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Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival

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Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH! 03 Dec 04 - 06:12 AM
GUEST 03 Dec 04 - 09:05 AM
Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH! 03 Dec 04 - 09:48 AM
treewind 03 Dec 04 - 10:00 AM
GUEST,Jim 03 Dec 04 - 10:11 AM
GUEST,Jim 03 Dec 04 - 10:15 AM
GUEST 03 Dec 04 - 11:34 AM
breezy 03 Dec 04 - 11:49 AM
GUEST 03 Dec 04 - 11:51 AM
Chris Amos 03 Dec 04 - 11:54 AM
GUEST,Raggytash 03 Dec 04 - 11:59 AM
GUEST,Jim 03 Dec 04 - 12:04 PM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 03 Dec 04 - 12:20 PM
John MacKenzie 03 Dec 04 - 12:39 PM
GUEST,Another Festival Organiser 03 Dec 04 - 01:56 PM
George Papavgeris 03 Dec 04 - 02:13 PM
Scooby Doo 03 Dec 04 - 02:34 PM
John MacKenzie 03 Dec 04 - 03:08 PM
Raggytash 03 Dec 04 - 03:19 PM
steve_harris 03 Dec 04 - 03:53 PM
Scooby Doo 03 Dec 04 - 04:45 PM
GUEST 03 Dec 04 - 07:30 PM
Pat Cooksey 03 Dec 04 - 08:45 PM
GUEST,Guest 03 Dec 04 - 11:53 PM
Dave Hanson 04 Dec 04 - 03:23 AM
Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH! 04 Dec 04 - 08:16 AM
George Papavgeris 04 Dec 04 - 09:35 AM
Dave Hanson 04 Dec 04 - 09:51 AM
Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH! 04 Dec 04 - 12:52 PM
The Borchester Echo 04 Dec 04 - 01:00 PM
GUEST 04 Dec 04 - 01:01 PM
Scooby Doo 04 Dec 04 - 01:21 PM
Scooby Doo 04 Dec 04 - 01:23 PM
GUEST 04 Dec 04 - 01:30 PM
breezy 04 Dec 04 - 01:39 PM
George Papavgeris 04 Dec 04 - 02:38 PM
Blowzabella 04 Dec 04 - 03:23 PM
breezy 04 Dec 04 - 03:28 PM
George Papavgeris 04 Dec 04 - 04:48 PM
*Laura* 04 Dec 04 - 05:19 PM
Juan P-B 04 Dec 04 - 07:16 PM
Juan P-B 04 Dec 04 - 07:19 PM
Manitas_at_home 05 Dec 04 - 03:28 AM
Juan P-B 05 Dec 04 - 12:32 PM
fiddler 05 Dec 04 - 02:30 PM
fiddler 05 Dec 04 - 02:31 PM
GUEST 05 Dec 04 - 02:44 PM
breezy 05 Dec 04 - 07:59 PM
Cllr 05 Dec 04 - 08:12 PM
Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH! 06 Dec 04 - 05:19 AM
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Subject: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH!
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 06:12 AM

So, I'm fed up with the Moaners, the Whingers, the Jonah's, and the Completly Barmy!!

The important question is how can WE, the people who LOVE Sidmouth Festival and don't want to see it die, raise the money to save it?

I guess the amount has to be somewhere in the region of £300,000.
How do you do it AND ensure there is a yearly 'top-up' to ensure the future?

Any ideas anyone?

Lizzie


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 09:05 AM

I have not put my name to this for fear of recriminations and I know far too many people on the folk scene who will berate me for saying this, however EVERYTHING has it's allotted lifespan, birth, life, death. In death those who loved something should rejoice that they were priviledged enough to know someone, something ......... they should not seek to keep alive by artificial means, something that has run it's course. RIP Sidmouth


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH!
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 09:48 AM

Aha! My Very First Coward!

I see you've got your 'We Come to Bury Sidmouth Not to Praise Her! T shirt on! Move along and try to kill another festival please!

And PLEASE DON'T sit there and DARE to type that you once loved Sidmouth!

As you're the first coward in here, you've won today's Special Prize....here....catch!......I'm sending you a new T-shirt to wear! It's got 'I'm a Sidmouth Festival Lover Hypocrite' on! Wear it well for it will really suit you!! :0) :0)

Please don't take offence, but as this is my thread I just feel a lttle more as if I can really let rip about 'some' so-called Sidmouth Lovers!!

