Folkies supporting IRA

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: skarpi
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:22 PM

Dear Keith, why do IRA fight ???? why should IRA give up their weapons
if the British are not gonna do that ????    it not just fair
after all the British took their land and houses many hundred years ago right ??? and so did the Vikings ...



well I am sorry that IRA is Bombing and hurting people who have done nothing and I am a against that they should not do that ....
but I am more suprised that they did not try other ways to fight the british without hurting poeple , there are other ways to fight them
I am not gonna tell here how ....

but its PEACE I WANT TO SEE ,,

I walked through the airport in North Ireland in Belfast with a
woollen cap that my wife gave to my before I went to Portaferry
2004 to meet up with my friends of Mudcat and I was asked to take it
of becouse it had the colours of the IRISH FLAG ????? I didint
take it off and I am gonna wear it next February in Portaferry
I have my believes and I stick to them no-one tells me other wise .

well my friends thats the end of that ... lets all enjoy the weekend and listen to the folk music country music or waht ever we like :>)

All the best from a Islander from north atlandic Island

Iceland Skarpi Iceland .....I hope that I do not hurt anyone with my writing ......

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 09:42 AM

I hope you get your good weather Sceilg, and I wish I could get there.
If you were meaning me, you have got me all wrong.
As I have said before, I love Ireland and all things Irish.
(except paramilitary violence)
keith

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: GUEST,Sceilg
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 08:51 AM

Maybe the anti Irish member could give us a break for a few days and let us enjoy a great weekend of music. With the like of Glen Campbell, Emmylou Harris, Kenny Rogers, Folklore and Van Morrison on the bill for Midlands, a new festival which takes place in Ireland this weekend.

The two-day festival takes place at Ballinlough Castle, Athboy, Co Meath on Friday 28 and Saturday 29 July, with capacity limited to 15,000.

Now all we need is the weather !

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:52 AM

Thanks Giok:-)

I never knew it was one of Mr Behans! I love that last verse - Says far better than I could that it is the top dogs that cause the problems. Get rid of the buggers. Up the revolution:-)

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Charmain
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:42 AM

If Eire had given up its "neutrality" during WWII then Churchill would have given her NI for keeps - FACT!

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:30 AM

There ya go DtG, I love it too, it's a lot less hate filled than the average sectarian song.
Giok

Sorry about the centenarian steal [not]

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:18 AM

Damn you, MacKenzie. I just had that 100 in my sights..:-)

:D (tG)

Who's favourite, incidentaly, was 'Thank God we're surrounded by water'.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:15 AM

If the UK really was democracy this problem would have been solved in 1921! [I think]
G.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul Burke
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 05:06 AM

English leave NI? I bet most people in Britain would welcome that. Give it to Ireland? They wouldn't take it. I once thought that handing the country over to Iran might help, by uniting everyone against the occupiers, but recent events in Iraq have shown that to be a non- sequitur.

Perhaps there's some milage in creating a completely new federal state, consisting of Eire, Northern Ireland and Scotland. That way, you get a middle-sized European country of about 11 million people, with only a slight preponderance of Catholics. The Loyalists wouldn't have surrendered if the Queen became nominal head of state, though whether you could get the Republic to agree is another matter. And perhaps we could complement the Celtic Tiger with the Rangers Tiger.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 04:15 AM

Skarpi,
I am english, and very sorry for your experience.
Folkies are usually OK, but other people are still angry about IRA bombs.
The British people and British government want to leave N.I., but the majority do not want us to go.
The majority is about to change.

Sweeney left?

I do not make Guest posts.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 04:04 AM

Well said skarpi. Always be careful of grammar and punctuation. Keith is watching !

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: skarpi
Date: 28 Jul 06 - 02:42 AM

Bloody mudcat anti-irish squad out again!


I Have once been hit by an Englishman becouse I was singing with my band
an IRA song ........ and I aint gonna stop singing IRA songs or songs
about IRA or storys , becouse SOME ENGLISHMAN are telling me not to .



my wiew is very simple : English should leave North Ireland
and give the control to to Ireland, and thats the end that.
Afterwords the people can deside in alection what to do .

But I am told this is not a good way , what is a good way ??
this is the way , but there are always some Politicals
who stopp this .


well I am not gonna solve this here , and I have nothing
against either English people or IRA

All the best Skarpi Iceland

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 08:19 PM

uh?

