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Subject: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: RB3 Date: 27 Jun 06 - 10:05 AM At the Old Songs Festival during the Saturday night concert, John Roberts sang a really wonderful filk of "Barretts Privateers" about the Ring of the Niebelungs. It was along the same lines of the "3 Minute Hamlet". I thought he said it was by the Berrymans. I've been looking around to see if there are any online lyrics for it, but there don't seem to be. The only bits I remember at the moment are: "when the Valkyries come with their steel brassieres and the voice of Siegfried fills your ears" and "So here I sit in the 23rd tier" Anyone know it? Thanks! -RB3 |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: MMario Date: 27 Jun 06 - 10:07 AM I think this is the one being discussed on the old songs thread written by mary LaMarca - who has requested it not be posted - but you can contact her by PM. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: RB3 Date: 27 Jun 06 - 11:00 AM Thanks! Yeah, I just was reading that, so I will do as you said. Thanks again! -RB3 |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Micca Date: 27 Jun 06 - 11:25 AM RB3, Yes I can confirm that Mary asked for it not to be posted but rather that it be passed on by "word of mouth" so to speak, I am privelaged to have a set of the words that she gave me at the Getaway a few years ago after she had performed it in the "Parodies" workshop that I ran. I like to perform it from time to time here in the UK and it is easy to spot those that know the original in the audience! Pf she os happy with the idea I could send you a copy by PM |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: GUEST,Jon Pfaff Date: 27 Jun 06 - 05:51 PM I would also like to get a copy of those lyrics. I will be working and singing with the Tallis Scholars in late July and would love to dazzle their ears with it. Since I have lost my Mudcat identity, would you please reply to a regular email or to this forum? 2eek2@airpost.net Thanks |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 27 Jun 06 - 07:19 PM I too would dearly love a copy - 'passing it on by word of mouth' is all very laudable, but those of us who for financial reasons are unable to travel half way round the world to do it, MAY just find that idea ... well..... unfortunate, at least in a sort of PC way... :-] And I don't seem to remember that 'folk songs' were TRADitionally the sole preserve of the filthy rich ... :-) ;-0 |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Barry Finn Date: 27 Jun 06 - 07:33 PM I remember Mary doing this at the last Indian Neck fest. & it was quite a treat. She's done an excellent job on this one. Foolestroupe, Mary's a very nice & generous person, try a plesant e-mail. It's not a traditional song & wither or not she's rich I don't know or care but she's not filthy, though she & her husband George maybe some the finest salt of the earth. Barry |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: mack/misophist Date: 28 Jun 06 - 01:04 AM May I also beg a copy? Please? The Geneva Convention bans me from singing but I have many friends who are opera buffs. And a few who sing. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: JohnInKansas Date: 28 Jun 06 - 01:46 AM A bit off subject, but the thread title might attract someone interested in the original Wagner work. There is lots of variation in how various sites spell the title of the work, wit Niebelungs, Niebelung, Nibelung, and Nibelungs predominating. Each site of course insists that theirs is the only correct version. Sacred Texts: Ring of the Niblung has what amounts to a "program" and text for the opera, with character identities and an outline of the acts, etc. Of more interest to me was a fair selection of the well-known but not often accessible illustrations by Arthur Rackham. The images are "mediocre to fair" quality, but I haven't found a better place with as many of them all together. (Rackham is better known for other kinds of work?) You do have to page through to see them, as they're inserted at applicable points in the text. There are a couple of nice images of Brunhilde, but I can't tell if it's a steel brassiere in any of them. John |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Bob Bolton Date: 28 Jun 06 - 05:06 AM G'day, Foolestroupe: Mary & George were out here September last ... and Mary did this song (at a song gathering we had in Margaret Walters home ... ?). It is a most impressive piece of parody! I'm not sure I could do it justice, but I'll ask Mary if