheese..)
gosh this is confusing...
i do not know if i am mad, sad, or what......


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 04:23 PM

BB, women don't care about BandWIDTH.

Really.

;-D


..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 04:53 PM

Sorry to hear that, OM. It ain't right. Had a similar experience once and it just plain sucks. Hope you do OK.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 05:02 PM

Mike - be angry and sad and relieved, whatever you have to be. But go and keep going. I am sorry. How did someone as smart as you get involved with this piece of crap? Damn!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Nerd
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 05:12 PM

That happened to me once, Open Mike. My "girlfriend"'s family even knew all about the other guy...I was the only one in the dark. It sure sucks, and I hope you'll be able to move on without too much regret.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 07:19 PM

yOU SHOULD BE absolutely furious with him and spread the word far and wide about his misdeeds. Apart from the faithfulness question, he has exposed you to nasty diseases that could be fatal (well, hopefully not but you never know what people carry.)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 07:35 PM

Don't waste one minute feeling sad about this bum. Good riddance to bad rubbish. mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 10:18 PM

OM, why give up sex? Sex is not the enemy, the asshole you had it with is the problem!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: open mike
Date: 10 Aug 04 - 01:42 AM

well, thanks for the hopeful note, Kendall!
but if i had given "it" up before i got involved i would
not be in this postion now!! oh well, never a dull moment..
i will survive, and thrive, and live to see another day..
and maybe even another relationship, but once bitten, twice shy!
(thrice? quadruple...whatever....)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 10 Aug 04 - 07:01 AM

Openmike, I'm sorry that my posting right after yours seemed to ignore you. It wasn't there when I started to write my message or I would have responded to you rather than continuing my silly banter with Beardedbruce.

I really feel for you. I've been in your position, and the only difference was that I was married to the creep.

Men lie because they think they can get away with it (yes, big generalization and if it doesn't fit you, then it's not aimed at you) and will continue doing it unless you make it clear what they've done is unacceptable.

The best way to tell them? Walk out.

Sometimes they'll learn, but it's the hard way. If this guy really cares about you, he'll make amends and immediately cut off his relationship with the other woman.

If you choose to forgive him down the road, that's your call. I did, and in the end he really did change. But would I bet on that happening in 9 cases out of 10? Nope.

Just take care of yourself, hon. You deserve better treatment.

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 10 Aug 04 - 07:28 AM

om - been there as well. It does hurt. Just keep going - there are some great guys out there, believe me.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 04:26 AM

Kendall it is perhaps best to keep away from "assholes" and use the right ones. Can be less of a problem


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 11:00 AM

OM---that is just horrendous. I'll refrain from offering any advice, and just say I hope you get the situation sorted out in the way that's best for YOU (always maintaining your SOVEREIGNTY, mind!).

D


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: el ted
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 11:13 AM

Shoes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,amused
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 02:01 PM

Beware of men who offer "Equality." What that generally means is they don't want to be burdened by any responsiblities towards you, they don't want to give you anything, they don't want to help support you, and they are barely taking care of themselves, as it is.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: jacqui.c
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 02:56 PM

So what are men supposed to do?

If they say they want subservience they're wrong, if they offer equality they're lying and why would we want to be superior?

Equality suits me fine.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: mg
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 03:42 PM

I wouldn't personally want equality -- I already have that and I would want much more...and throw some subservience to one and only one man into the picture in exchange for the traditional offer of protection. I think each man and woman (or whatever combination) needs to work out their own agreement and these days you can not assume anything, even the most basic stuff like fidelity so you have to ask and you have to ask soon into the relationship so you don't waste your time or his. Says the spinster...but I have never even been around a bad man so something is working....mg


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 05:08 PM

Naturally I protect my mate..goes without saying. Beware of nameless people who give advice. The wise don't need it and the fool won't heed it.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 06:18 PM

Sounds like our GUEST is not only amused but also quite needy and has had a few bad experiences. I agree with Mary G. Equality and all it implies is a given. The rest needs to be individually tailored to the couple.
SINS, also a spinster who has never spent her time around a bad man.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: harpgirl
Date: 11 Aug 04 - 10:19 PM

