BS - This parenting thing is so hard

Subject: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 12:15 AM

Our family has an animal mad child who over the years has filled our house with cats, dogs, mice, rats, lizards, snakes, frogs -- all sorts. When she moved out two years ago (to be nearer to the school where she is studying for a Vet Tech's diploma) the reptiles were smuggled into her apartment but the bull mastiff and five cats stayed home (the dog being too large and the cats too mobile to smuggle!).

Anyway, she and I went to the vet today with one of the cats who has lost a huge amount of weight. The result of the ultrasound was a 99.9% certain verdict of lymphoma for the cat - Tucker. My lovely, gutsy, bright, capable 21 year old daughter just sobbed. Wouldn't you do ANYTHING you could to take pain away from them? I think seeing your child in pain is the worst feeling in the world. Before I had kids I was incredibly selfish - now I am STILL selfish but just moderately so but know there are at least three people in the world I will always put before me. Being a parent is TOUGH.

So I am going to take my glass of wine to bed and shed a few tears for this damned cat who I have come to love but more for the hurting daughter who I have always and will always love. I'll think about the time we had her pet mouse euthanized (cancer then too) and the time she cried for a week when the Shetland pony she used to ride passed on the greener pastures.......goodnight, everyone - thanks for listening.....may your animals live long and healthy lives (and your kids, too, of course!)

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 12:16 AM

Please could the elves move this to BS - where it should be and where I intended it to be - many thanks.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: CapriUni
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 12:19 AM

Hugs to you. Hugs to your Daughter. Hugs to the kitty (in spirit).

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Linda Goodman Zebooker
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 12:23 AM

Your daughter will benefit immensely from knowing you care - that she doesn't have to go through the pain alone.
Take care,
--Linda

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 01:11 AM

The things they become attached to--my daughter had a fish that became ill while she was away at college this fall and we had an ongoing discussion about treating it. I had to euthanize the fish (clove oil and then vodka) and though it was just a little betta, it was a sad day to have to put down the fish that had been on her desk for the last year she lived here at home.

The cats and the dogs are mine (this I judge because I walk the dogs, I scoop the poop, I feed them all, and I pay the vet bills) but I know many friends who have accumulated their children's pets over the years. The kids know I'm maxed out as far as the village allows (and as far as the vet bills allow!)

SRS

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Paul Burke
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 03:12 AM

Sorry for her. If a person has got to 21 and hasn't realised that death is part of life, and is training to be a vet, she's a lot of sobbing yet to do. If she's like that over a cat, how will she cope when you die?

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 06:01 AM

Paul, I believe your post is a little insensitive to the reality of the death of something/someone close...Some people go through much of their early life without experiencing the death of someone or something close and as a consequence they do not build any framework of the death/ life cycle.
I am now 58 yrs old and I cried when my mother died of cancer last August...I have seen death...perhaps with having been in the Police force...more than most...but you can never be prepared for when someone or something close to you dies. Arriving at the scene of an accident and 'the job' took over when there were serious injuries or death....I ALWAYS felt down and even cried when getting home after a shift where I had to deal with violent premature death. I also felt aggrieved and saddened for the relatives of the person. I also had to deal with the death of animals in accidents and to inform owners of their demise.....they suffered LOSS and as a result had to go through the grief and mourning process just as we do for loved ones.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 07:49 AM

Often enough people get more obviously upset at the death of a pet than a family member. There can be constraints wired into us, especially in some cultures, that can inhibit us from showing grief too openly, and the death of animals can bypass these.   

It's rather the same way people who are dry-eyed at funerals can find themselves breaking up over a song or a story. Typically men, but not just men.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: jacqui.c
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 07:59 AM

So sorry Deb, losing a loved pet is a sad business. We become so attached to these little animals that will give unconditional love and can be the source of so much amusement. Please give Mim a big hug from me.

I know what you mean about wanting to take the pain away. There have been a number of times when I have wanted to do that for my children. The only thing that I could tell myself was that every experience, good or bad, would help them to grow as human beings and, hopefully, to become more mature and compassionate people.

