Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off

Subject: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 02:40 PM

As of a few days ago I'm now the owner of a guitar (again), and will be relearning to play after about 35 years off. In high school and college in the 1960's I used to play guitar at the Beginner level on a nice-sounding Giannini. Simple folk songs, enough to accompany myself singing and playing just for myself, in my room or in the dorm stairwell. I had a few friends who played guitar well, but it didn't cross my mind to try to play with them, as we were at such a different level.

The Giannini got smashed in a house-move, and I was without a guitar for a couple of decades. Eventually, at an Auction benefiting my choir, I bought a friend's Yamaha, which was a good-looking guitar, but once I got it home I found that trying to play it was very awkward and painful. I thought it was just me, getting out-of-shape older. When I moved to Maryland, and started going to Open Sings, I got tired of only being able to sing unaccompanied songs. I kept getting out the guitar and trying to play it, but just got nowhere. A couple of minutes and I just couldn't take it anymore.

Since I'm quite short (5"0"), I finally realized maybe my guitar was just not a good size for me. So this fall, encouraged by several local people, and what I read on the Mudcat, I decided to look into getting a different guitar. I visited The Guitar Store near where I work in Washington DC and was matched up (after a trade) with an affordable 3/4 sized Sunlite and there was an immediate affinity. What a happy day! It feels right and the tone is very nice. I plan to take some lessons to get started out on a good foot and hopefully avoid picking up bad habits. (Last time my next-door-neighbor and I began together, using a book).

I can't do much yet, and of course my fingers are very tender, but the guitar feels as comfortable as it's possible at this stage. I hope I have the patience to wait and develop skills solidly and slowly rather than remembering where I was (or where my mind thinks I was) and getting frustrated. Has anyone begun again after a long time, and how did it go?

This time, I have a community: two communities, really. The local folk groups - and this time I will not be reclusive. And the Mudcat. Over the last week I've found such a wealth of messages on how to build up stamina, how to learn 1-, 2- and 3-chord songs, about learning by playing with a group where you can just blend in the background, even how to not worry about "copying" others. I'm saving the most helpful messages in an electronic journal, and keeping traces on some of the many relevant threads.

I had started to worry a little because I find myself greeting my new guitar ("Hello, guitar!") when I take it out of its case several times a day. But there's a thread about that too!

Well, it's a beautiful day, and I really should be outside. It's 62 degrees in Maryland in the middle of December! But first, "Freight train, freight train, goin' so fast...."

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 02:44 PM

You go for it girl!
Good luck, and see you at the Getaway next October ;o)
Giok

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Bee
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 02:50 PM

You're well on your way. I got my first guitar last year, started teaching myself in February, a beginner at 54, and now I can play several dozen tunes reasonably well, and many others with a little hesitation (Dm still hurts, for some reason). And Mudcat is great. Have lots of fun with it!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Big Mick
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 02:57 PM

Great news from one of my favorite folks. I trust they did a good setup on the instrument at the shop? If not, ask around (Chance Shivers would be a good resource on this) for a good luthier and make sure the action works for you. You may want to consider light strings (again make sure the setup is for this gauge string) until your fingers get up to snuff, but be aware that different gauge strings sound different on the same guitar.

I can't wait to hear you do a song on the guitar. Congratulations.

Mick

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Leadfingers
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 03:10 PM

Best of luck Linda - My Re-Learning was after a Motorbike crash and a smashed Left wrist - But I learned bar Chords the second time round !
Ans as Giok said , see you at The Getaway !!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: fat B****rd
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 03:14 PM

Good luck, Linda. You put me to shame. I've HAD a guitar for 35 years and still not "got it together" fB.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Scrump
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 03:18 PM

I don't see why you should have any more problem learning, than someone who has never played before. In fact, your previous experience, even though it was long ago, must be an advantage. I'll bet that once you start, it will 'come back' to you.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: kendall
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 03:45 PM

Hell, I get discouraged after 35 DAYS of not playing.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Ebbie
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 05:00 PM

Good for you, Linda! See -and hear - you at the Getaway 2007.

Ebbie

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Restless
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 05:10 PM

Good for you Linda. I've been an "on & off" player for 30 years. Each time I go back I learn a little more.

