BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)

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BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)

11 Nov 07 - 08:52 AM (#2191103)
Subject: BS: The structure of fannies
From: Azizi

Some are bigger than others.

11 Nov 07 - 08:53 AM (#2191105)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies
From: Azizi

In the USA, big is good.

Small-or should I say flat?-is not so good.

11 Nov 07 - 08:54 AM (#2191106)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: John MacKenzie

Who you trying to fool ?
G ¦¬]

11 Nov 07 - 08:55 AM (#2191107)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Well that was quick. Someone added US bottoms to my title.

That works for me.

Of course, there's other words that Americans use to refer to "fannies" and "bottoms".

11 Nov 07 - 08:56 AM (#2191109)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

I've never gotten any complaints about the structure of my fanny.

11 Nov 07 - 09:02 AM (#2191111)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Janie

There is more of mine to love as each year passes;^)

11 Nov 07 - 09:07 AM (#2191113)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: skarpi

someone said - " how low can they get " and he talked about the USA
coverment and added I feel sorry for the poor people who put them to the white house , well this man is gone now so I ask is this the " so called bottom " spending money on some war they can´t win , at the same time at home the health care is falling , its only good for the rich people . :>(

Then its the other " bottoms " ( / ) hehehe well we can change it very easy ..... :>)

11 Nov 07 - 09:20 AM (#2191120)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Well I just looked up the definition for "fanny" in the UK.

And I hasten to say I am using the US definition for that term and NOT the UK definition.

**

Skarpi, I'm posting a link here that gives definitions for fanny {I only used the word "fannies" as a play on words of this Mudcat thread- thread.cfm?threadid=106172&messages=7 "BS: The structure of funny"}

11 Nov 07 - 09:23 AM (#2191122)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Er, yes Azizi, I don't think I've ever seen you so flippant, I'm glad you're happy.

Here in the UK, the word "Fanny" is used to refer to the - er - how shall I put this? - "front bottom" so to speak, and I think that might have been a bit too exciting for some of us.

On the other hand, there is some scholastic concentration I understand on appreciating how it is that the arse has now become such a feature (in both sexes) of erotic attraction, rather than the primary sexual and principal secondary sexual characteristics.

In any event, I was surprised to learn from CSI the other night that in the US people do have implants in their arse cheeks. I'm more attuned to the common complaint "Does my bum look big in this?", and despite my own lack of slenderness I have always preferred thin women.

There has been some debate about the preferred profile of female arses - even in the James Bond books (that dates me) one of the Russian female assassins was noted to have an arse of which a purist would have disapproved, in that it had lost its smooth downward sweep and jutted like a boy's (I think I still nearly got that quote right after about 45 years). Be that as it may, my preference is for less arse on women rather than more.

I am however conscious that this may be an aspect of the institutional paedophilia over many many years of much of the western world (odd that despite this paedophilia is now perhaps the most reviled sexual preference - is it that people fear most the dark shadows they might see in themselves?).

Shall we discuss body hair as well?

I think I'd better go and have a cold bath.

11 Nov 07 - 09:30 AM (#2191128)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: John MacKenzie

You mean hairy fannies Richard?

G

I only asked !

11 Nov 07 - 10:50 AM (#2191168)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: wysiwyg

The bigger the cushion, the better the pushin'.

Heard, from an offduty Chicago cop, in the late 70's or early 80's.

~Susan

11 Nov 07 - 10:54 AM (#2191173)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bee

I have watched a very silly discussion, on a Christian message board, of appropriate terms for what most Nova Scotians would call an ass or an arse. The American Christians are horrified by the words 'ass' and 'arse' and wish to impose the term 'butt' on the international community. However, the word 'ass' as in Balaam's, appears in scripture, whereas 'butt' does not, so they are in a great quandary as to what words to filter, since 'obviously', they cannot filter words that appear in the Bible.

11 Nov 07 - 11:00 AM (#2191177)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,Obie

.......and did not Jesus enter Jerusalem sitting on his ass?

11 Nov 07 - 11:22 AM (#2191196)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bee

Guest Obie, precisely their problem. Not all, but a vocal subset, of the members of that forum would far prefer that Jesus had not been possessed of all the physical assets of your average human form. Though how they might envision an eating, drinking, donkey riding, yet assless Christ is beyond my imagination.

11 Nov 07 - 11:23 AM (#2191197)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: danensis

If they take the arse out of the bible, will they take the one out of the White House as well?

11 Nov 07 - 11:37 AM (#2191210)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bee

Some ills, danensis, are beyond the powers of heaven to cure. An earthly solution is necessary, which would involve not having more than half of all U.S. Americans embarassing the other half every four years.

11 Nov 07 - 11:38 AM (#2191211)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

It gives a new meaning to the problems of inflation....

11 Nov 07 - 11:39 AM (#2191212)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: number 6

I thought this thread was about Studio 4 going into U.S. syndication.

biLL

11 Nov 07 - 11:41 AM (#2191215)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bill D

"In the USA, big is good."

Oh? Surely, generalizations are dangerous. There are SO many factors involved in what people admire, whether it be derrieres or paintings or pie......(And, as we just saw there are many cultural responses to the very words used to refer to the subject as well! *grin*...around the US, 'butt' is sorta loaded, but not terribly offensive, while 'bottom' is often used for mixed company, and 'ass' is often the choice for more ...ummm...explicit context. Funny, whenI was a kid, 'fanny' was common, and was a fairly polite term, but I almost never hear it anymore. Perhaps becoming aware of UK usage has moved it to the sidelines.)

I would argue that the most common 'choice of size' is contained in this collage (clearly not small, but not huge, either.) (took me all of 12.47 seconds to find using Google Images)..

But I remember seeing in a list an entire internet newsgroup devoted to 'skinny'.

In the last analysis, what does it matter, as long as there is a selection for everyone when just looking, and that one does not complain about size in one's chosen partner.

11 Nov 07 - 12:11 PM (#2191239)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

And, as we just saw there are many cultural responses to the very words used to refer to the subject as well!

When I started this thread on an impulse, I wasn't aware of the UK meaning for the word "fanny". If I had been aware of that meaning, I still woulda started this thread as it fit my mood of if not happiness than at least 'let's have some fun with words'. But, if I had known the UK meaning of fanny, from the first post, I probably would have have emphasized the fact that I meant the USA definition of that word.

I don't have any problem with a moderator quickly adding "US bottoms" to this thread title. However, "bottoms" isn't a word that I usually use for "fanny". Then again, usually don't say "fanny" either. The addition of the phrase "US bottoms" in the title adds additional meaning to the title because of the multiple meanings of the word "bottoms". I've no problem with this, and actually find it interesting. But I'm just sayin.

