Pete Seeger's last concert

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 03:42 PM

Two schools of thought

1) Leave us admirers alone as we reminisce sadly and gently about our dear Pete and his career. You (not being in sympathy with the general mood of the thread) start another thread Is Pete Seeger Rubbish? where you and you pals can expound how Pete devastated your life and made existence itself a burden.

2) Gatecrash the party and get on as many peoples tits as you know how: generally stamping on toes, kicking shins, belching in polite society etc.

Which one Martin?

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Once Famous
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 03:18 PM

63 posts now since I said no one had much to say.

See post number 10.

Good morning, everyone.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 02:42 PM

The thing some people miss about Pete Seeger is that the main instrument he plays is the audience.

I was reading through this and surprised noone said that, until at last cobber did. Precisely - no one I've ever come across can play that instrument as well, or even in the same league. (Though maybe there was one man who came pretty close, and that was Alex Campbell.)

Mind, there was just one time he came unstuck with that I can remember, and that was when he was in the Albert Hall, and tried to teach an English audience to yodel. People were trying, but nothing came out, just silence and some gasps and coughs. But when it came to singing he got that audience to sing out loud enough to take the roof off.

And I'm glad someone mentined his Goofing off suite - and wasn't it great when they put out Raising Arizona, and there it was blasting out pver the end titles. Absolute magic.

And I'm also glad we're saying these things while he's still here, rather than saving them up till it's too late. (Setting aside the occasional distracting ego-trip posts from ** which are best set aside anyway.)

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 01:50 PM

Hi Frank,

I hope I was not misunderstood. I am not taking anything away from Pete Seeger. He is one of the reasons why I grew to love folk music. I love Pete Seeger and I can't imagine what the world would be like he never existed. He is one of those people that you can point to and say they made a difference in the way we live. Pete deserves every honor bestowed upon him.

What I was attempting to say is that the others you mention certainly deserve credit for carrying on the tradition, and often they are overlooked. Martin credits Dave Guard for his interest in folk music. Your point is very well taken, we need to look back at their sources. Disciples deserve recognition for their work as well.

How about Pete's influences?

Have you read Ronald Cohen's book about the folk revival?   I was very intrigued by the way he wove so many threads together that made up the revival in the U.S.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Jack The Lad
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 12:57 PM

Pete was and is a gentleman, a wondeful entertainer and an inspiration for millions of people the world over. It is a moving experience to be at one of his concerts- indeed , in his presence.
I don't know anything about his "championing the Palestinian cause",
Martin- but even if he does so- I am sure he has not lost his regard
and respect for the decent achievements of Israel.
It was my pleasure to meet him here in Israel in 1963- at an International Youth Conference, when he inspired and encouraged many of us young "pioneers". I again recently met him at Woodstock NY, when many were moved to tears just to be there with him.
When I introduced myself to him- as being from Israel- he did not enter into any political discussion- or any "championing" of anyone's cause. Rather he took the time to suggest a way of harnessing wind and waterpower to the benefit of everyone in the region.
I can only wish him a comfortable and healthy old age- he may be retiring from the stage- but I am sure he will never retire from his love and concern for all humanity.
Shanna Tova (Happy New Year) to all of you.
May the coming year bring Peace to all of us.
Jack The Lad

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Frank Hamilton
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 12:40 PM

Hi Ron,

Was put in mind of what Dizzy Gillespie said about Louis Armstrong.
"No Louis, no me".

I think the same can be said for Dave Guard and Dave if he were here would agree.

Almost everyone in folk-related music owes Pete. He championed Dylan when Bob was called "Hammond's Folly"., Pete introduced Scruggs style playing to New York audiences. I bet Roger Sprung owes him too. I know Eric Weissberg does. I believe they would say so.

And how about Woody and Leadbelly? Pete was a one-man publicity campaign for both performers. Pete once told me, "You know I'd give up all I know about the five-string banjo if I could play like Leadbelly."

Pete promoted the Almanac Singers.

He toured a whole year with Sonny Terry to introduce the harmonica master to concert audiences.

Odetta owes him too and I know she would say so. He championed her at the inception of her career.

The Old Town School of Folk Music owes Pete as well. He introduced a fundamental and important idea that music is not an elitist or exclusive club.
This was and is the raison d'etre behind the success of the School.

