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19 Oct 09 - 01:59 PM (#2748074) Subject: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ I wanted to write something in Barry's honor, and I knew it had to be a shanty. While I have done some blue water sailing, I'm no expert on the tall ships, and so forgive me(and correct me, I know Barry would) if some lines are lubberly. Anyone who has a couple of lines they'd like to toss in, welcome aboard. I hope on one is offended by this. Its just my way of celebrating my memory of him. Barry Finn Well the sails are raised and the anchor stowed No more shall we tarry And it's roll and go on the West Sea Road Sing it again for Mr Finn and haul away for Barry! May our loved ones back in port be blessed No more shall we tarry And our course be set for the West Nor'west Sing it again for Mr Finn and haul away for Barry! Well our ship is old but she's sound and dry No more shall we tarry So its raise the flag and watch her fly Sing it again for Mr Finn and haul away for Barry! We're bound for harbor on the Eastern Shore No more shall we tarry A thousand miles away or more Sing it again for Mr Finn and haul away for Barry! If never we return again No more shall we tarry We'll leave a song on the Western Wind Sing it again for Mr Finn and haul away for Barry! |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:08 PM (#2748080) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: catspaw49 Damn Leej......Very well done! Yeah.......that's just about perfect....... Spaw |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:11 PM (#2748085) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: jacqui.c Beautiful EJ, just beautiful. |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:14 PM (#2748087) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Songbob Not that is can be expressed in a text-only medium, but what's the tune? And is it essentially a five-line stanza? If never we return again No more shall we tarry We'll leave a song on the Western Wind Sing it again for Mr Finn And haul away for Barry! My memory of most shanties (not my specialty, for sure) is that the short second line would typically be mirrored in the fourth line, so I tried cutting your last line into two short lines instead. I almost think you could drop the "Mr. Finn" part and just leave the "haul away for Barry" in its place: If never we return again No more shall we tarry We'll leave a song on the Western Wind And haul away for Barry! Your mileage may vary. I may have more comments on the lyric in a while. Bob Clayton |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:21 PM (#2748094) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: maeve I love the structure as is, and had no trouble at all setting it to a strong, rhythmic tune. I'm hearing a tasty bit of bodhran in there, too- and lots of rich harmonies. maeve |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:25 PM (#2748096) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: jacqui.c So, next time you're around the area, Maeve, we need to hear this and join in. |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:26 PM (#2748097) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ The last bit with the extra line is a little unusual, but I like it. Maybe it fits my feeling about Barry. But you are right, Bob, it is essentially 5 lines 4 beats each. |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:31 PM (#2748106) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: maeve Jacqui- I'd be happy to try it out with y'all- but it's not my song, and others may well have tunes to suggest too. I'll note it down. I like the song as is a lot. Thanks for posting it, Lonesome EJ. maeve |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:36 PM (#2748110) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Dani Very nice. Maybe we can sing it on the banks @ Chalk Point next year? I had a vision of a duet I wanted to do with Barry some time as a lark, did't make time this year to pitch it to him. I thought it would be funny to intersperse some of Julianna with Julie London's rendition of Sentimental Journey: "haha, my London Julie!" Had a whole bit worked up in my head. Dani |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:46 PM (#2748115) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ As long as you lead it, Dani, I'd love to join in on the choruses. |
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19 Oct 09 - 02:48 PM (#2748118) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: gnu Damn fine! |
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19 Oct 09 - 03:44 PM (#2748157) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Lonesome, if you call me and sing your chantey into the phone as a voice mail, I can either turn it into an mp3 or make a MIDI of it. Of course, you could probably do that with other Catters who have them newfangled answering machines, voice mails, and computer machines. Genie PS I love your lyrics! I'm sure Barry's smiling somewhere when you sing them. And whether the longer or shorter version of the last line works best really can't be known without hearing the tune. |
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19 Oct 09 - 03:56 PM (#2748172) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: ClaireBear I love 'em too, as written with the extra line, and can't wait to hear the tune. Thank you for putting pen to paper! C |
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19 Oct 09 - 04:05 PM (#2748177) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Azizi Barry Finn was one of the Mudcatters who introduced me to shanties. I believe he would like this song. And even though this is a very sad time, I smiled a bit thinking how 50 or 100 years from now some group of folkies somehow are going to be debating about who "Mr Finn" was and what town named "Barry" is referred in that song. And of course there will be a contentious few who will insist that the "town" was not really "Barry" but "Gary" [Indiana?] :o) |
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19 Oct 09 - 04:06 PM (#2748179) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Bill D exceedingly fine, LEJ and I hear part of it to "The Black Ball Line"...the 2nd & 4th lines fall into place. |
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19 Oct 09 - 04:16 PM (#2748190) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SINSULL Leave Her, Johnny, Leave Her Well the sails are raised and the anchor stowed No more shall we tarry And it's roll and go on the West Sea Road And it's haul away for Barry! Slight alteration. Nicely done, LeeJ Thank You. Azizi - you made me laugh. Very insightful. |
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19 Oct 09 - 04:44 PM (#2748212) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ You know Sins, I did think of that tune. I love the bittersweet tone of it, and it would fit the shorter version. and yet... It really seems to me that a Barry Finn shanty ought to be a rousing, stomping, joyous thing. A bench-walker, if you will. |