Please feel extremely welcome to return however, if you've any uplifting financial suggestions, otherwise, just go on the Sidmouth + or - thread and leave your opinion there.

And tonight, as you go to close your eyes, just think back and remember what Sidmouth DID actually mean to you and how you are now prepared to run away at high speed, when it needs you most! Urrggghhhh!!!! People like you make me just SO ANGRY!!!

It's funny, I always thought that just maybe EDDC would be the ones to kill Sidmouth off, or even the grumpy people in my town, but NEVER IN A THOUSAND YEARS DID I EVER think it would be the so-called Siddy Lovers themselves who would try SO hard to do it!

My God! I feel SO ashamed of you! Maybe it IS a good job you didn't leave your name after all!!!!   

Lizzie


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: treewind
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 10:00 AM

Look up "flogging a dead horse"...
The support should be coming from local businesses. Maybe a few years without a festival are needed for them to wake up to what they are missing.

I'm not convinced that Sidmouth is the best place for a big folk festival. Having been to some others recently I can see the benefit in having a really large indoor hall for the big-name events that make the money that's needed to finance the rest of the festival. The weather-dependency of Sidmouth's outside arena is its big problem, and the Arts Theatre isn't big enough.

I wouldn't mind being proved wrong, but I suspect if Steve Heap couldn't do it, nobody else will.

There, now you can hate me too, Lizzie!

Anahata


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 10:11 AM

Yep - I'd mailshot all local businesses and sell them what they should want to hear - that it'll add to their bottom line. I first went to Whitby in 1952 and it was a one-horse town that folks visited when it was raining in Scarborough. Visit Whitby now during Folk Week and do some mental maths - it's staggering. The Plough Inn(for instance) - 6 people behind the bar pulling a drink every 30 seconds from 10 in the morning till 11 at night x 7 days.

£35000 for the week is about the sum of it.

If your business community don't get the message - they don't deserve you. Lay it on the line for them in plain English

Good Luck


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 10:15 AM

Oh, and I forgot Lizzie - ignore the knockers


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 11:34 AM

Lizzie ..........I am not a Sidmouth lover, or hater come to that, but I am a realist and as such a fatalist, everything at some point must die. If you had taken the time to read my contribution before launching off into your tirade you may have seen that. I certainly will not lose any sleep about the passing of this or ANY other festival. There are festivals I have deeply enjoyed such as Amber which are no more, but other festivals have sprung up to take their place, it is an evolutionary cycle. You may well find that if Sidmouth were to cease, you found another festival that was even more to your liking, however that too in time will die or change to an extent that it relates little to the festival you once knew and loved.
The best example of this I can recall was Bracknell which in the 70's was probably (to my mind)the finest folk festival in the land which become a "music" festival.Finally anger is of no value unless it is channelled into something positive, so use your energy in ways that will either secure the future of Sidmouth or better still create a new vibrant festival elsewhere


Jim, I have long used the Plough and I'm sure the brewery would be delighted if your figures were correct, however the last time I had details info about the taking in the Plough, the year before Gil & Denise took over (7 years ago?) the taking were approx £21,500 for the week, even accounting for inflating ..........


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: breezy
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 11:49 AM

Its grown to be too large

It needs to downsize

The 'name' will ensure support from the music community, I wouldnt use the term 'folk' anymore since it diversified to become the cumbersome creature that it has emergerd.

Cut back to what it was once about.

Fri - Sun 3days,

realistic costs, and fees.

If it falls over, so be it.

Maybe Steve has seen it grow so large that it is a drain on his motivation.

time for another individual or small group to take the initiative, maybe?

Just food for thought, but when it started it was one of a few, now Fests are ten a penny.

Its not dead, just looking for someone to lead it into economical reality.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 11:51 AM

Guest you received the tax mans version - the 35K is a lot closer.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Chris Amos
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 11:54 AM

I must admit that I have only been to Sidmouth once in recent years, I do have very fond memories of the 60's & 70's though. It doesn't have to be run on the scale that Steve Heap ran it on, the real essence of Sidmouth is what happens in the streets and pubs, perhaps a smaller festivals for a few years would do no harm at all.

£300,000 is a lot of money to raise, I would be prepared to take part in money raising events, I could suggest to my local folk club that we should do a benefit, it would only raise £300 at most, are there 999 similar offers out there.