she might favour me with the words ... "for a friend". JohnInKansas: The Rackham illustrations are magnificent - I have several of them very well-reproduced in a large hardcover book on Arthur Rackham. I can't rememeber any Valyries in steel brassieres ... but I clearly remember the lissome, teasing Rhine Maidens! Regards, Bob |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: JohnInKansas Date: 28 Jun 06 - 05:21 AM Bob B - side note: Some additional Rackham illustrations (30), a little better image quality, but no Rhine Maidens. Mostly Alice in Wonderland, etc. But back to the parody... John |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 28 Jun 06 - 08:04 AM AH! Remembered it! It was Anna Russell, who many years ago did a fall about funny (real explanatory - complete with stage directions) condensed version of The Ring Cycle - it was first on LP from the 1960's or thereabouts, but I have seen it (and most of her other brilliantly funny stuff) reissued on CD. She was a classically trained singer, who I believe was an opera singer at one stage. Probably available at Amazon. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Snuffy Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:12 AM I wish I was in Bayreuth now |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: MoorleyMan Date: 28 Jun 06 - 09:37 AM Heijaho---o---o---a! Heijaho---o---o---a! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Wilfried Schaum Date: 29 Jun 06 - 08:34 AM JohnInKansas - tell them: there is only one correct version: sing. Nibelung, pl. germ. Nibelungen,engl. Nibelungs. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: lamarca Date: 30 Jun 06 - 04:08 PM Well, it seems that John Roberts opened the floodgates on this one! Thanks for the interest, folks - it's fun that "my baby", The Ring of the Nibelung (abridged), has finally made it out into the world. I wrote this parody back in 1992 or so, and have been singing it around ever since. I sang the song for Nathan Rogers, Stan's son, at a festival one year, and he loved it. He said to go ahead and sing it wherever I wanted - but if I recorded it without permission from the Rogers estate, he's sue the pants off me! I give the words out freely to folks who ask for it, but I'd prefer to only pass them on to folks who've actually heard the song, whether sung by me, or Micca, or John Roberts, etc. The phrasing, the correct pronunciation of names (it's By-royt, fer instance, not Bay-royth, as one might assume from the spelling) are important, and can't be easily picked up just from a piece of paper. This is why I've asked that the words not be posted on Mudcat or in SingOut, etc. I'd also like to get whatever dubious credit there may be for writing the thing, and words that get passed around on the Internet frequently lose the author's name rather quickly. If you've heard the song and enjoyed it, send me a PM with your email address and I'll send you an illustrated PDF, with pictures stolen from the above mentioned Arthur Rackham and German Wagnerian postcard sites and from a couple of Pagan Ring websites that specialize in Norse mythology: http://www.artpassions.net/rackham/wagner_ring.html http://www.thetroth.org/gallery/ring http://www.richard-wagner-postkarten.de/postkarten/sie.php http://home.earthlink.net/~norsemyths/norsemyths.html Those of you who have heard the Gospel according to Wagner (abridged), go forth and inflict it on new ears - it's better than sitting through four nights of the operas... |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: WFDU - Ron Olesko Date: 30 Jun 06 - 04:19 PM Mary, I think it is a great song. I admire your respect for the Rogers estate, but I do believe the vesion of the song I heard John sing falls into the catagory of parody and you would not be infringing on any copyrights. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Kaleea Date: 30 Jun 06 - 04:36 PM Many years back, my music history professor played for us-just for fun!- an old record of a woman who played piano & told /sang her condensed version of Der Ring Des Nibelungen, finishing by saying how at the end of all those hours & hours of singing of battles, mayhem etc was the same damn dwarf & the same damn ring--or something like that. It was quite funny. Anyone ever heard it? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Stewart Date: 30 Jun 06 - 05:15 PM Sounds like the sort of song that Newman Levy might have written. He wrote the poem that became the song Thais, and also Carmen. And many more like that from his book "Opera Guyed" (told in a way that the average 'guy' would understand). I don't have a copy of that book, but can get it from the local library to see if he wrote anything about the Ring operas. Cheers, S. in Seattle |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: lamarca Date: 30 Jun 06 - 05:41 PM Kaleea - it might have been Anna Russell's famous version of the Ring story - she keeps stopping after telling about some improbable plot twist and says "I'm not making this up, you know!" It's still available on budget classical CD - look here at Amazon: Anna Russell |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Bill D Date: 30 Jun 06 - 05:51 PM *big smile*....being one of the fortunate group who heard LaMarca do this in it's early days, I too am glad to hear of it becoming |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 30 Jun 06 - 06:33 PM Kaleea - it _must_ have been Anna Russell's famous version of the Ring story - mentioned by me above in Post 28 Jun 06 - 08:04 AM . I had never heard of any other. ~~~~~~ lamarca I would dearly love the words, but being on dialup (for technical AND expense reasons), and since PDF files are always HUGE, having them sent to me by email can cause real hassles if I am not prepared, i.e. able to stay connected for several hours, and I am also unable to get any other email till the big one finalises. It is actually much easier for me to be able to download massive files (on the order of several hundreds of megabytes) in the background (being able to suspend and restart over a period of weeks at my convenience) from somewhere than to get even just 3 megabytes in a single email... I do appreciate and respect your point of view, however. I do respect the point of view of the author, having trashed several 'adaptations' I was interested in doing, once the original authors expressed negative opinions. "a 'proper' rendition of it is hard to do from simply reading and adapting" I would agree that would DEFINITELY be the case for those who ONLY have a 'folk music' background - but some people who play in the folk scene DO have appropriate relevant experience of a Classical Music background (I'm refusing to take offence!), and if we don't understand something, we know how to look up appropriate references, even correct pronunciations. "Let's keep the "word of mouth" spirit alive, folks!" I have already expressed my partial negativity on this - 27 Jun 06 - 07:19 PM . ~~~~~~~~~ ""I'm not making this up, you know!"" Where do you think _I_ got that from as a child?.... :-) |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: lamarca Date: 30 Jun 06 - 07:39 PM Foolstroupe - I sent my 336kb PDF file to Bob Bolton in Sydney - maybe he can mail you a printout by Aussie Post! I've been telling folks I've sent it to to pass it on to people who've heard them sing it themselves, or have heard others sing it, or who are familiar with Barrett's Privateers and will get the tune, rhythm and internal jokes :>} So, sweet-talk Bob Bolton to get the words - the mysteries of trying to send overseas mail are sometimes too much for me. BTW, if we ever make it back to Oz, I really want to see parts of Queensland, both for folk music and for birdwatching. George and I were (and still are) very fond of Bill Scott's songs. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Bob Bolton Date: 01 Jul 06 - 02:27 AM G'day Mary, Grateful thanks for the (neat, tidy & compact) PDF file. Pronouncing Bayreuth, &c, is no problem ... I just have problems with "... brassieres", which doesn't rhyme with "tears" or "ears" ... in English! ;-) Regard(les)s, Bob |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 01 Jul 06 - 07:54 AM Well I PMed Mary, so she responded, & then Bob 'helped'... so no MORE copies please... :-) Thanks guys... BTW, 'shed some tears' - 'steel Bra-ziers' - 'fills your ears' what's the problem? :-) Wagner - pronounced with a 'V', not a 'W' ;-) |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: JohnInKansas Date: 01 Jul 06 - 09:23 PM brassiere = bra ZEER; a sometimes lethal weapon used against vulnerable men by some women. [last syllable rhymes with "ear" in common US pronunciation?] brazier = BRA zi er or BRAY zhur; a pit, frame, or container for burning things, and/or a person who makes things out of brass. [last syllable rhymes with "her" in most common US pronunciation?] ????? John |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 08:13 AM OK then Jik, just for pedantics... pronounced 'shed some tears' - 'steel Bra-zeers' - 'fills your ears' happier now? :-) |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Bob Bolton Date: 02 Jul 06 - 09:51 AM G'day