BS: KatrinaGate

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 09:29 PM

BTW, I just returnd from performin' at a fundraiser, "Relay for Life", which raises money for cancer research down at the ball field in Luray... Big danged crowd... It was fun... Played with a 14 year old sax player, Luke "Saxman" Black, who can blow that horn... Don't hurt me none that his dad is assistent town manager but he sho nuff can blow that horn...

Wonder what GUEST's did for their communities today???...

(There you go agin, Bobert, blowing yer own horn about just how wonderful you are...)

Thought I'd beat the GUEST's to their *** usual reaction*** and save 'um the time..

And, GUESTs, your welcome...

But still curious about what you anonomous folks do in the real world... Hehe... Not that I'd believe anyone who is, ahhhhh, anon...

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 09:21 PM

Well, Amos, I don't have a clue about GUEST's post... I also went back and reread them as if they were going to be some thunderous post that we all missed that contained the Holy Grail but, ahhhh, they seemed purdy mundane to me???

But one thing is fir sure... These GUEST's don't collectively have a rebuttal... Here we are well over 500 posts now and not one actual, ahhhh, rebuttal??? But they are persistent at gnat like distractions... But no real defense here...

Oh sure, they say that Bobert has to have it his own way, or Bobert is this or Bobert is that... But no rebuttals???

But, hey, it has been entertainin', that's fir sure... Here GUEST A has changed his name to GUEST, Rufus trying to neddle me 'cause of my couzin Rufus... Hey, that's some funny stuff, Amos... And then he wandered over to Tweedsblues 'er somewhere to find stuff I said there about "stink bombs" that I'd almost forgotten I posted about Mudcat... I love it... Like I siad, very entertainin', indeed...

No rebuttals, however, so I guess they know their boy screwed up royally but can't admit it...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 03:27 PM

Well, GUEST, since you were too indifferent to provide a link I crawled back in time to look at those posts. I don't see a question there, exactly. What is it you are saying? That the Governors delay in turning over authority to the Feds was responsible for the inactivity of the Federal government in responding?

Why do you expect me to go to the trouble of trying to guess what you are implying?

A

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 01:17 PM

So what is yer point Amos?

I got to ax you questions now since O'Bobert done shut down his propaganda machine.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 10:33 AM

Good point, Amos and I think the following two posts say it all. No one here replied to the 01:35 AM post until bobert at 9:35 PM.
WHy did others not respound? They were able to ascertain the real truth

Post @ 08 January 01:35 AM and a post @ 9:35 PM same day.


Once again, shrugging off the facts.

As I said just above, that is enough for me. You can have Joe check for my ISP on this thread from now on if you don't believe me.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 10:15 AM

You guys are a piece of work -- all you do is spew tangents around like some wanna-be circle running amok.

Find the point. It's in the first few posts to this thread. Speak to the point.

Pose a specific question and answer specific questions offered by others.

What are y'all doing here?

A

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 10:10 AM

Relevance, por favor...

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 08:16 AM

Well, that is enough for me. Love the summary. And bobert, you were the one from the beginning that said this Poppagator fellow would help prove your point(s). Have not seen that yet - he did what any smart person would do and what all were told to do and got the hell of NO before the storm.

I still don't know if you are an agitator, play "Devils Advocate" a basic wiseguy or badly uniformed. I happen to feel the latter is a large part of of this.

You are the winner in one respect - ignorance is bliss and you are happy.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jun 06 - 03:33 AM

Dear O'Bobert:

#1 Unless you got some kinda gag order, anythin and everythin to do with Katrina is pertinent ta this here thread you started, other wise you done illegally put Katrina in tha name.

#2 I never appointed anybody to anythin. I wanted to see if somebody from NO ahrees with you. Does Poppagator? Did he say Bush Blew itwif no mention of the local gummint?

Personal attacks by O'Bobert:
"Bush-heads, T-Head included"
"All the crap you are saying is just that: crap"
"Waht don't you get about that???: How many time do I have to point that out to you before it sinks into yer bone-head???"
"knothead Bushites"
"Weell, it's like arguin' with a couple friggin' retards, as far as I can see it... The two of them don't have 'nuff I.Q. points to take on a box of animal crackers."
"Freud would have a field day with these two"
"You sound like some prize-fighter whio has both eyes bloodied and is just flailin' way a air"
"The dumb shit who said there were WMDs in Iraq,"
"Well, no, I haven't" quacks the quaster"

O'Boberts bad language:
"They say the same dumbass stuff over and over and over like it's true????"
"Then you get these two knotheads who are either just making sh*t up or are gettin' sh*t that is made up for them from some Bushite blog and it's, quite frankly, purdy danged pathetic"
"It doesn't matter a rat's ass"
"Who gives a rat's ass about Blanko"
"if you don't have the balls"

O'Bobert's hypocrisy:
"missing the big piccure"
"name calling by you and the other "couragous" GUESTS"


O'Boberts attempt to control the discussion to suit himself:
"there are some premises that I laid down that superceed yer arguments"

O'Bobert wanderin off of the topic he demands everybody else (cept his buds) must stick to:
"Once upon a time, a very bad thing happened and some angry people from Saudi Arabia hyjacked 4 American Airliners and flew 2 of the into buildings in New York, 1 into the Pentagon and the last airliner crashed in a Pennsylvania woods. This occured on September 11th and so it has since just been referred to as "Nine Eleven"

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 08:08 PM

No more answers until you do a little answerin' of yer own, Rufe.. I asked you hald a dozen relevant qurstion that you seem to try to evade by asking me stuff that don't have nuthin' to do with the issue at hand...