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19 Oct 09 - 04:58 PM (#2748222) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: open mike here is a re-post from the obit thread still looking for info about the one who posted this tune and wondered if it might fit the meter of the song/ Subject: RE: Obit: Barry Finn (16 Oct 2009) From: open mike - PM Date: 19 Oct 09 - 12:09 AM Will someone please tell me if there is a connection? I happened to open a message tonight with a tune written in it: X: 1 T: Barry Finn M: 6/8 L: 1/8 R: jig K: Gmaj |:D3 FED|FAA A2 B|c3 BAG|EDC EGE| D3 FED|FAA EGG|EDC A,B,C|D3 A3:| |:d2 e d2 c|ABc EFG|ABc EFG|A3 A2G| FED EGG|CEE G2A| EDC A,B,C|D3 D2 A:| this was the web site: http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display.php/9970 tune: Barry Finn, jig Key signature: Gmajor Submitted on October 17th 2009 by seinnteoir. Is the person seinnteoir a mudcat? is this tune about "our" Barry? |
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19 Oct 09 - 04:58 PM (#2748223) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SINSULL You're right, Leej. A bit morose right now. |
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19 Oct 09 - 05:02 PM (#2748224) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Jeri Leave Her Johnny is a natural tune, and I think the last line works the way it is. I'd just add a few notes/beats in the last line. Well done, LEJ, and Barry sure would like it. |
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19 Oct 09 - 05:29 PM (#2748239) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie I just sent you an email, LEJ, with a possible 'new' tune. It's kind of a patchwork of tune phrases I've heard in other chanteys, etc., but I don't think the final product is the tune to any song I've heard before. You may or may not find it helpful, but if you do, use it however you please. Genie |
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19 Oct 09 - 05:30 PM (#2748243) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: ClaireBear LEJ -- your instincts are right on. I know it will come to you and be just right. |
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19 Oct 09 - 06:59 PM (#2748325) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Leave that ine structure as it be, Mister Johnson!! This is a classic, and perfectly true to its source as qritten, IMNSHO. I will try and record it tonight. I think I know the tune... A |
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19 Oct 09 - 07:06 PM (#2748330) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: haddocker It's a wonderful tribute. I am frustrated, however in that I don't have the tune, although until the last line of the refrain, it would fit "Leave Her Johnnie Leave Her". Can you post a midi, or something so that we can start it going? h |
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19 Oct 09 - 07:10 PM (#2748332) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: maeve He has several tunes working their way to him as we speak. For myself, Barry was such an original I'd kind of hate to see these words with an existing tune. LEJ will figure out what he wants to use... perhaps more than one version will form. maeve |
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19 Oct 09 - 07:44 PM (#2748367) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Janie Well done, Ernie. |
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19 Oct 09 - 07:46 PM (#2748369) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: ranger1 Leej, Yes, definitely a rousing, stomping, joyous thing. Thanks for sharing this. |
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19 Oct 09 - 07:53 PM (#2748377) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Tinker Thanks LeJ -- a bench walker indeed... Loud and rowdy and forcing your feet to stomp along.... I've been going through video and it seems every year the camera would stray down for a moment or two to capture Barry's feet --- A reminder that is warn't no quiet sit and listen music. thanks |
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19 Oct 09 - 08:14 PM (#2748402) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Barry's feet moved while he sang, Tinker? You mean like this? |
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19 Oct 09 - 09:10 PM (#2748430) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Tinker Yes, there are many variations on the theme... |
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19 Oct 09 - 11:41 PM (#2748476) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Ernie: My recording setups are all fubar, so it will be a day or so before I can get you the recording. Damn. You may have found one you like, already, but if not I'll email you a version as soon as I can debug my mixer and get it down. A |
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20 Oct 09 - 12:36 AM (#2748486) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SaltyWalt Actually, I agree with both camps about this songs line length-- You have a point Mr Clayton, with your suggestion it would be a haliard chantey, and it works better. That being said, Barry chose to sing a lot of songs that by the usual standards and metrics "didn't work" and he "Didn't give a flying F**k" He sang em any and loved em hard and in public. He was drawn to unusual structures (Think of what he did to make the "Yangtze River Shantey" singable. I've had to sing versions of "Leave Her Johnny" at too many funerals this year, and I'm sorry, I get it, but it's too overdone in our community. Besides Jerry Bryant already stole that basic tune for his tribute to Stan. Let's give Barry one that relates more to him. For that reason I worked with the original and lyrics, pinched and pieced together two of his favorite perfomance pieces to give a tune that is mornful, soulful, and ends on an up beat err. . . note. Those of you who stood next to him late at night at sings will know which two I chose. It's not hard. Perhaps you can tidy up what I was trying to do, and you can improve it. If you get it, great, If not, well this is how we'll sing it in 'ol Frisco. After all I've had no internet all week so I'm reading this thread for the first time tonight, and made the recording I hope to post in about 10 minutes. I'll post it or a link to it, err, as soon as I figure out how. . . |
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20 Oct 09 - 01:11 AM (#2748493) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie LEJ, the email I sent you came back to me. DK if the 1.8 MB audio file was too big or your e-dress is no longer the one listed here at Mudcat. If you PM me the correct e-dress I'll try again. I'm thinking maybe if you hear the various tunes that get sent to you, you'll come up with your own special tune that may perhaps reflect aspects of those. (Or not.) Anyway you'll have some ideas to ponder. Genie |
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20 Oct 09 - 01:43 AM (#2748496) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SaltyWalt Please, forgive the sond quality. I'll try for a better recording tomorrow. I tried to imagine him singing it, but I didn't want to copy his unique style at this time lest someone think I was making fun. I'll really miss everthing we will never do together. I am so glad he got a cd out. I know, wrong thread. If this link doesn't work, Let me know. http://www.yellowzeppelin.net/Barry/Chantey%20For%20Barry.mp3 http://www.yellowzeppelin.net/Barry/Chantey%20For%20Barry.mp3 |