& UH?

Divis Sweeney left? Whats that mean?

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: GUEST,Sceilg
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 06:39 PM

DIVIS SWEENEY left yesterday morning and Keith starts putting the boot in on him. Nasty.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 06:21 PM

Keith you have more GUEST posts on this site than half the members put together ! Come on mate put your hands.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 01:36 PM

if you concentrate on the specifics - you won't see it. because each set of circumstances is so compelling. take another look at those songs - look how people felt about the hunger strikers.

you're not going to see fairness, or even handedness from such a perspective . Maybe you can, if you're a saint like Nelson Mandela. But in this game, saintliness is obviously in short supply.

i can see what I am saying is having no impact.

what I mean is - you have to deal the fact that men are what they are - not what they should be. the key to communicating in this case is not going to be insisting that you are right.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 01:14 PM

I should also have said that most of our contributors are above such tactics.
You mentioned Ard. I would add Den.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 12:58 PM

When I left the certainty of teenage behind, I soon learned that issues that divide people are never clear cut, and that both sides are right or have right on their side.
In our folk music we sing songs from both sides.
But look at a recent example on this forum.
Sweeney included in a list of criticisms that I contributed to the I Met A War Hero thread.
When I asked what I had done wrong, Sweeney said that the man was involved in NI security.
Not asking if he was, or suggesting he might have been.
It was stated as if a fact.
We were even told that the man wore a NI service medal.
Hundreds of thousands grew up in turmoil of the troubles.
Compulsive lie telling is not an inevitable consequence.
It is just being used as a debating tactic.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 12:21 PM

grown up, but grown up different. different country, different mythologies, different gods to propitiate. their lives have their own parabola to describe.

put it this way. you never grew up in a place where joining the IRA seemed like a good idea.

I think it was Ionesco, the playwright - who said, we grow up with certainties, and when we learn a foreign language, you learn all these statements that you have taken for granted all your life -"the floor is up, the ceiling is down". and sometimes you think, is that really so.......?

for ard and divis, the floor and ceiling are probably someplace else. no dishonesty intended.    If I told the story of the miners strike, I imagine it would have some different truths to tell than a Mrs Thatcher fan.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 12:14 PM

So much of what is written by either side is maudlin sentimental rubbish, sort of thing that would bring a tear to glass eye, but only if the wearer was pissed.
Songs like the Foggy Dew, and the Patriot game only come once in a lifetime, too many of the others are used as propaganda weapons to arouse hate against the opposition, and if looked at dispassionately are pure doggerel.
Giok

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 11:20 AM

I am not sure WLD.
These are grown up men.
They can't help telling lies because of emotion?

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 08:59 AM

yes I think so. just look at the emotional intensity of the songs. if truth is first casualty of war, they wouldn't be the first side involved that massacre. show a bit of tolerance.

i think to most people (apart from the odd yank who thinks he's an expert because he once had a tin of Irish stew) the violence and its effects speak for themselves.

lets just be glad there seems to be some turning away from it. constant bickering over over who was right....well it just won't get us anywhere.

divis and Ard do you know this guy who wrote these songs?

Glad you like it Paul. I thought it was a cut above the usual Boys of the Old Brigade and Sean South - more current, and a real sense of humour.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 08:36 AM

WLD,
Yes, when I reread posts after a few days it often does look like that.
But they do say things that are wrong.
Blatant lies often.
It should not go un exposed should it?

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 08:30 AM

Damn, I needed cheering up 'drummer, & that bugger did it! Brilliant song!

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 08:26 AM

No Keith you have misunderstood my point. They are going to say what they want, whatever you say.

No doubt in the fullness of time(another 600 years or so) they will apreciate that they have to say something marginally different to get a united Ireland, and get on with their Unionist mates.

However that time is not here.

In the interim, you popping up like a Harry Enfield sketch in a nightmare, ('Now you got that bit wrong, I don't really think you meant to say that........).

Well ......it isn't adding to the gaiety of nations.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 06:39 AM

I do see what you are saying WLD, but

on no other area of dissent would anyone say, "just let them say what they like, otherwise they get angry and abusive."

