Lyr Req: Ploughboy's Dream

Subject: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Chris Amos
Date: 19 Apr 06 - 05:19 PM

Does anyone have the words to The Ploughboy's Dream collected by Dr. George Gardiner and Ralph Vaughan Williams from Daniel Wigg of Preston Candover, Hampshire, in 1909. I've done a Google and I can find the tune, masquerading as two hymns but not the traditional words.

Some friends of mine used to sing this in Essex back in the 60s.

Chris

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: DMcG
Date: 19 Apr 06 - 05:23 PM

It's in "Marrowbones", p 69. Hang on while I type it up ...

Subject: Lyr Add: PLOUGHBOY'S DREAM
From: DMcG
Date: 19 Apr 06 - 05:34 PM


THE PLOUGHBOY'S DREAM

I am a ploughboy stout and strong as ever drove a team,
And three years since as I lay abed I had a dreadful dream,
I thought I drove my master's team both Dobbin, Belle and Star,
Before a stiff and armoured plough as all my master's are.
I found the ground was baked so hard 'twas more like bricks than clay
I could not cut my furrow through, nor would my beasts obey,
The more I whipped them, slashed and swore, the less my horses tried,
Dobbin lay down, and Belle and Star ignored my threats and cries.

Till lo! above me appeared a youth he seemed to hang in air,
And all around a dazzling light which made my eyes to stare,
Give over, cruel wretch, he cried, no more thy beasts abuse
Think, if the ground was not so hard they would there work refuse?
Besides, I heard thee curse and swear, as if dumb beasts could know,
What all thy oaths and cursing meant,
It's better far than gold,
That you should know that there is one who knows thy sins full well
And what shall be thy after doom another shall thee tell.

No more he said, but light as air he vanished from my sight,
And with him went the sun's bright beams, 'twas all as dark as night,
The thunder roared fro underground, the earth appeared to gape,
Blue flames broke forth and in those flames appeared an awful shape.
I soon shall call thee mine, he cried, with a voice so clear and deep,
And quivering like an aspen leaf I woke from out my sleep.
So ponder well, you plough-boys all, this dream that I have told
And if the work goes hard with you, it's worth its weight in gold.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 19 Apr 06 - 06:55 PM

The version from Daniel Wigg was collected by Gardiner only, I believe.

RVW did collect 2 verses from a Mr. Garman (published JFS II), who had previously sung it for John Broadwood:

I am a ploughboy stout and strong as ever drove a team.
Now three years since, asleep in bed, I had a dreadful dream.
Now since the dream has done me good I put it down in rhyme,
That other boys might read and sing whenever they have time.

I dreamt I drove my master's team with Dobbin, Bald and Star,
Before a stiff and handy plough, as all my master's are.
I found the ground was baked so hard, 'twas more like bricks than clay;
I could not cut my furrow through, nor would my beasts obey.

(Info from Roud Index and Roy Palmer's Bushes and Briars - Folk Songs collected by RVW).

Mick

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 19 Apr 06 - 07:48 PM

Dr Gardiner noted only the words from Mr Wigg; the tune was taken down by one of his collaborators. At the moment I don't know which. Probably J F Guyer or Charles Gamblin; but that's one of the wee details that I'm hoping to check in the near future.

Vaughan Williams had nothing to do with it, though as Mick points out he did "collect" another example elsewhere, and indeed used that tune (as Forest Green) for O Little Town of Berthleham when he revised the English Hymnal. There's another set from tradition (Scottish this time) in vol III of the Greig-Duncan Collection.

The song was issued on broadsides, of course. Two editions of the early C19 can be seen at Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads:

The plough-boy's dream

An earlier edition of the late C18 can also be seen; the Bodleian indicates that it was written by William Mason.

The plow-boy's dream

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 19 Apr 06 - 08:43 PM

It seems that this was the Rev William Mason (1725-1797), friend of the writers Thomas Gray and Horace Walpole. The Cheap Repository Tracts (see final Bodleian link above) were initiated, and to begin with, published, by Hannah More, a major force in the Sunday School movement. They were intended as "improving" antidotes to the profane broadside and chapbook market among other things. They were inclined to be didactic and condescending, but the nastier images (the same would be true of the vile, but vastly popular, Struwelpeter) evidently made quite an impression at the time.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 20 Apr 06 - 03:22 AM

It looks as if Roy Palmer didn't know about the earlier broadside: he begins his comments on the song with: "After the hellfire sermon, the hellfire song - probably deriving from the climate of feeling produced by the religious revival of 1816...".

Mick

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Chris Amos
Date: 20 Apr 06 - 04:39 PM

Thanks for this excelent response.

Did Dr. George Gardiner and Ralph Vaughan did colaberate collecting songs from Daniel Wigg? Folk Info gives credit to thm both for God Bless the Master here

Chris

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 20 Apr 06 - 04:59 PM

Chris - According to my version of the Roud Database, both collected from Daniel Wigg, but not apparently together. 4 entries are listed as collected by Gardiner (Twas Through The Groves, The Bricklayer's Dream, The Ploughboy's Dream and When This Old Hat Was New). 6 are listed for RVW (God Bless The Master (2 entries), Nelson, Nelson's Monument and Pretty Nancy (2 entries)).

