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BS: Abuse of words

GUEST,Barrie Roberts 04 Sep 05 - 01:16 AM
Michael 03 Sep 05 - 05:37 PM
John Hardly 03 Sep 05 - 02:40 PM
McGrath of Harlow 03 Sep 05 - 02:38 PM
Divis Sweeney 03 Sep 05 - 02:13 PM
Wilfried Schaum 03 Sep 05 - 05:37 AM
JennyO 03 Sep 05 - 05:26 AM
Blowzabella 03 Sep 05 - 05:23 AM
John MacKenzie 03 Sep 05 - 04:42 AM
Amos 03 Sep 05 - 01:01 AM
LadyJean 03 Sep 05 - 12:58 AM
The Fooles Troupe 03 Sep 05 - 12:50 AM
dick greenhaus 02 Sep 05 - 11:08 PM
katlaughing 02 Sep 05 - 10:47 PM
John Hardly 02 Sep 05 - 10:34 PM
Jerry Rasmussen 02 Sep 05 - 10:31 PM
Bill D 02 Sep 05 - 09:35 PM
McGrath of Harlow 02 Sep 05 - 07:59 PM
akenaton 02 Sep 05 - 07:49 PM
The Fooles Troupe 02 Sep 05 - 07:47 PM
John Hardly 02 Sep 05 - 06:33 PM
McGrath of Harlow 02 Sep 05 - 06:19 PM
John Hardly 02 Sep 05 - 06:13 PM
Raedwulf 02 Sep 05 - 06:11 PM
Raedwulf 02 Sep 05 - 06:04 PM
Ebbie 02 Sep 05 - 06:03 PM
Raedwulf 02 Sep 05 - 05:55 PM
Charmion 02 Sep 05 - 05:52 PM
Wilfried Schaum 02 Sep 05 - 05:31 PM
John MacKenzie 02 Sep 05 - 02:21 PM
John Hardly 02 Sep 05 - 02:19 PM
Grab 02 Sep 05 - 02:12 PM
Jerry Rasmussen 02 Sep 05 - 02:06 PM
Ebbie 02 Sep 05 - 02:02 PM
Amos 02 Sep 05 - 02:00 PM
Wesley S 02 Sep 05 - 01:40 PM
Little Hawk 02 Sep 05 - 01:38 PM
McGrath of Harlow 02 Sep 05 - 01:35 PM
GUEST,Mrr 02 Sep 05 - 01:33 PM
Divis Sweeney 02 Sep 05 - 01:08 PM
Bill D 02 Sep 05 - 01:07 PM
Pseudolus 02 Sep 05 - 01:02 PM
Divis Sweeney 02 Sep 05 - 12:53 PM
katlaughing 02 Sep 05 - 12:50 PM
Little Hawk 02 Sep 05 - 12:45 PM
Cluin 02 Sep 05 - 12:43 PM
Bill D 02 Sep 05 - 12:42 PM
John MacKenzie 02 Sep 05 - 12:40 PM
Wesley S 02 Sep 05 - 12:31 PM
Cluin 02 Sep 05 - 12:29 PM

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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: GUEST,Barrie Roberts
Date: 04 Sep 05 - 01:16 AM

How about 'I could of' instead of 'I could have'? That always drives me wild, but I've found it in printed UK English back to the 1940s.

As to Raedwulf's comment about 'gay', I'm not sure from where he thinks the homosexual community hijacked it. Two hundred years ago 'gay' as an English adjective could mean 'randy or promiscupos or sexually available': as a verb it meant 'to copulate', and there were odd phrases like 'gaying pole' and 'gaying pintle' meaning the penis. The Victorian prostitute's come-on was 'Are you gay?', meaning 'Are you looking for sex?' and prostitutes were referred to as 'gay women'. I have a Home Office report of about 1910 which refers to prostitutes as 'gay women' and doesn't feel the need to explain or comment. I thought the modern usage by homosexuals arose because they were the last group to preserve the question 'Are you gay?' but gradually let it change its meaning, from 'Are you looking for sex?' to 'Are you homosexual?'


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Michael
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 05:37 PM

One that like gets on my tits is 'real' as in 'real good'as opposed to 'pretend good'I presume.
Mike


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John Hardly
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 02:40 PM

Like, whatEVER.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 02:38 PM

"Valley" - I take it that that's what those American girls on the telly, who quack every time they open their mouth, are speaking?


