Subject: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,Alphabet Date: 29 Dec 05 - 12:33 AM I am part of the Alphabet Gang and I thought I'd start a thread to say I think it's not true that Bush lied, about anything. He has always been open and honest with the American people and he deserves our respect because he is our President. Even if he thinks it is necessary to change The Constitution, you whiners should understand that he and his advisors know what's best for all of us. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Ebbie Date: 29 Dec 05 - 03:33 AM Right-o |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: burntstump Date: 29 Dec 05 - 04:12 AM Don't look up a pig just flew over! |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 08:11 AM And maybe the Constitution really is outdated too. Oh, there goes another one! A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: DMcG Date: 29 Dec 05 - 08:19 AM You are a member of The Alphabet Gang? Are you sure Bush wants that kind of backing? (Many people here think the answer to that is 'yes', by the way!) |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 08:24 AM A few references on Bush's propensity for lying. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 08:29 AM "No terrorist state poses a greater or more immediate threat to the security of our people and the stability of the world than the regime of Saddam Hussein in Iraq." Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld (09.19.02) "This man poses a much graver threat than anybody could have possibly imagined." President Bush (09.26.02) "The Iraqi regime is a threat of unique urgency. . . . It has developed weapons of mass death" President Bush (10.02.02) "There's a grave threat in Iraq. There just is." President Bush (10.02.03) "There are many dangers in the world; the threat from Iraq stands alone because it gathers the most serious dangers of our age in one place. President Bush (10.07.02) "The Iraqi regime is a serious and growing threat to peace." President Bush (10.16.02) "There is a real threat, in my judgment, a real and dangerous threat to America in the form of Saddam Hussein." President Bush (10.28.02) "I see a significant threat to the security of the United States in Iraq." President Bush (11.01.02) "Today the world is...uniting to answer the unique and urgent threat posed by Iraq." President Bush (11.01.02) "The world is also uniting to answer the unique and urgent threat posed by Iraq whose dictator has already used weapons of mass destruction to kill thousands." President Bush (11.23.02) In January 2003, White House Communications Director Dan Bartlett, when asked "is Saddam an imminent threat to U.S. interests"; he replied "Well, of course he is." In February 2003, White House spokesman Scott McClellan said "[t]his is about [an] imminent threat." In May 2003, Ari Fleisher was asked "Didn't we go to war because we said WMD's were a direct and imminent threat to the U.S?" He responded, "Absolutely." Sources: Daily Mis-Lead 01.28.04, CAP Daily Progress Report 01.29.04 |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: freda underhill Date: 29 Dec 05 - 08:48 AM lies, damn lies & statistics |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 29 Dec 05 - 08:52 AM Amos, those same things were said by Clinton, Gore and other members during 98 and 99. Bush does appear to be stupid for repeating that stuff. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:41 AM They were not; context is everything. Gore and Clinton were not preparing a unilateral invasion. Doh. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Donuel Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:47 AM http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/bushlieworked2.jpg http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/bushrepcon5.jpg etc. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Once Famous Date: 29 Dec 05 - 11:13 AM Boldly spoken, Guest Alphabet. You have the socialists here pegged, and realize there are others, some vocal, some not, who agree with you here on what you have said. There are some sick people here who do nothing EVERYDAY but undermine what this country does. It's one thing to criticize, but because they have no life, they rant about it here EVERYDAY with their obsessive compulsive rants that solve nothing. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 29 Dec 05 - 11:16 AM I agree! Context is everything. Some other quotes; "To strike military and security targets in Iraq that contribute to Iraq's ability to produce, store, maintain and deliver weapons of mass destruction." "to degrade Saddam Hussein's ability to make and to use weapons of mass destruction. To diminish Saddam Hussein's ability to wage war against his neighbors." "....support eforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Husein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government government to replace that regime. I also agree the the above also sounds exactly like something GWB would say. HOWEVER, the first two statements were by WJC in December, 1998 when he authorized "Operation Desert Fox." The third is part of the Iraq National Liberation Act that Clinton signed into law in that same time period. Tha law also include $100 million for some guy named Chalabi who is refered to these days as someone GWB brought into the Picture. Just seems to be a case of who is saying these things, eh? |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: CarolC Date: 29 Dec 05 - 01:05 PM It's true that Clinton and Gore lied. And Bush lied. When Clinton and Gore lied, people died. When Bush lies, people die. When politicians lie, people frequently die. So what are we going to do about that? |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 01:44 PM The context, oh ye of little brain, is the present, and the mismanagement of the nations treasure, repute, resources and future in pursuit of cross-eyed goals aimed at scratching the rectums of the few and powerful. The issue is whether George Bush is merely a political liar, a compulsive liar, or a pathological liar. My guess is the latter. