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BS: KatrinaGate

Bobert 30 Mar 10 - 10:29 AM
CarolC 30 Mar 10 - 10:12 AM
Bobert 30 Mar 10 - 08:38 AM
Sawzaw 30 Mar 10 - 02:03 AM
CarolC 29 Mar 10 - 07:06 PM
Bobert 29 Mar 10 - 05:45 PM
PoppaGator 29 Mar 10 - 05:25 PM
CarolC 29 Mar 10 - 01:35 PM
CarolC 29 Mar 10 - 01:33 PM
Amos 29 Mar 10 - 01:02 PM
Sawzaw 29 Mar 10 - 12:47 PM
Bobert 28 Mar 10 - 09:54 PM
Bobert 28 Mar 10 - 05:26 PM
Bobert 28 Mar 10 - 05:03 PM
Sawzaw 28 Mar 10 - 04:45 PM
Bobert 04 Oct 08 - 04:47 PM
Donuel 04 Oct 08 - 10:46 AM
Sawzaw 03 Oct 08 - 11:53 PM
Stringsinger 20 Sep 08 - 12:50 PM
Joe Offer 19 Sep 08 - 01:32 PM
GUEST,Sawzaw 19 Sep 08 - 10:21 AM
Bobert 19 Sep 08 - 07:21 AM
GUEST,Sawzaw 18 Sep 08 - 08:48 PM
Bobert 18 Sep 08 - 07:45 AM
GUEST,Sawzaw 17 Sep 08 - 10:37 PM
PoppaGator 17 Sep 08 - 05:38 PM
Bobert 17 Sep 08 - 04:41 PM
GUEST,Sawzaw 17 Sep 08 - 11:33 AM
Bobert 17 Sep 08 - 07:12 AM
GUEST,Sawzaw 17 Sep 08 - 12:09 AM
Bobert 15 Sep 08 - 10:34 PM
PoppaGator 15 Sep 08 - 10:10 PM
Bobert 15 Sep 08 - 08:15 PM
PoppaGator 15 Sep 08 - 10:25 AM
Bobert 15 Sep 08 - 09:17 AM
GUEST,Sawzaw 14 Sep 08 - 10:56 AM
Bobert 13 Sep 08 - 04:09 PM
GUEST,Sawzaw 13 Sep 08 - 12:01 PM
Bobert 12 Sep 08 - 06:21 PM
PoppaGator 12 Sep 08 - 04:10 PM
Bobert 12 Sep 08 - 02:42 PM
GUEST,Sawzaw 12 Sep 08 - 11:34 AM
Amos 12 Sep 08 - 01:49 AM
GUEST,Sawzaw 11 Sep 08 - 11:03 PM
Bobert 11 Sep 08 - 06:21 PM
PoppaGator 11 Sep 08 - 05:47 PM
Amos 11 Sep 08 - 05:35 PM
Bobert 11 Sep 08 - 05:07 PM
PoppaGator 11 Sep 08 - 02:05 PM
SINSULL 11 Sep 08 - 11:38 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Mar 10 - 10:29 AM

Ignore him, Carol... He adds nothing to any discussion... He is a troll and only into attacking people from the safety of cyberworld...
But you are correct in yer assessment that he doesn't really have a clue what people have done in their lives...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: CarolC
Date: 30 Mar 10 - 10:12 AM

Oh really, Sawzaw? You think I only became an activist after ACORN was closed down? You're not very observant.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Mar 10 - 08:38 AM

Yo, p-gator... Are you familiar with Jarvis DeBerry of the "Times-Piiayune"??? Nice guy and purdy danged smart, too...

BTW, Slawz... Any post of yours that begins with accusatory language doesn't get read by me... And I would guess just about everyone else so... Knock yerself out spending hours putting together these bill-of-particular-attacks 'cuase it's your right... Just thought you'd like to know in case you have anything else to do with yer life but obsess on me... But believe me, people are shooting right past yer posts like it was a radiation pit...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Sawzaw
Date: 30 Mar 10 - 02:03 AM

Bobert response to someone who wouldn't answer his questions:

Apr 08 - 2008

"Well, then why won't you friggin' answer my questions with anything but BS questions??? What do you have to hide???"

"She absolutely refuses to answer straight up questions... She runs like "pigs from a gun" and then plays her little games by not answering the questions but rather ask a multitude of meaningless rhetorical questions of her own"

"All I can see is someone filled with hate who won't come clean"

Also this proves he can type perfectly when he wants to. It is just his little cute game to type like an idiot.

