Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning

Subject: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: GUEST,bats
Date: 21 Oct 04 - 04:00 PM

Mudcat's comment on the lyrics of this song (from the Planxty album "Well below the Valley") surely misunderstands the song. The singer jilts his true love to marry "the lassie with the land": in the light of the last verse, the lassie with the land must be none other than the Queen (Victoria) -- in other words he has joined the British army and is bitterly regretting it.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: GUEST,Clara
Date: 21 Oct 04 - 04:07 PM

Kate Rusby recorded this song. In the cover sleeve it says

"a very well known Irish ballad from Napoleonic times. it tells the sad story of lovers separated by a governmental decree that single men, for monetary reward, shuld marry the wives of landed lords away at war so that the land would still be worked."

sorry if that repeats any of the previous thread, which I haven't read.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Oct 04 - 04:28 PM

See thread 6562 for these songs. As I Roved
Much already posted. Presume comments relate to As I Roved Out (2) in the DT. The comments are not "Mudcat's" but belong to the person who submitted it (MJ).
There are many versions of this song. The verse about the queen is an add on.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: GUEST,Dave Ruch
Date: 21 Oct 04 - 07:50 PM

I've always enjoyed the Seamus Ennis version of this song as recorded by Alan Lomax - I have it on an international sampler of Lomax's recordings. Unless I'm missing the boat entirely, it seems to be a fairly straight forward story about an eager young man courting an even younger girl and being fairly happy about it until the subject of fidelity/marriage comes up, at which point he hightails out of there.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 21 Oct 04 - 08:06 PM

You're thinking of one of the many other, entirely different songs, which sometimes have similar titles (in this case another also recorded by Planxty on the same album, and so often confused by the unwary).

"bat" 's idea is novel, but wrong.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 21 Oct 04 - 09:18 PM

When I see "As I Roved out...+ my mind goes blank. This line is as ubiquitous as the novelist's "It was a dark and stormy night."

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Nerd
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 01:40 AM

Also, Kate Rusby's note seems to be nonsensical; was there really a decree that a man would marry an already-married woman? Seems unnecessary; why not just pay him to work the land? Anyone know more about this?

I have often found KR's notes to be full of fancy: in her notes to "The Recruited Collier" she talks about the Yorkshire dialect words when in fact the song in in Cumbrian dialect, had nowt to do with Yorkshire at all. (As sung it is a purely a folk-revival phenomenon, so don't bother to defend her by saying "maybe it was in Yorkshire tradition too." It wasn't.)

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 03:20 AM

And, as Malcolm has already explained here, it has sod all to do with miners either,

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 03:22 AM

Sorry, that 'guest' was me. The new ISP swallowed my cookie.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Big Tim
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 03:31 AM

Planxty got the song from the singing of Bridget Tunney (mother of Paddy Tunney) of Beeleek, Co. Fermanagh.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 05:16 AM

I'm sorry, but I too, find the words 'as I roved out' a complete off-switch. And why is it always May? Did the buggers never do anything but wander up and down the fields looking for ploughboys and maidens? Presumably they were all wandering up and down as well.... (I believe the Kippers wrote about this phenomenon)

I also suspect that if you look too deeply into any song, they are all complete gibberish and the product of a deranged mind. Perhaps that's why I find it so hard to write "traditional" songs. *G*
LTS

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: GUEST,Hootenanny
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 07:47 AM

The words "As I roved Out" bring back to me memories of a great folk music programme (series)put out on the BBC on Sunday mornings more years back than I care to remember. The real McCoy featuring many field recordings of singers from Britain and the US with knowledgeable commentary by the collectors. That's where I first heard much great material. I'm sure the good old Beeb will have wiped those recordings by now but they were worth getting out of bed for.

Perhaps I've missed something in the above thread but how do you write a traditional song hard or otherwise ??

Re all the Mike Harding gripes? It is a crap programme so do what I do and hit the off button. There are other things to do and other sources of music.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Big Tim
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 09:04 AM

"The difference between folksong and poetry…if you see a folksong written down, most likely someone who's into English poetry will say, well, "That's doggerel", but, on the other hand, when you sing it, it becomes something much more beautiful. It may be doggerel but it becomes beautiful too".
Andy Irvine, Planxty, 2004.

Paddy Tunney, in his book "The Stone Fiddle", says that his mother called the song, "The False Bride".

Does the line referring to armies in "the West Indies, America and Spain" suggest that the song may date from around 1800.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 09:17 AM

"...field recordings of singers from Britain and the US with knowledgeable commentary by the collectors"

That would be Peter Kennedy...who had a good try at copyrighting the lot. These are (or used to be) in the sound library at C# House where his father Douglas was director. Very much doubt whether the Beeb still has 'em...

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: GUEST,Hootenanny
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 04:22 PM

I don't think so Countess, Alan Lomax and Seamus Ennis and Jean Ritchie also I believe come to mind. Almost certaily though Kennedy was involved.

As far as I am aware these programmes were commissioned by the BBC and presumably the recordings would be in their ownership ? I could be wrong though. I know that the series which came on the BBC around 1960/61 by Lomax used his own recordings from the 1959/60 trips he did (partly accompanied by Shirley Collins) in the southern states.
I still have reel to reel copies of these but I understand the Beeb doesn't.

I guess we are all aware of the copyright thing but this does not mean that the programmes weren't worthwhile. Did you ever hear them ?

As you brought up the subject of Kennedy, I looked at his website recently and must say I was not impressed with the claims he makes, particularly regarding two performers for whom I was handling contracts at the time but, as "they" say 'it takes all sorts'.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 05:36 PM

I remember hearing them on the radio as a child, Hootenanny, and listened to some later at C# House.   Peter Kennedy was the main presenter. You are quite right to say that the others you mention were involved in the collecting. I didn't mean to imply that the programmes weren't worthwhile; I was just having a dig at PK's proprietorial attitude to "his" material.

Subject: RE: Origins: As I roved out one bright May morning
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 22 Oct 04 - 06:10 PM

Liz the Squeak on writing traditional songs. Why not; songcatchers such as Sharp and Karpeles did it all the time, so there is precedent.
Well, not written from scratch, but altered, bowdlerized, etc.
I was looking up "Hares on the Mountain," and came across the one in "English Folk Songs for Schools," Gould and Sharp. I doubt it ever was collected in the form that appears in that song book.

Maud Karpeles made some odd changes, especially to choruses, where something like "Din-don-din" in a French song becomes "Derry Down," and in another, "Ei, ei, ei, ei, ei" becomes "Be you glad, rejoice the day!" (Austrian). By the way, all of the verses in her "Folk Songs of Europe," 1956, are copyright.