Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 11 May 10 - 07:28 PM

I shouldn't worry too much about what does or doesn't feature in the song - Hugh Robertson was writing in Glasgow where the niceties of Highland geography probably didn't matter too much.

Fowler doesn't give linguistic history, or cite sources.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 11 May 10 - 07:11 PM

Fowler reckon's that Minch is probably from th Old Scandinavian "megin nes" = great headland.

I don't see it myself: the Minch is a *channel*. Both the Minch and the Little Minch are surrounded by headlands, but from a boat no one of them stands out as being particularly "great" compared to the others. And in any event sailors are not prone to naming water features after nearby land features, or vice-versa. It just sounds like someone who hasn't been able to find a plausible etymology clutching at straws.

It also seems odd that the Minch features at all in the song, seeing as Mingulay is actually in the Hebridean Sea, with a hell of a pull even to the south end of the Little Minch...probably much further than local boatmen would have normally gone back when the island was inhabited...just one more indication that the song was written by someone outside the community.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Gutcher
Date: 11 May 10 - 04:50 PM

Anent a previous post on this thread which states that Norman Kennedy
thought that this song had something to do with an Owl. Do any of
you gaelic scholars have any knowledge of an ancient song called
"The Owl"?
In a traditional tale of Malcolm 11, King of Scotland, it is given
that this was his favourite song & that his youngest daughter would
sing it to him to help him to relax. Gaelic was at that time the
language used in Scotland.
Malcolm 11 was grandfather to Duncan & McBeth if my memory is
correct,they being sisters sons.
The daughter accompanied herself on the harp when singing.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 11 May 10 - 08:22 AM

Fowler reckon's that Minch is probably from th Old Scandinavian "megin nes" = great headland.

They give "mickill ey" (muckle island) for Mingulay (Miughalaigh) so the 'n' looks as if it intruded on Anglicisation.

Of the song they say "A famous but inauthentic 'folk song', based on a tune from the Western Highlands and with words by Hugh S. Robertson, written in 1938 for his Glasgow Orpheus Choir."

As for non-Scandinavian roots, you wouldn't find many Anglo-Saxons in the Highlands and Islands till fairly recently, and their place-names are usually recognisably English rather than Anglo-Saxon.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: IanC
Date: 11 May 10 - 07:05 AM

Not necessarily Scandinavian. Most islands in the Cambridgeshire fens have names ending in -ey (e.g. Whittlesey, Ely) and in the Somerset marshes (e.g. Athelney) which is a standard Anglo-Saxon suffix for an island.

:-)

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Rob Naylor
Date: 11 May 10 - 06:50 AM

I don't think that's the case (minch= whitecaps).

The Gaelic names for the Minch (both parts) are completely unrelated to the word, and it's used in several places in the UK to mean a somewhat crooked channel or body of water.

From my (admittedly fairly basic, but including a lot of dialect, historic and seafaring terms, since I worked on Norwegian vessels for several years in my youth) Norwegian, it doesn't seem to fit with any old Norsk, Ny Norsk or Bøkmal Norsk terms or word roots that I know, so I'd be very much inclined to think that the derivation is the same as "Manche" as used in French for the Channel.

Island names such as Mingulay are certainly of scandinavian origin. They match the Norwegian ending "øy" for island and there are several possibilites for the fore-part of the name. Probably the most logical would be the old Norsk for "big"...ie "Big Island" since, although Mingulay isn't actually the biggest of its local group, standing tall it *looks* to be the biggest from a boat. Giving descriptive names ("sheep island", puffin island", "bird island", etc) seems to have been very much a habit of scandianvian seafarers in the dark ages.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: GUEST,Bernie in Ontario
Date: 11 May 10 - 02:19 AM

I heard many years ago from a Scotish friend of mine that the Minch was the white caps on top of the waves at sea. It's an indication of how rough the sea is. Hope this helps.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 14 Jan 03 - 07:06 AM

thanks, Malcolm I've passed this thread to the friend who enquired.

