Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Strollin' Johnny Date: 31 Jan 05 - 12:19 PM Way to go Oakley - no one can argue with that! S:0) |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Pauline L Date: 31 Jan 05 - 12:36 PM When a newbie posts a question and someone says, "We've discussed that before," it can sound like a put down. It may sound like, "We've done such a good job that there's nothing left to say." I favor referring to the previous discussion, giving a link, and adding new thoughts. The population of Mudcat is constantly changing, and fresh viewpoints can be very worthwhile. Also, previous contributors may have something new to add. I hope we're all capable of new thoughts. :-) |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Big Al Whittle Date: 31 Jan 05 - 02:57 PM well anyway if I offended anybody here , I'm sorry. You're quite right, whoever said it, its your own fault if you lose your temper. Perhaps we all have to imagine the person's here that we are talking to. I'm sure most of us don't start rows with people who are guests in our own house. Its all part of the trouble I guess - all this impersonal freedom and we're like nudists running through cyberspace throwing off social conventions and flaunting naked emotions. Feeling the wind between bits of thought and feeling that haven't seen the light of day in years. all the best Big Al |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: PoppaGator Date: 31 Jan 05 - 03:32 PM I've been away for over 24 hours, so many others have answered WLD's question to me (about those asterisks) quite adequately already. But I'll say something anyway: Quote marks are never a problem, and the *'s are not intended as a subsititute for "'s. I picked up a practice I had seen others use in email and on various forums, to wit, using "open and close" asterisks for emphasis, like boldface and/or italics. Thanks to McGofH, I now know how to make real italics. I suppose you can get boldface similarly, using "b" instead of "i." (Yes! It works! Let me try bold italics) I suppose I'll have to change my ways now... I was quite surprised to see that he could get the correct bracket marks to actually print in a message, i.e., not to be "seen" as code and therefore as non-printing characters ~ I suppose it worked because they had spaces before and after: let's see if this works ~ < >. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 31 Jan 05 - 04:40 PM bbbbbbb bbbbbbb |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 31 Jan 05 - 04:42 PM And if you put Q in there instead, you get quote marks; if you put U you get underlinimg. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST,observer Date: 31 Jan 05 - 04:58 PM GUEST that started this thread: If you don't like it, stay out of the BS thread!!!!!! Otherwise, shut up. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 31 Jan 05 - 06:14 PM GUEST that started the thread actually made the comment in respect of music threads. As I indicated earlier, I don't think the criticism made of the Mudcat was that well-founded, however it has given rise to an intereesting enough thread, which stayed reasonably well-mannered - up until that last post by "GUEST,observer", anyway. Well, I suppose there are always going to be some like that - not that many, but too many. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST Date: 01 Feb 05 - 05:02 AM This isn't Google or an instant-help-desk; it's a preserved yet dynamic collection of contributions. If only it were just that. It is also a collection of contributors - and a fine lot they generally are. But there does need to be a balance. Is there a case that far too much attention can often be focused upon judging who it is that may be contributing - rather than concentrating on the contribution itself? |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Azizi Date: 01 Feb 05 - 11:58 AM In the short time that I've been posting here, I've probably ruffled the feathers some people by asking questions about traditions that are highly esteemed by them {such as Morris dancing and the custom of blacking up}. I also know that my mention of race/ethnicity has irritated or angered some folks here who believe that this music site and/or music in general [is or should be] color-blind. But I'm pleased to say that I've had only a few 'nasty' [mean]comments. Also [though this wasn't the question]I would add that there have only been a few occasions in my 5 months posting here that I've received what I would consider to be purposely racially offensive public posts or argumentative PMs. On those occassions other members/guests have posted supportive comments on the forum and I have received supportive PMs. Usually I try to 'play pass' {ignore}these comments and those commentors. Once it seems clear to me that a person is commenting for the fight of it all, and not genuinely seeking information or understanding, I disengage. So yes, I have walked away from threads and will continue to do so. Some people may think that I shouldn't walk away from a pot after I had stirred it up..but my intention has never been to raise an issue to provoke an argument or to declare my position {the only right one} and any other position completely wrong. With regard to subjects such as the aforementioned Morris dancing and blackening up, I feel that as a result of my engagement I better understand the folks who are involved in those traditions and I believe that many of them better understand my concerns...Therefore I count it worth posting to such threads or introducing such threads to be worth the possibility or reality that some people will be annoyed at me. Although I don't want to be considered as speaking for any other person or any other African American but myself, sometimes I do find myself giving the [a] Black point of view or seizing an opportunity and turning it into a teaching moment {to raise awareness about African American culture and perspectives}. It's my nature to do so and I've clearly admitted it's part of the reason why I'm here {or if I didn't clearly admit it-I do so now}. Hopefully more African Americans and other people of color will begin to post regularly on Mudcat Cafe. This place is so rich in information and generally so welcoming that it would be a shame for newcomers of any race or ethnicity to be turned off by the atypical few. Ms. Azizi |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 01 Feb 05 - 02:09 PM Azizi has initiated and contributed to some very useful and interesting threads; and I haven't seen a single post by her that messed things up by the way she responded to potentially provocative posts. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST,Frank Date: 01 Feb 05 - 06:10 PM Passions run high in a true democracy. Mudcat is a true democracy. Frank |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Azizi Date: 01 Feb 05 - 06:20 PM Thanks, McGrath of Harlow Azizi |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: wysiwyg Date: 01 Feb 05 - 07:17 PM GUEST 01 Feb 05 - 05:02 AM, Of course that's also true. What I think happens sometimes tho is that people will wring an upset out of a post that is merely brief.... that a lot of human beans tend not to say "this hurts me" but say instead "YOU failed MY manners standard". I'm not a mind-reader, and I certainly don't mean to give offense in brevity. BUT I also think the expectations new people bring here often are part of the instant-internet-gratification stuff rampant in the culture today. ~Susan |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Gypsy Date: 01 Feb 05 - 10:25 PM Initial Guest, you REALLLY need a name! Oftentimes, if a thread is out of control, or veering a direction that is distasteful to me, i will PM a person directly with pertinant information. I can't be the only one who does this. You might get alot of answers, and avoid the fighting. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: The Shambles Date: 02 Feb 05 - 01:57 AM Passions run high in a true democracy. Mudcat is a true democracy. I think perhaps the forum may require a few more elements to qualify as a democracy - let alone a true one. Passions tend to run equally high - if not even higher in a dictatorship. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST,ragdall Date: 02 Feb 05 - 02:33 AM It is difficult for a newcomer to learn the unwritten rules of conduct in this forum. They seem complicated. Are there some topics that are off limits in the BS section? How do you decide whether a post was intended to create a thoughtful discussion, or to inflame? Would a topic be more likely to gather responses if it were posted by one of the long time contributers than if it were posted by someone who is new to this forum? It sometimes appears that the interaction between people who have established connections and relationships here, (both "positive" and "negative"), is more important to participants than the actual substance of the posts. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST,McGrath of Harlow Date: 02 Feb 05 - 02:16 PM There aren't those kind of rules, ragdall. But I think once we start reading between the ones about people's intentions that can be dangerous. The best rule here, I think, is to always assume the best about people's intentions. If we are wrong, it will rapidly become apparent, and nothing is lost. If we do it the other way, and assume that someone is hostile, when they aren't in fact, and react accordingly, we do genuine damage to the Mudcat. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Guy Wolff Date: 02 Feb 05 - 03:27 PM Guru and Leadfingers, THanks for your question and Lead's clarification . All the best . guy |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Raedwulf Date: 02 Feb 05 - 04:04 PM Azizi, First time I've seen your name (I tend to hang around the BS section & fight dirty! *grin*), but I reckon your post of 11:58 would make a pretty good "Rules of the Road" for a Mudcat beginner. Especially the last line. It could almost be a Site by-line! |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST Date: 03 Feb 05 - 03:42 AM I used to be a regular but recently some of the back bitting has been overwhelming and not what I joined Mudcat for, so I stick with the lyrics and music which are invaluable. I think its very sad what this place has become, to what it used to be. Perhaps one day it will get back to what it once was. |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 03 Feb 05 - 04:37 AM Well, at least I don't have to worry about all this 'fool' nonsense... |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST,The Shambles Date: 03 Feb 05 - 10:50 AM Very often the strong elements of something can also be its weakness. The ability to find folk who post things that interest you or are involved in similar things lead us to make closer contact over time. Sometimes this is possible - if you live close enough but mostly this contact is confined to the forum or via Personal Messages (PMs) etc. Over the years this has lead to the current situation where the forum is groups of posters (known in some degree or form to one another) who tend for some reason - to need to judge the worth of other posters entire personalities - based purely on what is contained in their posts. Often building up a picture of this person - which may have some truth in it - but one that is just as likely to be right as wrong. For some posters - for some reason - also seem to have a need to create a personality here to post behind - which may in fact be nothing like their real one. Pretending not to spell very well or adopting a 'hicky' way of writing etc. I am not too sure what can be done now to address this need for all of these judgements to be made and seemingly encouraged - but I am pretty sure that it what contributes to what is referred to as the nastiness some refer to here. It is not always that these judgements of other poster's personalities are nasty - but it is that they do seem to be needed for some reason and have become very much part of the forum and not I suggest - to its benefit. However, there is no real need for any judgements of people and their motives - for how in all truth can you tell this from a posting or even a series of postings? Surely all that is required is just for a personal judgement to be made by each contributor of that contribution - as to whether to respond or not - to what is said in the post........? |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: Azizi Date: 03 Feb 05 - 10:41 PM Raedwulf - I appreciate your comment & compliment. And I would also mention that this is the first time I saw your name too... As I mentioned in my post, I'm relatively new here, and usually post above the BS line. I guess being a church girl book worm music lover I never learned how to fight dirty... Although sometimes somebody has to fight dirty, and maybe the occassion would arise that it might be me..But I'd rather fight smart..or not have to fight at all... Peace, Ms. Azizi |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: PoppaGator Date: 04 Feb 05 - 01:16 AM I was surprised that Azizi and Raedwulf just "met" for the first time. Both names have been familiar to me for at least several months. There are so many different discussions going on here at any given time, and none of us could possibly participate in all of them. Since everyone has a different set of interests, we encounter each other in different threads; each of us has areas of interest that "overlap" with those of some fellow members more than with those of others. I recently noticed a clever pseudonym for the first time and figured the person must be a new member. I clicked on the name and learned that he had made literally thousands of posts, both music and "BS," and has been a member much longer than I have. I could not even perceive a pattern in the titles of thread to which he had contributed that indicated that his interests were notably different from my own. How could I possibly have missed him? Coincidence, I suppose. When I consider this case, and then think about the many members who have become very familiar to me, constantly posting to the same threads, I don't know what to think. So, think about it. If you find a particular individual especially annoying, it may reflect on you ~ the very fact that you continually encounter each other indicates that the two of you have quite a bit in common. Otherwise, you'd never bump into each other. So, try to "accentuate the positive" by concentrating on that common ground! |
Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness From: GUEST,Mrr Date: 04 Feb 05 - 02:58 PM Seems pretty benign lately, at least... |