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17 Mar 08 - 07:12 PM (#2291099) Subject: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: NormanD Does anyone know where to get hold of a copy of "Dark Girl Dressed In Blue" by Stanley Holloway? It was originally the 'B' side to Holloway's "Growing Old" (Decca F11140) released June 1959. Holloway's version is the one being sought, so any leads are welcomed. Thanks in advance. |
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17 Mar 08 - 07:35 PM (#2291130) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,Steve Gardham Possibly not the same song, Norman, but prolific folk-song writer Harry Clifton who died in 1872 wrote a song of this title in 1862. I say folk-song writer because of all the music hall lyricists his songs more than anyone else's of the early music hall are still sung today as folk songs. Both Vance and Leybourne wrote spin-off songs to this one so it must have been very popular in its day. The Levy collection has a copy online. It must have entered oral tradition very quickly as different versions exist on broadsides. |
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17 Mar 08 - 08:02 PM (#2291164) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Q (Frank Staplin) As Steve says, it was spread by penny broadsides by several printers. The Bodleian Library has copies, no date, no author. Kilgarriff says there were several spin-offs, including "I'm the Dark Girl Dress'd in Blue," and "The Young Chap Dressed in Blue." It is listed as one of Stanley Holloway's standards. I couldn't find the song listed on any of the Holloway cds listed at amazon.com. Try amazon.co.uk |
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17 Mar 08 - 08:45 PM (#2291201) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Peace Winster Gallop/Four-Hand Reel/Dark Girl Dressed In Blue This set of tunes was included on the band's first album 'No Reels' in 1977 and Dave Hunt adapted a dance for it, which we now know as "The Old Swan Gallop". It's changed a bit since then and shows the way the band has developed. "Winster Gallop" is one of the traditional Morris tunes from Winster in Derbyshire, which was noted down by Cecil Sharp in his famous meeting with the team in 1908. The "Four-Hand Reel" with its odd number of bars in the A-music, was a tune played by Herbert Smith in 1952 to Peter Kennedy. Smith was a sexton from Blakeney in Norfolk. "The Dark Girl Dressed In Blue" Decca F11140 coupled with "Growing Old" in 1959 by Stanley Holloway. Jack Warner (more famous as Dixon of Dock Green) was said to have used it as his theme song when he worked on the Music Halls, but, in fact, it's much older than that, with broadside versions having been issued around 1865. It's a humorous song where the chap (often up for the Great Exhibition) meets the Dark Girl, who asks him to get her change for her five-pound note. Of course, the note is forged, the girl disappears and he has to explain himself to "the large man dressed in blue". It was popular as a tune especially in England and Ireland, where the great fiddler Johnny Doherty had a fine version. from here. |
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17 Mar 08 - 08:50 PM (#2291206) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Peace Maybe a search for "Growing Old". ? |
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18 Mar 08 - 12:52 PM (#2291692) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: NormanD "Growing Old"? Clearly I must be.... Here's a sheet music link Dark Girl Dressed In Blue I'm assuming this is the same song. |
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18 Mar 08 - 01:14 PM (#2291721) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: The Borchester Echo Dark Girl (Duchess) Dressed In Blue is done (and recorded) famously at a fair lick and in the style of Chuck Berry by Tigermoth. And possibly even more famously when Spiers&Boden used the tune for Child Morris (Gil Morice Child #93). |
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18 Mar 08 - 01:14 PM (#2291722) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: The Borchester Echo Erm, #83. Cold fingers . . . |
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18 Mar 08 - 01:48 PM (#2291762) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Q (Frank Staplin) I have not been able to find Holloway's version. |