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20 Oct 09 - 02:04 AM (#2748501) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Very nice, Walt! |
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20 Oct 09 - 02:37 AM (#2748504) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Anglo Ah, an adaptation of Bye Bye My Roseanna, I take it. Appropriate enough. I've sung that one with Barry a few times. Nice, Walt. And I totally agree, nothing at all amiss with the 5-line stanza. I like it that way. |
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20 Oct 09 - 04:15 AM (#2748525) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: georgeward Re: open mike's question about the Barry Finn Jig. It's good, a bit appropriately lonesome, and in D Mixolydian, not G maj. And there's not a word on the comment tab about it or its composer. Hard to imagine it isn't "our" Barry. But who...? |
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20 Oct 09 - 08:56 AM (#2748635) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble Nicely sung, Walt! Charley Noble |
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20 Oct 09 - 10:46 AM (#2748695) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Jeri Barry once convinced me to sing Warren Zevon's 'Carmelita' at one of our sea music sessions, just because he loved it (even if he did keep insisting that "Smith Corona" should be "Smith & Wesson" because a junkie with a typewriter didn't make sense to him). I think there might have been some aerodynamic copulation commentary involved. ("Barry, I can't--it's not a sea song!" Barry: "So? I don't give a...") So I sang it, and it was a right dog's breakfast because I couldn't find a key that would let us both sing melody. He didn't much care about the mess either. You screw something up, you have fun doing it, laugh and move on. I'll have to look for a completely inappropriate place to sing that song now. Of course, I now hear a lot of similarity between the tune for 'Carmelita' and 'Leave Her, Johnny'. |
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20 Oct 09 - 11:04 AM (#2748707) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: open mike nice to hear from you here salty walt--i was stage manager for the sea music fest. on the stage you performed on...golly i miss that event... good job on the shanty... |
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20 Oct 09 - 11:36 AM (#2748723) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Bill D That settles it...for me, at least. I will hear Walt's version in my head. As Barry would say, "I don't give an Thanks, LEJ and SaltyWalt...and everyone... |
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20 Oct 09 - 12:32 PM (#2748771) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Nice job, Walt, and very much the kind of thing I had inmind as well!! A |
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20 Oct 09 - 02:32 PM (#2748856) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: AllisonA(Animaterra) Beautiful- thanks, Leej! |
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20 Oct 09 - 02:45 PM (#2748867) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Tinker Thank You one and all --- it sets a wistful smile, and leaves the promise of some boot stompin' when the time is right. |
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20 Oct 09 - 03:26 PM (#2748909) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Walt's tune was beautiful, and Genie sent me a great version in a minor key which is unique and has some good foot-stomping potential. If anyone wants to hear her version, I'm quite sure she would email it. Maeve has promised me a cassette with her take. I am very gratified that so many people who knew and liked Barry think the Barry Finn Shanty was a good idea. Funny thing about this song. I suppose because it seems to have hit home for a lot of people, I hardly feel that its my song anymore. I really like Walt's tune, but I had originally envisioned something more raucous, as Barry might have sung it for someone he loved and lost. But then I think Barry Finn had a lot of facets to his singing, and he could do the tear-jerkers as well as anyone. So I almost think the decision isn't mine to make. The song belongs to Barry and those who knew him. I think he might enjoy hearing the tune done however the singer's heart told him to do it. Or, of course, he might think this whole line of thought is sentimental horseshit. ;>} |
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20 Oct 09 - 04:15 PM (#2748945) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: ClaireBear I've got a tune bubbling up inside me too, so the San Francisco scene might get TWO tunes to choose from. Mine's raucous, at least I think it will be. I'll let you know what it is when it's finished percolating around in there. |
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20 Oct 09 - 04:20 PM (#2748949) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Sentimental horseshit??? ROFL. He would say something like that, ya know, but it isn't what he'd think of this, at least inside. A |
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20 Oct 09 - 05:24 PM (#2748981) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Bupkes For the past year, I sat next to Barry nearly every week at the Press Room, and I'd testify that he would bend a tune like Superman bending steel with his bare hands. I like Walt's version, but sensing the folk process still in process, I'm experimenting with other tunes too. For example, something like Bold Riley-O the way Kate Rusby does it, the verses part not the chorus, seems to work, without the "Mr Finn" part, as others suggested. May well come back to Walt's tune in the end, though. I'll try it out on Peter Souza and the others at Cameron's tonight. (Sorry, I'm having a hard time getting into the Mudcat nicknames.) Marty |
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20 Oct 09 - 05:59 PM (#2749002) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Hi Marty. If you do it at Cameron's, I'd be interested to know how it's received. Ernie |
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20 Oct 09 - 08:20 PM (#2749064) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie LEJ, I did make a slipshod video just for the purpose of sharing a possible tune and some possible harmonies. It's a crummy video (partly because I was reading off the 'puter screen) but the sound quality is better than on the audio file I sent you yesterday. Here's the link, in case anyone wants to hear the tune: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3NxaT3RF_g. I will probably take the video down in a day or two, since it was just thrown together (and I'm a bit 'pitchy' in a place or two). As I said, it's just for letting people hear a tune suggestion. I do kind of like the "folk process" that seems to be going on with this song and the Mudcat community. Genie |
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20 Oct 09 - 08:23 PM (#2749066) Subject: Haul Away For Barry - LEJ From: Genie (Premature message submission going on.) I also have a couple of audio files that I could send anyone who would like to hear the tune (without having to watch my mug reading the lyrics). I just need e-dresses. But I figured the YT method would be less time-consuming. Genie |
