Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.

Subject: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 01:56 PM

Twenty years ago I used to sing my heart out and was actually asked, frequently, to perform. I became allergic to cigarette smoke some 5yrs after giving up smoking.....smoking took its toll on me, wrecked my voice and...consequently also sapped my confidence....I still sing occasionally but am not happy with how I perform.
When considering organising Folk venues/Festivals/gathers (In the UK of course)....please at least consider having a NON-SMOKING room or area where people who are...like me..now allergic to cigarette smoke can attend without fear of being poisoned by other people.
Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: kendall
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 01:59 PM

5 years after I quit I developed throat cancer. Radiation and surgery gave me an excellent chance for survival, but my singing voice is gone forever. It's the main reason I didn't go to the Getaway this year.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:01 PM

Make the whole thing non-smoking.... let the scum-bags go outside the event to poison themselves.

I'm an occasional smoker, who will HAPPILY step outside the pub to have a smoke.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:03 PM

Kendall... don't give up.... John Prine fought throat cancer and won, but found it VERY difficult to sing for quite a while...

And when he could sing, his voice was VERY different. He joked recently about how he had to go back and relearn a LOT of his old material, in new keys for his new voice.

Maybe yours just hasn't been delivered yet

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Mrs Scarecrow
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:03 PM

I gave up smoking only two years ago and am delighted with how much my voice has improved. If I had realised what a good effect it would have I would have given up before

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:07 PM

Interesting - I did a gig with the band in a smoky pub last night and what I noticed was that my voice became a bit croaky later in the evening. It can't have been the amount of singing I did, because I only sang a handful of songs during a fairly long set of largely instrumental stuff we did, so I probably sang about half a dozen songs spread over about 3 hours.

Can smoke affect your voice like that? I guess it could have been a coincidence, but I don't have any reason to think it was anything else.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:08 PM

'Smoke can damage your voice.'
As well as getting in your eyes!
Move to Ireland; we've had a no-smoking policy here for a couple of years and it works like a dream.
No more sore eyes, wheezy chests and going home smelling like a used ash-tray.
Long may it stay that way.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:12 PM

Its not only your throat.

I am 8 years clear from Bladder cancer cuased by smoking.
So think about it folkies, if you would like to have a camera stuck into your bladder through your willie, then carry on smoking. Same goes for you women. It doesn't end when you are clear, you have to go back on at least once a year to have it stuck up again, to see if it is still clear.

Protect the performer and the audience.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:12 PM

" Can smoke affect your voice like that?"

If the poisons and gunk coming off the lit end of a cigarette were present down a mine shaft or in a foundry, in even half the quanties, no bugger in the civilized world would be allowed to work there.

So yes, 2nd hand smoke CAN affect your voice like that

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:14 PM

"Bladder cancer cuased by smoking"

Who told you that it was CAUSED by smoking? They were likely fulla skite. They cannot say that THIS caused your cancer HERE or THERE in ANY situation....

Otherwise, only smokers would get lung cancer.

So, while I'm all in favour of non-smoking, lets not fall victim to erroneous information.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:15 PM

Kendall, I hope that Clinton is correct in what he points out. (bless you, child Clinton) I keep remembering the true note you brought out a few months ago, and it seems evident that if ONE true note is there, there are others.

And if not? Well, there are worse things, and maybe there are ways of meeting the challenges.

What if a combination of proper amplifying and recording systems can be instituted to present the voice you now have? You could bring out a unique album of stories and songs that we - and you - would love.

It might take a studio approach but I'll bet it has been done. And if not, SOMEBODY'S got to be the first one.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:19 PM

Scotland too for non-smoking venues (some clubs were smoke-free by mutual consent even before the ban.)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Shaneo
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:28 PM

The Irish smoking ban has really worked to the advantage of the singers who preform in pubs/clubs
I am the singer/guitar player of a ballad/folk group and 3 out of the four of us smoke.
A few years ago before the ban we would be chocked by smoke from other peoples fags and even our own sitting in the ash-tray.
Them days are long gone now and we just go outside for a smoke about 3 times during a 2 hour session,,
Is the ban coming soon in the UK ?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bernard
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 02:34 PM

Whether you smoke or not, cancer will get you if it's your turn...

I'm a life-long non-smoker, and find the people who have given up smoking tend to be the most vociferous about non-smoking establishments...

