Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafesj

Post to this Thread - Printer Friendly - Home
Page: [1] [2]


BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture

John MacKenzie 05 Jun 06 - 12:42 PM
Rapparee 05 Jun 06 - 11:35 AM
John MacKenzie 05 Jun 06 - 11:14 AM
Rapparee 05 Jun 06 - 10:51 AM
GUEST,Bible Basher 05 Jun 06 - 05:15 AM
Rapparee 04 Jun 06 - 10:21 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Jun 06 - 09:08 PM
GUEST 04 Jun 06 - 09:08 PM
Rapparee 04 Jun 06 - 08:52 PM
Rapparee 04 Jun 06 - 07:33 PM
Divis Sweeney 04 Jun 06 - 06:04 PM
beardedbruce 04 Jun 06 - 05:30 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Jun 06 - 05:26 PM
GUEST,Bible Basher. 04 Jun 06 - 04:56 PM
John MacKenzie 04 Jun 06 - 02:55 PM
GUEST 04 Jun 06 - 02:36 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Jun 06 - 02:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 04 Jun 06 - 12:57 PM
SussexCarole 04 Jun 06 - 12:23 PM
Dave the Gnome 04 Jun 06 - 12:16 PM
John MacKenzie 04 Jun 06 - 12:03 PM
Rapparee 04 Jun 06 - 11:13 AM
SussexCarole 04 Jun 06 - 10:16 AM
John MacKenzie 04 Jun 06 - 06:46 AM
Divis Sweeney 04 Jun 06 - 05:57 AM
John MacKenzie 04 Jun 06 - 05:01 AM
Rapparee 04 Jun 06 - 12:26 AM
GUEST 04 Jun 06 - 12:12 AM
Rapparee 03 Jun 06 - 10:36 PM
McGrath of Harlow 03 Jun 06 - 08:50 PM
GUEST,Bible basher 03 Jun 06 - 06:54 PM
Rapparee 03 Jun 06 - 06:23 PM
Dave the Gnome 03 Jun 06 - 06:11 PM
John MacKenzie 03 Jun 06 - 03:46 PM
dianavan 03 Jun 06 - 03:40 PM
GUEST 03 Jun 06 - 01:26 PM
Rapparee 03 Jun 06 - 11:28 AM
John MacKenzie 03 Jun 06 - 09:13 AM
ard mhacha 03 Jun 06 - 09:13 AM
Divis Sweeney 03 Jun 06 - 02:58 AM
GUEST 03 Jun 06 - 12:52 AM
Rapparee 31 May 06 - 11:00 AM
The Fooles Troupe 31 May 06 - 07:44 AM
Georgiansilver 31 May 06 - 02:53 AM
Divis Sweeney 30 May 06 - 07:40 PM
Fibula Mattock 30 May 06 - 05:06 PM
Rapparee 30 May 06 - 08:41 AM
DMcG 30 May 06 - 08:37 AM
GUEST,jOhn 30 May 06 - 07:46 AM
Strollin' Johnny 30 May 06 - 07:41 AM

Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:













Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 05 Jun 06 - 12:42 PM

Free B&B is not to be turned down lightly Rap.
G. ☻


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Jun 06 - 11:35 AM

Yeah, that's what we found out, six years later. At least I didn't have to break her out of the Tollbooth or something. It would have caused me to pause and consider whether to rescue her from Durance Vile or continue the vacation. Decisions, always decisions!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 05 Jun 06 - 11:14 AM

Lock knives are not forbidden in the UK, flick knives are though.
G.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Jun 06 - 10:51 AM

Frankly, BBasher, I don't give a damn. That's Paul, not Jesus.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST,Bible Basher
Date: 05 Jun 06 - 05:15 AM

Rapaire! 1 Corinthians 6v9. 1Thessalonians 4v3 and Romans 1 v's 22.27.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 10:21 PM

Quite, McGrath. And I'm reminded of a cartoon where a teenager fills out a survey: "Parents: Married, Divorced...." so he answers "Cousins." And so on throughout the survey, he fills in smart-aleck answers to the questions; in the last panel his mother is lamenting the ignorance of teenagers demonstrated by the survey.

