Political songs on Aboriginal rights

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Neil D
Date: 17 May 11 - 10:33 PM

"From Little Things Big Things Grow" is a wonderful song. I could listen to it over and over. There is a version on Youtube being performed by Kev, Paul Kelly and Jon Butler that kicks ass. Here's another gem from Kev Carmody. If you click on the Show More arrow you'll see the lyrics. "Thou Shalt Not Steal"

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Allen in Oz
Date: 17 May 11 - 07:45 PM

Gary Shearston sang a Kath Walker song about Aborigines:
" Must we native old Australians
In our own land rank as aliens...'
etc

All good stuff

AD

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Gallus Moll
Date: 17 May 11 - 07:33 PM

Look out for the documentary film 'Murandak' which I believe is to be released this month, it was shown at Womadelaide in March (Archie Roach was in concert, also interviewed later the same day),
Murandak follows the recent struggle to win the apology from the Australian Government, and has some great songs and performers on it, gives good insight into the way Aboriginals have been treated.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST
Date: 17 May 11 - 09:29 AM

I am searching for Helen Black, campaigner for Aboriginal rights and visited the UK in the late 80s and stayed with me. Please constact Rashmi Chopra at [e-mail]

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,bankley
Date: 29 Apr 10 - 08:46 AM

so what's the question ?
check out 'Anthem for Dissent' by Splitting the Sky. It's on youtube. Also 'Blackfire' which is a kick-ass Dene/Navajo trio...
'One Nation Under'

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 06 Aug 09 - 08:33 AM

email from Bruce Watson -

Just out of interest, I re-recorded the song (The Man & the Woman & the Edison Phonograph) with Ronnie Summers in Tasmania earlier this year. He is Fanny Cochrane Smith's great great grandson, so we are 'related by song'(!) The recording will be published later this year in a package with a book called 'Ronnie: Tasmanian Songman'
http://catalogue.nla.gov.au/Record/4598926?lookfor=subject-browse:%22Aboriginal%20Australian%20musicians%20--%20Tasmania%20--%20Cape%20Barren%20Island%20--%20Biography%22&offset=1&max=1

And it will be on my next CD.

I have also written a song about massacres called "The War Without a Name" and have just finished one on language extinction in Australia.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,folk1e
Date: 03 Aug 09 - 03:03 PM

Unless I missed it the Roy Bailey song is "Hard Times"
10 years on I guess you already knew that!

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 03 Aug 09 - 03:44 AM

Google images of Fanny Cochrane Smith (& a few ring-ins!)

see also the flickr reference on page 1 for Flickr pool pics of Indigeneous Australians

sandra

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 03 Aug 09 - 03:38 AM

Bruce Watson is a great grandson of Dr Horace Watson who recorded Fanny Cochrane Smith's songs

Bruce wrote a song about the recording session - The Man & the Woman & the Edison Phonograph - & recorded it on his CD "Out of My Window" using the archival pic of Fanny & Horace, as well as some of Fanny's songs in his song.

sandra

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Rowan
Date: 03 Aug 09 - 01:20 AM

References to (and, I think, discussions of) Fanny Cochrane's recordings have also appeared elsewhere on Mudcat, but it's good to have them referenced in this context as well.

Dominique has made several interesting (and important) contributions to Mudcat; I do so wish she'd become a member so we could tempt her with PMs: "Private Messages to the uninitiated.

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,Dominique
Date: 06 Mar 09 - 11:29 PM

The NFSA text to Fanny Cochrane does not acknowledge Ronnie Summers or other contemporary Tasmanian Aboriginal musician/composers.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,Dominique
Date: 06 Mar 09 - 08:34 AM

1899 - Fanny Cochrane Smith's recordings of Tasmanian Aboriginal songs

(NFSA Collection: Title No 500445 (exerpt))

The only recorded example of Tasmanian Aboriginal songs - and the only recorded example of Tasmanian Aboriginal language. Fanny Cochrane Smith was born on Flinders Island and married a sealer, William Smith. In late 1899 and 1903 she recorded for the Royal Society in Hobart all the Tasmanian songs that she knew. She recorded six cylinders in both English and the Tasmanian Aboriginal language.