I have recently lost two close friends to lung cancer - one was a smoker, the other wasn't. They were both in their mid-forties... so make of that what you will.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:08 PM

Clinton
Its not erronious info. I went private with a top consultant, who said it was one of two things. 1. Working in a chemical factory for and being exposed to them or 2. Smoking and I used to smoke 50 a day when I was 30.
I was diagnosed when I was 52 and was one of the younger people to get it. He was certain it was through smoking.
If you would like to disgree with my consultant, I will willingly send you by PM his name and contact.
He is a top guy and did a brilliant job for me and was well respected in the trade so to speak.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:15 PM

"He was certain it was through smoking."
He was certain he was justifying the size of his bill is what he was certan of....

http://www.cancerhelp.org.uk/help/default.asp?page=119

It's a lot of guess-work in a white labcoat

" I used to smoke 50 a day"
Where the hell did you find time to do anything else?!?! LOL It's not uncommon for a pack of 25 to last me two weeks...

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,memyself
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:17 PM

I'm sure he'd love to hear from Clinton ...

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:23 PM

LOL
I don't smoke anymore, stopped 30 years ago, thank goodness.

My job in those days required a lot of writing with me right hand, whilst my left held the fag. It was dead easy LOL The job was so bloody stressful and everybody else in the rest of the office smoked like chimneys. Its terrible to think of it now LOL

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:24 PM

>>I'm sure he'd love to hear from Clinton ... <<

NOT LOL :-)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:25 PM

The very thought of 50 smokes a day makes me wanna barf up a large chunk of my colon....

yuuch

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:25 PM

Well,I am very pleased to say I am agreeing with Jim Carroll. The Smoking ban in IRELAND has made my job a lot more pleasant .
   However carbon monoxide fumes are carconogenic as well. Dick Miles

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:28 PM

How do you get your bladder to smoke? This could eb interesting.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bernard
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:29 PM

Set fire to it...!! '0)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: melodeonboy
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:37 PM

I can't wait for the smoking ban that's due to start in England next year. I perform regularly in one capacity or another and apart from the sheer unpleasantness of cigarette smoke (especially those bloody ready-made things with the extra nasty chemicals to make them burn - saltpetre, is it?), it does affect my ability to sing. In the short term it makes me cough, sneeze and choke, and in the long term it makes me lose my voice (yes, I know there are some of you out there who think that might not be such a bad thing!). It also means that I often spend the following morning coughing repeatedly, and, in severe cases, I can hardly speak.

This results in my attending fewer "dos". If I've been in a smoky atmosphere for two nights on the trot, I would then probably not go to venues where smoking is permitted for the next two or three nights.

This is not my being PC, by the way. It's just telling it as it is.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:39 PM

I was 52 when I was diagnosed

Here you go from BUPA

Causes and risk factors
Bladder cancer usually forms from the cells inside the bladder. It is mainly a disease of older people. Half of bladder tumours occur in people over the age of 70 and the disease is very rare in people under 40 years of age.

The exact causes of bladder cancer are not clear, but smoking is an important avoidable cause of the disease. Cancer-causing chemicals in tobacco smoke are absorbed into the blood, filtered out by the kidneys and then, as a part of the urine, stored in the bladder. In the long term, this appears to cause damage to the bladder lining. Smokers are two to three times more likely to develop bladder cancer than non smokers.

Environmental factors can also increase the risk of developing bladder cancer. These include certain chemicals once used in the rubber, paint, dye, printing and textile industries.

A family history of the disease, or chronic infection with the tropical diseases bilharzia also increase the risk of bladder cancer.



The last two paragraphs were not applicable.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:42 PM

By the way, if anybody p[lays golf, then a great way to beat your opponent if you are behind, is to tell your opponent all about how they go up your willie (especially when they are playing their shot).

Works every time LOL :-)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:45 PM

" The exact causes of bladder cancer are not clear"

Because the exact cause of ANY cancer isn't clear....

so....

"smoking is an important avoidable cause of the disease"

... is the STOCK answer whenever the subject of cancer prevention comes up, because there seems to be a lot of evidence that it at least contributes....

But there's no way ANY doctor worth his salt will tell you "Smoking CAUSED your bladder cancer". It probably didn't HURT your chances of getting cancer, however.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bernard
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:46 PM

Erm, isn't that cheating, Les?!! ;0)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:47 PM

OK Clinton, tell me what caused it then.