I myself have always lied on surveys whenever I have been asked to take them.

And yes, during my school days we would have answered "Yes" to a question about carrying a knife. We all did. Pocketknifes. You opened them with your fingernail. While we were vaguely aware of the ability to use them as weapons, we actually used them to sharpen pencils or whittle sticks or just to say sometime, "Here, use my knife."

And there we were, flying from Edinburgh to Dublin, and the security guard found my wife's lockback pocketknife in her purse (2 inch blade). He said that lockbacks were forbidden in the UK, but we were leaving and this was obviously NOT a "fighting knife", and he was, in his words, "up a pole." Finally, he decided the matter in these words: "Argh, let the Irish deal with it." Clicked her bag shut, and we were off to Dublin.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 09:08 PM

To get back to the knives - I get a bit suspicious about these surveys about a high proportion of kids in school saying they carry knives. In the press reports they publish they never seem to print what teh exact questions asked are.

I mean, if many years ago you'd asked kids in my own school whether we carried knives with us, we'd all have said yes. And I'd still say yes. But the knives in question would have been penknives and army knives, the sort you have to open up before you can cut anything.

It may be that the questions they ask in these surveys are designed to identify different types of knives which are more liable to be used in anger; and it may be that the surveys actually did something about checking whether the answers were actually truthful, because that's another factor in this kind of study. But I haven't seen any thing to make me assume that to be the case.

I think there's a very real danger of flawed headline-chasing surveys setting up a dangerous self-fulfilling feedback, that makes carrying fighting type knives seem a lot more normative than it actually is.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 09:08 PM

Well, I guess it comes down to do you want to take care of yourself or have someone else take care of you. America's getting as bad as the rest of the former English colonies when it comes to socialism, but at least we have a right to bear arms. And the country's the better for it. If we didn't have gun ownership, I have no doubt we could be locked up at present for criticizing the war in Iraq. But screw 'em. The war is wrong. Come kick in my door. See how it works?

Check out the Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership. They have some insightful things to say about guns. Essentially, they learned their lesson from Hitler. Good for them.

Guns keep people free of tyranny. That is the purpose of arming a populace. When the populace is disarmed, it leaves Stalin free to kill 50 million, Mao free to kill 50 million, etc. It is utter madness to give up your own guns and expect your govt to treat you fairly after you've been disarmed. History has shown us this over and over and over again.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 08:52 PM

Here's a question, and I'm serious about it.

Why is it that we feel that what's "correct" for our culture is necessarily "correct" for everyone?

Missionaries decked out the Polynesian people in muumuus because general nakedness wasn't acceptable to British-based (I include American) culture, even though the muumuu was less than optimal clothing for the environment. The US and Canada ran "boarding schools" for the indigineous peoples, removing their culture and attempting, unsuccessfully in most cases, to replace it with that of the whiteman. Modern urban society (and I include most of Britain and the East Coast of the US in this) seem view firearms and violence as a solution (albeit an undesirable one), while rural societies see firearms (and the inherent violence) as a tool.

We don't seem to learn that there can be more than one answer....


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 07:33 PM

Well, ask one of them biblethumpers to cite the verse about men laying with men, etc. Then ask him if he believes completely in the bible. He'll say yes, of course. Then ask him about Jesus saying that he came as the fulfullment of the old testament. He'll agree that yes, Jesus fulfilled the old testament. Then ask him, since the old testament has been fulfilled and is therefore of no further importance, where in the new testament Jesus condemns men laying with men, etc.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 06:04 PM

Religion and churches have caused more deaths over the centuries than anything else. There is always something in the bible. Heard a sky pilot preaching on the street last week in the town about it saying, I shall not lay with man as I shall lay with woman, chapter whatever. And we have this eye for an eye thing too. It should be banned as incitement !


