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Just found Mudcat

ositojuanito 24 Sep 06 - 05:09 AM
Morticia 24 Sep 06 - 05:14 AM
Les in Chorlton 24 Sep 06 - 05:28 AM
Dave Hanson 24 Sep 06 - 05:28 AM
Les in Chorlton 24 Sep 06 - 05:29 AM
Liz the Squeak 24 Sep 06 - 05:31 AM
JamesHenry 24 Sep 06 - 05:51 AM
Richard Bridge 24 Sep 06 - 06:22 AM
Rockhen 24 Sep 06 - 06:35 AM
catspaw49 24 Sep 06 - 06:35 AM
ositojuanito 24 Sep 06 - 06:41 AM
catspaw49 24 Sep 06 - 07:00 AM
Richard Bridge 24 Sep 06 - 07:31 AM
Zany Mouse 24 Sep 06 - 07:40 AM
catspaw49 24 Sep 06 - 07:48 AM
Leadfingers 24 Sep 06 - 08:01 AM
number 6 24 Sep 06 - 08:15 AM
kendall 24 Sep 06 - 08:34 AM
Dave Hanson 24 Sep 06 - 08:42 AM
wysiwyg 24 Sep 06 - 08:56 AM
Maryrrf 24 Sep 06 - 08:59 AM
Azizi 24 Sep 06 - 09:09 AM
GUEST 24 Sep 06 - 09:19 AM
artbrooks 24 Sep 06 - 09:23 AM
jacqui.c 24 Sep 06 - 09:35 AM
Willie-O 24 Sep 06 - 09:39 AM
Charley Noble 24 Sep 06 - 09:59 AM
Cruiser 24 Sep 06 - 10:00 AM
breezy 24 Sep 06 - 10:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Sep 06 - 10:21 AM
Big Mick 24 Sep 06 - 10:34 AM
Maryrrf 24 Sep 06 - 10:43 AM
JennyO 24 Sep 06 - 11:01 AM
Big Mick 24 Sep 06 - 11:12 AM
Richard Bridge 24 Sep 06 - 11:20 AM
kendall 24 Sep 06 - 11:32 AM
Ron Davies 24 Sep 06 - 11:44 AM
GUEST 24 Sep 06 - 12:00 PM
SINSULL 24 Sep 06 - 12:07 PM
Alice 24 Sep 06 - 12:12 PM
Mo the caller 24 Sep 06 - 04:51 PM
Pistachio 24 Sep 06 - 05:31 PM
billybob 24 Sep 06 - 05:42 PM
Roughyed 24 Sep 06 - 06:02 PM
Peter Kasin 24 Sep 06 - 06:03 PM
John O'L 24 Sep 06 - 07:29 PM
Beer 24 Sep 06 - 09:32 PM
Tannywheeler 24 Sep 06 - 09:48 PM
fat B****rd 25 Sep 06 - 03:04 PM
gnu 25 Sep 06 - 04:39 PM
GUEST,Art Thieme 25 Sep 06 - 09:27 PM
The Fooles Troupe 25 Sep 06 - 11:59 PM
Big Al Whittle 26 Sep 06 - 04:05 AM
Black Diamond 26 Sep 06 - 09:28 AM
jacqui.c 26 Sep 06 - 09:44 AM
George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca 26 Sep 06 - 09:49 AM
MuddleC 26 Sep 06 - 11:59 AM
MMario 26 Sep 06 - 12:02 PM
Mo the caller 26 Sep 06 - 12:05 PM
wysiwyg 26 Sep 06 - 12:08 PM
Richard Bridge 26 Sep 06 - 12:41 PM
John MacKenzie 26 Sep 06 - 12:46 PM
open mike 26 Sep 06 - 12:52 PM
katlaughing 26 Sep 06 - 12:56 PM
Mr Yellow 26 Sep 06 - 12:59 PM
The Shambles 27 Sep 06 - 07:13 PM
Black Diamond 28 Sep 06 - 06:46 AM
John J 28 Sep 06 - 08:41 AM
MMario 28 Sep 06 - 08:41 AM
Effsee 28 Sep 06 - 09:17 AM
Gurney 13 Mar 08 - 03:06 AM
skarpi 13 Mar 08 - 06:45 AM
Mr Red 13 Mar 08 - 09:00 AM
pavane 13 Mar 08 - 09:26 AM
Jeri 13 Mar 08 - 09:53 AM
Peace 13 Mar 08 - 09:55 AM
Amos 13 Mar 08 - 10:23 AM
skarpi 13 Mar 08 - 10:30 AM
Jeri 13 Mar 08 - 10:33 AM
Charley Noble 13 Mar 08 - 10:33 PM
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katlaughing 14 Mar 08 - 12:21 AM
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Subject: Just found Mudcat
From: ositojuanito
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:09 AM

Hi

I'm from Dublin in Ireland and I am Folk Musician and a lover of the culture for all of my life and I was looking up the internet for the lyrics of a Tom Paxton song yesterday when I stumbled across this very interesting site. I didn't know anything like it existed and I would love to see being fully developed.