Like P-Gator questions... What on God's Good Earth has possessed you to not only appoint P-Gator to the position of speaking for every New Orleanan, which if I were from there I would find personally insaultin, but then you kepp asking the same dumb-ass question for me to answer as if P-Gator was in possession of the Holy Grail??? I'm not too sure who yer debating coach was in high school or college but that person failed you miserably...

If this was a court of law I would have motioned the judge for "Relevance" over and over as you ask questions that have nuthin' to do with Bush's response to Katrina...

Maybe you'd like to expalin how P-Gatot's testmony is relevant to Bush's response to Katrina???

Maybe you like to explain why you try to turn this discussion to one about me???

Maybe you'd like to explain what queations you have asked that I haven't answered and why you think they are "relevant" to this thread???

Maybe you'd like to explain why you have used foul language in yer posts???

No, pal, it isn't me who has been palying games... It's you and you continue to play game becuase either you like playing games of you have no real defense... It really doesn't matter much to me...

As for responding to any more of yer posts don't expect much more responses because frankly, and I don't mean this disrespectfully, until you come up with some reasonable rebuttals, responding to yer accusdations and abitings it not worth my time...

You have added nuthin' to this discussion... If you think you have, please explain and answer all the questions I put forth in this post... Purdy simple... You've been playing a bad hand and it getting time to show 'um....

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 03:01 PM

Where is the Poppagators anger at GWB?

If he was holdin him responsible for evething like you are an like you say evebody should he would say so. He didn't so that means you is just beatin yore chest and making a lot of noise about GWB while side steppin any questions about who else is responsible. Ya don't want to look at tha whole picture.

Like I said another nasty ass one sided rant about Bush and a false one, a troll at that. Just Fun for O'Bobert.

let's go back thru those questions one at a time and see if ya can answer them or have fun not answerin em.

What are the first responders responsibilities?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 11:04 AM

Here's what P-Gator said (paraphrased) in rrgards to Katrina:

"Fortunately we lived on the 2nd floor so most of our good stuff wasn't damaged... The first floor, however, where we stored a lot of stuff was flooded out and everything is ruined, including the wallboard. It'm going down there to see what I can salvage and to collect a few things then I'm going back to New Jersey to take care of my mom..."

That's 'bout the crux of the discussion.. It's puzzeling that anyone would find any meat in that that could be used to prove any point or that anyone would promote poor ol' P-Gator to some kinda Katrina guru or see-er who is the end all authority on Bush's failures...

That conversation occued last October and I haven't had any further contact with P-Gator since...

Now, whoever wants to pour thru the contents of our discussion, which I think was rather mondane, for debating nuggets, have at it...

As fir "mainstream sh*theads", Rufe, this thread began well before "mainstream sh*theads" arrived at this story... It was done thru hard work and many hours of reading all kinds of stuff from Google search, from personal stories, to obscure articles, to less obscure articles, then to Googling stuff like National Response Plan, flood control, FEMA, DHS, etc...

This was before Michael Brown's 2nd trip to Congress for intense questioning... This was before the discussion of the organization of DHS and FEMA became common discussions... This was before the subject became vouge...

I know from the ill-informed rebuttals, if you can call them that at all, that there is no one on the Bush side of the fence who has evn scrathed the surface in familiarizing themselves with the real "facts" involving the original positions that I laid out and thus a string of persoanl attacks against me for having put in the time it takes to research an issue and make an argument...

Katrina ain't about me, Rufe... If you think it is go back an reread the original post of this thread... It's about a a series of failures within the Bush administartion... He's the CEO and the job didn't get done in accordance with his own folks National Response plan...

I guess if I were assigned your side to debate, however, seein' as there little there to defend, I might use the same tactics as many anonomous GUEST's have used... Second thought, I'd ask the debate coach if I could just take a pass and iof he or she said "no", I'd quit the debate team...

But, Rufe, and others keep them personal attacks comin'... With each and everyone of them you are just proving that you ain't got no real defenses...

BTW, we all do what we can... I donated as much money to the Red Cross as I could afford... Plus I played two benefit concerts, one in Northern Virgina and the other here in Luray...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 09:39 AM

I am gonna rename Bobert O'Bobert cause all he wants to hear is what agrees with him an he don't answer any questions hisself.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 09:26 AM

Why, Rufus, well done. Sounds like you saved some asses based on yer own good judgement.

A

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 08:42 AM

Why you doin a cover up of whut Poppagator said?

Bobert either can't or won't answer simple questions.

I guess that's wut people in the real world do. They keeps changin tha subjects.

When FEMA don't get aid to tha folks fast enuf they gets criticized. When they cut tha red tape to get aid to them faster, they gets critisized. Is it tha crooks that does tha stealin in tha real world or is it the people that let's em steal? Opps, I fogot, you is always on the side of tha killers an crooks.

Hey mr real world, no answer Bobert, for the umpteenth time, How come FEMA ain't the independant agincy they was back in the golden years of the Clintoon administration?

You ever even been to NO? I has. I done stood on the levees and looked up at the ships. Then I turned around an looked down on tha city an I wundered How long it would be befo a storm would flood it.