Paul - I hope the day never comes when I don't cry over the loss of a beloved pet. I would not want to become that insulated against life itself.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: SINSULL
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 08:27 AM

As a child I was finally allowed to have a cat in a houseful of dogs. Poor kitty was hit by a car when I was at school. I was about ten.

At eighteen, I was told quite by accident that in fact the cat had left a litter of kittens and she and her family were carted off to the ASPCA. I still cry for her. And I have never forgiven my mother.
You have been a good mother to your daughter and her pets. I have seen how they have the run of the house.

Paul - death is a part of life. I have seen seen young men and old men cry for a lost pet. It is normal and healthy to mourn the death of a loved one. My vet in NY shed a few tears when Susie finally succumbed to cancer after a long battle with unexplainable infections. A vet who understands the pain is a very valuable asset.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Sorcha
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 08:45 AM

I don't want a vet or tech that isn't at least sad at putting animals down.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: MMario
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 09:20 AM

In some ways losing a pet is more devastating then losing a family member; because society does not support you in your loss in the same way. You get a lot of "it's a *PET*, get over it*" type comments.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Maryrrf
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 09:53 AM

I completely sympathize on both counts. Many times I've seen my kids go through disillusionments, disappointments, upsetting love affairs, etc. and thought I wished there was some way I could wave a magic wand and make everything allright. We can't of course, they have to go through these things on their own, but that doesn't make it any easier for a mom. And, regarding the loss of a pet - I've been there and I have a 13 year old dog who is not doing well, so will be facing it again in the near future, I expect. While one cannot equate the loss of a pet with the loss of a beloved person, they do occupy a place in our lives and hearts that is unique.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: leeneia
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 10:09 AM

"My lovely, gutsy, bright, capable 21 year old daughter just sobbed."

Trubrit, that is not normal behavior for somebody 21 years old. I think you need to analyze about your daughter's life. Is she getting enough sleep? Is she taking more classes than she can handle? Are friends/boyfriend causing her problems?

If there are problems, then help her deal with them.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: MMario
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 10:11 AM

leenia - I'd be more worried about the 21 year olds I know if they got that kind of news and didn't tear up!

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: MBSLynne
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 10:15 AM

leeneia I can't believe you just said that. It is total bullshit! If you think that's not normal behaviour I think it's you who should be analyzing your life! The loss of a beloved pet can be devastating, not least because they are so reliant and dependant on you. I don't know many pet owners who haven't shed tears at the loss pets. I certainly have and I tend to be less anthropomorphic about animals than some people

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Maryrrf
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 10:33 AM

I know very few people who wouldn't shed tears at the loss of a beloved pet - sounds like completely normal behavior to me!

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 10:36 AM

Quite right, and anyway it was her pet, not some strange animal that she met up with at work.
G.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Alaska Mike
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 11:22 AM

The first job I had when I moved my family to Anchorage was running the city's Animal Control Shelter. For 4 years I started my workday out with a cup of coffee in one hand and a syringe of Pentathol in the other. Each morning I would kill 30 or 40 dogs and cats in order to make room for the 30 or 40 that would be coming in that day. Most of them gentle and loving animals. I became very skilled at providing a pain free death. But I never became comfortable with this duty. I know how close pets and their owners become, and I truly sympathize with the loss of your cat.

Mike

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 11:30 AM

"that is not normal behavior for somebody 21 years old."

I think that is absolute undiluted nonsense. Sorry, leeneia, but
it really is.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 12:08 PM

leeneia...please go back to the start of the thread and read my posting re what Paul Burke had said...I would like to direct my comments also to you.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 12:30 PM

A little parable here: From the time when my daughter was very young I encouraged her and supported her in thinking for herself, and to recognize and deal with the consequences. One of my brothers, with a daughter just six months older than mine, cautioned me that my daughter was too self confident and was going to get hurt.

I responded by saying that life would deal her enough blows that she would discover quickly enough that there were limits to what she could do. In the meantime I wanted her to go into life with her head held high and eager.

My daughter, now 44 years old, grew up to be a caring, capable, can-do person with a family that she nurtures very much the way I did her.