Instead of either "fanny" or "bottoms", I use the word "butt" or "behind". The word "ass" is a little too coarse for me. And the word "arse" is totally outside my culturally experience, though I know that "arse" means the same thing as "ass" {not the "donkey" but the "butt"}.

With regard to my statement that folks in the US like women with "big butts" {well I didn't say that but that's what I meant by my first comment}, that may be true, and even more so since that Latina actress whatshername. {I'm having a mental blank here}.

But if a woman's butt is too big, she's called a "Bertha Butt". That's an old insult. I'm not sure where it came from, but perhaps someone on this forum might know.

11 Nov 07 - 12:14 PM (#2191242)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: John MacKenzie

We could use another British word for arse, which is bum, but that might cause shouts of HALLELUJAH from across the ditch.
There's always backside of course.
G

11 Nov 07 - 12:16 PM (#2191244)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Okay. I remembered who I was thinking of-Jennifer Lopez aka JLo.

11 Nov 07 - 12:29 PM (#2191254)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

We could use another British word for arse, which is bum, but that might cause shouts of HALLELUJAH from across the ditch.

Would you please explain what you mean by this? I've heard pre-school teachers or early primary school teachers say "sit on your bum" but, if I might generalize, I believe the word "bum" is seldom used this way by African Americans. I also think "tush" {another equivalent word for "fanny"} is most often used by White Americans than by Black Americans.

The words "butt", "behind", "ass" and "backside" are all commonly used in everyday African Americans speech, literature, and songs.

Another common informal word that African Amerians {and others} use for "butt", "behind", "ass", and "backside" is "booty".

11 Nov 07 - 12:30 PM (#2191256)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bill D

There was a famous Dutch woman athlete (sprinter) named Fanny Blankers-Koen, and an American comedienne, Fanny Brice.

I suspect that very few in Britain have been called that since John Cleland published "Fanny Hill - Memoirs of a Woman of Pleasure" in 1748.

And, see http://www.thenamemachine.com/baby-names-girls/Fanny.html for the decline of the name in th USA.

Clever use of Google will get you many references.

(and...it will get you practically infinite examples of every size & shape 'behind' imaginable, and a few almost beyond imagination)

11 Nov 07 - 12:35 PM (#2191259)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bill D

I guess the 'official' polite term is buttocks.... or the latin Gluteus mostly 'maximus'

11 Nov 07 - 01:35 PM (#2191290)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rasener

Not 10 miles from where I live in a village called Ludford there is a road called Fanny Hands Lane.

A mate of mine loved women with big bottoms.
I asked him why that was and he replied "I love them because when I make sex, I can slap her arse and ride in on the waves!

11 Nov 07 - 01:42 PM (#2191297)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: bobad

Azizi, I think that Giok was probably making reference to the song "HALLELUJAH I'm a bum."

11 Nov 07 - 02:19 PM (#2191321)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

"Tush" I surmise was originally American-Jewish, from what root I know not, but I think in the UK would now widely be regarded as synonymous with "fanny" in the UK meaning - - - surely there is a rock song with that title, or maybe "I want some tush" and I'm sure it is not speaking of anal sex.

"Arse" on the other hand is found in middle English and probably comes from the German and pre-German "arsch" - not that I am a comparative linguist (and no again that is not at this moment a sexual reference). There are some rock fissures in I think Lancashire that are named on Ordnance Survey maps as "Great House" and "Little House" (I was hearing on the wireless the other day) which was due to a Victorian bowdlerisation. Local parlance had dubbed them "Great Arse" and "Little Arse" because, well, of the shapes of the fissures, but the Victorian cartographers were shocked.

I think it would be fairly general in the UK that small arses are preferred. That was the original topic, wasn't it? I remember being rivetted some years ago the first time I saw Annie Lennox on Top of the Pops - a clingy wool dress, and a small firm arse in dancing motion. There is too much of J-Lo for my taste.

So what do US women call men's arses? Last time I was in LA it was still "ass" or "butt" with the former being more lascivious, but I am sure that "fanny" would not have been used for a male arse. And before someone else makes the point, yes, I went to public school (US, private school).

11 Nov 07 - 02:20 PM (#2191323)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Oh, and if we are having fun with words, I once (this is perfectly genuine) knew a girl whose address went

Miss Amanda Proudfoot
Pennis House
Pennis Lane
Fawkham,
Kent.

How we chortled.

11 Nov 07 - 02:30 PM (#2191336)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Peace

These are the lyrics to a song I'm working on now. I intend to entitle it "My PC Song". It's a kinda cross between a talking blues and a rap song but it will have a melody.

She's got these pretty little eyes
Shine all day and glow all night, uh huh!
She got this wiggle in her walk
Make a blind man ask his dog to talk, uh huh!

11 Nov 07 - 02:34 PM (#2191342)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Sorcha

In polite company I use either behind or tush. Sometimes bottom. Usually it's just ass.

Where I live, tush hasn't migrated into meaning British fanny, the 'new' word I hear for that is coochie, but maybe I just never heard it before.

11 Nov 07 - 02:43 PM (#2191352)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Oh, I think the Hoochie Coochie man has been around for a while...

As to songs, there was a great new English rock and roll song (well, not that new, but newer than original rock and roll, right?) from the original lineup of Dr Feelgood with both Lee Brilleaux and Wilko Johnson about a man who liked his girlfriend's derriere so much that wherever they went he was: -

"Always walking 20 yards behind" - that was the hook and chorus.

And now the womens's view (my but you lot are shy today, no-one started drinking yet?) ......

11 Nov 07 - 02:50 PM (#2191357)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bill D

There is a doctoral degree waiting for a learned cross-cultural study of euphemisms and their origins and psychological adaptations.

I really wish folks didn't use up perfectly good words to make sexual references...'gay' 'Willie' and a dozen more.

11 Nov 07 - 02:56 PM (#2191364)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: John MacKenzie

Peter Johnson, John Thomas, Hugh Jampton

11 Nov 07 - 03:21 PM (#2191386)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: number 6

"I been up, I been down.
Take my word, my way around.
I aint askin for much.
I said, lord, take me downtown,
Im just lookin for some tush."

.... Beard/Gibbons/Hill

Richard Bridge ... tush, from the Yissish word tokhes (rear end)

biLL

11 Nov 07 - 03:22 PM (#2191387)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: number 6

correction .... Yiddish, not Yissish.

11 Nov 07 - 03:27 PM (#2191392)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bill D

"Sure, deck your lower limbs in pants;
Yours are the limbs, my sweeting.
You look divine as you advance —
Have you seen yourself retreating?"