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 02:13 PM

LadyJean: "It's better to be pissed off than to be pissed on!"

:)

E


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 05:37 AM

Holocaust - using a book title and a word signifying an old sacrificial procedure for the cruel "liquidation" in Nazi times creating a certain distance to the beholder. I prefer the original and sincere German word "Judenvernichtung" = Destroying Jewry.

American orthography - it's kool, insn't it?

This person's army (formerly this man's army)


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: JennyO
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 05:26 AM

'cordial' comes out as 'cord ee al'

So what's wrong with that?


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Blowzabella
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 05:23 AM

I get really annoyed about the way in which the word 'community' is used nowadays - such as 'community art', 'community musicians', 'in the community', 'the (insert sub-group) community' - worse, though, are the phrases 'community school', 'community hospital' and 'community fire stations' - is it really necessary to elaborate on 'school', hospital' and 'fire station'? Who else are these places serving? A private club?

And 'unique' - as mentioned above - things can't be 'almost' unique or 'quite' unique - they either are unique or they aren't.

Mutter......


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 04:42 AM

Libary for library
Umburella for umbrella
Febuary for February

BTW John Hardly, I recommend you avoid listening to Tony Benn!

G..


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Amos
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 01:01 AM

Calvary is the name given in the King James version of the Bible for the hill where the Crucifixion occurred.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: LadyJean
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 12:58 AM

Calvary is the Episcopal church on the corner of Shady Avenue and Walnut Street. Cavalry are mounted soldiers.
Then there's shit. The most overused noun in American English. As in: "Get that shit off the table before dinner". (And then sterilize it please.) or "I got to get my shit together for the trip". (Can't you make more when you get there?)
Pissed off isn't much better. Get angry for heaven's sake. Nobody will wonder about your bladder.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 03 Sep 05 - 12:50 AM

Folk Singer - on two counts...

Folk & Singer


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 11:08 PM

"GREAT" seems to mean at least average, when referring to folk singers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 10:47 PM

"my bad"...I absolutely abhor that expression!

on the news, today: something about an "immediate need, now" isn't that a bit redundnat?


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John Hardly
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 10:34 PM

MofH, I'd agree with you for the most part -- sorry though, in this case I think it's developed as a fashion. It's too hand-in-hand with other new ways of speaking.   

For instance, "Valley" made a huge impact in the way youth now speak in America -- from exponential growth of the annoying (understatement of the year) use of "Like", not to compare something, but rather as a verbal "filler" -- a way to flavor the language -- not the dictionary definition of "like" that's important -- instead, an "attitude" one intends to convey when using the word.

And ALL narrative is first person, present tense. ".....so, I'm like climbing the shtairs and he's, like, not, and I go "can't you, like, help me?" and he's like "...whatEVER"

I had a friend's kid in my shop the other day and he was talking about "KAY-bruhs". I could NOT figure out what he was talking about. Turns out "kay-bruh" is "valley" for the snake that the mongoose kills.

Drives me exshtremely crazy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 10:31 PM

And what in the world is the "exact same?" I used to bug my son about that phrase but his English teacher said that I was wrong. If it's the same, can it be pretty much the same? Kinda like almost pregnant.

Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 09:35 PM

shibboleth


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 07:59 PM

Wiston Churchill used to do that, John - it can be (and was in his case) a kind of way of dealing with a lisp really (a way of avoiding the "s" sound when that's hard to say, so it comes out "th"). It's also quite common in lots of places where they speak English, for example Ireland.

It's an interesting variation, and it's intriguing the way that public language shifts in that kind of way, but I can't see why it should be anything to get annoyed about.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 07:49 PM

Politicians these days are always about to "redouble their efforts"

Sounds like bad news for us chickens...Ake


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 07:47 PM

Folk Music.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John Hardly
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 06:33 PM

"What's that about?"

In the same way that I might be drawn to look at an auto accident as I drive by it, I sort of wonder how it started. If you watch American TV I think it is impossible to not eventually notice how many Americans now pronounce "str" as "shtr" (see list above).

I originally thought it came into the culture via pro athlete worship -- it's a very "ebonic" pronunciation. But that just isn't a satisfactory explanation -- too many do it all across the culture. Out miss-pronouncer-in-chief does it -- "it will take true shtrength and curge!".

There are things that slip into a culture unawares -- a fascinating phenomenon. For instance, fashion is almost always traceable to some popular figure -- a movie star, athlete, or other public figure does something a certain way and suddenly everyone is doing it...

