Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp

Subject: Piratesof carib CD
From: GUEST,Julia
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 09:15 PM

This is a new thread regarding the CD mentioned in the concertina thread

I amazed that nobody has commented on the truly bizarre collection of songs and artists on that CD! Whew!
It is called Rogue's Gallery and has 43 "sea" songs supposedly inspired by the movie, or maybe reminiscent of it...?
The idea is an interesting one, but the manifestation seems ill-concieved.
I mean, Sting singing Blood Red Roses?! And someone please tell me when Bonny Portmore became a sea song? Loudon Wainwright does "Good Ship Venus"- obviously this is not intended for family listening... truly wierd
I guess nobody has heard this yet as it is to be released in august.

I'll follow up with a link for the curious

Cheers- Julia

Subject: RE: Piratesof carib CD
From: GUEST,Julia
Date: 15 Jul 06 - 09:18 PM

here's the link

Rogues Gallery CD
http://www.billboard.com/bbcom/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002691275

I have been wondering how this might affect sales of Gordon Bok's Rogues Gallery for 12 string...

TTFN
Julia

Subject: RE: Piratesof carib CD
From: Nerd
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 01:22 AM

Here's some info from the record's producer

Ian Anderson of Folk Roots has heard an advance copy and says it is remarkably good...

Subject: RE: Piratesof carib CD
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 04:44 AM

http://www.billboard.com/bbcom/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002691275

http://www.cyber-kat.com/potc/images/jackSparrow3800.jpg

http://www.johnnycollins.net/

Subject: RE: Piratesof carib CD
From: Zhenya
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 05:03 AM

Interesting...! Well, it's a great collection of songs, and, in fact, a lot of great musicians as well. And I skimmed some of the liner notes (thanks for the link Nerd) and it looks like straightforward folk type liner notes to me. I'm curious to actually hear how the songs are styled. And even more curious how this album will come across to all those people who buy it because of the artists or movie tie-in, and never heard this type of song before.

I did take issue a bit with this paragraph (see that same link above) "At first, I was a bit concerned that most of these songs and chants don't really have song structure as some of us like. Many of these songs are verses over and over again with a one line chorus like 'heave ho boys heave away'... But, as I continued, it occurred to me that with exception of some collectors and scholars, this was a totally unexplored kind of folk music."

Well, thanks to the Mudcatters who alerted me to this, and maybe it will interest some new listeners in this "totally unexplored kind of folk music."

Subject: RE: Piratesof carib CD
From: Nerd
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 10:25 AM

Well, he's right that in transforming something like a sea shanty into a pop song one of the first decisions is whether to leave it as is architecturally, or whether to add verse, chorus, bridge structure. If you decide on the latter, doing it can be a big challenge in your arrangement. The same goes for other kinds of folksongs too.

As for "totally unexplored," he just doesn't want to know...

Subject: RE: Piratesof carib CD
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 16 Jul 06 - 02:16 PM

"remarkably good" -- is that kind of like "surprisingly, it doesn't suck"?   ;-D

I'm sorry, I find this all very scary to contemplate (in an amusing kind of way).

The notes are very straight. I found it strange to see them juxtaposed with those listings of performers with so many instruments.

But, as a good liberal I'll bite my tongue and say instead, what the hell! The more, the merrier! If you want to be a folk evangelist, you can't afford to be excessively picky.

~ Becky in landlocked Tucson

Subject: Pirates album courtesy of Depp
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 10:36 PM

"Rogue's Gallery: Pirate Ballads, Sea Songs, and Chanteys"

There are some snippets on Amazon.

What do you think?

Dani

Subject: RE: Review: Pirates Album courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Janie
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 11:27 PM

Hey Girl! When did you get in? Check pm's tonight or I'll call you in the AM.

I'm no music critic, and really don't know much re: shanties. So, in the FWIW department, I enjoyed the clips but thought many of those snippets sounded a bit over-produced.