Ogden Nash

11 Nov 07 - 03:32 PM (#2191398)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Nigel Parsons

Pictures available Here of several British Fany's

11 Nov 07 - 03:47 PM (#2191408)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

bobad, thanks for that explanation in your 11 Nov 07 - 01:42 PM post about Giok's 11 Nov 07 - 12:14 PM post. Needless to say, the word "bum" also has more than one meaning.

Are other languages as mixed up as English is? English seems like it would be a difficult language to learn because of all these words with multiple meanings.

**

With regard to songs about butts, here's an excerpt of the R&B song "Doin The Butt"

Da Butt (by E U)
Alright. Come on. Sing it one time
(Yeah-ee yeah. Yeah-ee, Yeah-ee, Yeah-ee Yeah)
Sing! Ow!
(Yeah-ee yeah. Yeah-ee, Yeah-ee, Yeah-ee Yeah)
Ha! Ha!

Walked in this place surprised to see
A big girl gettin' busy, just rockin' to the go-go beat
The way she shook her booty sho' looked good to me
I said, 'Come here, big girl, won't you rock my world
Show that dance to me.' She was

CHORUS:
Doin' the butt. Hey pretty, pretty
When you get that notion, put your backfield in motion, hey
Doin' the butt. Hey sexy, sexy Ain't nothing wrong, if you
wanna do the butt all night long

http://www.43things.com/entries/view/832226

**

Here's a YouTube clip of "Doin Da Butt" from the Spike Lee movie "School Daze":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQUgFNEGmGI

-snip-

One of the things that is interesting to me about the African American "doin the butt" dance is that I've seen video clips of contemporary Nigerian social dances where the women lean forward while they dance and their butts protrude and move rhythmically to the beat. I wouldn't be surprised if this is a traditional dance move-leaning forward for some dances certainly is.

11 Nov 07 - 03:48 PM (#2191410)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Peace

The crack is split north-south as opposed to east-west so that when you slide down bannisters you don't make a 'pftpftpftpftpfttttttt' sound (like riffling cards}.

11 Nov 07 - 03:58 PM (#2191415)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: kendall

Ladies, if you want to see what the perfect bum looks like, watch the film "The Piano". Holly Hunter has it.

11 Nov 07 - 04:01 PM (#2191416)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Peace

The perfect bum.

11 Nov 07 - 04:12 PM (#2191426)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

...My PC Song". It's a kinda cross between a talking blues and a rap song but it will have a melody.

Peace, your new song "sounds" great!

We want more! We want more!

11 Nov 07 - 04:19 PM (#2191429)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rasener

Kont means buttocks in Dutch

Kut in Dutch means fanny (UK fanny)

Just to confuse things more

11 Nov 07 - 04:33 PM (#2191441)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

US rude dance movements got nothing at all on Jamaican wining or whining or wine-ing depending on the formulation you fancy - and almost all seem to concentrate on rear entry sex.

So where are the women's points of view?

I think, Azizi, you started this and need to introduce some protagonists....

(still nice to see you relax, and no Frankie Goes to Hollywood implication intended)

11 Nov 07 - 04:39 PM (#2191447)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

"I think, Azizi, you started this and need to introduce some protagonists...."

??

"(still nice to see you relax, and no Frankie Goes to Hollywood implication intended)"

Thanks, I think. I'm almost afraid to Google "Frankie Goes To Hollywood". I take it that was a racy movie?

Ha! "racy"

LOL!!!

11 Nov 07 - 04:47 PM (#2191460)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Oh, Okay. I see that Frankie Goes To Hollywood is a British pop band. And I take it you are referring to this:

"Relax:
On January 11, 1984, BBC Radio 1 disc jockey Mike Read was playing the record on his show when he noticed the front cover design (by Yvonne Gilbert), depicting a man and woman pressed against each other, back to back, with clothed upper bodies but bared buttocks, and including a somewhat salacious quote from the song's lyrics. This prompted him to listen more intently to the words, and his reaction was such that he apparently removed the disc from the turntable live on air, branding it "disgusting". [2]

Two days later — almost three months after the single's initial release, and just eight days after the group's Top Of The Pops appearance — the BBC banned the record from all its TV and radio outlets.

"Relax" immediately shot to Number One in the UK charts and stayed there for five weeks, leading to the situation where the BBC could not feature the nation's best-selling single on any of their flagship radio and TV chart shows for over a month (hence the traditional closing 'number one spot' on Top Of The Pops was filled by different, distinctly non-number-one acts for five consecutive weeks)...

The BBC had not intended to enhance record sales by banning "Relax", and yet the record had defied these intentions emphatically, meaning that — not for the first time — the BBC and the media were faced with a fast-selling record that could beat and even be seen to exploit a widely-publicised institutional ban. Moreover, the BBC and the UK media were completely unprepared for the unprecedented "Relax" phenomenon that followed. The experience of "Relax" would ultimately prove something of a cultural watershed, causing a marked change in the BBC's policy on banning provocative records, and the popular media's approach to "controversial" records in general.

Read had apparently been outraged by the "overtly sexual" nature of both the record sleeve and the printed lyrics. However, the sleeve's "Relax, don't do it, when you want to suck it to it" had been a deliberately provocative misprint. The real words were, in fact, "...when you want to sock it to it...". On the other hand, the imagery of the concluding expression "Relax, don't do it, when you want to come" seemed rather more inescapable, if no less cryptic in some quarters (when Johnson was asked by pop magazine Smash Hits "'Relax, don't do it' — Don't do what?", he had replied "don't relax, of course")..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankie_Goes_to_Hollywood

11 Nov 07 - 04:50 PM (#2191463)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Big Al Whittle

Gosh, how rude...!

11 Nov 07 - 04:59 PM (#2191473)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Of course, "sock it to it" is also racy.

R-E-S-P-E-C-T find out what it means to me,
R-E-S-P-E-C-T take care of TCB, (sock it to me, sock it to me, sock it to me, etc).

{excerpt from Aretha Franklin's hit R&B song RESPECT}

"Sock it to me" means "give it to me". "It" could mean "respect" or it could mean something else. I leave that to your imagination.

Of course, this 1960s African American slang phrase has long been retired from everyday use.

11 Nov 07 - 05:01 PM (#2191475)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Doh! It's about anal sex. Specifically gay anal sex. Relaxing the anal sphincter tends to be useful, unless having your neck wrung is your idea of fun. The words are a dialogue between the protagonst and a more reluctant partner.

Mike Read can be a bit precious. As some may remember from "Get me out of here..." - where he was in fact stitched up for a very good financial reason.

Oddly, not long back, he was commissioned to write a stage musical for the Village People franchise. I hope he was not too shocked.

11 Nov 07 - 05:03 PM (#2191477)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Peace

'"Sock it to ME?"