And when she and her family suffer loss, she cries.

Finally, when it comes to grief, no one can tell anyone else how to do it, how much to feel and how to show it.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: ranger1
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 01:11 PM

I got the news that one of my cats had a gigantic abdominal tumor, and, as she was almost 20, we made the decision to have her put down. I was 35 and I, too, broke down and sobbed. It's never easy, especially when it happens so close to the holidays.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 02:56 PM

From time to time it has occurred to me that an inordinate number of personal losses seem to happen around significant dates. Is it possible, unwitting as it may be, that the person or pet or event chooses a date that will be memorable for all foreseen time?

Maybe we should be grateful, maybe we should be glad that we will always remember.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Charmion
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 03:33 PM

Now, Ebbie, you know that's just magical thinking. Cats don't have calendars and don't care that we do.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: jeffp
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 04:30 PM

I have lost two wives and several pets. I cried for each of them. It's a natural reaction to loss. If you didn't care so much, it wouldn't hurt like this.

My sympathies.

Jeff

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: catspaw49
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 04:57 PM

When I think how many times I have cried over the loss of great friends.............some walked on two legs and some on four.

Leeneia & Paul Burke:

When I read those two posts above what I wanted to do was scream at you both, tell you you're completely fucked up, pathetic little creatures, lacking in even the vaguest idea of love and caring, and you need an injection of either friendship and compassion or a lethal dose of morphine.

I decided against that as too much truth can be damaging to the psyche of even total cretins like yourselves. Instead I suggest you just kiss my ass.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 05:10 PM

I get totally what you're saying about the parenting thing. I've involved Limpit in the decisions for both the cats we've lost over the past 22 months, the second less than a week ago. I sobbed more than she did over Max, but she knows it was the right thing for him. I could have wished she were a bit older or more mature before she had to deal with the death of a creature she loved so much, but hopefully she'll learn to deal with each death a little better.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 06:07 PM

Ebbie, your observation about losses ocurring around significant dates....I remember reading some years ago that men tend to die before events and women after.....women seem to have the capacity to stay alive until after the birthday but men mostly die just before...same with Christmas...I presume a lot of study has gone into this...give me something to research in the New Year.
Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: GUEST, Ebbie
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 07:56 PM

Magical thinking or not, Charmion, I still wonder. There are still a number of things I don't know. :)

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 08:55 PM

I opened the thread with a little trepadition thinking I was being overly sentimental but these wonderful responses (mostly wonderful) make me glad I did it. I think her reaction was totally normal and understandable -- my thread was more to do with -- wouldn't you as a parent do ANYTHING to take the pain away if you could? But you can't - and that is the price you pay for being a parent I guess. She sobbed, I cried and now we are both on track for making the cat as comfortable as he can be for as long as possible. Sounds like pretty normal behavior to me!!!!!

Hope everyone has a wonderful holiday. I am checking out for about 10 days -- relatives coming in from England, rushing here there and everywhere......back in the New Year.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: katlaughing
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 11:25 PM

Hi, Deb. I meant to post a link to this, this morning, but got busy. Then when I searched for it, I couldn't find it for the life of me. I know what you mean about when a child loses a pet, even if they are considered "adults." Here's an excerpt from my book I think you may like:

All Horses Go to Heaven

      My youngest daughter, Rue, called me from her grandma's in New Hampshire. She and her dad, Rog, had driven up for a quick visit, while we held the fort down in Connecticut.

"Mom, you have to tell Dad I can have her! They want to give me this horse and she's 3/4 Arab and 1/4 Connemara and sweet and just tell him to say `yes'!" she said working me for all it was worth. We'd all been missing our old horse we'd had back in Wyoming.

It seemed there was a wonderful 4H horse, who'd been out to pasture for eight years and was available for free to the right kid. Stabled at Roger's old riding master's place, she was fat and sassy, but small enough to be tempered by a kid who knew who was supposed to be boss.
We were renting...didn't tell the landlord...had four acres and lots of grass. Long story short...we had to move because of the horse and had to find a stable for her.