Fanny cochrane SmithImage file: Fanny Cochrane Smith recording with Dr Harold Watson.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Rowan
Date: 05 Mar 09 - 07:56 PM

it was suggested that the Tasmanian people A) never learned to make fire (they carried a burning branch with them if they moved), and B) they never learned how to catch fish from the sea----on an island !!
               Any truth in these ??

G'day, bubblyrat.
Rhys Jones has a lot to answer for! He came to Oz (from Wales) and got into Australian archaeology; one of his first efforts was to dig on Hunter Island, off the NW tip of Tasmania. He became extremely influential but, as I recall, never published any "real data" to support his propositions. Being Welsh, he had a very good line in story telling, though.

His thesis was made into a book entitled "The Last Tasmanians" in which the notion that they had "all been exterminated", already widely held by white Taswegians who were nervous about having aspects of their ancestry (Aboriginal ancestry or convict ancestry, in particular) was reified by the authority he brought to his tale; the Tasmanian Aborigines have never really forgiven him for it. His 1969 paper "Firestick farming" was a masterpiece of story telling that hit Oz just after the devastating fires of 1967, especially in Tasmania, and resulted in wholesale changes to the way land management and wildfire management has been conducted in Oz ever since; the thread BS: Bushfires in Australia - Feb 2009 will give some idea of those changes.

Because he didn't find any fish bones in his middens, Rhys Jones argued that the Aborigines who made the middens didn't know how to catch them, conveniently forgetting that he picked up large quantities of shells of shellfish that required much less energy to collect for the same calorific value.

The notion that they didn't know how to start a fire (or know how to use dogs for hunting, unlike the mainland Aborigines) started much earlier and comes from two contexts; when social Darwinism was at its height, the whites in Tassie (and many other places) regarded the Tasmanian Aborigines as the most primitive of the most primitive of Earth's peoples and several canards were promulgated. The inability to start fires, use dogs or (later) catch fish all were asserted despite evidence to the contrary and to support the popular white views. Tassie can be rather damp; the southwest coast gets 12' of rain a year and you can guarantee the last 12" are still on the top of the ground in buttongrass swamps. It's easier to carry a fire than start one anew in such circumstances. Within a few months of whites settling at Hobart, dogs were being used by the local Aborigines to hunt food animals in exactly the same ways as mainland Aborigines but both observations never made into the prejudiced mainstream thought.

But, acknowledging his faults, I regarded Rhys (now "late", as McCall Smith puts it) as a good archaeologist and a good friend.

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: katlaughing
Date: 05 Mar 09 - 05:26 PM

NeilD...so glad you liked both of those! There rest of the songs on Secola's CD are just as catchy, but I LOVE NDN Cars and I've had some like that, too!!

Rowan...you have so much knowledge...and share it so freely. Thanks!

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: bankley
Date: 05 Mar 09 - 11:57 AM

well, it's great that there are so many Native artists these days.. there's an Aboriginal Music Awards gala in Canada every year, also the Aboriginal Achievement Awards founded by John Kim Bell which is a broad platform for recognizing the contributions made by individuals to their various cultures... 40 odd years back, not much long after the Native people were given the right to vote.. there were only a few singers in North America who addressed the issues... Buffy Ste-Marie, Floyd Red Crow Westerman, Peter LaFarge, Shingoose, and Willie Dunn come to mind.
They really blazed a wide trail for the many who followed...

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: bubblyrat
Date: 05 Mar 09 - 04:52 AM

Thanks for the information,Rowan,it is a most interesting subject.I didn't know about the ethnicity classification system,---it does seem to be a convenient way of making sure that there actually ARE "Aboriginals" left in Tasmania !! On that basis,I am a Viking, or a Roman, I guess !!
          I remember reading about the way in which visiting ships kidnapped native women "for sexual purposes"....the effects must have been quite severe on the breeding stock.Also,it was suggested that the Tasmanian people A) never learned to make fire (they carried a burning branch with them if they moved), and B) they never learned how to catch fish from the sea----on an island !!
               Any truth in these ??

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Andrez
Date: 05 Mar 09 - 04:32 AM

The Bran New Dae Soundtrack is pretty good too. There are a couple of versions but I like the one that originally came out on cassette not to mention the live versions at the Roey on friday nights :-)

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Rowan
Date: 04 Mar 09 - 04:56 PM

I wonder if there are any about the Aboriginals in Tasmania ??They were totally wiped out by white settlers,I believe, the very last one,a Princess I think,dying in the 1920s or thereabouts. If there isn't a song about such an appalling act of genocide as that,then there certainly should be one written !