Janie

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 11:19 AM

There's gold in these old sea songs. Many of us nautical singers have been mining these songs for years, getting filthy rich! I'm only surprised that it has taken the commercial music world so long to discover this gendre of singing.

The sequel CD may even include "You Can't be a Pirate with All of Your Parts."

Argghhh!
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 12:21 PM

(thanks for cleaning up: I didn't look carefully enough!)

I have to say, to the untrained ear there's some very interesting stuff here. That said, my favorite versions of some of these are from right here: Dave Diamond, Barry Finn, Ken Schatz and the like have spoiled me ; )

Dani

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Anglo
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 01:18 PM

Well, some of the sound clips on Amazon make Jerry Bryant's recent unexpurgated shanties CD sound relatively clean. Not your usual Disney fare, (though I doubt they had anything to do with it). I didn't know the term "m***** f*****" was used back in the 18th century. Neither did Oscar Brand, I imagine, when he made his Bawdy Sailor Songs LP way back in the 50s.

You can buy in on eBay (at almost twice the price) though Amazon (and everyone else) releases it in two days.

As an aside on the eclecticism of Sting, he has just recorded an album of Dowland Lute Songs for Deutsche Grammophon. That should be different.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 02:53 PM

Anglo, Mother is only half a word in the new Pirate way of talking & singing. This will surely push the current Pirate fad into high gear, sigh.
Well after listening to the snippets I don't come away with wanting to buy this at any price. No one's setting a standard here. Here's my take on the little that I heard of each. I'll be very brief, there's to many & none worth more than a spot or two:

Disc one:
"Cape Cod Girls," Baby Gramps - sucked
"Mingulay Boat Song," Richard Thompson - pretty good
"My Son John," John C. Reilly - pretty good
"Fire Down Below," Nick Cave - sucked
"Turkish Revelry," Loudon Wainwright III - eh, ok
"Bully In The Alley," Three Pruned Men - sucked
"The Cruel Ship's Captain," Bryan Ferry - sucked
"Dead Horse," Robin Holcomb - there was nothing there to really go on
"High Barbary," Joseph Arthur - sucked
"Dan Dan," David Thomas - sucked
"Blood Red Roses," Sting - sucked
"Sally Brown," Teddy Thompson - eh, ok
"Lowlands Away," Rufus Wainwright & Kate McGarrigle - just alright
"Baltimore Whores," Gavin Friday - eh, ???
"Rolling Sea," Eliza Carthy - Eliza was good but her back up sucked
"The Mermaid," Martin Carthy & the UK Group - eh
"Haul On The Bowline," Bob Neuwirth - ok, good
"Dying Sailor to His Shipmates," Bono - whoa, sucked, nothing but a moan
"Bonnie Portmore," Lucinda Williams - eh, not to bad
"Shenandoah," Richard Greene & Jack Sh*t - nothing to really go on
"The Cry Of Man," Mary Margaret O'Hara - eh

Disc two:
"Boney," Jack Sh*t - eh, shit
"Good Ship Venus," Loudon Wainwright III - whoa, lously
"Long Time Ago," White Magic - to bad such a nice BWI version, yeech
"Pinery Boy," Nick Cave - sucked
"Lowlands Low," Bryan Ferry with Antony - eh, not too bad
"One Spring Morning," Akron/Family - eh
"Hog Eye Man," Martin Carthy & family - good
"The Fiddler/A Drop of Nelson's Blood," Ricky Jay & Richard Greene - sucked
"Caroline and Her Young Sailor Bold," Andrea Corr - not too bad
"Fathom The Bowl," John C. Reilly - I never knew that stout & strong cider was under Ireland's control but it still was ok
"Drunken Sailor," David Thomas - sucked real bad
"Farewell Nancy," Ed Harcourt - nothing to reall go on
"Hanging Johnny," Stan Ridgway - ok
"Old Man of The Sea," Baby Gramps - sucked
"Greenland Whale Fisheries," Van Dyke Parks - eh, ok
"Shallow Brown," Sting - eh
"The Grey Funnel Line," Jolie Holland - I hope that they not only paid up on Cyril's royalities ut they should triple it because of what they did to it, he's probably rollin in his grave
"A Drop of Nelson's Blood," Jarvis Cocker - yecck
"Leave Her Johnny," Lou Reed - a "Velvet Underground" version on heroin, bad
"Little Boy Billy," Ralph Steadman - pretty decent