Try and hook up with like minded souls, teachers or friends and have at it! I can honestly say that after a lifetime of "learning stuff" that progressing on the Guitar has given me THE most satisfaction of ANYTHING I have ever been successful at.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 05:15 PM

I've been playing the guitar for quite a while now (when the Big Bang occurred, I'm the guy that yelled, "Hey, knock of the racket! Can't you hear I'm trying to practice?"), and I've learned a lot of things the hard way.

Here's a biggy that should help those left-hand fingertips a bit:   put a left-hand finger on one of the strings as usual, but without pressing the string down on the fret. Play the string with your right hand. You should get a sort of a dull "thubb" sound (if you get a clear tone, you're pressing too hard for now). Okay, now press the string down until it contacts the fret very, very lightly. So lightly that the tone still isn't clear (similar "thubb" sound). Now, increase the pressure just a tiny bit while playing the string. Keep increasing the pressure just until the tone becomes clear.

Okay, that's enough. That's all the pressure you need to exert.

Most people, even very experienced guitarists, mash the strings into the fingerboard much harder than they need to to get good, clear tones from the guitar. This causes two problems. First, it makes your fingertips sore. A lot sorer than they need to be to do the job right. And second, it makes you hand much too tense. If you can keep the fingers, and the whole hand, light and relaxed, using only as much muscular tension as you absolutely need to, it will save wear and tear on the fingertips, and you fingers will be freer to move much more lightly and swiftly.

Take it easy. But take it!   Good luck and have fun!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: GUEST,MikesRV6A
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 05:29 PM

Yup, sounds like the story of my life. Playing the guitar is one of the MOST rewarding activities I know of. Like you Linda, and many others, I played folk music in the 60's...actually playing small events with a trio (can you imagine?) and even appeared on a local TV station during Christmas season. Put the guitar down for a very long time and have picked it up again this past year. In fact, I added a "new" Martin to the stable...she sits right next to the guitar I've had all my life (nearly), an Epiphone Seranader 12-string. I'm trying to learn something besides very basic fingerpicking and chording. Linda, have a good time with your new guitar and fill the air with sounds dreams are made of!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 05:53 PM

" Most people, even very experienced guitarists, mash the strings into the fingerboard much harder than they need to to get good, clear tones from the guitar "

You're lucky Don, you've never had to play my guitar ...

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 06:17 PM

If you can afford it, get a teacher who burns with a passion for teaching - rather than playing, the guitar. Someone though, who is a good enough guitarist to see where you're at, and all the exciting stuff that lies in front of you - all the ways forward, for there are always many ways forward - not just one; and they should all be fun.

Take it easy....

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 07:19 PM

They say you never forget how to ride a bicycle. I'm not too sure about that actually - I think I'd probably fall off a couple of times anyway. But it's true for guitars anyway, and falling off isn't so dangerous. Fingers toughen up quick enough, and hand muscles build up - though squeezing on a soft tennis size foam ball can speed that up.

I pretty well stopped playing for nearly 30 years, and I know I'm a lot better now than I was when I was young. I never got round to taking lessons, but if that's the way you learn, go for it.

Welcome back. The water's lovely.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: SussexCarole
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 08:12 PM

Linda, that's superb news. I'll send you the guitar chords for Shirley's Sunburnt Spot. Look forward to hearing you sing and play next year

Carole x

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Don Firth
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 10:18 PM

Uhh . . . yeah, the way I usually hear it is that you never forget how to fall off a bicycle, but then. . . .

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 10:55 PM

I just want to also offer my encouragement. Bob

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: GUEST,DonMeixner
Date: 17 Dec 06 - 10:57 PM

Hi LInda,

I would view success as a definate thing. Riding a bike and all that.

I've learned guitar three times now due to various devastating hand injuries. Even with nerve damage, destroyed tissue and reatachment I have been a success. Muscle memory will see you through.

Good luck tho' none is needed.

Don

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Bert
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 01:39 AM

Go for it Linda. Sheesh, I've been playing for years and never did learn it.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 02:13 AM

Hi Linda,

I don't know how to make blue clickies on PMs but this is who I am.
http://bigalwhittle.co.uk/


there is so much good tuition stuff out there nowadays. If you have a good music shop near you there some great dvd guitar lessons available. If not try Amazon - put folk guitar tuition for beginners DVD, or somesuch into search. Even if you get a teacher -- its as well to check that he isn't talking complete nonsense.