Too much shagging

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Morticia
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:48 PM

I certainly noticed the difference when smokers were, politely, requested to step outside in the Middle Bar in Sidmouth. My voice used to last 3 days.....it stretched to 5. When I gave up myself ( dear heavens, nearly 2 years ago now) it went to 7, no bother.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:48 PM

Yes Bernard but it was great fun doing it with my mates LOL

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Joybell
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 03:49 PM

Of course there are other carcinogens around like carbon monoxide - but -- and it's a big but - We don't shut ourselves into rooms full of running cars.
There are many studies out there on cancers in locations other than the respiratory system which suggest a link to cigarette smoke. Bladder and breast cancer are among them.

Over a singing career that spans 40 years I've heard all the arguments from smokers about why I have to put up with their habit. It's been 30 years since I was able to accept invitations to gatherings in restaurants, pubs, (and private homes where smoking is allowed). I have permanant breathing problems from working in smoke - as a singer and also as a nurse.
The ban didn't come soon enough for me. I am glad it came in time for my grandchildren.
Cheers, Joy

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:05 PM

"tell me what caused it then"

Read your own post.....

"The exact causes of bladder cancer are not clear"

"which suggest a link"
And the key word there is SUGGEST.... We simply don't KNOW yet.... Hopefully one day we will.

So keep donating $$ to cancer research
Quit smoking
Get some exercise
Eat a ballance diet
Support the ban on smoking in public spaces. (Smoking in a car or house where children are passangers/residents should be classified as child abuse if you ask me!)

You'll still drop dead someday.... but maybe it won't be cancer that gets you.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bernard
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:06 PM

I once read that barbecue food had sufficient benzopyrenes to be considered just as dangerous as smoking...

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bernard
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:08 PM

Read this!

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:24 PM

When I started this thread the reason was my concern for people who suffer voice problems through smoking or smoke inhalation but it is sure interesting how the thread has developed. Thanks you for the interest.
Smoking and smoke inhalation have caused damage to the membranes in my nose and made me susceptible to infection in the ear/nose/throat/chest as a result. I have become very catarrhal and need to swallow heavy mucous as it runs down my throat from my nasal cavity as a matter of course. To swallow in the middle of a song is dashed inconvenient and to have lost some of the power I had in my voice even more so.....anyone else in the same situation?
Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:39 PM

So you are a snot gobbler then Mike :-)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:40 PM

Fraid so Les....makes life a little difficult but I get by. At least it's my own snot eh?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: kendall
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:41 PM

Clinton, I wasn't aware of John Prine's recovery. Thanks. A bit of encouragement is always welcome.

I've had three top drawer specialists tell me that the type of cancer I had, Squamous cell carcinoma, is caused by chemicles such as those in cigarettes, and they are cock sure of that. The evidence is that it attacked my throat instead of my naughty bits, or some other part.
I don't know, but I do know they are more qualified than I to make such a statement.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 04:46 PM

to joybell,
I am a nonsmoker and am very pleased about the non smoking ban. I have chosen to live in rural ireland, where there is very little carbon monoxide, but last time I walked down LONDON BRIDGE one misty morning early, I was overpowered by car fumes, Its just as much of a problem as cigarette smoke.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 05:56 PM

"I wasn't aware of John Prine's recovery."
Hie thee hence and lay hands upon his last CD mate, "Fair And Square"

If you havn't heard it, there's really no point in even having ears, unless you really need them to hold your glasses on your face....

:-)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 06:17 PM

"I am a nonsmoker and am very pleased about the non smoking ban. I have chosen to live in rural ireland, where there is very little carbon monoxide, but last time I walked down LONDON BRIDGE one misty morning early, I was overpowered by car fumes, Its just as much of a problem as cigarette smoke."

I agree with you Cap'n (another first).
However, it seems the great and the good are only capable of concentrating on one thing at a time, so for the present, let's be grateful for small mercies.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 06:29 PM

In Oz smoking has been progressively banned in most indoor venues (businesses, shopping centres, restaurants, clubs, pubs) in most states. I don't know the exact details as I gave up smoking in 1976 & haven't spent much time in to pubs since our singing session died a few years ago when the new publican used our room as a Pool/Gambling, oops 'Gaming', room.