I can't think of anybody who I've known in folk music including Bascom Lamar Lunsford who doesn't owe Pete. Pete was responsible for Bascom on Folkways Records.

Pete reached out beyond partisan politics. He gave a memorable concert and enchanted the Young Republicans (when they were a different breed in the 50's). Nelson Rockefeller was a fan.

Pete introduced the folk world to so-called World Music. His group, the Song Swappers popularized South African Zulu chants in the folkie crowd paving the way for Wimoweh and Miriam McKeba.

Johnny Carignan, the virtuoso French Canadian fiddler idolized Pete.

Pete toured with Big Bill Broonzy as he did with Sonny Terry so that his audience could hear this great artist.

He accompanied the Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem at Carnegie Hall, one of their first recordings.

Even folks at the Grand Ol' Opry knew Pete. I know Earl Scruggs would have good things to say about him.

Pete once took me to the Riverside Rancho a, Los Angeles country music club to hear Merle Travis. That was quite a meeting. Merle certainly knew Pete and admired him.

Pete has touched so many musical lives as well as just lives that most people wouldn't be aware of this.

No Pete, no John Hartford, Bob Gibson, Dave Guard, Alex Hassilev, and I believe even Bela Flek, Eric Weissberg, Billy Faer, Erik Darling, Fleming Brown, Bill Keith, ....damn so many.

Yeah, no me too. And I know I'm not alone.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Once Famous
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 12:19 PM

Two schools of thought here:

"If you don't have anything good to say, don't say it."

If you don't have something good to say, say it anyway and be honest about it."

There is a lot that we hear that we don't want to hear. My suggestion is if you are uncomfortable with someone's honest feelings, please get yourself another pillow. It's not always a matter of jumping in just because they can.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Arkie
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 11:58 AM

When you see a post praising someone for their accomplishment and expressing appreciation for what they have meant and then you don't see a post belittling the hero and making sport of those who join in the praise, that was me who didn't post.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 11:54 AM

I yield to no-one in my admiration for Pete Seeger.

Howsomever, that song, "Oh, Had I a Golden Thread" is about as bad a song as I've ever heard, in my opinion. I came close to nominating it in the "Worst Song" thread.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Alonzo M. Zilch (inactive)
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 08:42 AM

A Weavers record that my parents had in the 1950s was my introduction to folk music. Over the years I've amassed dozens of Pete Seeger LPs and CDs and have seen him perform many, many times. That's me (and hundred others) you hear singing with him on the "Singalong at Sanders Theater" CDs.

It's now been about ten years since I last saw Pete perform. I wish him the best and sure wish I could be one of the lucky few that gets to see him with the Weavers in Toronto.

Brucie, Pete wrote both the words and the music to "O Had I A Golden Thread."

Thanks to everyone who didn't let Martin Gibson spoil the thread.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Midchuck
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 07:26 AM

Art, if it's any consolation, we have two cats - black and white brothers, one longhair, one shorthair - named Waylon and Willie.

Waylon has, in fact, lost his sexual prowess.

So has Willie.

Peter.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Sep 04 - 07:10 AM

Thanks for replying Martin. in the event I did Freight Train which I always associated with Pete and the 12 string.

Sorry if I sounded peevish and ratty. you don't rate Pete seeger. i guess that's alright.

who knows, perhaps he doesn't speak well of you.

we've all got our blind spots. I know its difficult, but i think it as well to keep quiet about them. we offend people when we see the red mist. its so easy to do on this site.

I always used to think that the creative process was as much about what you reject and what repels you, as what it is that turns you on.

as you get older, that truth gets increasingly hard to handle. negative feelings get voiced about stuff and people who have meant something to you, and the world seems increasingly impertinent and abrasive.

keep strumming, Pete would want that - or perhaps not - who knows!

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 02:01 PM

Well said, Art.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Nerd
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:51 PM

I just want to second Joe Offer's post. Get those "American Favorite Ballads" CDs.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:48 PM

I doubt I would jump into a thread on the sadness of Waylon losing his sexual prowess, or his life for that matter, and turn off those who admire him just because I could. It'd serve no purpose I can discern.