Most of us are self taught, you see, and we pick up blind spots, areas of ignorance, and predjudices - without hardly knowing.

like I said though - someone who has taught people before and has seen the initial problems they encounter and can see you over some of them, is worth his/her weight in gold. Agood rule of thumb is that good teacher will always start out by asking YOU, what you want to achieve - rather than arriving with a lesson plan.

all the best

al

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 08:10 AM

Thanks to everyone for this wonderful advice and encouragement. It makes me feel that the journey this time will be FUN and that maybe I'll be able to get beyond the "stuck at the beginner" stage! I can't wait to try these things.

I did fairly recently take up bicycling again, but I got one of the new low-slung ones I don't have to be so scared of falling off. I can put my feet down flat on the ground when I stop. Taking that one slowly, too.

--Linda

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Duke
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 09:46 AM

I was once a pretty fair picker but in the last 20 years or so I have gone through periods where I stopped for months on end. I didnt get excited about it as I knew that it would only take a couple of weeks to be back to where I was. Sometimes months turned into years as it has this time and although I am now back at it again, I find that the mind has failed me. I have forgotten so much music that I once played. If I could remember it, I could play it. So that is a side that I never even thought about. So I guess this time I'd better not stop again.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Alaska Mike
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 10:40 AM

Hi Linda,
Like you I played guitar in the sixties and then put it under the bed for about 15 years before finally getting it out again. But once it was back in my hands, I worked hard at learning to play. I don't consider myself a "good" guitarist, but I accompany myself adequately I think. Best of luck to you. I know you will receive great pleasure playing your new guitar and I hope you continue to share your skills with others.

Mike
Alaska Mike's Website

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Wesley S
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 10:53 AM

Linda - Don gave you some very good advice. I hope you can learn from it.

Two more little pieces of advice if you don't mind. First - work on a steady rhythm. You can get away with a lot of flubs and mistakes if you don't break your rhythm. It's that stopping and starting between chords that can really mess up a presentation.

And second - I'm pretty sure that I heard this on a Pete Seegar TV show. If not I still give him credit for it. The last thing you should play before you put your guitar away is something you play well. That way your last memory of your guitar is a good one. If your struggling with a piece - get away from it for a few minutes just before put your guitar away and play something you can do with ease.

Best of luck to you. Keep us informed on your progress.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Scrump
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 11:28 AM

I'm interested to see how many people stopped playing for a long period (as well as you, Linda). Although I stopped playing in public for a very long time (longer than I care to remember, and having got back to it, I still regret all those lost years!), I've always kept the guitar handy and played around on it at home during that period.

My advice is not to put the guitar away in its case but leave it handy and available for use whenever you get the urge - I still do that now; it sits on a stand in the corner of the room so when I fancy a 'swift pluck' (ooerr, missus! they can't touch you for it!) I can just grab the guitar and do it! If you have to get it out of the case each time you might find you play it less.

Anyroad, best of luck, be sure to let us know how it goes!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: pdq
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 01:33 PM

Here are some tips that will ruin your chances of becoming a good guitar player:


1) buy a nylon string guitar

2) practice only 3-finger 'pattern picking' as done by Peter, Paul & Mary

3) never go past the third fret: "nothin' up there anyway"

4) eschew the study of music theory: "I'm so good now I don't need to study!"


These tips will keep you mediocre for at least 35 more years.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 01:36 PM

some of us would settle for mediocre....

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: DonMeixner
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 01:45 PM

1 Chet Atkins, Gordon Bok, Willy Nelson, Susan Tedeschi(?), Christpher Parkening play Nylon string Guitars

2. Joan Baez Peter Yarrow, N. Paul Stookey, and Tom Paxton have earned a pretty good living for more than thirty years using among other things a three finger style, You can't count Doc Watson, Ike Everly or Merle Travis because they only used two fingers.

3. Learn what you can about the neck.

4. There is theory and there is theory. But it is a good thing to know all you can about theory. I don't know nearly enough. BUt I always ask the kind folks in here and I get the answer (Even from Gargoyle) and I have learned something.