Remember my only point of disagreement with them is that I believe the violence was counterproductive.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 06:33 AM

I see now that the thread has been moved to BS people are giving lyrics, and links to them.
G

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 06:22 AM

a couple more songs by the same author

http://celtic-lyrics.com/forum/index.php?autocom=tclc&code=artists&id=189

I think if you read through the lyrics Keith, you will see what I have been driving at in various posts.

The people who write, sing, applaud songs like this - they 'feel' different. Ricochet-ing facts off each other isn't going to do anything but increase rancour.

I personally find some of the abuse and rudeness which accompanies this very unacceptable, in what is ostensibly a forum for friendly exchanges. But face the facts, civilised dialogue on this subject isn't going to break out. Not when there are sensibilities out there waiting to be outraged, serious doubts about the popular warcries and slogans of every faction, and stinging abuse is such fun to deliver.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Jul 06 - 06:00 AM

This the one I meant

http://www.vincentpeters.nl/triskelle/lyrics/kinkyboots.php?index=080.010.040.050

Anybody know anything about it? it was popular on the jukebox at a pub I used to play in Nottingham.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 09:57 AM

does anyone know that parody of the Wurzels - i've got a brand new combine harvester - only its about an armoured car?

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 08:19 AM

now my song for you this evening
well it ain't to make you sad
nor for adding to the sorrows
of this troubled northern land
but lately I been thinking
and it just won't leave my mind
to tell you about two friends of mine
who were both good friends one time
now alan bell from benagh
he lived just across the fields
he was a great man for the music
and the dancing and the reels
o'malley came from south armagh
to court young alice fair
and often we'd meet on the ryan road
and laughter filled the air

there were roses, roses, roses
and the tears of the people ran together

alan he was protestant
and sean was catholic born
but it never made any difference
you know the friendship it was strong
and sometimes in the evening
when we'd hear the sound of the drums
well we said it wouldn't divide us
you know we'd always be the ones
for the ground our fathers ploughed in
well the soil is just the same
and the places where we say our prayers
have just got different names
and we talked for hours about those who died
and hoped there'd be no more
it was little then that we realised
the tragedy in store

there were roses, roses, roses
and the tears of the people ran together

well it was on a sunday morning
that the awful news went round
another killing had been done
just outside of newry town
we knew that alan danced up there
and we knew he loved the band
but when we heard they'd shot him dead
well we just couldn't understand
and we gathered at the graveside
on that cold and rainy day
and the minister he closed his eyes
and prayed for no revenge
and all the ones who knew him
from all along the ryan road
well they bowed their heads
and they said a prayer
for the resting of his soul

there were roses, roses, roses
and the tears of the people ran together

now fear it ruled the countryside
there was fear in every home
when the car of death came prowling
round the ryan road
a catholic will be killed tonight
to even up the score
o christ it's young o'malley
they've taken him from the door
"alan was my friend" he cried
he begged them with his fear
but centuries of hatred
have ears that cannot hear
an eye for an eye
was all that filled their minds
and another eye for another eye
till everyone is blind

there were roses, roses, roses
and the tears of the people ran together

now my song for you this evening
well it ain't to make you sad
nor for adding to the sorrows
of this troubled northern land
but lately I been thinking
and it just won't leave my mind
to tell you about two friends of mine
who were both good friends one time

I don't know where the moral is
or where this song should end
but I wonder just how many wars
are fought between good friends
I know that those who give the orders
well they're not the ones to die
it's bell and o'malley
and the likes of you and i

there were roses, roses, roses
and the tears of the people...

there were roses, roses, roses
and the tears of the people ran together

There Were Roses
by Tommy Sands (I think?)

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Wolfgang
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 07:37 AM

As I roved out by Newry town... (Paul Burke's post) has been posted once or twice before but if I am not mistaken the tune has not been mentioned yet. It is sung to the tune of "The battle of Harlaw" (in the DT).

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: GUEST,Keith fan
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 07:25 AM

Say Hello To The Provos is an Irish Rebel/folk song written in the early 70s which deals with events happening at that time in Irish history, namely The Troubles. The "Provos" in the song's title were the Provisional IRA. "The Provos" was a popular nickname for them used by both sides of the Troubles.


Lyrics

Chorus

    "Say Hello To The Provos,
    Say hello to the brave,
    Say hello to the Provos,
    And Ireland shall be saved.

