BS: Mudcat Nastiness

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Pauline L
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 10:41 PM

I agree that the great majority of exchanges on the Forum are civilized, even friendly, and frequently helpful. The few that are not, however, can be quite painful to thin skinned people like me. I find it reassuring to read that other people feel the way I do. I don't go for "Life is tough, so get tough." I go for, "Show a little respect."

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Sorcha
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 10:24 PM

I just don't respond or post to the nastiness anymore. I think it's called Growing Up a Little Bit. I am sick of it, and as a result, don't do the threads much anymore, esp. the BS ones which I used to enjoy. Oh well. I'll stil do Lyric Searches.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 09:04 PM

I'll try and be nicer to people in the future.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: robomatic
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 08:59 PM

I think a response can be abrupt but helpful, such as "why not do a search in digiTRAD, HERE'S HOW". Most people here are knowledgeable and real helpful, and some of the long lines of information spawned by a simple inquiry of lyrics such as I experienced with Whisky in the Jar and an old Alaskan song "30 US on the Wall" are simply astounding.

And of course, it helps if you're persistent.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Guy Wolff
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 08:17 PM

Leadfingers . I did not recognise this as trolling . Interesting . Thanks for the perspective . All the best , guy

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Leadfingers
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 08:13 PM

I have said it before and will no doubt have cause to say it again - If the regular sensible (Sometimes) people in here did NOT respond to the obvious wind up trolling , there would be a lot less nastiness !

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Peace
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 08:00 PM

GUEST

From your perspective you are correct, of course. I would however call your attention to the number of times GUESTS (visitor) ask for information that requires some fairly serious digging, have their question(s) answered within a few hours, even have the info sent to them by e-mail, and not a word of thanks returned. That happens too. Does that mean that we stop trying to help people or ignore them in future? I don't think so.

Bruce M

PS That's a bit much coming from me, since I have only ever been able to find stuff for maybe 15 people. I'd guess that 1/3 of them didn't say a word of thanks. Hey, the others did, though.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Bobert
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 07:35 PM

Well, this is my take on what's going down... Artists are the unfortunate ones who have the responsibility to try reflect what is going down around them. It's always been that way and always will...

I think what we are seeing in the "folk community" is just that...

We're not living in the 50's, ot even the 60's... There a lot of fundamentalism, dogmatism and polarization.

It's no wonder that folkies are a tad on the edge... To not be would be irrespnsible...

Jus' my take...

Wanna fight? Jus' kiddin'...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Guy Wolff
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 07:23 PM

I am so thankful for the great friends I have made here . The musical subjects that have been brought up have really been of interest to me. I think one answer is that life takes effort. I am sorry we sometimes meet rude people but if your interested and motivated about the subjects you'll meet some life-time friends in here . THe musical adventures Ive had in person with other mudcatters has made a real difference in my life.There are to many to thank.
                   It dose start with coming forward and saying this is me ( Im so and so and Im real ) and I love blues or old time or whatever and then meeting over voices . Some are worth the work others side step .
                Guest your conplaint is very understandable and I would love for it to be nicer in here but life isnt that easy . You have brought up a good subject (again ) and i would PM you if you told us who you were. All the very best , Guy Wolff

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 04:44 PM

Was "GUEST Date: 29 Jan 05 - 12:44 PM" the same as "GUEST Date: 29 Jan 05 - 02:03 PM"? Why not use a label for the thread just to keep things clearer, and show a friendly attitude?

I'm with Amos on this - my impression is that the overwhelming majority of responses to questions are polite and welcoming, with people falling over themselves to be helpful.

Sometimes you get the odd pillock who got out of bed the wrong side. Occasionally you get people who come on all paranoid because they talke a genuine question as soem kind of wind-up. And sometimes you get people who set out to stir things up, which isn't too hard to do...

But mostly it's pretty friendly here - I can only think of a couple of Mudcatters who can be more or less relied on to be nasty, and that's not bad for any community of this size, online or in the flesh.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Jim Tailor
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 04:36 PM

One helpful tip: What is polite to a fellow from the US is not the same thing as what is polite to a Brit (at least not the Brits represented here). No right or wrong implied -- just a difference that causes misunderstanding.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: GUEST,marks
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 04:30 PM

The very first time I posted a question here I was jumped on by ***** who asked "Who are you and what do you care." The response from other catters was to tell ***** to p*** off and to welcome me and help me with my request.
Please stay and contribute. Sure, you will find some thorns among the roses, but most differences of opinion are cogently argued points of view which will make you ponder even though you might not agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: artbrooks
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 02:14 PM

Actually, the very vast majority of the people who "live" here are both polite and helpful. Then there are the others, probably less than half a dozen, who poison the atmosphere by their trolling for irate responses, profane, obscene or scatological comments, and juvenile rudeness. I guess that the best available option is to ignore them completely, but that can be hard. Many of us, myself included, find it difficult to resist being drawn into some sort of dialogue with them, and regret it afterwards. But please stay, or come back often...and it would help us to distinguish you from others if you would use some sort of consistent name.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: kendall
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 02:10 PM

When I was a new member I asked a question and one of our most popular members jumped all over me. It was somewhat irritating, but it didn't destroy me, nor did it drive me away. We learn by making mistakes, not by doing something right. Besides, I figured I could kick his ass if called upon to do so.
Seriously, it is only a very few who make life unpleasant for newbies, and they certainly don't represent the majority.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 02:03 PM

Yes, there is a ton of good stuff and knowledge here but there are also many people who could contribute even more valuable info but who are put off by the rudeness and general unkind atmosphere. It's a shame. Like many, I use the information but don't contribute because I've had my hands slapped too many times. I don't mind being corrected or having someone disagree, but things escalate into personal attacks so quickly. It's just cyberspace so I don't dwell on it, nor do I visit Mudcat very often, and I suppose my possible contributions are no great loss considering the well informed folks who do post here, but how many other people who are gold mines of information have started to get involved, been ridiculed and insulted, and just said "Why bother".

