mudchat gone? Not used I take it.

14 Oct 09 - 12:04 PM (#2745639)
Subject: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: the lemonade lady

I'm not surprised. Or is it that it's not showing on my pc anymore?

sal

---

Note: Mudchat is working again. See Max's note below (click).
-Joe Offer-

---

14 Oct 09 - 12:12 PM (#2745643)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

Seems to have gone. I shall miss it dreadfully :)

JM

---

14 Oct 09 - 01:12 PM (#2745693)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

In MY opinion MudChat was killed by people who Mis used the whole concept for their own warped purposes !

---

14 Oct 09 - 01:17 PM (#2745699)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: The Sandman

tell us more, leadfingers, [Icould never get it work anyway].
what dastardly doings happened in the mudchat room,sexual perversions in cyber space,what were these warped purposes,sounds fascinating,tell us more,did people talk dirty?

---

14 Oct 09 - 02:42 PM (#2745791)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Simply put, when you are not in Mudchat, you can't read what is being said, and you can't see what has been said afterward. That gave rise to some individuals being pretty nasty to others. Many left Mudchat and some even left Mudcat over the crap going on.

The management is well aware of the problem and it's consequences.

Will it be back? Who knows? In a different form? I, for one, sure hope so, because accountability for ones words and actions in a chat is paramount to it's future.

---

14 Oct 09 - 02:44 PM (#2745794)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

Well it's hard to deny your posts, if more than one person sees them.

JM

---

14 Oct 09 - 02:50 PM (#2745802)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

And if clones can retrieve same when alerted. And if good friends are kind enough to alert persons being trashed in their abscence to same... and so on.

It all adds up... eventually.

---

14 Oct 09 - 03:01 PM (#2745812)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Egos? Perhaps. Reputations, under penalty of liable, are a different matter altogether.

BTW, Garg... what is "critter chatter"?

---

14 Oct 09 - 03:23 PM (#2745826)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jeri

The link was missing. Max must've snuck in and put it back... sneaky sumbitch!

---

14 Oct 09 - 03:31 PM (#2745840)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Yo, J. Thanks... once again. >;-)

---

14 Oct 09 - 05:15 PM (#2745930)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Hovering Bob

Well, apparently some really nasty, insidious things have been perpetrated by some who have populated a parallel chat room and carried out 'raids' into the Mudchat room. I am told that a series of posts to the Mudchat chat room have been copied, edited to make them say something totally different and then sent to people who have taken them at face value. In this way some very hurtful results have been achieved and despicable damage done to the targets of these attacks. The fact that the third parties have been hurt as well is a sad knock on effect.
If the people who have caused this senseless destruction of friendships can not be excluded from Mudchat then it is just as well that the room has been closed, if that is what has happened. Isn't it a sad commentary on the state of the responsible individuals who can look at this sort of cyber thuggery as FUN.
Some close friends of mine have been badly hurt and what I find really disturbing is that the injuries have been inflicted by, or at least condoned, by other friends who should have known better.
It's a disgusting, disgraceful and distasteful situation that should never have been allowed to develop.
Sadly, BobH

---

14 Oct 09 - 05:19 PM (#2745934)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Mrs.Duck

I feel the same Bob!

---

14 Oct 09 - 05:51 PM (#2745952)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: The Sandman

Bob,I have never used the chat room,so have no idea what has been going on.
I am sorry to hear that sort of thing has been happening,If I had known,I would not have put up my earlier post,my apologies if my comment was in poor taste.

---

14 Oct 09 - 05:56 PM (#2745958)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Me too. And I sincerely hope that the truth about what actually happened becomes public someday... or stays buried and forgotten.

BTW, what do you mean by "parallel chat room", Hovering Bob?

Oh. BTW. I refuse, absoluteley, for myself or my friends, to be maligned again in any way at any time in any chat or in any forum.

The record speaks for itself and so do I.

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:04 PM (#2745966)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Hovering Bob

No problem Schweik, if you weren't involved or even aware of what went on then you can't be expected to know. I'm only reacting to what I've been told (and I have seen some of the evidence.)
The really sad thing is that two good friends of mine, who used to be good friends themselves, are now at loggerheads with each other, a situation caused quite maliciously by third parties who thought it would be 'fun!' A lot of hurt and upset that hasn't touched the perpetrator(s.)
Thankfully, I've not been involved other than having to witness the hurt and distress that has been caused.

BobH

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:11 PM (#2745975)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

Bob - It IS interesting that you have seen 'some of the Evidence' when at least one of the maligned parties has never seen any of this 'Evidence' despite a number of requests .