The toxins are in all those types of trailers, not just the ones bought under the Bush administration but Bobert wants it to look like Bush caused the toxins to be there.

Amos's feelings are hurt cause I found two big ass, dumb ass mistakes in his frantic postings and his supreme being status is now tarnished.

CC is pissed cause her beloved ACORN went down the tubes because of internal wrongdoing and mismanagement. Now she's got her claws out itchin' for a fight.

Bobert don't want to respond to McKinney's fairy tale because it might expose his Green Party as being a bunch of nuts.

I never said anybody was shot in the head. That was McKinney.

I am glad Poppagator has his head on straight and looking for the truth.

People should be looking for the truth, admitting their mistakes and quit this stupid ass he's all good or all bad tribal mentality.

The world is not going to get any better until people quit looking for scapegoats and demons to blame everything on.

Sure Bush screwed up, Brownie screwed up, Nagin screwed up, Blanco screwed up. Who did their job perfectly or even passably?

NO has plenty of corruption to go around. My Daughter was married there in the Garden District. She went to Loyola.

I know something about the place and I know it was an accident waiting to happen with crooked politics like any city. They played games with money for the levees.

If any improvements are to be made in the situation we would have to sort out all the screw ups and take steps to prevent them from happening again.

Right now it is a race to see which politician can make the most promises and send the most money to insure their re election. And where does the money go? Mostley down a rat hole.

Oh you poor people, so and so fucked you over so bad, I am going to fix it.

Yeah, The Big Easy.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 07:06 PM

McKinney is saying they were probably prisoners, and that this information was entered in a Pentagon database. I don't know if I would dismiss it out of hand. I think more investigation might not be a bad idea.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 05:45 PM

Hmmmmmmm??? Let's see... How many folks died during Katrina??? 2000??? 1800??? And of those 1800 to 2000, 5000 were shot in the head???? Hmmmmm??? Better talk "Math 101" with "Critical Thinking 101", Swaz...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 05:25 PM

I'm amazed that this thread is still alive; and kinda glad too.

Despite some very transparent efforts to hush things up, it has become pretty well documented that the Army Corps of Engineers had, for years, fallen short in designing the levee system and ~ more significantly ~ in assuring that the existing designs were executed properly by the contractors they hired. Unfortunately, some elements within the Corps continue to spend their time and our money on trying to excuse and/or cover-up past transgressions rather than to work at fixing thimgs for the next storm. Also, for years and years, Congress (both parties) has refused to fully fund flood-protection proposals for this area.

On the other hand, the repaired floodwalls on the Industriasl Canal held up during Hurricain Gustav a couple of years ago, under conditions very similar to those under which they caved during and immediately after Katrina. Also, the vast majority of the people working at Corps HQ in New Orleans live here and have an obvious vested interest in getting it right, finally.

I have no doubt that some cops were so freaked by the surreal conditions of that first week after the flood that they killed a number of innocent people. An especially notorious bunch are just now finally being brought to trial for the killings at the Danzinger Bridge. But I don't for a minute believe that urban legend bullshit about 5,000 indidviduals all vicitmized by the same kind of headshot. And even if true, that would have nothing at all to do with one or the other Presidential administration or political party.

Anyone interested in the truth, and in reasonable discussion of these issues, should check out:

www.levees.org.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 01:35 PM

And while we're at it, are you trying to blame the toxins in the trailers on Obama, too? GW Bush was president during Hurricane Katrina, not Barack Obama.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 01:33 PM

Who do you think was responsible for those people being shot in the head, Sawzaw? Are you going to try to blame it on Obama? Keep in mind that the federal government appears to have had at least some involvement in what happened to those people, and also the fact that it was George W Bush who was president at the time (or Dick Cheney).


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 01:02 PM

Ya know, Sawzer, it's a darned shame that neither Bobert nor I are willing to kowtow to your imperious interrogatories. We just don't answer up like good Charlie McCarthy types oughter. Dang. Maybe it's that "freedom of speech" gene which includes the freedom NOT to speak to snide antagonisms.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Sawzaw
Date: 29 Mar 10 - 12:47 PM

Bobert:

The one and only question was how are the levees.

Instead of an honest answer I get an anti Bush hate speech.

First you say GWB took too long and then you say he didn't take the time.

Why was there toxins in those trailers?

Who shot those 5000 people in the head?