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19 Mar 08 - 01:41 PM (#2292770) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks The Stanley Holloway version was recorded in 1959 for Decca and issued on a 45rpm disc. It is a magnificent performance and I can confirm that the song was,indeed the Harry Clifton number. The original sheet music, published by B Williams in 1862 has a lithographed front with one of the finest representations of Clifton 'in character', with the cunning dark girl who conned him out of his money and nearly got him nicked for handling counterfeit notes (bills) at the Great Exhibition of '62. I'm sure this has all been covered in detail in another thread, but I don't see it listed above. |
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19 Mar 08 - 04:53 PM (#2292981) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Malcolm Douglas Not of any help with the original question, but as a follow-up, sheet music (with that lithographed cover) is at the Lester Levy Collection: The dark girl dress'd in blue Broadside editions, localised to various places, can be seen at Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads: The dark girl dress'd in blue Note that the tune at 'http://www.traditionalmusic.co.uk/' was copied without permission (along with the entire contents of their tunebook) from the Lewes Arms Folk Club website; and without even the elementary courtesy of a link to the source site. |
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19 Mar 08 - 05:56 PM (#2293037) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Arkie Is this song any relation to Blue Velvet Band? |
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20 Mar 08 - 03:33 AM (#2293317) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Malcolm Douglas No. |
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20 Mar 08 - 07:15 AM (#2293401) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,Edthefolkie I think I remember Stanley's version on Children's Favourites around the time the record came out. Interestingly, the song can be dated approximately (1860-ish) by the line: "For I must go to Pimlico, to catch the Brighton train". The Brighton line originally only got as far as Stewart's Lane (Battersea) and the railway bridge over the Thames came later, along with the railway to Victoria station. Until Victoria was completed, Pimlico was the terminus for Brighton. Which just goes to show that folk and puffer trains are parallel lines. |
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20 Mar 08 - 03:46 PM (#2293888) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks It is also dateable quite precisely by the reference in the first verse to 'the exhibition', meaning the 1862 exhibition in South Kensington. To remove any possible doubt,the 1862 building can be seen in the background to the Concanen & Lee lithograph attached to Malcolm's 19 March posting. Part of this building later got transported to Bethnal Green,where it houses the Museum of Childhood. I find Clifton fascinating as character-singer and songwriter. One of the pre-sound-recording artistes I would have most liked to hear. |
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20 Mar 08 - 07:14 PM (#2294065) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,Steve Gardham Billy, I too am a great fan of Harry Clifton. Do you have any of his sheets? I came to him through 'My Rattling Old Black Mare' which I collected orally in the 60s and since have come across several of his songs in oral tradition, more than anybody else's from the early music hall. Rocky Road to Dublin (Though he didn't write it) Send back my Barney (The original of My Bonny) Polly Perkins Lannigan's Ball Paddle your own Canoe Where there's a will there's a way (Still sung round Sheffield) Calico Printer's Clerk I am one of the Olden Time (Mukram Wakes) On Board of the Kangaroo Water Cresses Waterford Boys The Weepin Willer I paid the most I've ever paid for a piece of sheet music to get 'Rattling Old Black Mare' I also have more than a passing interest in the early burlesques of trad ballads like Lord Lovel, Barbara Allen, Ah my Love's Dead, Villikins etc. and the songs of J B Geoghegan who wrote 'Hey John Barleycorn' and 'Ten thousand Miles away' among others we still sing. |
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21 Mar 08 - 06:17 AM (#2294308) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks Steve Good to hear from another Clifton aficianado. Yes, I have a number of pieces of sheet music of Clifton songs, mostly with portrait fronts, including 'Dark Girl d.i.b', Paddle Your Own Canoe', Polly Perkins', 'Weepin Willer', Pulling Hard Against the Stream', Jones's Musical Party' and others. He seems to have had a great facility for writing songs that immediately took on a feral existence. I think he must have done a great deal of listening as a young man to capture the common voice as he did. I share your interest in the burlesque ballads that seemed to peak in (but were already established by) the 1850s/6Os. My collection contains a number of them, with Jack Sharp, Sam Cowell, Robson etc all represented. There is much more work to be done on these singers and their songs. |