sandra

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 13 Jan 03 - 07:53 AM

It would at any rate be interesting to know where Norman Kennedy got his story from. So far as anyone knows, Roberton set his new words to a Lochaber tune, as mentioned a couple of times earlier; and none of the (vague enough) descriptions anyone has come up with of the old song seem to have much to do with owls. It may also have been known in the Islands, of course; but if it was, Roberton doesn't seem to have known about that. Equally, Roberton's text may subsequently have been translated into Gaelic, which would not be unusual, and could possibly Strupag's hearing it there.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 13 Jan 03 - 07:32 AM

refresh -

does anyone know anything about the owl song I referred to above?

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Strupag
Date: 11 Jan 03 - 12:26 PM

OK Thanks for waiting. I've just been down to
Portree Pier and started a discussion with local fishermen about as long as this one as to the origins of the word Minch.
Most of these guys were native gaelic speakers and we are all convinced that it is not a gaelic word.
As someone said earlier, many of the place names around these parts and on the north west mainland coast are of Norse origin and it is suspected that it's a Norse word. Mingulay, as with all island ending in the ay sound is almost certainly a norse word.
Interesting to hear that the song was actually written by Hugh Roberton. I've heard a gaelic version sung many years ago by a Barra man.He used the same tune but with a much faster beat.
Could it be that Hugh did a "Marjory Kennedy Frazer" and took up an old traditional song and "anglisized" it.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Strupag
Date: 11 Jan 03 - 10:38 AM

As someone who lives by repairing gear on the boats that fish in the Minch I would like to point out, just to be geographically correct, The Minch is the stretch of sea beetween the Scottish mainland going as far south as Ardnamurchan and as far north as Cape Wrath.
We ofter refer to North Minch and South Minch. Skye, being close to the mainland is on the mainland side of the minch.
Aye, there's not much going on in Mingulay these days but Eriskay (of Eriskay Love Lilt fame) now has a causway joining it to the Uists
and some people are moving back to the island as it is possible for them to commute now. They have a few good boats there and are doing all right.
As to the origins of the word Minch: I'm off to work on a boat here in Skye and I'll ask around. I'll be back
Cheeridh an drasda

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 11 Jan 03 - 08:25 AM

Going back to 17 Mar 99 where rich r asked about the supernatural powers of the owl, has anyone any more info about this earlier song. One of my friends was asking about it last night & I said I'd check Mudcat.

extract from Rich's post -
"Norman Kennedy states that the song was originally about the supernatural powers of an owl, but when the singers of the Hebrides became embarrassed by such ideas, they ceased to sing those words."

sandra

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: David Ingerson
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 04:33 PM

This is an illuminating thread. Thanks for all the contributions, agus go raimh mile maith agat, a Philippa, for your reaearch and authoritative posts.

Apparently no one in Portland's song circle has read it, for we still repeat our bit of folk mythology about it for newcomers--that this is the only surviving bit of (presumably ancient) culture from the island, whose population had been wiped out by disease. How romantic! I will correct that notion next time it's sung here!

By the way, I had been singing the song for many years before I saw a deeper layer of meaning there for me: If you want to get "home", you have to turn and "face the weather."

David

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Dez Yello
Date: 23 Oct 02 - 08:38 PM

Back in 1984 I was singing this song in a group in the Manchester area, we could only find the opening verse and the Wive's are waiting verse. So myself and group member Paul Whitehill wrote this verse as we thought at the time only two verse was too short a song. This verse was recorded by then South Wales based shanty group Motley Crew now Baggyrinkle in the late eighties. I still use this verse when I sing the song.

Bairns are waitin' by the fireside
In the cradle rocking gently
There's a candle in the window
Ere the men return to Mingulay.

Hope this might be of use to any of you out there.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Wotcha
Date: 19 Feb 01 - 04:26 PM

Too bad that Philip Caputo didn't read this thread before he penned his book "The Voyage." Check out the first chapter describing the Mingulay Boat Song as "the ancient chantey" (being sung about 1900 in the relevant scene). Sort of spoiled the start of this fine novel ...
Cheers,
Brian

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 19 Feb 01 - 02:04 PM

you can get my version from my web page too!