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 10 - 09:54 PM

BTW, on my way to New Aww'leens I passed an area in Mississippi (maybe Alabama) right next to the interstae where all the FEMA traiolers are being stored... It was an awesome site... Thousands of them lined up... I was thinking, "Hmmmmmm, that represents alot of money... Too bad that they were filled with toxins and unsafe and too bad that the Bush administration didn't take the time to be sure that, even tho it was way too late, to be sure that the federal government wasn't getting fleeced..."

But fleecing governments is what George cut his teeth on... Hell, he bungled everything he touched until he and a bunch of lawyers, accountants and crooks fleeced Arlington, Texas... Then Geiorge went a step further and fleeced the IRS??? Danged, son!!! That is some serouss fleecin'...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 10 - 05:26 PM

Oh, I almost forgot a couple of things...

First, don't get the BBQ'd shrimp anywhere 'cause it's like in this soupy hot sauce with the shells on... Very messy but that's they way them New Aww'leens folk like 'um...

Second of all, had a nice talk with one of the editorial writers on the Times-Picayune about Katrina and he was very appreciative of some of the comments I made to him...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 28 Mar 10 - 05:03 PM

Oh yeah... I checked 'um out... Purdy cool system but cooler than that was New Orleans itself... The Garden District is the "shits"... I mean, awesomely nice gardens and beautiful, yet electric, achitecture... The bridge oveb Lake Poncitraine leading to the North Shore was something to behold... That thing must be close to 15 miles long... The street musicans were a hoot... I got to meet up with Blind Troy and jammed with this drummer in another part of the French Quarter...

It's a real shame that George Bush was blowin' so much smoke up America's ass after 9/11 about being ready for the next disaster... I mean, I don't blame Bush for Katrina or the flooding but his National Response Plan was junk...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Sawzaw
Date: 28 Mar 10 - 04:45 PM

Well Well Well Bobert.

Did you check out the levees in N.O. while you was there to see if Obama has them up to snuff?

With all your fair mindedness, I sure wouldn't want you to have to attack him for not fixing something he inherited.

I seen him campaigning down there with his coat off and everything making his election promises about how he is going to swing into action like the Taz as soon as he gets elected.

Speakin' of Katrina, Here is a Progressive and a Greenie presidential candidate that has quite a tale to tell about Katrina:

Cynthia McKinney said during a public press conference is that a mother contacted her in 2005. The woman's son purportedly had job with the Department of Defense and processed the bodies of 5,000 people who died from a single bullet wound to the head, and later dumped in a swamp in Louisiana.

This man reportedly signed an agreement of silence to never discuss any of this, and further, the data about these murdered individuals was entered into Pentagon computers.

McKinney said she has verification of the alleged crime by insiders at the Red Cross who wish to remain anonymous.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 04:47 PM

Yer right, Strings....

New Orleans has been conducting "ethnic cleansing" since Katrina... Laws have been enacted to keep blacks from inhabiting certain neighborhods one one hand while others are being arresting and held up to 90 days without hearings...

It is disgracefull... What is equally disgracefulll is that the media couldn't care less about reporting what is going on in New Orleans...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Donuel
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 10:46 AM

How many dead bodies from Katrina were found?

It seems like that number is a national secret.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Sawzaw
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:53 PM

FEMA Says State Must Pay $30 Million

Louisiana officials are stumped. Do officials in our Office of Homeland Security owe the federal government more than 30 million dollars? The feds sent the bill Wednesday for money paid out in the form of grants for a federal flood buyout program. Three former Louisiana Homeland Security employees who oversaw the program are currently under federal indictment.

The state says we don't owe the money back. But they say if we do, the individual parishes the grants went to will have to pay back the money.

Mark Smith, Dept. of Homeland Security said, "Would I call it a public relations nightmare? Yes."

It was just a matter of time before the bill was sent to the state following its handling of federal FEMA flood buyout monies. The government says more than 30 million was misspent by the state through the Office of Emergency Preparedness between 1997 and 2002. Three former high level employees of the office are under federal indictment for charges related to the handling of those FEMA funds.

"Really its not that the money was misspent here or the money was misspent there," says Smith. "It's going to be, in a lot of the cases, a matter of improper paperwork."

According to the letter, the Louisiana Office of Homeland Security and Office of Emergency Preparedness failed to properly assess project eligibility, rank properties consistently with state priorities, and verify that projects met the criteria for priority funding.

"We'll have to look at each individual parish and possibly go back to them for money."