Starting in 1987, Rue worked everyday at a stables, working up from mucking out stalls, starting at ten years old, to in charge of the barn and horses on weekends, by the time she was thirteen. She started out trading for lessons, then when the horse, Tamarans Martini, came along in 1989, she bartered her way into getting paid. She paid for all of the upkeep of her beautiful little Arab. Martini rewarded her with so many hours of riding, currying, snuffling in pockets and just general companionship with unconditional love. This horse was a gem, the perfect horse for a kid, just feisty enough to keep her on her toes and keep her learning.


We drove out to see her everyday. What a wonderful way for a parent and child to bond. We went through so much to make sure that horse was well taken care of and nurtured. My favourite picture of the two of them is one I snapped while following her in the car while she walked her up to the vet's. Martini had a swishy butt, she sashayed, flicking her tail this way and that, a saucy little Arab feeling fine, long dark tail going back and forth, with this little girl, no more than 4'8" leading her on, her own almost black auburn thick ponytail, swinging down her back to her waist in tempo with Mart's tail. What a pair!

When it came time for us to move back to the West, we discussed what to do with Mart. Rue saved up her money, good family friends in Colorado offered a home for free and before we even had our moving van loaded, the horse was gone in a fancy trailer to her new home.
That new home was four hours drive from where we lived in Wyoming. Our horse was now in the same town as my sister, so we went down as often as possible to see her. My second favourite picture of Martini is when my dad drove over from Utah to see her and us. There they were, the two of them, him in his seventies, her already in her thirties, looking kind of grey, the old horse and my dad who somehow wasn't as tall as I remembered. Both of them looking so wise and knowing of the other, speaking the same easy, quiet language. My dad, a natural born horse whisperer before the term was coined.

Until recently, Rue still rode Martini who was still quite the Queen Bee, lording it over all of the other horses. One day they all got out and started running down the road. There she was, 14.5 hands high, out in front of the "boys", all bigger than her, leading them astray. They all knew better than to try to usurp the Matriarch's position and risk her lightning fast kick to the chest to keep them in line.

The winter before last we weren't sure she would make it. Her teeth were going and the Colorado winters were long and cold. She seemed content, though, hanging about in the high altitude sunshine in the mornings, in her stall at night. She made it. Then, this past winter, a mild one, they had to start feeding her mushier food, but she made it through, even outlasting a couple of others about the place. In January, we reckoned she was 35 years old.

    Yesterday, Saturday morning, Rue called me, almost incoherent with tears. Martini had shown signs of wanting to wander off and be alone, not eating and drinking. The vet had been called, our friend was with her. Martini, ever a horse with her own mind about doing things, didn't wait for the vet. She laid herself down and died. The kindest and final gift this beautiful old curmudgeonly, doting horse could give my youngest, my "baby", doing it on her own terms, so that poor Rue didn't have to make the decision for her. I am so grateful to the "auld" beauty for that.

So, here's to Tamarans Martini...one hell of a horse and friend, who is very sadly missed.

© 2004 Kathleen LaFrance
All Rights Reserved

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Dec 06 - 11:32 PM

Beautiful, kat.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: GUEST,Scoville at Dad's
Date: 23 Dec 06 - 12:31 AM

It doesn't get easier. Vet techs cry for other peoples' pets as well as their own (would you want somebody treating your pet who didn't care?). I came home from work after a particularly hard day and burst into tears over a dead animal I saw on a news report.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: MBSLynne
Date: 23 Dec 06 - 07:36 AM

I work on a farm, and it is in the nature of nature for death to occur. I have to close my mind when the pigs and the young bulls go off to slaughter after I've fed and looked after them, and that is difficult, but I am ready for that so I don't get to know them in the same way. But I still spend two or three days grieving when any of the cows die or come to the end of their lives and have to go. These are not pets, as such, but I milk then every day, and because it is a small herd (only 16 cows) and they are also show-cows, so handled more than most dairy animals, I know them all individually. I know their names, their personalities. I know which one will hog all the food and demand more. I know which one will stomp on the milking pipe if I don't hurry and give her her rations and I know which one will always be five minutes after the others coming up from the field. I also know which one will rest her head against me and close her eyes in ecstacy when I scratch her ears. I have been in this job for several years now, and it NEVER becomes any easier when they die.