Outrageously popular it transitioned television entertainment from the stand up comedy on The Ed Sullivan Show to the next generation of the related variety show Saturday Night Live.

This wasn't the first time the phrase was used of course. It dates from some time around the 1850s and the earliest example in print that's been discovered so far is from a book published in 1866 about the American Civil War including the following quote:

"Now then, tell General Emory if they attack him again to go after them, and to follow them up, and to sock it to them, and to give them the devil".'

11 Nov 07 - 05:28 PM (#2191506)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Sorcha

It went to Rowan and Martins 'Laugh In' too.

11 Nov 07 - 05:31 PM (#2191513)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

As to gay anal sex, to each his or her own.

"But", it seems to me this thread is getting far too serious, though I love the wide range of topics we've already touched on.

More! More!

Keep it comin!

;0)

11 Nov 07 - 05:35 PM (#2191516)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Fundamentally, your arse is meant for sitting on, I've always been told and, if its structure tends to the steatopygous, is probably more comfortable.

Cheers, Rowan

11 Nov 07 - 05:42 PM (#2191521)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Bill D

It is what 'probably' got Richard Nixon elected president. They convinced him to do a cameo saying "Sock it to ME?" on "Laugh In"....and they only had to repeat it 12-14 times to get him to understand what inflection to use.
The public assumed that anyone who'd do that could be ALL bad, and it got him a few more votes.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
and one 'opinion' from the album "When Dalliance Was in Flower and Maidens Lost Their Heads" ...Ed McCurdy singing Elizabethan bawdy ballads...with Eric Darling on banjo

"Let her face be fair,
Let her breasts be bare.
And a voice let her have that can warble!
Let her belly be soft,
But to mount me aloft,
Let her bounding buttocks be marble!"

11 Nov 07 - 05:49 PM (#2191528)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: frogprince

Then there's this classic piece from the Limelighters, dedicated to a young woman who achieved her one moment of fame by modeling a dress with the back cut down to her "fanny". Until I googled it just now, I never dreamt that Melvina Reynolds co-wrote it.

VIKKI DOUGAN
(Malvina Reynolds / Lou Gottlieb)
The Limeliters - 1960

Chorus:
Vikki turn your back on me
Come on darlin' just for me
'Cause there is something so appealin',
That your eyes are not revealin'!
Oh, Miss Dougan, you're for me!

Other girls who approach me,
Are beautiful, gorgeous and gay!
But you're so gosh darn more inviting
Going the other way!

Chorus

Vikki baby you move me,
In those far-out clothes!
But don't it get chilly flyin' home at night
When that cold cold tail-wind blows?

Chorus

Vikki baby, you rock me,
Without you I'm bereft!
I'm hynotized by those crazy eyes,
And that callipygian cleft!

Chorus

Once, for a brief moment in time, in 1968, I operated a very small "underground" radio station, and played this from a reel-to-reel tape regularly.

11 Nov 07 - 07:50 PM (#2191595)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

I think, Rowan, you'll find it is for something else...fundamentally, and other things FUNdamentally.

And then there is the alleged old Pathan love song, with the "hook"

"There's a boy across the river
With a bottom like a peach"...

11 Nov 07 - 08:31 PM (#2191615)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

"Alas, I cannot swim" ?

In Oz the ABC is currently doing a series of programs celebrating the 40th aniversary of the onset of the Bossa Nova. There's a certain amount of celebration of callipygous structure implicit in its rhythm.

Cheers, Rowan

11 Nov 07 - 08:40 PM (#2191620)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Nigel Parsons

It was in Baghdad,
That my mother met my dad
Singing
Annie put your fanny next to mine!

It was in the foreign legion,
And it was the dirty season,
Singing
Annie put your fanny next to mine!

Lowering the tone, but keeping the theme, and introducing song!!!

11 Nov 07 - 08:46 PM (#2191623)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

And, with more song to avoid the confusion between fannies and bums, there's the chorus to the Oz version of "Roll me over";

Roll me over,
in the clover;
put your belly next to mine
and wriggle your bum!

Cheers, Rowan

12 Nov 07 - 12:18 AM (#2191708)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: JennieG

To add a bit of confusion....when I was a wee sprog my mother used an expression "so-and-so has more arse than Jessie the elephant". Jessie was a famous elephant in an Ozzie zoo nigh on 100 years ago.

But she wasn't referring to the person's backside - in Oz lingo to say someone has "arse" means they are a pushy person.

Cheers
JennieG

12 Nov 07 - 12:56 AM (#2191724)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

When JennieG says to someone has "arse" means they are a pushy person she's describing Sydney lingo. The equivalent phrase in Melb'n-speak is "More front than Myers."

Myers was (maybe still is) the largest department store in Melbourne at the time, with an extensive frontage along the middle of Bourke St, where there's now a mall and where buskers have to be licensed.

Cheers, Rowan

12 Nov 07 - 01:04 AM (#2191726)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

I'mma repost a comment that I made today on another thread because it applies here to:

Subject: RE: songs that made us laugh
From: Azizi - PM
Date: 11 Nov 07 - 06:29 PM

... thanks for that info.

This is one reason why I like the fact that Mudcatters live in a number of nations throughout the world. You get to learn such odd and end info-bits as that.

thread.cfm?threadid=105876&messages=42

-snip-

On this thread I'm referring to the different meanings of certain words like "fanny" and "arse" as well as different sayings and customs and other on topic/somewhat off topic information.

Thanks for all who have posted thus far to this thread!

Keep 'em coming!

12 Nov 07 - 05:16 AM (#2191781)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,PMB

Good arse Azizi!

A few years ago I was doing a bit of carpentry, and was asked by my little daughter why I'd written rude words on one piece of wood. To remind myself of where this particular piece went among a number of similarly- shaped but not exactly the same size pieces, I'd written "front bottom" on it. Which I hasten to add, wasn't a euphemism we used at home.

The little niece was being bathed by her grandma, who being a bit prim said "I'll leave you to wash your private parts yourself." "Call it by it's proper name, Grandma," she replied, "That's my regina."

12 Nov 07 - 06:03 AM (#2191799)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

Fanny was the perfectly acceptable and usual contraction of the female name Frances. I myself have a picture of my great great Aunt Fanny. It confused me no end when my mother would refer to Aunt Fanny when something had annoyed or upset her - as in 'you want how much? You'll get my Aunt Fanny!' Took me a few years to work out what she really meant.

I was a little bemused by a Simpsons episode where Marge was attempting to buy Lisa a sun suit with 'a starfish on the fanny', thinking, how symbolic and disturbing is that?!

LTS

12 Nov 07 - 07:47 AM (#2191854)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Good arse Azizi!
-PMB

Um,PMB where are you from?