...but I remember reading in the late '80s or early '90s that "big hair" had no such precedent. Though you couldn't go to a small town in the US and not find a large number of the girls wearing big hair, there was no popular precedent -- no Farrah, no Dorothy Hammil(sp) setting the trend. It just happened and spread. Spontaneous bad taste.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 06:19 PM

I just want "str" to lose the "h" it somehow picked up in the last decade. ??? What's that about?
............................
One phrase - and I know phrases is drifting the thread a bit - that has annoyed me many times is when someone being tackled about failure in the system says "In a perfect world...", meaning "All right, it's wrong, but I'm not going to be arsed about trying to do anything about it." When I was a social worker you could alway spot the ones who'd climb up the greasy pole, because they'd say things like that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John Hardly
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 06:13 PM

shtrong
shtrength
ekshtreme
ekshtrapolate
shtrohs
shtring
ashtronaut
ashtronomy
unshtrung
Meryl Shtreep
Neil Armshtrong
Lance Armshtrong

arg. I can't take it anymore.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Raedwulf
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 06:11 PM

Queer & gay - can't use either word without people hearing the (homo-)sexual meanings. Gay is particularly annoying, given that it was deliberately hijacked by the homosexual community. Queer ('strange or odd'), if largely derogatory in this context, is at least technically accurate, since the majority of homo sapiens is hetero.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Raedwulf
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 06:04 PM

Grab - Irregardless of wot yew fink, yes it is a word. According to the OED it's early 20thC, no indication that it's Yank (I've heard & seen it used in the UK, & used it myself), & they reckon it's an informal combination of irrespective & regardless. Personally, I've always regarded the "ir-" as an intensifier & use it when I particularly want to emphasize the 'regardless' bit. Which seems to sit pretty well with the OED combo origin!


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 06:03 PM

I hear 'irregardless' fairly frequently and it surprises me every time. I think it's used mostly by people who are not really 'into' words and they haven't registered that 'less' is already a negative. They may be influenced by words such as 'irredeemable', 'irrational', words of that sort.

I have a musician friend who does something I've never heard anyone else do. She pronounces 'usual' as 'yooz you al' and I noticed the other day that 'cordial' comes out as 'cord ee al'.

She does not have a speech impediment, and she is a very bright, logical person. I have never commented on the oddities but I suspect that she is on a one-man (person?) mission to change the world's habits.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Raedwulf
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 05:55 PM

The French troops were right to mutiny in WWI. It would have been more appropriate to execute the generals who kept sending thousands of men to die in futile attacks on entrenched postions, if anyone.

The Russian army also mutinied in 1917, and simply started walking home. That sparked a revolution which overthrew the Czarist system.

The German army and navy finally mutinied at the very end of the war in the fall of 1918.

With a little more awareness on the part of the individual soldier, ALL the citizen armies would have mutinied way back in 1914, and have ended the whole useless misery right then and there. They were dying for nothing.


Bullshit, LH, but if you want a proper rebuttal (sic), PM me or start a new thread. I shan't mess up this one!


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Charmion
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 05:52 PM

Epona, I too have a bone to pick with you. Civilians, even those employed by the government department that directs and supports the armed forces, are not members of those forces even though they are engaged in the same mission.

Trust me on this: I've been a soldier, and now I'm a civil servant (snivel serpent). The differences are striking, most notably the fact that I'm never going to be posted someplace fraught with snipers and anti-tank mines, and lacking flush toilets. Also, I now pay union dues and receive a rather less lavish benefits package.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 05:31 PM

Epona - stop philosophizing. Cling to the regulations. Combattants are recognized as such by wearing uniform or a uniform sign clearly visible, uniform leadership, wearing arms in the open, and respecting the laws of land warfare. I think that is what Giok means. If they do not, they are criminals (like our Red Army Fraction) and are not protected by the Hague Treaties [no pardon, shot immediately].

Mrr - decimation is a reduction of 10 percent. It was the classical old Roman punishment for mutinous units. On parade every tenth man was counted out and killed on the spot, mutineer or not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 02:21 PM

Then there's another of my betes noir 'very unique' a thing is either unique or it isn't.
G..


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John Hardly
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 02:19 PM

I just want "str" to lose the "h" it somehow picked up in the last decade. Is that asking too much?