I heard Mr Nagin changin his mind back an forth about forcin an evacuation for two days. When I heared predictions of frigerators and small cars flyin through the air, when I heard that you had to be in a 4 story buildin to be safe from tha flood an even then the windows would blow out, when I heard that even if you survived all that you would be stranded for at least a week with no food, water or medcines, I sepent all Sunday afternoon callin folks I know to tell them to get the hell out of thar and don't plan on comin back for months at least.

Well the lines was so messed up that I had to call bout 20 times for each time I got thru and then the people on tuther end was unwillin to leave cause nobody was forcin them to leave. I kept callin gack with even worse perdictions until they finaly got out Sunday night and by then they barely got out.

Now what the hell do you know except what high frofit corporate mainstream media shitheads has fed to ya?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 08:36 AM

Great piece by Chris Rose, Woody...

Thanks for posting it... The tiny letters kinda hurt my head but it was well worth the read...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 07:25 AM

Q, you and bobert would have been the first to complain if the Feds had delayed the offering of funds. Why not comment on the greedy and crooked citizens who took advantage of something offered in good faith?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 07:13 AM

http://www.nola.com/search/index.ssf?sconfig=nola&count=20&xpath.pubdate=06%2F15%2F2006+06%2F14%2F2006+06%2F13%2F2006+06%2F12%2F2006+06%2F11%2F2006+06%2F10%2F2006+06%2F09%2F2006+06%2F08%2F2006+06%2F07%2F2006+06%2F06%2F2006+06%2F05%2F2006+06%2F04%2F2006+06%2F03%2F2006+06%2F02%2F2006&xpath.category_letter=&xpath.any=corruption&x=20&y=9


» Firm lent Jefferson at least $50,000   (Thursday, 6/15/2006, Times-Picayune)
WASHINGTON -- Rep. William Jefferson, D-New Orleans, who is at the center of a federal criminal bribery probe, received a personal loan from a satellite radio executive who has had business before the federal government, financial records released Wednesday show.

» Four N.O. housing developments will be demolished   (Thursday, 6/15/2006, Times-Picayune)
Promising a renaissance for public housing in New Orleans, federal housing officials said Wednesday that they will reopen 1,000 units by summer's end and within three years demolish four decades-old complexes, changing sections of the city's landscape by replacing the sprawling brick developments with a mix of single-family homes and apartments.

» Former political fund-raiser sentenced   (Wednesday, 6/14/2006, Times-Picayune)
Former New Orleans business executive Gilbert Jackson, once a major political fund-raiser at the local level, has been sentenced to 27 months in federal prison for income tax evasion.

» Mesmerizing madam   (Wednesday, 6/14/2006, Times-Picayune)
How does one prepare for a role like Norma Wallace, for more than four decades the French Quarter's most infamous, colorful and scandalously successful whorehouse madam?

» 2nd cop accused of armed robbery arrested, resigns   (Tuesday, 6/13/2006, Times-Picayune)
The second New Orleans police officer accused of participating in a three-man shakedown of a downtown massage parlor last week was arrested Monday, and Superintendent Warren Riley called the arrests a reflection of his department's policy to weed out corruption.

» Punishment doesn't fit the allegation   (Tuesday, 6/13/2006, Times-Picayune)
Far be it from me to take up for U.S. Rep. William Jefferson, whose embarrassing actions, caught on tape by the FBI in the course of a widespread bribery probe, have undermined his flood-ravaged district's prospects in Washington at the worst possible time.

» Ex-bail bonds executive starts sentence   (Saturday, 6/10/2006, Times-Picayune)
Former Bail Bonds Unlimited executive Norman Bowley has reported to prison for his part in corrupting then-Judge Alan Green with cash and gifts in exchange for boosting the company's profits.

» GOSPEL AND GOALS   (Friday, 6/09/2006, Times-Picayune)
Contemporary gospel star Kirk Franklin intended to spend Monday, a rare day off at home in Dallas, helping his oldest son prepare for his first semester of college.

» Jefferson on the defensive   (Friday, 6/09/2006, Times-Picayune)
U.S. Rep. William Jefferson, D-New Orleans, is ratcheting up his response as the threat of indictment looms.

» Vote may cost seat on powerful panel   (Friday, 6/09/2006, Times-Picayune)
WASHINGTON -- A House Democratic steering committee voted Thursday to recommend that embattled Rep. William Jefferson, D-New Orleans, be stripped temporarily of his seat on the powerful House Ways and Means Committee, but a vote by the full Democratic caucus was delayed after strong objections from the head of the Congressional Black Caucus.

» EDITORIAL: It's time to step in, governor   (Thursday, 6/08/2006, Times-Picayune)
Opponents of levee board consolidation didn't wait long to try to unravel reforms passed in February.

» Jefferson promises he has 'an honorable explanation'   (Wednesday, 6/07/2006, Times-Picayune)
WASHINGTON -- Rep. William Jefferson, D-New Orleans, said Tuesday that there is "an honorable explanation" for the damaging scenario being painted by the federal government in the federal bribery probe targeting him, and he again denied breaking any laws.

» Pious lectures from a House committee   (Wednesday, 6/07/2006, Times-Picayune)
Watching a legislative committee discuss ethics can put you in mind of what Dr. Johnson said when told that a woman had delivered the sermon at a Quaker meeting:"Sir, a woman's preaching is like a dog's walking on its hinder legs. It is not done well; but you are surprised to find it done at all."