Chris


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 11:59 AM

Guest, the Guest is correct with his £21,500 for the week, but that was when Pete Tyler had it and that's many years ago, so £35,000 might be an accurate figure today.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 12:04 PM

Gil was asked, and confirmed. I'm not going to call him a liar, and if you spend as much time in the Plough as I do every year, you'll believe the figures. How much do you think the Whitby economy nets from Folk week!!


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 12:20 PM

i'll go along with the evolutionary perspective..

the concept of 'festival' maxed out in the early 80's

now most of them are too big,
overcommercialized/profiteering,
and inhospitable for true music lovers..

..any music event with more than 2 main stages and a couple of smaller act tents hosting performances all at the same time
is a test of endurance and frustration beyond reason..
born from the same corporate mentality as Sky satellite TV..

sick of paying to watch bands that have been scheduled
to perform at opposite ends of a vast crowded field
at the same time..
and barely managing to catch a full song or 2 from each one..
this might satisfy the soundbite requirements
of young trendy TV producers and advertising sponsors..
but these days i would'rt bother wasting my time and money
at any big UK festival..

i think i spent an afternoon at sidmouth in the late 70's
and thoroughly enjoyed the experience..
if thats the place where i sat on the beach watching bands
performing on a simple stage on the seafront..


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 12:39 PM

To come at it from a dfifferent angle; there are too many festivals, admittedly not many a good as Sidders. Look what happens when you try to organise a Mudcat thing, you get "Oh we're going to X that weekend, can you change it?", whatever weeekend you choose. Then there's all those closed folk clubs who couldn't afford to pay the sort of rates that acts now ask for, based on what they can make at festivals. Don't get me wrong for too many years good acts have worked for peanuts, but now all acts want megabucks not just the good ones. Look what happens when festivals are subsidised or encouraged by their local councils. Cambridge for instance was always eclectic, but I reckon my old mate Ken Woollard is spinning in his grave these days. A lot of festivals need to go, it would make sense, and maybe help revive a folk club or two. It's just a pity that Sidders is one of the casualties, there are others we could do without much easier. However if you can't get local businesses, and the council behind you you're doomed. There's also the fact that by trying to do it any other way you will incur resentment from people who will accuse you of interfering.

Giok


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,Another Festival Organiser
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 01:56 PM

First thing you need is the support of the local authority and the local business community. Sidmouth, sadly, no longer has either. The Council has cut its grant from £60,000 to zero. The business community have long refused to put their hands into their pockets to save the Festival.

If Steve Heap and Mrs. Casey Music, the best organisers in the folk festival world, didn't feel they could keep it going, no-one else with any sense will take it on. The financial risks are too great especially given all the hassles with the local Council on licensing and insurance.

The best bet for Sidmouth is to downsize dramatically. Let those who wish to still sing in the Anchor or dance on the Prom do so. Good luck to them. Those who seek major name concerts and the like will go elsewhere, taking their hard-earned cash to spend in areas where the local authority and local businesses give the Festival more support than is now the case in Sidmouth.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 02:13 PM

I will second what GUEST,Another Festival Organiser said. There are "festival towns" that truly embrace their local event and help it along. One of the best examples this year has to be Bedworth, where the discover of asbestos during refurbishment of the main venue comples (the Arts Centre) meant delays and non-availability of the venues. The town rose to the occasion to help Malc Gurnham (the organiser), and no less than 4 news superb venues came out of the woodworks, at least two of which were so pleased with how everything went, that they asked to be considered for next year also - even though the Arts Centre will be ready again by then. Two of those venues could support 3-400 audiences with huge stage for really big acts, giving rise to real possibility of sensible growth.

And the shopkeepers and traders and the townies of Bedworth are always supportive and welcoming to the folkies. Sessions to suit all tastes in three locations. Central location, easily accessible by road and rail.

Showy Sidmouth could learn from lowly Bedworth.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 02:34 PM

Your right George,everybody came out of the woodwork to help Malc this year,thats what should happen with Sidmouth all the clubs and pubs should support the festival in anyway they can and welcome us with open arms.
Scooby


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 03:08 PM

Sidmouth businesses will notice the drop in takings, and maybe then they'll realise, but they'll still do nothing!
Giok


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Raggytash
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 03:19 PM

OK I'll come out of the woodwork now, I thought my initial "Guest" thread in answer to Lizzie's initial thread might have been a lone voice and I realise a little contentious to say the least but I'm am pleased to see there are plenty of other realists out there, sorry Lizzie but I stand by my original postings, the King is dead, long live the King .......... things move on.

