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BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...

Alice 30 Apr 06 - 11:15 AM
Clinton Hammond 30 Apr 06 - 11:19 AM
Alice 30 Apr 06 - 11:39 AM
GUEST 30 Apr 06 - 11:47 AM
Bert 30 Apr 06 - 12:19 PM
Once Famous 30 Apr 06 - 12:43 PM
GUEST,AR282 30 Apr 06 - 12:49 PM
Ebbie 30 Apr 06 - 12:50 PM
Little Hawk 30 Apr 06 - 02:11 PM
Ebbie 30 Apr 06 - 02:27 PM
Little Hawk 30 Apr 06 - 02:47 PM
GUEST 30 Apr 06 - 02:54 PM
Little Hawk 30 Apr 06 - 03:15 PM
Ebbie 30 Apr 06 - 03:23 PM
Little Hawk 30 Apr 06 - 03:36 PM
Bobert 30 Apr 06 - 08:10 PM
Once Famous 30 Apr 06 - 09:01 PM
Bobert 30 Apr 06 - 09:09 PM
Bobert 30 Apr 06 - 10:34 PM
Clinton Hammond 30 Apr 06 - 11:26 PM
katlaughing 01 May 06 - 12:48 AM
paddymac 01 May 06 - 09:24 PM
number 6 01 May 06 - 09:34 PM
Donuel 02 May 06 - 10:03 AM
Little Hawk 02 May 06 - 10:15 AM
katlaughing 02 May 06 - 10:30 AM
Once Famous 02 May 06 - 10:10 PM

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Subject: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Alice
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 11:15 AM

Today's news includes clips from W Bush doing comedy side by side with Bush impersonator from Comedy Central. I immediately thought of a dream I had last week. It was a dream with Bush in it, and it was so detailed and funny I immediately had to tell my son about it when I woke up (he was in it, too).
Well, it was a long dream, so I'll just describe the main part with W. We were sitting side by side in a booth like those in a diner, with my son across the table from us. Pres W was joking around with me and flipping little pieces of beef jerky, one of them landing on the seat between us. He was playing the clown, and I finally turned to him and said, "You are a nut!".
When I saw the video clip of him today clowning around with his "clone", I immediately thought of how he acted in the dream.
How scary that so much world power is in the hands of a buffoon.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 11:19 AM

I dream about bush, only most often it's shaved


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Alice
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 11:39 AM

sigh....
I'm serious about this. Stress comes out in our dreams, and I have dreamt about the Iraq war, Katrina aftermath and other serious concerns the world is dealing with and finally this dream underlined the message that this clown in the White House is still the frat boy he has always been. Sorry, I'm just haunted by the failure of US voters to have common sense.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 11:47 AM

the possibilities aren't too bright for common sense.....if Hillary Clinton gets the Dem nomination in '08 (and she has the financial backing to swing it most likely) ... all the Repubs have to do is run a moderately conservative candidate against her ...(McCain maybe?) ...and we're looking at 4-8 more years of Republican rule.

Unless Clinton wins, of course (how likely is that?).   

Just a scenario based on pure conjecture.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Bert
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 12:19 PM

...I'm just haunted by the failure of US voters to have common sense. ...

Give us a break Alice - We didn't vote him in - It was those damned DEIBOLD MACHINES.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Once Famous
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 12:43 PM

I'm haunted by the fact that people have dreams about Bush and lead a life of pure fear.

Maybe it's not because of the choices others made, but by the choices the dreamer has made.

In other words Alice, stop worrying and get out there and do something with your life that is rewarding enough to put you at peace and you might have some better dreams.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: GUEST,AR282
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 12:49 PM

That wasn't a dream, Alice, I was in the next booth and saw the whoel thing. You really did meet our president. You're just in denial about it and who can blame you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Ebbie
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 12:50 PM

I watched the whole dinner/roast last night, Alice. Throughout, I watched the dub- I really would like to figure him out. He took the barbs and wielded clubs (subtle, it was not)without visible emotion, and frankly, without apparent understanding. I'll just bet that he later asked Laura, What did Colbert mean? He likes me. Doesn't he?

What IS the matter with him? More to the point, I guess, would be the question: What IS the matter with us? People who voted for him MUST, it would seem, be aghast at his 'accomplishments'. Howver, judging by some people I know, he still has his followers. I suspect that Colbert has it about right: Some poople admire the president for standing fast, for never changing his views. As Colbert said, "Bush NEVER changes his mind. What he thought on Monday is what he thinks on Wednesday. No matter what happened on Tuesday."

Why do some people think of that as a virtue?

The Mudcat has a few Bush supporters. They are not shy about saying so- they're just shy of giving reasons why. I would like to hear their current reasoning.

As for Diebold, if the 2006 election does not reflect the country's current disaffection and alarm then I give up. To me, it would mean that corruption is so well entrenched that there's not much to be done.