» Changing the system, vs. the subject   (Tuesday, 6/06/2006, Times-Picayune)
Gov. Kathleen Blanco sat down Monday before the House Ways and Means Committee, to plead once again that New Orleans residents be allowed to vote on whether to merge the city's seven assessors into a single office.

» For juries, seeing deed on tape often is believing   (Saturday, 6/03/2006, Times-Picayune)
WASHINGTON -- The kind of videotaped evidence confronting U.S. Rep. William Jefferson, D-New Orleans, is often more persuasive to jurors than even eyewitness testimony but doesn't always produce a slam-dunk case for prosecutors, lawyers Thomas Puccio and Michael Tigar said.

» Uncle's larceny at RTA surprises Morial   (Saturday, 6/03/2006, Times-Picayune)
Marc Morial broke his silence this week on the federal corruption probes into his eight-year mayoral administration, stating that he had no inkling that his uncle, Glenn Haydel, had stolen money from the Regional Transit Authority.

» Judge backs Jefferson affidavit ruling   (Friday, 6/02/2006, Times-Picayune)
WASHINGTON -- A federal judge in Maryland on Thursday affirmed an earlier ruling authorizing the release of an FBI affidavit used to justify a search of the U.S. residence of the vice president of Nigeria and his wife on the same day that Rep. William Jefferson's homes were searched by FBI agent.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 06:56 AM


http://www.nola.com/rose/t-p/index.ssf?/rose/katrina/do_the_right_thing.html
Do The Right Thing

Open your hearts and your neighborhoods to those in need
Friday, December 30, 2005
By Chris Rose

I don't mean to pick on old Cyril Neville in every column, but it's just so darn easy.

Lately, the Bitter Neville Brother From Austin Who Besmirches Our Name has taken to wearing a T-shirt when he performs that says "Ethnic Cleansing in New Orleans."

And that's the truth. I, for one, am glad that we finally got rid of all those pesky white people in Old Metairie, Lakeview, Gentilly, Chalmette, Arabi and Plaquemines Parish.

They were beginning to bug me, what with their strange diets and music and taste in automobiles. Ugh! What's with this Prius thing, anyway? You call that a car?

Cyril has turned into one of those lamentable figures, the demagogues and rabble-rousers and so-called Christian Soldiers who use a disaster such as this to further their own bizarre and deconstructive personal causes and agendas, whether they be racial discord, homophobia or just the embarrassing need for attention. (See: Jackson, Jesse.)

Like Spike Lee, the acclaimed director who seems determined to displace Oliver Stone as America's chief conspiracy-minded filmmaker, who paraded around New Orleans a few weeks ago proclaiming that it was highly plausible that the levees were bombed to run all the black people out of town.

Well, I guess no one checked in with Houston and Baton Rouge when this plan was hatched.

The only real evidence to support this theory is that, if there was such a plan, it was mangled so badly that it wouldn't be hard to believe that the government was, indeed, involved.

If the plan was to run all the black folks out of town but all the stockbrokers in Lakeview got taken out in the deal, then it's not a stretch to think that FEMA's fingerprints are all over the thing.

The race issue is going to haunt our rebuilding process for years; that is a lamentable given.

And it begins with trying to fathom how 49 states just opened their doors, their communities and their hearts to our evacuees but now that we are trying to piece things back together here, AT HOME, we do not offer the same hospitality to our own.

The shame of this is unspeakable, the FEMA trailer thing and its concomitant cry of Not In My Neighborhood.

There is good reason to dread the great inconvenience that trailer parks bring, but here's the Big Picture on that: Inconvenience is going to be our way of life around here for an appreciable period of time.

We can bear it together or apart. We can open our neighborhoods to those who have suffered more than us, or we can wait for the whole damn thing to explode in our faces.

Here's a novel idea: You could introduce yourself to the trailer people. Wouldn't it be strange to discover you have the same interests in gardening or sports or music?

There is this daunting notion sweeping our community that some of these trailer parks will harbor -- horrors! -- POOR PEOPLE!

Well, yes -- and many of them were poor before Katrina and now they have nothing at all except a gleaming white trailer crammed up against a bunch of other gleaming white trailers and as experiments in social interaction go, we're up against tough odds and praying for a miracle of harmony.

Here's the thing about poor people: Most of them are honest. Many of them will become writers and artists and musicians and teachers and cops. Many will serve in the National Guard units that saved our wet and desperate behinds this fall when the bottom fell out.

And some poor people will even become rich. It's weird how that works.

And, truth is, they're less likely than Entergy or your insurance company to try and rip you off.

It is incumbent upon those of us who "have" to help those who "had"; help them (us) rebuild their (our) lives here in their (our) home. That the regular citizenry would block this is unwise, uncharitable and, more than anything else -- it is not the Louisiana way.

Let's go with the words of Spike Lee -- the title of a great movie he made a long time ago -- before he became a whack job and started claiming the Oscars were fixed because he didn't have one.

It was called "Do The Right Thing."

Simple advice. Somebody. Please.

. . . . . . .

Columnist Chris Rose can be reached at [e-mail], [phone] or [phone].