Best wishes

John Hartery


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Morticia
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:14 AM

I think a lot of us 'natives' think of it as developed enough already, mate, but welcome.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:28 AM

Yes, welcome John, it is the source of much good music and much great discussion. But, as you might detect if you follow fairly innocent threads, after a while people get bored and start attacking each other and other names from the wonderful world of "Folk".


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:28 AM

Welcome to the madhoues, abandon all hope ye who enter here.

eric


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:29 AM

Thanks Eric, need I say more?


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:31 AM

Welcome to the Madhouse Osito - don't take everything here too seriously (unless it's about chocolate) and you'll be fine!

Oh.. and watch out for trolls.. they like lurking. They've been a bit restless of late so think twice before hitting that button!

LTS


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: JamesHenry
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:51 AM

Eric

Shouldn't that read "Abandon all hope ye who press Enter here?"


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 06:22 AM

Can I start a typical Mudcat row by saying that Tom Paxton is not folk, but contemporary?

Feel free to join in ositojuanito!

The mudcat will not be FULLY developed until the digitrad contains all known folk songs and all songs in the style of the tradition. But it is already the best source in the world as far as I know.

It is also a place to find many wonderfully informed people, like Bob Bolton of Australia, who can add hugely to your store of knowledge.

Unfortunately there are also some who demonstrate that any animal that eats must also produce waste products.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Rockhen
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 06:35 AM

Mudcat can be really useful or just a place to give and receive a lot of aggro. Depends what you want...if you give a lot of aggro, you will get it in return and some people enjoy that and treat it as a game. Is your choice.
I have found it really helpful for finding out info on wide variety of musical topics and if you want opinions on music, you will definitely find them, here... :-)


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: catspaw49
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 06:35 AM

Yes Richard but we are herd animals and form a large herd therefore producing such copious amounts of waste that we both have folks who celebrate it in song and have others available to polish the turds. The former are called folksingers, the latter, lawyers. Should any one individual achieve both positions they are called broke-dick mamaluccas.

Welcome to the 'Cat ositojuanito!!

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: ositojuanito
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 06:41 AM

I don't pretend to know what 'Folk' is. Louis Armstrong said it was all Folk Music 'cos I never heard no horse sing' I guess I see Folk as lyric oriented music or traditional music, that is music written within a tradition. Certainly folk lyrics are stuff of legend but so too are some of its melodies, many which have been embraced by Classical music and musicians.

John


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: catspaw49
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 07:00 AM

LOL....You'll love this joint! Everything you mention in your post has multiple threads on it. There are at least two on who said the horse singing thing!   Everything that has ever been discussed here is still here although a crash jumbled some thread orders of posting. I've been around here since '98 and I am always amazed at what gets discussed.......here's one reference by Art Thieme.......We also have dozens of threads arguing over the definition of folk. Of course we also have dozens of threads about William Shatner and the Neil Young Center for the Terminally Screwed..............

Have fun!

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 07:31 AM

Folk Song in England

In 1954 the International Folk Music Council adopted this definition:—

"Folk music is the product of a musical tradition that has been evolved through the process of oral transmission.

The factors that shape the tradition are:
(i)         Continuity which links the present with the past:
(ii)        Variation which springs from the creative impulse of the individual or group:
(iii)        Selection by the community, which determines the form or forms in which the music survives.

The term can be applied to music that has been evolved from the rudimentary beginnings by a community uninfluenced by popular music and art music, and it can likewise be applied to the music which has originated with an individual composer and has subsequently been absorbed into the unwritten living tradition of a community.

The term does not cover composed popular music that has been taken over ready—made by a community and remains unchanged, for it is the refashioning and recreation of the music by the community that gives its folk character.