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 01:38 PM

Tricky stuff, isnt it. theres sneering hatefulness and theres free expression. I fear I may bave been a hateful sneerer in the recent, what is wrong with being a purist thread.

|Certainly I stopped myself from contributing further to the debate, because my bitter words were doing nobody any good least of all myself.

Part of the problem is of course we are here on this page because we care passionately about the music. Of course that doesn't excuse you from caring about other peoples feelings.

However I've seen too many of my contemporaries who have given their lives to the folk club movement in England and ended up without even a living, to feel anything but anger at the kind of person who sneers and doesn't even know he's sneering at other peoples lifes' work.

all the best
Big Al Whittle - proud unrepentant member of anything goes brigade

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Guy Wolff
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 01:33 PM

I think its a bit like skiing. In the begining stay to subjects you love or respond to things you find reallly interesting.Stay off the mean slopes. THreads that start with nasty titles are not worth your time... I have worked very hard to only talk to people and subjects I am inspired by . The northumberland pipe comunity is just awsom and the same with the gang around Beverly and Hull. THere is still a ton of fun to have in here.I do miss some of the great music minds that lived here for years .If you are interested in open tunings for guitar for instance you can spend a month researching those threads . So thankfully there is a ton of music imformation in here . If you side step the small stuff there is a very large conciuosness to get . Good and optomistic hunting !! All the best , guy

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Jim Tailor
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 01:31 PM

People are pretty much what you make of 'em -- anywhere you go. If you think they'll be friendly, well then friendly they will seem. And if you think that they'll be nasty, well then, that's the time to take out your big stick and beat the shit out of 'em.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Nerd
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 01:30 PM

Yeah, I just got called a dope on another thread for saying something that was technically correct. I just don't take offense when I'm here, that's my secret. So what if some other catter calls me a fool? I'm secure enough to know when I have been a fool and when I haven't!

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Amos
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 01:27 PM

Ya know, I'm sorry, but I never experienced that. I got politely answered the first time I asked for lyrics, even though the song was in the DT, and I hadn't found it there because the search tool was tricky.

I don't consider sweeping generalizations about bad qualities to have any merit, because I know in any population there are a small number of folks who can make everything look bad by their negative attitudes, and its a survival skill to see through that and recognize the actual experience behind the sweeping generality is often one or two interactions.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 01:19 PM

Seems like several of the answers to my very first information requests on the Mudcat carried the implication that I was somehow lacking in either musical sophistication or mental acuity. So I got even by becoming a member. I'm still around but every one of the people who made those disparaging comments is long gone.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 12:59 PM

" New members who venture to ask a question are quickly driven away by sneering hatefullness"

no, many adjust just fine to the fact that 'some' unfortunate remarks are made.....not all requests are met that way, by any means. I'm sorry if you had some bad experiences.

The forum IS slightly moderated, but it is so VERY hard to decide where to draw the line between true nastiness and just general careless replies. Remember the **FORUM** is not the problem...it consists only of hundreds of individuals, and the reply you get could be positive 87% of the time, depending on who happened to first reply.

It is best to point out specific places where you might be offended...and if YOU are a member, you could discuss it privately with the offender...if THEY are a member.

This place is like life...there are real people behind these posts. Try to shrug at the bad ones and enjoy the good ones...

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 12:57 PM

Yes, but Life is not controllable. Forums may be. This forum is a good training ground for Life, because it's basically pretty wide-open. That's not a threat, it's an opportunity for growth.

You find what you look for. Look for what pleases you, and don't worry about the rest. There will always be problems in Life. That does not mean we need a "moderator" to control it all so that we can remain in our little chosen comfort zones all the time. If we did, we would not learn much of anything.

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: mooman
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 12:53 PM

There is no excuse for some of it you're right. I'd prefer to see a little more self-restraint and general respect for others though rather than moderation or censorship. I tend to now post less because of some of the general unpleasantness.

Peace

moo

Subject: RE: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 12:52 PM

I'm afraid to say this, but if you'd done a search on this, you'd have found enough crap to fertilise the Sahara desert.
Giok

Subject: BS: Mudcat Nastiness
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Jan 05 - 12:44 PM

I used to be a member but gradually stopped posting due to the constant sniping, sarcasm and general unpleasantness that seemed pervasive on this site. Recently I had to do some searches for lyrics, origins, etc. I have to say, the information on this site is wonderful but my God, if the people on this forum are representative of "folkies" in general it's no wonder the genre is dying out. New members who venture to ask a question are quickly driven away by sneering hatefullness i.e. "Why didn't you do a search...." which they may not have known about when the posted. Anyone who ventures an opinion is subjected to withering scorn and sarcasm - very seldom is the attitude taken of "While I respect your tastes, I don't share them and here's my view". I truly wish this forum could be moderated/censored. There's no excuse for the rudeness that goes on here.