According to Joanne Moreau, Director of the East Baton Rouge Parish Homeland Security, East Baton Rouge will be asked to pony up 3.6 million dollars. Moreau says she has requested documentation from the state to prove what they owe.

East Baton Rouge Parish applied for their own grants and did not enlist the help of private companies like Aegis Innovative Solutions. Aegis contracted with many of the parishes who will be asked to pay back the money. Aegis is owned by former Office of Emergency Preparedness employees.

Moreau says she believes the letter from FEMA clearly asks the state to re-pay that money. In other words, it's a state issue and not a parish by parish issue. We also asked the state Homeland Security Office to show us the documentation the federal government used to come up with that 30 million dollar figure. They agreed to show us, but not until Thursday.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Stringsinger
Date: 20 Sep 08 - 12:50 PM

Here's the Bush/McCain plan. Get rid of New Orleans and replace it with condominiums
and gambling casinos.

That way you eliminate the "sinful" New Orleans and replace it with a "morally acceptable"
alternative.

FEMA can help in this endeavor by doing nothing and letting "god's will" take its course.

Put those recalcitrant victims in barbed wire compounds or cheap trailers and subject them to chemical poisoning.

Let Blackwater patrol the streets.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 01:32 PM

FEMA, the Federal Emergency Management Agency, was established in 1979 under President Jimmy Carter, a consolidation of functions performed by a number of Federal agencies.
In response to the attacks of September 11, 2001, Congress passed the Homeland Security Act of 2002, and FEMA was absorbed into the new Department of Homeland Security in 2003.

I did security clearance investigations on FEMA disaster workers for a number of years, and I was very impressed by the caliber of employee FEMA was able to hire for temporary jobs. I'd guess most FEMA workers stayed at a disaster site for two or three months, but some were around for 6 months. Many were retired experts from a variety of professions, particularly the building trades and building insprection, and engineering. They really enjoyed their work and were very enthusiastic about wanting to help people recover from disasters. They were creative, interesting people - and they had a lot of good stories to tell.

A parallel agency was the Disaster Branch of the Small Business Administration, which processed low-interest recovery loans for victims of disasters (FEMA workers arrived first and gave grants for short term needs, and SBA came later and handled loans for the long-term needs of recovery). I also did clearances for SBA - SBA people tended to be younger, attorneys and people who had come from the banking industry. I lived with two SBA disaster workers for about 15 months in 1992-93. One was an attorney - he spent about a year in Hawaii and Guam after Hurricane Iniki. The other had been a business specialist with Dun & Bradstreet - she spent a good amount of time in Guam. I think the FEMA people had more interesting jobs, since they were more closely involved with immediate recovery after a disaster. The SBA people did a lot of paperwork.

I retired in 1999 and quit part-time work in the summer of 2001, so I don't know what's happened to these programs since the establishment of the Department of Homeland Secruity. I don't think absorption into DHS is a bad idea, since it gives disaster relief representation on the Cabinet. However, I get the impression the entire federal bureaucracy has been in a demoralized state under the Bush Administration. Bush has poured all resources into Defense, and everything else has been on the back burner since 2002.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 10:21 AM

Noe that you mention FEMA, how did FEMA get to be part of DHS?

Who demanded that?


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 07:21 AM

Yeah, I predict that Sawz will soon either starve to death in the "Pointless Forest" or find someone elses heels to nip at her in Mudville... Or both...

BTW, Howz the new 'n improved FEMA doing in Texas??? How did that National Response Plan work out??? Hmmmmmm???

Where's Brownie???

Where's Elmo???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 08:48 PM

OK. Folks voted Dem and the Derms took back either house of Congress, but no subpoenas, no filibusters and nothing "gotten" on the Boy.

Got it. Next prediction?


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 07:45 AM

Tell me what good supena powers are when the Bush administration thinks they are invitations to be accepted or ignored???

Yo, P-Gator... Just a few more days of vacation and I'll be "back on the farm"... (Rememeber it??? Well, it's changed alot since you were there...) I'll reread my material and throw some of it into the mix here...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 10:37 PM

So I assume that the "Congressional comittee, with supena powers" got nothing.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 05:38 PM

A local politician in suburban St. Bernard Parish ~ predominantly working-class and almost entirely white ~ proposed an ordinance outlawing the conversion of homes that were owner-occupied before Katrina into rental property, with the only exceptions allowed being rental within the owner's family.

There was a lot of controversy, public discussion, etc., much of it on racial themes ~ that the motive was to exclude black renters from the parish. I'm sure that a degree of racism was a factor, especially unconscious racism, but it was not the primary motivation.