Foolestroupe, ... not for those who pronounce brassière ... Regard(les)s, Bob |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 09:55 AM Well, those who want to sing the song, may prefer what I suggested.. {:-P |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 09:57 AM I thought a brassière was a sort of French Cafe... |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Jeri Date: 02 Jul 06 - 10:15 AM Bob, if the accent were the other way around - é - the ér would have been pronouned 'ay'. As the accent was like this - è - it makes the èr sound like 'ur'. The emphasis is then on the French 'i', which is pronounced 'ee', which is where the rhyme is. I just knew all those French classes were going to be good for something. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: lamarca Date: 02 Jul 06 - 05:43 PM Aaarrggghhh! Bruh - zeer', the things we 'Mericuns also call "bras". Don't know the correct French spelling or pronunciation, but, remember, we're the country with lovely towns called Beloit, Wisconsin (that's bell-oyt') and Calais, Maine (that's cal'-us). Perhaps the steel brassieres were forged in braziers and sold in a special brasserie along with the barbequed spatchcock with pecorino and chilli oil (see previous link...) |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Jul 06 - 07:07 PM Aha - Robin got it corrected. The first Brazier obviously was an attempt at "phonetic spelling" but as it accidentally(?) and inadvertently(?) spelled a word that exists and has a different pronunciation it was confusing. The second Bra-zeer obviously is a phonetic spelling, and is crystal clear, since there ain't no such rièl word spelled like that. (or is there?) John |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 07:42 PM Phew! I dunno why I try... I thought the 'ie' was a single sound not two, can't remember the word we used in Grammar lessons... |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Nibelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 07:51 PM That's it! 'dipthong' - no smart arse comments.... "A complex speech sound or glide that begins with one vowel and gradually changes to another vowel within the same syllable" "the sound formed by two merged vowels, highly prevalent in English, eg the vowel sounds of 'loud', 'new', 'why' " "a vowel sound that starts near the articulatory position for one vowel and moves toward the position for another" I'm not going to quote the entire volume... Damn Senelity! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 02 Jul 06 - 08:11 PM Remember the Bugs Bunny version, "What's opera, Doc?"? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Bob Bolton Date: 02 Jul 06 - 08:12 PM G'day Foolestroupe, lamarca, JiK ( ... Uncle Tom Cobbley & all ...), Jeri has it quite right ... I was just mulling over the fact that local ( ~ 'correct' ... in not strictly Francophone) pronunciation is quite different from the common American pronunciation used by lamarca. It works fine for Mary ... and the song is a wonderful parody for Americans, who are familiar - to the point of boredom in some cases - with the original Barret's Privateers. I'm just facing the perennial risks of adopting a "foreign accent" to make the song work. I do this ... but with a degree of circumspection ... and, if I do sing the song, I'll need to cut some slack. In the meantime, I need to hear the original a few more times. (I have heard it once or twice - sung by Sydney shanty group The Roaring Forties ... but not by any others.) Anyway, Foolestroupe can enjoy either of the copies - and work out how to fit in a piano accordion. Regards, Bob |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Jul 06 - 08:23 PM Senelity? Senility - root word Senile. Keep workin' on it Robin. It'll all come back to ya after a good night's sleep. (Not really a pedantic quibble. Just a chance to jab the needle.) John |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 08:31 PM "Keep workin' on it" Senility works quite well by itself, thanks John... |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: JohnInKansas Date: 02 Jul 06 - 11:14 PM Just for Foolestroupe Note especially the last paragraph. John |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 02 Jul 06 - 11:17 PM Sorry, John, I don't remember reading that thread... |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Ron Davies Date: 14 Sep 11 - 08:36 PM Yes, Mary's parody is one of the best parodies I have ever heard--and I told her so. Ich kann Deutsch, so I could certainly pronounce all the German correctly. It's really tragic that Mary is no longer with us so she could sing it herself. But the song really should be sung. Anybody have the text or know if it is now available? I'd be glad to sing it at the Getaway--and it proves impossible for me to get the lyrics by then, somebody who has them should sing the song at the Getaway. It really should be spread. Does anybody (Bill D, for instance) know whether we could prevail on George Stevens to sing it, for instance? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Don Firth Date: 14 Sep 11 - 09:33 PM Here ya go! Anna Russell explains Wagner's Ring Cycle in three bite-sized segments. Hoy Yo To Ho, and all that. Back in 19 ought 52 0r 53, Claire, the girl I was dating who taught me my first guitar chords, and I saw Anna Russell live at Meany Hall on the U. of W. campus. She did the Ring, along with a whole bunch of other stuff. Hilarious! She's one funny lady! Sometime in the late 1980s, my wife Barbara and I took in Seattle Opera's massive presentation of the entire Ring Cycle. Four very long operas on consecutive evenings. If you're into heavy opera (I prefer Italian or French opera, but Wagner's okay now and then), the presentation was absolutely magnificent! But after twenty hours of sitting, we were really butt-weary! If you hate opera, this would have been Absolute Hell! By the way, Anna Russell's synopsis is quite accurate. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: dick greenhaus Date: 14 Sep 11 - 10:15 PM Remember Wotan? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Ron Davies Date: 14 Sep 11 - 10:26 PM I remember a review of a post-modern production of the Ring. The reviewer said that in this staging of the Ring "a nuclear war had destroyed the world and made shopping difficult." |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Don Firth Date: 15 Sep 11 - 01:53 PM A few years back, I saw a "modernized" staging of the Ring Cycle on my local PBS affiliate (Great Performances mini-series? Can't remember). I find "modernized" stagings of operas to be an abomination, generally springing from some dork's attempt to use someone else's masterpiece to "make a statement." There oughta be a law!! Anyway, this particular dork wanted to take Wagner's musical setting of Germanic and Norse myth and use it to make a statement about the evils of the Industrial Revolution. So he had the Nibelungs (dwarfs laboring away in the caves under the evil gnome, Alberich) all wearing hard-hats, safety goggles, and carrying lunch pails. Wotan is still wearing an eye-patch and carrying a spear, but he's traded in the long, flowing black cloak for a frock coat. Siegfried, the somewhat dense Officially Ordained Hero normally wore a bearskin, but in this staging, they had him in a plaid shirt and suspenders. The music was the same, but visually it was a disaster. PTUI!! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: michaelr Date: 15 Sep 11 - 04:50 PM Can we please have Mary's lyrics now? |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Bill D Date: 15 Sep 11 - 05:06 PM I'd guess George is the semi-official keeper of the lyrics now...we can ask about and see if we are all still honoring Mary's request to spread it only by 'oral tradition'. Once words are posed openly, thousands of people can be messing with it....much like "You can't be a pirate with all of your parts".... but of course, every 'author' runs into that. Once a song is in anyway public, it takes on a life of its own. We who knew Mary can ask around and see what current thinking is. |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: GUEST,JimP Date: 15 Sep 11 - 08:27 PM Mary very kindly shared her lyrics with me a few years ago, and it saddens me to learn of her passing. I've been singing this off and on since then, and it always gets a good laugh. Thanks, Mary! |
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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: 3 minute Ring of the Niebelungs From: Ron Davies Date: 15 Sep 11 - 08:35 PM "messing around". True, Bill. But I would think we all here would cite Mary every time as the author--and try to encourage others to do the same. And anybody who wanted to change it drastically would be a fool---I've heard it enough times to know it's a perfect gem. But if just somebody--anybody (who can carry the tune)--would sing it at the Getaway, it would be a big hit. It couldn't be that you're supersensitive because of imagined overexposure of the "Bold Fisherman", now could it? I assure you once a year is far from overexposure. Even twice a year might well be OK. |
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