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20 Oct 09 - 08:47 PM (#2749080) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Disregard that last link I posted. This one is better: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08lV72FE-5s G |
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20 Oct 09 - 11:19 PM (#2749147) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: katlaughing Genie, great tune. I heard little bits which reminded me of the one that goes, "hey-ho, nobody home, no meat, nor drink, no money have we none, still we will be merry" or some such. It is a catching tune. LeeJ...grand job! I like Bob's tune, but think it needs to be faster. I think you are spot on re' it being racuous, etc. Barry would LOVE this folk process...:-) Mudcat at its best! |
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20 Oct 09 - 11:40 PM (#2749151) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Kat, I hadn't thought of that one, but I do hear snippets of "Rollin' Down To Old Maui" and several others in the tune that popped into my mind. There are some very familiar-sounding measures that I can't quite put my finger on. I love the communal folk process too. Genie |
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21 Oct 09 - 12:20 AM (#2749160) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,siochain It WAS sung tonight at Cameron's (Gloucester), but it was led by David Coffin to a tune he crafted. Cameron's is a weekly venue that Barry attended very regularly. His regular bar stool was adorned with several photos of himself. |
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21 Oct 09 - 12:34 AM (#2749162) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Is there an audio or video of David singing it? |
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21 Oct 09 - 01:14 AM (#2749174) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Siochain, I am very proud to hear that. Would love to have been there. |
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21 Oct 09 - 02:01 AM (#2749185) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Thanks to Amos as well for his terrific interpretation. I came up with this in way of a tune. I will try to convert this to a sound file and sing it for those interested. If you have a guitar or such, you'll get the idea by singing the chord/notes on the words following the chord insets. Well the (E)sails are (A)raised and the (D)anchor (E)stowed (D)No more shall we (E)tarry And it's(A) roll and (E)go on the (D)West (G)Sea (E)Road (D)Sing it (A)again for (G)Mr (A)Finn and (D)haul a(B)way for (E)Barry! |
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21 Oct 09 - 02:23 AM (#2749195) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Bupkes When I arrived at Cameron's, Peter Souza said he'd seen the words, and a number of others knew about it too. David Coffin had printed out his own copy, and said he'd been humming up his own tunes for Barry's shanty since he'd read it this afternoon, and was enthused to sing it. I was happy to defer to his grand voice, and although I can't transcribe the tune for you all here, it was a good rolling tune, using all the words as written, and everyone enjoyed joining in. David promised to send an mp3 file on Wednesday, and we'll get it posted somehow. Ernie, although we're still in the throes of his eery sudden absence, this song is like having Barry transformed into a constellation in the sky, to make us smile for having known him. |
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21 Oct 09 - 02:35 AM (#2749197) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Marty, your comments meant a lot to me. I had written the song, then hesitated posting it here, because I was concerned about how it might be perceived and received. To have it sung for your group by people who knew and loved Mr Finn is the ultimate I could have hoped for. I really like the idea of painting this song on different canvases with different pallets and brush strokes, and I am knocked out by everything I have been sent by people who have written tunes. I have a wav file I can send with my own tune idea, if anyone interested wants to PM me with their email address. |
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21 Oct 09 - 03:58 AM (#2749228) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Justine What a tribute to Barry. What a wonderful group of friends. |
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21 Oct 09 - 07:52 AM (#2749347) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Ernie, please send me the .wav file (my e-dress is in the members section). And since you're still on board with the "different canvases" idea, here is a variation of the tune and tempo of the one I posted earlier. Haul Away For Barry - more up-tempo The tune is less important to this variation than the rhythm. It should be done with a bodhran or some drum like that. (But clapping can work if no one has one.) The idea is to get a strong rhythm going and belt it out (but I'm incapable of belting). You can get the idea from the video* though. The altered phrasing and rhythm is what popped into my head in the middle of the night and inspired me to re-do my earlier tune. Genie *It's really more of an audio file with a darkened screen. YouTube won't let you post just audio files. |
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21 Oct 09 - 07:58 AM (#2749352) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: maeve Justine- Thanks for your post. Many people across the miles valued Barry. I'm glad you've seen Lonesome EJ's song in Barry's honor. maeve |
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21 Oct 09 - 09:37 AM (#2749413) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: MMario I'm going to be at a session in Plymouth saturday - I suspect several of the regulars knew Barry - and I hope to do this shanty for them. I'll probably wimp and use "Leave 'er Johnny" for the tune - so as not to mess up. MMario |
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21 Oct 09 - 09:49 AM (#2749421) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Glostaman Nice Lyrics. David Copper sang this at our Tuesday night Pub Sing at Cameron's in Gloucester. Roger Hussey and Alexander Thompson also wrote songs as tributes to Barry and sang them as well. Some folks brought photos of Barry and put them at his favorite seat at the bar. We members of Three Sheets to the Wind consider it to have been an honor that Barry shared his songs with us. |
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21 Oct 09 - 09:55 AM (#2749432) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Glostaman Apologies to David Coffin for getting his name wrong. |
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21 Oct 09 - 12:48 PM (#2749539) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Gloucesterman, David Coffin By request I have recorded my version of A Shanty for Barry Finn. It is posted on my website here . It should play automatically and you can download it for free. Lonesome EJ I don't know your real name so I credit you by your screen name. I hope you don't mind my "putting it out there". Seems people wanted it. It's a great song and I tried to balance slow with uptempo. The tune just came to me as I was reading the lyrics so it felt right. Thanks for a great tribute song to a huge man. David Coffin |