Sydney's best pub venue for folk has been non-smoking since the folk concerts started 4 or 5 years ago cos the organiser demands a non-smoking venue for his concerts. As the bar is next to the concert venue, smokers don't miss anything.

Oz's National Folk Festival Guiness Session Bar has also been non-smoking for the last few years due to the efforts of a folkie with a life-long immune deficiency who is severely allergic to a lot of things including cigarette smoke. Everyone knows that if someone smokes the bar will be closed immediately, and this keeps the place smoke free! Smokers congregate outside & everyone is happy.

More folk clubs are in community halls than in pubs so performers & audiences are in smoke-fre environments.

I remember the days of leaving clothes in the bathroom to air, & washing my hair before going to bed cos I smelled like an ashtray.

sandra

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rumncoke
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 06:34 PM

Tobacco smoke certainly affects me - even if the bar is suposed to be non smoking - like the middle bar in Sidmouth, there is almost always someone who thinks it doesn't apply to them and I have had many an evening ruined by being unable to escape at once when someone lights up close by. Even worse are the times when someone is so close by that their smoke sets me off coughing and I have to get out into the open air - even if it is in the middle of someone's song.

I have even had someone enquiring if I was alright whilst holding a cigarette within inches of my face, and then burn my arm as I forced their hand away.

Inhaling even a small amount of tobacco smoke wipes out the upper half of my vocal range for several hours.

Anne

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 06:34 PM

"Its just as much of a problem as cigarette smoke."
It's actually MUCH bigger... But being a much bigger problem, it also needs a MUCH bigger solution.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: gnu
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 06:36 PM

It should be "more illegal" than any other drug. Fred Flinstone suckered me into it when I was five years old. I'd like to kick his sorry ass. But, he's rich.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,harvey andrews
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 06:52 PM

After over 20 years of working in smoky folk clubs I developed asthma. Now one cigar can close my throat, also candles on tables or cigarettes and perfumes. I began requesting no smoking at my gigs and found I lost work and suffered abuse for my request. I remember one internet thread where a guy posted about a gig I had done in the North East of England at his folk club. He said I went round putting up posters demanding non-smoking (actually the posters read "For medical reasons the artist politely requests no smoking") and that his wife smoked even more that night in protest. This was some years ago. Now all my gigs are non-smoking because most folk clubs operate that policy. One club posted that after my night the committee met and decided it was so much nicer that they would make no smoking club policy. Next August all gigs will be smoke free by law. It's been a long battle and at a cost to me, and other artists with similar problems, but it's a battle good as won, and I'm glad for those young performers who will be working in smoke free environments in the future.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: kendall
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 07:25 PM

The big difference between the exhaust fumes and tobacco smoke is, you don't HAVE to smoke.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Dartford Warbler
Date: 06 Nov 06 - 07:40 PM

A couple of artists appearing at Dartford Folk Club requested that people at the front of house should refrain from smoking. The organisers decided that should be the case every folk club night. Smokers go to the back rows. It works well but then it is a large venue.

Roll on August 2007 in the UK! (IMHO)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 02:45 AM

Two examples of how well the smoking ban has worked in Ireland.
On several occasions we have driven through towns here late (2-am - 2.30am) to find illegal drinkers huddled outside pubs having a smoke - it's apparently ok to drink after hours, but......
Just after the ban was implemented one of our local bars organised a week-end away in Lewes, Sussex. One of the group persistently went outside for a smoke, and on being told that he didn't need to do this in Lewes he said, "It doesn't feel right anymore".
I agree with Cap'n Birdseye (a first) about carbon monoxide emissions, but as the great and the good who reign over us seem only to be capable of getting their heads around one problem at a time, let us be grateful for small mercies (for the time being) and not divert the attention away from one problem partially solved by pointing out another one.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: The Barden of England
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 02:49 AM

Damn - I thought the ban was coming to England in June next year - oh well.
I'm an ex-smoker who suffers in smokey places, so try wherever possible to avoid them as it does affect my voice something cronic. Forunately most folk clubs these days tend to have a no smoking policy which suits me - but as an ex smoker I try not to be 'holier than the next man' but it's sometimes difficult when a cigarette is burning in an ashtray and the smoke seems to be attracted to you.
John Barden

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 03:37 AM

Well, Melodeonboy, it doesn't seem to affect Growler (Chimney) Barlow - or to stop you sitting next to him seemingly by choice....