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: MBSLynne
Date: 23 Dec 06 - 07:46 AM

In answer to TRUBRIT's main point. Yes, my children's pain hurts more than my own and I would do ANYTHING to prevent hurt or harm to them. If anyone ever inflicted serious hurt on one of my children, I would hunt them down and, not only kill them, but torture them, making sure they knew who I was and why I was doing it. Sorry, but that's how I feel. Hurt such as TRUBRIT is describing is almost worse in one way though because there is not really anything you can do.

Trouble is, since I had children I find that the pain of other people's children hurts me too. Not with the same intensity, but still it distresses much more than when I was childless. I have always had a very vivid imagination. Or perhaps it's very strong empathy. Whatever, when I hear news stories about pain, harm and damage to people's children, I feel it very strongly, and it does hurt.

This is going on a bit, but just to make those of you who feel like me feel a bit happier: A few months ago a 14 year old boy who goes to my son't school was badly hurt in a jet-ski accident while on holiday with his family. His skull and eye-socket werer fractured and the3 frontal lobe of his brain damaged. For the first two days they really thought he wouldn't make it but he did and was flown back to England where he underwent 6 hours of brain surgery to remove fluid and an abscess. If all that wasn't bad enough, his parents discovered that their holiday insurance didn't cover it so they have had to shell out thousands that they couldn't really afford. The local community tose up almost as one and there were so many fund raising events and so many local businessmen contributed that thousands were raised to help. Then a few days ago I got the local paper, and the story on the front made me cry. No, it wasn't sad. Matthew, the child who was hurt, against all odds, has been able to come home for Christmas with his family, and it looks very hopeful that he will make a full recovery. Who could ask for a better Christmas present than that?

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: jacqui.c
Date: 23 Dec 06 - 07:59 AM

Lovely posts Lynne and Kat.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Becca72
Date: 23 Dec 06 - 10:54 AM

I lost a very dear cat last spring and the first thing I did was call my father and sobbingly ask if I could bury her in his yard as I live in an apartment and couldn't bear the thought of turning her over to the vet. I was a total mess on the phone and cried for hours afterward. I think Dad would have given me the moon if I'd asked for it that day (and probably any other day). I'm 34 and not ashamed in the least to have loved a creature so completely as to be totally heartbroken when she had to leave.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 23 Dec 06 - 04:58 PM

Again I say it -- what a terrific site and what wonderful people who post on it. To MBSLynne I say, -- I agree with you 100%. When my daughters come home with new boyfriends, I routinely tell them 'in fun' that if they hurt the girls, I will kill them -- and I think they need to know that!!!!!!! My dad died when I was 13 and I am incredibly old now so many many years ago, I remember my dad saying he would 'swing for ' anyone who hurt his girls. I never understood the intensity of the passion....I get it now. One daughter, I think, is getting ready to announce an engagement to someone I wouldn't have picked (but what the hell ... I don';t have to live with him). So I pointed out to her if she was happy, her dad and I were happy but we would - of course - kill the young man if he hurt her. I don't feel quite as wierd now.........thanks MBSLynne - and thanks to everyone else. It helps.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 22 Feb 07 - 10:46 PM

Quick update to the animal mad ones out there -- I posted on 12/22 that we discovered one of our five cats had cancer and my daughter (the vet tech, not my daughter the teacher) was devastated. Today said cat, Tucker, was euthanized.....the great thing about having a vet tech in the family is they pull weight with vets. The vet came to our house to do the dark deed. I chose to be out but came home to a quiet and sad house with a big Tucker shaped gap in it. Damn! He was a great cat - RIP.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Janie
Date: 22 Feb 07 - 10:49 PM

I'm so sorry Deborah.

{{{{{{{{{{{{hug}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Janie

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 22 Feb 07 - 10:51 PM

Thank you Janie -- I am heading to bed with a glass of wine to have ' a bit of a wallow ' in sentimentality.....