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21 Mar 08 - 12:05 PM (#2294517) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Folknacious Diane Easby wrote: "Dark Girl (Duchess) Dressed In Blue is done (and recorded) famously at a fair lick and in the style of Chuck Berry by Tigermoth." I think you'll find that the style is Bo Diddley rather than Chuck Berry (hence The Duchess Dressed In Blue - she and Jerome were Bo Diddley's musical sidekicks). Tiger Moth's reworking seems to have become an English Ceilidh standard judging by the number of other bands I've heard do it that way at festivals over the years. |
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21 Mar 08 - 12:19 PM (#2294531) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: The Borchester Echo I suppose it is a bit Not Fade Away-ish. Amazing how well the tune works with Child Morris though. |
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21 Mar 08 - 01:21 PM (#2294574) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: NormanD If you ever want to get from Stanley Holloway to Bo, Jerome and The Duchess in three moves, then look no further than this thread. As ever, great! Info on tis old 45 / 78 still seems as elusive as ever...... |
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21 Mar 08 - 04:48 PM (#2294746) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,Steve Gardham Okay Billy, Malcolm's blown your cover. We should get together sometime and put together a presentation on the Clifton and Cowell/Robson stuff for TSF. I've already done one on the burlesques, but I'd love to do one on the music hall stuff at one of the London meetings, nothing too heavy. Distance might prove a problem, me in Hull and you in Kent. We probably have a pretty representative coverage of Clifton sheets between us. Have you got a copy of Harry Clifton's Death? I've got it on a broadside but haven't seen sheet music if it exists. One thing that puzzles me is why were there several similar but different portraits on different issues of the sheets. I have several copies of such as 'Paddle your own canoe/Polly Perkins' with slightly different sketches on. Another thing that amused me about his songs is I think 'Rattling Old Black Mare' is a parody of his 'My Old Wife and I' It actually says in the chorus of ROBM 'It's not my wife upon my life but my rattling old black mare. (That he now loves) Did he fall out with his wife at some point? He also had a song 'My Mother-in-law! He seems to have incorporated the names of the main towns he sang in. Our local one is 'Faithless Maria or The Land of Green Ginger' |
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22 Mar 08 - 06:39 AM (#2295030) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: NormanD Thanks, Steve. You don't, by chance, know the whereabouts or availability of an old 45 by Stanley Holloway called.......? |
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22 Mar 08 - 07:14 AM (#2295039) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks Steve, I adopted my Mudcat name because I am not really part of the folk world - just dipping my toe in from time to time. But since you have managed to get so close (Kent? South East London actually - but it was once Kent) I'm glad of the contact to compare notes. It may be better by PM to avoid gross thread drift. I have a collection of some hundreds of theatre and music hall song sheets covering a wide range of dates, types and origins, but (and I hasten to say this, to avoid inviting random inquiries) it is totally unindexed. I think you must have more Clifton's than I do. Sorting mine out from the heap may take some time (never had reason to do it until now). And, no, I've not seen HC's Death. I am currently collecting (very slowly) song sheets of the early nineteenth century actors, Mr & Mrs Fitzwilliam, whose songs and style seem to me anticipate music hall by twenty years or more. With regard to lithographs, I have always assumed that, because the published life of a comic song was quite short, there was never any need to renew the fronts but, when a song enjoyed continuing heavy sales,the stones would eventually show signs of wear. They were often crudely retouched (which is why we don't like buying them) but sometimes, I think, a completely new front was commissioned. ther was also, of course, some piracy. I mustn't go on! |
