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BS: Obit: The Republican Party
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Bill D Date: 13 Apr 09 - 03:08 PM so...I left out the word 'anymore'.. This system has too many features designed to answer to 'either/or'. and you want to apply "Know Nothings" to Democrats? *grin*....when Republicans and their talking heads have been mis-reading and faking facts in bucketloads recently. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 13 Apr 09 - 03:30 PM Ach, Rig, old friend, come home from Wonderland!!! The children are crying.... A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: PoppaGator Date: 13 Apr 09 - 03:37 PM In actual U.S. History, the group that actually described itself as the "Know-Nothing Party" was nativist (i.e., biased against blacks and immigrants) and pro-robber-baron in the name of the "Free Market." Of the two present-day major parties, I don't think that it's the Democrats who are following this model. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 13 Apr 09 - 03:54 PM Maybe it was just that what they knew didn't amount to nothin'! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 14 Apr 09 - 05:52 PM Statistics on the decline of the GOP. I believe these turbulent numbers come from an innate confusion about the word "values". or possibly the word "American". A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Bobert Date: 14 Apr 09 - 06:14 PM Hmmmmmmm??? Has it really been 4 years since I predicted that the Republican Party was going to implode... Even said that MCCain wouldn't even be able to save it... I'd say I got that bit of predictin' the future right... Truth be known, I'd forgotten about this thread a long time ago... But not my feekings that the Repubs were screwing things up badly... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 14 Apr 09 - 09:30 PM We just simply have to quit electing people who are hopelessly addicted to some ancient superstition, like Sarah Palin and Barack Obama. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Bobert Date: 14 Apr 09 - 09:55 PM You are confused, Rigs... ***We*** didn't elect Sarah Palin... ***We*** rejected her... Your attempt to link Obama and the Frontier Roller Derby Queeen is, ahhhhhhh, juvenilistic, at best... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: robomatic Date: 14 Apr 09 - 10:09 PM Personally I agree with the Krugman article. I've been listening to the small chunks of Limbaugh that exude between commercials and he's devolving to a johnny one-note. I think the Republicans have made the transition from elephant not to donkey, but to ass, one with its legs straight out in drag position. It seems to me they are not engaging the issues of the times with any intellectuality. They are simply braying. It's not for nothing that the son of William F Buckley came out for Obama before the election. (Wonder if the FDR era was similar?) We really need a better more cogent Opposition. For the good of the country. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Bobert Date: 14 Apr 09 - 10:15 PM The Repubs ain't it, Robo... They are nuthin' but sports fans anymore... The South is devoid of a sufficiency of intellegent people anymore... If it ain't NASCAR then it ain't sh*t... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 15 Apr 09 - 08:56 AM "You are confused, Rigs... ***We*** didn't elect Sarah Palin... ***We*** rejected her..." The people of Alaska elected her. But the point is, Palin and Obama are cut from the same bolt of clothe. They both refuse to deal with reality. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Greg F. Date: 15 Apr 09 - 10:06 AM The Repubs ain't down for the count yet. Have a read of Kevin Phillips' book American Theocracy... and Michael Goldberg's Kingdom Coming.... Scary stuff. (PS: Phillips is a Republican) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Big Mick Date: 15 Apr 09 - 10:14 AM Anyone who thinks the Republicans are down for the count simply is not dealing with reality. The American voter is extremely self centered. Most especially the great middle/independent/moderate Repub/conservative Dem. They vote on the issues and events at the moment that are driving them. In the last election it was clear that they woke up and realized that they had been deceived, and the price of that was declining home values, job losses, 401k savings severely damaged, and they voted their pocket book. Obama will take the necessary steps to get us off life support and get the economy started back up. Our greed has a price tag, and it will be paid. But when things start rolling again, you can count on the great middle to have a short memory, and to start the same old stuff again. And so it goes in the Land of the Free. One can only hope that the one thing that sticks in their minds is that we must have the appropriate regulatory safety net on our financial institutions, food manufacturers, and drug manufacturers. I would also hope that they would see the correlation between strong labor laws and a thriving middle class. But do not count the Republicans out. They are down....... but they are not out. They have a whole generation of Rovian mindbots that are looking to widen the gap between the haves and the havenots. Mick |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 11:01 AM Mick, I am afraid there is no question-- they VILL be back. The progress we make is always whiplash-formed, with the forces of Boskone always finding new dramatizations to offer to our most lizardly sides. As PAscal observed, we are ni bete, ni ange. RIg, what reality is it you believe in that Mr. Obama is refusing to deal with? I have to confess, sometimes you sound liuke a genuine scurrilous blackguard in your unfounded assertions. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Big Mick Date: 15 Apr 09 - 11:59 AM I think that is what I said, Amos. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 12:18 PM Well, then I was agreeing with you, right? A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Big Mick Date: 15 Apr 09 - 12:29 PM cool. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 15 Apr 09 - 01:02 PM "RIg, what reality is it you believe in that Mr. Obama is refusing to deal with?" The same one Sarah Palin is refusing to deal with, reality in general. One can't solve problems without dealing with "all" of the symptoms. A leader can't simply take a solution off the table simply because it offends somebody's superstitious beliefs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Big Mick Date: 15 Apr 09 - 01:14 PM Rig....... that is convoluted. It is the equivalent of saying, "THEY are out to get us". You were asked a direct question. You indicate that it is "reality in general". Please give a specific definition and examples of what the hell you are referring to. Mick |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 15 Apr 09 - 01:42 PM What I'm saying is, when we see political decisions perverted by religious imput, we normally get bad decisions. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 02:29 PM Obama as far as I know has kept his religious views out of his public decisions. The right-wing nutballs were chastising him for not going to church for eleven weeks; your side, understandably, chastises him for having any non-reasoned faith at all. But, look here--it is a very different thing for him to have a private faith, and for him to do as Bush did and insist his faith is "part of his foreign policy", personally communicated from his It is none of my business--or yours--what he does with his private beliefs as long as they do not color his public decisions. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 15 Apr 09 - 02:35 PM Well, Amos, we can agree on that. But we have already seen his superstition involving itself in public policy when he decided to leave the Office of Faith Based Initiatives open. I think it will happen more often than not. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 02:50 PM Are there specific programs involving the OFBI to which you object? Or is it just the title which sets you off? I sympathize with your distaste for many of the memes and symbols, icons, and plaster personae that are bandied about in the name of faith. But I would submit for reflection that faith without incarnations and symbols may just be something intrinsically very valuable and useful to any viewpoint embedded in the maze of space-time. The reason is that being locked into space-time tends to severely constrict the ability to know, so severely that it leaves natural responsibility desperate for some way to know enough to exercise itself. From this perspective it is possible that "faith" may constitute a valuable baby in the midst of a lot of bathwater, one with whom it behooves us to treat kindly. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: beardedbruce Date: 15 Apr 09 - 03:41 PM Amos, "you sound liuke a genuine scurrilous blackguard in your unfounded assertions." As well you should know, from your past obsessions with Bush. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 04:33 PM God, Bruce, I wish you would come up with a genuine sentiment of your own once in a while, instead of constantly resorting to this puerile neener-neener style bullshit. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: beardedbruce Date: 15 Apr 09 - 05:14 PM And that from someone who presents NYT opinion as if it were fact???? I wish you would ( as you said you would) apply the SAME standards to your evaluation of Obama that you applied to Bush. Unless you want to insist that he is above the law, morality, and critical observation. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 08:51 PM I do not do any such thing. The NYT articles I have presented are always presented as views. A view, I should point out to you, is not the same as a fact. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 15 Apr 09 - 10:21 PM So not only are the Grimm Reepers writing the tea-party fairy tale, they are now falsifying MIT! "MEDIA -- EDITOR: 'I'M EMBARRASSED' I PUBLISHED REP. BACHMANN'S CAP AND TRADE LIES: On April 8, global warming denier Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-MN) published an op-ed in the Minneapolis Star Tribune that attacked green economy legislation by claiming that "cap and trade" is really "cap and tax." To make her argument, Bachmann wrote, "[A]ccording to an analysis by the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, the average American household could expect its yearly energy bill to increase by $3,128 per year." This claim, however, was a flat lie, as a letter to the editor published the very next day pointed out. In fact, Bachmann's lie had been debunked publicly