You may have noticed I generally don't, but I wouldn't be so rude as to ask him not to.

Or indeed Jeff RIPOHMS.

As an ex-smoker whose wife's death was probably caused by two main factors - smoking and Medway Maritime Hospital (with a bit of help from another doctor who made a disastrous choice of treatment for her migraines so causing the start of COPD and cerebellar ataxia) - I assert a smoker's liberty to do something that affects them more than anyone else, and the non-smokers' rights to shun them - but not to cast them out.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: kendall
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 09:25 AM

What would happen if you were to light up a piece of rubber, or an old army blanket in a public place? Is there a difference?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Scrump
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 09:44 AM

Between rubber and an old army blanket?

Ah... I'll get me coat.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Hamish
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 11:18 AM

I went to an open mic a while back and there was a young girl who sang and she had a lovely voice. I noticed afterwards that she was smoking. "That'll wreck your voice" I opined. To which she said that she reckoned it improved her voice. Made it a little husky. A bit fuller, perhaps. Maybe she was right. But it's a fool's short term answer at best. "Listen to Joni Mitchell" I said. One of the finest voices in her prime: trashed to blazes now. And she's only 63.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 11:23 AM

Only... heh

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: melodeonboy
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 11:41 AM

Well, Richard, I suspect that it does actually affect Growler, but I'll leave Growler and his doctor to answer that one for you.

As for sitting next to him by choice, usually I don't. Growler (all round good bloke and gentleman that he is) knows my views on the subject and does not get upset when I move away from him - as I usually do if there's space available - and he often moves away from me to spare me the discomfort. I also do my very best not to make an issue of it in places where smoking is permitted, as it is my choice to come to a smoking venue in the first place. Hence my previous comments about how much I'm looking forward to the smoking ban and the fact that I often stay at home rather than going to a folk club if I know it's going to be smoky.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bernard
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 12:47 PM

Rosie Hardman retired from public performance mainly because she could no longer tolerate tobacco smoke - even in small doses. She'd developed some sort of allergy to it.

She says that even if the concert was 'non smoking', the fact that the stage crew had been smoking a couple of hours before the sound check was enough to set her off.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Joybell
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 04:18 PM

My reaction to cigarette smoke is the same as Anne's and Mike's. The damage done to my respiratory system (and my voice) was caused by smokers. I had no choice except that of not working, (and that includes working in hospitals) shopping, attending social functions, lectures, visits to friends....
I have never been rude or aggressive when asking smokers to keep their smoke away from me. Nor have I been anything but nice about asking if a venue was smoke-free.
I wish I could say the same about some of the smokers I met in the course of my work. I have had smoke blown into my face deliberately.
Put up with endless tirades about "smokers rights". Smoking has never been a "right". Breathing is a right.
Endured nasty, sneaky behaviour - like smokers hiding their cigarettes while smoking in non-smoking areas - then producing them with a grin and a flourish.
I've been called "intolerant" "a whinger" "misinformed" "stupid" - given the red-herring argument.
Thank you, Mike for this thread. For allowing me to rave a bit. Thank you for sharing.
Cheers, Joy

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Nov 06 - 04:37 PM

After 25 plus years of smoking, I quit more than 25 years ago. When someone is smoking outdoors I still kind of like the smell. However, these days, indoors- and when I can't get away - I get somewhat choked up. A few years back I didn't. Do most ex-smokers get more sensitive to it as they age, I wonder?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 02:59 AM

Thanks you for the PMs and for all the relevant thoughts on the thread. Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 03:44 AM

A footnote to the smoking ban.
In the old days, if you were in a session in a smoky pub you would nip out for a breath of fresh air - nowadays you stay inside for the fresh air and go outside to be choked.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Scrump
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 04:43 AM

Roll on August 2007 in the UK! (IMHO)

And IMHO too! Hopefully that will be in time for Broadstairs, so I won't get almost asphyx... aspic... asfix... suffocated like I did in one or two venues there last time.

Meanwhile, I suppose I could buy one of those army surplus gas masks and don it while singing in pubs - might sound a bit muffled though

:-)

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: ossonflags
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 11:34 AM

I can only speak from experiance and what others tell me. I stopped smoking seven months ago -had smoked very heavilly for fifty years - decided I enjoyed singing more than I enjoyed smoking.