;-)

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From:
Date: 19 Feb 01 - 01:48 PM

What a fascinating discussion on one song! Very few versions exist on MP3 but you can listen to my version at www.mp3.com/docwood.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Alice
Date: 19 Feb 01 - 01:26 PM

As I was singing this song last night with a bunch of friends, I was thinking of this old thread. No matter if we Montanan's pronounce it correctly, it certainly is a great one to gather harmonies of different voices together. An old favorite here.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Philippa
Date: 15 Jun 99 - 07:13 PM

The Gaelic for the Minch is "an Cuan Sgith", the winged (wing shaped, I suppose) sea. I think this lends creedance to the theory advanced in this thread that Minch is related to 'manche' or 'mancha'in Romance languages, meaning sleeve.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Frank of Toledo
Date: 04 Jun 99 - 11:40 AM

On Saturday the 22nd of May I held a concert here in Toledo, Oregon with a young trio "Casey Neill Trio". They closed a very good show with the "Mingulay Boat Song",and they mentioned that they learned the song, or their version, from Al Capolla on the Hudson river Sloop Clearwater (PS). It is on their recent CD "SKREE'. on Appleseed Recordings......

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Philippa
Date: 04 Jun 99 - 11:15 AM

The following information of Mingulay is from Ben Buxton. "Mingulay: an Island and Its People". Birlinn, Edinburgh, 1995

p. 33
"A large number of the place names in the Barra isles are of Norse origin (or are compound Norse-Gaelic), as are the names of the islands themselves. The name Mingulay is thought to derive from the Old Norse 'mikil', meaning big, and 'ay', meaning island. In Gaelic i is 'Miughalaigh', pronounced something like 'me-ul-eye', or 'Miùghalaigh', which accounts for the form 'Mewla' given in a 17th century source. [anon 1620 in J L Campbell, ed, "The Book of Barra", 1936, p 44] Monro's version of 1549 - Megaly - is the earliest known; Martin Martin, 1695, gives 'Micklay'. The current spelling and pronuciation in English has drifed further from the Gaelic than in other cases, possibly because of the various forms used by early writers and map makers."

p. 47-48

"Mingulay's most famous song - outside Barra and Vatersay that is - is "The Mingulay Boat Song'. But neither the words nor the melody originate anywhere near Mingulay; it is a romantic invention of the 20th century. It was devised in 1938 by Glasgow-born Sir Hugh Roberton, who was very fond of the melody of 'Creag Ghuanach', a song from Lochaber, which celebrates a crag near Loch Treig. He needed a sea shanty, and so he adapted the music, chose the romantic name Mingulay, and composed the words. It was to be sung in F, slowly and rhythmically. [Roberton Publications, personal information; Derek Cooper. "The Road to Mingulay: a View of he Western Isles", London, 1985]…

"It is ironic that this song should be the only well-known song associated with the island, and, for many, the only reason they have heard the name Mingulay at all. "

In his appendix, Buxton publishes two real Mingulay songs, in Gaelic with Englsh translations: 'Oran do Dh'Eilean Mhiulaidh' /'Song to the Isle of Mingulay' and 'Turas Nèll a Mhiùghlaigh'/ 'Neil's Trip to Mingulay'

I repeat my earlier statement that I know of no evidence of a connecton between the names 'Mingulay' and 'Minch'. There are many islands in the Minch. Though there is Johnson's theory of a similar Norse derivation for Minch (see John Nolan's 18 Apr posting). In Skye there is a place called 'Minginish', which supposedly has the same meaning as Mingulay, 'inis' or 'inish' being the Gaelic equivalent of the Norse 'aigh' or 'ey' for 'island'.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Pete M
Date: 19 Apr 99 - 04:23 PM

Bravo Steve! how did I miss that? might have something to do with lack of sleep, but more likely sheer stupidity.