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: beardedbruce
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 05:30 PM

LUKE 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.

36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.

38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 05:26 PM

Try verse 36. But remember, irony is hardly a modern invention.
................

Look at what that brainwashing has done to Britain and Australia.    Far fewer people getting shot for example... Not that gun laws are the only factor. Murder rates in general are lower anyway in these brainwashed sopcieties.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST,Bible Basher.
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 04:56 PM

Sorry GIOK but try again please Luke 22 v 26 says nothing about swords! I am ready to be educated but only in the truth.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 02:55 PM

Guest I don't think I have ever read anything so sad and yet so scary, in my whole life.
Giok


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 02:36 PM

I guess I was the one refered to as the Bible Belt guest. The trouble with govt regulation is that the govt has no business regulating. Deliver the mail and guard the borders. That's it. Anything else is meddling.

The framers of the US constitution knew this and built in safeguards. We can own guns to protect us from abusive govts. Felons lose the right to own guns, and I have no problem with that. And the constitution refers to a 'well-regulated militia' being the reason to own guns, and that's fine. My local sheriff has the authority to call me up at any time and make me part of a possee. So, the constitution kind of demands you own arms, so you can help regulate things.

Yet Americans are being brainwashed into thinking the opposite is true. You're a BAD American if you own a gun. Look at what that brainwashing has done to Britain and Australia. And I bet the 'telly' is now agitating over knives, to condition you to give those up too, and then it'll be rocks, I suppose. You poor folks. How'd you lose the right to percolate baddies? The US Constitution calls the right to bear arms 'God-given.' I don't know about that, but I do know that no govt has the right to disarm me.

Tonight my family will sleep secure in the knowlege that firearms are in the house.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 02:31 PM

"bleeding heart", "kissy cheek" - using those terms as sneers does rather suggest our nameless friend is not actually that keen on Jesus.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 12:57 PM

OK - Good to hear from you anyway. Got to grips with the furrin language yet? All the best to you and Jacqui.

:D


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: SussexCarole
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 12:23 PM

kendall here.
We are in Wales, Dave. Our itinerary doesn't take in your neck of the woods this trip, but you haven't seen the last of us!

Giok, you are right, the chance of my getting stabbed is small, but it's better than it ever was before.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 12:16 PM

Aye - One thing I would say while it is being reported in the rags it is the exception rather than the rule. When knifings are no longer newsworthy I will worry a lot more:-(

Are you in Blighty then, Kendall? Whereabouts and are you here long? Be nice to meet up again if you are available.

Cheers

DtG


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 12:03 PM

Just stop a second and look at WHERE these stabbings are happening, then look at the statistics for knife crime as opposed to all other crime.
Then think to yourself,what realistically are the chances of it happening to me, and you should come up with the answer.
Vanishingly small.
It's nasty it's horrible, it's over hyped too.
Giok


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 11:13 AM

To know how to take another's life -- with a gun, a knife, a club, with your bare hands, with poison, with explosives, or in any way -- is a heavy burden to carry. Perhaps the heaviest. If you feel that you must have with you the ability to do this without at the same time carrying the responsibility you should be denied the ability.

Most people have never taken or will ever take the life of another. But talk to the cop who kills someone in the line of duty. Talk to the train driver who runs over someone laying on the tracks. Talk to the trucker who hits a child who suddenly dashes out in the road. Talk to the soldier....

Television and films have made killing seem like a simple, ordinary thing and they should be held responsible for that.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: SussexCarole
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 10:16 AM

Kendall here.

I've been coming to the UK for many years, and in this trip I am appalled by the number of knife incidents we have seen in the pAST week or so. This used to be one of my favorite places to visit but now I can't wait to get back where I can carry my gun!

Giok, if I could make all guns and knives disappear, I WOULD! However, the reality of is such that as long as criminals carry weapons I will carry mine. I've never used it, never even shown it to a bad guy, so it's highly unlikely that I ever will.