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22 Mar 08 - 07:55 AM (#2295051) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks Steve: I forgot to ask. What time of day are the TSF meetings? That may seem a strange question, but I am an ancient (and also a non-driver) and like to be home in the evenings at a reasonable hour. |
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24 Mar 08 - 05:16 AM (#2296345) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks Refresh |
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24 Mar 08 - 07:32 PM (#2296864) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST Billy TSF presentations are always in the afternoon. Format. Round robin of current research in morning plus TSF business. Afternoon presentations followed by a bit of a sing. London mtgs are always at C#ho Email gardhams?hotmail.com I also have a pretty large collection of 19thc sheet music mostly related to trad, specialising in Clifton, Robson, Cowell, Geoghegan, burlesques and minstrel. Have you got any Geoghegan? Mine is indexed and the bulk is actually filed in title alphabetical order. Cheers Steve |
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25 Mar 08 - 11:10 AM (#2297278) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Billy Weeks Hi Steve Afternoons suit my life pattern rather well. My God, you are indexed! In my own defence, I am working on a system. 'Should be in that pile over there. Or possibly somewhere else'. I haven't any Geoghegan. Not that I can be absolutely sure. I'll be in touch by email today. |
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25 Mar 08 - 05:36 PM (#2297583) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,ChrisP. Steve, with regard to lithograph editions it has to be remembered that, as the name suggests, DRAWN ON STONE ! Even if the image didn't actually wear out and need redrawing, I suspect there would be little temptation to keep an archive of images in case another edition came along, simply on space grounds. These lumps of stone are typically over an inch thick and would take up too much room. They would also be valuable and recycled as a matter of course. Much easier to do the drawing again from scratch if required, since it was a requirement to be able to do this sort of thing for every single image anyway. |
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25 Mar 08 - 07:16 PM (#2297625) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: NormanD Great! Any chance of one of you technicians transferring an old 45 onto MP3 and sending it me? Thought not. Hope you don't mind me asking. Please excuse my thread drift. |
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26 Mar 08 - 06:44 PM (#2298336) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Greg B Ask Bill Clinton. |
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02 Apr 08 - 08:13 AM (#2304362) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,jh |
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11 May 10 - 03:12 PM (#2904660) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,Michelle Does anyone have an MP3 of Stanley Holloway's "Dark girl dressed in blue" ? pleeeese. |
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11 May 10 - 06:12 PM (#2904776) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Steve Gardham Artful will shortly have a midi of the Clifton version. Is it the same song? We will be posting all the relevant ABC and background very shortly. Thanks for reviving the thread. An amazing coincidence seeing as the last posting was in April 08 and I've just sent Artful all the scores and background. Artful, please see Billy Weekes' posting of 20th march 08 as it adds some clarity to what I put as description of the litho. |
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12 May 10 - 09:22 AM (#2905183) Subject: Lyr/Tune Add: DARK GIRL DRESS'D IN BLUE (H Clifton From: Artful Codger The Clifton version Steve Gardham sent me appears to be identical to the copy online at the Lester S. Levy site. The lyrics also tally nearly identically to a broadside in the online Bodleian Library Ballads collection: Harding B 11(795). Below, I've transcribed the lyrics from the sheet music, taking liberties with the punctuation to make the lyrics more readable. Another broadside version in the Bodley collection was previously transcribed by Joe Offer in this thread. THE DARK GIRL DRESS'D IN BLUE Written and Sung by Harry Clifton [1862?] 1. From a village away in Leicester, To London here I came, To see the Exhibition and All places of great fame. But what I suffer'd since I came, I now will tell to you, How I lost my heart and senses too, Thro' a dark girl dress'd in blue. CHORUS. She was a fine girl, fol de riddle I do A charmer, Fol de riddle oh. 2. 