by MIT's John Reilly with Politifact.com on Tuesday, March 24. Reilly also sent a letter to the congressional Republican leadership denouncing their repeated use of the fabricated figure. In an interview with the Wonk Room's Brad Johnson, Eric Ringham, the opinion page editor of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune, acknowledged that the MIT lie was fully debunked before the column was submitted by Bachmann. "It wasn't on my radar. I'm embarrassed to have let it go unchallenged," said Ringham. Ringham told Johnson that with both the limited resources he has and the role of the opinion page as a forum for argument, it is "an uncomfortable role" for an op-ed editor to run corrections after a column's publication. "I'm not equipped -- or really inclined -- to go, after the fact, probing someone's assertions," said Ringham. Despite the fact that a correction will not be run, Ringham said, "You can rest assured this study is never going to be represented in the paper again without confirmation it's being accurately portrayed." " |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Donuel Date: 16 Apr 09 - 01:33 AM Bobert, Thank you for saving me from starting this thread. They entire name of the Republican party should go. It is baggage that true conservatives no longer need or want. I have seen staunch republicans peel the GOP stickers off their bumpers. The only platform that would do them any good is a jobs platform. The secessonists, racists, evangelicals and gun fanatics could gather behind the jobs banner but the big money of the party that was designed for total corporate rule of the country would not want to get on board with what could be deemed a new labor movement. For now the GOP is the no party, the do nothing and pray party, the "I'm so pissed of that were gonna go kill us some *****, party" Whatever fundamental change the GOP makes will by human nature be fundamentally irrational and not helpful except to cause more violence and hate. They need to bury the dead elephant. The name they should choose is ... FOX. It could stand for Freedom Or Xtinction and members would be called Freedomists. (of course the plan would be to eliminate freedoms, but that is another story) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 16 Apr 09 - 11:04 AM On the other hand, some Republicans are doing some very constructive things. See below: http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2009/04/16//news/sandiego//z3a7cb4466b4507ce882575970077d470.txt |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 17 Apr 09 - 07:27 PM Actuall, the Republicans have a lot to work with, see attached: Illegal immigrants cashing in on federal tax credits, study shows. By: Kevin Mooney Examiner Staff Writer/Commentary 04/16/09 5:19 AM Large numbers of illegal immigrants file tax returns using phony Social Security numbers to cash in on the federal Earned Income Tax Credit, thanks to lax government management, according to the author of a new study. "Technically, only people authorized to work in the U.S. are eligible for the credit, you need a valid Social security number," said Ed Rubenstein, a financial analyst and economist, speaking at a news conference Tuesday at the National Press Club. "But identity theft, stolen Social Security numbers, and other scams effectively nullify the restriction. As a result, illegal aliens actually receive the EITC at even greater rates than legal immigrants," Rubenstein said. The IRS makes little or no effort to verify the authenticity of Social Security numbers, or existence of dependant children, Rubenstein said. This makes it possible for illegal immigrants to claim children still living in Mexico as dependents and for parents living illegally in the U.S. to file separate returns claiming the same children as dependents under the EITC, Rubenstein said. The EITC was created to boost work incentives for poor families with children. Childless households received a maximum $438 payment in 2008, while the maximum available to families with two or more children was $4,824. "From a distance, the EITC looks like a winner," he said. "The devil is in the details. For starters, the program is dominated by fraud." Illegal immigrant households are more than three times as likely to receive EITC than native-born American households, Rubenstein said. Higher fertility rates evident among the immigrant population accounts for this disparity, he said. "Even a tiny increase in the fertility rates, if maintained over the decades, will have enormous consequences," Rubenstein said. "The role of EITC in the nation's demographic destiny cannot be denied." Rubenstein also cited figures from the General Accounting Office (GAO) showing that as many as a third of all EITC claims are "improperly paid." Rubenstein's report "The Earned Income Tax Credit and Illegal Immigration: A Study in Fraud, Abuse and Liberal Activism" is available at The SocialContract.Com. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 24 Apr 09 - 11:30 AM The GOP: divorced from reality The Republican base is behaving like a guy who just got dumped by his wife. By Bill Maher April 24, 2009 "If conservatives don't want to be seen as bitter people who cling to their guns and religion and anti-immigrant sentiments, they should stop being bitter and clinging to their guns, religion and anti-immigrant sentiments. It's been a week now, and I still don't know what those "tea bag" protests were about. I saw signs protesting abortion, illegal immigrants, the bank bailout and that gay guy who's going to win "American Idol." But it wasn't tax day that made them crazy; it was election day. Because that's when Republicans became what they fear most: a minority. The conservative base is absolutely apoplectic because, because ... well, nobody knows. They're mad as hell, and they're not going to take it anymore. Even though they're not quite sure what "it" is. But they know they're fed up with "it," and that "it" has got to stop. Here are the big issues for normal people: the war, the economy, the environment, mending fences with our enemies and allies, and the rule of law. And here's the list of Republican obsessions since President Obama took office: that his birth certificate is supposedly fake, he uses a teleprompter too much, he bowed to a Saudi guy, Europeans like him, he gives inappropriate gifts, his wife shamelessly flaunts her upper arms, and he shook hands with Hugo Chavez and slipped him the nuclear launch codes. Do these sound like the concerns of a healthy, vibrant political party? It's sad what's happened to the Republicans. They used to be the party of the big tent; now they're the party of the sideshow attraction, a socially awkward group of mostly white people who speak a language only they understand. Like Trekkies, but paranoid...." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: DougR Date: 25 Apr 09 - 01:25 AM The RAssmussen Poll for today reports that 53% of those polled predicted that the next president will be a Republican. I think it is a bit early to be writing our obituary. After all, Bobert started this thread in 2005. For those of the liberal persuasion that was four years ago. DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Amos Date: 25 Apr 09 - 02:28 AM I think it more likely the next President elected will be Barack Obama. But there's many a mmile between now and then. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Jeri Date: 25 Apr 09 - 08:21 AM He meant the next president after Obama. The Republican part is going to have to do something intelligent if they don't want to continue being laughed at. It could happen. Quit letting gasbags speak for the part, come up with a platform that isn't basically a list of what they hate. When you're number 2, and the Repubs are most definitely number 2, it seems to be popular to ridicule and attack number 1. I think a growing number of Americans see through that. They're gonna have to come up with some 'pros' and come up with some believable ideas that aren't based on the Democratic party. I think if they could have done it, the already would have. The time is ripe for a new party or an internal Republican party coup. They have to find their own hope and idealism, or they just look like a party whose identity is all about the other guys. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 25 Apr 09 - 09:23 AM If there were only enough honest Democrats to fill all the posts in the government, the Republicans wouldn't have as much to squawk about. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Jeri Date: 25 Apr 09 - 09:26 AM I'm sure you didn't mean to provide a convenient example... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Alice Date: 25 Apr 09 - 10:07 AM Michelle Bachmann is one of the Republicans who has added to the pile of "reasons to laugh" at the party. Her latest crazy statement is that climate change can't be real because "Carbon dioxide, Mister Speaker, is a natural byproduct of nature. Carbon dioxide is natural. It occurs in Earth". |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Alice Date: 25 Apr 09 - 10:21 AM More evidence from Michelle Bachmann for being the dunce of Congress: "Literally, if we took away the minimum wage—if conceivably it was gone—we could potentially virtually wipe out unemployment completely because we would be able to offer jobs at whatever level." —Michele Bachmann, 1/26/05, Jobs, Energy and Community Development Committee, testifying against SF 3, a bill to raise the MN minimum wage and advocating the elimination of the minimum wage altogether.. "Many teenagers that come in should be paying the employer because of broken dishes or whatever occurs during that period of time. But you know what? After six months, that teenager is going to be a fabulous employee and is going to go on a trajectory where he's going to be making so much money, we'll be borrowing money from him." —Michele Bachmann, 1/26/05, explaining why teenagers should pay employers for the privilege of working instead of receiving minimum wage. "I look at the Scripture and I read it and I take it for what it is. I give more credence in the Scripture as being kind of a timeless word of God to mankind, and I take it for what it is. And I don't think I give as much credence to my own mind, because I see myself as being very limited and very flawed, and lacking in knowledge, and wisdom and understanding. So, I just take the Bible for what it is, I guess, and recognize that I am not a scientist, not trained to be a scientist. I'm not a deep thinker on all of this. I wish I was. I wish I was more knowledgeable, but I'm not a scientist." - Michele Bachmann interviewing with Todd Fiel at KKMS as quoted in the Stillwater Gazette, September 