** I just realized that I have it completely backward. If the 2006 election does not reflect our country's current disaffection and alarm, it's high time to get busy. There is much to be done.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:11 PM

It isn't that there is something wrong with most Americans, Ebbie...

It is that your $y$tem is run by 2 completely phony controlled political parties who represent no one but the huge monetary players who fund them...and the same players fund both of those parties.

They provide 2 figureheads, 2 flunkies for you to choose between every 4 years. They try and find 2 that seem at least...vaguely plausible as real candidates. (hopefully) Don't be surprised when the choice you make does not end up addressing the real concerns you had when you made the choice! You have just all been suckered once again, that's all.

It takes a huge amount of money to run a presidential campaign or a congressional campaign and get elected. Where do you think that money comes from? Very little of it comes from the ordinary voters. It comes from lobbyists for the major corporations and the major banks. It comes from international drug money and international blood money. It comes from the kingpins of the military-industrial complex.

You also have a controlled media which is essentially a vast marketing and propagandizing and entertainment $y$tem meant to keep you lulled into a stupor of "normality" (conformity), and fearful enough to buy into the next war or the next demolition of your traditional social programs and civil rights.

You CANNOT have genuine elections which elect genuinely representative and responsive politicians in such a $yStem...unless a radical one slips through the cracks somehow by what would amount to a virtual full-blown miracle at this point.

That is the sorry but sad truth. Americans do not live in a democracy. They live in a controlled oligarchy. So do the citizens of virtually ever other so-called democracy nowadays, but it's worse in the USA than in many other such nations at this time.

Most of the world now watches this spectacle with the same sense of forboding with which they watched Nazi Germany in the late 30's. I kid you not. The USA is the most feared country on the face of the Earth.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Ebbie
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:27 PM

Any people, Little Hawk, who sit back submissively and allow that kind of situation have a good deal wrong with them. And like everything else, until one understands how it came about there is not much chance of changing it.

In most countries, I imagine, the most common way of addressing such a problem is revolution. Violent revolution. But that's way down the road I would think. A system has to no longer be funtional at all before the populace coalesces and begins to think in such terms.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:47 PM

That's right, Ebbie. Violent revolution doesn't generally happen in a country until that country is facing complete economic disaster...or has catastrophically lost a great war...or is suffering both of those at the same time. It doesn't happen until the system is very clearly failing to function, as you said, and the failure is so obvious that every citizen is aware of it.

Such a revolution is inconceivable in the USA right now. Most people still have lots of food to eat, they still have consumer goods to buy and cars to drive and visual entertainment to keep them distracted. They have not totally lost confidence in the viability of their social system.

The capitalist oligarchy has proven to be the cleverest form of dictatorship yet established, because it appeals to people directly through their most basic pleasure-producing appetites. That's clever. It's much more clever than doing what the Soviets did and ruling people by the iron glove of humorless authority.

It's far more clever to have a 1-party system disguised as 2 competitive parties....and keep the public busy fighting over which of those 2 parties is the better one...than it is to have an official 1-party system, as the Communists did. They too had elections, but the people could easily see that the elections were meaningless. American elections are essentially meaningless too...but they have a superficial appearance of "choice". They go through the motions, and people are fooled.

You won't have a violent revolution in tbe USA until the system collapses or is on the verge of collapse. That could only happen in the case of losing a really major war (with great destruction and loss of life on the homefront), a severe economic collapse, or the revelation of a scandal in high places so great that it completely destroyed the average American's faith in his government (such as that the administration was complicit in the planning of 911, for example...just as a theoretical example...not that I'm saying they were).

Revolutions only happen when people are completely disillusioned and desperate. It hasn't gone that far yet.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 02:54 PM

Ebbie, corruption will be entrenched regardless of what party in power. You just don't seem to accept reality.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 03:15 PM

Here's what people risk losing, in the case of violent revolution:

Their homes, their possessions, their security, their money, their lives.

That's why it never happens until people are simply desperate...until they basically feel they have nothing left to lose. That was the case in France for the poor at the time of the French revolution. It was the case in Russia in 1917 and China in the 30's and 40's.

Americans are way too comfortable right now to be ready for revolution, even if they are living in a phony "democracy" where their vote is meaningless. That's why I say, it's a very clever form of dictatorship. As long as you keep a monkey well fed and entertained inside his cage...specially if he has never known of life outside his well furnished and sizable cage...he will imagine in his mind that he is free. His freedom will be an illusion, but a comfortable one for all that. He will talk about how free he is, compared to foreign monkeys, and he will believe it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Ebbie
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 03:23 PM

Guest, this is not a time for personal attack. I'm perfectly willing to hear your reasoning.

Little Hawk, it seems to me that there is another scenario possible.