Pete M

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: katlaughing
Date: 19 Apr 99 - 02:10 PM

SuMac, never fear, darlin', I shoula guessed thar'd be na words fer a "piper" ta sing, else how'd he pipe?:->

Sailor Boy, will you share those of the lewd and bawdy nature, or did I miss something?

On my tape from the singers at the Mystic Seaport, in CT, they pronounce it Ming(as in ming dynasty) gah lay with the accent on the first two syllables.

Thanks,

katlaughing

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Sailor boy
Date: 19 Apr 99 - 07:47 AM

It may be of interest to note that there is a pipe tune called Crossing The Minch otherwise known as Crossing The Minge in piping circles. This translation places a very different connotation on the words of the song and it should therefore be re-classified as Lewd and Baudy.

I hope this helps.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Ewan McV (inactive)
Date: 19 Apr 99 - 04:40 AM

I'm fascinated to learn that someone says that Mingulay is regularly pronounced Min Gala. I've never heard such a pronunciation in the mouths of Scots or Gaelic speakers, but anything is possible in ths wild world of ours. There are two ways I've heard it said is something like the following :

more usually : ming goo lay sometimes : min geeue lay In either case the emphasis is slightly but not heavily on the first and third syllables. Ewan McVicar

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 19 Apr 99 - 03:39 AM

Tut-tut, Pete! Surely you mean "the penis mightier than the sword"?

Steve

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From:
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 09:33 PM

katlaughin': if th' wairds tae th' "Aged Bard's Wish" haed been on th' pipe music's liner notes, I'd hae been th' fairst tae send 'em tae ye; as 'tis, I've sent ye aa' thaur was exceptin' th' henscratches an' staves, an' aa' those wee sma' notes that pass fer pipe music. I'm that sorry! -SuMac, Apprentice Piper

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Philippa
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 05:49 PM

I don't know that there's any connection between the names Mingulay and Minch; Mingulay is but one of many islands reached by sailing the Minch. The Norse 'megin' theory is intriguing and maybe does after all indicate common origin for the two names for the Gaelic 'Miugulaidh' sounds something like 'Mig-oo-lye' (emphasis on first syllable and no 'n' sound; a Barra native confirmed that 'Miugulaidh' is the Gaelic name used by Barra people; I'm not sure I remember his pronunciation of the third syllable correctly; it may have been closer to 'lay' than to 'lye').
I don't know if we have more concrete evidence, but a Spanish/Portugese derivation for the Minch isn't implausible; they were seafarers.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Pete M
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 05:38 PM

Precisely Jerry, you may as well conclude that it refers to feeding fish because of the similarity to "Munch".

Added to which the theory that the Celts "fled" anywhere to escape Saxons or anyone else has been discredited by genetical research. Data from the Human genome project indicates that there is a common racial / ethnic strain running from Ireland (ALL of it) across Wales, across all of Southern England to Essex and extending into Western France. The prick is mightier than the sword, and assimilation easier than extermination.

Pete M

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: John Nolan
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 05:35 PM

One source, Johnston's Place names of Scotland, 1892, theorizes Minch is from the Norse megin nös (great ness)or megin nish, shortened to min-nish, and corrupted to Minch. On the other hand,in the Concise Scots Dictionary, minch is equivalent to mince, and therefore "what care we how white the minch is" may mean, "we are so starving that we are going to eat that meat pie, whether it is completely baked or not."

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Jerry Friedman
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 01:32 PM

I hope I'm not being a curmudgeon to point out that no one has presented a single scrap of evidence that "Minch" comes from French, Spanish, or Portuguese. All those languages have a word that means a similar body of water and has a similar sound. That's it. Stop before you land on a conclusion!

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Alice
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 09:06 AM

so, Ian, is it MINCH Gala, Minch GAla, or Minch GaLA??

alice

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Apr 99 - 03:29 AM

So....SuMac! Are ye goin' ta post 'em for us ta read? Bein' of partial Highland heritage, I'd luv ta knoo wha' they are.