    It all happened in '71,
    Internment it had just begun,
    Men were taken by the point of a gun,
    Remember, we shall remember.

Chorus

    Many a battle has been fought and won,
    Many a home has lost a son,
    Long Kesh's gates shall soon be undone,
    Remember, we shall remember.

Chorus

    The UFF and SAS,
    Assassinations at their best,
    Innocent people they put to their deaths,
    Remember, we shall remember.

Chorus

    Dáithí Ó Conaill we honour your name,
    Those British generals you put them to shame,
    For Stormont's downfall you were to blame,
    Remember, we shall remember.

Chorus

    So put your faith in the Provos,
    Put your faith in the brave,
    Put your faith in the Provos,
    And Ireland shall be saved."

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:50 AM

Conciliatory stuff that!
G.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul Burke
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:42 AM

One of the greatest acts of barbarian vandalism in Irish history was committed when the Free State Army and the Diehards between them blew up the Four Courts in Dublin, along with over 1000 years of manuscripts in the Records Office. Along with the burning of many local records in the insurgency, it has meant that genealogical research largely reaches a full stop if your ancestry is Irish.

But as to the original comment, I've not heard a good old rebel song in ages. Even, or perhaps especially, in Irish circles. So here's one, not implying any support for terrorism or colonialism and with full sympathy for the human beings injured or killed in the incident:

As I roved out by Newry Town
A band of men I saw,
It was the First Battalion of
The men from South Armagh.

Ch: With me diddy-i-oh, fol-a-doh, diddy-i-o-i-ay (whatever that means)

"Oh have you crossed the border,
And have you travelled far?
Did you see the English soldiers?
Were they in their armoured car?"

Ch.

"Yes I have crossed the border,
And I have come that far,
I saw fifteen English soldiers,
They were in two armoured cars."

Ch.

And soon we saw the armoured cars
and they were coming fast.
A young man pulled a lever
And there was a mighty blast.

Ch.

We opened up along the ditch
With everything we had,
And when the firing finished
We knew we had them bad.

Ch.

Now the fighters in this gallant band
They numbered barely ten,
They were neither man nor devil,
Sure they came from Crossmaglen.

Ch.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:28 AM

...AND:

Way back up near the top of this thread Keith A of Hertford responded to a post by Big Mick, thusly:

..."Mick,
The British don't really sing songs about heroes.
There are a few 19th Century ones about the likes of Wolfe, and Nelson, but very few and rarely heard.
I can think of none about 20th Century heroes."

Here is at least one though:


In a station in the city a British soldier stood
Talking to the people there if the people would
Some just stared in hatred, and others turned in pain
And the lonely British soldier wished he was back home again

Come join the British Army! said the posters in his town
See the world and have your fun come serve before the Crown
The jobs were hard to come by and he could not face the dole
So he took his country's shilling and enlisted on the roll

For there was no fear of fighting, the Empire long was lost
Just ten years in the army getting paid for being bossed
Then leave a man experienced a man who's made the grade
A medal and a pension some mem'ries and a trade

Then came the call for Ireland as the call had come before
Another bloody chapter in an endless civil war
The priests they stood on both sides the priests they stood behind
Another fight in Jesus's name the blind against the blind

The soldier stood between them between the whistling stones
And then the broken bottles that led to broken bones
The petrol bombs that burnt his hands the nails that pierced his skin
And wished that he had stayed at home surrounded by his kin

The station filled with people the soldier soon was bored
But better in the station than where the people warred
The room filled up with mothers with daughters and with sons
Who stared with itchy fingers at the soldier and his gun

A yell of fear a screech of brakes the shattering of glass
The window of the station broke to let the package pass
A scream came from the mothers as they ran towards the door
Dragging their children crying from the bomb upon the floor

The soldier stood and could not move his gun he could not use
He knew the bomb had seconds and not minutes on the fuse
He could not run and pick it up and throw it in the street
There were far too many people there too many running feet

Take cover! yelled the soldier, Take cover for your lives
And the Irishmen threw down their young and stood before their wives
They turned towards the soldier their eyes alive with fear
For God's sake save our children or they'll end their short lives here

The soldier moved towards the bomb his stomach like a stone
Why was this his battle God why was he alone
He lay down on the package and he murmured one farewell
To those at home in England to those he loved so well