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 15 Jun 06 - 12:11 AM

Bobert points out something every citizen should know- a major problem for all our cities in the U. S. of A. and Canada is the lack of money for basics, as tax money goes for frills like wars and pork barrels. New Orleans and most major cities have no reserve funds but live from hand to mouth, always at least one tax year behind needs. There is nothing for keeping up infrastructure. (Engineers in N. Y. live in dread of a major failure in main water lines, some of which have had no repair or maintenance in 100 years). Infrastructure is deteriorating everywhere.

(Digression to local comment). Right here in River City (Calgary, that is), the school system needs $100 million for essential repairs to schools but have been offered $4 million. Boards are faced with abandoning some schools because needed repairs were never made, and they can't get the funds, although the province is swimming in oil money. The provincial government gave a $400 gift to every citizen when as a focused expenditure, the money would have paid for a few new schools, hospitals, and their upkeep.

Back to Katrinagate- The 1.4 billion dollars thrown away by the feds on false Katrina-Rita claims, as detailed in the N. Y. Times, would have helped the N. O. and other local governments with rebuilding their school, transportation and other genuine infrastructure needs.
Katrinagate marches on!

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 10:08 PM

Yo, rufe...

We have one danged Mudcatter from NO and you want to put him on some pedistal and worship his every burp... Like what it that all about, pal???

Hey, I don't speaek for NO any more than you do and anymore that P-Gator does so what is the deal here... As far as debating points, this is a "zero" for yer side...

And rather than talk about what oviously overwhelmed local and state governemtns did lets get back to the Alaison's Young's obseravations here... Some things are too big for local governemnts to handle... Do you have any experience with local governments, budget processes, ect in these days of fewer and fwer federal dollars going back to state and local governemnts???

Yeah, just answer that one... You been in budget hearings and work sessions??? I have and guess what, pal.. It ain't too purdy...

Like after paying for the basics, local governments ain't got no extra dough for first responders... Sates don't either... The Council of zGovernors has been begging for dough from Bush but guess what... Bush writes checks like a man with no arms when it comes to much more than the DoD and their contractors...

You, my frind, are not livin' in the real world... You haven't been payin' attention to the dollar drain in state and local governments that have occured since 2000!!!

Ask any Governor, Republican or Democart... They'll tell you... Ask any mayor of a large city... Thay'll tell you...

And yopu expect these governments to have all that extra cash to do what FEMA used to do??

You are not living in the real world...

Go attend yer local city council meeting and get educated...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 09:50 PM

I axed why bone of them gound Zero folks was in tune with you. You mentioned poppagator. I axed waht he said. You ain't said what he said yet.

Now I am axin what the first responders did in the two precious days before the hurricane hit?

I am sayin they fiddlefarted around cause they was so inept an unsuitable for tha job. They could have got them people out but they didn't even tho they was told to. They set the evacuation process back so bad it was a dizaster. They could have called a military evacuation with their own national guard an they could have axed for out of state national guard to get them folks out beginin on Friday.

Did they do it? no

Now ya can hoot an holler at me about bein a bushite and point to the number of posts and claim nobody has made a intelligent response Blah Blah but you caint keep the first responders out of the list of causes for the Disaster.

If you do that you is just makin this whole thread just another nasty ass one sided, anti Bush rant

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 09:33 PM

LOL, Rufe...

Allison Young, reporter for Knight Ritter and author of an article entitled "Chertoff Delayed Federal Response, Memo Shows"... These are her words and she makes her living reseraching the stuff that neither you nor I have the time to research:

"Well, the entire response has been intersting, hearing all of the finger pointing about the lack of command and control on the ground in the hurricane zone during Katrina. In January of this year, the Department of Haomeland Security unveiled their National Response Plan. This was supposed to be a blueprint in this post-Septmeber 11 world for how we were going to deal with a massive catastrophe. While certainly terrorism was an emphasis behind this document, it very clearly says that this is to be used when you have a major catastrophic natural disaster, such as a hurricane.

What's surprising is, when you listen to the testimony yesterday by the former FEMA director, it seems to be in conflict with what the pane calls for in a catastrphe, where locals have become overwhelmed by the situation, both in terms of resources and the structure, that the federal governemnt is supposed to take a proactive- take proactive steps to protect the lives of of citizens. And it says that all the standard procedures fro requiring requests can be waived in these kinds of situations, and while federal asuthorities are supposed to notify. if they can, and coordinate with staes, it says, in the plan, that the coordination process should not delay or impede the rapid mobilization and deployment of critical federal resources...."

(Interview with Aliaon Young, Septmber 28, 2005, Pacifica Radio)

Now to Governor Blanco:

"Among the more that 100,000 pages of newly released records, which ranged from after-action reports to hand-scrawled notes written at the height of the storm, are memoes showing Blanco frustrated and angered over delays in evacuations and the slow delivery of promised federal aid.

'We need everything you've got,' Blanco is quoted in a memo as telling President Bush on August 29, the day Katrina made landfall. But despite assurances from the federal Emergency Management Agency that 500 buses were 'standing by,', Blanco's aides were compelled to to take action when the buses failed to materialize, documents show...

(There's mush more in a Washington Post story of December 4, 2005 written by Jody Warrick, Spencer S. Hsu and Anne Hull entitled "Blanco Releases Katrina Records")

Hmmmmmmm, Rufe???

These are some purdy danged good journalist who make their liovings doing the hard research... Hey, if you want to jusy go and call them liars, hey, it's a fee country but...