'Conclusions', by Cecil Sharp~

A folk song is always anonymous.
Modal melodies, set to secular words, are nearly always of folk origin.
Song tunes in the minor mode are either composed tunes, or folk airs that have suffered corruption.
Folk tunes do not modulate.
Folk melodies are non—harmonic: that is to say, they have been fashioned by those in whom the harmonic sense is undeveloped. This is shown:—

a.        in the use of non—harmonic passing notes.
b.        in a certain vagueness of tonality, especially in the opening phrases of modal tunes.
c.        in the use of flattened seventh, after the manner of a leading note, in the final cadence of modal airs.
d.        in the difficulty of harmonizing a folk tune.
e.        Folk melodies often contain bars of irregular length.
f.        Prevalence of five and seven time-measures in folk airs.

In giving evidence in 1835, Francis Place reported that ballads sung about the streets during his youth could not be adequately described in present company. 'I have given you in writing words of some common ballads which you would not think fit to have uttered here. At that time the songs were of the most indecent kind: they were publicly sung and sold in the streets and markets: no one would mention them in any society now!



Another consideration.

"The mind of the folk singer is occupied exclusively with the words, with the clearness of which he will allow nothing to interfere. Consequently, he but rarely sings more than one note to a syllable and will often. interpolate a syllable of his own rather than break this rule.

"O abroad as I was wordelkin'
I was walking all alone
When I heard a couple tordelkin'
As they walked all along"



The Greek/Mediaeval/Folk Song Modes ~

The scales on which many English folk tunes are based are not the same as those with which we arc familiar through classical music.
The Greeks were the earliest musical grammarians in Europe and laid the foundation of the scientific system which was to be, in a modified form, our inheritance for plainsong and folk song.

        There were seven Greek Modes        (The white notes on a piano).
Dorian (Plato considered this the strongest)        D to D
Phrygian.        E to E
Lydian        F to F
Mixolydian        C to C
Aeolian        A to A
Locrian        B to B
lonian (our major modeNodus lascivus)        C to C

"Sumer is a--cumen in", our oldest Mss is in the Ionian Mode.

English folk tunes are most frequently found cast in the Dorian, Phrygian, Mixolydian, Aeolian, and Ionian modes. Occasionally in the minor: Cecil Sharp wrote: "The majority of our English -folk times, say two~thirds, are in the major mode. The remaining third is fairly evenly divided between the Mixolydian, Dorian and Aeolian modes, with, perhaps, a preponderance in favour of the Mixolydian,

The pitch of the mode may of course be varied, the relationship of the notes being constant.



The Pentatonic_Scale

The pentatonic scale (five notes to the octave) is widely distributed in folk music and is found in the traditional music of many oriental countries. We also know that it was practiced in ancient times in China and Greece. It is common in Scotland and Ireland.

In its most common form it possesses no semitones, the intervals between the notes consisting of whole tones and one—and—a—half tones. It can be played on the black notes of a piano, or on the white notes, omitting B and B.

According to the relative position of the tonic, there are five pentatonic modes, though some scholars prefer to regard them as segments of the same scale.

English songs also show a number of Hexatonic (six—notes) tunes, usually with the sixth missing.

Sharp held the theory that the present seven—note diatonic scale is a development from the pentatonic scale,




Ballads

"'Therefore,' while each ballad will he idiosyncratic, it will not be an expression of the personality of individuals, but of a collective sympathy: and the fundamental characteristic of popular ballads is therefore the absence of subjectivity and self—consciousness. Though they do not ~"write themselves" as Grimm has said - though a man and not a people has composed them, still the author counts for nothing, and it is not by mere accident, but with the best reason, that they have come down to us anonymously." Child.

Romantic Ballads        Child Waters, The Gypsy Laddie, The Maid Freed from the Gallows.

Tragic Ballads        The Two sisters, Lord Randal, Barbara Allan.

Historical Ballads        Sir Patric Spens, Mary Hamilton, Queen Jane, The Hunting of the Cheviot.

The Outlaw Ballads        Robin and the Three Squires, Johnnie Cock.

Supernatural Ballads        Lady Isobel and the Elf—Knight, The Unquiet Grave, The Demon Lover, The Wife of Usher's Well.

Humorous Ballads        Our Goodman, The Farmer's Curst Wife,





Conventional Elements

Conventional_diction        cerbain archaisms not found in common parlance — a song about lords and ladies will use "steed", "morrow," etc.

.Conventional Epithet        "milk—white steed," "Lily—white hand," "Fair Margaret."

Conventional Phrase        Tears "blind the eye," blood 'trickling down the knee."

