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BS: Best Canadian ever

Dickey 13 Mar 07 - 12:01 AM
Little Hawk 13 Mar 07 - 12:18 AM
dianavan 13 Mar 07 - 12:25 AM
Metchosin 13 Mar 07 - 02:15 AM
Wordsmith 13 Mar 07 - 02:19 AM
Liz the Squeak 13 Mar 07 - 04:25 AM
gnu 13 Mar 07 - 05:42 AM
*daylia* 13 Mar 07 - 07:43 AM
Rapparee 13 Mar 07 - 08:05 AM
Metchosin 13 Mar 07 - 08:51 AM
bobad 13 Mar 07 - 09:00 AM
GUEST 13 Mar 07 - 10:17 AM
Scrump 13 Mar 07 - 10:19 AM
Bee 13 Mar 07 - 10:22 AM
Dickey 13 Mar 07 - 10:29 AM
Scrump 13 Mar 07 - 10:38 AM
Metchosin 13 Mar 07 - 11:01 AM
Dickey 13 Mar 07 - 11:08 AM
Scrump 13 Mar 07 - 11:13 AM
black walnut 13 Mar 07 - 11:16 AM
Marion 13 Mar 07 - 11:20 AM
bobad 13 Mar 07 - 11:22 AM
Peace 13 Mar 07 - 11:25 AM
Metchosin 13 Mar 07 - 11:38 AM
Marion 13 Mar 07 - 11:42 AM
bobad 13 Mar 07 - 11:53 AM
Marion 13 Mar 07 - 11:54 AM
pdq 13 Mar 07 - 11:55 AM
sian, west wales 13 Mar 07 - 11:57 AM
Little Hawk 13 Mar 07 - 11:59 AM
Peace 13 Mar 07 - 12:02 PM
beardedbruce 13 Mar 07 - 12:07 PM
Peace 13 Mar 07 - 02:09 PM
beardedbruce 13 Mar 07 - 02:12 PM
Mooh 13 Mar 07 - 02:55 PM
GUEST,Peter T. 13 Mar 07 - 03:29 PM
black walnut 13 Mar 07 - 03:43 PM
sian, west wales 13 Mar 07 - 03:55 PM
gnu 13 Mar 07 - 05:16 PM
gnu 13 Mar 07 - 05:32 PM
bobad 13 Mar 07 - 05:37 PM
bubblyrat 13 Mar 07 - 06:01 PM
number 6 13 Mar 07 - 07:09 PM
number 6 13 Mar 07 - 07:11 PM
Little Hawk 13 Mar 07 - 08:05 PM
Beer 13 Mar 07 - 09:15 PM
bobad 13 Mar 07 - 09:20 PM
heric 13 Mar 07 - 09:51 PM
number 6 13 Mar 07 - 10:12 PM
Big Al Whittle 14 Mar 07 - 12:59 AM

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Subject: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Dickey
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 12:01 AM

I think it is time to vote for the best Canadian.

Othet than the gi=uy that invented Kokanee Glacier Beer. The best canadianss are Dudley Do-Right and his predecessor, Sargent Preston of the Yukon.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 12:18 AM

Dudley and Preston are great, no doubt about it. Then there was Sam Steele, first commander of the RCMP...he was extraordinary. Read his life story, Dickey, it's a good one.

Pierre Trudeau was definitely our most interesting politician. Most people either greatly admired him or utterly detested him. I was among those who really disliked him at one time, but I slowly changed my mind about that and ended up admiring him. He had guts and keen intelligence, that's for sure.

Nixon referred to him once as an "asshole" (on the Oval Office tapes that came out in Watergate). When the press asked Trudeau what he thought about that, he smiled and quipped, "I've been called worse things, by better men." That was a very clever answer! ;-)

And here's a cool quote from Irving Layton, a Canadian writer who didn't like Trudeau: Pierre Elliott Trudeau's victory in Canada's 1968 election was not universally welcomed. "In Pierre Elliott Trudeau," Irving Layton declared, "Canada has at last produced a political leader worthy of assassination."


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: dianavan
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 12:25 AM

According to CBC its Tommy Douglas but I would have to vote for David Suzuki.

