BS: Gary Glitter

Subject: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:11 PM

5 dollar prostitute under the age of consent - potential for statutory rape sentence to be firing squad?

Something a bit screwy here?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:13 PM

Need more info ... ?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:32 PM

Maybe it is thought that a girl under the age of consent is not mature enough to make an informed choice. In which case he took advantage of her ill informed life choice, which would be abuse and he then had sex with a child who has not developed emotionally enough to give consent?

I think firing squad is way too severe, but hey I don't live there or make their laws.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:45 PM

this isn't his first sex offense though, is it? Wasn't there something icky about child pron with him a few years back?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:46 PM

pron = PORN
sorry

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:48 PM

He was in prison in UK for sex with underage girls in UK. One being a friend of his daughters who would stay over night. These girls were very young. And he is a thoroughly nasty piece of work.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Sorcha
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:55 PM

Link?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 07:56 PM

rock n'roll eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 08:39 PM

Here's a link for those of us who have morbid curiosity:



Glitter 'had sex with girl, 12'
Gary Glitter
An arrest warrant was issued for Gary Glitter last week
Ex-glam rock star Gary Glitter has been accused of having sex with two girls, one aged 12, police in Vietnam said.
Gary's latest underage Sex scandal

That photo of him is frightening!

As for his prior offense, th article states:

"Glitter was found guilty in the UK in 1999 of possessing child pornography and served two months in jail."

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 08:46 PM

Oh my.. it get's even worse - it appears for years now he has been ping-ponging around south-east asia in search of underage sex.


Gary gets deported from Cambodia for sImilar sex stuff


Why isn't he in a rubber room somewhere? Oh wait.. he'd like that...

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Sorcha
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 08:47 PM

Sick. Hey, come chat, Dave's wife!

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 24 Nov 05 - 09:13 PM

I'm there in chat. Where are you?

And..what's up with that man's eyebrows?

Oh.. check this out - sums up the last 15 years of Gary's life succinctly:

>>> Glitter, who rose to fame as a glam rocker in the 1970s, is best known for Do You Wanna Touch and Rock and Roll (Part 2), which is still frequently played at sporting events. <<<

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 04:16 AM

Do they have Christmas decorations in Vietnam?

No but I believe they will be hanging glitter this year...

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 04:24 AM

Paul Gadd [ Garry Glitter ] is a serial paedophile, he likes it and wouldn't stop if he could, if the Viet Namese execute him this will be no great loss to humanity, personally I don't believe in capital punishment, he ought to be locked up forever in the worst possible hell hole of a prison.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 04:41 AM

warms your heart to see the spirit of brotherly love and forgiveness, at this special time of the year.

I would have machine gunned him personally throughout the 70's for his music, but I feel sorry for him for the sexual proclivities that he seems to have beeen born with and can't be tolerated because they do harm to others.

If he's going to be locked up, we should fess up and take charge, he's one of ours. Vietnam is too poor to be sorting out stuff like this for us.

What kind of society sets people like this free to scour the world for predatory pleasures. It's our fault we shouldn't have set him free. He should have been assessed by a psychlogists in prison. And only released into some sort of programme of care and protection - for us all.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: John O'L
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 04:48 AM

Apparently he's looking to go to Chile next, where the age of consent is 12.

Assuming he survives his Vietnam adventure of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 04:52 AM

How the hell was he released in the first place.

Paedophile offences are framed in terms of rape, sexual assault, indecency, making or possessing child pornography and so forth. The Macquarie Dictionary defines paedophilia as "sexual attraction in an adult towards children". The Concise Oxford Dictionary defines the word as: "sexual love directed towards children". Paedophiles come from virtually all social, income, racial, ethnic and age groups.

This man is an evil minded repulsive bastard who should never be allowed to walk this earth again.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 05:03 AM

I am against the death sentence, but if he cannot control himself he is a very real danger to innocent lives. He should be locked up for life in Vietnam (he went there of his own free will, did he not), and his estate should be sold off to pay for the costs of the incarceration - no tax payer of any country should have to shoulder the cost.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Paul Burke
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 05:06 AM

He was convicted of possession of illegal pornography, a nonce offence. AFAIK he was not convicted of any actual offenses against individual children; he would have served a much longer sentence if he ghad been. He served the sentence handed out by the court. Anything else should wait until the evidence is produced at the trial. There is no death penalty for anything in truly civilised societies.