The upshot is, I feel like the playing field is now level and the bastards have no unfair advantage over me.

Raparie, you are right. Carrying a gun is one of the heaviest responsibilities you can ever take on, and you better know what you are doing. As you say, knowing when to NOT shoot is the big question.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 06:46 AM

Then along come the religious and cultural rights brigade, as in this example.
We Scotsmen want to wear our Sgian Dubh in out stocking top when in full highland dress, etc etc.
Anything can be classed as an offensive weapon, and here are some actual examples. 1 Doc Martin Boots, 2 an umbrella, 3 a large finger ring.
All of these have been used in offensive weapons charges by the police in England. Where they often fall down is in proving 'intent' if they cannot prove that, then a pair of boots, is a pair of boots, is a pair of boots, etc!
Giok


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 05:57 AM

Guns are under licence so why not blades ?
We need to see the courts make examples of those who carry and in a lot of cases use them against decent people just trying to make a living.
All too often when it goes to court, out come the sob stories about broken homes and not getting to taste steak until he was fifteen. The judge wants to turf out the social workers and do gooders and send out a clear message to these bastards, carry a weapon and you will get 10 plus years to think it over.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 05:01 AM

Bible Belt Guest! Well that sort of says it all, as there's nothing uglier than a christian brimming over with self righteousness. Boy can those folks espouse a cause, and when they're right, all of the rest of us are really wrong.
As for quoting the bible, well I've heard it used to prove diametrically opposed points. Basically if you look hard enough you'll find something in there to justify whatever bee you have in your bonnet.
The bible also says 'Spare the rod and spoil the child' they tell me. They also tell me that if I hit my child I can be sent to jail under human rights legislation.
Now then you fundies and and believers of all degrees, who's law takes precedence, man's or God's?
I know which one of them would turn the key of my cell door!
Giok


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 12:26 AM

GUEST, I have no problem with you owning weapons. Just don't make the mistake of assuming that they are for defense. They are not. You cannot defend yourself or anyone else with a firearm. You CAN do so with a sword, a knife, a cane, but not with a gun. And anyone who thinks that a gun makes him or her twelve feet tall and covered with hair shouldn't have one, because then you are a danger to yourself and those around you.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 12:12 AM

I'd have to look up chapter and verse. It's been a while. But yes, Jesus said two were sufficient, which means don't arm yourself to do injury, just to protect your family. Split hairs if you must, but I live in the Bible Belt, and my neighbors follow the Bible, and that's fine with me. They've freely updated the term 'sword' to 'semi-automatic,' and I couldn't feel safer. Zero crime rate. Zero fear. Our only fear is that we might not kill the bastard before he gets back out the window he busted. Then some bleeding heart jury might go through a box of tissues while a psycho-analyst tells them how hard the misunderstood boy had it when he was a whelp. What a world.

Patrick Henry looked at the American constitution and pointed out it had a few flaws, one of the biggest of which was that we could be back under the rule of another insane monarch before long unless we had weapons. Weapons to protect us from government. So we got the Second Amendment.

By the way, Patrick Henry was radicalized when he saw a preacher being flogged for not paying his tuppence or thruppence or whatever to mad old King George for a license to preach. Three days later they dragged the man out again and gave him another chance to pay, he refused, and he was flogged to death. That incident led to Patrick Henry sparking the start of the Revolutionary War, then later to the Bill of Rights. It's amazing what one act, one incident can lead to.

"...and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." King James Version. Not much interpretting needed for that.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 10:36 PM

Luke 22, verse 36.

Blacklisted by the Jesus Seminar as derived solely from Luke, no other sources, not even in Q. Moreover, when the Apostles tell Jesus, "There are two swords here" Jesus answers, "That's enough."

Not a good place to cite for owning weapons, especially in light of what Jesus said at his arrest (look it up yourself).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 08:50 PM

It's there all right - Luke Chapter 22, verse 26. But it needs to be read in context with the rest of what he says, and not necessarily to be taken as an instruction that overules all that.