Greatest artist - Bill Reid


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Metchosin
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 02:15 AM

I'm inclined to agree with Layton. The enactment of the War Measures Act did more to alienate a massive proportion of people in Quebec, from the rest of Canada, in one fell swoop, than anything else in the previous history of this country. So much overwhelming mindless clout expended, for such a tiny group of criminal extremists. A cunning intellect and academically inclined, he was. Keen intelligence?.....well that's debateable.

But he sure got a lot of airhead bimbos all wet at the outset. Which was weird to me.....I thought him a singularly, cold and unattractive man and his interest in sweet young things, sort of creepy.....like someone on the prowl for what he perceived as appropriate breeding stock, rather than a 3 dimentional life's partner. But then, I was young, what did I know?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Wordsmith
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 02:19 AM

The doctor who invented (discovered) insulin, although his name escapes me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 04:25 AM

For a country that size to produce only 10 people worthy of note is beyond me.

I vote for former RCMP officer Leslie Nielson of 'Police Squad' fame. Funniest actor ever after Steve Martin. The man has bow legs and looks like an egg whisk when he dances. He's been in many ridiculous films - Airplane, Naked Gun (Police Squad spin-off movies) and has the perfect deadpan face.

He was a guest star on 'Due South' as a fellow RCMP on the trail of a killer and the first thing he did on set was to tell the costume department they were lacing the boots incorrectly!

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: gnu
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 05:42 AM

Um... I believe the CBC's overall process weeded out "the guy who did this or that" and ultimately named the Canuck who was the most dedicated to public service and who most advanced the standard of living in Canada. = Tommy Douglas.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: *daylia*
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 07:43 AM

Wordsmith, the discoverer of insulin was Sir Frederick Banting. There is a school named after him in Alliston Ont, where he was born, a half-hour drive from where I live near Barrie. For sufferers of diabetes, he's certainly earned the pedestal Wordsmith put him on -- and for the rest of us, he remains a source of nationalistic pride, inspiration and wisdom. From the link above:

It occurred to me when we were puffing up the hill and the train was speeding along away below that the engine with all its power could not go up that slushy, soft, snowy road as fast as we could. Power is useless unless directed in the proper channel. People have different powers and the big question in life must be-"Are we on the right road for travel?"

We will certainly not get far in our given time unless we have chosen the road that is fitted to our particular locomotive.


- Dr. F. G. Banting


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Rapparee
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 08:05 AM

McDonnell on the Heights.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Metchosin
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 08:51 AM

Ah Rap! but not one in 10,000 know his name....and isn't that true of most real heroes in this life?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 09:00 AM

Here's one you should enjoy Dickey - Norman Bethune, who is a revered hero to the Chinese people.

"After being elevated to hero status by Mao, Bethune has been revered by the Chinese people ever since. Numerous statues and memorials were erected around China in his memory, including the 800-bed Norman Bethune International Peace Hospital (which includes a Bethune museum on the hospital grounds) and the Norman Bethune Medical School.
• Bethune is buried in the Cemetery of Martyrs in Shih-chia-chuang. Every year on the anniversary of his death, a ceremony is held at Bethune's tomb."

Short Bio


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 10:17 AM

Pierre Trudea, Tommy Douglas, David Suzuki, Peter Z......, Rosemary Brown, Nellie McClung, Wilfred Laurier and Joni Mitchell..IMHO.As a guest, will I be deleted ?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Scrump
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 10:19 AM

Apart from GUEST, no-one's mentioned Joni Mitchell, which surprised me in this group.

I'd vote for her (but then I don't really know all that many Canadians anyway). One of the very best ever singers, songwriters and guitarists, anywhere in the world.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Bee
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 10:22 AM

Ah, but all heros have their detractors. A friend of mine is the son of a (now deceased) laboratory assistant to Banting. The old man grumbled all his life that Banting owed him at least a little credit for his significant contributions (to his son's embarassment, deserved by the father or not).