Oh and Jim. we must have sung the same songs and dozens of occasions in the Plough, the first time I went to Whitby and stumbled on the Plough I thought I'd died and gone to heaven!


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: steve_harris
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 03:53 PM

"Showy Sidmouth could learn from lowly Bedworth"

No, the folkies need to learn from this.

Bedworth takes place in late November in a rather ordinary midlands town. Hardly a tourist hotspot so the festival really helps the traders. Sidmouth in August is a completely different (commercial) situation.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 04:45 PM

No it is no difeerent at all,your making it different because its been going n for so many years thats all.
If Sidmouth had been going for a few years then it would be no different to Bedworth.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 07:30 PM

But in August Sidmouth would have the tourists anyway. So the local businesses may not rely on the festival for revenue as much as we may hope.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Pat Cooksey
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 08:45 PM

If Sidmouth council can't be bothered, there must be a reason. I
live in Nuremberg, in Germany, which hosts every year the biggest
folk festival in the world, 16 stages over three days, and all for
free.
Over 100 acts from all over the world, invited and sponsored by
the city of Nuremberg, this year more than 200,000 attended.
Work it out for youself.

Cheers, Cooksey.

P.S. Lizzie in Sidmouth, Show of Hands were a big hit three years
ago, I played with them, together with Sean Cannon to a huge crowd.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 03 Dec 04 - 11:53 PM

There's some good positive debating on this thread regarding the future of Sidmouth. What a welcome contrast to the childish postings on other threads.

Pat Cooksey makes the point that festivals abroad often get much better funding and support from their local communities than here in the UK. Everyone rallies round. But the bigger festivals abroad also have professional organisers because it is a full-time job making the whole thing work well.

Here in the UK most festivals are run by enthusiastic, dedicated amateurs who do it because they love the music and not because they hope to make a swift buck.

Perhaps those of us who attend festivals take the organisers for granted. We're not risking many thousands of pounds of our own money if things go wrong.

'Another Festival Organiser' makes some valid points above and those of us who enjoy attending festivals should perhaps give more thought to the views of those who organise things for us to enjoy.

Is Sidmouth worth raising lots of money for? Can the Festival survive and prosper? Not in its present form if the Council and local businesses won't help to fund it. They perhaps need to experience a year without a Festival in order to understand what they risk losing.

But that is not to say the dedicated diehards should not return to The Anchor or The Bedford and still enjoy a song and a jar with their friends in venues that have given consistent support to the Sidmouth Festival over many years.

It's the businesses who don't support the festival who deserve to lose out. Not those that do.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 03:23 AM

Lizzie, you forgot to mention Show of Hands.

eric


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH!
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 08:16 AM

Hi Eric! (Hello You!) I'm almost feeling too sad to mention Show of Hands today! Can you believe that?!!!!!

To risk losing this precioius, precious festival just fills my heart with tears! I make no excuses for losing my temper about Sidmouth for I've come to realise just what it signifies!

It's this TERRIBLE attitude that gets to me so badly! I do appreciate some of the points above and I too find some of them immensely interesting. But EDDC is not just cutting back with the Festival, every week something else goes down, a few weeks ago it was £400,000 off the Disability Budget, EVERYTHING is being pared down to the bone!

Why does this Wretched Government dictate that every Council must be Online, at vast cost, but they only pay a fraction of the cost towards it? Why are there all these crazy Health And Safety Rules? Why are there new re-cycling regulations from Above, but again no money to pay for it? Why the Licensing Act that is killing our music and our Festivals? WHY? WHY? WHY?

But MOST of all, WHY do we as a Nation and as individuals put up with it??? What has happened to us all that we all just lie down and take it?

It's just NOT good enough to stand there and say The King is Dead..Long Live The King! It's appalling to not be content to gently watch, as people try to bring Sidmouth back to life, but to actually step forward and Plunge the Sword in! In fact it's UNFORGIVABLE!
(And I hope that Ian Anderson reads this!!!!)

Yes! The businesses need to pull their finger out! As to the people of my town, loads love the festival, but Sidmouth has a HUGE amount of
very, very elderly people, just getting to the end of the day and still being alive is a major achievement, they have nothing left for anything else! It's not their fault!

