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Concertina and guitar dilemma

jonm 07 Nov 05 - 07:50 AM
GUEST 07 Nov 05 - 08:00 AM
greg stephens 07 Nov 05 - 08:04 AM
Ernest 07 Nov 05 - 08:04 AM
GUEST 07 Nov 05 - 08:06 AM
AllisonA(Animaterra) 07 Nov 05 - 08:11 AM
Mooh 07 Nov 05 - 08:17 AM
Strollin' Johnny 07 Nov 05 - 08:22 AM
GUEST,Raggytash 07 Nov 05 - 08:27 AM
Richard Bridge 07 Nov 05 - 08:41 AM
GUEST 07 Nov 05 - 09:09 AM
Lady Hillary 07 Nov 05 - 09:18 AM
breezy 07 Nov 05 - 09:39 AM
jonm 07 Nov 05 - 03:27 PM
Eye Lander 07 Nov 05 - 06:08 PM
GUEST,MikeofNorthumbria(sans cllkie) 07 Nov 05 - 06:13 PM
greg stephens 07 Nov 05 - 06:29 PM
Strollin' Johnny 08 Nov 05 - 03:55 AM
Gurney 08 Nov 05 - 04:28 AM
mooman 08 Nov 05 - 04:46 AM
GUEST,Andy 09 Nov 05 - 04:58 AM
jonm 09 Nov 05 - 07:13 AM
The Fooles Troupe 09 Nov 05 - 07:22 AM
Grab 09 Nov 05 - 07:29 AM
GUEST,Just Wonderin' 09 Nov 05 - 07:41 AM
Reagle 09 Nov 05 - 07:46 AM
GUEST,Ralph 10 Nov 05 - 02:25 AM
Green Man 10 Nov 05 - 08:45 AM
Grab 10 Nov 05 - 01:08 PM
12string growler 10 Nov 05 - 05:33 PM
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Subject: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: jonm
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 07:50 AM

I have a very nice 1912 Wheatstone english concertina, expertly restored and well cared for. I have had two professional valuations in the £1500 - £1800 range.

I play it well and have played for the Morris for many years, frequently being invited to guest for other cotswold teams as well. It's really too loud to sing to, but I also play in any sessions I can. I work long hours so I cannot really play at home since the kids are generally asleep by the time I might get round to it.

As more and more Morris men's knees pack up, they take up a musical instrument or a melodeon and every side now has a massed band and a need for dancers (I do that, too). The concertina, faced with the Hohner wall of sound, spends a lot of time in its box. This grieves me no end. I used to play the accordion for Morris and in ceilidh bands, and regret letting that slide.

I also play guitar, and after several years of letting my playing languish, have been taking it out more often. I have a travel guitar, a decent pub guitar and a reasonable electro-acoustic. It's difficult to get decent left handed instruments. I've been offered a couple of stand-in gigs with ceilidh bands and several club gigs solo, singing to it, on the strength of playing in sessions etc.

Once upon a time, I had some savings, then Mrs. J bought a new car and engaged a builder to extend the house. The biscuit tin is empty. I have found a beautiful left-handed Lowden which I do not need, but which I definitely want. It will cost more than I can afford without parting with the concertina, and I doubt I shall ever earn enough as a musician to cover the outlay.

What would you do? Part with the concertina (it's my only one) and always regret letting a wonderful instrument, and the skill to play it, go - so I can buy another guitar which may become so precious I daren't take it out? Pass up the guitar so I can keep the 'tina, even though I rarely get to play it? Put the guitar on plastic and hope I can pay it off? Anyone been in a similar situation?


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:00 AM

Hi jonm.
No contest.
Keep Tina.
(Thats from someone who plays both tina and guitar!)
Seriously, tinas (good ones) are pretty rare, and will always keep their value, Guitars, on the other hand.......
I've been in your dilemma many times, and have never regretted the "Tina" road.
My only question is "Why English?"
Don't you know that the Duet is Gods own Box!!!!

Hope this helps
Regards Ralphie


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: greg stephens
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:04 AM

keep the concertian. Instruments like that dont grow on trees. The world is full of guitars at any price and any quality, you can always find something to suit whatever money you have.


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Ernest
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:04 AM

By all means keep the concertina! Since you have 3 guitars already, is it possible to trade in one of them?
What are the differences between the pub-guitar and the others? Does pub-guitar mean that you can amplify it too? Can one - or the Lowden - substitute one of the others?
However you deceide - good luck
Ernest


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:06 AM

Mmmm
Another thought...put Wife and Kids on E Bay!

Seriously, I bought a Gibson LG1 a year ago, for silly money. I love it, but it never leaves my house, its too precious to me.