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Dickey
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 10:29 AM

CBC's Picks:

Frederick Banting the man who discovered insulin

Alexander Graham Bell

Don Cherry

Tommy Douglas

Terry Fox

Wayne Gretzky

Sir John A. Macdonald         

Lester B. Pearson

David Suzuki

Pierre Trudeau


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Scrump
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 10:38 AM

What, the bloke who invented the telephone voted higher than one of the best songwriters in history? IMO that's definitely the wrong way round :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Metchosin
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:01 AM

That was just a list Scrump, not a ranking. Poor Joni never even made the list, but then, who would consider being in the running with the likes of Don Cherry, an honour?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Dickey
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:08 AM

The invention of the telephone was one step int the pathway of inventions that lead to the electronics we have today that enable us to have recorded music, broadcasts and almplification.

Where would artists today be without that?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Scrump
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:13 AM

Where would artists today be without that?

Doing more live gigs that we would be able to see :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: black walnut
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:16 AM

Just like reading the Sports Section. Not too many women...

~b.w.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Marion
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:20 AM

Even if I did think that Joni was Canada's best songwriter, I wouldn't think she belonged on a list of the greatest Canadians any more than Don Cherry or Wayne Gretsky. We who are into such things are very fond of our musicians (or athletes, or sports journalists, as the case may be), but at the end of the day, they're just musicians.

I'd say the "greatest" people are those who make a difference to society through humanitarianism, invention or discovery, or leadership.

Tommy Douglas ("Father of Medicare") seems like a reasonable winner of the CBC contest, though David Suzuki or Terry Fox would also make sense to me.

Guest, who's Peter Z.?

Marion


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:22 AM

"Guest, who's Peter Z.?"

Probably means Peter G.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Peace
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:25 AM

The doctor who invented (discovered) insulin, although his name escapes me.

As noted above, Banting was one of the guys. The co-worker/discoverer was Best who'd been born in the US but became a Canuck. (Macleod and Collip were important to the discovery also.) Both B and B fought in Canada's army in WWI. Banting was awarded a medal for braverey because he continued to treat wounded soldiers when he himself was wounded.

"Charles Herbert Best was born in Maine, the son of a physician. He joined the Canadian artillery during World War I, and thus qualified for Canadian citizenship.

Best was still a medical student at the University of Toronto when he joined Frederick Banting in his work to isolate the pancreatic hormone insulin and apply it to the treatment of diabetes. The work had personal significance for Best, as his favorite aunt had recently died of the disease. He finished his medical degree in 1925, two years after Banting and physiology professor J.J. Macleod received the Nobel Prize for the work. Banting, who felt that Best should have been recognized by the Nobel Prize committee as well, gave half of his monetary award to Best. Macleod then shared his with J.B. Collip, the chemist who had worked with them to purify insulin for clinical trials."


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Metchosin
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:38 AM

Well as I mentioned above Black Walnut, more often than not, real heroes are unsung....male or female. Hero worship, while sometimes of benefit to a particular cause, as in the case of Fox's admirable endeavor, generally makes me uncomfortable.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Marion
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:42 AM

True that there's not many women being spoken of. I expect that's because of the historical "invisibility" of women's accomplishments, as well as the historical limitations on women's activities.

So, I'll nominate Lady Aberdeen, founder of the Victorian Order of Nurses

Marion

PS. Who's Peter G.?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:53 AM

Peter Gzowski


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Marion
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:54 AM

Thanks Bobad.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: pdq
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:55 AM

How about some inventors: Guglielmo Marconi and Alexander Graham Bell.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: sian, west wales
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:57 AM

Not the best, but one of whom I'm proud (and whose name has appeared in Mudcat before now): General Romeo Dallaire.

And, if you're looking for women who have made a difference, I'd suggest Adelaide Hoodless who founded the Women's Institute in Stony Creek, Ontario; a movement which 'made land' in the UK in Angelsey, Wales, BTW.

“A nation cannot rise above the level of its homes, we women must work and study together to raise our homes to the highest level possible.â€쳌 (AH)

It was quite a radical, early feminist idea and did a lot in terms of improving the quality of women's lives and the home environment. And still does, at its best.

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 11:59 AM

We also have Neil Young, Gordon Lightfoot, Ian and Sylvia Tyson, Leonard Cohen, and Buffy Sainte-Marie (born in Saskatchewan, dual citizenship for Canada and USA)....along with Joni Mitchell...a very big slice of the finest folk-rock songwriters and performers of the 60's there. If Bob Dylan had been born a little bit farther north it would almost have been a clean sweep of the top folk songwriters of the time.

And then there's This guy...