Art

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Wesley S
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:31 PM

From what I've heard Pete found an obscure spiritual and suggested to Martin Luthur King that "We Shall Overcome" might be a good song for the freedom movement.

Pete Seeger helped popularize the 12 string guitar. And invented the long neck banjo as mentioned before.

Pete also appeared before the HUAC and stood his ground.

Everyone somewhere in the world knows and loves a song that Pete Seeger had his hands on. The evidence is clear on that.

Easily one of the most influential musicians of the 20th Century.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:07 PM

Well done Martin!   I agree with your last post 100%.   Everyone has individual "mentors" that they look up to. Pete certainly filled that roll for many.    Unfortunately some people look for one significant event or person and make that the centerpiece of a movement.   There were MANY individuals that were involved in the folk revival that do not get the credit they deserve. I agree with you that Dave Guard does not get the credit he is due for the work he did.

Folk music is not a sport. It bothers me that so many people find a need to compare apples and oranges. Both have a place.

We can't diminish Seeger's role. While he may not have played an important role in Martin's life, there are many of us who love and cherish Pete. There are places for all of us.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Charlie Baum
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 12:22 PM

I still remember taking a housemate who had never before seen Pete Seeger in person to a concert he did in Boston in Spring of 1976. She had known him through recordings, and I explained to Sarah that you don't go to a Pete Seeger concert to hear him sing--you go to sing for him. That difference is what made every Pete Seeger concert an event, not just a concert--because he had EVERYBODY singing. It was never really about his voice (though his banjo could be virtuosic when he wanted it to be); it was about his genius as a song-leader.

--Charlie Baum

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Once Famous
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 12:19 PM

weelittledrummer, I will reply. I DEFINATELY lived through the 50s and 60s and have been aware of playing folk music since approx. 1958

I started out on banjo like everyone else with the red covered "How to Play the 5-string banjo" book. Quite frankly, outside of the basic strum, I did not learn to much. I learned more from listening to Dave Guard of the Kingston Trio and then later from Earl Scruggs on their records. You do not have to be a Pete Seeger fan to have a positive influence on others musically. Many others have filled that need for me. Please go ahead and perform Little Boxes if you want to. I could think of better songs that I perform, but for your show, well, it's your show.

I can understand that Pete Seeger was many people's hero. He really wasn't mine as far as a folk artist goes, but I want you all to know that I do understand how people like Art feel. I felt the same way when Waylon Jennings passed away after I followed his career for 35 years and know how much of an impact he had on me. some of you may think he wasn't worth it and that is OK if you express that, but you also have to realize that Pete Seeger wasn't that big of an influence to me as other folk and later country musicians were.

So, he is done with performing. Please quit moaning and be thankful for what you got out of him, but realize that for some he wasn't as significant as he was for you.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Art
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 12:16 PM

Of course, the ought to be "Pete played the banjo." And I was talking about a jaws/jews/juice/whatever harp. ;-)

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 12:13 PM

In 1979, after folksinger Michael Cooney had been horribly injured in an automobile accident with a drunk driver, we in Chicago did a large benefit for Michael.   Just four of us. Steve Goodman , Cindy Mangsen, Pete Seeger and myself were on the bill. Pete had terrible larengitis (spelling ?). (That's not a Greek name.) Pete did exactly as Cobber said. He'd croak out a first line, hit the banjo a bit, motion to the sudience---and the rest was magic. Eight part harmonies coming from the audience.

Eventually Steve Goodman took over and -- Bob Gibson came out and Steve led a finale "Mama Don't 'Llow" that took the roof of. Of course, steve picked the banjo on that one. I did my musical saw, jes harp and nose flute..."Mama don't allow no nose flute playing (picking ?) 'round here"

Pete was and is the best.

Art

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: cobber
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 04:46 AM

Just after I left school in 1964, I went to a party where everyone had to take their favourite record. I took the Weavers reunion concert and when my turn came, I played Wimowey. The thing some people miss about Pete Seeger is that the main instrument he plays is the audience. It wouldn't matter if he was 185 and croaking like a frog, his ability to get other people singing and enjoying the music is his strength.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 04:37 AM

Art, even when you're tired and rambling ...you're wonderful. That was very nicely put.