Help needs to come from ALL OF US! EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US! And if you can't be bothered or think Sidmouth doesn't matter then just move on and leave Sidmouth to the people who DAMN WELL DO CARE! I have no respect for you or this 'Let's Kill Sidmouth Campaign!

I'll again put down the words that to me are the only words I want to read on the seered site, they are from Steve Heap:


.......< So to the 51st Sidmouth in whatever style it may take, I would ask you to support the Festival, support the organisers whoever they be, keep this great tradition alive and well for as long as you can and make it your gift to your children so that Sidmouth celebrates with a Festival forever.>........


Well, I'm damn well going to try and save it for my children!

All I'm asking is for people to stand alongside, to stand up and be counted, to get behind the Organisers, to try and think of ways forward!

I too am a realist, but I'm not a fatalist! We choose which paths to take and what we make of our lives. It's all basicallly up to us!
Sidmouth's future lies with each and every one of us and what we choose to do!


Lizzie

PS Show of Hands 4 Ever!! :0) :0) (Just to cheer you all up!)


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 09:35 AM

Lizzie, this must be your best post ever (not beeing cheeky here, I'm serious). This came all out from the heart, and your colours showed (oops, missus!).

I sympathise with your predicament. You had an excellent festival at your doorstep, in a town where the average age goes up 1 year every year, at least, and where little happens for the youngsters. I too would fight to keep the festival, or some sort of activity in any case, for my children, if I was in your place.

The majority of the rest of us however, and indeed the majority of the SIF attendees, have slightly different criteria. We DO want a good festival, with lots of good acts and a vibrant fringe. We would like it to be in an attractive place, too. Sidmouth has scored well there in the past.

But we would also like it to be easily accessible, and when we are there we like to feel that the townies are enjoying the atmosphere with us, and not hear mutterings if we go into one of the local shops. Here Sidmouth can "do better" (well not in accessibility, it's stuck where it is).

If Sidmouth was still so popular despite these latter drawbacks, it is a testament to the quality of the festival itself.

Faced with at least 30 brilliant festivals to choose from every summer, many punters look for "second best" closer to home every year. Now that SIF05 is looking like a fringe event with a few concerts, but without much of what made SIF04 the success it was, I think we can take it for granted that even more punters will look for other alternatives for their limited cash and time. No need to disparage them or call them names, they cannot all be "patriotic" about SIF - it's simply the market forces at work. And ranting at them will not persuade them to turn up at Sidmouth - more likely it will just annoy them; which is why I criticised some of your postings in other threads.

A scaled down, mainly fringe, event in 2005 may not be a bad thing anyway. Lots will enjoy it. And the reduced trading activity (as forecast) will be enough as a warning to locals; we don't need to cut off noses to spite faces here.

SIF05 will not be anything like SIF04. It will not have its size, glamour or variety. Or, indeed, its prestige. Pretending otherwise would be negative PR. But it will be good for some, whether for old times sake, or for whatever reason.

And then, we will all look forward to SIF06...


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 09:51 AM

Sidmouth is a bit too far away for me at the moment but everyone I know who has been has loved it. I would be fighting like you Lizzie if I was down there.

Best of luck, eric


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH!
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 12:52 PM

Ek Greko, it's not just Sidmouth I'm ranting about! I'll tell you the problem and why I get just SO..........!

When I look around my town in Festival time I don't just see the dancers and the singers and the 'stars'. I see people of ALL ages, all backgrounds,all nations, communicating in a way they'd never normally do, laughing, crying,
dancing, relaxing, drinking, all together, all in a place that is just so exquisitely beautiful that at times it takes your breath away!

There is nowhere else like Sidmouth! Not in the first week of August at least! It is just the Best Place On The Planet to be! If God himself had designed a backdrop for the glorious Festival that Steve Heap created, he could have done no better! It literally cries out to be danced in! The Byes..The Beach...Jacobs Ladder...Connaught Gardens....The Arena and Knowle.....The Storyteller's Tree.....The River.....The Living Map up on Salcombe Hill, where you can look down on the entire town below you and hear the music and the sound of the crowds drifting up towards you....The Ham....Blackmore Gardens....It just goes on....Beautiful unspoilt Regency buildings everywhere!