Commonplace        e.g., the rose—briar stanza.

They buried her in the old churchyard (epithet)
They buried him in the choir
Out of her grave grew a red, red rose (epithet)
And out of his a green briar. -

Opening/Ending Formula         "As I walked out one Nay morning,"
        'It fell upon a..        
        "Come all you young fellows and listen to me.





"Voice and ear are left at a loss what to do with the ballad until supplied with the tune it was written to go with…. Unsung, it stays half—lacking.'

Robert Frost.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 07:40 AM

Welcome new Mudcatter - where DID you get that name?

Mudcat should be issued with a Government Health Warning - it's addictive. I spend far too long on here each day when I should be doing housework, practising, learning new songs etc.

Good luck

Rhiannon


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: catspaw49
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 07:48 AM

OR, instead of Richard's suggestions, try THIS PAST THREAD and all of those others linked at the top of it!

There are no simple answers here.....LOL.....no matter what Richard says.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Leadfingers
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 08:01 AM

As Liz the Squeak said , this IS a Madhouse , but there are a lot worse places to waste time on the Internet! Welcome , and have fun here !!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: number 6
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 08:15 AM

Some advice here ... if you are of a sensitive, non confrontational nature, stay away from any threads whose subject pertains to politics, religion, the mid-east, what is folk music, banjo playing, guitars other than Martin or Gibson, professional folk musicians, bodhrans, capos.

Welcome ositojuanito, good luck and may your spiritual commander be with you.

sIx


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: kendall
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 08:34 AM

So tie your dory and come aboard.

Where would one find parts for an "Oral" transmission?


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 08:42 AM

See what I mean osijuanito, you've only been here a few hours and already you have had a lecture from Richard Bridge.

eric


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 08:56 AM

Enjoy the anarchy, give what you can, and use what you get!

~Susan


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Maryrrf
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 08:59 AM

Welcome to Mudcat!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:09 AM

Welcome to Mudcat, ositojuanito.

I believe this forum has been around for 10 years or so-though I don't know if it's birthday has come or gone.

I've been here posting here for two years. My main areas of interests are children's game songs, children's handclap, taunting, jump rope, choosing "it", and foot stomping rhymes, and children's cheerleader cheers. I'm also interested in military cadences {jodies}, African American secular slave songs {many of which have become part of a generic category of American folk songs}, African American spirituals, and New Orleans Mardi Gras Indian chants.

All of these topics have been discussed in various Mudcat threads.
I certainly would look forward to additional comments on existing current or archived threads on these subjects and/or new threads on these subjects {and others}.

One way to find any archived threads that I've alluded to is to click on a member's name. A list of that member's posting to threads will appear and then you can click on titles that may be of interest to you.

Btw, ositojuanito, no one welcoming you to Mudcat has specifically mentioned the BS section. Imo, some of the references to Mudcat being a "Madhouse" may refer to the wit & humor found in some BS threads. And imo, the references to "waste material" certainly apply to BS threads or posts within BS threads than to music threads. Yet, also in my opinion, the BS section is the heart of Mudcat.

In my opinion, the comments that Mudcat members and identified guests make in BS threads-much more than in Music threads-provide information about the personality of those individual posters. In the BS section, Mudcatters reach out to the community during personal crisis and provide support & information. Mudcatters send birthday wishes and congratulate individuals in BS theads.

Also in my opinion, the BS section ususually contains interesting and informative threads, and threads which are fun & relaxing {in a "play on words sense" of fun}. And yes, much more than in the music threads, the BS threads have comments that I would consider to be "waste material". But which communities don't have waste material?

And I believe that much more than in the music threads, the BS threads show that Mudcatville has its cliques and counter cliques.   But which communities don't have cliques and counter cliques?
As much as possible, I "play pass" {ignore} the waste and as much as possible I play pass the arguments between the cliques & counter cliques.

That's how I roll. To each his or her own {way of rollin}.

All this to say, ositojuanito, I encourage you to check out Mudcat's music/folklore section and also Mudcat's BS section.

Share! Learn! Enjoy!