Having said that, he seems to have gone out of his way to make it easy for people to jump to conclusions, following the established and well documented paedo trail to SE Asia.

He's also not the brightest button on the card: his conviction in the UK happened because he went into a computer shop, saying "Mend my computer, but don't look at anything on the hard drive..."

I suspect he will end up in prison for a very long time.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 05:08 AM

I agree, we should wait until the evidence is produced. Then he should be locked up.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Harmony Angel
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 06:38 AM

I don't believe in the death penalty but in cases like this, I have no objection what-so-ever to those proved guilty being surgically castrated.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,Max
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 07:25 AM

Like many who grew up in the 1970's Gary was a big part of our lives. We all loved his music and a great show man. Sad it's come to this. We are near afraid to play his music now ! Yes what he's done is wrong, these countries need to do something about their under age sex problem. It's a honey pot for the weak.I know Gary also comitted crimes in this country which again I know was wrong, but it's no sicker than these creeps in guy clubs with a leather strap pulled up their ass hugging another man. And every night you turn on the television one of these bastards is presenting a programme. Frankly I see Gary as ill. These creeps I see as sick and forced down all our throats daily.Spread of Aids down to them, which no one can say is untrue.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 07:40 AM

Guest Max
What gays do to each other is their problem as long as they do it to consenting adults.
What Gary Glitter has done is totally unacceptable. You may think he is ill and as long as people like you are around, then bastards like him get away with it.
Lock him up, hang him, shoot him, shoot his bollocks off - I care not, providing he can no longer do it again.

I have no problem playing his songs, but thinking he is around to do what he has been doing makes me disgusted.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 07:45 AM

Agree, Villan - GUEST-Not-Max simply found an opportunity to vent some irrelevant spleen.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Jeri
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 08:21 AM

If GUEST,Max wasn't trying to be ironic, it's even more ironic.

This stuff happens in third world countries - always has/always will. It happens anywhere poverty exists. You can punish people you catch taking advantage, but as long as people are desparate for money, they're going to be selling whatever people will buy.

I associate Glitter with THAT song. The one that someone combined with the Dr Who theme so they're now stuck together in my head. If he did anything else (besides get arrested), I don't know about it. How many guys go to places like Cambodia for a 'sex holiday'? Glitter's just a famous one who got caught. And no, I don't have an answer. It's just that where there's one former rock star with a recognizable name, there are probably hundereds of family members and guys-you-work-with who get away with this sort of thing on a regular basis.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 08:37 AM

I don't really think it matters who it is. Get rid of them all.
There is no excuse for what they do.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 09:04 AM

Why didn't he just pop over to Spain? The age of consent there used to be 12, but I think it's 13 now.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Paul Burke
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 10:00 AM

That's an important point Ted. The age of consent is a legal matter, and a social matter, not moral. The age at which people become sexually active (marry in thge old days) has varied vastly over years and cultures. Typically the lower end about 12, the upper about 18. The matter of morals is in the abuse of people who can't consent because they are too immature - whatever age they are.

Furthermore, sexual abuse is not the only way adults abuse children. Advertising aimed at children, not caring if their diet is screwed up, that they start smoking or drinking, or trying to get them to apply pressure to each other and to their parents to comply with the latest marketing craze, are all abuse too.

And as for those who stuff kids' minds with racism, I don't think there's a pit deep enough for them.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,Max
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 01:42 PM

A few very touchy here about Aids spreaders. I wonder why ?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 01:51 PM

Max hate to burst your homophobic bubble but heterosexuals are the group that sees the highest incidence of aids.

As for gary glitter, he went to Vietnam for the opportunity he knew would arise, why on earth should he be deported back to UK for imprisonment, it was hardly a deterrent last time was it? Let him rot somewhere filthy.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 01:55 PM

There is plenty of evidence that people who are abused in childhood develop serious problems in later life - maybe some of them are condemned to a 'living death'. Children need to be nurtured and educated - not violated. Gary Glitter deserves everything that is coming to him - try as I might, I can't work up any sympathy for him.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,David Hannam
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 02:25 PM

Why would you even try to work up sympathy for him?