Mind now that these are 1st reactions to only short clips.
My prediction; It'll sell like crazy mad.
I don't know if this well put shantydom forward 5 yrs or set it back 50.

The more the merrier, I don't know, we'll have to see

The article is right about this being done on the fly, off the cuff & with very little research into such an unknown type of music.

Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Mr Fox
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 04:32 PM

Looks interesting. The only thing that worries me is the good review from FRoots - over the years I've learned not to bother with ANYTHING they like.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 05:00 PM

Barry-

I admire your patience in reviewing the song samples.

I was kind of curious but you've satisfied my curiosity.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 05:36 PM

It is an interesting look though Charlie, at what a new younger group of potential sea music lovers will be expecting of us. We has beens can't come close to what they'll be expecting to hear.

Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 06:48 PM

Spotted this in today's (Sunday) New York Times, under "Playlist" by Ben Ratliff, a column of short reviews:

Baby Gramps

If the new "Pirates of the Caribbean" film has any associative power, this may finally be the public moment for Baby Gramps, an eccentric, seemingly very old (though nobody seems to knows how old) singer and steel-guitar player based in Seattle, with a voice like Popeye after smoking an entire tin of Prince Albert. His performances on "Rogue's Gallery" (Anti), a two-disc set of sea chanteys produced by Hal Willner, are among the album's best, and that's saying a lot: among the other contributors are Sting, Lou Reed, Lucinda Williams, Bono, a gravel-voiced Bryan Ferry, a midnight-voiced Nick Cave, a twee Van Dyke Parks and Bill Frisell with a beautiful guitar track. Chanteys are durable songs, and this turns out to be a strong album with heart as well as ideas: the conscious weirdness doesn't render it inconsequential.

[And aside from me: I don't think I've ever seen the word "twee" used in an American commentary before.]

~ Becky in Tucson

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 08:21 PM

Well, I've never run across the term "twee" here in Maine but it generally takes decades for British slang to wash ashore here. Here's what I could find by Googling:

"Twee", a baby-talk alteration of "sweet", was originally a British term for something that is daintily sweet or cute.

Twee pop is a type of indie pop that is known for simple, sweet melodies and lyrics, often combined with jangling guitars. The genre began in 1986, when New Musical Express released C86, a compilation of bands including the Pastels and Primal Scream; see 1986 in music.

The 1970s-1980s Post-Punk Band The Television Personalities are often cited as a major influence on the genre, along with Buzzcocks and The Ramones. This was more evident in the more punk-influenced bands, like Shonen Knife and the Beatnik Termites.
In the United Kingdom, where twee pop was most popular, Sarah Records was home to most of the bands in the field, including Heavenly, The Field Mice and the Orchids. In the United States, the movement was championed by K Records of Olympia, Washington and was headed by the band Beat Happening.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 10:58 PM

re: twee
Well I understood the term in the general sense... I'm amused at the report that it's actually also applied to a particular musical genre. I wonder if the writer meant that or not.

~ Becky in Tucson

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Pelrad
Date: 20 Aug 06 - 11:03 PM

Good lord, I'm willing to string Johnny Depp up by his heels if he's responsible for this horror. I'll cheerfully add most of the musical contributors to the string. It sounded like they all got really drunk and recorded this album during their hangover hours.

I took the Barry Finn tour through the samples on Amazon.com. I'm still shuddering at most of the bits I heard.