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Peace
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 12:02 PM

General Romeo Dallaire.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 12:07 PM

"Dallaire and his troops were about to become spectators to genocide. As bodies filled the streets and rivers, the general, backed by a U.N. mandate that didn't even allow him to disarm the militias, pleaded with his U.N. superiors for additional troops, ammunition, and the authority to seize Hutu arms caches. In an assessment that military experts now accept as realistic, Dallaire argued that with 5,000 well-equipped soldiers and a free hand to fight Hutu power, he could bring the genocide to a rapid halt.
The U.N. turned him down. He asked the U.S. to block the Hutu radio transmissions. The Clinton administration refused to do even that. Gun-shy after a humiliating retreat from Somalia, Washington saw nothing to gain from another intervention in Africa, and the Defense Department, according to a memo, assessed the cost of jamming the Hutu hate broadcasts at $8,500 per flight-hour.
Dallaire's pain is palpable as he remembers his yearlong mission. His words, raw as a wound, make a grim contrast to the carefully parsed regrets of the world leaders who actually had the power to stop the genocide but turned away. He has just spoken at an Amnesty-sponsored conference in Atlanta on law and human rights, and he looks tired- older than his 56 years. His eyes are close set, raptor-like, but his gaze is warm and direct. "When you're in command, you are in command," he says. "There's 800,000 gone, the mission turned into catastrophe, and you're in command. I feel I did not convince my superiors and the international community," he says. "I didn't have enough of the skills to be able to influence that portion of the problem."
Three days after the Rwandan killings began, with Dallaire's troops running short of rations as well as ammunition, about l,000 European troops arrived in Kigali. The general watched with frustration as the well-armed, well-fed Westerners landed and left again as soon as they'd evacuated their own nationals. Then, after Hutu militias killed ~o Belgian paratroopers, Brussels withdrew all of its peacekeepers (the only significant Western contingent and the only one that was properly equipped) from the U.N. mission. Dallaire's depleted force was on its own.
Even as the already desperate situation worsened, Washington called for a complete withdrawal of peacekeepers. On April 21, after international pressure, the U.S. agreed to a limited force and supported a Security Council resolution slashing the force to 270 peacekeepers. U.S. Secretary of State Madeline Albright accurately described the tiny force as enough "to show the will of the international community."
If Dallaire's anger at those who did too little is fierce, his fury at world leaders who feigned ignorance and did nothing is white hot. He cannot forget, for example, that President Clinton stopped for a few hours in Kigali in 1998, after it was all over, and with the engines of Air Force One running, said he was sorry; he didn't know.
Or that David Rawson, the U.S. ambassador to Rwanda at the time of the mass murders, waited a month before declaring a "state of disaster," and then dismissed the slaughter as "tribal killings." Calling what happened in Rwanda "tribal" conflict made intervention seem futile. U.S. Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Prudence Bushnell, who had pushed hard for the U.S. to "neutralize" Hutu hate radio, later explained to author Samantha Power, "What I was told was, 'Look, Pru, these people do this from time to time."'
The designation of "tribal" conflict also nicely avoided the word "genocide." Had a major power or the U.N. invoked that term in time, all states that were signatories of the 1948 convention on genocide would have been obliged to condemn the slaughter and act to stop it.
Avoiding the word did not however avoid the fact. "They knew how many people were dying," Dallaire says, no matter what word they used. "The world is racist," he says bitterly. ,' "Africans don't count; Yugoslavians do. More people were killed, injured, internally displaced, and refugeed in 100 days in Rwanda than in the whole eight to nine years of the Yugoslavia campaign," he says, and there are still peacekeeping troops in the former Yugoslavia while Rwanda is again off the radar. f "Why didn't the world react to scenes where women were held as shields so nobody could shoot back while the militia shot into the | crowd?" he asks. "Where... boys were drugged up and turned into child soldiers, slaughtering families?...Where girls and women were systematically raped before they were killed? Babies ripped out of their stomachs? ...Why didn't the world come?"
Dallaire supplies his own answer: "Because there was no self-interest....No oil. They didn't come because some humans are [considered] less human than others."


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Peace
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 02:09 PM

That more than anything else is why I dislike Clinton.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: beardedbruce
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 02:12 PM

"When Clinton lied, no-one died"

Nobody that we should care about, anyway. Just Rwandans...