"Our Lord seems to suggest,in irony, that since he is to be apprehended like a robber, it is time this compoanions should go armed like robbers" (Monsignor Ronald Knox in the notes to his translation of the Bible.)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST,Bible basher
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 06:54 PM

GUEST 03.06 01.26 you stated "Even Jesus himself said if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. The right to self-protection is so fundamental that even Jesus espoused it (kissy cheek, love, forgive, buy a sword, kissy cheek, etc.)"
Perhaps GUEST you would like to give a chapter and verse reference for this statement by Jesus.
Whilst in Gethsemane...Jesus said to Peter..."Put your sword in its place, for all who take the sword will perish by the sword". Matthew 26v52.   A statement hardly conducive to his approving of swords or suggesting he would want people to take one up.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 06:23 PM

Remember that Sherlock Holmes was a pretty lousy shot. He prefered a (loaded) stick and let Watson, a pretty good shot, carry the firearm. (And shooting a "patriotic VR" into the brickwork of 221B with "Boxer cartridges" was a pretty stupid idea.)

Firearms are nice and all, in their place, but I'll take the Holmes' Solution if I have a choice (actually, I prefer the Monty Python solution of "Run away! Run away!). Silent, effective....


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 06:11 PM

I aways used to be anti-gun but now it seems to be that only the criminals are able to brandish guns with impunity, while law abiding citizens cannot even get them. Something wrong somewhere. Drug addict using a gun. Short sentence due to mitigating circumstances. Farmer using a gun to defend his property. Life sentence. Hardly fair is it.

Anyhow, back to the question. I don't think there is anything sudden about it. We have always had knives. In Victoria England both the sword and it's hidden equivalent the sword stick were considered reasonable defensive weapons. They have only been shelved due to the popularity of the gun. Now the gun is making it's way out the blades are back in.

I no longer think it is right that an outright ban on weapons is applied. They should only be issued to proper citizens. Like me...

:D (tG)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 03:46 PM

Guest sounds like a proselytiser for the NRA.
G.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: dianavan
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 03:40 PM

Guest - Lets see some statistics about countries who have gun laws and those that do not and compare it to crimes in those countries, committed with or without guns.

Ignorance causes fear and fear causes pain.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 01:26 PM

If a family of seven was gunned down, why didn't the cops stop it? If you're going to kill like that, you'll find a way. Cops can't be everywhere. For every murder committed in the U.S. today with a gun there will be THOUSANDS that were prevented because the skanks who thought about it knew their intended victims were armed. Gun ownership works. In states that pass less restrictive gun laws, crims like car-jacking stop overnight. A car's not worth getting ventillated over.

Even Jesus himself said if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. The right to self-protection is so fundamental that even Jesus espoused it (kissy cheek, love, forgive, buy a sword, kissy cheek, etc.)

Nah, the law wants you COMPLETELY in its care, but that only leads to Abu Grahibs. Hitler, Stalin and Mao all agreed gun control works. I say take responsibility for your own life. Defend yourself. And don't show the gun unless you are ready and sure that, at that very moment, it may need to be used. The look of resolution on your face will be all the weapon you need to scare that evildoer away.

And make the lawmakers stop going around with armed guards. THAT would cause a shift in the legislative attitude. Sue your lawmakers for violating the gun laws and see what happens.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 11:28 AM

Giok old friend, you and I both know that if someone REALLY want to kill someone else they'll do it, gun or no gun. They'll use a knive, a rock, a pitchfork, a car, a scythe, a sickle, a piece of wire, a bow and arrow, or any one of the innumerable ways humans have, over the years, devised to kill another human.

This is not to say that I (a gun owner and someone who has a "concealed carry permit"*) agrees with GUEST. I don't. Besides myself there are perhaps only a dozen or eighteen people in the WORLD that I would trust with firearms.















