finding a metal clarinet

Subject: finding a metal clarinet
From: GUEST,Fogie
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 06:19 AM

I am interested to find where I could purchase a metal clarinet such as I have seen in Europe.I believe they are made in the middle east, and look very thin -a skeleton tube with the keys fixed on - more like a sax to look at. Anybody knows where I could go to on the net to find out more, and are they called something other than clarinets?

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: s&r
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 06:45 AM

Some here

Stu

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 06:45 AM

If it looks like this metal clarinet its a kind that was very popular as a student instrument a few years back. The metal ones have been mostly replaced by plastic (they call them "resin" clarinets).

In my area, the metal ones are abundant in pawn shops, but mostly unplayable without a bit of work. New pads and some cork work often will do it. Getting an old one put in playable shape may be more expensive than getting an old one.

If this isn't what you're looking for, we'll need a name for it - or a picture - to make our guesses about where you might find what you want.

John

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: Jeremiah McCaw
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 09:04 AM

I had one. Played it when I was so much younger, practically in another lifetime, it seems.

Stop looking for one, unless it's real cheap and you just want it for decoration on a shelf.

Based on my experience, the cheapest, crappiest wood student instrument has noticeably better tone!

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 09:09 AM

Try 'Lark in the Morning' - they used to have one in their catalogue - their website - www.larkinam.com - in key of G or C I think, definitely not in one of the normal 'band keys'. It is supposedly the type played in the Middle East.

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: s&r
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 10:35 AM

One on this page - dead right Robin

Stu

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 23 Aug 05 - 12:54 PM

If you just want a clarinet, I just saw this one in the store yesterday at Sam's Club, at about the same price I paid for my Selmer Bundy (resin) one in 1956. No recommendation, but the price is right and it looked pretty flashy.

The detail at the link indicates "two tuning barrels" which probably means you can swap barrels to be "in A" which will be a whole lot easier to play with your bluegrass buddies than the standard marching band Bb tuning.

(They've also had a $70 (US) guitar recently.)

If you're wanting the metal one for some "effect" (you have basket and python, and need music to make the snake dance?) they should be pretty easy to find at any "used junk" market. If it's for a particular tone, and you're not already an accomplished clarinetist, you can be assured that anything resembling a clarinet will produce an entire range of rude and bizarre tones while you're learning. A reasonably practiced player can do most of them on purpose. If you actually want something to play, I'd second the comment above that a standard wooden one, of good quality, will be easiest to play, with modern resin ones close. Either will be much better than the old metal ones - based on trying a few ca. 50 years ago.

John

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: SharonA
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 01:18 AM

I have one that I purchased at a local antique/junk store some 15 to 20 years ago. It is in a condition similar to most of the ones shown on the pages linked in this thread (i.e. it needs new pads, some new springs, and polishing; and the case shows wear and tear). I remember that I paid $50 U.S. for it back then.

I've never had it repaired because I've never done the research on where I should have the repairs made. If I let the local music/instrument shop send it out to their usual repair shop, I'm afraid they might botch the job because it's an antique instrument. But I don't know where else to take the clarinet, where it would get the T.L.C. it needs from a professional knowledgable about metal clarinets.

Perhaps someone at Mudcat can address my concerns in this thread (which might also be helpful to Fogie if and when he finds a metal clarinet in need of the same sort of repair). If so, please help!

Thanks,
Sharon

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 05:14 AM

SharonA

Unless there's something unique about your metal clarinet, like perhaps some rare obsolete key mechanism, it's probably a student model just like the several thousand others gathering dust in pawnshops. While it may be old enough to be considered an antique, old alone doesn't make it a "rare and valuable antique." Even having an obsolete key system doesn't make it particularly noteworthy; it has to be an almost unique obsolete system. Any instrument that does have significant "antique value" probably should not be repaired, since the collectors who might want it would want it in "original condition."

Any instrument service person accustomed to working on flutes, which are quite often metal, and/or saxophones which nearly always are, should have the necessary skills and equipment to make a metal clarinet "playable." When such instruments were in common use, it was usually the Junior High School band director who "serviced" them, including, when necessary, salvaging parts from three to make one that worked. For the most part, the "pieces and parts" required - pads and cork, - are the same as would be used on a "real" clarinet, except for the possible bit of silver solder to plug any extraneous holes. There's little that can be done to such an instrument except removal of minor corrosion and looking for the place where a pad or a cork fell off, and gluing a replacement in the existing socket.