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21 Oct 09 - 12:54 PM (#2749541) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos David, that is a beautiful salty rendering indeed!! Nicely done, and a perfect tune. If a couple of hands got rummed up and sang it louder and faster, it would sound just like him!! I love it. A |
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21 Oct 09 - 01:05 PM (#2749548) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Quite a stunning rendition, David. Ernie Johnson |
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21 Oct 09 - 01:35 PM (#2749576) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie David, that is hauntingly beautiful! |
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21 Oct 09 - 02:02 PM (#2749587) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble David- Well sung! I can certainly envision that one being raised in the dance hall at Mystic next June. Cheerily, Charley Noble |
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21 Oct 09 - 03:27 PM (#2749629) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Joe Offer That's a wonderful song, David. A good tribute to a good friend. -Joe- |
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21 Oct 09 - 04:41 PM (#2749689) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Lonesome: IF they are sailing WNW, aiming for the Eastern SHore, it is a long haul indeed. Maybe they are heading for Shanghai from Cape Horn? I dunno. But man, I love that song the way David does it. A |
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21 Oct 09 - 05:16 PM (#2749730) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Jamaica to Galveston? How about Nassau to Boston? I make it about 290 degrees, right? Of course, allowing for the Gulf Stream drift, maybe we need to head due west until we lose sight of the Great Isaac Light, or consume one liter of Jameson's whichever comes first, then adjust to 290, assuming the wind stays in the South. |
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21 Oct 09 - 05:54 PM (#2749756) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Jeri David, I love your voice no matter what you're singing, but that tune is perfect for a group of strong singers and wanton harmony sluts. It's not fast, but it sure is bold, and I'm sure Barry'd love it and be honored you did that for him. |
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21 Oct 09 - 06:25 PM (#2749777) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Rumrunners!! Awright! A |
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21 Oct 09 - 09:54 PM (#2749921) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Tony H Farewell, Barry Finn, one of/if not the finest shanty men I've ever had the pleasure to know and sing with. I will miss your voice on Tuesday evenings at Cameron's. The tremendous heart you put into your songs will echo in my soul always and I will cherish the memories. Rest in peace, you feisty little Irishman. Here's hoping you were in heaven an hour before the devil knew ye were dead! |
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21 Oct 09 - 10:19 PM (#2749943) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Janie Brought tears to my eyes. |
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21 Oct 09 - 11:02 PM (#2749966) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos They could also be running gold from Johannesburg to the Chesapeake shores. I like that fancy. In any case, well written, and well sung. A |
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21 Oct 09 - 11:12 PM (#2749974) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SaltyWalt This is what I get for being busy and only checking once a day at night. I have so many comments that they all may be Moot. When this thread was first posted I had hoped there would be a number of people offering different "Chanteys for Barry". No disrespect to Lonesome EJ, it's awesome that so many folks are coming up with tunes for your words, but are there any other words on the horizon? There are plenty of folks with stuff to say. I'd like to hear some different voices on this, especially since people seem to have different needs in a Barry Chantey. To that end, the two tunes I associate with late night Barry and used for my tune were "Bye Bye My Roseanna" and "London Julie". In that order. If folks want, I can invert the order to make it more rousing. That was my original take, but I didn't think it did as much justice to the words as mournful first. I can really hear Barry doing it either way. I can drop a recording by. Now that that is said. I like Genie's; well suited to the words, just the sort of tune that goes with a long 2nd chorus 5 line stanza, but not Chantey like. I still think the best way to Chantey it up and "rock out" is Clayton's halliard style version. And plain and simple David's version is awesome and cool and a great reason to move onto other words to come up with tunes for. I think it's a gonna stick. |
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21 Oct 09 - 11:28 PM (#2749978) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SaltyWalt P.S. I didn't get to listen to Genie's 2nd tune yet. No dispariging words. I don't want to be misunderstood while in the house of Universal Love. Everyone has been great. |
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22 Oct 09 - 12:46 AM (#2749991) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Hey Genie! Somehow I missed the rhythmic (2nd)version until I saw Walt's post. Great stuff! I like the tambo, and a bodhran added would be terrific. |
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22 Oct 09 - 02:55 AM (#2750016) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie SaltyWalt, which of my tunes did you mean? ("Now that that is said. I like Genie's; well suited to the words, just the sort of tune that goes with a long 2nd chorus 5 line stanza, but not Chantey like. I still think the best way to Chantey it up and "rock out" is Clayton's halliard style version." The first version I posted wasn't as slow as David's but wasn't very fast or upbeat. The second version (the video with the dark screen) can be a bit faster, "brighter," and definitely more rhythmic and rollicking (calling for a bodhran backup or at least foot stomping). (Note: I'm a little embarrassed to share such amateurish and slapdash videos when there are such wonderful and professional recordings as David's out there. Please understand that my only aim was to suggest a couple of possible tunes, and I don't know how to make MIDI files quickly on my MacBook. YouTube is the easiest way to share audio but the file has to be in video form.) |
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22 Oct 09 - 09:51 AM (#2750205) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Gloucesterman, David Coffin Genie, I appreciate your kind words but the most important aspect to all of this is that you keep singing. Life is way to short to be embarrassed about stuff like this. Besides, my recording is anything but professional. That was 20 minutes worth of work, a small digital recorder and a good song. Go to it! All the best, David. |