It's not in the middle of a field with vast car parks and chemical toilets staring at you. You don't have to trek miles through oceans of people, there is always somewhere to buy your bread and milk and loads of pubs! You just feel 'home'

And now for the TRULY important bit! My kids couldn't take school anymore, with all the violent bullying going on and the terrible stress that kids are under, they came out and now learn at home. I see first-hand what is happening, not just in our schools but to our children in general! A lot of them are literally falling apart and when I see Folk Festivals and I hear Folk Music I see a way back! Back to kindness and community, caring and sharing, back to old mixing with young and the young enjoying being with the old! It's about being able to enjoy yourself, feel free and let go and I'll fight as hard as I can to keep it! Not one Festival in this country should be allowed to die! Not one!

I've spoken to kids who've been 'burnt' by their classmates, not in Sidmouth, but in Exmouth, a young lad had Lynx Aftershave poured on him and then was set fire to! And what made my blood run REALLY cold is that it's EXACTLY the same thing that happened to a boy my daughter knew on Dartmoor, on the school bus, the very same thing took place! I could go on and on with stories but this is not the place!!

We are poisoning our kids' minds with foul videos and films that make your hair stand on end! They're drinking themselves senseless, younger and younger and NO-ONE is asking WHY!! Their 'music' is leading them down some Damned Dodgy Roads but Folk Music is DIFFERENT and it is SO Important to get it out there and get the kids into it! And THAT'S why I'll fight for Sidmouth, not just for the town, or for you Folkies but FOR THE CHILDREN, young and older!

I don't MEAN to upset anyone, but this was supposed to be a thread for people to offer helpful opinions, not just whinge on again about Sidmouth RIP! I think it IS important to keep the Festival going next year, not ever to lose that continuity. The danger is it may NEVER get picked up again!

Sorry to ramble on again but I seem to be getting more passionate about Sidmouth by the day!!! Don't know where it's coming from, I was going to move away a few months ago, but 'something' happened!!

So how about a Sponsored Walk by all the Folkies in the Country, all meeting up in one place to demonstrate about our music and freedoms being taken away from us? Is it time for a Folk Rebellion yet which can raise money along the way?!!! I'll walk!

Lizzie

PS Eric...could you give me 'how to explain yourself in just a few easywords' lessons? I'm in severe need!!!! :0) :0) Sorry everyone!


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 01:00 PM

Festival that Steve Heap created

No, he didn't.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 01:01 PM

I prefer the option of sitting in my lovely garden in the Yorkshire country side sipping wine next year.I wont be going on your walk or do any demonstrations,we have the right to say "NO" thank goodness.

You can do what you like it is a free country but i think your fighting a losing battle,if EDDC doesnt want a festival it wont pull any strings out to help even you.

Leave Eric the Red alone too,what has he done to be picked on by you?.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 01:21 PM

The first Director of


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 01:23 PM

The first direcor of sidmouth was Bill Rutter,which is how the the middle bar got the walking sticks named after him.Then is was John Dowell who is on the new list of directors followed by Steve Heap.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 01:30 PM

Your right Scooby someone who knows what they are talking about,Bill started the festival in Blackmoor Gardens working with EFDSS.Then Bill passed on and John took it over as his full time job well into the 80's when EFDSS had a hiccup this is when Steve Heap took over with Mrs Casey's music.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: breezy
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 01:39 PM

If any club or festival requires independant funding and fails to repay what is inherently a loan then its not very good at doing business.

If outgoings exceed income and a loss is made ,then thats not good economics.

If the council tax payers are pouring money down the drain then dont be surprised if the the funding stops.

If the town benefits financially from making an investment then it will continue to fund, if not ,then the funding will end.

There is no right to be funded, if you need capital then take out a loan and be prepared to re-pay it, with interest regardless.

How much did the average attendee pay for tickets and in admission fees to attend Sidmouth last year?
Do some people ever go to festivals and hang on the fringe going to mainly free sessions?
Do free sessions clash with organised festival events?


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 02:38 PM

Thanks for the response Lizzie. My kids thankfully grew up in areas of minimal or zero bullying, but I am sorry for what yours have been through. It sounds like you did the right thing to educate them at home, anyway.

Back to fundraising: Several of the Mudcatters are gigging artists. I, for one, would be willing to take part in a fundraising event, just for half of the petrol money and somewhere flat and dry to put my sleeping bag for the night. I am sure others would, too. And most of us would put the petrol money back into the pot anyway.

So, let someone (local) organise such fundraising events/concerts/series of concerts, featuring Mudcatter artists. Call them "Mudcat 4 Sidmouth" or something.