Pretty much everything was awful, in my opinion, except the following:

Dead Horse - Robin Holcomb - not too terrible
High Barbary - Joseph Arthur - not terrible if you indulge new ideas
Haul Away Joe - Mark Anthony Thompson - not bad
Sally Brown - Teddy Thompson - I actually liked the bit I heard
Rolling Sea - Eliza McCarthy - I agree with Barry, her backup sucked
Haul On The Bowline - Bob Neuwirth - finally, someone who actually understood the medium he was taking from (excepting, of course, the Carthys)
Hog Eye Man - Martin Carthy & Family - pretty good
Caroline and Her Young Sailor Bold - Andrea Corr - interesting, would have been willing to hear more

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: andrewq
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 08:24 AM

Anglo wrote "As an aside on the eclecticism of Sting, he has just recorded an album of Dowland Lute Songs for Deutsche Grammophon. That should be different."

That is too horrible to contemplate. No wonder Dowland semper dolens.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Artful Codger
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 05:34 PM

Just listened to the samples, and I must agree: absolutely dreadful. Substandard performances even from the folk greats. It's like the producer told them, "Sing the way Johnny Depp acts; or better yet, Keanu Reeves imitating Johnny Depp. If it's good, we'll have to cut it." A few numbers squeak by, but not one is inspiring.

It's a pity that, fueled by "Pirates" frenzy, this may be the first exposure to "shanties" a lot of kids will get, and assuredly the last, without a gun to their temples.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: michaelr
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 06:57 PM

Is that Ralph Steadman, the artist and longtime Hunter S. Thompson collaborator? If he sings the way he draws, it must be truly bizarre (but good).

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Rowan
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 07:04 PM

Artful Codger may be right but he reminds me that, in past years, when acquaintances found out I was 'into' folk music they'd often say "Oh, yes, I've got a Burl Ives/Kingston Trio/Peter, Paul & Mary/Bushwackers/etc album at home!" (The choice of artist pretty accurately indicated their age.) They seemed to believe that this enabled them to both rank my activities/performances as well as have an opinion worth listening to on the entire folk music scene. I could usually accept aspects of their ranking but the latter bit 'was' rather interesting.

This CD will probably be a similar broadside before the swarming boarding party of newbies who will rank all of our expertise as so much waffle. To the extent that it introduces loads of them to an informed participation we must be thankful, but.... Shiver me timbers and spare me their criticisms. Then again, I might learn something great.

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 07:17 PM

Oh, Codger, you did NOT just dis' Johnny Depp. You are in dangerous waters indeed....

Dani

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: EBarnacle
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 07:48 PM

If Shendoah survived Mitch Miller and the various choral groups of the '40s and '50s, chanteys will survive this. As a doctor friend off mine once said about kidney stones: This too shall pass.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 08:03 PM

It's a bit funny that this is getting pawned off as the new folk genre, the unearthing of the sea song might actually be it's drowning. What's sadder is that in it's hype the media commentators who know even less than those know nothings that were involved in this turnip truck tip-over are calling it smashing, go figure.

Has anybody been following the small but steady rise in the pirate faze or reinactment fad that's been happening here in the US during the past few years, espically around the college & university campuses? Well here comes the Rogue's Wave.

There's a storm a brewing now, wondering what's gonna be left in it's wake, probably us.

Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: C. Ham
Date: 21 Aug 06 - 09:06 PM

Tom Lewis, my favorite singer of sea songs, was interviewed on the Folk Roots/Folk Branches last week and remarked on how much he enjoyed hearing Sting sing "Blood Red Roses" on this CD.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 03:18 PM

Enjoyed or found interesting? I've already heard 3 different cuts, plus a new Tom WAIT's! pirate shanty?? on the radio, already, enough, pretty please. I thought Sting was hauling to a phycoReelic March & that each pause at the pull he was wrenching. The shades of Jimi Hendrick's & the Velvet Underground's acid & heroin trips ribbon through out the CD's production. "Pirates on Acid" should be the title.

Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 04:37 PM

Barry, your evaluation is too generous. I couldn't wait for most of the samples to stop !

The exceptions were "My Son John," "The Mermaid," and "The Rolling Sea."

Dylan must have been thinking of this album.

Nice Howard Pyle painting, though.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Greg B
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 06:47 PM

I just listened to all the samples.

I believe the adjective I'd use would be 'uneven.'

I forecast a couple of unfortunate outcomes. One, people will
innocently buy it for their kids. Oops. And that will put them
off the genre. Two, John and Jane Q. Public will buy the thing,
find it hideous, and that will put them off the genre.

Some of the tracks were obviously mastered in the studio, for
the purpose.

Others sound like they were gleaned from someone's home-made
CD or tape.

Still others sound as if someone stuck a microphone in the
center of a chantey sing (we've had people do that) with
bad result.

That about covers the recording quality.

Now, as to the performance quality:

I had a feeling that in some cases neither the performers nor the
producers knew what the material is supposed to sound like. Some
of the performers seem to be of a level of talent that causes
people to take potty breaks at sing-arounds. Others just sounded
inebriate.

I wonder who Sting was impersonating. He didn't sound like Sting
but rather some folk club denizen impersonating a primary source.
Personally, I don't think there's a thing wrong with his own voice
and I would have liked to hear that 'instrument' applied to the
material.

I guess what I find frustrating is this: if you were going to do
a compilation CD, why not just go out and license some of the best?
The best tracks on this were probably not as good as any of the
tracks on the Mystic Seaport Festival CDs, nor on some of the
Folkways compilations (such as X-Seaman's Institute and Friends
or the San Francisco Festival of the Sea recording).

Nor did I hear many 'fresh approaches' and what were there were
really rather indifferent and tolerable at best.

With two CDs and this many tracks, and this kind of cache...they
could have done so very much better.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: JohnB
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 07:32 PM

Not to contribute to thread drift BUT, on the amazon site they say that people who bought this cd also liked "Roast Beef of Old England"
From the associated samples what do you guys think of that in comparison to the Rougue's Gallery?.
I'm just not sure what you can really get out of 30 seconds of a song.
JohnB

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Greg B
Date: 23 Aug 06 - 08:14 PM

If the RBoOE is Roast Beef, then Rogues Gallery is
runny eggs and sardines.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 24 Aug 06 - 12:06 PM

I hope I'm not rumor-mongering, but I saw elsewhere that "Jack Sh*t" is actually Bob Dylan. Anyone got the scoop on that??

~ Becky in Tucson

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Artful Codger
Date: 24 Aug 06 - 02:35 PM

Becky, when you play the CD backwards, do you hear "Bob is a dead man"? :-}

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Greg B
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 01:36 PM

Interesting to read the reviews of this thing on Amazon.com

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 01:44 PM

Yes Greg, just heart wrenching, hehee.
Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Joe Offer
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 07:33 PM

I've had the CD in the car stereo for the last week or so, and I have to say I've enjoyed listening to it. Already, I can hear the screams of Barry Finn, the first time somebody demands that he sing a sea song the "right" way, the way it's on the Rogue's Gallery CD.

These are commercial recordings. They're meant to sell lots of CD's, not to satisfy us purists who actually want to sing the songs ourselves. And within the context of it being a commercial CD, I think it's pretty good.

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Dave'sWife
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 07:42 PM

well, if Joe likes it, Ill borrow a copy from any of the twenty-something interns at my husbands office who buy every CD that comes out. They spend all their money on CDs, movie tickets and martinis made from things martinis shouldn't be made of.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 01 Sep 06 - 08:53 PM

Hi Joe
I won't scream, promise. I'll just tell 'em to f@#k off as I've been told to do. I'd like to give it a full listen but there's no way I'm gonna buy this one for a lesser price I could hardly not do better.