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 29 Dec 05 - 01:59 PM Amos, is your final retort always one of redicule? Has been prevalent in various threads. I just thought you would like to see the author of the "Iraq Liberation Law". Context can remain the same whether past or present. Your constant reference to the Constitution and that it should not be ignored seems to be constant proof, don't you think? Your opinion is acknowledged - your ability to ignore those things that are not of your opinion is also acknowledged. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 02:20 PM Sorry if I was a little acerbic, nameless one. I just don't see the merit in expiating Bush's lying by pointing to someone else's lying. A child couldn't get away with such meretricious rationalization, so I see no reason an allegedly grown man should. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: dianavan Date: 29 Dec 05 - 04:17 PM "...he and his advisors know what's best for all of us." He doesn't know what is best for me. I don't give anybody that much credit. If you want to sublimate yourself to his final authority, go for it but do not presume that you are 'us'. Its pretty sad when you need someone else to tell you what is best. You must have been a very obedient child. You still are. Most people are adults who think for themselves and don't need a 'daddy'. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 29 Dec 05 - 04:40 PM Amos, I am not trying to change your opinion or even try to alter it. It is not important to me. My point is that information was believed by many in this country for a number of years. Using that info to say someone was/is lying is to suggest that dislike and even hatred can cause one to act in an irrational matter. Arrogance can be amplified by ones' reluctance or even an inability to see simple fact for what it is. Sometimes that arrogance is used as a method to demonstrate superiority. If that be your premise, I feel fortunate to be at the level I am. Rationalization can be used for showing truth as well as trying to show untrue reasons for conduct. Your continuing to do the latter is very evident. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Big Al Whittle Date: 29 Dec 05 - 05:01 PM Richard the Lionheart Billy the Kid Bush the Liar......nah! It'll never catch on. You need something more catchy and memorable with a hook in it, an maybe a rhyme Bush the Tush! Bush the Lush! GWB, with an IQ of 3 no they ain't any good either, but keep trying..... |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 29 Dec 05 - 06:58 PM Excuse me, but I saw through that information from the beginning; and given his authority to question sources and get a review, you would think the LEAST he could do is come up with a more rational interpretation of shitty data than he did. Don't give me that "everyone believed it" bulllpucky; it just won't wash, and it just ain't so. Thousands of people marched out on the basis of the strong sense that the "information" was "disinformation" and Bush's great failure was refusing top tell the difference. Then, he made it worse by promoting his stupid and erroneous conclusions as facts. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Azizi Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:07 PM The American Civil Liberties Union ran this ad in the December 29, 2005 edition of The New York Times: The President Lied to the American People and Broke the Law The ad features a photograph of President Richard Nixon and current President GWB as well an example of bald face lie that each one of them told. The example for Nixon was an August 15, 1973 quote denying his involvement or knowledge about Watergate. The example for GWB was an April 20, 2004 statement about the Patriot Act in which he said that wiretaps require court orders. The ACLU ad calls for the appointment of a special prosecutor to lead a bipartisan investigation of the Bush's administration's spying on US citizens without warrants. The ACLU ad ends with this powerful statement: "It's not about promoting a political agenda. It's about preserving American democracy." |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Azizi Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:13 PM Clarification: The implication of GWB's words was that his administration would not wiretap without warrants. When Bush said that statement quoted above, he must have had his fingers and his toes crossed since prior to that time, and during that time, he had approved widespread warrentless wiretapping of US citizens. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,Alphabet Gang Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:22 PM But Bush didn't tell a lie. Neither did Nixon and neither did Clinton. Clinton did NOT have sex with Richard Nixon, and he didn't with George Bush either. I wouldn't know about Nixon and Bush. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Once Famous Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:32 PM The ACLU is a socialist organization. Anyone can pay for an ad. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Bobert Date: 29 Dec 05 - 09:34 PM Yeah, A, maybe you would like to go back thru some of the old threads... You know like the ones during the mad-dash-to-war days... I think you would find them, while not enlightening, at least "Exhibit A" that al ot of us were calling the lies as they were coming from Bush's lips... This ain't no 20/20 hindsight game we got going here but a lot of folks who have been callin' Bush on his lies going back years... There was a lot of "information" during the mad-dash-to-war that Amos, myslef and others were bringing to the table only to have the Teribus's of the world try to dilute the real facts with endless drivvle.... Yeah, TO WIT: You come in here and make accusations about stuff that you plainly have no knowledge of... (Excuse the preposition at the end of the sentence)... as if you speak from some historical perspective here... You don't... If you want to argue points, fine, argue points but please don't come in this joint and try to lecture good folks like Amos on arrogance... Arrogance is being ill-informed yet putting forth the confidence that you actually know what you are talking about... Let me ask you, A... Do you really think that this joint is filled with a bunch of light-weights that you can just roll over??? Yes___________ No____________ I mean, do a little homework here, man... Yeah, about 90% of the bad stuff that has happened in Iraq-mire was predicted during the Mad-dash-to-war by someone here who you may think doesn't know sh*t from Shinola... Well, if that's the case then what does that make yer hero and his little circle of power hungry autocrats... Bobert (no longer in NC) |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,Alphabet Date: 29 Dec 05 - 10:45 PM "The ACLU is a socialist organization." Never heard this before. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST Date: 29 Dec 05 - 10:52 PM Coming from the same brain that brought us the film Dancing with Wolves I am not surprised |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: dianavan Date: 30 Dec 05 - 01:56 AM Azizi - Do you remember me saying, "I'm sure that the ACLU will have a heyday with this even if Bush is not impeached," on the Should Bush be Impeached, thread? I don't usually say I told you so but this time I will. I told you so, I told you so. I hope they take a strip off of him. He deserves it. How dare he attempt to destroy constitutional freedoms? Lets hope the A.C.L.U. has the support it deserves. BTW - ACLU stands for the American Civil Liberties Union. It is not a Socialist organization. It is every bit an American institution. What Martin fails to understand is that once your civil liberties are eroded, America dies. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 30 Dec 05 - 07:57 AM bobert, it is all about opinions, some with bias, on both sides of the spectrum. What would lead one to believe that your statements are the fruits of wisdom? You admit to your sources being the NY Times and the Washington Post. Not exactly 'middle of the road' publications. Please tell me, why makes you think I should take your statements to heart? Dianavan, I am still waiting for someone to tell me (us) what rights are being eroded. In my case, I will say it is to the contrary. I fly monthly and KNOW the chances of my flight being hijacked are miniscule compared to 4 years ago. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: TIA Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:07 AM About those eroding rights: Guest A, please submit (PM is fine for privacy): * a list of all those to whom you sent Christmas cards * a list of all incoming and outgoing telephone calls for the last three months * a list of all of your active credit cards, current balances, and recent activity. I will not look at this data, simply archive it in case the proper authorities might someday require it. Don't worry, if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:34 AM Tia, I will gladly provide you with even more; * All Bank account numbers. * Stock holdings * Addresses of all family members * Voting record |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:39 AM A lie, a staement that a condition exists which does not exist, or vice-versa, is not really a matter of opinion. The man has consistently misled and misguided the country that allegedly elected him into a worse situation than it has been in some time. The cost overrun of the nation is on the order of 8 trillion dollars. It has become so commonplace for Bush to bullshit the public that when he even acted frank, earlier this month, by saying that the road to "victory" in Iraq is uneven and has been harder than he thought, and so on, the columnists remarked "Oh! Bush is trying candor! How clever." Years of violence, agony and waste, death and loss, all brought about by one singularly short-sighted order from W's crooked mouth. Muck about with the Constitution, muck about with the international community, muck about with large corporate interests, and go for the waste. Wodda maroon. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:39 AM Oops! * A record of all donations, political or otherwise * A list of CDs purchased by type * Rental properties and the names, ages and gender of who lives there. * Even the source of the Nazis tie rack I own. ......and your point is (was)? |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:43 AM Amos; No, I am certain he is Caucasian. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,A Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:46 AM It is now time for dining, partying, College ball watching and bringing in the New Year in a Country that is much safer than it was 5 years ago, no matter what it took. Imagine that! and we can still travel freely about. Happy New Year - see you next year. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 30 Dec 05 - 10:59 AM Same to you, A. I dunno about the much safer bit; but if you feel that way, enjoy it. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: TIA Date: 30 Dec 05 - 12:01 PM Not much personal space on you, eh? |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: GUEST,Old Guy Date: 30 Dec 05 - 12:10 PM Amos of the Alphabet Gang: Bush did not change the Consitution. You are in the vast minority: Eighty-one percent (81%) of Republicans believe the NSA should be allowed to listen in on conversations between terror suspects and people living in the United States. That view is shared by 51% of Democrats and 57% of those not affiliated with either major political party. http://www.rasmussenreports.com/2005/NSA.htm |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: CarolC Date: 30 Dec 05 - 02:14 PM About those eroding rights: Guest A, please submit (PM is fine for privacy): * a list of all those to whom you sent Christmas cards * a list of all incoming and outgoing telephone calls for the last three months * a list of all of your active credit cards, current balances, and recent activity. --TIA Tia, I will gladly provide you with even more; * All Bank account numbers. * Stock holdings * Addresses of all family members * Voting record * A record of all donations, political or otherwise * A list of CDs purchased by type * Rental properties and the names, ages and gender of who lives there. * Even the source of the Nazis tie rack I own. --Guest,A Please send this information to me also. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: DougR Date: 30 Dec 05 - 03:50 PM Gee, Azizi, why do you suppose the ACLU has been so slow in demanding that the Justice Department appoint a Special Prosicuter to investigate who leaked the NSA story to the New Yawk Times? They were quick enough to do so when the name of a CIA operative (who had not acted covertly for six years) was leaked to the press. Or perhaps you do not believe that those who leak critical national security information to the press, information that could endanger Americans, should be punished. Hmmmm? (to borrow a phrase from Bobert). Thanks goodness the Justice Department finally got off it's ass and is launching an investigation. I hope whoever did it is found out, and punished to the full limit of the law. I think he/she will be gone up river for a very long time. DougR |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: CarolC Date: 30 Dec 05 - 03:57 PM The ACLU, by definition, is concerned with preserving civil liberties. Spying on citizens of the US falls under the purview of 'civil liberties'. Did the ACLU really demand that the Justice Department appoint a special prosecutor when Valerie Plame's name was leaked as a CIA operative? |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Troll Date: 30 Dec 05 - 04:19 PM Doug, sorry to have to say this, but my ACLU expert (Skeptic) informs me that the Valerie Plame case involved civil liberties (privacy) while the NSA issue is one of national security and possibly constitutional law. The ACLU deals only with civil liberties cases. The idea that Bush lied about WMD is a little silly since most of the intelligence agencies in Europe also believed it. I'm talking about England, France, Germany, Russia, etc. But, if a lie is repeated often enough, people will believe that it's the truth. I don't like Bush, but I like people like John Kerry and Ted Kennedy even less. I will give Kerry credit for having the guts to say that he did not read the intelligence reports that the White House sent to the Congress, but he still voted to go to war right along with the rest of them. Now, some of the Dems claim that they were mislead. How the hell would they know if they didn't read the reports? Whether or not the decision to go to war was right or not, the fact is that we are there and I think that we must stay until Iraq is able to defend itself against its enemies both foreign and domestic. We upset the apple cart and it's our job to make that right. We can either stay, and tough it out, or release Saddam, pull our troops out and slink back home. troll |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Troll Date: 30 Dec 05 - 04:24 PM CarolC. I just say your post.I think it answers your question. Has anyone wondered why there has been no hue and cry about the leaking of the CIA "prisons" in eastern Europe, which certainly concern national security more than the Plame case did. Could there be politics involved? troll |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Azizi Date: 30 Dec 05 - 04:46 PM "ACLU Slams DOJ Investigation of NSA Whistleblower, Says Government Must Independently Investigate Violation of Wiretap Laws (12/30/2005) NEW YORK - The American Civil Liberties Union today sharply criticized a Justice Department investigation into the disclosure of an illegal National Security Agency domestic eavesdropping operation approved by President George W. Bush. In a letter to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales as well as two full-page advertisements in the New York Times, the ACLU has called for the appointment of a special counsel to determine whether President Bush violated federal wiretapping laws by authorizing illegal surveillance of domestic targets. The following statement can be attributed to ACLU Executive Director Anthony D. Romero: "President Bush broke the law and lied to the American people when he unilaterally authorized secret wiretaps of U.S. citizens. But rather than focus on this constitutional crisis, Attorney General Gonzales is cracking down on critics of his friend and boss. Our nation is strengthened, not weakened, by those whistleblowers who are courageous enough to speak out on violations of the law." "To avoid further charges of cronyism, Attorney General Gonzales should call off the investigation. Better yet, Mr. Gonzales ought to fulfill his own oath of office and appoint a special counsel to determine whether federal laws were violated." -snip- For the entire comment, click:ACLU Slams DOJ Investigation of NSA Whistleblower |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Amos Date: 30 Dec 05 - 05:24 PM Go play with yourself, Old Guy. You are an expert at twisting. I am sure Martin can use your skills at keeping things crooked. A |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Peace Date: 30 Dec 05 - 05:34 PM "Natinal Security Agency Rasmussen Reports. Sign up now for ElectionEdge 2006. The most comprehensive public opinion coverage ever provided for ... www.rasmussenreports.com/2005/NSA.htm" I wish the NATINAL Security Agency would spell its name correctly on the Google Address. It would make me think less about snake oil and more about the poll results. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Peace Date: 30 Dec 05 - 05:43 PM From the site Old Guy posted: "Election Polls 2008 Virginia: Warner leads Allen in Presidential Match-up Republicans: Giuliani 26% Rice 24% McCain 21% Democrats: Clinton 43% Gore 14%" Yep, those folks at that there polling place sure do pay attention to detail. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Peace Date: 30 Dec 05 - 05:52 PM We are already talking about that pussy, Bush. |
Subject: RE: BS: Bush the Liar. From: Peace Date: 30 Dec 05 - 05:59 PM LOLOLOL |