The myth/contention that they no longer exist has been a sore point among Tasmanian Aborigines for more than a century.

The women among them who went off, voluntarily or kidnapped, with sealers and lived out of view of officialdom were only some of the Tasmanian Aborigines who survived and kept their Aboriginality alive; it still flourishes on the Bass Strait islands and went as far away as Kangaroo Island, off South Australia. [For nonAussies, this would be like Poms finding Gibraltar unoccupied and settling there, which they did but as a result of conquest.]

Whitefellas, with their agricultural approach to ancestry, have often maintained that the only "real" member of any ethnic group (pick any American Native Peoples, Maori, "Englishness" as examples) are those that are "full blooded"; that is to say, their ancestry contains no other outgroups as far back as the ark. In US legislation (if I understand it correctly), this is set in concrete to the extent that, to be legally describable as a member of an indigenous group you must have at least 1/32 of your ancestry in that group. [For some of the smaller groups it is no longer possible to marry within the group to maintain such a definition and thus the group (as so defined) is destined for extinction. SOme might argue that as an example of genocide by administration.]

Australian legislation now accepts other criteria, including one's own identification as Aboriginal and one's acceptance by the group as a member of the group; ancestry has a role but it is not the sole criterion. On that basis, Tasmanian Aborigines are thriving.

While I'm on a roll, I suppose I could mention that the "tribe" concept was brought to Australia by British (some educated and some not) from Africa via North America. While it had some application in North America it had almost none in Oz, where decisions made by groups were (more often than not) made by negotiation. Sometimes the negotiation was more violently lethal than "consensus" but negotiation seems to have been "the go." The British, however, were keen on notions of leadership where one person was regarded as boss cocky and often regarded that person as "a king". They even handed out engraved "King Plates" to selected individuals to be worn as token breast plates.

The notion of Truganinni as "Princess" fits into that aspect of Britishness and had no functional relevance to Tasmanian Aborigines other than accepting her status as a seriously "senior person" and thus keeper of the traditions and lore.

End of rave.

But if you ever get a chance to see "Bran new dae" jump at it!

Cheers, Rowan

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Helen
Date: 04 Mar 09 - 04:00 PM

bubblyrat,

The last Tasmanian Aboriginal person was believed to be a woman called Truganini. Midnight Oil, a rock group, wrote a song called Truganini, but I don't see anything specific in the lyrics about Truganini, just a passing reference.

Midnight Oil: Truganini

(Midnight Oil, IMHO, tend to metaphorically and physically "yell" at people in their songs - didactic songs, this is right, you are wrong type songs - no surprise then that the lead singer is now a politician. Archie Roach, Ruby Hunter, Kev Carmody and whitefella Paul Kelly are good at helping us to see situations through the blackfellas' eyes, and their songs are more powerful as a result, again, IMHO.)

Helen

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,DWR
Date: 04 Mar 09 - 02:39 PM

I just posted the lyrics for Archie Roach's Took The Children Away (with sound sample links) thread.cfm?threadid=119138&messages=1

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,Ian cookieless
Date: 04 Mar 09 - 12:17 PM

Two songs by Bruce Cockburn: 'Red Brother, Red Sister' (on 'Circles In The Stream') and 'Stolen Land' (on 'You Pay Your Money' - though I think it would be a challange to make this work with a choir!).

All the very best,
Ian

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: rich-joy
Date: 04 Mar 09 - 01:31 AM

re Tasmanian Aboriginal story :
Robb Johnson wrote "England's Power and Glory" (in your name was this done, in the name of the bible and the gun), powerfully sung by English singer-songwriter, Maggie Holland, whilst a member of the English Country Blues Band (c.1980s)

Cheers, R-J

PS I think I posted in the recent "Australian Songs of Influence" thread, a link to an earlier thread regarding songs using indigenous music .....