I believe that the law should protect children with every possible means.

The death penalty for offenders proven via DNA evidence should be simply be punished by capital punishment. All recent polls have indicated the British public share this sentiment.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,Hannam
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 02:26 PM

minus the first 'b'

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 04:34 PM

the death penalty is a sign of uncivillised society

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 05:17 PM

So you're an authority on DNA, David Hannam? Even if you, few jurors are likely to be. So they have to rely on what they're told by other poeple. Other people, including specialist witnesses, are sometimes mistaken or deceitful, or didn't you know?

weelittledrummer has it exactly right in my view.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: greg stephens
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 05:52 PM

A lot of people here are always ready to cast the first stone. We could always wait and see the evidence.
   Funny how Oscar Wilde was soon rehabilitated, but recent perpetrators of the same offence(underage sex) seem to get pilloried even worse. These people of course need controlling, but the hanging/shooting/cut off their bollocks brigade I find a lot more disturbing than a few perverts.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,David Hannam
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 06:09 PM

Even if you, few jurors are likely to be. So they have to rely on what they're told by other poeple. Other people, including specialist witnesses, are sometimes mistaken or deceitful, or didn't you know?

Yes, mistakes are made due to the factors you mention above, which is why i said capital punishment should only be implemented when it is proven via DNA evidence. Restoration of capital punishment for paedophiles, terrorists and murderers should be an option for judges in cases where their guilt is proven beyond dispute, as by DNA evidence or being caught red-handed.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,David Hannam
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 06:13 PM

but the hanging/shooting/cut off their bollocks brigade I find a lot more disturbing than a few perverts.

The problem is that we are not talking about a 'few perverts' as though you imply 'few' equals harmless? We are talking a mass epidemic of paedophilia in the UK.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST,Ooh-Aah2
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 06:21 PM

A lot of people have a perfect right to throw the first stone, Greg Stephens, because they do not live in a glass house as far as this issue is concerned - ie, they do not dream of destroying the lives of innocent children by interfering with them sexually. I'm with El Greko, let him spend the rest of his life with the cockroaches in a Vietnamese prison, if fairly found guilty.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Nov 05 - 07:45 PM

Greg Stephens
Have you got any daughters. If so would you like these perverts to sexually abuse them.

Maybe you haven't got any children, which would make me understand why you make such comments.

Young children need to be protected from all scumbags who want to abuse them. Even one scumbag is too many.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 01:35 AM

Oscar Wilde?

I don't believe he was convicted of having sex with children. He as convicted of being a homosexual, yes? Was that blue blood boyfriend of his under the age of consent?

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: dianavan
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 02:04 AM

I've seen the damage done to children (male and female) and know that many will become abusive adults in later life. Because I know this, I also know that paedophils have probably also been abused as young children. My sympathy stops there.

There must be a way to break this cycle of victimization. Perhaps the only way to stop this cycle is through imprisonment. I thought of house arrest but that would only work if computers and videos were also banned. At any rate, the movement of these criminals must be watched very closely so that they will not harm any more children.

Unfortunately, I think it is a worlwide problem and until we tackle the problem of human trafficing, paedophilia is going to thrive.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 02:39 AM

Was Oscar Wilde rehabilitated? I thought he died in disgrace, and shunned by his former friends and admirers, in Paris.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 05:17 AM

Sadly, a large majority of the young females in Vietnam see prostitution as a "job" and willingly go into it for the few dollars which give them a better standard of life....which in some way negates the "abused child" factor in many cases. However, I believe that GG lives there for a reason! He has taken advantage of a situation and found himself at the precipice of life by his own choice. I still go with the belief we have in the UK that a person is innocent until proven guilty but that for all of us is as good as it gets....unfortunately, the guilty have been found 'innocent' by courts as have the innocent been found guilty. I await the results of GG's case with anticipation...hoping that whatever the truth is will out and justice will be done either way. Again, 'sadly' as I have said justice is not always done...either way.
Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 08:38 AM

First, two points for David Hannam.