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22 Oct 09 - 12:06 PM (#2750311) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble David- You are much too modest. You even provided harmony! Hey, it's about time that you became a member here, and that way people could also send you Personal Messages, or not! Cheerily, Charley Noble |
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22 Oct 09 - 12:40 PM (#2750345) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Ferrara LEJ, this is just right, I'm so glad you had the urge to write this song for Barry. David Coffin, I think your tune is perfect. It carries the feel of a traditional shanty and I can hear Barry singing it. I like the last line a little better as Sing it again for Mr Finn and we'll haul away for Barry! Rita |
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22 Oct 09 - 04:02 PM (#2750525) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: mg I like it too and it is quite similar to tunes that jumped into my head when I first saw the lyrics...bye bye my Julianna///Roseanna?? thought it was J. Anyway, I would sing it a bit faster but it seems to be a definitive tune. mg |
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22 Oct 09 - 05:28 PM (#2750577) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Ferrara Haven't heard LEJ's tune. Have you posted it yet? If so I'm overlooking it. David C's tune seems so perfect but if you had a tune in mind it would be nice to know how it goes too. |
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22 Oct 09 - 07:11 PM (#2750639) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ The tune is in the hands of the folk process and anyone who wants to sing the shanty, Rita. But send me your email and I'll send my concept to you on a wav file. It's hard to compete with David's version because it's just so damned expertly done. He said he knocled it off in 20 minutes, but I think he bought studio time and had Daniel Lanois produce it. Walt's is also dandy if you want a terrific heartfelt version that's really well sung. Genie's is raucous and quite Barry-like, as is Amos' jaunty version. |
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22 Oct 09 - 07:26 PM (#2750651) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Ref I didn't know Barry except through here, and we didn't necessarily see eye to eye, but I respected his opinions tremendously and can see what a grand, passionate fellow he was by the way so many remember him. I think your shanty is absolutely superb as is and I immediately imagined a tune for it in my head, as did so many others here. Well done! |
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22 Oct 09 - 07:42 PM (#2750665) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Genie (sans cookie) David, I don't doubt you made that recording in 20 minutes. You're just good at it. LOL (And your voiceover programming may be less SNAFU-prone that iMovie is. Sometimes I have to do a voiceover several times to get the synch with the first track right. DK why.) You also have a great voice for the kind of songs that Barry did. Your recording seems to be professional quality, no matter how quickly you threw it together. As for my tossing out some tune ideas, I'm not wed to any of them. It's kind of "brainstorming," hoping that as people hear various takes on the song, more and better melodies and arrangements will be created. I really like your version. Still, I would love to hear Ernie's own version of the song, either with a tune he heard someone else do or suggest or with one of his own. Genie |
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22 Oct 09 - 07:45 PM (#2750666) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST See, Ernie, I haven't yet gotten your .wav file (I PM'd you my e-dress). Nor have I got to hear Amos's version. I would like to. Genie |
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22 Oct 09 - 08:32 PM (#2750691) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos A rough recording of Amos' version can be heard here. A |
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22 Oct 09 - 09:28 PM (#2750729) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Love it, Amos. See, comparing the various tunes is kind of an apples v. oranges thing. Not unlike hearing several different tunes to "Matty Groves." Genie |
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22 Oct 09 - 10:08 PM (#2750742) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: GUEST,Gloucesterman, David Coffin Amos, Really like your tune and your voice. Reminded me of Gordon Bok. Nicely done. Please don't think me presumptuous; my ear wanted the last note to end down on the fifth. Haul away for Barry (moving by syllable:1-1-1-6-6-5) See what you think. It leaves it kind of unresolved. Like maybe....? David |
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22 Oct 09 - 10:26 PM (#2750751) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Gibb Sahib Been enjoying this thread. Thanks for all the creativity, good job everyone. Let's keep this "bumped." I've some ideas myself, maybe I'll sketch them out when I get more time. |
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22 Oct 09 - 10:43 PM (#2750762) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: katlaughing David, did you take the tune down from your website? I missed it and didn't hear anything nor see anything on which to click to hear it following your link. I'd love to hear it and love this about Mudcat. At its best, this IS Mudcat! |
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23 Oct 09 - 01:45 AM (#2750818) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: ClaireBear It;s still there, Kat, and it does play automatically. Did you try using another browaer? |
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23 Oct 09 - 02:08 AM (#2750830) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: KT Wonderful, Lej! |
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23 Oct 09 - 06:39 AM (#2750913) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Leadfingers 100 |