I think also Pete will be remebered for getting people to use the banjo as accompaniment when Scruggs and co had turned it so successfully into a lead instrument in a band. Pete made us look at Frank Profit, long neck banjos, fretless banjos and all sorts of different picking styles - frailing, Kentucky up picking etc.

It always amazes me you don't see Irish bands use that 5-string picking style for 6/8 time that Pete did the Irish Washerwoman with on his tuition album. Still I suppose the 5 string isn't an Irish instrument.

Perhaps Martin didn't live in the 1950's and early 60's and he didn't know how bloody stifling the bonds of conformity were for many of us, who found ourselves in Little Boxes, both real and metaphorical. it was an international hit - it had many resonances for us in England - growing up with rationing, austerity and our parents expectations. And yeh our parents were grateful to be alive after years of bombing and the menfolk having to go out and fight - but they weren't dumb - they knew they were being sold short. After all that's just sound economics for the right....dreams of paradise, my bottom!

If you don't get Pete Seeger..... I'm sort of sorry for you. I'm doing a gig tonight in Derby and I'll be doing a sort of tribute. Freight Train was the first song I ever heard Pete play, and it was on the London Palladium television show. It was the first time I had ever heard a twelve string guitar. He played Little Boxes and what did you learn in school today?

Martin don't bother replying to this, go out and do something nice. Try and influence one person to pick up the guitar and perform. Pete made that gift to millions of us.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 02:42 AM

I thought I knew Pete Seeger's music. I've listened ot his 1963 Carnegie Hall "We Shall Overcome" concert over and over again, along with al three concert recordings he made with Arlo Guthrie. I have so many Pete CD's I didn't think I needed to buy any more.
Then I came across the first American Favorite Ballads CD, and I discovered the traditional side of Pete Seeger. Pete's American Favorite Ballads songbook (Oak Publications, 1961) is nice, but the CD series should be even better. Five CD's are planned, including recordings from his five American Favorite Ballads LP's, and additional cuts from Frontier Ballads and American Ballads. I like Pete's political songs and all the other stuff I've heard, but I didn't know he'd do such good work on traditional songs like these.

There are three CD's out so far, with at least 25 tracks on each CD. Pete recorded 38 albums for Folkways from 1950 to 1964. This ballads series shows off Pete's work at its best.

I've always wanted to hear Pete in person, and I regret that I'll never have the chance.

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 02:00 AM

Check out the Pete Seeger Appreciation website. There you will see what many of us feel about Pete. He was only my mentor from afar, the man who precipitated all of my positive social tendencies, the one who showed me the glory of this music and an appreciation for the traditional discipline that is what at least one side of this folk music scene is all about. The Hammer Song, the incandescent Bells Of Rhymney, beautiful arrangements and tunes for several hundred traditional ballads and songs, Weavers songs, Almanac Singers songs, union songs, accessible versions of Spanish Civil War Songs, popularizing the work of Woody Guthrie, Tom Paxton and so many others. I'm glad to be able to say this man showed me the way by his shining examples all through the last half century. I MUST stand here and bar the way when this man is verbally trounced by a reurrected batch of verbal vigilantees who want to tear down all the good advancements since the New Deal in the name of maximizing the bottom lines of people who are already billionaires. This is not a diatribe against M.G. It is only a feeble try at standing up for Pete Seeger. By God, he sure stood tall through most of the last century pointing out to me and anyone with their eyes half open all the causes that it only took a bit of common sense to see the rightness of.

I am tired and rambling tonight and ought to hit the sack, but enduring a negative diatribe aimed at Pete in this thread discussing the sad loss of his abilities---not to mention the loss of his regular and valued presence in my life, yes, that is simply way over the top--and more than I will keep quiet for. Pete Seeger is the bright beacon that helped me to find my own road through the dead marshes of American show biz. For that I will always be thankful and grateful.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Jeri
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:48 AM

Eccclesiastes: there is a time for every 'C', son.