'Twas on a Friday morning The first day of August, When of that day I ever think My heart feels ready to bust. I went in a sixpenny omnibus, To the Exhibition of Sixty two; On a seat by the right-hand side of the door, Sat a dark girl dress'd in blue. 3. When we arrived in the Brompton Road The lady look'd so strange. The conductor he said, "Sixpence, ma'am!" Said she, "I have no change; I've nothing less than a five pound note. Whatever shall I do?" Said I, "Allow me to pay." "Oh, thank you, Sir," Said the dark girl dress'd in blue. 4. We chatted and talk'd as we onward walk'd About one thing or the other; She ask'd me, too--oh, wasn't it kind?-- If I had a Father or Mother. "Oh yes," says I, "and a grandmother too. But pray miss what are you?" "Oh, I'm chief engineer in a Milliner's Shop," Says the dark girl dress'd in blue. 5. We walk'd about for an hour or two Thro' the building near and far, Till we came in the grand refreshment room; I went straight up to the bar. She slipp'd in my hand a five pound note. I said, "What are you going to do?" "Oh, don't think it strange, I must have change," Said the dark girl dress'd in blue. 6. I call'd a waiter and handed him the note, And said, "Please change me that." The waiter bow'd and touch'd his hair, For this waiter wore no hat. In silver and gold five pounds he brought, I gave him coppers a few, And the change of the note I then did hand To the dark girl dress'd in blue. 7. She thank'd me and said, "I must away, Farewell 'til we meet again, For I've to go to Pimlico To catch the Brighton train." She quickly glided from my sight And soon was lost to view. I turn'd to leave, when by my side Stood a tall man dress'd in blue. 8. This tall man said, "Excuse me, sir, I'm one of the X division. That note was bad; my duty is, To take you on suspicion." Said I, "For a lady I obtain'd the change." He said, "Are you telling me true? Where's she live, What's her name?" Says I, "I don't know, She was a dark girl dress'd in blue." 9. My story they believ'd, they thought I'd been deceive'd But they said I must hand back the cash; I thought 'twas a sin [as] I gave them the tin And away went five pounds smash. So all young men take my advice, Be careful what you do When you make the acquaintance of ladies strange, Especially a dark girl dress'd in blue. Notes by Steve Gardham: Cover And here's an ABC transcription of the melody: X:1 T:The Dark Girl Dress'd in Blue C:Written and Sung by Harry Clifton [1862?] S:From period sheet music provided by Steve Gardham Z:Transcribed by Artful Codger M:C L:1/4 Q:1/4=180 " Allegretto" K:Bb "_mf" D/ E/ | F/ F/ F G>E | F>D B,>A | B B c A | w: From a vil-lage a-way to Lei-cester-shire, To Lon-don here I % B3 (D/E/) | F F G>E | F D C (D/E/) | F F E C | B,3 c | w: came, To* see the Ex-hi-bi-tion and All* pla-ces of great fame. But % d d e c | B A F>c | d d e c | (B2 A) c/ c/ | w: what I suf-fer'd since I came, I now will tell to you,_ How I % d d e (d/c/) | B A F F/ G/ | _A A G>D | E3 "<||" "^Chorus." D/E/ | w: lost my heart and* sen-ses too, Thro' a dark girl dress'd in blue. She* % % Chorus F F G E | F/ F/ D/ D/ B,/ B,/ (G/A/) | B B d/ B/ c/ A/ | B3 z |] w: was a fine girl fol de rid-dle I do A char-mer Fol de rid-dle oh. Also, the sheet music can be seen at The Levy Collection at Johns Hopkins University As Steve mentioned, MIDIs will be appearing shortly. The first will present the melody only, generated from the ABC above. The second will render the relevant bits of the sheet music score: the piano introduction, first verse, four-part chorus and piano break/finale. The remainder of the sheet music is duplication of the verse section, with the melody adjusted to scan with the lyrics. Click to play (melody)Click to play (full) |
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12 May 10 - 04:18 PM (#2905531) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Joe Offer MIDIs posted, thanks to Artful Codger. See links above - it's a lovely tune. -Joe- |
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12 May 10 - 05:05 PM (#2905565) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: Steve Gardham Yes, a very folky tune. It reminds me of the polka 'The Leathering of the Wattle O'. |
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01 Feb 12 - 10:11 AM (#3300262) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,sky Thank you all for this, the Holloway version was a favourite of my late wife, even to read the words is uplifting, thank you 'Artful Codger'. |
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07 Apr 12 - 06:22 PM (#3335142) Subject: RE: Looking for 'Dark Girl Dressed In Blue' From: GUEST,Nickthe bottlwasher I have both sides of this record "cleaned up" and put onto a CD. I could let you have a copy if you are still looking for it. |