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Neil D
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 04:23 PM

OMG katlaughing what have you done to me. I've listened to NDN Car
25 times since this morning. It is so infectious and I just want to absorb it. I'm not Native but I've had my share of cars like that. So universal. No wonder it's the "Native American National Anthem".
   I am really enjoying discovering the music of Bill Miller as well.
His opening monologue on the "Ghost Dance" video made me want to cry.
His songs are so spiritual and he's a fine guitarist. Thanks so much for the links.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: SINSULL
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 01:29 PM

DOH!
Pithead in the Fern
Yarri of Wiradjuri

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: SINSULL
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 01:26 PM

John Warner, Pitcairn in the Fern

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Celtaddict
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:58 PM

Interesting. That thread was the week I became a member; second time I looked for an obscure song; fascinating responses.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Celtaddict
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:57 PM

Warragul Creek thread

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Celtaddict
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:49 PM

The group Boola Boola from the Gippsland area has an amazingly haunting song "Warragul Creek" about the massacre of the local blacks by a group commanded by a Scots immigrant, MacMillan, who ironically was pushed out of Scotland by the Highland clearances. There is a thread about the song and the history.
The refrain at the end is
Left women like dogs in the back yard
Howling at the moon
The day MacMillan and the boys rode out in the bush and it did boom...

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: bankley
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 11:36 AM

similiar story to the extinct Beotuck people of Newfoundland...

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: bubblyrat
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 08:56 AM

I wonder if there are any about the Aboriginals in Tasmania ??They were totally wiped out by white settlers,I believe, the very last one,a Princess I think,dying in the 1920s or thereabouts. If there isn't a song about such an appalling act of genocide as that,then there certainly should be one written !

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: bankley
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 08:40 AM

there are many by Willie Dunn going back almost 40 years..

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:51 AM

One more: Ghost Dance by Bill Miller.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:46 AM

Making a Noise by Robbie Robertson. Good song and video.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:37 AM

There's always the incredible spoken song by Ulali, All My Relations.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Mar 09 - 12:29 AM

Here's one of my fav. groups and songs, "NDN Car," the "Native American National Anthem" (USA) done by Keith Secola and his Wild Band of Indians.

That's the long, live version. You can see the shorter one HERE.

And, this is just so you know he can do acoustic, too: Keith Secola duo

He's got some other political songs. I'll see if I can find a couple of them.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,webby
Date: 02 Mar 09 - 08:21 PM

If you are interested in Aboriginal Australians read a good short book called "The Song Lines" its written by a Pommy but a goood read non the less. Seriously though it reveals an ancient and exquisitely adapted culture.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Acorn4
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 01:29 PM

Try looking at the work of Paul Metsers. Paul is a New Zealander , now resident in Kendal, who did quite a few songs on this topic, mainly on vinyl.

He doesn't gig a lot nowadays, but I know he has a myspace page

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Emma B
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 01:05 PM

Thanks for the suggestion guest

The Ballad of Crowfoot

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 11:20 AM

for North American '1st Nation' peoples check out Willie Dunn, he's one of the pioneers in this genre... strong writer... many songs and stories written since the late 60's to present,,, fine singer as well...

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: freda underhill
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 09:41 AM

links for those interested in Indigenous Australian songwriters
Kev Carmody

archie roach

ruby hunter

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Wolfgang
Date: 20 Nov 00 - 03:55 AM

I have brought a tape from Australia called 'Pillars of Society'. It has a couple of such songs on it. Beside the tile song there's 'Black deaths in custody', 'Black Beth' etc.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 18 Nov 00 - 08:52 PM

G'day,
Thanks to John in Brisbane the tune for "The Drover's Boy" can be found here at the Mudcat MIDI site.

Cheers,
Alan

Subject: Lyr Add: THE DROVER'S BOY^^
From: MMario
Date: 15 Nov 00 - 12:31 PM

from John_in_brisbane:

THE DROVER'S BOY

They could-n't un-der-stand why the dro-ver cried
As they bu-ried the dro-ver's boy,
For the dro-ver had al-ways seemed so hard
To the men in his em-ploy.
A bolt-ing horse, a stir-rup lost,
and the dro-ver's boy was dead
The sho-velled dirt
and a mut-tered word
and it's back to the road a-head
and for-get a-bout -----the dro-ver's boy

They couldn't understand why the drover cut
A lock of the dead boy's hari,
Put it in the band of his battered old hat
As they watched him standing there.
And he told them "Take the cattle on,
I'll sit with the boy awhile";
A silent thought, a pipe to smoke
And it's ride another mile,
And forget about --- the drover's boy

The couldn't make out why the drover and the boy
Always camped so far away,
For the tall white man and the slim black boy
Had never had musch to say.
And the boy would be gone at the break of dawn
Tail the horses, carry on;
While the drover roused the sleeping men
Daylight ---- hit the road again,
And follow ------the drover's boy.