Nevermind. I'm gonna assume that you were giving me a compliment.

Thanks, I'm sure!

LOL!

12 Nov 07 - 09:22 AM (#2191909)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Donuel

Bubble butts are best
but they all are under water

12 Nov 07 - 11:36 AM (#2191990)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,Neil D

Fat bottom girls you make the rockin world go round
    Queen said that

I like big butts and I cannot lie
    Sir Mix-A-Lot said that

I like big bottoms and my girl's gottem
    Spinal Tap said that

You can dream about mine if I can dream about yours
    I said that

BTW is this a musical thread now or should it stay below the line, you know, at the BOTTOM?

12 Nov 07 - 04:02 PM (#2192171)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: kendall

I've never known a woman who thought her ass was too small.

12 Nov 07 - 06:09 PM (#2192264)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

I just found a musical source for the usually at least mildly insulting term "Bertha Butt".

This referent is used by African Americans {and maybe other folks} for women with very big butts. I don't know any comparable term for males with big butts unless it's Baby Huey, an insulting referent that comes from a cartoon character who was born large and lacked street wits. However, males who were called "Baby Huey" were big all over. The butts of males who were called Baby Hueys weren't the focus of derision {and a certain degree of lasciviousness} as is/was the case with women who are/were called "Bertha Butts".

The alliterative name "Bertha Butt" may predate the mid 1970s Jimmy Castor Bunch records, but I haven't found an earlier source-yet.

I'll post the lyrics and a YouTube video for the "Bertha Butt Boogie" in my next post to this thread.

12 Nov 07 - 06:12 PM (#2192269)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

THE BERTHA BUTT BOOGIE- Part I

{Jimmy Castor Bunch}

The party was jumpin' when Bertha got off o' her stump,
The whistles were blowin' and everybody did the "Bump".
But all the time Bertha had been workin' on her goodie,
Now folks call it "The Bertha Butt Boogie".

When Bertha Butt did her goodie,
She started "The Bertha Butt Boogie".
No question.

When Bertha got movin' her hips were hummin' in the wind,
The ground started shakin' - no grass grew where she'd been!
The music was poppin', the crowd had formed a ring,
Her sisters yelled, "Boogie, Bertha, do your thing!".

Uh, for your information, Bertha had three sisters,
Betty Butt, Bella Butt and Bathsheba Butt.

When Bertha Butt did her goodie,
She started "The Bertha Butt Boogie".
I said no question.

Hey, Leroy, get away from that woman!
The boy'll never learn!
Uh-oh, here comes the Troglodyte!
Troglodyte: "Come here, sock it to me!"

Bertha stood back and yelled, "Betty, Bella, Bathsheba!"
And the Butt Sisters backed her up when she yelled, "I need ya!".
The Troglodyte, Leroy, Luther and the Butt Sisters all knew
That "The Bertha Butt Boogie" was now the thing to do.

When Bertha Butt did her goodie,
She started "The Bertha Butt Boogie".
No question.

Bertha: "I'll sock it ya, daddy!"
Troglodyte: "Me like, me like! Come here, woman, woman!"
Leroy: "Yo' mama, I'm calling you, man!"
Troglodyte: "Yeah - the Boogie!"

FADE OUT

http://www.lyricsdownload.com/jimmy-castor-bunch-the-bertha-butt-boogie-part-1-lyrics.html

**

Youtube clip {sound clip and an image of the record album}:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CBOhw2wSZo

12 Nov 07 - 06:37 PM (#2192294)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

BTW is this a musical thread now or should it stay below the line, you know, at the BOTTOM?
-Neil D

I like it when BS threads contain song lyrics and music videos.

I think adding lyrics enhance threads and that links to music videos are a wonderful way to introduce & reacquaint people to songs and dances.

While I think that there definitely should be a BS thread separate from the Mudcat music & folk culture thread, I think that sometimes a merging of those divisions will occur and it's healthy for that to happen.

For instance, I think it's nautural for some BS threads-like this one-to contain references to, and examples of music & folk culture. After all, "folk culture" encompases everything, including lighthearted and more serious "BS".

That said, I remember when I had dial up, and it was impossible to access videos. Plus even if I couldn't get those videos, having them posted on a page made the page load so much slower.

While I'll continue to post links videos, I'd like to apologize to those who are still on dial up for slowing up the works.

If you can get faster Internet access where you live, I hope that you get it soon. Doing so truly opens up a whole new world.

12 Nov 07 - 06:38 PM (#2192295)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Steve Shaw

If Jesus was arseless, then what, pray tell, did he use to sit on the right hand of his heavenly father?

12 Nov 07 - 07:04 PM (#2192311)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Becca72

My ring-back tone on my cell phone is 'Fat Bottom Girls' by Queen. It's a family theme song. :-)

12 Nov 07 - 07:17 PM (#2192319)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Steve Shaw

Then of course there's Short Fat Fanny, as sung by Gino Lupari on the first Four Men And A Dog album!

12 Nov 07 - 07:32 PM (#2192332)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Just imagine the confusion if "The hole in the elephant's bottom" had been written in the US.

Cheers, Rowan

13 Nov 07 - 01:34 AM (#2192481)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: JennieG

Rowan, I didn't grow up with Sydney slang - I grew up with Tamworth slang! I haven't heard of "more front than Myers".

Cheers
JennieG

13 Nov 07 - 01:51 AM (#2192483)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Sorry JennieG!
So you probably haven't heard the expression (when indicating "He's got as much chance of ... as a snowball's in hell", ie none at all)

"He's got Buckley's!"

Also reputed to derive from the store in Bourke St next to Myer's; Buckley & Nunn

Cheers, Rowan

13 Nov 07 - 05:01 AM (#2192535)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: rich-joy

... and then there's the expression "sweet fanny adams" (or, rather "sweet f**k all", in Oz, and often acronymed into "SFA")!!!

Cheers, R-J

13 Nov 07 - 05:17 AM (#2192544)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,sparticus

Other fanny expressions:

"He/She's running around like a fanny in a fit." - He/She doesn't have a clue what he/she is doing.

"Here comes Fanny two-shoes" - Miss prim and proper.

"Stop fannying on." - Stop messing about.

Fanny by gaslight always made me chuckle!

13 Nov 07 - 06:32 AM (#2192566)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: David C. Carter

"Fanlight Fanny the Froussy Night Club Queen"
Clinton Ford,Way back when...
The title always gave me a laugh!

David

13 Nov 07 - 07:06 AM (#2192583)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Steve Shaw

Then there's the (possibly apocryphal) tale of Johnny Cradock saying at the end of the cookery programme "That's all for this week, and I hope your doughnuts turn out like Fanny's."