Don

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 01:49 PM

A couple of very simple tips:

Keep yout hands out of hot water (and dish soap) until you build your calluses;

Keep your finger nails trimmed.

Make your practice time YOURS ALONE! Don't let other people intefere unless you invite them. CHEERS, Bob

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 02:38 PM

Nothing wrong with nylon strings. Willie Nelson doesn't think so anyway.

Just a matter of what you prefer, and when you prefer it.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Muttley
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 05:43 PM

Dear Linda

Good Onya - that's Aussie for well done!

I, too was an on-again-off-again player until my late twenties when I picked up my old 3/4 Yamaha and decided I WOULD learn to play it.
As Weelittledrummer said - find a teacher with passion for teaching rather than a passion for playing" brilliant advice (not that I would expect anything other from 'Drummer') - but my suggestion would be "find a teacher with a passion for BOTH (if possible).

I went to a community learning centre one night a week to get the basics in an 8-week course and then sat in with our local head teacher at the Primary (Elementary) school across the road and learned more - - - BOTH were passionate anbout playing and teaching - Terry (the teacher) can literally pick up ANYTHING with strings and play it - and quite a few things without them too. The other guy was a classical-trained pianist.

After several years of playing I was devastated with head injuries suffered in a motorcycle accident which caused me to forget HOW to play and also robbed me of some fine-motor control in my fingers and hands.

Back to the drawing board and I decided that my playing previously might serve to help me remember chord patterns (how to place my fingers to play chords) and started looking through my old 8-week course book I had compiled. The notation exercises were beyond me but I found I could hit MOST of the chords - 'F' was and still is a dead loss! I then started looking for songs whose tunes I was familiar with and accumulated these along with the relevant chords - if they used chords I couldn't play - I transposed them into ones I COULD. I thus compiled about 300 (+ / -) songs in books which I can play (in varying degrees of competence) - my only concession is that I must have the books WITH me to play as I can't remember chord progressions or the chord changes without seeing them in place any more.

Some of the chords I play are 'cheat' or abbreviated - a purist would not use them, but with my limited fine motor control, they're good. They sound very close to the real thing to the layman and that's all that matters. I can now busk - and make a few dollars when I do (worst day about $30 in an hour and a half - best day about $90 in two and a half hours), I play at schools at which I teach - either for fun or as an accompaniment to the lesson I am teaching and I occasionally fill in if the muso's are away at church.

Hang in there, Linda - you've just gotta REALLY want to play - and you will. Time is no obstacle. You'll probably never be another Eric Clapton or Woody Guthrie - but neither are MOST of us. Play for yourself and THEN play for others and most of all - - - - - HAVE FUN !!!

Muttley

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 05:53 PM

Another tip: keep you guitar OUT all day and night. That might mean hanging it on the wall where it's handy, or maybe on a stand where it available at the drop of a thought! Bob

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Nancy King
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 06:58 PM

Linda, I'm so glad you found a guitar that fits you! That's probably the most important thing, even more than whether it has nylon or steel strings, etc. etc. It sounds like you're motivated to work on it, and that of course is what counts. I agree with those who urge you to keep it out -- a guitar stand is a big help!

Over the many years since I first started playing guitar, I went through a couple of very long periods when I didn't play at all, and when I started up again, I was surprised to find that, after a bit of work, I was able to play much better and more smoothly than I had way back when. Of course I'll never be what I consider a "good" guitarist, but I can accompany a song and enjoy doing it. I have a lot of bad habits, but I can do well enough that I'm not really motivated to force myself to play barre chords, for example. My hands aren't very strong, so I keep extra-light strings on my Martin, and it works out well. Just keep experimenting and practicing, and soon you'll be all set!

Most of all, have fun!

Nancy

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: karen k
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 10:19 PM

Glad to hear that you are going to play again. Good for you. Look forward to hearing you at the Getaway next Nov. Good luck.

karen

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Bee
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 11:35 PM

I was leaving the guitar out until two events - onset of einter woodstove heating season, and new baby kitty. Kitty likes to play guitar: plucks strings with claws and teeth, tries to climb in sound hole, chews capo. Now it's in the case if it ain't in my hands.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Bee
Date: 18 Dec 06 - 11:36 PM

That would be 'winter' woodstove....etc.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Janice in NJ
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 12:35 AM

Congratulations! Lots of people are going to give you advice, all of it well intentioned and a lot of it actually useful. So let me join the parade with five suggestions you are welcome to take or leave.