In the Camooweal pub they talked about
The death of the drover's boy,
They drank their rum with the stranger who'd come
From the Kimberley round Fitsroy
And he told them of the massacre in the West
Barest details, guess the rest
Shoot the bucks, grab a gin,
Cut her hair, break her in,
And call her boy --- the drover's boy.

So when they build the stock-man's hall of fame
and they talk a-bout the dro-ving game
re-mem-ber the girl
who was bed-mate and guide
Rode with the dro-ver side by side
Watched the bul-locks, flayed the hide
faith-ful wife but nev-er a bride
bred his sons for the cat-tle runs
don't weep for the dro-ver's boy
don't mourn for the dro-ver's boy
But don't for-get! The dro-ver's boy

midi sent to alan's midi page, NWC file to DickG.

John- how did you send to Karen before???

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: aussiebloke
Date: 15 Nov 00 - 09:59 AM

And furthermore... Up here in the Top End, you wouldn't use the word Koori - they are 'southern mob'.
Mostly in conversation we get by with the descriptive and non-perjorative 'blackfella or whitefella'.
Cheers...

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: aussiebloke
Date: 15 Nov 00 - 09:54 AM

The song 'From little things big things grow' written by Paul Kelly and Kevin Carmody, recorded by Paul Kelly is worth a look - would be lovely performed by a choir - possibly with a small group as 'narrator' for the verses, and the whole choir for the chorus.

Lyrics here

This quote from the Green Left Weekly.
"From Little Things Big Things Grow" documents the birth of the land rights movement in 1966 when Vincent Lingiarri led a walkoff of Gurindji drovers and reclaimed Wattie Creek. It is an inspiring ballad whose title neatly sums up how justice can be won by ordinary people. It was co-written by Paul Kelly for the episode of the SBS television documentary Bloodbrothers which looked at Carmody and his music.

Cheers..

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: karen jonason
Date: 15 Nov 00 - 08:30 AM

Thanks to all who have revived this thread. I first posted it over a year ago and forgot about it. I look forwad to receiving John in Brisbane's lyrics and music.I won't be able to get it in MIDI. John - you previously set up the music notation for me for the song Rigs of the time and it printed out very well.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Nov 00 - 05:20 AM

Have a listen to a friend of mine Alistair Hulett a Scottish singer/songwriter who lived in Austrailia for over 20 years. On the CD Dance of the Underclass there is a song called The Plains of Maralinga.The chorus goes: Out on the plains of Maralinga, What happened there was a bloody disgrace, Out on the plains of Maralinga, Was total disregard for the Black Austrailian Race.

On another CD Alistair sings about police treatment of Aboriginal people in a song called The Day the Boys Came Down.from the CD The Cold Grey Light Of Dawn. PS.Alistair will be touring AUS/NZ in January '01. Hope this helps John Hamill.Scotland.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: GUEST,Fedele
Date: 13 Nov 00 - 04:30 AM

Not so "folk", but some years ago I heard an aborigine song called "Treaty", I saw the video on the telly. SOme years lated I heard it performed by Yotu Yindi at the Sidney Olimpics closing ceremony and discovered that it was a political song, asking for a "Treaty" that would recognize Aborigine's rights.
I think it is a beautiful song and it sounds very "aborigine", and I think it shouls sound good when sung by a choir.

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: BigDaddy
Date: 13 Nov 00 - 12:49 AM

Check out Steeleye Span's song, "White Man."

Subject: RE: Political songs on Aboriginal rights
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 12 Nov 00 - 09:29 PM

G'day NHDave,

That is indeed the situation here - Koori is often used, but refers only to (roughly) NSW coastal groupings ... and has inevitably acquired pejorative overtones.

I saw a document recently where the groups that gathered called themselves (~)Kooris, Murris, Nyungars, Arabana ... and a few more group names ... This is only a small selection of the 50-odd major language groups recognised in the Australian Oxford Dictionary's etymologies.

Ironically, one great advantage to the name Aborigine, rejected as a colonial imposition, is that it clearly recognises what the law and legislature refuse to acknowledge ... that these are the people who were here "from the beginning" ... Latin: ab origine. There is no terra nullius where people were from the beginning.

Regards,

Bob Bolton