In any event, the proposed ordinance did not pass.

There were out-of-state real estate speculators buying up properties in badly-flooded St. Bernard really cheap in the aftermath of the storm. The relatively few people who had returned to fix up and reoccupy their homes and their communities ~ which had always, since they were built in the late 1940s, been composed of homeowners ~ were understandably concerned about half the properties on each of their blocks being bought up for development by investors living in Florida.

St. Bernard is just "below" (downriver from) and adjacent to the lower 9th ward, is in the same flood "basin" at an even lower elevation, and had many more properties sitting in much deeper water. The lower 9 gets a lot of public attention, deservedly enough, for a number of reasons:
~ The area immediately next to the Industrial Canal level-break was hit by a huge, explosive, fast-moving wall of water that blew houses off their foundations, turned cars and trucks upside-down, and generally created the most amazing photo ops of the whole disaster.
~ The Lower 9th is (or was) the entire nation's leading neighborhood in terms of black home-ownership, while at the same time being a very poverty-stricvken area. Almost every home in the area was inherited by its occupants, and many were built "by hand" by the father or grandfather.

St. Bernard was arguably more throughly damaged than any part of New Orleans, but is more generally "forgotten" by the media and the outside world, and the citizens have a bit of a chip on their collective shoulder.

******************************

I've heard nothing about a landlord in New Orleans being thrown in jail for renting to anyone, black or white. Some of them probaly should be thrown in jail for jacking up their rents and evicting long-time residents so they can get their new higher prices from newcomers.

These are instances where relatively affluent people (those who own multiple properties) are taking advantage of the less fortunate, but it has nothing to do with race. In fact, most landlords in New Orleans are African-American, just as most people, and almost all elected officials, are black.

Also, most landlords in New Orleans, white and black alike, are pretty small-time capitalists who inherited their houses ~ could never have afforded to buy more than one home ~ and in very many cases only own one structure, living in one half of a double (two-family house) while renting out the other side.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 04:41 PM

Read yer own posts, Sawz... You asked what the Dems have done to make Bush pay for his clusterf*cks and I pointed out that there is little the Dems can do with only a 51/49 majority in the Senate...

Purdy simple to figure out...

It ain't been the Dems on the fillibusterin' side of late... It's been the threats from the Repbs...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 11:33 AM

Would somebody fill me in on what, in regards to Bush and Katrina, was filibustered?


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 07:12 AM

51/49 ain't gonna punish anyone as long as it takes 60 votes to cut off a fillibuster... PoliSci 101...

BTW, P-Gator... I understand that a N.O.landlord was jailed for renting to some black folks and ended up putting them out as a condition of his sentence... I'm in SC on vacation so I don't have access to my files but when I get home I'll reread that article and thrown some facts of the case at ya'...


Meanwhile, I reckon we'll see just what level of "protection" the American people have from the losses from Ike... Outta be an eye-opener...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 12:09 AM

"if you vote Dem and the Derms take back either house of Congress, yer gonna find out that what I've been able to get against the boy wil pale in comparision to what the Congressional comittee, with supena powers, will get"

Will somebody fill me in on what the Derms have done to punish GWB for his clusterfuck?


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 10:34 PM

The one I was refering to, P-Gator, has something to do with not being able to rent unless you have blood releatives who once owned or rented in that area...

Ya' heard of that one???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 10:10 PM

There's so much wrong-headed stuff going on hereabouts, Bob, that I'm not sure just which dumbass rules you refer to.

The worst of all the federal rules are those which forbid FEMA to provide funding for repairing or building permanent housing, only for temporary lodging (rent payment, hotel bills).

I can see how this was originally intended, to prevent pork-barrel-type profiteering by building contractors, and also as a measure against favoritism for property owners as opposed to renters, but in a situation where so very much of a region's housing stock has been badly damaged, and where recovery is so certain to take years rather than months, it leads to incredible waste.

People were stuck in motel rooms for months and months, unable to cook and forced to spend money they didn't have on eating out. Meanwhile, houses that could be undergoing repair sat festering and falling into worse and worse condition every day.

Nothing "Jim Crow" about that, not even unintentionally. If more black folks than white are affected, it's only because more than half the population of New Orleans is of African descent (and, or course, an even higher percentage of the poor ~ not a surprise and not unlike any other American city, although probably less so.)