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:41 PM (#2746009)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

This will be the same party who PM'd people in the USA, to spread lies about someone who's confidence they betrayed, which is what caused the rift in the first place.
NEVER Bob, make a judgement based on just one side of a story.
Also, it seems odd to describe someone as 'carrying out raids'. After all the Mudchat is open to all.
If you want the other side of the story, all you need to do is ask.

JM

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:51 PM (#2746017)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

Another thought, Max has a record of Mudchat, I'm sure you could ask him whether the alleged words were said or not.
JM

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:55 PM (#2746023)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

On record you say? All of it? Gee... could be VERY interesting. Imagine that. Maybe peeps might stop being so nasty and stunned as me arse in future?

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:55 PM (#2746024)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: skarpi

hurt yes .................

but I think its been fixed .. so it might be back .

Max must be thinkin ( let them suffer for a while ) hihihiihi

kv Skarpi Iceland

---

14 Oct 09 - 06:58 PM (#2746029)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

It IS back up ! And I am 'In' !!

---

14 Oct 09 - 07:00 PM (#2746031)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Max

Chat was acting up, I fixed it.

Mudchat doesn't malign people. People malign people.

---

14 Oct 09 - 07:02 PM (#2746033)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

Very True Max

---

14 Oct 09 - 07:19 PM (#2746050)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Again... as I have many times said, I applaud Max for his staunch defense of freedom of speech, be it in the forum or chat. He is, indeed, correct, as he has been in the past, through some rather trying times.

Having said that, I still believe that a chat that could be "read back" would discourage nasty crap.

Oh well. If the crap continues, I'll deal with it.

---

14 Oct 09 - 07:33 PM (#2746061)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Max

I can read it back.

---

14 Oct 09 - 08:22 PM (#2746089)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

Well we had a nice natter ! Hovering Bob , EmmaB , gnu , artbrooks and Kendall .

As the Brit Telecom Advert said , It Good to Talk !

---

14 Oct 09 - 08:58 PM (#2746113)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: open mike

the chat is here...and is only open to members...not guests...

---

14 Oct 09 - 10:48 PM (#2746181)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: michaelr

I've never used Mudchat, and am disinclined to, preferring to conduct my relationships in meat space.

But for the life of me I cannot understand how anyone could be "badly hurt" by whatever someone posts on some message board!? Sticks and stones, people, sticks and stones! I encourage anyone here to examine whether they might need to acquire an existence.

---

14 Oct 09 - 10:59 PM (#2746187)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Joe Offer

Well, I get a lot of complaints about nastiness there, so I have the feeling it can be a jungle. It's an "Enter At Your Own Risk" kind of place. If somebody insults you there, don't expect a Moderator in Shining Armor to ride up on a white charger and protect you.

But somehow I think that if there is no expectation of protection, it turns out there is little need for protection....

-Joe-

---

15 Oct 09 - 05:24 AM (#2746313)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

The problem is SLANDER ! Total Untruths get passed on , and unless you are In Chat at the time , you never know what lies are being put out !
And Moderators saying "give me the proof and I will do something" dont help at all .

---

15 Oct 09 - 05:57 AM (#2746327)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: The Sandman

From: Max - PM
Date: 14 Oct 09 - 07:00 PM

Chat was acting up, I fixed it.

Mudchat doesn't malign people. People malign people.
yes, very true,but if you want a service to be used.which I presume you do,action needs to be taken against those people who abuse the chat room,they should be suspended from Mudcat,and publicly put in the cyber space stocks[named and shamed]there is too much of this cyberspace bullying.
if people are concerned about being verbally assaulted in the chat room,nobody will use it

---

15 Oct 09 - 06:19 AM (#2746337)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: My guru always said

Well, this just goes to show that I know very little about what's going on here on the Cat *sigh* Can't people just play nice????

Thanks for all you do Max!!

---

15 Oct 09 - 06:21 AM (#2746339)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jean(eanjay)

What happened went beyond verbal assault in the chat room. I feel the same as Bob.

---

15 Oct 09 - 06:25 AM (#2746346)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Mrs.Duck

Michael, the problem has not been what was said on the messages or in the chat room but malicious lies that have been sent to some folk via the PM system. Some were so shocked by what they recieved that they felt it necessary to contact the 'victim'. Sadly others believed what was said and friendships ended. That goes beyond the 'sticks and stones' IMO

---

15 Oct 09 - 06:33 AM (#2746352)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: The Sandman

absolutely disgraceful,if members are subjected to that sort of crap ,no wonder they leave.