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23 Oct 09 - 01:29 PM (#2751167) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie C'mon, Terry, you can add more than just a number here! (How 'bout a musical number?) *g* Ernie, I've been toying around with your lyrics - remember the discussion of the "Sing it again" phrase - and Mary G's suggestion, and come up with this. The one think I really kind of like about this tune/arrangement is the way I did the "Sing it again (ba ba ba bum) for Mister Finn (ba ba ba bum)" part. Then it occurred to me that maybe that should be a chorus, sort of comme ça: Haul Away For Barry Well the sails are raised and the anchor stowed - No more shall we tarry. And it's roll and go on the West Sea Road And we'll haul away for Barry! Sing it again (sing it again)* For Mister Finn (for Mr. Finn),* A true heart strong and merry!** Yes, it's roll and go on the West Sea Road And we'll haul away for Barry! May our loved ones back in port be blessed No more shall we tarry And our course be set for the West Nor'west And we'll haul away for Barry! Sing it again (sing it again) For Mister Finn (for Mr. Finn), A true heart strong and merry! Let our course be set for the West Nor'west And we'll haul away for Barry! Well our ship is old but she's sound and dry No more shall we tarry So its raise the flag and watch her fly And we'll haul away for Barry! Sing it again (sing it again) For Mister Finn (for Mr. Finn), A true heart strong and merry! It's raise the flag and watch her fly And we'll haul away for Barry! We're bound for harbor on the Eastern Shore, No more shall we tarry, A thousand miles away or more We'll haul away for Barry! Sing it again (sing it again) For Mister Finn (for Mr. Finn), A true heart strong and merry! A thousand miles away or more We'll haul away for Barry! If never we return again, No more shall we tarry. We'll leave a song on the Western Wind And haul away for Barry! Sing it again (sing it again) For Mister Finn (for Mr. Finn), A true heart strong and merry! We will leave a song on the Western Wind And haul away for Barry! *This could be an echo part and/or a drum beat that echoes the meter of the "sing it again" line. *This lyric line could be about anything that rhymes with "Barry." E.g., "more fond of rum than sherry," "And our song his soul shall ferry," "and his soul our song will carry," or even "rumble-dee dumble-dee derry." I'm sure someone will come up with the perfect line. This kind of arrangement seems very suitable for a group sing and very catchy. What do you think? |
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23 Oct 09 - 01:58 PM (#2751193) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: katlaughing Don't know what the trouble was..it worked this time. Beautiful job, David!!! LeeJ...this is so fitting...so Mudcat...so wonderful...my heart is really happy despite the sad loss. I love Mudcat. |
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23 Oct 09 - 02:28 PM (#2751214) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Genie, I love the idea of the rhythmic arrangement and can imagine Barry himself beating the bodhran on it. You do it in any way you want. Bend it, change it, add, subtract. If you feel moved, take the basic idea and write an entirely new song even. Most of you know a hell of a lot more about shanties than I do. I think Barry would dig hearing this in all it's iterations. And somehow, I get a sense that he'll be there when any of us do it, as long as we pour heart and soul into it, just like he did in every song I ever heard him do. I give this song to him and to anyone else who sings it. If somebody makes a fortune with it, we can talk ;>). One thing I would love to hear though. I'd love to hear Ken Schatz do some form of this next Getaway, God willing we all meet there again. I think Ken's energy comes from the same blazing fire where Barry got his. |
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23 Oct 09 - 03:23 PM (#2751251) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: MMario I second that! |
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23 Oct 09 - 03:47 PM (#2751278) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie I third it! G |
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23 Oct 09 - 05:06 PM (#2751330) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Gibb Sahib I've been working on this little tribute to Barry. Dunno how soon I'll get a chance to record a sample of it, so I'll just put up lyrics here. I echo Lonesome's sentiment in hoping no one is offended by this gesture. Barry was one of the main singers to have inspired me in the last few years since I first heard him. This reflects his impressions on me. If the meter seems slightly irregular, that's because it fits a particular tune. It's a slow, capstan chantey (the old fashioned kind, without a grand chorus). SO LONG TO BOSTON BAY Mister Finn we'll miss ye dearly Way-ay ay-ay! Your voice still rings out clearly As we say so long to Boston Bay Heard he'd sailed the wide world over Being a salt sea rover Chanteyman and ballad-crafter Every song shook the rafters Slight of height, but what a sound, sir! Raised up in Boston Town, sir Warm an' round, but tough as iron Called him the Singing Lion Filled each room with a roaring voice, boys Join in and make some noise, boys Moved his feet in joyful dance, sir Eyes closed in mystic trance, sir "Come back down," you'd hear them say, sir "Else you might fly away, sir!" Without him we are ten men down, boys Caps'n won't heave around, boys Roller-bowler, rock 'n' shake her Why don't you bend an' break her Wipe your tears 'way with your flipper Stand and salute the skipper Gibb |
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23 Oct 09 - 05:48 PM (#2751345) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Filled each room with a roaring voice, boys Join in and make some noise, boys Moved his feet in joyful dance, sir Eyes closed in mystic trance, sir "Come back down," you'd hear them say, sir "Else you might fly away, sir!" Absolutely true to life Gibb! Well done! Watching the videos of Barry gives some impression of the performance, but you really had to be there to feel the vibrations bouncing 'round the room when Mr Finn was in full sail! |
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25 Oct 09 - 05:31 PM (#2752581) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Gibb Sahib Here's a link to me singing my chantey tribute to Barry. Info about the tune and whatnot is in the description. So Long To Boston Bay (for Barry Finn) (You'll need to turn up the volume a bit. The sound recording aspect of my computer has problems, also resulting in some weird, unfortunate crackling noises.) |
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25 Oct 09 - 05:38 PM (#2752586) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble Gibb- That one is almost scary. You've done a great job of composing and singing that one. I've just recording my own tribute to Barry on the "Press Room's Extra Voice" thread. Give it a listen. Charley Noble |
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25 Oct 09 - 09:21 PM (#2752714) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Gibb: Are you doing all the voices? That's amazing good! A |
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26 Oct 09 - 10:08 AM (#2752902) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble Amos- I think he's channeling at least one "extra voice." Charley Noble |
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26 Oct 09 - 05:36 PM (#2753203) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Tinker Okay guys, this is a very rough field recording.... but somehow as I worked out the talk I was giving this weekend to 59 assorted kids aged 11 to 18 on how and why do the work I do, Barry seemed to leave me with a song. Hopefully all the stuff I found myself telling them isn't dreadfully wrong, but if it is I'm sure you'll correct me and I'll tell 'em all the truth next time.... When I work these overnight events I tend to get pulled in many directions and as a result I've been known to misplace things on a regular basis... I think Barry would have enjoyed this crowd. The Chorus is all his. Tinker and the Diocese of Newark Youth Where? Where are me keys Me noggin' noggin keys I gave them to someone for something They'll turn up again, it'll work out in the end And we'll all sing together in the chorus Chorus: Sing for the friends, the fun that never ends Sing through the tears and the laughter Close your eyes and move your feet Don't you loose the blippin' beat And we'll all search together til the morning Where are me shoes.... I left them somewhere for something Where is me head ...... I had it last night --or this morning The kids have all ready folked in a new verse Where is me wallet...... In a bag, in the trash, in the dumpster... We'll dumpster dive again, It'll work out in the end.... The carpeted floor "ate" all the foot stomping, but you can see the movement... |