Thanks,

katlaughing, whose Grandmas & greatgrandma were a Crawford, a Ewing, and a Fountain, two originally from Nova Scotia, farther back all from Bonnie Scotland!

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From:
Date: 17 Apr 99 - 07:44 PM

just tae add tae th' confusion, th' sang "Mingulay Boat Sang" is th' pipe chune "Creag Guanach", an' in th' notes on ma sheet music, it says that the chune was "originally a Lochaber tune and derives its name from a crag in Glenroy. It is a very old hunting song that comes from ancient times in the Highlands...also entitled "The Aged Bard's Wish." In it he tells that his last resting place should be near his favourite hunting grounds near Loch Treig, and speaks of pastoral scenes of great beauty and tenderness. The popular modern 'Mingulay Boat Song' uses the air but not the sentiments." Hey, don't blame th' piper, I'm just quotin'! -cheers, Sumac, Apprentice Piper

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Bud Sherman
Date: 17 Apr 99 - 06:06 PM

Earlier in this thread there was a discussion about the similarity of Minch and Manche. Would the Celtic presence in Brittany be the connection? Breton is considered to be one of the still living Celtic languages. Brittany means "little Britian" as I recall. Many Celts fled there when fleeing the Saxons, etal.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Matthew B.
Date: 17 Apr 99 - 12:50 PM

Ask Dan Milner to tell you the story about leaving a man on Mingulay!

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: BK
Date: 27 Mar 99 - 12:42 AM

Re some of the earlier postings: Many English still believe that "The wogs begin at Calais."

Otherwise: fascinating info abt an interesting song; so just how is Mingulay supposed to be pronounced, in case I get crazy enough to try to learn it (been tempted, as I don't know enough Scottish songs).

Cheers, BK

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Wotcha
Date: 27 Mar 99 - 12:03 AM

Jim and Ferrara:

The old pub can get pretty smoked up but that's cos Maryland has not yet passed any legislation on smoking tobacco in bars. To be fair though, the advent of more shanty singers has reduced the number of smokers who are relegated to the public bar. Come on down!

Some of the regular singers are trying out a new venue in Old Town Alexandria -- the third Tuesday of each month at The Hard Times Cafe on King Street: since that is Virginia, the smoking regime may be somewhat different (despite being home of RJ Reynolds et al).

Jim, some free legal advice: try not to sing the Sailor's Alphabet when the officers stop you next time ... they get all confused when you get to "S is for stunstail ..."

Cheers, Brian

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: GutBucketeer
Date: 23 Mar 99 - 12:23 AM

Hi Ferrara:

Thanks for the offer of the tune. I have found several Midi's of the tune on the Web, and have a printed version in the "Songs and Dances of Scotland".

The Pub Sing has grown in the last year. I took about 9 months off and it went from about 15 people in the back of the pub, to basically taking over the whole bar. It's great, and there are several professional singers that often come, but your turn only comes up maybe once or twice an evening. The smoke isn't as bad as I remember the blues bars in Chicago to be, but you still wake up with the smell in your hair.

It's funny, last month I sang for two hours. I had one beer not because I didn't want to order another but because it was so crowded that the waitress only came around once. Well, I started driving home and filled with the music I was singing at the top of my lungs and my arms were a flailing. Before you know it there I was on University Blvd. with flashing lights behind me. It turns out the parking lot was well lit, and I had forgotten to turn on my lights. Plus, I was driving slow because I don't see that well at night. Well, when the officer heard that I had been to the Shanty Sing he put me through every test he could think of (I don't think he really believed me when I said I had only had one beer). I can't say the alphabet from d to w fast without singing the ABC song even when I'm sober. Anyway, He finally let me off with a warning. I think he followed me for about a mile after he let me go.

To make a long story short, the smoke is noticeable but not too bad.