Ms. Azizi


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:19 AM

Welcome! Richard's a fundamentalist. There are others. To me Tom Paxton's who got me in to folk music, and anyway, some of his songs are now fifty years old. It's a broad church and it has its hardliners, however, they never stop progess and change. But arguing their corner keeps them happy, and frequently grumpy too!
But welcome!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: artbrooks
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:23 AM

Welcome, Little John Bear. This is a great place to hang out...and I spend a lot of time here. To piggyback on what Azizi said, there really are two different "rooms" to play in here...the MUSIC section (which also includes threads on TECHnical issues, and FOLKLORE) and the BS section, which includes just what you would think. Some of us are pretty exclusively in one or the other and others hang out in both. Like any community, we have our quiet types, scholars and some loud obsessives...and don't let the latter get to you, especially when they say something like "do a search before asking a question" or "the moderators are inhibiting my freedom of speech." The FAQ section (which seems to move around) has a lot of tips on what you can find and do here, not all of which is really obvious. By the way, the site and all of the equipment related to it is operated as a labor of love by a guy named Max in Pennsylvania, and he accepts contributions to keep it all going.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: jacqui.c
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:35 AM

ositojuanito - just a little warning here -

This site can be totally lifechanging. As a result of my addiction to the site I am now married and living on a different continent.

I also have friends, met and unmet, in many parts of the world.

If you want to get an idea of some of the people you may be 'talking' to go to the 'quick links' at the top of the page, click on the drop down menu, click onto 'Member photos and info' and click 'Go'. Quite a number of us have put photos and brief descriptions of who we are in there.

Here's wishing you many happy hours playing on what I think is the best site on the net.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Willie-O
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:39 AM

Welcome aboard mate! Yup, you have had a lengthy music lesson from Richard Bridge, and a brief introduction to the strange humour of Catspaw and some kind of barely-recognizable pun-kind-of-thing from Kendall (who has the virtue of brevity, considered admirable in his native Maine). There's also a guy named Max who is the brains of the outfit (started and hosts the site and servers; if you like Mudcat send him a nice note and/or a contribution), and the redoubtable Joe Offer, who tries to keep the threads organized and not too duplicitous nor libellous (a thankless task). And there are literally hundreds more of us, from all over the world. There are many many Mudcatters in the UK and the US, plus Canada (comme moi), Ireland, Europe, Australia, and lots of places I don't know about.

The coolest thing about Mudcat IMHO is that it is not a "virtual community", it is a real community. Mudcatters have frequent real-world get-togethers, to share music and good times (after all we are musicians eh!) some of which involve ocean crossings. In particular there's an event called the Getaway which occurs in Maryland, USA, this year the weekend of November 4-5, for which large numbers of Catters come from the UK, all over North America, and God knows where else. You'll hear a lot about it and perhaps be tempted to attend.

So jump right in, participate, enjoy. Good to know ya.

Bill


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Charley Noble
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:59 AM

ositojuanito-

Welcome aboard!

I still remember my initial delight from being directed to this website. The first few months I enjoyed tracking down old songs I'd been curious about for years which were discussed in previous threads. Eventually I added my own requests for more information about songs I couldn't find here but I was still interested in and was generally surprised and delighted with the response from my inquiries. I eventually became bold enough to respond in kind to other people's requests and even to post some of my own original songs or musical arrangements. You soon learn to sift through the responses but some are always rewarding.

I enjoy some of the word play and song challenges that periodically appear.

I have also made some good friends here from other parts of the world and have even visited some of them and shared songs.

Not bad for a free service!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Cruiser
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 10:00 AM

The Mudcat Cafe is simply the best archived music forum on the blue marble.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: breezy
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 10:20 AM

Welcome osi

and tonight at the madhouse of Windward Folk Club at the Comfort Hotel, in St Albans , herts eng


its Anthony John Clarke

in person

he's from belfast and liverpool

wrote 'broken years'

plus Chris Flegg and Christine Connolley

and a few othrs

7.30 for an 8.00 p.m start


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 10:21 AM

The archive is excellent, but the body of knowledge available through the forum is outstanding.
Barely a question goes unanswered.
keith.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Big Mick
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 10:34 AM

Catspaw, your eloquence in taking the piss is legendary, and I bow to your mastery of it. Best laugh I have had in years.

Sure is nice having you here, Mate. Enjoy yourself, and learn the first skill at the Mudcat. That is the use of the search function. It is always a good idea to search the old threads when you want information, and before starting a new thread. If the old ones don't answer your questions, you can either post to them, or if you feel it doesn't fit (or just feel like a new conversation), start a new one.

May I suggest that you consider attending an annual gathering of Mudcatters in Portaferry, Co. Down in February? HERE IS A LINK to the thread on this annual gathering. It is usually a gathering of mostly European Mudcatters, but you never know but a Yank will show up.