---

15 Oct 09 - 10:39 AM (#2746546)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

I really think it's time the details of this were brought out into the light of day.
There is obviously misinformation around, and a lot of partiality based on incomplete data.
I am quite willing to explain my actions, and reasons for them.
So how about a bit of honesty and openness round here, then maybe we can put all this pettiness behind us.
We could ask Max to check back, to see what was actually said, and by whom?

JM

---

15 Oct 09 - 11:09 AM (#2746585)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Mrs.Duck

Although this would not show anything that was said or written outside mudchat that may have prompted someone's comments!

---

15 Oct 09 - 11:14 AM (#2746588)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jean(eanjay)

This is never going to be put behind anybody when at every opportunity nasty comments are made again and again.

I, for one, am not interested in an explanation of anybody's actions or their reasons for them.

---

15 Oct 09 - 11:18 AM (#2746591)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

The accusation was made, that words posted in Mudchat, were altered and then forwarded to a third party.
IF this is the nub of the matter, then it should be easy to prove or disprove.
All other nastiness seems to flow from there.
So ask Max

JM

---

15 Oct 09 - 01:50 PM (#2746738)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Re John's 15 Oct 09 - 11:18 AM post, I was accused of doing it. I did not. (BTW, that was not part of the original set of problems). And that is a fact that can be proven without Max reading back, which is not his job.

However... if it is brought out into the open, in any way, shape or form, a number of people would be hurt by doing so. People I care about.

In light of this, contrary to what I said, in part, above, my OPINION is that it should be left alone and that we all just bury the hatchet. That is what I have pleaded for many times. unfortunately, it hasn't stopped, as evidenced by this thread.

If it stops now, my lips are seals. I only seek to defend myself and those maligned, libelled and bullied, as I have done all along, and shall continue to do.

PS... the Mudchat I was in last night was quite pleasant and enjoyable. Reminded me of the good old days when I received so much support and caring through dark days and when I met many new and wonderful friends. Thanks once again to all of you.

---

15 Oct 09 - 02:15 PM (#2746763)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

Sorry gnu, but I want it sorted out, I am fed up with the unwarranted villification, and the blackening of people's names.

JM

---

15 Oct 09 - 03:17 PM (#2746804)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jean(eanjay)

If anybody feels like a budding Sherlock Holmes then they should investigate it!

Gnu is right; it should be left alone.

---

15 Oct 09 - 03:23 PM (#2746810)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: John MacKenzie

Wrong, lies need to be exposed, especially when they are being disseminated as truths.

---

15 Oct 09 - 03:24 PM (#2746812)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jean(eanjay)

Well, get on with it then!

---

15 Oct 09 - 06:52 PM (#2747055)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: semi-submersible

John and Leadfingers,

If "bringing the details of this out into the light of day" involves repeating some hurtful accusations, then I declare emphatically that as a member of the Mudcat public, unless the problem is recurrent I have no Need To Know.

Look, either:
(a) it's serious enough to involve the police, in which case available evidence is already on the record, or
(b) it happened, was handled privately, stopped happening, and life (and healing of wounds) can go on.

If such an event happens again, we can record what we read and report it.

In the meantime, with all due respect, accusation and speculations in this atmosphere don't smell good.

---

15 Oct 09 - 07:06 PM (#2747068)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

Semi Sub - I am in the positon that accusations have been made against me that I have done things , said things . posted things that I have NO knowledge of ! I have asked for the 'Proof/Evidence to be made public so that I can refute (OR accept) this ! NO such
evidence has been forthcoming and as a result my name has been blackened to a number of people who I used to think were friends !
As a result , there have been occasions in MudChat where I have been on Permanent Ignore by some people .
This does NOT make for a pleasant atmosphere in an On Line Chatroom , and is , in MY opinion one of the reasons MudChat has not been used to any great extent over the last several months .
I ask AGAIN that these 'Proofs' of what I am supposed to have done be made public so that I can clear my name .

---

15 Oct 09 - 09:38 PM (#2747112)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: jeddy

i have just reread this thread and it upsets me to see you all fighting like this.

i think the problem with mudchat is the use of blues, where you can talk to one person, without everyone else in the room seeing it.
this doesn't get rid of the multi page thing, that will always be there but at least when things go quiet for abit in chat, you can be assured that no one is talking about you behind your back. that others have just nipped to the loo or something.

i agree with mrs duck and bob, this stuff started years ago, please, isn't it about time to move on?
i know the upset it has caused and have no wish to witness any further upset or arguements because of it.

this site is becoming a warzone. even just in the time i have been here, i have seen it. it saddens me that we pick over things and try to hurt and put down people who we no longer get on with or just don't see things their way.

please, PLEASE, lets try to get over this and start looking forwards instead of backwards? PLEASE?

take care all

jade x x

---

15 Oct 09 - 10:11 PM (#2747131)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Janie

Seems to me this thread should be moved below the line.