Because of the time/labor involved, a complete refurbishment of most such instruments will cost considerably more than the value of the restored instrument. That's the main reason there are so many of them in the hock shops.

You should, by all means, get an "appraisal" and/or a repair estimate from anyone who works on band/orchestra instruments, but the most likely recommendation will be that instruments of this kind are "not worth fixing." If it happens to be a "name brand" by a manufacturer who's still in business, they might offer authentic restoration service; but it won't be cheap. You could write them, or possibly email a query. You probably don't need to worry too much about any repair shop "spoiling" your antique, because they can't afford to spend the time on it to do anything but replace the soft parts.

Sorry if this sounds cynical, but I've got a rack full of old 'uns that aren't worth fixing, and literally can't be sold. My silver plated 1934 Martin tenor saxophone might yield $1.18 worth of silver plate if it was chemically stripped, and that's about the most it's worth. My 1956 King alto is about 3 pounds of scrap brass, 6 cents a pound, on the open market. (But they look right purty sittin' there beside the fireplace.)

John

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: GUEST,Fogie
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 07:08 AM

Many thanks - it appears to be a Turkish low G clarinet, I dont trust the look of the e-bay model and was surprised by the cost of the Larkinam site model. Any body in the UK know where they might be found? I think they are easily repaired with standard clarinet parts- its just the key that is attractive which is why I dont want an orchestral one.

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 07:18 AM

I was dissapointed by the price of the Larkinam one too, I too like Fogie was interested in obtaining one because of the key.

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 24 Aug 05 - 03:16 PM

If you can't find one in G, a normal clarinet with an "A barrel" might make it easier to play with the other kids than the marching band Bb tuning. Many wood and resin clarinets come with both barrels, and just swapping that one piece gives you either an "A" or a "Bb" instrument.

Since the clarinet register shift is at one and a half octaves rather than at simple octaves like saxophones, flutes, and penny whistles, you can also shift registers (for the lower two) to get an additional "key transposition." Once you figure out how to do the "mental shift" for this, it makes a clarinet somewhat more versatile than many other instruments for playing in "odd keys."

Also note that the p'whistle fingerings for a notated C scale are much closer to the clarinet fingerings (2d register) for a notated D scale, so you'll have to learn that "mental transposition" if you trade off whistles with almost any concert instrument.

Or you could look for an oboe...

John

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From:
Date: 11 Sep 05 - 12:33 AM

I have an old silver plated I believe cavalier clarinet, It was made in Elkhart, Indiana. I can make a sound or two with it but really don't know how to play it. I'd send pics if your interested in buying it.

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: kendall
Date: 11 Sep 05 - 09:53 AM

I saw a program on TV some time ago that said the trees that they make the real ones from are almost extinct.

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 05 - 09:30 PM

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7349931875&ssPageName=ADME:L:LCA:AU:31

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: MickyMan
Date: 11 Sep 05 - 09:56 PM

Metal Clarinet!! That's kind of funny. When I was a student teaching music teacher in 1975 we had about 7-8 old metal clarinets left over from the pre-plastic days. They worked OK but the tone was horrible when compared to even the cheapest plastic model. Remember, a clarinet should sound like it's made of wood ... and I can't recall that these metal ones had any redeeming factors that would make them at all desirable for anything other than unique wall hangings or lamp stands.
   Just for the record, repadding a cheap old clarinet costs quite a bit of $$$$ , and I'd stay away from those Sam's Club bargains. Most music stores have a 4 month new instrument rental trial period for real cheap, which gives you a bit of time to shop for a decent used instrument (which you have checkd by a repair person if you are smart). Good luck

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: Bill D
Date: 12 Sep 05 - 05:55 PM

the trees they make wood clarinets from are "African Blackwood"...Dalbergia melanoxylon...not exactly near extinction, but scarcer due to overuse and political unrest in Africa. There are projects to conserve and replenish it. (It is often confused with Ebony, which is similar in look but much less stable to work)

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 12 Sep 05 - 07:08 PM

"... but the tone was horrible"

The problem for all you helpful people, you see, is that you are thinking with Western Music ears: Fogie & I are thinking about Eastern Music, where the tonal sounds are appreciated quite differently.

Subject: RE: finding a metal clarinet
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Sep 05 - 08:18 AM

More horrible than a real one? Hard to believe.