1. Have fun. Whatever you do it should ultimately be for your own enjoyment, including the enjoyment you get making music together with others.

2. Get involved with other people. Many folk music societies have slow jams, song circles, and other activities that allow you to build your confidence while learning (or in your case relearning) skills.

3. Your right thumb (presuming you play guitar right handed) will become your best friend. Learn to use it to play a steady rhythm in 4/4 and in 3/4 time. Then learn to use it to play bass runs and to pick out simple melodies. The fancier stuff, like 3-finger picking, will come a lot easier once you learn to make your thumb do what you want.

4. Your capo will become your next best friend. Get a really good one. I like the pistol grip kind.

5. Books and charts will tell you about barre chords, but they won't tell you about hook chords. Those are chords where you hook your left thumb around the neck so you can press down the 6th (bass E) string. This is really useful for playing an F or Dm (hook on 1st fret), or a D or D7 chord (hook on 2nd fret). Music teachers may tell you it's terrible form, but lots of folk musicians do this anyway.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 06:44 AM

And get an electronic tuner - preferably the sort you clip on the guitar. (For example.) They are pretty inexpensive, and they make it a lot easier when it comes to playing with other people or with records.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 08:40 AM

At the most recent Open Sing in early December, Nancy King was talking about these things to me and was kind enough to let me try her fine guitar. That's what pushed me over the edge. Then I KNEW I had the wrong instrument. So then I dithered, and asked, and I wondered – steel, nylon, nylon, steel?… maybe in a couple of months….. -- And I was talking it over in the store when this guitar kind of came up to me and said, "Hi, I'm your new guitar". And I said "Okey-doke".

These are all so great. Working backwards….

On my new guitar (and on Nancy's) I could do this wraparound. I could not do this on my former guitar. And I always felt guilty about using a capo, like it was cheating, sort of. Glad to know it isn't. (we feel guilty about the weirdest things, don't we?) …and not being able to do barre cords or F's.

I had noticed my fingertips being tingly when doing dishes this weekend. Platex rubber gloves back on, now.

A teacher with passion… I was so very lucky about 14 years ago when I went back to Community College to begin to learn a few things about the (still sort of) new PC computer thing in order to be able to be semi-useful in this modren world. I was scared of being overtaken by all the 15-year-olds who knew so much more than I. At that school, and in the greater community choir, I had the most WONDERFUL teachers, 5 of them. All fiercely passionate about programming or databases or music or accounting, and who just swept you up in it. And who could structure each day's work so that it built upon what you'd learned previously and take it one step higher. When you'd look back you were amazed how far you had come.

Theory. Only tried to study it once, in 9th grade. Everybody else in the class was in the orchestra. I didn't have a clue. It's long been one of my goals for later life [NOW] to learn more about this. Ending on a high note – yes that's what my wonderful choral directors have done. We might have spent the last hour working on some dratted 8-part fugue, but then we'd end rehearsals with something beautiful or rousing that we'd previously nailed, and walk out happy.

So now I'm trying to use the lightest possible pressure (at least a third less than I would have thought), and play frequently in quite short sessions, until the fingers get too tender. Then try again later. Guitar is in a case, but it's open and in the hallway. I can't get from kitchen to computer without passing by and picking it up. A stand and a tuner are on my list. I'm trying to keep a slow but regular rhythm, just strumming – which means I can't sing yet. – but I can wait…

I'm also trying (this is MY hint) to be careful not to squeeze my lips together (which I found myself doing) even if my fingers are still kinda sore. As in natural childbirth, the common tendency to tighten something doesn't relieve pain – relaxing does. So I'm trying to remember to smile and not grimace.

In just a couple of days my hands are figuring out what to do, a bit. These messages have been SO inspiring.
--Linda

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 09:09 AM

Capos aren't just for playing in keys where you can't manage the chords. (Though there is nothing wrong with that.) Capoing up a few frets means the frets are closer together, and that can make it easier to learn how to do quite a lot of things, especially if you've got small hands.