Turn, Turn, Turn might stick in my head too. It does that. I also remember Goofing Off Suite and Ode to Joy on banjo. I only saw him once in concert, with Arlo Guthrie, and had a great time. It seems like the end of an era. May he enjoy his retirement, earned many times over.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:20 AM

Guantanamera- Music by Jose Fernamdez Dias, poem by Jose Marti, adaptation by Pete Seeger and Julian Orbon. Incompletely attributed in the DT.
Turn, Turn, Turn -Inspired by Eccclesiastes (mispelled also?) but otherwise Pete's.
Now both of those will be running through my head, probably even after I get to sleep.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Peace
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 01:06 AM

Little Boxes: Malvina Reynolds
Turn, Turn, Turn: Eccliastes--word changes, Pete and I think the melody was his
Guantanamera: based on a translation of a poem (?) by Jose Marti

Golden Thread: I'm stumped on this one.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: artbrooks
Date: 14 Sep 04 - 12:46 AM

I remember going back stage...it must have been the early 1990s...to pay Pete after a concert he had done for our Madison (WI) folk group, and saw him putting on the braces he wore for his carpal tunnel. He was in pain every time he played his banjo, yet he kept on sharing his music with the rest of us. I read his "farewell" statement in SingOut a couple of issues ago, and was amazed then that he has lasted as long as he has. Best of luck to him and, after everything he has brought to all of us, I hope he has some years for others to bring things to him.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,MG, your 50 minutes are up
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:42 PM

Maybe Little Boxes was Pete Seeger's best known song as far as Martin Gibson knows, but he doesn't know much. Pete Seeger didn't write that song, but did he put together some of the best know songs of the 60s. Guantanamera, Turn Turn Turn, Golden Thread, lots of others. Some he wrote outright and some he took verses and put them to music. Either Martin Gibson doesn't know anything about Pete Seeger or he is just trying to get attention. What better way to get attention on a folk music forum than to badmouth someone like Pete Seeger? "I want some attention, I want some attention, I want some attention!"

Sad. Incurable.

S. Freud

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:30 PM

stupid and condescending, if not arrogant

A great capsule autobiography.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:18 PM

... and I don't think that conservatives in music are taking themselves too seriously. They can have fun with the rest of us if they choose.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:16 PM

Ooops.   Akroyd, Chase... same thing!

Still stirring the pot Martin!   I would look at the civil rights movement, the labor movement and the anti-war movement and the work all three did. I am sure you will knock each one, but that is your opinion after all.

You of all people find objection to something that is "stupid and condescending, if not arrogant."   I assume you don't own any mirrors? That is a hell of a thing to say about Art. I know you like to stir up crap, and I am sure you will send back an e-mail with a few choice obsenities at me, but so what.

You have a lot going for you Martin. You do make some very good points at times and I know you have a strong knowlege of music and history. It is a shame that you have to attack people and make such ignorant remarks. You lose all credibility when you do that. You could really make a difference instead of becoming a sad caricature of the right.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Marc Bernier
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:07 PM

Ron, you quoted Dan Akroyd not Chevy Chase. I too felt something lost, when I just saw this thread. I met Pete once about 10 years ago. I was cooking on a schooner that had been chartered by clearwater to do programs on the hudson. (The program has gotten so popular that the sloop clearwater can no longer handle the demand alone). Tao was music educator on board, and Pete stopped by for lunch and an afternoon sail. The 3 of us did the afternoon music program together. That will always be one of the highlights in my career as a musician. And your right. It's not about his voice or his picking. He makes everyone part of the event at that moment. I glad I got my opportunity to experience that.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Once Famous
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:05 PM

Art, that's fine with me. You don't seem to be living much these days anyway. And those "stupid little houses" were full of real people's dreams. You have no right to criticize that without being called a snob, or worse.

Pete seeger was best known for the song Little Boxes even though he did not write it. You do not need to have written a song to be most known for it. Plenty of examples on that.

I found the song stupid and condescending, if not arrogant.