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Feb 07 - 11:25 PM

It's a real art in parenting, to spare your children as much pain as possible while at the same time, preparing them for a life that will, of course, involve pain along the way. The hardest thing is to stand beside them and let them make the decision, and let them cry. You cheat your child if you DON'T teach them how to deal with hardship and loss.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Amos
Date: 22 Feb 07 - 11:30 PM

Losses cause grief. Those who can't feel it when it happens will feel it later, at some really inappropriate time. It doesn't just go away because you suppress it into silence. It waits its time.

The person who feels grief at a time of loss is far saner, to my mind, than the person who feels it when it is no longer happening, and it is no longer part of the present time.

And far more likely to move on and out of it in a normal period.

21 or 50 or 90.


A

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: KT
Date: 22 Feb 07 - 11:55 PM

Holding you in my heart,TRUBRIT.

KT

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: LilyFestre
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 01:19 AM

We lost our dog Abu this week to cancer and share in your feeling of the empty spot.

Love to you, your family and all the other critters,

LQF

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Partridge
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 01:49 AM

Pets just don't live long enough, you get used to them round the house and their unconditional love. The gap they leave when they die can be massive. I still have a huge black lab gap in my life.

Thinking of you and yours,

love

Pat xx

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Barry Finn
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 02:29 AM

Sorry for you & your daughter Deborah. Would any songs help?

Barry

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: MBSLynne
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 02:45 AM

My thoughts to you.

Yes, I have a dog-shaped gap in my life too and have had for four years now. It's been made worse recently when my boss's dog, who always came running barking to the gate when I arrived on the farm, had to be put down due to cancer. It's amazing how loud the lack of a sound is.

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: The PA
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 03:57 AM

On Wednesday morning this week, we turned up at the stables as usual at 5.00am to 'do' the horses before going to work. My friend's horse Maggie was down in her stable in agony with colic. We called her owner and the vet and to cut a very long and traumatic story short we hitched up the trailer, loaded Maggie, and raced down the M5 and the M50 to the equine hospital in Tewkesbury. The vet team were waiting for us and within 40 minutes Maggie was in surgery undergoing a 4 hour operation for a twisted gut. I dont have to describe the feelings and emotions that we experienced that morning.
Two days on she has survived the surgery but is by no means out of the woods, the part of the gut that had twisted had started to die off the she now has massive amounts of toxins in the body which we only hope she can fight off. She will be in hospital for at least 10 days.
Maggie is a 15 year old Connemara and Lucy has had her all her life. Lucy and I have travelled and competed together for at least 10 years. My horse Red, who's 14, and Maggie have been best buddies for most of their lives and are inseperable.
When I brought Red in to his stable on Wednesday night, he stopped dead outside Maggies empty stable looked over the door and called to her.
That just about finished everyone off. The whole yard disolved into tears - even the men. Everyone hugged Red and tried to tell him that his best friend will be home soon. God - I just hope she is.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 04:55 AM

Thoughts are with you Deborah.

It seems to be a bad week for animals. My Shadow cat has developed a wobble in her walk that in a human would signify a stroke or nerve damage to her back. I'm hoping it's a strained muscle as she fell off the chair a few days back... but given her history of epileptic fits (we found the trigger and stopped doing it when she was around) it's probably in her brain. I'm loathe to take her to the vets when she's still functioning normally, it's too soon after Max last December, but I know it'll come soon.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 10:03 AM

I was at the vet's office a couple of weeks ago and happened to read some of the fliers for animals for sale and those needing good homes. There were two adult dogs they listed that had to go together--they were littermates and had been together all of their lives.

My two (aged about 2 years and 2.5 years) weren't companions until about a year and a half ago, but they bonded instantly. My pitbull craved another dog to play with and as a big playful puppy was almost uncontrollable if we met other dogs on a walk.