Other festivals have done this sort of thing in the past and are doing it this year again. The trick is to organise these events locally (to the festival), otherwise one can be liable to accusations of asking other parts of the UK to subsidise Sidmouth Town.

Pass it on.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Blowzabella
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 03:23 PM

Lizzie - believe me, I do understand how frustrated you are.

I am in a difficult position myself, as someone who is connected with a festival which is also having likely to have its Local Authority funding pulled. It is a little more tricky in my case, because the festival I speak of has, for the last xx years been organised by the local authority and they have met 2/3 of the costs. The organisers (of which I am one) are actually employed by said local authority. You will, perhaps begin to understand why my position is difficut.

I agree, it is so frustrating when something that you know is so good - and I do mean SO good - for people, as an educational tool, as a means of breaking down boundaries, as an economic development measure - all of those things - and (from my personal point of view) as something I have slogged over for nearly two decades of my life) - is threatened with cessation. All the stuff about atmosphere, friendships etc are all true. Festivals also have an uncanny way of taking over an (arguably) large portion of one's life - including mine. It has, undoubtedly, taken precedence, at times when, perhaps it shouldn't (ask my brother, whose wedding I didn't attend, cos it clashed!)

If the political will isn't there in whichever town is meant to support the Festival, it is going to be very very tough. I do, however, wish all of the new organisers the very best of luck and sincerely hope that they succeed - as does the previous organiser, who is clearly a magnanimous (?) person.

If the one I am involved with folds, I will be very sorry indeed. And I know that a lot of people will miss it very much. I can take some consolation from having being involved in something which has meant such a lot to so many people. But it is small consolation. Spare a thought too for how Steve Heap and the other organisers are feeling about Sidmouth. Some people might well have put so much effort into keeping the 'old' event going that they have neither the energy or inclination to be too vocal about 'the new kids on the block'.
I am aware this probably makes not too much sense - I'm on strong painkillers - hurt my back (sorry if I'm burbling)

I can see you have loved attending Sidmouth Lizzie and I hope you get to attend many more. I'm burbling - sorry everyone....


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: breezy
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 03:28 PM

Interesting idea, E G , but isnt that the rationale behind organising any kind of event, so therefore shouldn't the festival raise its own finances by its own shows and aim to make a reasonable profit to be re-invested in future ventures?

If you as an artiste take away more in the way of fee than you drew to your performance then you the artiste are taking and not giving.

And too many artistes are prepared to ask more than their appearance justifies.

In 4 years,only one artiste was concerned enough and ever asked if the club had taken enough to cover his fee, and that was Andy Irvine. Another agreed to reduce his fee for future engagements to help re-dress a loss made and that was Harvey Andrews. Another agreed to a fee that reflected the size of the club attendence, Martin Carthy.To these artistes I say 'Thank you'

Jeremy Taylor asks a reasonable fee as does Steve Tilston.

Geoff Higginbottom is very good value.

So if an ariste doesnt 'pull' who are they to demand 'fees'

In 4 years I have learned much as to who I can afford to book without it draining club funds. Certain artistes rule themselves out of the club market by being out of touch with grass roots, while some clubs do not take a realistic view of their own admission charges.

A geographical location can have a negative influence on attendance too.

Organising a Festival can be likened to running up to 10 club events at the same time, simultaneously, each event must therefore justify its own costs, ideally, but if one doesnt then hopefully another will so as to end up with a balance, but hopefully a plus surplus.

Or is this asking too much??


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 04:48 PM

Agree Breezy, my suggestion is only meant as a one-off interim measure in these extraordinary circumstances - not as an ongoing festival funding mechanism.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: *Laura*
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 05:19 PM

Lizzy - going right back to your first few posts - I love sidmouth. but I also have the sense to realise that it needs a break this year - it's too late. Do you plan to organise a fesitval in seven months? Let it go and start planning for 06 - you're just about in time for that!
I am confident this is not the end for Sidmouth. 06 will be as good as it ever was - without a half organised, confused muddle resembling something like a faded Sidmouth in the middle to put people off.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Juan P-B
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 07:16 PM

I'm at a loss to see how, if you don't have the support of the local council and chamber of commerce, how you can ever expect to raise that sort of financial backing.

I am all in favour of keeping any festival going but sometimes you have to see the whole picture and either (to use current jargon) 'downsize' or retreat & reform later.