Not all the poor are black, however, and not all the blacks are poor. We have a very large black middle class and upper-middle class population ~ including the political ruling class ~ and of course there are also plenty of white folks of modest means. No one is exempt from the suffering


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 08:15 PM

I hate to bring this up, P-Gator but there's some dumbass rules for renting and rebuilding in N.O. that comes right outta an old Jim Crow Play Book... I reckon that the old Klaners are feeling their oats and figure that if they can jus' run the rest of the blacks outta Lousianna then Katrina or Gustov or whatever, Louisana will go Repub for the next million years...

Maybe you know somethin' about these things, I donno, but the rumblings ain't stayin' right there in N.O. and folks as far away as Virginia have heard 'bout this stuff...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 10:25 AM

FEMA has cleaned up its act as well as they could over the past three years, but of course news continues to come out about fatcat busnessmen taking every advantage to exploit government contracts ~ and, of course, every instance of "emergency response" is a near-perfect opportunity to rip off the taxpayer.

I'm sure that think-tank hirelings, columnists being paid under the table, and talk-radio demagogues will continue to blame the victims for waste and overspending, not the campaign-contributing corporations who are the major abusers of the system.

I wonder if those nasty bigmouths will be any kinder to Texan hurricane victims than they were to us Louisianans. (As recently as this year's Midwestern flooding, they were still on their soapboxes denouncing us and pretending that Iowans would be less dependent upon emergenccy funding than we've been.)

This latest population to be wiped out by flooding is only slightly more Caucasian than us in next-door Louisiana, but it's much more Protestant and less Catholic, and their gay minority is less visible. It should be more difficult for the dittoheads of the world to demonize a group they see as "their own" than they did us "un-American" Blacks, Catholics, and gays in Louisiana.

Of course, Louisiana voted for Bush, pretty overwhelmingly, in the last two elections, with rural white Louisiana expecially receptive to the neoconservative message. But the talkshow assholes liked to pretend that the 15,000-20,000 poor black folks left behind in New Orleans during Katrina ~ and more specifically, the couple-hundred lawbreaking looters ~ were more representative of our population than the 80,000 homeowners who evacuated at their own expense and, in many ases, lost everything they owned. Now that similar numbers of Texans are having the same experience, I'm curious to see how the right-wing hate-and-fear industry will respond.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:17 AM

Get a life, Old Guy/Dickey/whomever...

Whatever question I asked I rescend... There, now back to the discussion at hand...


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 10:56 AM

I will go by your judgment Joe. You are the boss and you seem to be a fair man.

However Bobert asked me a question and I answered it. However he does not like the answer and refuses to answer mine.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 04:09 PM

Ask until the cows come home, Sawz... It has nothing to do with this thread... You are just trolling and as Joe has pointed out, you are not acting in a civil manner...

But then you didn't when you were Dickey or when you were Old Guy or when you were ____________________ or when you were _____________________.....

B~















-


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 12:01 PM

Bobert I am merely responding to your question "Are you even interetsed in facts, Sawz??? Apparently not..."

And I am asking you again where your fact "1% hold all the wealth in Haiti" came from. That fact caught my eye and I am interested in knowing the source.

Answer: _______________________________________________

    Sawzaw, your posts are getting far too aggressive. You'll notice that many of them are being deleted. I suggest you back off, and conduct yourself in a civil manner.
    -Joe Offer, Forum Moderator-


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 06:21 PM

Ya'll "Ike'rs" hear that??? Better read the small print...

Ya' know, P-Gator... Why is it that I am not surprised???

I also heard that Gustov wiped out any reswerve cash the Red Cross had... Hmmmmmmm???

I don't like this hurrican one bit and am truely scared for the folks who are going to lose everything as a result of it... Ain't 'sposed to be this way in America...

I mean, $3B a week for Iraq and we can't even protect our own people from being wiped pit finacially??? Somethin' real wrong here... real wrong...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 04:10 PM

"Are those the trailers that have those bad fumes in 'um, P-gator??? If so, the way I hear it they are not safe to live in..."

Actually, any small trailer designed for short-term use (two-week vacation, etc.) has enough formaldehyde in the interior building materials to present a danger to anyone living inside,all day every day, for months and months, especially if they don't air it out regularly.

And when you're spending a New Orleans summer in a little tin box parked in front of your gutted home, you will probably keep the A/C running 24/7, with all the windows shut all the time and the doors opened as infreqently as possible. Under those conditions, the accumulating fumes can begin to pose a danger to the very young, very old, and chronically ill.