Sometimes, instruments can seem more important than family. I don't have your answer, but, you do have my sympathy.

I will follow this thread to discover the outcome.

Good Luck Ralph


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:11 AM

Keep the tina! For all the reasons above!


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Mooh
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:17 AM

Keep the concertina by all means. The better ones I've heard are like portable pipe organs...amazing sound. Guitars come and go. One retailer I visit will allow you to finance a purchase with regular monthly credit card payments, and pay it off anytime or let it run to term. I hate passing up a worthy instrument that I can use...happened just Saturday with a Gibson A9.

Peace, Mooh.


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:22 AM

Never have understood how anyone can buy a guitar and then say it's too 'good' to take out of the house. What's the point in buying it if you don't wanna play it? I've got a Lowden and a Martin - they both go out to play, picked up one or two minor dings along the way but what the hell? They're far too good to be kept locked away, and the odd mark doesn't detract from their sound or playability. And if they get seriously broken well, hell they're insured!
S:0)


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST,Raggytash
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:27 AM

The nub of your dilemma seem to be you want a decent guitar but cannot afford/justify the Lowden. Have you had a look at Simon & Patrick left handers, a friend has one and it's a very good sounding guitar, even though he in particular plays it quietly


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 08:41 AM

Replace the car with a second-hand skoda, keep the Wheatstone and buy the Lowden..


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 09:09 AM

Ah Mr Johnny.
Fair point well made.
I'm in the lucky position of having two other guitars for gigging purposes (Fylde and Taylor) so, my delicate little Mahogany Gibson doesn't need to see the road.!
R


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Lady Hillary
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 09:18 AM

Take your best guitar, add a wear plate to the side that does not have one, string your guitar opposite the right handers and play on. See, you've just save hundreds of Pounds and gained a usable instrument. Problem resolved. Doing this mod also lets you add a pickup to the instrument. TA DA

Yeah, I know it's a little more complicated than that but you get the idea.


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: breezy
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 09:39 AM

plenty of guitarists

go busk with the 'tina', its a novelty, wish I could play one, I'ld make a killing

Play it with a blanket over it to mute if it too loud, under the duvet even.

Lowdens are good, was it made for a lefthander originally?

Dont give up the tina whatever you do


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: jonm
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 03:27 PM

So many responses! And yes, when I re-read the original post, I'm really saying I don't want to give up the concertina, even if it rarely gets played.

I guess I shall have to try the "it followed me home" excuse. It is always easier to gain forgiveness than to get permission!

Thanks all.


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Eye Lander
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 06:08 PM

I have a beautiful Wheatstone Concertina 1875 (bought it a year a go now) can't play it very well but I love it. Some one said to me how lovely it was and that I have to look after it and leave it to my favourite child!
So keep the tina I say but i am biased - no interest in guitars.
Jillie


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST,MikeofNorthumbria(sans cllkie)
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 06:13 PM

Hi Jonm,

Having only just caught up with your thread, I can't add more than a few random thoughts to the good advice already given above. But rest assured that I do sympathise with your dilemma. This is because I'm an ageing, though still functional Morrisman who's played various guitars over the years, and has recently taken up the Anglo concertina as insurance against the day my knees give out.

Now If I were lucky enough to own a vintage Wheatstone concertina like yours, I'd be very reluctant to sell it. There'll never be any more of them made, and the way prices are going, if you give it up , it'll be extremely hard to replace if you regret the decision later. As to Lowden guitars - well yes, they are fantastic. But you can buy a very servicable guitar for a lot less money. You might even find a good local guitar builder who would construct one to your personal specification for less money than the shop price of a new Lowden.

But if you really want to have your cake and eat it ... have a serious talk with your financial adviser. Explain that the Lowden, like the Wheatstone, is not an indulgence, but an investment. You might get lucky!

Wassail!


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: greg stephens
Date: 07 Nov 05 - 06:29 PM

Think of all the great guitarists of the world,all the great recordings you treasure. How many of them needed a Lowden guitar? See, completely unnecessary.
BUt the concertina, you actually already love it. No contest.


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 08 Nov 05 - 03:55 AM

I think it's not so much a contest of needs Greg, more a matter of lust!! LOL!


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Gurney
Date: 08 Nov 05 - 04:28 AM

Where are you going to find a concertina like that again?
Are you always going to work long hours?
Are you always going to have small children about the place?
Why am I asking these questions?