I want to get caught up on my work! Perhaps, while we hunker down for the first storm!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: el ted
Date: 12 Aug 04 - 03:54 AM

The 200th post


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: el ted
Date: 12 Aug 04 - 05:15 AM

Handbags.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: el ted
Date: 12 Aug 04 - 05:16 AM

shopping trips


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: el ted
Date: 12 Aug 04 - 05:16 AM

oh, 200 by the way! Ha! jennyO where are you?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: open mike
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 01:03 AM

well, we might want some dignity
and to not have important things
trivialized with comments of
shopping, shoes, etc.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 02:26 AM

The shoes was just so's we guys have something from which to drink champagne.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: open mike
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 03:04 AM

the shoes i have been wearing the most lately are FIRE BOOTS.
and champagne would not taste so good from them...ashes, mud,
not the flavorings of choice...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 03:52 AM

Yeah, I'm a fire fighter also. You fight wildland/forest fire, don't you? It's structure for us. Either way, the boots DO take on a certain (whatever word I'm lookin' for but can't find goes here) don't they? There is no such thing as a routine situation, is there?! Always something new, and the thing we fight never seems to run out of surprises, does it? Take good care, OM.

Bruce


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: freda underhill
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 06:18 AM

..bouquet..


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 02:46 PM

Of petunias?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 03:07 PM

Well, my girlfriend wanted a cordless drill for her birthday (her ex took all the tools when they split). So I bought one for her, which she promptly handed back with a request to install the new screen door at the side of the house. Done. The drill works pretty good. Wish I had one.

Afterwards, she wanted the knot worked out of her muscles behind the left scapula. Did that too.

I got some good stuff in return.

So that's my one weekend off this summer so far. I'm off to wash the car now...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: shepherdlass
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 04:01 PM

Mysterious gender differences best answered by the genius (wish I could claim it myself) who wrote:

Men are from earth, women are from earth - get over it!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 04:05 PM

LOL


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: JennyO
Date: 14 Aug 04 - 11:07 PM

My son has one of those T shirts. And yes, he is very happily married and very good at communicating. Makes me think I must have done something right.

Jenny (proud mother)


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 03:38 AM

I still wouldn't mind Hugh Jackman or Sean Connery..... any help?

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: bflat
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 10:24 AM

Respect..Humor..Friendship..Security..Roll-in-the-hay.

Ellen


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Matt_R
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 12:01 PM

Orgasms. And lots of 'em.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: beardedbruce
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 12:02 PM

sonnets and chocolate, I hope...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 12:05 PM

MattR --

Delighted to see you have developed a good opinion on the subject!!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 05:20 PM

Matt R...assuming that women wants lots of orgasms...do you think that involves you or perhaps just themselves?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: JennyO
Date: 15 Aug 04 - 10:37 PM

Sonnets and chocolate sound pretty good to me, Bruce!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Matt_R
Date: 16 Aug 04 - 12:13 AM

Probably just themselves. Witness "The Rabbit".


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 16 Aug 04 - 02:36 AM

Yep, sounds good to me but maybe a bigger chocolate to sonnet ratio?

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 16 Aug 04 - 12:00 PM

1 Everything.

2 Not what you got them.

3. Another couple of inches.

4. Another couple of inches.

5. Another couple of inches.

6.More time.

7 More money.

8. Someone else.

9.To be thinner.

10 to be fatter.

11.To be bigger.

12 to be smaller.

13 To be Blond.

14 To be in charge.

15. Not to be in charge.

16. To be able to make decisions(not sure about that one).

17. Peace and quiet.

18 more conversation.

19 the remote control.