Mick

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 20 Apr 06 - 07:31 PM

Gardiner and RVW never worked together. What happened was that some tunes noted by Gardiner's collaborators (J F Guyer and, chiefly, Charles Gamblin) looked a bit odd to the editorial board of the Journal of the Folk-Song Society; so, before publishing them, they got Guyer and/or RVW to re-visit some of the singers and take down the tunes a second time. In some cases RVW worked from phonograph recordings, and it's a great shame that these don't seem to have survived.

When the songs were published, RVW's name was attached to those he had (re)noted. He wasn't the original "collector", and this was made clear in the introduction to the songs; but not everyone has read as carefully as they might have, and confusion has sometimes occurred. The "collector" credits in the original Penguin Book of English Folk Songs were as a result misleading in several places; I corrected that in the recent revision. The Roud Index simply quotes credits as given in the publication concerned.

As I understand it, Gamblin's notations -it was his which were mostly felt to be in need of double-checking- turned out to be accurate enough in the main. The singers tended to be elderly, and it's not surprising that their intonation was sometimes hard to be sure of. Gamblin's conscientious observation of this has perhaps resulted in an unfair reputation for inaccuracy.

As to the source of the song, I only spotted the earlier broadside myself yesterday, having failed (I ought to know better) to check for "plow" as well as "plough" last time I looked into it. I'm glad that Chris brought the subject up. Steve Gardham and I are working on a revised re-issue of Marrow Bones, which should be available in Spring 2007, and this is another step toward getting all the info we will need.

I might also mention that Coope, Boyes and Simpson recorded Mr Garman's set (with some textual modifications) on their recent cd Triple Echo. Well worth hearing.

Subject: Lyr Add: THE PLOUGHBOY'S DREAM
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 21 Apr 06 - 11:07 PM

Here's my transcription from the broadside image at Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads, Harding B 11(3032), London "between 1858 and 1885."

THE PLOUGHBOY'S DREAM

I am a ploughboy stout and strong, as ever drove a team,
And three years since, asleep in bed, I had a dreadful dream.

Now since that dream has done me good, I've got it put in rhyme,
That other boys may read or sing my dream when they have time.

Methought I drove my master's team with Dobbin, Ball and Star,
Before a stiff and hand plough as all my master's are.

But found the ground was baked so hard, more like brick than clay,
I could not cut my furrow through, nor would my beasts obey.

The more I whipped and lashed and swore, the less my cattle stirred,
Dobbin lay down, and Ball, and Star, they kicked and snorted hard.

When lo! above me a bright youth did seem to hang in air,
With purple wings and golden wand, as Angels painted are.

Give over, cruel wretch, he cried, nor thus thy beasts abuse,
Think, if the ground it was not hard, would they their work refuse?

Besides, I heard thee curse and swear, as if dumb beasts could know,
What all thy oaths and curses meant, or better for them go.

But though they know not, there is ONE who knows thy sins full well,
And what shall be thy after doom another shall thee tell.

No more he said, but light as air, he vanished from my sight,
And with him went the sun's bright beams, and all was dark as night.

The thunder roared fro under ground, the earth did seem to gape,
Blue flames broke forth, and in the flames, a dire gigantic shape.

Soon shall I call thee mine, it cried, with voice so dread and deep,
And quiv'ring like an aspen leaf, I wakened from my sleep.

And though I found it but a dream, it left upon my mind,
That fear of GOD, that dread of sin, which all should wish to find.

For since that hour, I never dared to use my cattle ill
And ever feared to curse or swear, and hope to do so still.

Now ponder well, ye ploughboys all, this Dream which I have told
And if it work such change in you, 'tis worth its weight in gold.

For should you think it false or true, it matters not one pin,
If you but deeds of mercy shew, and keep your souls from sin.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 04:27 PM

I should mention that I was wrong to say that none of the phonograph recordings Vaughan Williams used to check notation from singers found by George Gardiner 'seem to have survived'.

One, at any rate, (probably) does. The Vaughan Williams Memorial Library has a cylinder recording of The Banks of Green Willow which appears (from the tune and words) to be David Clements, from whom Gardiner got the words in August 1906; it was probably Charles Gamblin who originally noted the melody, but that may have been later on; Gardiner increasingly worked ahead of his musical collaborators as his collecting proceeded.

RVW re-transcribed the tune in January 1909; apparently directly from Mr Clements in the first instance, afterwards correcting the transcription from the recording, which can be heard on the English Folk Dance and Song Society cd A Century of Song.

Subject: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's Dream
From: Haruo
Date: 28 Aug 06 - 06:01 AM

There's a tune the hymnists call "Forest Green", which is said to be an arrangement by Ralph Vaughan Williams of an English folk tune "The Ploughboy's Dream".
Haruo

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's Dream
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 03:47 PM

Melody - O Little Town of Bethlehem, or Heretic Heart??

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's Dream
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jan 21 - 04:26 PM

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Ploughboy's dream From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 19 Apr 06 - 07:48 PM

Dr Gardiner noted only the words from Mr Wigg; the tune was taken down by one of his collaborators. At the moment I don't know which. Probably J F Guyer or Charles Gamblin; but that's one of the wee details that I'm hoping to check in the near future.

Vaughan Williams had nothing to do with it, though as Mick points out he did "collect" another example elsewhere, and indeed used that tune (as Forest Green) for O Little Town of Berthleham when he revised the English Hymnal. There's another set from tradition (Scottish this time) in vol III of the Greig-Duncan Collection.