Glad to have you hear, and I look forward to your posts.

All the best,

Mick


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Maryrrf
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 10:43 AM

Any chance that YOU will be there,Mick?   Being from Virginia, technically I do not consider myself a Yank, so I don't count!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: JennyO
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 11:01 AM

Hello John. I'm one of the 'Cats from the land of Oz. There are a few of us around here - it was my friend Sandra in Sydney who encouraged (nagged) me to join Mudcat 4 years ago. What she didn't tell me was how addictive it can be!

I agree with Willie-O about how great it is that we often meet other Mudcatters in real-life. A lot of us have entertained visiting 'catters from the US and the UK, had sessions for them, invited them to our folk clubs and festivals, and some of us (not me yet unfortunately) have gone overseas and met some of the people we had only met on Mudcat before. In every case I can think of, finally meeting these people has been like reuniting with old friends!

There's a chat room here - just use the quick links drop down menu and click on 'mudchat'. It will tell you how many are in there and you can chat with whoever is there in real time.

Also, if you really want to join in some of the fun soon, have a look at the Secret Santa thread. If you send a PM to Liz the Squeak in the next few days, giving her your address where to send a present, you will be assigned a Santee - someone you send a present to, and someone else (your Secret Santa) will send you a present, but you won't know who it is. A lot of the fun is in the hints threads where people try to work out who their Secret Santa is in the weeks leading up to Christmas.

Anyway, enjoy all the ups and downs here - a bit like real life, really!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Big Mick
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 11:12 AM

I would love to go to Loughstock, Maryrrf, and had planned to go this year. But difficulties with my career have me in a bit of a tizz just now. Hopefully next year, unless this works out in time.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 11:20 AM

I'm most certainly not a fundamentalist, in that I will listen to almost anything and play quite a range, but I do believe that a definition is a definition. Only folk music is folk music. A fundamentalist would assert that only folk music is music, and that folk music or his/her folk music was better than anyone else's folk music. I ascribe to neither of the latter views. I do believe that some folk music is more appropriate to some performers than others.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: kendall
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 11:32 AM

Willy O, Brevity is the soul of wit.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Ron Davies
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 11:44 AM

Welcome!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 12:00 PM

One warning: do NOT try to define folk music. You will pay heavily for that effort.

PS, Tom Paxton is a folk singer and folk-song writer.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: SINSULL
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 12:07 PM

John - we would all like to get to know you better.
SO:
What do you think about George Bush, the war in Iraq, the situation in Palestine, Star Trek, banjos, the World Trade Center (Terrorists or Bush Demolition), the Orange, Israel, Bob Dylan, Neil Young, etc.

Don't be shy. Jump in and choose your weapons but please leave Blue Clickies. Do not cut and paste.
And when you are ready for a rest Nurse Ratchet will fix you a nice quiet room at the Center.

Do you play the banjo?
SINS


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Alice
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 12:12 PM

Welcome! Learn to search the forum discussions and you will find a huge amount of information compiled over the years.

Have fun.

Alice Flynn


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Mo the caller
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 04:51 PM

Welcome from Mo
the one in the red jacket


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Pistachio
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:31 PM

John, I hope you put a tracer on this thread! The comments here make very informative reading and I've found out loads I wasn't aware of thanks to your post. I've been 'on' mudcat for about 3 years now, I find it amazing, I have to remember to check the clock and log out, it's so easy to read post after post .............. .
I'll add my welcome - and close now.
Hazel.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: billybob
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 05:42 PM

Welcome.
go to the kitchen table
lovely folk
put the coffee on and read the great posts
nice folks and good friends
Wendy


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Roughyed
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 06:02 PM

Welcome Ositojuanito.

When my daughter was in trouble and danger it was someone from the Mudcat who sent me a personal message offering to give practical help. In my experience this is the closest you will find to a real community on the Net. It has been a completely positive experience for me. Treat the idiots as a comedy turn, tap into the knowledge and wisdom that abound and enjoy!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 06:03 PM

Welcome! Mudcat at its best is generous, fun, informative, and it's great to meet other 'Catters when travelling and at festivals/gatherings. Ignore the trolls and flamers and enjoy this community, I say. Second JennyO's motion about joining in on Secret Santa.

Chanteyranger


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: John O'L
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 07:29 PM

I didn't know anything like it existed and I would love to see being fully developed.