...seems like the ball is in your court...

Ahhhh, as fir P-Gator... What yer fascination with the poor guy??? Like does he, as one home owner, represent the heartbeat of NO??? I just don't understand yer logic in constantly bring him up as if he were the second coming... Maybe, while yer mulling over what I have written here you will elaborate on his importance in Bush's response to Katrina??? Por favor...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 09:09 PM

An heres another one you can claim you can dance around an claim you has answered:

Who decides when the locals (first responder) has done been overwhelmed?

I guess it jus don't matter of they piss away two days goin back and forth on whether it is a forced evacuation or not. It only matters when the second responders cain't help right away cause the first responders screwed up so bad.

Yeah, them second responders are the bad guys. You cain't blame anythin on the first responders cause they is so stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 08:50 PM

Q, it has nothing to do with the ineptness of GWB and others.
The fraud is due to the absolute cheating and greedy mentality of a lot of Americans. You have seen nothing yet and when you do, give credit where credit is due - a segment of America that thinks greed and cheating is the American way. GWB and the Feds were trying to help. They put too much trust in a large segment of the welfare population.

And when other fraud comes to the surface, you will find that it will represent another segment, the something for nothing group and not a part of the welfare community, who are screwing the American taxpayer more than the welfare people could ever dream of!

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 08:43 PM

Now in this here thread the fust mention of who is in charge of evacuations I sees posted by Guest A:

"In every aspect of it, the stipulation is that the first responders, read local and state government here, are responsible for the for the first evacuation and rescue attempts. Don't you think it might be a little late for someone to respond from a 1000 miles away.
If you find this to not be to your liking, then please quote us the section and paragraph from the National Response plan that dictates otherwise. It could be there but my copy doesn't reflect it."

Didja answer that one? Nope you jus take to callin people stupid and callin them name like this:

"This is the point I've made over abnd over but these knothead Bushites jsut want to say stuff like "life is good" and leave it at that...;

Sure, life is good... I have provided GUEST A a source to find out just how good my life is but yet, when I point out the4 dfriggin' truth to either GUEST A or Old Guy, all I get is "Life is good and yer wro9ng, Bobert" crap throwed back at me...

Weell, it's like arguin' with a couple friggin' retards, as far as I can see it... The two of them don't have 'nuff I.Q. points to take on a box of animal crackers...

They say the same dumbass stuff over and over and over like it's true????

Freud would have a field day with these two..."

Scuse me mr right reverand Bobert but you aint answered the question yit and it is because you caint without blowin away yore assertion that Bush is tha problem with everthin.

Now here is another shinin example of how you don't answer:
You said "I've also heard from P-Gator who has been back to his house in N. O. and the stories are very similar"

I axed you about what Poppagator had to say and you gets all puffed up and said:
"I've also answered the P-Gator question **** to the best of my knowledge****... BTW, what does P-Gator have to do with this.... He doesn't work for Bush or FEMA... Last I heard from him he was spilttin' his time takin' care of his elderly mom in New Jersey and working on his house in NO but... no matter waht he's doing, expalin why this matters, will ya???"

The reason it matters is like I done said sevral times befo in this thread, but maybe you aint even readin you own thread, is if GWB is the sole reason fo these here problems surely the actul residence of ground zero would be up in arms even wus than you but they ain't and I am a wunderin why.

Now how bout stead of wasting so much disk space with your puffery, name callin an evasive tackticks you just anser the danged questions? Bye tha way you is up to 506 now. Maybe now ya can get on O'rielly and you and him can try avoidin his questions on National TV.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 07:55 PM

Amos, I thought Poppagator left before Katrina hit and did not return for weeks. What were his "misadventures"?

And just one more time, in every case, the State and Local governments are resposible for the evacuation prior to the storm.
Giving a mandatory evacuation order on Sunday as did the Mayor was a bit late.

But I am not going to try to convince bobert of this, he and his moldy stash box will do as they please. That is okay, I just consider the source. And yea, I have read "The Plan".

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 07:41 PM

Well, rufus, you keep asking question that I have ****fully**** answered... You can't just jump in the middle of threads and expect to sound intellegent... I've answer the "evacuation" question at least a half a dozen times... I'm not going to support yer laziness in not takin' the time to bring yerself up tyo date on this thread... Now, tell ya what, after you have found my answer, let me know what I said to prove you actually spent the time to bring yerself up to date...

I've also answered the P-Gator question **** to the best of my knowledge****... BTW, what does P-Gator have to do with this.... He doesn't work for Bush or FEMA... Last I heard from him he was spilttin' his time takin' care of his elderly mom in New Jersey and working on his house in NO but...

... no matter waht he's doing, expalin why this matters, will ya???

Seems that you are terribly locked in obn stuff that don't mean nuthin' to nuthin' to Bush's failures which have been highlighted by Katrina as the protector of the American people...

Now, hows 'bout finding the "evacuation" asnwer and prove to me that you found it and maybe we can talk about the position I have laid out in regards to "evacuation"... No hints either...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 02:32 PM

Hey, did you get your share of the $1.4 billion given out so far on fraudulent Katrina-Rita claims?

The feds are talking about some 7000 prosecutions for fraud, but most claims probably never will be investigated, chances are good to get a chunk of taxpayer money.