*My "carry permit" was issued by the State of Idaho. I earlier had ones issued by Indiana and Kentucky. To get them I had to undergo both classroom and range training to insure that I not only realized HOW to shoot and care for firearms, but more importantly when NOT to shoot and the legal ramifications if I made the choice of shooting. I was checked against the National Crime Computer and my fingerprints were taken; I could have been turned down if the examiner thought I was psychologically "unsound." My firearms are in a locked cabinet, with trigger locks on each. The ammunition, what I have of it, is stored in a seperate locked box. I do not need a firearm for home defense -- a home invader would get surprises I do not care to discuss in public, but I will say that they are nasty surprises that will not leave holes in my walls and furniture or massive blood spots on the carpet.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 09:13 AM

Sorry Guest but if guns are the answer, what is the question?
Guns are designed to kill people, and that is why they are wrong. It doesn't make any sense to say it's the people that have the guns that do the killing.
If they don't have the guns in the first place they couldn't do the killings.
No to all guns!
Giok


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: ard mhacha
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 09:13 AM

A family of seven gunned down in Indianapolis, the land of the itcy-finger has the answer to knives?.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 02:58 AM

Sorry, old age pensioner.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Jun 06 - 12:52 AM

So what's an OAP, by the way? For those of us in the states.

The answer is to reintroduce guns. You have no idea what a sense of peace it gives me to know my neighbors all have guns. Hunting rifles, shotguns and pistols for self protection, and so on. Seriously. The cops will never get here if someone threatens my life. They want us to THINK they'll protect us, but we know better. They can't be everywhere and protect us from all "evildoers," so we have to bear some of that responsibility ourselves, don't we? If that old lady had had a gun to stick in the guy's navel, there wouldn't have been a problem, would there? Oh, but then you have to worry about pensioners running amok with pistols.

Seriously, the criminals are always going to have weapons. The answer is an armed populace. I can't imagine living in a society where the leaders have dictated you can't protect yourself with a bit of gunpowder and lead. That's insane. The people who make the laws are surrounded by armed guards.

I only read the first post in this thread. Maybe others have pointed out the common sense in gun ownership.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 31 May 06 - 11:00 AM

The Small Arms Survey, an organization advocating the control of small arms (see external links) claims in their 2003 report that at least 1,134 companies in 98 countries worldwide are involved in some aspect of the production of small arms and/or ammunition. The largest exporters of small arms by volume are the European Union and the United States.

In addition, massive exports of small arms by the US, the former Soviet Union (AK-47), China (AK-47), Germany (H&K G3), Belgium (FN-FAL), and Brazil (FN-FAL) during the Cold War took place to support ideological movements. These small arms have survived many conflicts and many are now in the hands of arms dealers who move them between conflict areas as needed.


That from the Wikipedia, a source I don't completely trust. However, this extract seems true from what I know from other sources.

Bear in mind that this lists more-or-less modern assault rifles. Millions of bolt action rifles (Enfield, Mosin-Nagant, Springfield, Mauser, etc.) and pistols (Colt, Fabrique Nationale, Steyr, Luger, Markov, etc.) were also exported to "friendly forces" or dumped on the international arms market, snatched up by dealers, and sold.

In brief, if you want a gun badly enough you can get a gun. In the UK, in France, in Russia, in China, in Australia....


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 31 May 06 - 07:44 AM

Today, under 100 km up the road in a 'country' area, there was an incident where the pregnant mother got away and raised the alarm. Her father apparently killed a young guy (they didn't say if it was the father) the turned the gun on himself. That chewed up 6 or so hours before they sent in the camera robot to confirm that both were dead. Just as well we have that gadget these days, some poor guy would have had to go in there to check out the situation, otherwise.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 31 May 06 - 02:53 AM