13 Nov 07 - 07:43 AM (#2192596)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: TheSnail

There's a great line in Claudy Banks -

I boldly stepped up to her and gave her arse a prize.

13 Nov 07 - 07:54 AM (#2192601)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

And there's Jake Thackeray -

'I love a good bum on a woman, it makes my day!'

LTS

13 Nov 07 - 08:00 AM (#2192605)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rusty Dobro

Don't care what you call it but Kylie Minogue's on last week's TV Special (in the UK) was perfection.

13 Nov 07 - 08:42 AM (#2192632)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,sparticus

Jake Thakeray was spot on. Walking down the street to the shops there's nothing better than catching sight of a Kylie Minogue type rear. On the other hand there's others that just remind you that you need to buy a sack of spuds.

13 Nov 07 - 09:46 AM (#2192673)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Here's a children's rhyme that mentions "fat bums":

Apple on a stick makes me sick makes my heart beat 2-46 not because you're dirty not because you're clean not because you kissed the boy behind the magazine hey girls you wanna have some fun cause here come a lady with a big fat bum she can wibble she can wobble she can even do the splits but i bet ya i bet ya she can't do this close your eyes and count to ten if you muck it up you're a big fat hen. 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10 (if you didn't muck up) we didn't muck it up so that's the end. we're best friends. (if you did muck up) we mucked up and that's the end so start again cause we're not best friends.
-Allie; 2/15/2007

-snip-

That example was sent to my website Cocojams . Fwiw, I just posted that example and some others to Mudcat's thread on Children's Street Songs thread.cfm?threadid=4300&messages=133 in response to a guest's query about that rhyme.

13 Nov 07 - 10:02 AM (#2192679)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,Obie

Or the limerick:
There was a young lady from Mass.
With a truly magnificent ass
Not rounded and pink, as you probably think
But gray, had long ears and ate grass

13 Nov 07 - 05:30 PM (#2193029)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

There are some really wide ones at Big Cuties.com

14 Nov 07 - 01:35 AM (#2193251)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: JennieG

Darwin (Northern Teritory, Oz) has a place named Fanny Bay. Lots of boats moor there.

Those bags that folk wear hanging off their waist (either front or back) I believe are, in the US, called fanny packs. We call them bum bags.

Or, should one wish to go proper posh, rectum receptacles.

Cheers
JennieG

14 Nov 07 - 03:35 AM (#2193285)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Time to resurrect the regency term for a handbag - "reticule"?

14 Nov 07 - 08:46 AM (#2193446)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Here's another reference to big butts in a children's rhyme:

POLICE LADY POLICE LADY DO YOUR DUTY
Police lady, police lady. Do your duty.
Here comes Keisha
with ah African booty.
She can wiggle.
She can wobble.
She can do the split.
But I betcha five dollars
She can't do this.
Lady on one foot, one foot, one foot
Turn all around, around, around.
Lady on two foot, two foot, two foot
Touch the ground, the ground, the ground.
Lady on three foot, three foot, three foot
Say your prayers, your prayers, your prayers.
Lady on four foot, four foot, four foot
Jump right out.
-TMP. Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, mid 1980s

-snip-

The reference to big butts in this rhyme is "an African booty".
I need to correct the impression that I may have given that saying a woman has a big butt is always an insult in African American cultures. It's not. In this jump rope rhyme an African booty is a compliment.

"Lady on one foot" means jump on one foot, "two foot" means jump on two feet; three foot means jump with two feet and one hand touching the ground, and four feet means jumping on two feet with both hands touching the ground. Two people who we called "enders" turned one or two long ropes. We called it "Double Dutch" if enders turned two ropes.

TMP is my daughter. This rhyme is very much like the one I learned when I was growing up. However, we said "Policeman Policeman Do Your Duty". I find it very significant that children in my daughter's generation changed the referent "police man" to "police lady". I don't think there were any female police when I was growing up in the 1950s. Btw, I didn't teach her this rhyme. She learned it from her peers.

14 Nov 07 - 08:56 AM (#2193449)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

And LeRoi Jones (I'm spacing out what his name is now, sorry) wrote in a poem:

...and my goddess got steatopygia

I remember running across that many years ago and having to look it up to see what it meant.

14 Nov 07 - 09:07 AM (#2193458)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Steve Shaw

I've been using the word "callipygian" for some years now. It's far more respectable to say that in polite company when you've spotted a wondrous rear end than it is to say "Phwoar - (insert what it is you really want to say)!"

14 Nov 07 - 09:20 AM (#2193467)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Poet, playwright, author, activist LeRoi Jones
changed his name to Amiri Baraka to better reflect his African cultural nationalism.

Fyiw, from 1967-1969 I was a member of the Newark, New Jersey cultural nationalist group that Amiri Baraka led.

14 Nov 07 - 09:37 AM (#2193480)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Ugh! fyiw

I either meant to write fyi {for your information} or fwiw {for what it's worth}

Off topic but for what it's worth and for your information, here's a link to information on cultural nationalism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_nationalism

The form of Black cultural nationalism that I accepted/accept is learning, strengthening, and celebrating the cultural connections between African people and people of the African Diaspora worldwide, and helping to build and support Black cultural institutions in the USA.

Hmmm.

How did a play on words thread about the structure of butts lead to references to cultural nationalism? Well, [also] for what it's worth, and afaic {as far as I'm concerned} all roads do not lead to Rome. But I don't mind taking an opportunity to refer to serious subjects I'm interested in, even in a fun discussion thread.

But, hopefully, this will not ruin the lighthearted mood of this thread.

14 Nov 07 - 10:17 AM (#2193516)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

Azizi - Yes, Amiri Baraka, thank you.

I recall one of his earliest poems that started out:

What evil lurks in the hearts of men,
Only Jack Kerouac and me that I know of.

I saw him interviewed by Bill O'Reilly. It was total disconnect.

14 Nov 07 - 12:37 PM (#2193614)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: topical tom

UPON JULIA'S CLOTHES.
by Robert Herrick

WHENAS in silks my Julia goes,
Then, then, methinks, how sweetly flows
That liquefaction of her clothes.

Next, when I cast mine eyes and see
That brave vibration each way free ;
O how that glittering taketh me !

15 Nov 07 - 06:59 AM (#2194260)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

Presumably having a big butt is another way of saying 'child bearing hips', an indication of easy births and fecundity. Ever seen a fertility goddess with a tiny tush?

If your culture is based upon prosperity shewn by large families and lots of sons, then a good, fertile wife or wives is the way to go. A woman would have better prospects of marriage if she were healthy, plump and looked capable of bearing many children.