The Bush-Chummy-Rummie-etc. administration wins by a landslide as the most inept in USA history.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 02:11 PM

Rufus:

The original post that began this thread addresses mpst of your flaming rhetoric. Poppagator's remarks on the Katrina incident were mostly limited to his personal misadventures, as I recall. You could PM him if you took out a handle here.


A

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 12:54 PM

Let me ax them ignored questions one at a time Bobert.

What do Poppagator say bout Katrinagate?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 10:20 AM

Oh yes, bobert, the point is had you been down there you might not be clueless as to what really happened.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 10:02 AM

Amos, probably true but there are other frauds and abuses going on to save us all!

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 09:58 AM

You iz right as rain Amos but who need NPR? I listens to Cspan.

Id like to add that the money was stold by crooked people not FEMA and if FEMA was left alone an independint this might not have happened.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 09:52 AM

A recent article indicates fraud and abuse of Katrina funds up to 1.2 billion dollars. More than enough to save NPR!


A

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 09:34 AM

I am still waiting for a honest anser to things like who is responsible for evacuations etc. Ya jest keep skipin over em and keep repeatin "still waiting for one" an then your number gets higher so you think that makes you all high an mitey.

Anser this if you kin. How many times has you been told that ya ain't gonna get any defense of yore hated enemy GWB??

All yore gonna get is people tryin to say that it warnt all hiz fault.

Yore stink bomb didn't work jest like yore uranium stink bomb and your new Washinton Memorial troll ain't workin.

Is you a musician or a stand up comic?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 07:44 AM

Ummmmmmmmm, would someone explain to me how if I had been in NO or Bolixa would change the arguments that I laid down in the first poat of this thread???

Or how me being there or not relieves Bush of the F he and his boys have gotten for his handling of the Katrina???

Seems a couple folks here continue to think that attackin' me will somehow make Bush's failures okay... Well, if that is so then why isn't Tim Russert callin' to have me on his show??? Duhhhhhh...

Bobert

(still waiting for one danged even semi-intellegent rebuttal to charges I made 490 some posts ago...)

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 07:39 AM

Oops - "fear driven behavior"? Amos, you can do better than that. I am a secure individual who, while not intentionally causing it, can really get amused at a "bobert" who, when confronted with plain fact, can only resort to name calling. Rufus has him figured out.

"Anonymity"? I have no idea what an Amos, a bobert or even a Rufus is and what matter is that? I will never meet these people, I do try to treat them with the respect deserved (key word "deserved") and see no reason to get one's Boxers in a wad while engaging in a forum such as this one. Not a reflection on 'Mudcat', it is just one of thousands, I am sure.

And Amos, bobert apparently says a lot for effect. I can not tell if he is a Bullshitter, plays Devils Advocate (that is a cowardly way) or is simply ill informed. I mean no disrepect to him by those comments. Neither do I intend this to be an apology. He apparently does his best to bluff on occasion and to badger on others. I doubt very much that he would admit to an erroneous statement when directly confronted, rather, go with "coward, crybaby, creep",   
ad infitum. And, there is nothing to be ashamed of, why don't some here go with "if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the Kitchen?"

With that said, 'bobert, those toes must still be smarting, eh?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 07:20 AM

A "safe curtain of anonoymity"?????

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jun 06 - 12:06 AM

Bobert is correct in characterizing "Guest"'s posts as cowardly. It is typical fear-driven behaviour to make unkind remarks from behind a safe curtain of anonymity. "Guest" should be ashamed.

Rufus: If you don't care for Bush, or for his policies, come out and say so. If you do, come out and say that. Be straight, be brave, and speak your own truth plainly. That's all Bobert does, except when certain pizen-mongers get under his skin.

All this rhetorical flaming around doesn;t do either side much good, I guess.


A

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 11:03 PM

When one cain't give an answer with out incriminatin hisself he has to get all threatinin' like and callin people cowards. Is that how you gets things done in yore home town?

I ain't never said I liked Bush. You autiomatically accuze everybody that dissagrees with you of bein a Bushite. It ain't so but it makes you feel holy or somethin as if it proves you is right.

When ever Bush's approval ratin' goes down you celebrates an gloats over it. Whenever it goes up you say So What? Ifn we nabbed Bin Laudin tomorry you would say So What? Now don't hurt him or any thin. Give him a lawyer and don't execute him no matter what he done.

Would you call him a activist?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 10:33 PM

bobert, did I step on some toes? I never said I have done Jack - you are the one always trying to convince others how wonderful you are.

I simply said I d can't remember meeting you in Biloxi, NO and a couple other places. Where were you, by the way?

Oh yea, the name calling is classic, sorta' like the 3rd grade.

Again, a couple more laughs from the great one. And how do you know that I "havn't done jack"? Man, those toes must really sting!

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 10:23 PM

GUEST,

You, sir (or mam), are a jerk...

Why not step out from behind yer little cowardly ambush nest and tell us what you've done in yer life..

You won't becuase you ain't done jack...

Have a nice little cowardly life...

Coward, washrag, crybaby, creep...

Bye

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 10:19 PM

Still tryin' ta backpedal on the stink bomb fun eh? I sorta take folks at their word and call em as I sees 'em.

When you talked to Poppagator what was his idys on "Katrinagate"?

Now who wanted FEMA un organised? Who wanted to mess with somethin that wasn't broke? Dontch think that had a part in Katrinagate? What do fust responder an secon responder meas?

Still sportin' a pony tail? Is life good like you said?