Can't tell if that's a backhanded compliment or a backhanded insult, therefore it's perfect. Welcome aboard.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Beer
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:32 PM

There is always room for another Irishman. Enjoy your stay.
Beer
from Montreal


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Tannywheeler
Date: 24 Sep 06 - 09:48 PM

This joint is proof that warmth, kindness, justice, and brilliance is rife the world round. 99% of 'em are chock full of it. Welcome home. Up the Republic......Tw


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: fat B****rd
Date: 25 Sep 06 - 03:04 PM

May I add my greetings. All the best from Charlie S.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: gnu
Date: 25 Sep 06 - 04:39 PM

Goodiness gracious! I am sure there is a great deal of wisdom and good sense advice in all of the above posts. I may even read them all some day if I get that much time.

Welcome. You have just found a great bunch of knowledgible and friendly folk. You are as lucky as we. Enjoy.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 25 Sep 06 - 09:27 PM

Yes.

Art


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 25 Sep 06 - 11:59 PM

I didn't know it was lost.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 04:05 AM

There are worse things to care passionately about than music. I suppose we are all here because music sustains us in our daily lives.

Sometimes I feel guilty about the shitty things I occasionally say on mudcat. Its a very responsive website and sometimes it takes you down a well earned peg or two.

Richard for example, cares deeply about what he sees as folk music.

I don't agree with a word of what he says about the nature of folk music. As far as I'm concerned Cccil Sharp House is a populated by a gang of middle class bores who are too collectively dim to notice that that the English people have voted with their feet and gone on to enjoy their vibrant folk culture virtually anywhere they can, outside the environs of what is called traditional folk music.

Views that vary as widely as ours are bound to spark off each other - particularly as the views we hold are the mainsprings of our creative endeavours. And because of that I sincerely regret that respect sometimes gets lost in these heated exchanges.

if you come across us hitting each other with our handbags - just tell us to cut it out, and grow up!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Black Diamond
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 09:28 AM

oh ---- what has Osito juanito got that I havent got????
when I joined Mudcat just a few short weeks ago I never got bombarded by all these good wishes and other things!! I remeber just one or two very nuce people saying hi and welcome, and that was it!!
I think I will just go and sit in a corner and sob my hear out.
aha -- is it cos Im a melodeonist and not a singer I wonder????
Black Diamond


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: jacqui.c
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 09:44 AM

Welcome to you too Black Diamond.

Mudcat can be a very noisy place and sometimes you have to shout to make yourself heard.

I hope that you enjoy the site.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: George Seto - af221@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 09:49 AM

Sorry about that, Black Diamond. We do like to welcome all newcomers, even though some of us don't do the welcoming (like myself). I think it's just that a chord was struck with the definition of folk as that always brings lots of comment. So welcome to you and all new people to the Mudcat! As others have said, it is quite addictive. So share your knowledge and if you need a question answered, please feel free to ask! However, pleas try to do some searching first. We might have one or more set of messages already started. You might have a great new insight into something there.e


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: MuddleC
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 11:59 AM

..ositojuanito..just listen to the sound of my voice......
you are not feeling grumpy anymore... you are feeling sleepy, soon your eyes will become heavy, your eyelids drop and you will be in a deep sleep.....
when you awake all of this will have been naught but a dream..
.....
...
awake!

-there's a couple of Sheriff's Deputies outside wanting to speak to you about dwarf harassment

-all this is in your mind of course, take this site with a BIG pinch of salt!
(may contain bovine products, traces of nuts and monosodium glutamate, eat before sell by date, close cover before striking, mind the doors, not microwave proof)
may be recorded for training and security purposes


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: MMario
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:02 PM

welcome to all the newbies! Sometimes people slip in and you don't notice they are new - this is a good thing, really - others get noticed for some reason or another.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Mo the caller
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:05 PM

Welcome all new cats on the block.
Black Diamond is kidding us, she did get welcomed, but only by the techy people who answer the sort of thread she started. I never read tech threads, my answer to all problems is to ask my son-in-law!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: wysiwyg
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:08 PM

I said hello to BD and even had a chat about the name and its link to a favorite song-- BD = coal, right?

~S~


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:41 PM

What WLD overlooks (or omits to mention) is that I too participate in enjoy and value the types of music he wants to call folk. I just maintain they are not folk.

OK, there are some exceptions, the bits I don't much enjoy - quite a lot of what now gets called mobo, (although I like quite a lot of old tamla and soul as it used to be, up to an including the Pointer Sisters, and gospel-tinged like the Staple Singers) and the ceaseless tired iterations of punk, which once was so refreshing and inspiring, and whining crap like Oasis, oh, and I pretty much hate all westry and c***tron - but other than that I will listen to sometimes enjoy and occasionally perform (in some cases) pretty well anything.