20 to be able to use the remote control.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: shepherdlass
Date: 16 Aug 04 - 05:45 PM

Orgasms and chocolate are inextricably linked. Discuss.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 16 Aug 04 - 09:33 PM

Depends what you do with the chocolate bar.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 03:11 AM

Chocolate=1
Noddy=0


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: open mike
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:06 AM

it is the alkaloids...in chocolate--go to the center in the brain where good sensations go.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 07:22 AM

If you eat enough chocolate to equal an orgasm it would kill you.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 08:00 AM

oh yeah forgot the chocolate.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 11:14 AM

Oh Kendall.......


as with other things about men...


a little chocolate goes a long way.


;-)

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: SINSULL
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:03 PM

Is it time for Joe Offer to combine this thread with the "What Do Men Want?" thread?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:10 PM

NO.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:14 PM

Chocolate does not give orgasms but rather it gives the feeling of love that one feels when one is "IN LOVE". That is why women tend toward chocolate when they are on their own. There is an enzyme in chocolate which works on the endorfins in the brain and makes a woman feel loved. Shame it don't work for men!!!!!
Best wishes.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:15 PM

I'm still tryin' to see how this chocolate thing works.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:16 PM

Exercise does the same thing, GS.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM

You providing the chocolate?

Demo will be free

;-D

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:23 PM

LOL

A man's idea of a romantic evening: Show up naked; bring beer.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:23 PM

Never needed to provide chocolate!!!!! Even Christians are capable of giving!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: open mike
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:26 PM

http://chocolate.org/


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:29 PM

A woman's idea of a perfect evening, ring the bell, leave a nice box of Godiva's on the doorstep, leave and come back in about an hour.

The thing about chocolate is that ultimately it's a private pleasure.

But after an hour, you'll be received back with a big smile...and that naked bit.

(Georgiansilver, I've been following your latest threads, and I've figured out where you may be going wrong...the secret is definitely in this post..)

;-D

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:34 PM

Perhaps Ellenpoly, you should PM me with your findings as I am always ready to learn!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:37 PM

Just going back to what you posted, GS-Give and ye shall receive.

..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:39 PM

GS always leaves the chocolate and forgets to come back later! :>)


A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 04:40 PM

Very astute.....mmmm You are a knowledgable person...I shall remember that!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bill D
Date: 17 Aug 04 - 10:44 PM

Sensitive New Age Guys
Words and Music by Christine Lavin and John Gorka
Copyright 1990 CL2 (ASCAP) & Blues Palace Music (ASCAP)

Who like to talk about their feelings?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who's into crystals, into healing?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who like to dress like Richard Simmons?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who are hard to tell from women?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who like to cry at weddings?
Who think boxing is upsetting?
Who tapes "Thirty Something" on their VCR,
Who's got "Baby on Board" stickers on their cars, oh,
(Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh)

Whose last names are hypenated?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who like "Three Men and a Baby" a movie I hated?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Whose consciousness is constantly raising?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Whose tax free income is amazing?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who thinks that red meat is disgusting?
Who's into UFO's channeling, and usting?
Who believes us when we say we've got premenstrual syndrome?
Who doesn't know who plays in the Seattle Kingdome?

Who likes music that repetitious?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who likes music that's repetitious?
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who's concerned about your orgasm? (silence)
Well, I guess it's more important that they have 'em.
(Sensitive new age guys.)
Who carries the baby on his back?
Who thinks Shirley MacLaine is on the inside track?
Who always sings on sing-alongs,
Even when they can't stand stupid sing-along songs?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 06:19 AM

ok, so I need to budget for more chocolate at the Getaway....


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 07:33 AM

hormonal stability


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 07:33 AM

no sorry thats what men want women to have.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 09:19 AM

A SENCEABLE MAN -
AND THAT'S HARD TO FIND....

JIM MCAULEY
FIDDLE-4


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 11:07 AM

I think most men are highly concerned about women's orgasms (including sensitive New Age guys)...but maybe I'm wrong about that.

And I hate that stupid song! I would like to kick the idiot that wrote it. She deserves to be marooned on a desert island with Howard Stern. I had the displeasure to hear her sing the song at a folk festival back in the 90's when it was still sort of topical.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 02:34 PM

"Whatever they think they want, they all seem to require having their ego stroked - constantly."


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 03:43 PM

Point made, Brucie.

why does the species have a hard time giving each other what we need?