An one las thing, Who's responsible for evacuatin' folks and who decides an declares when they responsible ones is overwhlemed?

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 10:15 PM

bobert, I can see where you is a wonderful human bean, coming from a long line of family activists (60's) I wonder why we did not run into you you in Biloxi , New Orleans or a couple other places since 9-02? Well, maybe it was because you were home smokin' some cheap shit and telling lies about the situation and lies about how great you are.

If you think you are foolin' everyone, well...........you are not.

You are worth a couple chuckles now and then.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 10:07 PM

So, what's yer point, Woody???

I don't think there is any argument on either side of the isle that FEMA used to do a better job when it had: 1.) authority, 2.) staffing and 3.) resources...

The Republican conrtolled Seanate has said as much in recommending that FEMA (renamed or not) be given a larger role in the DHS... Larger role in bureaucracies = more money... You can't have a larger role if you are working witha bare-bones staff and few resources...

As for the quotes, other than the usual typos, I'll stand behind them both...

Apparently like is good for you, Woody, and that's just peachy... Makes me all warm and fuzzy knowin' that you are one of the 31% who is doing well under Bush...

And yeah, I think it is obvious, especially in 20/20 hindsight that FEMA would have been in a better postion after Katrina if Michale Brown didn't have to wait for the order to act...

Maybe, you are one of the few folks left on the planet that is so utterly in-love with Bush that thinks that he should make every danged decision, to corral all the powers and to be almighty in the running of every nut-'n-bolt of the government??? Hmmmmmmm??? The guy has taken more time away from the job than any president in history and, if I read you correctly, you want Bush to be the only guy who can get folks to act in the event of a catastrophy???

Is that yer position, Woody???

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Woody
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 09:45 PM

Now can you give is a little history lesson on how FEMA got to be part of DHS? How did FEMA score before DHS gate? (ignored by Bobert)

Bushites jsut want to say stuff like "life is good" and leave it at that( "life is good" is a former Bobert quote)

"roll the clock back where as head of FEMA I could act without having been so-ordered by the Secretary of GHomaland Security who is aewaitin' his marching orders from the president" (another Bobert quote)

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 09:35 PM

First of all, the only Catter who I know who lived in New Orleans when Katrina hit is Pappa Gator... Not too sure where P-Gator is now but he did stop at my house fir dinner on the way down to work on his house... That was back a few months ago...

Other than him, I don't think there's any Catters from New Orleans...

As fir FEMA's position as an quasi-independent agency like it used to, I'm all for that... But that doesn't change the fact the, cabinet position ot not, FEMA was stripped of staff and funding by Bush at the very same time that Bush was boasting of having the American people protected??? And ther Republican controled Senate has called for FEMA to be renamed (who cares) but also given greater resources... Bush opposes moving FEMA out from under DHS... So what you, Rufe, have suggested (or I think you suggested it..) is something that Bush is against...

But I agree and have stated in this thread that FEMA needs to reoraginized and ***funded*** like it was back in the Clinton years... I feel quite strongly about this since I do own one commercial property that is in a flood plane and pay flood insurance to FEMA... As do hundreds of thousands of other folks... That money comes out of my pocket and goes to supposedly protect my investment against flood damage... Maybe you aren't award of this little fact, Rufe???

As for the stink-bomb comment, you still haven't figured out that I will have fun with people when it's time to have fun but when it comes down to discussing policies, I can be dead serious...

You might find it intersting that I was one of the orgainizers of a Main Street program in Leesburg, Va. when I owned a business there and was also the promotions comitee chairman that involved me havin' to deal with all kinds of folks in order to get things done...

This hardly squares with yer generalization of me as some half crazed pot head... Might of fact, I come from a family of community activists and have been involved with volunteer organizations going back into the early 60's...

Hardly matches yer generalization...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: GUEST,Rufus
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 08:25 PM

Let me conjure up a paralel to Bobert's lame brain argumint.

If Bobert declared Fired chicken makes people fat I would not dissagree but ifn Bobert was to ingore and refuse to admit that anything else makes folks fat, that would make him wrong.

Of course Bobert would declare that anybody claimin that anythin other than fired chicken is to blame is a fired chicken defender.

He would esplain that none of the fired chicken defenders can prove he is wrong. He would point out that a large number of posts proves his point.

Well I could esplain that if'n all the fired chicken was done away wif, Folks would still get fat but Bobert wouln't answer except wit a repition of what he already said.

Truth is, this is another stink bomb that he has fun with.

Now is you, Amos, going to come out public like and say Bush is or ain't the onliest cause of the problems wif Katrina? Or is you goin to take some twisty path sayin that nobody kin prove what Bobert said is wrong?

An kin either one of youse nitwits say also what would have happened if FEMA wus allowed to stay an indpendint agincy?

An why aint folks from Nawlins weighin in here with their 2 cents and agreein wif Bobert? I done axed that serval times an it gits ingored. Just a bunch of denials and pufferfish stuff stead of an answer.

Subject: RE: BS: KatrinaGate...
From: Amos
Date: 13 Jun 06 - 07:47 PM

Hey, RUfus:

I doubt you can find one place Bobert has said any such a thing.

Bobert has a tendency to settle things based on data which he can point to. If you wanna argue with him, instead of going in like a puffer-fish, all hot air and pointy spnes, go in with some data and see what kind of response you get.

A