In the west, it's only in the last 100 years or so that skinny women have been the desired norm. Even with the corsetry of the 18th and 19th Centuries, the emphasis was placed on a large bosom (the "pouter pigeon" look) or the enhanced caboose. The shrinking of the waist to the desired 19 or 18 inches of an hourglass figure only served to enhance the size of the top and bottom parts.

I have an hourglass figure. It's just that the sand has mainly trickled to the bottom.

LTS

15 Nov 07 - 07:17 AM (#2194268)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: beardedbruce

100

15 Nov 07 - 07:29 AM (#2194274)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: GUEST,PMB

Or to put it another way, Steve, ecce fundamentum in ho.

Apparently it used to be said in the South West, "The bigger the maid, the better the cheese." This was because the cheese (Cheddar) was pressed by sitting on top of it.

15 Nov 07 - 07:36 AM (#2194279)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

www.smileytraffic.com/?rid=18247&splash=4

These things never turn out "blue" for me!

15 Nov 07 - 08:23 AM (#2194301)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Riginslinger, that didn't turn into a hyperlink because you didn't add a http:// in front of the www URL that you posted.

Highlight that URL and add an http:// to that www.smileytraffic.com/?rid=18247&splash=4 and then place the whole thing in the box that appears after you click on to the "Make a link {"blue clicky"} that is provided at the BOTTOM of this comment box.

When I added http: to that URL and did what I said above, I got a view that I could have lived without seeing.

And no, that's not a photo of me. BUTT I'm sure she's a very nice woman.

15 Nov 07 - 08:24 AM (#2194304)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Azizi

Opps, I meant to post that hyperlink:

http://www.smileytraffic.com/?rid=18247&splash=4

15 Nov 07 - 04:53 PM (#2194769)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Liz, your comments about female fertility reminded me.

According to a series of (apparently unconnected) articles in New Scientist that appeared around 1996/7 various investigators were trying to see whether there was any sort of objective measure of female beauty that could then be analysed in a natural selection methodology.

At first they took the "vital statistics" of all the Miss America, Miss World and Miss Universe winners, as reported in the press, on the basis that they represented at least a group of 'judged' and thus 'objectively accepted' beautiful shapes. The only common rating (stay with me) applicable to all of them was the Hip:Waist ratio, from memory about 1.2:1. Breast size & shape was irrelevant, apparently and the recorded weights of the women involved had decreased by about 2 stone (28 lbs in American money) from 1944(?) when the first of these competitions had occurred to ~ 1995. But despite these changes, the hip:waist ratio of "the most beautiful" had stayed the same.

Thinking that others might regard this as biased due to America (and western) fondness for displays of nudity, they checked their findings in Indonesia, where Playboy routinely had black bars printed over anything nude that wasn't a male chest. They used only silhouettes of women's figures and the preferred images all had the same hip:waist ratio. There was more but that's all I can recall.

I might add that this article was only one of series that New Scientist ran over a couple of years that was most interesting from a human biology perspective. One described the effect of attractiveness on how much semen was "stripped" (I kid you not) from men during intercourse and ejaculation. Without going into boring detail, they found that no matter how attractive the males rated their female partners for such activities (even using hip:waist ratios) it was the more Rubenesque ladies (ie, slightly overweight to "modern" eyes) that routinely stripped the most semen from their partners.

The inference drawn from this was that, despite any 'conscious' deliberations by the male, the women with just that little bit extra subcutaneous fat (already known to be a marker of higher fertility) were better able to get their partners to "deliver" in the fertilisation stakes. All very Darwinian!

Just thought you'd like to know.

Cheers, Rowan

15 Nov 07 - 07:14 PM (#2194894)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

Thanks Rowan - another theory proven then!

LTS

15 Nov 07 - 11:08 PM (#2195027)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

It would make sense, one would think, that a man would not lust after flesh, if there was no flesh to lust after.

17 Nov 07 - 10:04 AM (#2195940)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

I read a study about the concept of the ideal woman in advertising a number of years ago, and they made the point that American advertising icons were continually made thinner. The direction of their argument seemed to be that advertising made people think the ideal woman should be thinner, but people didn't really believe it in real life.
They started with Lilian Russell as an original role model, as I recall.
Some of the icons that had been made thinner over the years included Aunt Jemima, Better Crocker, the Dutch Cleanser Girl, and the Dove Soap Girl. There were others that I don't remember now.

17 Nov 07 - 12:44 PM (#2196060)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

There are several factors in play here.

First, the "selfish gene" approach. We will desire sex with the partner most likely to produce strongly surviving offspring.

Then the Gordon Gecko. Women will desire the mate best able to provide for offspring (in current Western society, the richest or the most socially or politically powerful).

Then the paranoid man. He will seek women least likely to have had previus partners lest his genes do not take in that the woman may already be pregnant. Here lies the Victorian fascination with virginity, and the foundations for today's institutional peadophilia.

Then the 60s - the change of sex from being for procreation to recreation. The LAST thinking you wanted was a fertile mate, for babies were a sex life disaster.

Then the powercrazed: The powerful of both sexes wish to control others including thier sex partners, so desire such partners to be inexperienced, hence immature, hence youthful - hence slim and free of body hair or odour.

The need for a robust physique to combat illness has been displaced by medical advance, so mass is no longer a survival trait.

Compare the way paleness is prized in agricultural societies, since it betokens a person of enough power that another can labour for them - but the 60s and since, the suntan indicates enough money to holiday in the sun. Then the sunbed and Easyjet - the suntan becomes the derided "tango".

17 Nov 07 - 01:31 PM (#2196087)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: TheSnail

Richard Bridge

Then the 60s - the change of sex from being for procreation to recreation.

That'll come a surprise to generations of ploughboys, milkmaids and Jolly Jack Tars. Invalidates a huge swathe of folksongs at one go.

17 Nov 07 - 05:34 PM (#2196243)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

You don't remember the liberating effect of the pill?

17 Nov 07 - 05:50 PM (#2196261)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

Richard - not all of us are that old :D

LTS

17 Nov 07 - 07:23 PM (#2196325)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Richard,your comment about the selfish gene may be spot on; the New Scientist articles were published only ten years ago, on research that had been done in only the previous year or two and I left out mention of others that were dealing with aspects not relevant to the structure/shape etc of human physiognomy. Given that the earlier study I mentioned was an atttempt to be objective about "what males regarded as attractive about a woman's shape" I was intrigued that it was the waist hip ratio. But I was fascinated by the disparity between attractiveness at the conscious level and the unconscious level. The women rated as most attractive at a (not necessarily "the") conscious level, as measured by how much sperm was "stripped" during ejaculation weren't nearly as effective at it as those our currrent culture would describe as "fat".