Ron, you are absolutely correct about the two camps of folk music. There is the one that's in it for the music and there is the one that takes itself way too seriously and looking at the world today, has really very little to show for it.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: lucky_p
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 10:04 PM

Thank you, Art Thieme. I was sitting at my computer tonight trying to come up with the precise words to convey the precise feelings and thoughts, all with the right tone and right rhythm. But you said it, Art, you said it. It's not worth spending a plug nickel on, not one breath from my body will be exhaled in Martin's direction.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 08:30 PM

oops. I made an error. I meant to type John Lomax, not Alan in my above post.

fixed it for you - el joe clone -

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 08:11 PM

Quite a few years before Malvena was astute enough to portray that part of California as well as she did in her good song, Carol and I were driving past that place (Daly City) on the coast and we both mentioned, noted, and shook our heads over the agonizing sight of all those stupid little houses---all in pastel colors and each one, otherwise, a mirror image of the ones on either side of it---as far as the eye could see. That was long before the rest of America, one nauseating housing development after another, became blights on the landscape that made a prfundity out of another line from a decent little song: "They paved paradise and put up a parking lot."

Martin, take note...

Oh, hell, it's just not worth wasting good word and/or time on you.

As long as you live, I will never be provoked into responding to your sickening ranting again.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 07:02 PM

Bill, Don, and others, why do you respond to such vitriol and ignorance? It is of no significance, while you have much good to share with us. Please do and ignore the little potshots.

Maybe a new motto should be WWPD- What would Pete Do?!

Happy Retirement, Pete and thanks for everything!

kat

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: CapriUni
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 06:51 PM

This is not a "Pete Seeger moment" that I have remmember clearly myself (I think I was about 8 or 9 at the time) but one my mother reminded me of.

We were hosting a Clearwater (that "project started by Seeger" Bill Hahn wrote of) fundraiser at our house. I was sitting on the ground and flinched at the sight of a large beetle walking nearby. When Pete saw that, he commented: "It's only a bug!" According to my mother, I was never afraid of bugs after that...

Okay. So it's not a big, earth-shattering, life-changing moment. But to my mind, it reflects his general attitude that all life is to be respected, and that which is different is not to be feared.

Oh, and I always felt happy when I saw the motto printed on the head of his banjo: "This machine surrounds hate and forces it to surrender."

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 06:50 PM

Martin, Martin.   You ignorant slut.   (sorry Chevy Chase)

I'm not sure why you are making this so personal. I never attacked you and suddenly you come mocking me. Why pick on me? Well, it's your thing, so be it.

I do have to give you credit. I think you realized that most of us would respond to your

You will never understand what Seeger meant to us because you come from a different perspective. I respect that. Many people forget that folk music during the revival had two distinct elements. You help remind us. There was a strong conservative leaning with people like John Lomax and John Jacob Niles. The leftist movement also jumped on the folksong movement and turned it into a tool for social causes. If it wasn't for both sides doing their job, there would have been no folk revival. You can't give credit to one side without acknowledging the other.

I do understand your point about his singing of Malvina Reynold's song, but again you took things the wrong way. If you really listened to the song you would see that it was a gentle protest against the conformity that was taking shape in the 1950s.   He was not begruding any GI for following their dream. He is also a veteran, and he fullfilled his dream by building his own cabin, most of it with his own two hands.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: GUEST,Arkie
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 06:24 PM

Responses here echo many that were in the first thread on Mr. Seeger's impending retirement. Though he has championed many causes in his lifetime he has done it with class and has earned the respect that is afforded him. I have seen him in person and read many of his articles and have never known him to spue the kind of hatred that is so common today when people speak of those who hold opposing views. Much could be learned from him on how to address one's concerns. The enjoyment I have found in music is due in part to him. I have not always agreed with his political views, but I am saddened to think he will no longer be performing and helping others enjoy music. I can't imagine him not continuing to speak out for justice and freedom.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:53 PM

Well put---look at this. A simple posting about a concert and a question and all the people who want to be "published" as brilliant critics come out of the proverbial woodwork---people don't come out of woodwork. We do know what does

---and if the Hudson had not been cleaned up by a project started by Seeger there would have been much more rotten woodwork in the various riverfront communities.

Bill Hahn

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: BK Lick
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:49 PM

His song "Little Boxes"...

Tells a lot about the depth of someone's knowledge of folk music, don't it?

   -- BK

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Tannywheeler
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:47 PM

Play nice children.