******************************

More FEMA news, just out in the last 24 hours or so:

A couple of days after Gustav hit last week, Chertov made a widely publicized announcement that anyone who had evacuated, was holed up in a hotel/motel, and either legally forbidden or simply unwilling to return home beofre power would be restored, could register with FEMA and FEMA would pick up the bill for lodging, paying the hotel directly. He very specifically stated that it was NOT necessary to prove that your home was damaged ~ you obviously would not know the extent of damage, if any, until able to return. The room-rate payment would not be retroactive, that is, it would not pay for the entire evacuation period, but it would go into effect immediately upon phoning in and registering with FEMA for anyone whose address of record was in a zipcode that had flooded and/or where power had gone out and was not immediatley restored.

We had already run out of cash and maxed out two credit cards and were driving home a day before we would be "allowed,": so this would not apply to us. However, a lot of folks who were still in hotels that day and running out of money took Chertof at his word and stayed an extra day or two until given the green light to head home.

FEMA has now reneged on this promise, and will pay lodging costs only for registered households whose primary residence had actually sustained substantial damage. Anyone who didn't know their home's status, and who DID know that their local authorities were discouraging them from returning, or even actually blocking the roads, and stayed away ~ they're out of pocket for all their temporary-relocation expenses.

Apparently, the part about paying the hotels directly was complete hogwash from the start. What payments will be made will be in the form of reimbursement.

For all the emphasis varioius news organizations have given the publically-funded evacuation of the indigent population (and of the lack thereof for Katrina three years ago), folks need to be reminded that the vast majority of evacuees do so in their own vehicles at their own expense. Some have friends or relatives located in some safe and accessble area, but most fill up every available motel room within hundreds of miles, paying full rates and of course also spending plenty more on gas and food. Also, of course, all but the most affluent, corporate workers on salary, are spending all this extra money while NOT bringing anything in for a week or more.

Hurricane evacuation is a substantial financial hardship for the middle-to-lower-middle class, and it's an unwelcome extra expense even for those who are better off and can more-or-less afford it. The poor do have endure the least comfortable conditions in their publicly-fnded transporation and shelters, of course, but at least they don't take on much extra expense. (The working poor, of course, lose a paycheck or two, as do all the not-quite-so-poor working families.)


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 02:42 PM

Tell ya' what, Sawz/Dickey/Old Guy... Rather than you pestering me like a gnat about something that has nothing to do with this thread how about dealing with the real issue which is the ineptness of the Bush ahministartion in making our urban centers safer and his gutting of FEMA and his appointing people to run agancies who were unqualified...

You just like being a pest for the sake of being a pest... You can change your name (spots) as much as you want but we all know that you are same ol' pest who would rather divert attention from your hero, George Bush, so that he and his supporters (you) won't have to accept "personal responsibiliy...

1% or 5%... Like who gives a rat's ass??? No one here and you can take that to the bank, unless of course, it's a Haitian bank... lol... Oh yeah, looks as if there are a few US banks you don't wnat any part of either... lol, part 2...

Now buzz off and go peddle yer papers...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 11:34 AM

Dear Amos:

If you care to look, I have already posted the correct figure on who owns what in Haiti base on a BBC article.

I am trying to get the fact man, Bobert, to reveal where his fact that "1% hold all the wealth in Haiti" came from, a seemingly impossible task because, like some other Mudcatters, he chooses to dodge perfectly legitimate questions.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 12 Sep 08 - 01:49 AM

Here ya go, weisenheimer:

http://www.fsmitha.com/world/haiti.htm, which I found in thirteen seconds, states concerning Haiti:

Wealth Distribution

One percent of the populations owns nearly half of the nation's wealth. The elite live a half-hour's drive from Port-au-Prince, in the mountain suburb of Pétionville, where it is cooler and, according to Jared Diamond, they are "enjoying expensive French restaurants and fine wines."

Female to male income rate: 52:100 (from Foreign Policy magazine.

Quality of Life

Ranks next to last, 110, in the Economist Magazine's 2005 Quality-of-Life index.

Female literacy rate (published in 2008): 57 percent.

SOURCES:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/
http://www.nationmaster.com/index.php


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 11:03 PM

Still waiting for the man of facts to reveal his un-named source on Haitian economic statistics.

Yes Bobert I am very interested in facts. Give me some and verify the source.