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Grab
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 02:12 PM

"Irregardless". For heaven's sake, it's not a word! This seems to be an American perversion - I've not yet heard it on this side of the pond.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 02:06 PM

How about "simply" in printed assembly instructions written by someone in Japanese, and badly translated. Or even written by someone in American. :-)

Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 02:02 PM

As listed by others, the misuse of 'literally' bugs me. Slang is one thing (note 'bugs') but when a word is misused frequently enough it becomes the norm, the accepted word, and that is a pity. The roots and actual meaning of a word are left behind and forgotten.

'Decimated' is another of those words. I think some people use it because they think it means 'devastated'.

Words are tools, true. And tools wear out, true. But you can't beat the right tool for the right job.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Amos
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 02:00 PM

Wesley:

You're just ASKING for trouble, man!! 7,000 posts of 300 words each, minimum, from some obscure corner of England, just for suggesting it!! LOL


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Wesley S
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:40 PM

McGrath - Maybe we could claify these threads by having a Joeclone relabel them "In the UK" and "In the USA".


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:38 PM

You're quite right, Kat. The management requires them to do it. My beef, clearly, is with the management, not the waitresses. If it's a chain, then the management gets their orders from the head office, so my beef is with some damned committee at the head office!

That's modern life, isn't it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:35 PM

Veggies. I hate the word veggies. What's so damn hard about saying vegetables ?

"Veggies" means vegetarians in England. Vegetables would be "veg".
..............

I get annoyed at "rebut" being misused, especially when public figures are trying to lie their way out of some embarassing revelations.

"Rebut" means to prove that some allegation is untrue. Just saying it is not true is not a rebuttal, but when it gets described as such people are liable to tricked into thinking that the charge has in fact been rebutted, or disproved, when in fact it has just been denied.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:33 PM

Guy who Thinks - I have to agree about Genocide - see my comment on the Genocide in New Orleans thread.

Also, I don't like racism to mean any kind of bigotry - it should be based on skin color to be racist. Sexism, for instance, isn't racism, not are many of the other -isms.

On the other hand, Curmudgeon is way UNDERused. I did ask my boss who showed up to work dressed perfectly normally on Halloween if he was dressed as a curmudgeon, once... funny, I don't work there anymore!


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:08 PM

Haha! Good for you Bill!

E


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:07 PM

I am not guilty of that often, Epona ...I am an old, grumpy curmudgeon who likes to think that clarity can seriously suffer when abbreviations and shortened forms are used. I 'will' sometime type 'thru' for through, but there is little doubt what I mean, and it may be a better way to spell the word anyway!

The language is full, fascinating and rich, and it behooves (see?) us to learn it and use it. The various examples above show different KINDS of laziness and 'dumbing down', and I suppose there are places for some of them, but I shudder when I hear/read someone who cannot or will not approximate 'standard' usage.

ah, well...


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Pseudolus
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 01:02 PM

Hot enough for ya?????


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:53 PM

Not all armies are composed of soldiers? True enough with all the civilians that are army personnel and help support the mission.

I'm guilty of that, Bill, esp. when I text ppl! :)

E


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:50 PM

Don't forget people in some service jobs are required to say such things or face reprimands or loss of jobs.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:45 PM

Yeah, "veggies" is annoying. So is "hubby". So is "jammies" (pajamas). So is "brekky" (breakfast).

Are people becoming too lazy to say entire words?

Here's one that annoys me frequently. Waitress or other person says to me, "And how are we doing today?" I think, sarcastically, "I'm doing fine...I don't know about you."

"Do we need anything?" she says, interrupting my quiet meal for the 3rd or 4rth time. (If "we" did, "we" would probably have waved at you and called you over!!! Go away!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Cluin
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:43 PM

F##kin' Ay!


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:42 PM

well, u kno, i hate lots of wrds that pple r just 2 lazy 2 type anymore. 4 sure!


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:40 PM

Not all armies are composed of soldiers!

Ending almost every sentence with the word 'like' said with a rising inflection. Saying 'absolutely' instead of yes without qualifying it; 'absolutely what?' I always ask.

Giok


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Wesley S
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:31 PM

Veggies. I hate the word veggies. What's so damn hard about saying vegtables ?

And "party" is not a verb. It's a noun.


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Subject: RE: BS: Abuse of words
From: Cluin
Date: 02 Sep 05 - 12:29 PM

"Don't get ignorant!"

To be ignorant means to lack knowledge or information; it is not synonymous with obnoxious... though the two often go hand in hand.


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