See you come November
Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Denis - UK
Date: 13 Sep 06 - 01:56 PM

I just heard "Rolling Sea" on the radio and I thought it was really rather good.....reminded me a little of the sort of arrangements Steelye Span used to do years ago!

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 13 Sep 06 - 03:12 PM

I got it as a birthday present and listened to some of it.... I'd have to say 'eclectic'....

LTS

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Barnacle (at work)
Date: 14 Sep 06 - 10:08 AM

gotta admit - it's growing on me! On first hearing it, I was gobsmacked, some of the tracks are surreal. However, I am listening it to it presently for the third time - and I'm getting to like it. Yes, it's eclectic, I don't like every track, but even the one's that disturbed me on the first hearing (such as Baby Gramp's Cape Cod Girls), I am getting used to.
I dunno, but anyone or anything that brings traditional material into the mainstream can only be a good thing as far as I am concerned. Having sung sea songs and shanties for the last ten years or so and having had to explain the genre to all and sundry, perhaps the intervention of this recording will boost the cause. Or ... perhaps shanties will be the new rock n roll - here's hoping!

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: open mike
Date: 14 Sep 06 - 01:04 PM

help me, Bob, there's a bully in the alley..

oh, it's Bob!'

some of these cuts are dreadfu.

and should be forced to walk the plank..

just in time for sept. 19, th

the bully in the alley chorus is not in time to the music,
sounds like they are laying in the alley, actually.

i did play a few of these on my sea shanty radio show,
but sort of regretted it...there are many other recordings
that do this genre much better justice...these are just wanna be's

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Greg B
Date: 15 Sep 06 - 01:13 PM

I've seen this 'well it brings the music into the mainstream'
apologia a couple of times now.

I don't buy it.

This dreck won't 'bring it into the mainstream'; it will send
the 'mainstream' running for the exits.

Some of it is among the worst...I mean THE WORST renditions
I've ever heard.

Ignoring the fact that most of the lexicon from which they
draw comes from an era a century or two removed from the
'Jack Sparrow' era, the stuff is mostly very badly performed
and in most cases just as badly engineered and produced.

It seems to me that if you wanted to 'bring it into the
mainstream' you'd be far better off selecting some of the
more stirring performances of forebitters and shanties from
the Mystic Festival (or others) and assemble a collection
that was at least listenable.

I guess if all I heard all day was a car alarm, it would
eventually 'grow on me' as an alternative to silence...

Greg

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Santa
Date: 15 Sep 06 - 01:49 PM

The review in today's Guardian was favourable but refered to it as a collection of old shanties. The alternative being new ones?

As a principle, I'm all for "eclectic" approaches to folk music. Let them all try it! Doesn't mean I have to like any or all of the results.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: stallion
Date: 16 Sep 06 - 08:27 AM

Haven't heard it but Martin has a copy and said that the only track he liked was Sting singing Blood Red Roses, he couldn't believe it(the cd) at first! Ah well I look forward to hearing it in the week, wish me luck that I should survivr the experience!

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: johnross
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 01:17 AM

Baby Gramps is a friend of mine, and I have admired his work for a long time, but I have never thought of him as a singer of chanteys. Not that he couldn't do them and do them well if he tried -- he's one of the most perceptive observers and analysts of other people's singing and performing styles I know -- but that has never been part of his own shtick.

Oh well. Maybe this will get him the attention beyond the Northwest that he has always deserved.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 03:24 AM

I've listened to most of it now... I think I have to stick with my initial opinion.... eclectic.





























Or damning with faint praise....

LTS

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 03:29 AM

Although the Robin Halcomb version of Dead Horse as a torch song is brilliant!!!

LTS

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 04:43 AM

Is it just me or do some of the listings appear to be off?? When I want to listen to 'A dying sailor' by Bono, I get him singing 'Haul on the bowline' which is supposed to be Bob Neuwirth.

And why did no-one do the song from the film... or is it just there in an unrecognisable form?