What is the fine line between legitimate needs and neediness?

Why can't we teach our young people how to deal with these things so they won't spend decades floundering in confusion?

I am very glad the younger generations seem to be having better conversations.

We mudcatters seem to be enjoying the conversation ...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 03:49 PM

I'm all for giving a woman what she wants, hell of it is, you are all different and it's time consuming to figure each of you out! Sometimes, it's worth the trouble though.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 03:50 PM

MAG,

As you are aware, that is NOT my statement.

BM


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 04:11 PM

right, Brucie.

what I have learned:

If he's a hardhead like my Dad, run.

If he does drugs or has an alcohol problem, run. If it's coke, run harder.

If he is possessive and jealous, run.

If he even threatens to hit you, run.

If he is smart, and funny, and good looking, he may last longer, but in the end you might still need to run if he turns out to be mental.

If he starts criticizing your clothes, your friends, and your general take on life, run.

It's better to be alone that with someone who upsets you all the time, even if the sex is great.

Too picky is better than not picky enough.

Don't run; it's your place. Kick him out.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 04:20 PM

That was all very good advice for both men and women!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 04:40 PM

Wisdom of the silver-haired elders. will the kids listen? depends on if they trust you ...


MAG, home sick with a bad cold


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 18 Aug 04 - 05:15 PM

MAG I've been say those things for years.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 05:36 PM

You mean, since before you were a silver-haired elder, Kendall??

I confess I have a sneaking affection for most of you guys on the 'cat.

M.A., home early with the same $%%^ cold.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 06:09 PM

MAG:

My grandmother's remedy was to marinate a small sprig of parsley in a flask of rum for about two minutes. She then strained it and drank the broth. Hope you feel better real soon.

Bruce M


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: MAG
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 07:09 PM

what a lovely idea. Unfortunately it doesn't mix with the codeine cough syrup or the diabetes ...

You Canadians can buy ASPIRIN w/ "C" -- sometimes I wish I lived closer to the border.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 19 Aug 04 - 07:19 PM

Yep, A,C&C. It's a good thing too `cause Tylenol doesn't do shit for me. Because if it's bad enough for me to have to take someting, it has to be the codeine.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 20 Aug 04 - 06:58 PM

The aspirin with codeine is a 222. Eighth grain codeine in there. Sorry, MAG, I didn't know about the sugar.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: the fence
Date: 21 Aug 04 - 06:59 PM

MONEY!!!!!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 21 Aug 04 - 07:01 PM

It's been my experience that most women want a real man. Not just a male, a real man.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Aug 04 - 07:46 PM

A warm back for my cold feet in winter.

A chocolate fondue by candle light.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Ellenpoly
Date: 21 Aug 04 - 07:57 PM

Gotta second you on those two, GUEST


..xx..e


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: kendall
Date: 22 Aug 04 - 07:15 AM

But, what does HE get out of warming your feet?


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 22 Aug 04 - 08:46 PM

A cold back.

And the knowledge that that sexual position can't be maintained all that long.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 04 - 01:32 AM

Not me.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Bert
Date: 23 Aug 04 - 01:40 AM

A big bowl of ice cream.


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Amos
Date: 23 Aug 04 - 09:49 AM

Little Hawk:

You are dissing Christine Lavin, man, one of the smartest song-writers on the circuit! Her "Kind of Love You Never Recover From" could revolutionize your life all by itsef. Her take on sensitive new age guys was a crack up.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Cluin
Date: 23 Aug 04 - 12:31 PM

And besides, it's all true.

And brucie, 222 is old school, dude. That's just aspirin & codeine. A.C.& C.s got Caffeine in `em so's ya don't get sleepy. Just the thing for today's Man-In-Motion. Pop a handful with your morning Gatorade and energy bar. Then go out and embrace your road rage.

This ain't your grandmother's 222...


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Subject: RE: BS: What Do Women Want???...
From: Peace
Date: 23 Aug 04 - 01:08 PM

You mean I took all those drugs for NOTHING?


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