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: mooman
Date: 08 Nov 05 - 04:46 AM

Good 1912 Wheatsone English = virtually irreplaceable

Left handed Lowden = very nice to have but there will always be others coming up for sale (as well as equally good makes)

So, like everyone else, I'd say hang on to the 'tina and go for the guitar when the time and conditions are right and the opportunity comes up.

Peace

moo
(not a 'tina player myself but I do love them played well)


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST,Andy
Date: 09 Nov 05 - 04:58 AM

jonm,

I have a very lovely Wheatstone 'tina, made in the 1850's. However, despite having owned it for about 20 years, I don't play it now. This is because I have a slight problem with my fingers and I'm not what I'd call a 'natural' musician. I struggle!.I have thought on numerous occasions that I should to let it go to someone who will use it for it's intended purpose, rather than having it sit on the bookcase. But it would be like losing a friend. I've been advised that it would fetch over £1000 and that's a nice sum in anybody's terms. The money would, no doubt, just get'absorbed'into other (useless?)things. BUT, are you, and I just HOARDING something that should have a better life? Someone else will love, cherish, be proud to own and use your magnificent 'tina (mine too!) We both have a problem of conscience. Guitars come and go and are insignificant compared with the vintage instrument that you own. BUT, LIKE MINE, IT'S DOING NO ONE ANY GOOD SITTING ON THE SHELF! Decision time for both of us maybe?
Regards    Andy


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: jonm
Date: 09 Nov 05 - 07:13 AM

Last year, when I was feeling really frustrated at never getting to play my box, I looked around for a cheaper, serviceable concertina so I would feel less guilty about not using it a deal. Unfortunately, it is hard to find an inexpensive instrument that doesn't either require a lot of costly work or otherwise sounds dire.

Mind you, I've played some £2k plus instruments which were neither decent players or had a reasonable tone.

I guess I'm lucky to have a good one and really ought to keep it an seek out more opportunities and sessions.....


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 09 Nov 05 - 07:22 AM

Ah! I've got the opposite problem - I'd love to get a good 'tina, but I know I never will have the money...


Hey! I've got an idea.... :-)


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Grab
Date: 09 Nov 05 - 07:29 AM

Left-handed Lowdens actually aren't that common, or not second-hand anyway. And since the George Lowden/Avalon dust-up, the price of an instrument made by the "Lowden shop" has gone up by 50% - instruments that previously would be £1300-1400 new are now £1800-2000 new. Because there aren't that many Lowdens made, they hold their value very well, so you're not going to lose money on the deal.

All the great guitarists mostly *did* have high quality guitars! ;-) However, it *will* still be possible to buy a left-handed Lowden in 10 years time (even if you have to buy new at £2k), whereas you may not be able to find another Wheatstone when you've got some money spare to buy one.

Ralph, you take the Fylde out and leave the Martin safe at home? Unless it's some vintage one that used to be owned by Doc Watson or something like that, surely that's got to be the wrong way round...?


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST,Just Wonderin'
Date: 09 Nov 05 - 07:41 AM

So, do they make left-handed concertinas?


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Reagle
Date: 09 Nov 05 - 07:46 AM

I have one guitar, its not that great, but I remain the weak link in the partnership. The thought of having ability in an instrument and giving it up... its beyond me.

Kids grow up so quickly.

Roger


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: GUEST,Ralph
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 02:25 AM

Hi Grab!

Well its the Gibson that stays at home!! (Haven't got a Martin)
Mind you, having had my last Fylde knicked after a gig last year, maybe I should leave them all at home!!!

Seriously, the Gibson is very small and quiet, and the Fylde suits the material I play. But, I take your point.

But, whatever instrument you play....Keep the insurance up to date!

Regards Ralphie


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Green Man
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 08:45 AM

I have two left haded guitars. My acoustic is handmade Northworthy Carsington by Alan Marshal, great instrument for sessions blues or jazz. The other an Epiphone Sheraton II for Blues and jazz amplified.(damn its good for the money). I have a Wheatstone Concertina and A Castagnari Lilly which I play the most. Never sell a good instrument. You will eventually regret it.

If we hang all of our instuments up we coud start a music shop. Strangely none of our kids a moosical and now they're old enough don't come to festivals any more.

I have never had problems finding lefty guitars, findng good ones is another thing entirely.

GM ;-)


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: Grab
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 01:08 PM

Need my eyes testing. I'll let you off with a Gibson... ;-)


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Subject: RE: Concertina and guitar dilemma
From: 12string growler
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 05:33 PM

If you think you can get away with the "it followed me home" excuse, you, like Strolling Johnny are too bloody affluent, LOL. I can justify expensive axe, but can't afford one nor am I a good enough musician and I know SJ will agree with that, won't you Mr Blanks!!

Chris


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