I visited the Humane Society and selected three dogs to consider as companions for my dog. They were high energy to match my dog, and I brought Cinnamon down to the shelter to meet at least one. The worker brought Poppy out and the two went through a flurry of moves in about 30 seconds--they gave out excited yelps, they both ended up rolling over on their backs, and finally, sat chest to chest licking each other's faces. I know more about dogs now and would do it a bit differently next time, but they have turned out to be a great match and are inseparable. So if ever they had to find a new home (one of those "over my dead body" scenarios) I'd hope they would be placed together. Same with my cats, who have been together for years.

Anyone who read the James Herriot vet books years ago remembers all of his stories about companion animals and animals mourning. I think for some people those stories made it "okay" to acknowledged that animals do have emotions, that it isn't projected human emotion.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: ranger1
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 02:30 PM

Deb, I'm so sorry about Tucker. He was a really sweet cat and I very much enjoyed making a fuss over him on Boxing Day. I'm glad that the vet could come to your house and do it so that he didn't have to spend his last moments dealing with the stress and trauma of travelling to the vet's office. I'll save my hugs for you for tomorrow.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Becca72
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 04:26 PM

Deb,
I'm so sorry for your and your daughter's loss. He sounds like a wonderful boy. It's alway so sad to see them go.

My sister had to have her dog put down about 3 years ago and the vet they use came to the house as well. It really made thing so much more calm. Definitely the way to go if you can handle it emotionally.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: *daylia*
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 06:25 PM

TRUBRIT, my heart goes out to you and your daughter. I do know where she is coming from. Over the last couple weeks, I've been facing just the POSSIBILITY of having to put my 14 year old kitty down. Not because of illness, but because I've had to relocate my private music studio into the tiny little house I share with the cat. Some of my students are allergic to her, and there's simply no longer a suitable place for an indoor litterbox. I've had to leave it in the back porch, where she does not always have access to it. I cannot make her stay in the porch with it when its 30 below - the porch has no heat, electricity or insulation. And as I tried to figure out how to overcome these snags, the poor cat has soiled and ruined about $500 worth of furniture and blankets since Christmas.

:-(

Much as I love her, I just lost it. I figured she had to go -- but I knew no-one who could take her.   Not even the SCPA -- she is so old she has slim to NO chances for adoption. THey couldn't turn me away, they told me, but in compassion for the cat -- who would absolutely HATE being held in a compound with other animals (she is NOT used to other animals at all), I would be better off to put her down.

That was one of the hardest days of my life, standing at the SPCA while they told me the news, offering me Kleenex and much sympathy. I cried off and on for the rest of the day, holding onto her.

And I am 48 -- a far cry from 21.

I just can't do it. I cannot put down a healthy animal that I love because of housekeeping difficulties. So I decided -- I will put up with the litter box in my kitchen during the night. I will run a cord from the garage so I can plug in a heating pad for her when she has to stay out on the porch while I'm teaching. I will clean the carpets EVERY DAY to make sure her hair doesn't bother anyone. I will make sure the litter box is IN the house every time I leave, even if only for a few minutes. Its a lot of extra work and stress, I know, but hey.

She is worth it.

ANd I am too.

Again, all the best TRUBRIT. ANd don't worry. Your daughter's behaviour is very normal and very human, at least in my book!

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 07:56 PM

love is normal

To be void of love is not.

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 23 Feb 07 - 11:05 PM

Thank you all so much for great warm thoughts. Tami, I will collect that hug tomorrow. Barry, songs, friends and hugs always help I have found.....

Golly - being a parent is so tough. Give me a nice easy task like climbing Everest any time......

Subject: RE: BS - This parenting thing is so hard
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 04 Mar 07 - 01:06 AM

But being a parent has its 'up' times too! Entertained our oldest daughter's boyfriend's parents for dinner tonight (lots of apostrophes - hope I got them right......). So nice to hear other adults validate what you believe about your daughter -- that she is the BEST .... decent people, decent son, loves my daughter- -- can't be so bad..........

And daughter #2 calling and asking us to drop everything and pick her up and then calling up and apologizing for being inconsiderate ....

And child # three - still in school and passing every class .... if he keeps this up he will GRADUATE.......

Life aint so bad.