Now I know there is an improvement in my voice and better than that other people tell me that there is.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Anne Lister
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 01:53 PM

All I know is that I developed asthma at the age of 27, not necessarily connected to smoking (and I have never smoked myself) but to all manner of other allergens (dust, feathers, wool, pollens, fur etc), and from that date on I have noticed a significant increase in my breathing problems if anyone is smoking around me. Which of course affects the voice as well as my respiratory system.

So whether or not people want to accept the link with cigarettes and cancer is immaterial to me - there's definitely a link between tobacco smoke (and incense sticks) and the quality of my breathing and my voice. I'm sure all manner of other fumes are unhealthy too, and I, too, notice the difference between my lungs when I'm here in South Wales and when we're visiting London, but this thread is about smoking and I'm not sure why smokers get quite so aggressive about it all. I can't imagine that smokers who love music really want to hear their favourite singers cough and splutter, but maybe they get some kind of thrill from that?

Anne

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 02:06 PM

"I'm not sure why smokers get quite so aggressive about it all."

Addiction is a scary thing. It takes away a persons will.

At least that's what it seems like to me, but then again, I'm not an addict.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Mick Tems
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 02:31 PM

Llantrisant Folk Club holds meetings in a non-smoking room for nigh on eight years now, and the members like it and appreciate it. The Welsh Assembly has banned smoking in public places, and we're looking forward to next spring when we can enjoy clean air.

Lucky musicians used to play in Bermuda, and tales were legion about Bermuda Folk Club. It seemed that they banned smoking - even though the club met on the beach, in the open air!

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: The Sandman
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 04:00 PM

cigarette smoke, candle fumes, car exhaust fumes, are all bad for singers    voices,. If I smoked I wouldnt have the volume, and the range that I have.
How can professional folk singers afford to smoke anyhow.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: kendall
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 04:12 PM

We can't. My income took a nose dive when I lost my voice.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 11:05 PM

ANOTHER coulda, woulda, shoulda, outa.

PATHETIC - (this is sort of dribble drunkards drabble in their latter years)

smoking wrecked my voice and sapped my confidence

If you do not begin, TODAY, IMMEDIATELY, you will continue to sink deeper into "The Hole."

At some point, (and in your case it appears sooner than later) you WILL succumb.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

GeorgianSilver = 0

Smirnoff and distributors = 56.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 11:08 PM

Try "red-man" or "day's work"

When you gotta spit...just lay it on the keyboard...90% of the Mudcatter do, due, dew.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: The Sandman
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 04:11 AM

gargoyle.The sounds of silence.Hello darkness my old friend.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 09:35 AM

And I had always considered gargoyles as some bitter, twisted, gnarled looking projections on Cathedrals and Churches....where on earth did I get that from?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Scoville
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 02:24 PM

I'm surprised that anyone was surprised by this. Really, inhaling any kind of smoke/air pollution is bad for you, in a lot of different ways both short-term and long-term (allergies, asthma, cancer, etc.). There's even some evidence that pets of smokers are more likely to get cancer because they not only inhale it but lick it when they bathe themselves. Of course, I grew up in/around big cities with bad air so I'll probably get lung cancer anyway.

I'm not even particularly sensitive to smoke (no allergies, asthma, etc.) and I'm not a singer but it does irritate me if I have to sit in it all evening.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 02:30 PM

"pets of smokers are more likely to get cancer"

Why anyone would smoke in their own home is beyond me... why not rub shit directly on the walls while you're at it......

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Nov 06 - 04:36 PM

Bobby Sands did. Didn't he?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 10 Nov 06 - 06:47 PM

OOOOOH

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Kaleea
Date: 10 Nov 06 - 08:27 PM

Ditto what Anne said!! I moved to San Diego after many years in the "midwest" USA & no longer have to stay away from many places because of the smoke. A few months ago, for the first time in many many years, I began to accept invitations to sing/play without having to ask about smoke as there is no smoking indoors in any public place (legally, that is).
Just imagine the shock & awe of my pals back in the "Bible Belt" when a few months ago I emailed several of 'em pics of me singing & playing in a well known BAR in the hip Ocean Beach area!! They're probably still praying for my lost soul.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 11 Nov 06 - 10:59 AM

Livin' sure does lead to dyin'

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 12 Nov 06 - 09:55 AM

Sho as this thread is livin' itsa gonna die eh?