It's interesting to quote a local politician from Fareham following the phenominally successful move of the Easter Festival from Gosport to that fair (?) town a few years ago

Following one of the best Easters that the local traders had experienced (and I quote) "in 30 years" the organiser attended the local council meeting to request the same take place the following year.

After reports from the police etc saying that the massive influx of over 4000 extra people there had been no additional adverse behavioral problems within the town - A councillor stood up and said (Again I quote) " This seems a very successful festival - Do we REALLY want it on our doorstep"

Now THAT is the sort of attitude that festival organisers (that is everyone from teh Steve Heap/Peter Chegwyn type festivals right down to your local Solent Song & Ale - just outside Southampton) have to deal with.

It was already mentioned about the holidaymakers who frequent Sidmouth at that time of the year - the local traders/B&B's etc can earn more from the 'grockles' than from the festival - If it was YOUR


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Juan P-B
Date: 04 Dec 04 - 07:19 PM

oops! Sorry - digitally inept

If it was YOUR livelihood would you take the lesser option??

By all means let's keep any festival going but at least take off the rose-tinted binoculars and see the real deal - If it was at all financially viable Mrs Casey would still be on it

Juan P-B


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 03:28 AM

From what I've been reading here the 2005 committee *does* have a lot of support from the local councils in the form of venues being made available.It's just cash that can't be provided. It would have been too late to budget for it anyway.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Juan P-B
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 12:32 PM

Ah! Point taken!

Winchester FF used to get sponsorship from the city council and the city council used to charge them exactly that amount to hire the main venue - something to do with accountants.

Once again, I say it's lovely to have the basics (the venues) and even if you have to get every guest on a shoe string I bet the other council expenses (police, traffic etc) would not be waived.

I look forward to Sidmouth continuing in some form or other and I will continue to support it in my small way as, although I have not been a festival regular (as it usually clashes with Broadstairs) I HAVE enjoyed many a short weekend there.

Juan P-B


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: fiddler
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 02:30 PM

The only thing I can glean from this thread is that Lizzie and Steve - both from ~ Sidmouth ~ should get it together both seem to have more opinions and the ability to know what is right in relation to everything. They could then rule the whole world (from Sidmouth) perfectly and we would only bother to say that which they approve and agree with, when we are told!

What a beautiful world - reaches for the poison bottle - goodbye cruel world - when I am re born hopefully Sidmouth and the world will exist as a folking Utopia where we can all sing and play perfectly and Festivals are all free and not dependent on weather or customers.

And of course festival organisors provide us with exactly what we want everytime, and as they are being organised to meet the demands of Steve and Lizzie they won't even need to ASK or discuss.

Andy


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: fiddler
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 02:31 PM

*WKD GRIN*


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 02:44 PM

second that


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: breezy
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 07:59 PM

Is there a proper folk club booking guests in Sidmouth, if so maybe it could expand its activities a little.


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Cllr
Date: 05 Dec 04 - 08:12 PM

breezy - there is no club in sidmouth the closest is the globe at topsham Pete hargreaves, (who does the booking ) spends most of the festival in the middle bar (heckling) cLLR


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Subject: RE: Raising Money to Save Sidmouth Festival
From: Lizzie in SASSY SIDMOUTH!
Date: 06 Dec 04 - 05:19 AM

OOHHH! 'Andy Fiddler'!! You come out here and fight me cleanly!!! GRRRRRRR! :0)

Right, first of all, I do not HATE anyone, I just HATE the attitudes that are being thrown around about Sidmouth! There has been far more sense spoken on this thread than I've seen in some of the others! There are some really interesting things coming out.

I'm just truly fed up with people coming on here to knock Sidmouth when it's supposed to be a thread about completely the opposite. If you don't want to see Sidmouth carry on, fine, but don't rub my nose in it! It's not poison I'm pouring out, it's anger! REAL anger that there is an element around who are doing their best to ensure Sidmouth stays down. I've decided to fight against it. That's all!

I've asked for people's opinions because I'm interested in opinions pointing towards that doing something CONstructive and not DEstructive! Anything else should go on the Sidmouth + or - thread!


And yup! You clever Fiddler you! You know exactly which buttons to press to insense me! Well done you. :0) Putting me in the same sentence as 'he who shall remain nameless' is one of them! Now, could we please just both sit back and let SOME people who DO have important things to say just say them!

Thanks Andy xx

(((((Wicked Grins to you too!)))))))

Lizzie :0) :0)


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