He saw the sights of summer felt the wind upon his brow
The young girls in the city parks how precious were they now
The soaring of the swallow the beauty of the swan
The music of the turning world so soon would it be gone

A muffled soft explosion and the room began to quake
The soldier blown across the floor his blood a crimson lake
There was no time to cry or shout there was no time to moan
And they turned their children's faces from the blood and from the bones

The crowd outside soon gathered and the ambulances came
To carry off the body of a pawn lost in the game
And the crowd they clapped and cheered and they sang their rebel song
One soldier less to interfere where he did not belong

And will the children growing up learn at their mothers' knees
The story of the soldier who bought their liberty
Who used his youthful body as a means towards an end
Who gave his life to those who called him murderer not friend.

SOLDIER
(Harvey Andrews)

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:19 AM

Sorry Dave ...couldnt resist!

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:16 AM

I was NOT that gnome...

And thanks to whoever for dropping this into the cellar.

:D (tG)

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:07 AM

Dave, you should be the LAST person to mention Irish builders.... did you not watch 'Fawlty Towers' then? *G*

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 05:03 AM

Oh right, lay waste to Dublin?
They already did that in 1916, didn't work then, wouldn't work now!

Did they? What history book is that in then? I don't think even the most ardent republican on this site would claim that the British lay waste to Dublin. If they did the 50 intervening years between then and my first visit there must have been pretty remarkable ones fo the Irish building industry. No wonder Irish builders are so popular in England!

I do wish people, on all sides, would stop making silly unsubstantiated comments.

And yes - below the line plase.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 04:50 AM

I was thinking that 'drummer...then got sidetracked before looking it up.

...& btw, while Im posting, I have to apologise to everyone. I was wrong. I said "there is nothing better guaranteed to get normally sane & sober Mudcatters ranting & sh*t-slinging than this topic."

That was untrue.

The present Iraq situation (& anything around it) does too.

In that case though it tends to be DIFFERENT Mudcatters.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 04:24 AM

Conrad Veidt - he played the German officer in Casablanca


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0786412895/104-0958108-2647957?v=glance&n=283155

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: s&r
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 04:14 AM

Can some elf or joeclone put this below the line?

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 04:10 AM

.......& yes, well said Stallion in that.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 04:09 AM

Yes I was baffled by the "plastic alarm clocks" too....but SOME of the other things ring true, despite being badly put perhaps.

We should all know better than to get onto this topic by now...there is nothing better guaranteed to get normally sane & sober Mudcatters ranting & sh*t-slinging than this topic.

Yes, WHY is it still above the line, WHY did we get suckered into it again, & why does this like nothing else make some people try & be determined to have the last word........& why did I post this & not leave Sorcha as the final voice of reason on this thread?

Paul

(1/8th Irish by blood, if not by culture)

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: stallion
Date: 26 Jul 06 - 04:02 AM

It really is time for this thread to end, I know just how deep rooted the rancur is on both sides but threads like this will not end the healing process here in the Uk and Eire, we will eventually learn to rub along and put the past behind us. One thing that does stick in my craw though, the US could have done more, diplomatically, to bring it to an end sooner and chose not to, I haven't been motivated to examine in detail why that was but it may be a worthwhile study.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Sorcha
Date: 25 Jul 06 - 10:38 PM

Pardon me...I didn't read most of the above....I have respect for SOME humans, NOT for 'entities'

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: GUEST,michaelr
Date: 25 Jul 06 - 10:15 PM

WHY IS THIS STILL ABOVE THE LINE?????????

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Effsee
Date: 25 Jul 06 - 09:59 PM

"with their plastic alarm clocks and some real ones"
Eh?

"who have after conquest legally ruled them since about 1600"
Eh? Conquest does not confer legality.

"Loads of them here who make it necessary to show real courage (more than I've got) on this forum to accuse their terrorists of being the terrorists they are.
WTF are you talking about?


"How about the USA sending England a stock of smart missiles so that England can deal with Irish terrorists the way Israel does Arab ones - destroying infrastructure wantonly killing non-combatants, and planning a final solution? "

Oh right, lay waste to Dublin?
They already did that in 1916, didn't work then, wouldn't work now!

One man's terrorist is another's Freedom Fightter.

Subject: RE: Folkies supporting IRA
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 25 Jul 06 - 08:32 PM

*sigh*