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Rasener
Date: 13 Nov 06 - 01:30 AM

Went to the bowling Alley in Lincoln yesterday.

Amazing smoking rules.

No Smoking in most of the building. Smoking allowed in the areas where you sit whilst bowling. Now that makes sense to me NOT.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,Bellatrix
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 03:46 PM

Right i just read some comments because i needed to know if it can damage your voice (need to know for college because i do performing arts) i just wanted to know ways you can damage your voice but i do not fully understand can it or can it not damage your voice because i smoke but appperently i have a nice voice so i dont know.

also Clinton Hammond sounds a bit like a lawyer talking about erroneous charges :) x

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: acegardener
Date: 03 Nov 10 - 05:53 PM

I gave up smoking because I do not like wearing cheap white trainers which seems to be the uniform of the smokers who stand puffing outside of pub doorways.

A bye product of doing this is that my singing voice has improved no end. I shall never be a 3 octave Orbison, but after a lifetime of growling out the pub favorites, I can now sing a sweet ballad when the occasion arrises.

Don't smoke, you know it makes sense. Nat King Cole smoked to get a distinct sound, but what a price he paid.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,kendall
Date: 04 Nov 10 - 07:42 AM

First, IQ has nothing to do with smoking. Some of the most intelligent people smoke.
It is denial, pure and simple. "It won't happen to me, I'm special."

People smoke to avoid the discomfort of not smoking. Anyone who says he/she enjoys it is fooling themselves.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Pierre Le Chapeau
Date: 04 Nov 10 - 08:46 PM

I smoke and I enjoy it?
Im sorry Kendell but you do not know me from Adam so what do you know of me "Fooling my self?

but I dont drive a car,
How many of you people on this thread drive.How many of you folk have two cars? but you cant compare car polution and the efects it has on people because driving a car is a nessesity. Really.

My throut is often lined with petrol fumes I can tatse it in the air

I have to breath in your poisionous fumes and Petrol AND Fosile fuel fumes are far more bloody leathal to me and above all the planet then a cigerette smoke.
kindest regards to all Pierre.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 05 Nov 10 - 08:30 AM

Smoking has great potential to shorten the lives and/or destroy the voices of people who smoke.

Kendall and Tom (Curmudgeon) know all too well what smoking can do to voices.

Linn

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: maple_leaf_boy
Date: 10 Dec 10 - 11:59 AM

At home, our smoking ban came into full effect in December 2007. One bar I used to frequent, the vast majority of people who went there
smoked. The last night that smoking was legal in bars, the place was
packed all night. There was another bar that I frequented afterwards
that allowed smoking on the patio, and you could take your drink outside
with you. That was nice for some people who like to have a smoke with
their beer.

Smoking regulations are getting even stricter now. I think it used to be 10 feet away from doors and windows everywhere you go. Now a lot
of places don't allow it on the property, or they have a designated
area. And the taxes went up again this year, and some tobacco brands
are increasing their wholesale prices.

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Jack Campin
Date: 05 Dec 11 - 06:44 PM

smoking can make your nipples fall off

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: Fossil
Date: 05 Dec 11 - 07:11 PM

Dear Pierre Le Hat, I am sure your reference to "fossil fuel fumes" wasn't aimed at me, so I'll let it pass...

Just watch it, though!

Yours ever

"Fossil" Fuell

Subject: RE: Smoking/smoke can damage your voice.
From: GUEST,Don Wise
Date: 06 Dec 11 - 06:58 AM

As a full-time non-(or should that be passive?)-smoker I have had enough bronchitis to last me a lifetime......At last the introduction of smoking bans means that going out and singing/making music has become possible, nay enjoyable, once more. If I'm honest, smoking was the main reason why I left The Garden Gnome Ceilidh Band- sitting in a van with 5 chain smokers on a 4 hour drive to London on a cold and damp December day was no health cure. Nor was doing a floor-spot with the Rev. Ken Loveless sitting in the front row and perpetrating serious industrial-level air pollution either-I had to break off singing.
The down side is that all the outdoor tables in cafes are now taken over by smokers...............