1) How is your second post about DNA supposed to address my point that jurors will never know whether DNA has proved a case? They (judges too) must rely on expert witnesses to interpret the scinetific evidence. There have been cases in the UK of such witnesses lying on oath or making grossly misleading claims about the probabilities associated with DNA science. A whole series of convictions in the west Midlands were quashed when it emerged that a senior police officer had persistently lied about forensic evidence. If any of those who had been convicted had also been hanged, what redress then? (And what "recent polls" do you have in mind when you talk about the popular attitude to capital punishment?)

2) No need to get hysterical David. We are NOT living in an epidemic of paedophilia. Trends are hard to monitor because reporting levels were historically low. But if there has been any significant increase in individual cases coming to public notice (and I'm not sure that this is so) then it will largely be because paedophiles have been driven off some of their traditional hunting grounds - the churches, scouting and to some extent teaching, etc.

It seems extraordinary, given the mood nowadays, that in the 1970s paedophilia was, in some degree, recognised as a clinical condition like psychopathy, and serious work was directed towards seeing whether people could be "cured". In those days, paedophiles were sometimes quite open about their proclivities and even had their own association. In fact their press officer was a member of the NUJ who worked for the Open University in his day job.

Just to underscore Greg's point that attitudes change, it's worth noting that each of the 25 counts against Oscar Wilde stated that the alleged behaviour (always in private, and always between consenting adults) offended "against the peace of our said Lady the Queen, her Crown, and dignity." Incidentally, Dave's Wife may wish to note that "Bosie" (Alfred Lord Douglas) was never mentioned at all in the indictment. The individuals cited were prostitutes.

Like weelittledrummer I am sure that nobody who finds sexual gratification in a pre-adolescent child does so out of mere wilfulness, and that whatever makes them so disposed is something over which they have no control. Partly for that reason I find the lust for vengeance expressed by people like the Villan sickening and depressing. (And yes, I do have a daughter, Villan. So what? If she fell victim to a paedophile, that would be a tragedy for two families.)

The sociologist Stanley Cohen wrote: "Societies appear to be subject, every now and then, to periods of moral panic. A condition, episode, person or group of persons emerges to become defined as a threat to societal values and interests; its nature is presented in a stylised and stereotypical fashion by the mass media. Sometimes the panic passes over and is forgotten; at other times it has more serious and long-lasting repercussions and might produce changes in legal and social policy or even in the way the society conceives itself."

That was in 1972 and all that's changed is that the media is even more reckless and irresponsible now than it was then.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Tam the man
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 08:50 AM

Gary Glitter he's great at children's parties, all round children's entertanter

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 09:08 AM

We are NOT living in an epidemic of paedophilia

oh really. get ur facts right!

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: greg stephens
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 09:49 AM

Oscar Wilde has indeed been rehabilitated, though after his death. Admiring him is perfectly respecatble, as is admiring Henry V and other paedophiles. Wilde was accused of plenty of sex with underage boys(though the technical charges brought may have been only with adults, I am not sure.). The English have always popped abroad for what was made illegal at home, and Joe Orton(to name one notorious example) is a regularly performed and not-particularly-vilified plawright, though a read of his immensely entertaining diaries reveals in total detail exactly what he got up to in Morocco.
   I am not saying these activities should be ignored, merely that they should be not be got out of proportion.
And yes, I have got children. And no, of course I woudnt have wanted them to have underage sex with Gary Glitter, or Oscae Wilde, or Joe Orton, or Jonathan King. But all those options, for example, are considerably less bad than their being murdered, or run over by a drunk driver, for example.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Mr Red
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 09:56 AM

By Gadd - the Glitter has long tarnished. Come to think of it - it was tinsel as I remember - little substance.

Subject: RE: BS: Gary Glitter
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 26 Nov 05 - 11:32 AM

Greg, I don't think Wilde was ever accused of sex with under-age children. However I don't know what the age of consent was in the UK in 1895. (I think it was raised from 12 to 13 some time during the 19th century, but I don't know if they went even further with the nanny state in that century.)