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26 Oct 09 - 08:33 PM (#2753318) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Gibb Sahib Thanks, Amos. Yeah, the virtual voices are me, but I'd much prefer to sing with a real chorus! Gibb |
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26 Oct 09 - 10:22 PM (#2753370) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Amos Tink: What a kick to see you in full battle gear!! Way to go!!! A |
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26 Oct 09 - 10:38 PM (#2753378) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: katlaughing What fun, Tink! Phew, that's a lot for one weekend. Barry would have loved it! Gibb...I love that tune and your words really capture what I have seen and know of Barry just through videos and on Mudcat. Thanks for posting and sharing and you did a great job on those other voices! |
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26 Oct 09 - 10:40 PM (#2753379) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Janie Channeling Barry for sure and for certain, Tink! Thanks for posting this. And as Amos says, great to see you in action. Wonderful job getting those kids involved. They clearly loved it! |
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26 Oct 09 - 11:15 PM (#2753391) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: KT Well done, Tink! I loved seeing you there! You did a great job getting the kids involved, too! KT |
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27 Oct 09 - 12:10 AM (#2753405) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Tinker That was 43 hours into a 68 hour "weekend" ... The kids actually expect me to throw them at least one "old folkie song" at these events. They really did enjoy this one. And I just kept picturing Barry at Getaway making Ms. Mary blush.. |
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27 Oct 09 - 03:30 AM (#2753439) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Genie Just seconding what the last few posters said, Tink. Way to go! I love it! |
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27 Oct 09 - 12:09 PM (#2753684) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Gibb, great singing and describes Barry to a T. Tink, hearing those kids sing a shanty would be a huge thrill to Barry Finn. Keep it up! Who knows, there might be another bench-walker in the bunch! I hear some strong voices in the mix. |
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30 Oct 09 - 09:48 AM (#2755620) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SaltyWalt Gibb! Thanks for throwing a hat in! I'm glad to hear more than one set of words as Barry would always have a lot of songs to choose from! Love it! Genie, Just saw what you asked. Don't be worried about the quality, I think we all rushed to record something (I think mine is awful quality, and I didn't post the other version that was more rowdy.) I hope you don't feel "attacked" or criticized. Not the intention. For clarification: I was talking about the first version (I thought I said that, but I don't have time to comb the thread) which although very British Folk - y or Folk revivaly, and a very nice fit to the style of stanza, is nothing like a rough strong work song. A diferentiation I make because I can't help myself. It's like the difference between "Dan Dan" and "Three Score and Ten". I had also wanted to point out the versatility of the words, because I really feel that Mr. Clayton's comment was a testament to them. By editing the last line, it worked as a stronger call and response than anything anyone else has done, and the writer (Lonesome EJ) said the intention was rowdy & chantey like. It's possible I've been unclear;Ive been away from home for a family emergency, going online only in the middle of the night, fatigued, but unable to sleep. A sub-optimal time for communication. (This can be evidenced by my typo's). Be well. Walt |
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02 Nov 09 - 11:17 AM (#2757953) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: SaltyWalt I had a little time to go back, and It seems I missed some other really cool itterations, like the Lej version with the refrains (I can hear it in the meter) or Amos' Bokian version. All are really great. I wish I was back in SF for the memorial there. |
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08 Apr 11 - 04:30 PM (#3131519) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Lonesome EJ Many will remember this thread that took place right after our friend Barry's death. I have put some images together with David Coffin's tune and singing, and the song is now on Youtube. This song will also be on the upcoming Mudcat CD Collection. Shanty for Barry Finn |
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08 Apr 11 - 09:59 PM (#3131651) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: bbc Great song for a great soul. I'm so glad it will be in the new CD set! Barbara |
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08 Apr 11 - 10:14 PM (#3131660) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble Glad that this tribute to Barry made the cut. Good work! Charley Noble |
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09 Apr 11 - 04:50 AM (#3131785) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: stallion Thanks for the link, Barry and I's last conversation was all too brief and nothing much, we had a lot of plans which we never did get to talk about. A great song for Barry's memory and I too am pleased it is on the cd's Peter |
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25 May 11 - 09:22 PM (#3160605) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Richard Atkins Lonesome EJ thank you for your U Tube work. well done I think. Barry and Justine were so welcoming to My Guru and myself on our visit from our side of the pond. Barry felt like a life long friend to me on our short visit ,and he left us all before we returned home. I do have videos that I have held until the time is right. Portsmouth and The Getaway, Barrys last two then! Must be via Justine I guess, or other sugestions welcome please ? |
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25 May 11 - 10:26 PM (#3160625) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Charley Noble Richard- I've sent you a PM with Justine's e-mail address. Charley Noble |
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26 May 11 - 07:50 AM (#3160761) Subject: RE: A Shanty for Barry Finn From: Richard Atkins Thanks for the PM's I will deal later. |