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Mooh
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 02:55 PM

Stephen Lewis, David Suzuki, Tommy Douglas, Jean Larrivee and a host of others...

Peace, Mooh.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: GUEST,Peter T.
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 03:29 PM

I have never quite seen what made Romeo Dallaire a hero for what happened in Rwanda. But he became a hero afterwards for his open struggle with the demons of what Rwanda did to him. That is what gives him stature.

yours,

Peter T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: black walnut
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 03:43 PM

alice munroe

~b.w.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: sian, west wales
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 03:55 PM

Peter, I agree. It's what he's done since ...

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: gnu
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 05:16 PM

David Suzuki over and over? Why? Genius? Maybe. Maybe lucky to be a smart guy in the right genes at the right time.

As for all his "activism", I would like to get paid for narrating science programming on the CBC. Especially for narrarting programs about which I know nothing about... programs about topics WAAAAAYYYY out of my field of expertise because I once was part of something great... in my own field.

Can you say "marketing"? Gooood. Now try "ratings".

Davey Boy ain't no Tommy and ain't no Pierre.

As for Pierre and the War Measures Act.... nobody with any semblence of civility was offended. Those license plates are another matter, and only meant to further the cause of those who would sell this country down the river.... the Mississippi River. René Lévesque, a New Brunswicker BTW, and Brian Mulroney, and Jacques Parizeau and the rest... just looking to sell.

Bring back FIRA! Oh... sorry... Stevie boy is selling the country down the river now... too late.

Unless, perhaps??? Justin time?


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: gnu
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 05:32 PM

Ahhh... sorry, non-Canucks. Several references there which you would not understand. But, that's okay, we are insignificant and shy. Carry on with the other threads. We'll just talk amongst ourselves. Until the water rights in Quebec come up.

Those are the water rights which are meant to feed the Tri-State area... the LARGEST civil engineering project on the face of the eatrh, on-going for over twenty years. Hmmm... can you say "separate"? Now, try "sovereignty" for the Country of Quebec. Now try "rich beyond all belief" if you are the politician who can make it happen. Stevie is giving it a go now too, isn't he?

We are taking the piss here. No FIRA. No Pierre. No Tommy. No balls.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 05:37 PM

Can you elaborate gnu, what is this civil engineering project of which you speak and what is FIRA?

And yes, Stevie's pulling a Mulroney.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: bubblyrat
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 06:01 PM

The Canadian medical professor who helped to save my life when I was critically ill with pneumonia in 1949. Many people who know me might argue that he should be on the list of WORST Canadians, to be honest !
My personal favourite Canadienne, is Vicky Herbert, of Scarborough, Toronto, for reasons into which I will not go !!


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: number 6
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 07:09 PM

I'm going throw a plug for Lester B. Pearson ... I feel his contributions to Canada (and the world) have much been forgotten over time.

As per Paul Anka and Neil Young ... these guys have lived south of the border so long I can't really consider them Canadians anymore. Joni Mitchell still retains a home here in Canada.

In regards to Buffy Saint Marie ... all aboriginal Canadians hold dual U.S. Canadian citizenship.

biLL


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: number 6
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 07:11 PM

Paul Anka being mentioned here 'cause he was voted as one of the worst Canadians.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 08:05 PM

Yeah, I voted him THE worst! ;-)

bubblyrat - What???? That's odd...Vicky Herbert of Scarborough, Ontario is one of my personal favorite Canadiennes too...for reasons I would not dream of divulging here....
























Ha! Just pulling your chain, eh? I've never met her.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Beer
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 09:15 PM

The Undertaker................ Stanfield.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: bobad
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 09:20 PM

The fumble that lost the election.


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: heric
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 09:51 PM

(Joni lives in LA, but still owns the vacation cabin in Sechelt she's always had.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: number 6
Date: 13 Mar 07 - 10:12 PM

The Underwear................Stanfield


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Subject: RE: BS: Best Canadian ever
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Mar 07 - 12:59 AM

three great snooker players of the 1980's Cliff Thorburn, Kirk Stevens, Big Bill Wuirbenik.

Mordecai Richler - the novelist.

Joni, of course - but too obvious.


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