Here's one of the great teachers/performers/encouragers of the last hundred years sitting down for a bit of a rest and you guys use it as an excuse to namecall, nitpick, badmouth each other -- on a site that probably wouldn't exist without Pete's long years and remarkable efforts. If your life is so full of bitterness and anger go to counseling or therapy. Do volunteer work at a local domestic violence shelter; clean your local waterways; train with the local gov't entity which staffs polling places and do something to make/keep the elections honest; etc. Do something to contribute to the health of your community, and, if you appreciate him, say your doing it in his honor. You might not have so much time (or inclination) to be nasty to each other. Grow up.

There's been a lot of good work and useful accomplishments done by many in the last half-century that's owed to Pete Seeger's inspiration. We should be thanking him (and Toshi) profusely, using that inspiration to carry on, and not wasting energy practicing viciousness. Haven't you learned anything?

I will cherish my personal memories of his warmth and kindness to me as a child; but as I became an adult I also learned to APPRECIATE his capacity to persevere in teaching/doing right -- day after day, trouble after trouble, setback after setback. If we can do half as well we might really bring about positive, healthy change and improvement in all areas.

I bet retirement from performing doesn't mean retirement from encouraging and helping the rest of us.   Tw.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:46 PM

Martin:---get your fact straight---Malvina Reynolds wrote Little Boxes. Seeger sang it---among others.
          Your last sentence re: Palestine/Israel is a bit disjointed and really does not make sense. My sense of his beliefs--and they are just mine--is that they translate into people getting along with people---in short humanity. Israelis argue amongst themselves about policy--Palestinians ditto. Seeger tries to put things into a human and world perspective.

            I don't know to what you are referring as to his songs on that subject---his most recent were about MLK, brotherhood around the world among others in that same vein.

             As to veins it is possible that you have been bled by dear Count Dracul aand a trying to suck the blood of Seeger now with your venomous and uninformed comments.

Bill Hahn

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Once Famous
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:38 PM

Ge Ron, it's hard when your heroes bite the dust, isn't it.

Political folk music really isn't my thing, basically. Yes, his voice has deteriorated, his banjo playing has deteriorated, and his IMPACT on music and politics saw it's limelight decades ago to all but a few old time hero worshipper folkies.

His song "Little Boxes" will always be the song I hate the most. He had no right to ridicule what was the WWII vet's American dream of building and buying a home for his family on the GI bill.

His support recently of the Palestinian causes hasn't won him any friends either, of course except his far left save the world from Israel pals.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:19 PM

Nice story Don. I enjoyed it.

Pete has meant so much to so many of us, its hard to put into words all that he has done for us - people like myself, who never met him, saw him perform live even.

he was a skilled interpreter in a time when even Bob Dylan sounded outlandish. He introduced us to all sorts of ethnic music and artists that we should never have been aware of.

A superb folk artist, songwriter, and from all acounts a good man.
I once wrote to him and he found time to write a personal reply.

I wish him and his family some good times together.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:17 PM

I'm high on a hill Martin watching you roll and tumble into your small and lonely crevice.

Of course there are others who had as much and perhaps more influence. Who said differently?   Why is it necessary for you to compare apples and oranges?

You are the one who is creating a limited definition of "talent". Perhaps you would like to point out where he "deteriorated".   I am betting you will say his voice, but that is not what makes Pete great.

Subject: RE: Pete Seeger's last concert
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:13 PM

An interesting anecdote that will show that some people never "are over the hill". Recently someone I know had Pete Seeger over to his house to ask him--as a favor-- to record on his home equipment Waist Deep in The Big Muddy (another still relevant piece) because this person had heard him in a local concert and was amazed that he still could hit the higher registers. Lo and behold, I am told that this recording came out quite well.

But, as Ron said, is right on the mark. With Seeger it was not really about the music---it was about an event or a cause. Yes, The Weavers it was both---Music and message---but no soothing massage of bland material.

As to songs staying relevant. Unfortunately many do---and not only Pete Seeger's---think older songs by Phil Ochs for example and also Tom Paxton.

This concert will be having a lot to do with a film that will be released shortly which was filmed as a tribute to Harold Leventhal at a concert in NYC which featured Pete Seeger among many others.

From my point of view---every last person who considers himself a "folk" or a "political" singer owes his career to Seeger and his ongoing causes that kept him and his music in the public eye. One of the most deserved Kennedy Ctr honors of recent memory went to him--rightfully so.

Bill Hahn