Do you go to the Folk Society sing alongs on the first Friday of every month, and do they sing Shanties there? I always have my son's Cubscouts, but someday...

Jim Bunch

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Ferrara
Date: 22 Mar 99 - 08:26 AM

Hi. Jim, sounds like it would be a local phone call, if you still need the tune I could get it to you easily enough. E-mail for phone number.

In about 1979 I was doing a computer project at the Pentagon and saw a lovely small oil painting hanging over someone's desk. It reminded me of my one visit to Skye, so I asked the man about it. He said it had been hanging over his bed at a bed & breakfast in Scotland, I forget the town, and it had reminded him of the scenery all around him. He stayed for a while and got to know his hosts, and they gave him the painting. He pointed to the largest island and said, "That's Mingulay, over there." The family had stayed in touch and one of the sons had visited him.

By the way, I took three trips to Europe in the late 70's and people were absolutely wonderful to us in spite of our obvious American-ness. We even found a helpful taxi driver in Paris during the Paris Air Show!

One more question, for JimBunch and Wotcha, you seem to be going to the shanty sings at the Royal Mile in Wheaton. It's about two fairly plebeian (not Royal) miles from my home. I've been wanting to go for months, but have allergies and I've heard it's pretty full of cigarette smoke. How bad is it? (Remember I'm a delicate flower, it might be fine for someone who isn't allergic to the stuff.)

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Philippa
Date: 22 Mar 99 - 07:42 AM

Give Kay my regards, Ian; I met her years ago at Corrymeela, Co Antrim. Does she speak Scottish Gaelic? I think the stress would be on the first syllable - the way you wrote it people might think it is on the 'GA' of 'gala'

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Ian C
Date: 22 Mar 99 - 03:31 AM

My information comes from Dr. Kay Muhr, who researched amongst Gaelic speakers on Barra. She is now in charge of the Irish Placenames project (which has a site on the internet). There is no-one left on Mingulay to ask, but It seems likely that the people of Barra (some of whom came from Mingulay) would know.

Cheers! Ian

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Alice
Date: 20 Mar 99 - 05:35 PM

Thanks for all the background on this song. It's a fun one to sing. Was there a definitive answer regarding the pronunciation of Mingulay? Ian Chandler said Minch Gala. What is correct?

alice in montana

Subject: Lyr Add: MINGULAY BOAT SONG (Sir Hugh Roberton)
From: Ian
Date: 20 Mar 99 - 05:21 PM

Oops!

Just looked in Paterson & Gray "Songs of Scotland,” 1996 and found the following:

MINGULAY BOAT SONG
(Sir Hugh Roberton)

Hill you ho, boys, let her go, boys,
Bring her head round, now all together.
Hill you ho, boys: let her go, boys;
Sailing home, home to Mingulay.

What care we tho' white the Minch is?
What care we for wind or weather?
Let her go, boys! Ev’ry inch is
Wearing home, home to Mingulay.

Hill you ho, boys; let her go, boys;
Bring her head round, now all together.
Hill you ho, boys: let her go, boys,
Sailing home, home to Mingulay.

Wives are waiting on the bank, or
Looking seaward from the heather;
Pull her round boys! And we'll anchor,
Ere the sun sets at Mingulay.

Hill you ho, boys; let her go, boys;
Bring her head round, now all together.
Hill you ho, boys: let her go, boys,
Sailing home, home to Mingulay.

Sir Hugh Roberton (1874-1952) was conductor of the famous Orpheus Choir of Glasgow for which he made many choral arrangements of Scots songs. He also published songs of the Isles (1950), a collection of traditional tunes for which he invented English words. 'Mairi's Wedding’ (the Lewis Bridal Song), 'Westering Home' and the 'Mingulay Boat Song' were all popularized by Roberton and they remain perennial favourites. The remote, barren island of Mingulay lies to the south of Barra in the Western Isles. Sometimes referred to as 'the nearer St Kilda', it was a crofting and fishing community of about 160 people until 1912. Isolation, infertile land, lack of a proper landing place and the absentee landlord problems familiar to the Western Isles and Highlands, resulted in a gradual disintegration of Mingulay's culture. The process of voluntary evacuation began in 1907 with land raids by the impoverished crofters to the neighbouring island of Vatersay, and Mingulay is now completely deserted. But summer visitors to Barra regularly brave the two-hour journey in exposed seas from Castlebay to Mingulay, inspired by Roberton's evocative but sentimental song, which has no connection with either the island or its people.