29, 2003. "Something that I think sometimes people don't like to hear is that secular people can be sometimes even more dogmatic in beliefs than people who are not secular. ... In some ways, to believe in evolution is almost like a following; a cult following — if you don't believe in evolution, you're considered completely backward. That seems to me very indicative of bias as well." - Michele Bachmann quoted in the Stillwater Gazette, September 29, 2003. "No one that I know disagrees with natural selection — that you can take various breeds of dogs ... breed them, you get different kinds of dogs," she said. "It's just a fact of life. ... Where there's controversy is (at the question) 'Where do we say that a cell became a blade of grass, which became a starfish, which became a cat, which became a donkey, which became a human being?' There's a real lack of evidence from change from actual species to a different type of species. That's where it's difficult to prove." - Michele Bachmann quoted in the Stillwater Gazette, September 29, 2003. well.... there's so much more she has said, but I'll stop there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: pdq Date: 25 Apr 09 - 01:04 PM The above article is a group of selected quotes intended to slime the speaker. It can be done to anyone. Here is something from Michelle Bachmann about incandescent lightbulbs... "Bachmann introduced the Light Bulb Freedom of Choice Act, to repeal the nationwide phase-out of conventional light bulbs. She argued that the government has no business telling consumers what kind of light bulbs they can buy: 'By 2012, incandescent light bulbs will be no more,' Bachmann said. 'Fluorescent bulbs are more polluting because of their mercury content.' " Yes, a broken flourescent light tube is a mini toxic waste spill. Imagine breaking one in the stove hood while dinner is cooking? Also, the US government has no right to tell people what to do in their daily lives. Good work Michelle Bachmann. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 25 Apr 09 - 10:01 PM "I'm sure you didn't mean to provide a convenient example..." All of the tax cheats who withdrew their nomination, and those that did not. It's just typical of elite Democrats, they think the rules apply to everyone but themselves and their friends. Having said that, I don't think the Republicans are much better. I think a strong third party is the best option. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Donuel Date: 27 Apr 09 - 06:55 PM The % of people who now declare they are Republicans are now 21% That is less than the % of people who believe in ESP That is less than half of people who believe in angels. Where did they go? They are now Independants which will outnumber the % of Democrats by next election. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Donuel Date: 27 Apr 09 - 07:51 PM Wow Imagine what the first 100 days of a Michelle Bachman Presidency would look like. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Bobert Date: 27 Apr 09 - 08:05 PM LOL, Donuel... But really, Michelle Bachmann has marginalized herself so much that nothing she say surprises me any more... She is like a Mad magazine character... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Donuel Date: 27 Apr 09 - 08:10 PM What worrys me are the people who are not worried about Michelle, her sanity and her pandering to Valdemort. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: maple_leaf_boy Date: 27 Apr 09 - 08:47 PM I think that political parties should be done away with. Nominations, elections, and serving in a governmental office should remain the same, but the politicians shouldn't be tied to any political party. This way, there won't be any bias views expressed by the media towards certain politicians because of the party to which they belong. There are good and bad Republicans, and the same with Democrats; if we took away those two labels, then there would be more peace among the world of politics. Independents are usually overlooked in election campaigns, but at least they aren't strictly tied to a right-wing nor a left-wing party. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Donuel Date: 27 Apr 09 - 09:17 PM With needs and wants there will come organized parties to satisfy those needs. Its simply a matter of who needs what. Republicans NEED to: Build Bombs for profit Republicans need to bail out their own Banks (because they own them) Republicans want to build more prisons Republicans want the rich to go tax free. Republicans want any law or regulation that limit thier schemes tossed out. Democrats need livable wages Democrats need affordable housing Democrats need collective Health care like we do with fireman and police. Democrats want a fair share of the pie Democrats want any law or regulation that insures fairness. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Riginslinger Date: 27 Apr 09 - 09:22 PM "What worrys me are the people who are not worried about Michelle Bachmann..." They don't have time to worry about Michelle Bachmann, they have to worry about Nancy Pelosi! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: Donuel Date: 27 Apr 09 - 09:46 PM I think Nancy has a windows virus...her smile is frozen. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obit: The Republican Party From: DougR Date: 28 Apr 09 - 01:34 AM Go Michelle! DougR |