However, I remember that I am not Irish or American.

Oh, I forgot, I hate,hate,hate taht damn Lilly Allen track...


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:46 PM

Is this not BS too?


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: open mike
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:52 PM

hello from california little john bear


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:56 PM

Welcome, welcome, welcome to all of the newbies!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Mr Yellow
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:59 PM

ositojuanito

I think you will find that - pedants lurk and will tell you that Louis Armstrong didn't claim to be original when he said the bit about Horses.

Big Bill Broonzy said it, and I seem to remember someone claimed Buddy Bolden said it but as he was too early or black to have been recorded it may be just one of those anecodotes.

So watch-out for the pedants - they KNOW what they KNOW, unfortunately they may not know what they don't know. I know that for a fact...................


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: The Shambles
Date: 27 Sep 06 - 07:13 PM

Talking of pedants.

Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: John 'Giok' MacKenzie - PM
Date: 26 Sep 06 - 12:46 PM

Is this not BS too?

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Seemingly this thread has not been judged so – but it has been judged (by virtue only that it remains in the music section) to be music related.

Unlike this one Just found Mudcat too. Which although there is no editing comment to explain why or who made this judgement – has been judged to be BS and relgated to the BS section.

Along with this one When was Mudcat lost?


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Black Diamond
Date: 28 Sep 06 - 06:46 AM

yeh yeh course I was only joking. after all you did say not to take anything too seriously!! LOL although I dont post too often I read avidly and am very very impressed with mudcats peeples - everyone very helpful anf friendly!!3
Black Diamond


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: John J
Date: 28 Sep 06 - 08:41 AM

Welcome....there's no escape.

The Mudcat; you'll never leave.

John


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: MMario
Date: 28 Sep 06 - 08:41 AM

too true - the BORG have nothing on mudcat.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Effsee
Date: 28 Sep 06 - 09:17 AM

Or Hotel California!


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Gurney
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 03:06 AM

Susan, I should think that on this site, Black Diamond = Strings!
You must play something with reeds.


All newbys will learn to proofread, to think twice about possibly controversial posts before clicking submit, to grow a thicker skin, and not to post when pissed (both English or American variants.) As in life, sensitive flowers will become upset.
Oh, and female posters do not have to hide their gender here, and often don't. That should tell you something about the membership.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: skarpi
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 06:45 AM

hallo john , and warm welcome to the Mudcat town .

I hope you like here , I have been here for eight years
so I must like it :>)

its good to see an Islander like me .

All the best Skarpi from Iceland


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Mr Red
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 09:00 AM

ositojuanito - you have the flavour of the place by now.

If you want a comparison to put this zany, erudite, flippant yet serious enclave into perspective - look at others (eg BBC) that might appear to be folky and worldly and methinks you will be back here for respite care.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: pavane
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 09:26 AM

BBC? Folky? Since when?


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 09:53 AM

It's so nice of you all to welcome someone who joined 18 months ago and hasn't posted for 6 months.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Peace
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 09:55 AM

Well, let me be the last in a long list of folks to welcome the--did HG Wells write about this guy?


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Amos
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 10:23 AM

I guess y'all must have scared the lad away with all that hooting. Ya think?


A


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: skarpi
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 10:30 AM

just to get it out , that the gathering that has happen in Portaferry
Co.Down maybe in Dublin next year ?? thats something we have to sort out
in time ,.

but who know s .............. we´ll see

All the best Skarpi Iceland


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Jeri
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 10:33 AM

I dunno. Spam has time-folding properties though. Somebody lobs a wad of spam, and all of a sudden we're back in the yesters. There should be a study done... or at least Gurney could add 'check the date' to his list of newbie do's...
Strangers on the web, exchanging e-mail
Oh what a surprise,
You thought I was female
...newbie, newbie do, etc.

I wonder if John's still around.


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Charley Noble
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 10:33 PM

If you've really just found Mudcat, the important thing to do is to feed it. Mudcats are an intergalectically endangered specie. You will reap what you will sow, or is it rape what you will sew?

Charley Noble


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: Amos
Date: 13 Mar 08 - 10:37 PM

Or you will rope whom you sue....


A


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Subject: RE: Just found Mudcat
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 12:21 AM

No, isn't it rape (seed) that you sow, Charley?**bg**


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