Looks like the Mingulay Boat Song is nothing to do with Mingulay either!

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Wotcha
Date: 20 Mar 99 - 03:58 PM

Jim:

Well Jim, guess you now know the history behind the name of Wheaton,Maryland's own Royal Mile Pub ... not to mention the song that is sung by the same lady every time they hold a shanty night there. See you at May's sing (won't be there in April). cheers, Brian

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Bev Lawton
Date: 20 Mar 99 - 01:35 PM

The tunes composer was : Pipe Major Donald MacLeod he was in either The Seaforth Highlanders or The Cameron Highlanders, Scottish Military, Highland Division and I guess it was written in 1930'ish can't recall exactly. Problem is the MacLeod's are a famous family of pipers from the Western Isle's streching back many generations from father to son and more than one is called Donald! The bar I mentioned isn't correct, one of the 2 bars involved IS "The Hebridian" and the other has a name connection with the same area (but I still can't recall it) hence the title! I will hazard a guess he wrote it whilst stationed at the barracks in Edinburgh Castle, if you do not know the area the Royal Mile leads directly to the gates of the Castle. The bar I mentioned earlier "The Tron" or "Tron Ceilldh House" (depending on which side of the building you look at!), Davey Square, is the most fantastic place for Celtic folk music four levels with a session on all of them ! Many famous band members hang out there and join in the informal sessions. Another to visit is "The Scotsman's Lounge" for hard-core Highland Pipes etc., all within a short stagger of each other and the Castle. Been a long time since I lived there but go back often and the folk music along "the mile" is amongst the best there is. Regards, Bev Lawton.

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Philippa
Date: 18 Mar 99 - 01:36 PM

I'm not disillusioned, Bev, I think it's hilarious that musicians equate crossing the mile while inebriated with sailing across the stormy Minch.
It does seem likely from what some sontributors to this thread say, that the name of the Minch is of Spanish or Portugese origin (not to be confused with Mingulay of Norse origin).

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: Bev Lawton
Date: 18 Mar 99 - 09:02 AM

I hate to disillusion you on part of this thread but there is no romantic connection between the "Mingulay Boat Song" and the pipe tune "Crossing The Minch" The tune actually refers to the dangers of crossing the Royal Mile in Edinburgh whilst "under the influence" between two well known pubs - the names escape me for now but one may be THE TRON BAR. It is a well known pipers tune and fairly modern. haven't got the info to hand but will post more later. Regards, Bev lawton

Subject: RE: Mingulay Boat Song's Minch ???
From: rich r
Date: 17 Mar 99 - 07:36 PM

Getting back to the original song. A version was published in "A Folksinger's Guide to Grassroots Harmony" by Ethel Raim and Josh Dunson (Oak PUblications 1968). The lyrics are pretty much what is in the DT except that they use "Hill you ho". The editors of the book add a little more to the background including the following:

"Here is a sea shanty made for stormy weather that has become gentle in the hands of the McPeakes. Norman Kennedy states that the song was originally about the supernatural powers of an owl, but when the singers of the Hebrides became embarrassed by such ideas, they ceased to sing those words. The McPeakes sang the Mingulay Boat Song during the performance at the Folklore Society of Greater Washington in 1964. Chuck Perdue provided a set of words which he learned from Bryan Sutton as the verses on the tape of the concert were difficult to pick up clearly"

Obviously a bunch of names are dropped in here. Perhaps someone can vouch for the people mentioned. What is more intriguing to me is what are the lyrics of the version about the owl?

rich r