As an alternative to a guitar stand, a Pub Prop is worth considering. Handier, so long as there is a table handy. And, I think, more reliable,

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: GUEST,dd
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 09:14 AM

Any hopes for me? I'm 72 and picking up again after learning a few
chords 40 odd years ago.I've started with 'Guitar for dummies'.I may have the wrong book,but they certainly have the right student.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Nancy King
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 10:40 AM

Linda, I could tell from the look on your face when you held my guitar that a narrower neck was what you needed! Glad you found one!

Just play a little bit each day, and those calluses will build up in no time. I never found that having my hands in hot water did any harm -- as long as I didn't try to play for an hour or so afterward. You'd find out soon enough why playing with softened hands doesn't work!

Just curious -- Steel or nylon strings on your new axe?

Nancy

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 01:09 PM

This new guitar has nylon strings. It just shook out that way. I vaguely remember that I chose my first guitar, a nylon-stringed Giannini, because it was said to be a good learner guitar, but also because it was Brazilian and I was (am) very fond of the sound of Brazilian music. I had bought the Black Orpheus soundtrack album at the same time. The new guitar sounds much like the Giannini.
--Linda

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 01:40 PM

There's absolutely nothing wrong with nylon strings on a guitar that's made for them. As stated above, some of the biggies use nylon-string guitars. All classical guitarists use nylon strings.

Also, although steel-string advocates (particularly owners of D-model guitars) will squawk at this, a well-made nylon-string guitar is louder than a steel string guitar. A steel-string guitar may sound a bit louder up close, but in a large auditorium or concert hall, the nylon-string guitar wins every time. They have much more carrying power. I've heard Andrés Segovia, Julian Bream, John Williams, Carlos Montoya, Christopher Parkening and others (along with singers like Theodore Bikel, Jean Redpath, and Richard Dyer-Bennet) in places like the Seattle Opera House (seats 3,100) playing without amplification, and they could be heard loud and clear. When was the last time you heard a steel-string guitar in a concert hall of any size that didn't need to be amplified to be heard clearly?

I played steel-string guitars for the first three years, then I switched to a nylon-string classic, and I've played classics ever since.

By the way—very important—NEVER put steel strings on a guitar that's built for nylon strings. Steel strings exert about 2-1/2 times as much tension as nylon strings, and that can pull a good classic apart. Also, you feel that higher tension in the fingertips of you left hand (!!).

I have a lot of things to say about fretting strings with the left-hand thumb, but I've said it all before in other threads, so I'll just shut up now.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: GUEST,Patrick Costello
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 09:48 PM

Linda, here are some links to free folk-blues stuff from a fellow Marylander (I'm over on the Eastern Shore) that addresses some of the concerns you brought up (hand pain, theory, playing & singing, etc.):


The How and the Tao of Folk Guitar
An open source guitar book.


Folk Guitar
Four half-hour video lessons. Lessons five through eight will be going online sometime in January or February.


The Subway Shuffle
Blues guitar from the Philadelphia subway system.


Another Subway Shuffle workshop - only this time on YouTube.

-Patrick
howandtao.com

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: pdq
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 10:21 PM

My post involving nylon string guitars was:

1) an attempt at humor (broadly defined)

2) required that a person do all four items listed

3) was not intended to knock Classical guitars (which are best used for Classical music, IMHO)

Sorry if anyone was offended.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: iancarterb
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 10:53 PM

Don Firth and Deckman gave terrific advice, and everybody's encouragemnet is good. My own advice has alway been that 80% comes back afeter two weeks (except for the brain or hand injury cases), and the other 20 is a function of how long it's been. Sounds like you've had a fortuitous choice of instrument and friends. carter b

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 19 Dec 06 - 11:12 PM

Are you the "Goodman" I remember from the Seattle area? PM me if you are. Bob

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 20 Dec 06 - 07:51 AM

Linda, thanks for PMing me. I answered your note privatly. Stick with it! Bob

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Mooh
Date: 20 Dec 06 - 09:34 AM

It's a wonderful idea! Every so often someone calls me with essentially the same concern, they really want to restart the guitar after a very long layoff. Most actually stick with it, at least caually, but some really take a shine the second time. There's nothing to loose and lots to gain in self-amusement/enjoyment/awareness/image and potentially a whole new or renewed social base.