Yo ho, yo ho....

LTS

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: freda underhill
Date: 03 May 07 - 12:20 PM

I heard it coming back from the St Albans folk festival (nsw) & enjoyed it!

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Artful Codger
Date: 03 May 07 - 04:22 PM

Two words: interlibrary loan. Why lay out a penny for this shipwreck just so you can listen to the few half-decent cuts, when you can get hold of it for free?

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 03 May 07 - 04:52 PM

Once again it is--"Forgive them! They know not what they do..."

Is it not thusly that things have proceeded seemingly--throughout history? The new crop thinks they "KNOW". The old paradigm, when it was new, knew absolutely that it KNEW. And acted accordingly.

It's unlistenable---but fascinating to see as it lumbers on towards Bethlehem.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 03 May 07 - 05:03 PM

"Not too bad" is praising with faint damn.
IMO it's one of the funniest botches I've encountered. Fageddabout whether it has anything to do with folk music or sea shanteys--it's for the most part just lousy music.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Barry Finn
Date: 03 May 07 - 05:37 PM

Aside from a couple of very good cuts it's so bad it's comical.

Barry

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Morris-ey
Date: 04 May 07 - 09:44 AM

Most of it, say 30 songs are, IMHO crap. e.g. "Help me Bob there's a bully in the alley" er no, it should be "I'm bully in the alley". Baby Gramps - what does he normally do for a living? Can't be anything to do with music.

Jack Shit is, I believe, Johnny Depp and his band.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 May 07 - 11:39 AM

Seems I've not listened to it since my birthday... I may just have to go back and see if it was as bad as I remember and people are saying... I may be some time!

LTS

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: johnross
Date: 05 May 07 - 12:38 AM

Baby Gramps is in fact a fine singer and musician, on his own terms. He plays an old National Steel resonator guitar, and he sings old hokum songs, his own compositions, and even the occasional Bob Dylan song all in his own unique style. He has played with lots of other people, and opened for the Grateful Dead and the Holy Modal Rounders. He's one of the most popular folk music acts in the Northwest. As I said upthread, until this CD came out, I don't think I'd ever heard him do any sea chanteys, and I've been listening to him for more than 30 years.

He's also one of the most perceptive musicians I know. He pays attention to a lot of other performers, and absorbs a tremendous amount from them. More than once, I have run into him at a concert or club gig and asked what he thought about the show. His critiques (positive and negative) are always spot on, and helped me understand exactly what the performers on the stage were doing.

I have to believe that the producers of this set came to him, and he gave them a chantey in his own style, rather than changing his style to fit the song.

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Depp
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 05 May 07 - 01:36 AM

I suspect that was one of the reasons behind this CD - to get musicians you don't usually associate with sea shanties and folk songs to give it their treatment and their own interpretations of shanties. After all, you don't associate Johnny Depp with steel front guitar (well, you do if you saw 'Chocolat') but he's actually quite a fine player.

I'll be listening again to it this morning whilst warming up for a gig this afternoon.

LTS

Subject: RE: Pirates of Caribbean CD courtesy of Johnny Dep
From: Greg B
Date: 07 May 07 - 05:10 PM

I'm not willing to work as hard as some interlocutors seem to
in attempts to find some 'redeeming artistic significance' to
what is nine-tenths complete rubbish.

And yes, even amongst the rubbish you may find the occasional
gem that's been accidentally tossed in.

If there were a contest to make the worst sea music recording
ever, this one would win.

Former winners were some low-grade recordings I've heard made
with single-mic'd tape recorders at a couple of different
chantey sings. They were terrible, but at least they were
innocently terrible.

That the producers couldn't bother to find out who actually
knew and could perform items from the genre is a tragedy and
a waste of good cover art--- and reflects the fact that at least
one producer thinks that wearing eye-liner and prancing about
with a sword means that he'd know a forebitter from a short-drag
if it got up and bit him on the bunghole.