Here is another easy question for Bobert:

Do all trailers have bad fumes in 'um or just "the ones" that the anti-abortion/pro Bush Boss Hogg guy sold to FEMA?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/Health/story?id=3240532&page=1


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 06:21 PM

Are those the trailers that have those bad fumes in 'um, P-gator??? If so, the way I hear it they are not safe to live in...

That's one of the things that bugs me about how the Bush administartion tried to cover their butts in the aftermath of Katrina in buying stuff too late, like hiring truckers to drive all over the county with trailers full of ice, like giving money to corporations that had given money to their campaigh and now we acres and acres of new trailers that taxpayers paid for that are unsafe???

(But, Boberdz... The guy who own the trailer manufacturing company gave all that dough to Buah and is against abortion, too...)

Oh???

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 05:47 PM

One of the ironies we encounter everytime we drive north-by-northeast, either during 2006 when bouncing back and forth between temporary and permanent homes in New Orelans and New Jersey, respectively, or more recently as Gustav evacuees:

There's a huge parking lot of unused FEMA trailers ~ hundreds of them ~ right alongside Interstate 59 near Laurel, Mississippi. We taxpayers paid for 'em, some company made the deal and collected their price, and the trailers have been sitting unused at least since early 2006 while hundreds, maybe thousands, of displaced families could have taken temporary shelter in them.

Good luck recouping those overpayments. I have a hunch that more effort will be put into dunning flood-victim families for one to two thousand "overpaid" dollars apiece than into trying to hit up any campaign-contributing contractors for hundreds of thousands, even a million or two, each.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 05:35 PM

KATRINA -- REPORT SAYS MILLIONS WASTED ON NO-BID CONTRACTS FOR KATRINA RECOVERY: 

According to a report by the Homeland Security Department's office of inspector general, "The government wasted millions of dollars on four no-bid contracts it handed out for Hurricane Katrina work." The Associated Press called the report "the latest to detail mismanagement in the multibillion-dollar Katrina hurricane recovery effort, which investigators have said wasted at least $1 billion." In the new report, investigators cite temporary housing contracts that were "awarded without competition to Shaw Group Inc., Bechtel Group Inc., CH2M Hill Companies Ltd. and Fluor Corp." by the Federal Emergency Management Administration (FEMA). Investigators found that FEMA "did not always properly review the invoices submitted by the four companies" and "also issued open-ended contract instructions for months without clear guidelines on what work was needed to be done and the appropriate charges," which "wasted at least $45.9 million." Approximately $20 million of the wasted money went towards "a camp for evacuees that was never inspected and proved to be unusable." FEMA said that it "generally agreed" with the report and "would further investigate the $45.9 million in questioned costs and recoup the money as necessary."

...


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 05:07 PM

Thanks, Sins, for that article... Yeah, purdy much sums up alot of what I have been saying since starting this thread almost 3 years ago... I didn't realize that Bectel had recieved so much money, though it being a large corporate donor to the Bush/Cheney administration/regime it is of no wonder...

But one thing that Katrina did do is expose just how little interest the Bushites have in providing any level of security for our urban areas... None are prepared for evacuations or for dealing with large situations... It's sad that our governemnt sees fit to spend $12b a month in Iraq but isn't up to the task of protecting it's own citizens... Yeah, as the recent evacuation of New Orleans showed, people get it... The governemnt can't anf ain't gonna do squat so ya' better just get the heck out, even if it means maxing out every credit card you own... It's every man for himself...

If Ike hits the Texas coast as a Cat 4 and is still a Cat 3 when it gets to Houston then we are going to witness "Exhibit B" that Bush ain't fixed nuthin'... I hate to say it and I'd doubly hate to see it but that's the way it is...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: PoppaGator
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 02:05 PM

The immediate response to Katrina (or, more accurately, the lack thereof) was pretty strong evidence that the agency had become a patronage mill, a source of dead-head jobs rewarding Bushite loyalists with easy paychecks.

It should be no surprise that the awarding of contracts for dealing with the aftermath, when time was short and approval for funding was pretty much automatic, would present opportunities for fraudualent profiteering that were just too tempting to pass up.

Because the Shaw Group, one of the fattest pigs at the trough, is based in Baton Rouge, we heard a lot of crowing about how much money was "staying right here in Louisiana." As though I should be glad that so much money found its way into the pockets of a well-connected few in Baton Rouge, not only to another bunch of fatcats in Washington and its Virginia and Maryland suburbs.


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Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: SINSULL
Date: 11 Sep 08 - 11:38 AM

More good news:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26647780/


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