Be encouraged. To paraphrse someone much more perceptive than me, "Everyone wants to be, but the real fun is in the becoming."

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Scrump
Date: 20 Dec 06 - 10:04 AM

The best advice of all is to stop wasting time reading all this undoubtedly good advice, and get playing!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 20 Dec 06 - 10:08 AM

LOL That occurred to me!! No danger. I can't play very long anyhow. Boy, talk about motivation...
--Linda

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 10:53 AM

Guitar again,

Mudcat people have been very helpful and asking me how it's going, learning to play after 35 years off. Here's an update after about a month.

I've been enjoying the guitar a lot, It's somewhat taking over my life. It's a ¾ sized nylon-stringed guitar that has a lovely warm sound and has been kind to the fingers, which are toughening up nicely. Most of what I could do in 1969 has re-emerged – which was "go-to-the-candy-store" picking and six or so of the easiest chords. For last week's local Open Sing I prepared a couple hundred times over my first-ever playing/singing in public to people who weren't my family or next-door neighbor, and I played and sang "I Still Miss Someone". I chose A, D, E because they were the easiest, safest chords, and are in my (lower) range. I got through the song without fumbling or blanking out (my big fear) and it was really well-received. Kind of threw me when people started singing along. Nobody ever did that when I was alone in my dorm room at school! My so-carefully-prepared soulful rendition of the singing was completely drowned out. Next time I won't work at it so hard! Next month I'm moving on to a G, C, D song with quicker chord changes. I can do a C without wincing now. I still only know one picking pattern. I'm afraid they are all going to have to sit through my old late '60's repertoire before I'm able to learn anything new. Not entirely a bad thing.

I'm taking lessons. I wasn't planning on weekly lessons, but think it's good – makes me really work at it every day. Using the Mel Bay classical book, I'm p-a-i-n-f-u-l-l-y slowly working through learning what those notes are in first position (as opposed to memorizing a few chord patterns). The first week it was just chaos. Now I'm up to two notes at once – and as slow as in the beginning.

I also sat in the Open Band at the Contra Dance this past Friday and tried to strum along on occasion. I thought maybe I could see what chords people were playing and catch on, but of course they were playing higher up the neck so I mostly couldn't recognize what they were. Even when I thought I knew what I was doing, and I think I was in tune, it mostly did not sound right to me, but I played pretty softly, not doing much damage in that big group. The leader telling us that something was in the key of A or G wasn't much use to me, because I couldn't remember what the other chords are, but once in awhile I could see an A or G or D coming in time and got in a couple of strums. The person sitting next to me (from the Getaway) helped also. Once I was playing on the entirely wrong fret, which the mandolin player in front of me pointed out. Oops!. But there are books of the tunes, with the chords, and the band makes Podcasts of what they play, so now I'm learning some of those songs, and will be more ready to play by ear next time. However, when I dance other times, now it's a bit harder. I get distracted because I can hear "there's where it goes up to the fourth", or "Oh, here's "Homage a Edmond Parizeau"!! (the best Contra tune there is—just sends everybody into outer space) and then I forget what step I'm supposed to be doing!

A lot farther than I imagined I would get in a month. Next week I'm taking a trip and will take along a beginning book of theory, I think things will start falling in place there also. Thanks, Mudcat posters for the advice and encouragement!

--Linda

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: fat B****rd
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 10:55 AM

What else is there to say,GO GIRL !!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 10:58 AM

Sounds like you're progressing nicely. Keep it up! Bob

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Scrump
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 10:58 AM

I hope you realise that now you've started, you won't be able to stop! :-)

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Deckman
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 12:41 PM

I'll bet that she can find a twelve step program for it!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 01:06 PM

The octave?

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: Leadfingers
Date: 15 Jan 07 - 01:20 PM

Linda - Glad to hear its 'coming together for you !
For practice , try the basic Chord run in different keys -
C , Am , F , G , G7 , etc If you can do C , G , D , A , E and F you can play most things !
But the main thing is to Have Fun !!

Subject: RE: Relearning Guitar After 35 Years Off
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 16 Jan 07 - 04:56 AM

Once you have learnt the run Leadfingers suggests, learn the trick of transposing.

I.e. taking a tune from C Major to D major moves it up 2 frets,

then you can buy a capo and bang away with the rest of them!

:-)