We can be as socially reconstructed as we like and as politically correct/incorrect etc as we like at a conscious level; the results showed that, at a rather fundamental level (over which we apparently have no conscious control; we're talking 'quantity' here rather than timing) our bodies have other ideas. Some may say it's the old reptilian brain at work. In winter I like sitting with my back to the sun so, while I may deny having a reptilian brain, I'll admit to having a reptilian back.

Cheers, Rowan

17 Nov 07 - 09:37 PM (#2196410)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

"...how much sperm was "stripped" during ejaculation weren't nearly as effective at it as those our currrent culture would describe as "fat"."

Males in current industrialized cultures are victims of advertising and consumerism to the point that their cognitive levels of sex drive seek thinner women than their animal levels would normally think to be desirable.

At least that's what I get from the posting, and I think it's correct. I think modern men would rather be seen in public with women who are thinner than those women with whom they would rather go to bed.

18 Nov 07 - 04:13 AM (#2196528)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

Riginslinger - I think that is entirely dependent on how secure your man is with his own image and his relationship with his friends. I know plenty of men who are considered 'hotties' who are perfectly happy being seen in public with women who don't quite meet the modern criteria for 'beautiful', because they've taken the time to get to know the person and love them for who they are, not what they look like.

Of course, we can condense all this into an old Biker joke.

Why is a fat woman like a moped? It's fun to ride but you wouldn't want your mates to find out.

LTS

18 Nov 07 - 08:43 AM (#2196657)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

Liz - Of course you're right. I was speaking in generalities. The moped joke is a funny line.

18 Nov 07 - 04:37 PM (#2196990)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Males in current industrialized cultures are victims of advertising and consumerism to the point that their cognitive levels of sex drive seek thinner women than their animal levels would normally think to be desirable.

While I'd agree with that summary, the test of hip:waist ratios was repeated in Indonesia (using silhouettes and not photos) and arrived at exactly the same results. I'm not sure of which part of Indonesia they located their testing but not much of Indonesia would be described as an industrialised culture. I suspect there's an opening for a PhD student (with a travel bug and a lot of financial support) to try the tests in as many far-flung and nonindustrialised culture as possible, to see how universally the results apply. Getting it past the ethics committee might be interesting.

Cheers, Rowan

18 Nov 07 - 06:11 PM (#2197056)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: JennieG

Perhaps the hip/waist ratio could be something to do with having good childbearing hips?

Cheers
JennieG who does (only just) remember the impact the Pill had in the 60s

18 Nov 07 - 06:58 PM (#2197079)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

You could look at it the other way round. In general, the more the male orgasm is delayed, the more ejaculate there will be. So a man having sex with a fat woman he doesn't really fancy may well ejaculate more by the time he comes. He probably will come (eventually) no matter how unattractive the partner, for the male orgasm is mostly a product of temperature and friction...

18 Nov 07 - 07:12 PM (#2197093)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Steve Shaw

Yeah but he might not be able to measure how much ejaculate, and what a word, he's produced because it got lost in all those rolls of lipaceous tissue. Bloody Nora, how a perfectly funny thread can go off. Click ye not here henceforth, Shaw.

19 Nov 07 - 07:57 AM (#2197373)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

Spoken like a true victim of Madison Avenue!

19 Nov 07 - 02:18 PM (#2197659)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Liz the Squeak

So who is Madison Avenue and why should we avoid her?

LTS

19 Nov 07 - 03:28 PM (#2197731)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Celtaddict

To go w-a-a-y back (to Nov 11), it is not clear why the assumption seems to have been put forth that 'tush' and such necessarily meant anal sex.
Surely the extremely common expressions 'piece of tail' and 'piece of ass' are commonly used to mean sexual intercourse, not necessarily anal.

There is a charming etching that has been on my nursery wall, then my (now grown) daughter's wall, for many years, entitled "Le Tousche." It depicts a very young child, unclothed, from the back, climbing on a chair.

And I must admit that, as a gynecologist who spent fourteen years in the Navy and reared four kids, I can discuss virtually anything, but the terms 'butt' and 'ass' are not in my usual vocabulary; I use 'backside' usually, and I don't think it is only because I never know the preferred terms (or offense threshold) of my patients.

19 Nov 07 - 04:17 PM (#2197767)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rowan

Celtaddict, your comment reminded me of the old saw about the "polite" terminology used by doctors, sometimes to the confusion of their patients.

A bloke visited his doctor complaining of a pain in his rear end, making it quite clear (but without using any particular words) he was referring to the alimentary canal. The doctor prescribed some pills with the instruction that he was "to put one pill in the back passage every day for month and then see him again."

After the month your man visited the doctor who asked "How did it go?"

Your man replied "I dunno if them pills is any good, Doc. I did what you said. I put them in the back passage, the front passage, the kitchen, the bathroom, but they never worked. I may as well have shoved 'em up me arse for all the good they did me!"

I suspect you wouldn't have had that problem in the navy.

Cheers, Rowan

19 Nov 07 - 11:56 PM (#2198010)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Riginslinger

"...it is not clear why the assumption seems to have been put forth that 'tush' and such necessarily meant anal sex."

I guess I missed that!

20 Nov 07 - 02:54 AM (#2198050)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Surely Celtaddict has become confused? I ahve not re-read the entire thread (but I have read all of it at least once) and as I recollect, it was stated that "tush" in the USA generally follows the Yiddish in meaning "backside" whereas in songs like "tush" it appears to have come to mean "cunt".

However, Frankie goes to Hollywood's "Relax" was a song about gay anal sex.

20 Nov 07 - 08:46 AM (#2198227)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Celtaddict

You may well be right, Richard Bridge, I may have misinterpreted the comment 'It's about gay anal sex, doh' to refer to more than just the song 'Relax', in the midst of all the commentary on terms that have in various times and places referred to the backside or the feminine front side.
Actually (mild thread drift) in the office it is important to make sure the patient does understand; I know too many doctors do not make a point of this, and some are notorious for using medical jargon leaving patients confused at best. I once had a memorable conversation in a pediatrics clinic with the mother of an infant who seemed dehydrated, as follows:
"Does your baby have diarrhea?"
   "Huh?"
"Watery bowel movements?"
   "Huh?"
"Are his stools loose?"
   "Huh?"
"Does he have the runs?"
   "Uhhh..."
"Your baby got the shits?"
   "Oh, yeah, doc, my baby got the shits real bad!"

20 Nov 07 - 09:14 AM (#2198252)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Rapparee

You must excuse me, Azizi, but I cannot resist inserting a picture of one of the best US bottoms (at least in my own opinion) in Boston or anywhere else in the country.

20 Nov 07 - 09:36 AM (#2198264)
Subject: RE: BS: The structure of fannies (US bottoms)
From: Richard Bridge

Surely that pic is mostly tops Rapaire.