---

15 Oct 09 - 10:56 PM (#2747147)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Effsee

I just thank the stars that I can't handle chatrooms!

---

18 Oct 09 - 01:35 PM (#2747274)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Well... kinda hard to forget when people make allegations and innuendos and then won't put thier money where their mouths are.

I asked two questions above and have no replies... yet.

I asked my accuser, many times, over two years ago to provide me a copy of the document I was alledged to have copied, altered and sent... I still have not received it.

So, it's kinda hard to hear peeps join in the crap long afterward... and come just shy of naming names, especially when they were not party to any of it and have no proof of anything they "apparently alledge."

---

18 Oct 09 - 01:48 PM (#2747289)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jerry Rasmussen

Thank God I missed all of this. I hadn't stopped into Mudchat for a couple of months, simply because my summer has been extremely busy. I'm sorry to hear that all of this has happened. It's been a long time since the sewer days of Martin Gibson, and I must say I've never missed them. I've innocently gone into Mudchat a few times in the last week or so, and people have e-mailed me saying that they'd noticed I was there but were too uncomfortable to come in. What a shame. Max gives us this gift out of the goodness of his heart and some people have missused it so grossly that they have destroyed it.

Just to make this a music thread,

"You better come on in my kitchen
You know it's going to be raining outdoors"

It's still sunny around the kitchen table.

Jerry

---

18 Oct 09 - 02:22 PM (#2747315)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Ahhhh... NOBODY should AVOID Mudchat.

Fact is, now that everyone knows it can be "read back", I am sure it will be pleasant... as it was the last time I was in.

---

18 Oct 09 - 03:09 PM (#2747369)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

I am in the same position as gnu ! Demanded proof of allegations many times to No avail ! But sadly , other Non Involved people seem to believe the stories !
To the best of my knowledge , the only thing I have done that may have upset someone was to NOT volunteer Transport from a location in london at a time when I was on a Driving ban !
If any one has any other information . please let the world know .
And I May well be In Chat later tonight !

---

18 Oct 09 - 03:27 PM (#2747382)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jerry Rasmussen

Well, I'm in Mudchat and it's not all dark and spooky. As a matter of fact, it's all white. Like Lennon's Imagine video.

---

18 Oct 09 - 04:10 PM (#2747418)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Jerry Rasmussen

I just had a wonderful conversation with Skarpi and Bernde, my northern connection. I'd never crossed paths with Bernde, or had any real conversation with Skarpi. It was delightful.

Don't let the past haunt you, no matter how much you've been hurt. Let the dead bury the dead. I think it's safe to come out now.

---

18 Oct 09 - 07:41 PM (#2747575)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: the lemonade lady

Good God, talk about lighting blue touch paper and retiring... how many threads aren't used to hack and spit at someone?

Answers on a post card please

Sal

---

19 Oct 09 - 06:30 AM (#2747789)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: GUEST,perplexed bystander

Two observations and a question

Unless a login is misappropriated there should be no confusion or *false allegations* by the recipient about the identity of anyone who has sent a PM. The authorship can be in no doubt although his or her motives and intent may not be so obvious.

If anyone is copying wholesale chunks of informal conversation and they are then subsequently distributed to others by PM I would imagine that mudchat was, at least, an uneasy place to be in and, at worst, potentially threatening. There are occasions on the forum when a remark is misinterpreted [sometimes almost deliberately] and for any remark in chat to be taken in isolation from its context there may be a danger of malicious misrepresentation to a third party.

Why is this in the music section?

---

19 Oct 09 - 07:48 AM (#2747816)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Mississippi Saxaphone

If anyone is copying wholesale chunks of informal conversation and they are then subsequently distributed to others

It is, of course, wrong to do this - even without alteration and irrespective of what is being said.

---

19 Oct 09 - 07:58 AM (#2747824)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: Leadfingers

It is also wrong to PM lies to other members regarding activities OF members

---

19 Oct 09 - 08:15 AM (#2747830)
Subject: RE: mudchat gone? Not used I take it.
From: gnu

Wrong? I was not aware of that. I was covering my ass.

---