I keep picturing a nation of haves and have nots, a community of servers and those-to-be-served. As evidence of this, we have several instances now that show an acceptance of that concept, for example, in Vail or Aspen Colorado (I've forgotten which), it has become too expensive for workers to live in town so the powers have built dormitories in town where workers (servers) live during the week and who go to their homes only on their days off.

If that is not the beginning of 'third world' thinking, what is? So maybe the overturning of a society by peaceful means is kind of like putting a frog in cold water and boiling it.

Would a revolution, violent or otherwise, be likely in a case like that?


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 03:36 PM

If the erosion of people's rights and general welfare is gradual enough, Ebbie, then it is very much like the creature which is slowly killed by gradually heathing up the water. He doesn't notice the small changes, but he falls into a stupor and ends up dead.

I think what is most likely to happen is that the USA will deteriorate until it finds itself eventually left behind by other nations. This is what usually happens with great empires eventually. In fact, it always happens eventually.

The life of an empire is like any other life. It has its childhood, its adolescence, its adulthood, its prime, its middle age, old age, death and decay. Then something new is born out of the ashes.

The danger when an empire is losing its viability is that it will experience severe paroxysms such as war, economic disaster, social breakdown...and many people will suffer in the process.

The next great empire in the wings would appear to be China. And possibly, a revitalized European Union. But more likely China.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 08:10 PM

Well, I've had over a thousand dreams that involve Bush... They begin when I wake in the mornin' and last until I fall asleep and they are all nightmares...

As fir the "revolution"... Yes, it will come and there will be violence... It will start in the South when Southern Man gets mad at the rich and the rich find themselves unwelcome in the Southland... It will start with one $1M RV shot up on an interstate and then another and what will slowly occur will be a retreat of the rich to their compounds where they will live like prisioners in the McMansions...

Think Haiti here.... 2% of the folks controlling 90% of ther wealth..,

This ain't nuthin' new here, folks...

If there is anything that we can than Bush for is acceleratin' the process with his bending to those with the biggest bucks... Yeah, one can argue that all politicans do that and certainly there is something to that argument but...

...these guys have raised the bar... Congressmen don't ven write legislation anymore... Lobbiest do... Energy Policy??? Medicare Perscprtion Plan??? You name it, lobbiest wrote it...

But, hey, we have the "best democracy that money can buy" (Greg Palist)...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Once Famous
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 09:01 PM

Ebbie, it's not even a question of being a Bush supporter. It's about having a very narrow life that one needs a web forum to express that they dream about such crap.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 09:09 PM

Ebbie is a real person, Martin, with a real life that isn't dependant on the innernet... I know this becuase I know her...

Not too sure about you, however... Me thinks there might be a little Martin projecting going on here...

But if we were to compare her real life with yer's my money would be on hers when it comes to balance, values and priorties...


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 10:34 PM

...and you go back to pretending that you are a musican, Marty...


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 30 Apr 06 - 11:26 PM

*Sigh*

People that think politics matters a tinkers cuss....

How sad


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 May 06 - 12:48 AM

That's the point, CH. If everyone was as cynical and apathetic as you, politics wouldn't matter. Ebbie is right, there is a LOT of work to be done.

Bobert and LH, how about giving all of your energy spent in doomsaying to finding the positives and enhance them with your support? If the country were your child, would you expect it to improve while being told how terrible and hopeless it is? Maybe not the most apt analogy, but I am sure you understand what I mean.

kat


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: paddymac
Date: 01 May 06 - 09:24 PM

Yeah, often, but then I live alone. Oh, damn, you mean "that" Bush. Damnation. You just ruined the start of a perfectly fine dream time.


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: number 6
Date: 01 May 06 - 09:34 PM

Have I ever dreamt about Bush ... nope. I try to keep a good attitude, I eat good food and I never eat anything 3 hours before I go to bed.

sIx


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Donuel
Date: 02 May 06 - 10:03 AM

Bush having a dream

http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/aas0.gif


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 May 06 - 10:15 AM

Well, Kat, I'm not an American, I'm a Canadian. As such, I feel rather as a Dutchman or Belgian might have felt living next door to Germany in 1935. Worried. There were plenty of positives in Germany too, but they were not in command of the national agenda.

What can I say?


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 May 06 - 10:30 AM

I understand that, LH, but I also know you know the power of the spoken/written word and mind and the metaphysical effect of such. This makes your words even more powerful, imo.

There are a lot of us who have cause for concern, too, but worry does no good.

IN Peace,

kat


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Subject: RE: BS: Ever had a dream about Bush? I did...
From: Once Famous
Date: 02 May 06 - 10:10 PM

And you bobert, go back to pretending you are black.

I'm a lot more musician than you are black.


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Mudcat time: 16 June 12:49 PM EDT

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