McGofH. In the sixties as a Police Officer, I was armed a handful of times and believe me we had the training necessary in what to do and what not to do. Our jobs depended upon in in a nutshell so we dare not get it wrong. Your statement "which wasn't always the case"...is that based on conjecture or fact. When were officers who were armed not trained. At the time I was, the training was rigorous and the 'Dos and don'ts were clear and concise. I actually wonder if the small arms training has improved at all judging by recent events. Perhaps it is just more media coverage that gives it the hype it has. Maybe as with anything else in the world...we have to learn to live with our own mistakes and those of others.
Best wishes, Mike.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Divis Sweeney
Date: 30 May 06 - 07:40 PM

See on the tv news tonight that over the Bank Holiday weekend there were 51 stabbings, two dead. The mum and dad of the kid who was stabbed, he was just 19, were interviewed, it was so hard to watch. Simple answer is to give anyone who stabs another, life in jail. That would send out a message. A 25 year old had his nose bitten off about a mile from me on Saturday night. The one who did it was charged yesterday. Doctors could not sew it back on. Now if a dog did that it would be put down. Animals.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 30 May 06 - 05:06 PM

"The simple truth is that most violent, avoidable or preventable deaths have nothing at all to do with the 630,000 people who are today in contact with mental health services."
Source: http://www.rethink.org/how_we_can_help/news_and_media/briefing_notes/briefing_3.html
(Rethink is the largest severe mental illness charity in the UK.)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Rapparee
Date: 30 May 06 - 08:41 AM

jOhn, if the food isn't served correctly the animal will turn up its nose. You have to put out the correct place setting in the correct order, a linen napkin, a finger bowl, and stuff like that. And goodness knows what will happen if you put wine into the wrong shaped glasses!

There was a shooting in downtown here some weeks ago. The dustup started in a bar and the bartender called the cops. As the cops were rounding the corner a guy in a car shot another in the stomach; the cops took out after the shooter, who sped away and eventually wrecked his car against a concrete barrier. The wounded man (who had done nothing wrong except to ignore the loud, obnoxious, drunken shooter) is fine. The shooter and two others are in jail and likely to stay there. ONE shot was fired, and that was the one by the shooter.

It was the first life-threatening incident in downtown in five (5) years, and that includes knife and other non-firearm assaults.

In two other recent incidents people had weapons (one fake pistol, one "survival" knife) and were looking to commit "suicide by cop" -- in both cases the police knocked them down with "beanbag" rounds and took them first to hospital and then, after they had received medical and psychiatric care, to jail (where they were placed in special cells where they could be watched). In both cases the people are not in jail, but receiving the care they need. And the police are VERY glad because they did NOT have to use deadly force. (Our police have been extensively trained in the use of non-lethal force.)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: DMcG
Date: 30 May 06 - 08:37 AM

The only difference is that you get to hear about it more today, bcos the less scrupulous papers know it sells.

If only it was the 'less scrupulous papers'. This was in the "The Observer" last weekend

Robberies recorded in 1997: 63,072
Robberies in 2004-05, after a peak in 2002: 88,710
Convictions and police cautions for robbery 1997: 10.2%
Convictions and cautions for robbery 2004-05: 8.9%

The message is clearly crime rate up, conviction rate down. But a little maths gives two figures they chose not to report

Convictions and police cautions for robbery 1997: 6433
Convictions and cautions for robbery 2004-05: 7853

Whoa! a 22% percent increase in the number of convictions! That must be highlighted in the article .... mustn't it?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: GUEST,jOhn
Date: 30 May 06 - 07:46 AM

"Taught to ski, canoe and feed farm animuls"

They run courses in feeding animals???

give food to animal, animal eats food, simple!!!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Suddenly Britain has a knife culture
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 30 May 06 - 07:41 AM

Indeed McG, and they are officers who have been carefully selected. One guy I know, who prior to his civilian police service had been in the military police (where they are routinely armed), was rejected from the ARU training course because, at a social evening, he laughed at a joke about Stevie Wonder. Apparently it caused the trainers to believe that he would shoot a black man more readily than he would shoot a white person.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate


Next Page

 


You must be a member to post in non-music threads. Join here.


You must be a member to post in non-music threads. Join here.



Mudcat time: 30 November 3:46 AM EST

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.