Songs of contempt about men

17 Jun 10 - 01:20 AM (#2929577)
Subject: Songs of contempt about men
From: Richard Bridge

May I ask for examples (preferably with links to recordings of perfomances and/or to worms and dots) of songs of contempt (by men) for the way some men treat womyn, particularly the cowards who try to control the female partners who have discarded them, by means of threats and intimidation or physical abuse?

I think I would like to learn some.

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17 Jun 10 - 02:03 AM (#2929590)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Long Firm Freddie

A Stitch in Time - written by Mike Waterson - is here:

Stitch

LFF

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17 Jun 10 - 03:41 AM (#2929619)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Richard Bridge

Ah yes, thank you, but surely it is a song to be sung by a woman about her man is it not?

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17 Jun 10 - 04:17 AM (#2929634)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Dave the Gnome

Andy Mitchell's 'Calum More' is from a womans point of view but I know a number of men who make a very good job of it - Including Vin Garbutt and my mate Dave:-)

I know it is not what you are realy after, Richard, but if you can't find many from the man's POV you may need to look from a different angle?

Let us know what you do find anyway.

Cheers

Dave

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17 Jun 10 - 06:32 AM (#2929708)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Rob Naylor

Maybe this site will give you some pointers. The songs are categorised by type of abuse:

Songs About Abuse

Hope that helps a bit.

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17 Jun 10 - 07:18 AM (#2929739)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Susan of DT

Look at songs with the keyword @feminist in the DT. Some may meet your criteria.

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17 Jun 10 - 07:40 AM (#2929748)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: oldhippie

Step It Out Nancy - Holly Near
She Sits At The Table - Tom Paxton

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17 Jun 10 - 07:47 AM (#2929752)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: GUEST,Ed

cowards who try to control female partners

aren't very likely to write songs about the situation, methinks...

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17 Jun 10 - 08:25 AM (#2929779)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Fergie

Christy Moore sings 'Stitch in Time' and he does a mighty job of it.

Fergus

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17 Jun 10 - 08:45 AM (#2929792)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: GUEST,Jack Campin

Look on my website for two Scottish ones - near the end of this chapter:

http://www.campin.me.uk/Embro/Webrelease/Embro/17riot/17riot.htm

"The Lament of the Working Class Hero's Wife" (recorded by Sandra Kerr and Alison McMorland, I think) and "Men Have All Had Their Own Way For Too Long" (unlikely to have been recorded).

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17 Jun 10 - 09:07 AM (#2929805)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Richard Bridge

Thanks all.

I will have a look next week. Off folking now. I thought there might be a vein of songs from the POV of the female victim's brother or father, or just any REAL man expressing his contempt for the scum who do that thing.

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17 Jun 10 - 09:12 AM (#2929808)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Tannywheeler

The field looks open, Richard. Knock yourself out, to coin a phrase. Tw

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17 Jun 10 - 09:17 AM (#2929811)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Dave Hanson

Blue Bleezin Blind Drunk.

Dave H

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17 Jun 10 - 09:19 AM (#2929813)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: meself

"Slap Her Down Again, Pa". Seriously. Although about controlling daughters rather than SOs.

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17 Jun 10 - 11:00 AM (#2929864)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: alanabit

Inevitably a lot of these songs are sung from the woman's point of view. Suszanne Vega's excellent "Luka" comes to mind. Joni MItchell's "Woman of Heart and Mind" is sung to a man, who is clearly annoying her. The trouble with Vega's "Luka" is that it makes you want to kick the violent bastard down a very long flight of stairs - an unfortunate effect for a song, which clearly rejects violence! Tracy Chapman's "Behind the Wall" covers a similar subject.

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17 Jun 10 - 11:19 AM (#2929874)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: mg

I just wish the title was something more like songs of contempt about men who act really badly or something like that rather than men in general. mg

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17 Jun 10 - 11:22 AM (#2929875)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Larry The Radio Guy

There is a great song, written and performed by a group of men (a punkish sounding group called Nada Surf from 2002, called Mother's Day. It expresses contempt for their peers who justify date rape of women. I believe it can be found on youtube.

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17 Jun 10 - 11:52 AM (#2929888)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Mrrzy

The Man Song (I wear the pants around here - when I finish with your laundry)

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17 Jun 10 - 12:07 PM (#2929892)
Subject: Lyr Add: HUSBAND TAMING (from Walter Pardon)
From: Jim Carroll

Two here:
HUSBAND TAMING
From the singing of Walter Pardon

Oh crikey, what a rummy go, there'll be throughout the nation,
So married men, just mind your eye, you'll find an alteration,
The women, they are fully bent and every day they're aiming,
By hook or crook, to find a plan to give the men a taming.

Hokey pokey, here's a go, the women, they are aiming,
To raise a new invented plan, they call it husband taming.

There lives a man not far from here, they call him Billy Shingle,
He says he give a thousand pounds if he were only single,
He says his wife is just begun to give him such a training,
She's took a patent out to try the plan of husband taming.

Hokey pokey……………

Every morning he must rise and kindle up the fire,
Sift the cinders, empty the pots, it is her first desire,
Then he must wash and dress the child and give the floor a sweeping,
While his wife, she lies in bed another hour asleeping.

Hokey pokey……………..

And when the kettle, it is boiled, he's ordered not to wake her,
Until he's brought her nice hot rolls from Mr Snooks, the baker,
Then he must go and lace her stays, it's no use his complaining,
Because he knows it is the plan she's got for husband taming.

Hokey pokey…………….

After breakfast he must wash, while she goes out a-shopping,
He must make the bed and hunt the fleas or else he gets a whopping,
The napkins then, he's got to dry, and clean the kitchen table,
And if he growls or says a word, she whops him with the ladle.

Hokey pokey…………….

And if the neigbours should pop in, to let them see she's able,
She makes him stand behind the chair and rock the baby's cradle,
And if the child should chance to cry she drives him nearly crazy,
He must pick it up and sing, oh hush-a-bye-a-baby.

Hokey pokey………………

On Sunday, when she takes a walk to see her cousin Atkins.
In his best hat he's got to take a half-a-dozen napkins,
So married men, judge for yourself, you'll see at what they're aiming,
To wear the britches out-and-out and give the men a taming.

Hokey pokey………………….

So single men, just study this, if you would study riches,
If ever you should get a wife don't let her wear the britches,
For once she gets the britches on she'll give you such a training,
And make you curse of the patent plan they've got for husband taming.

Hokey pokey, here's a go, the women, they are aiming,
To raise the new invented plan, they call it husband taming.

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and, of course

As I was a-walking one fine summers morning,
To view the filds and the leaves a-springing,
I heard two birds upong a bush,
And one of them was sweetly singing;
And all of their conversation was;
My husband's got no courage in him.

Oh dear oh, oh dear no,
My husband's got no courage in him,
Oh dear oh.

Quite enough of that one, I think,
Jim Carroll

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17 Jun 10 - 12:56 PM (#2929923)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Tattie Bogle

Like Dave Hanson, I thought of "Blue Bleezing Blind Drunk", a song that always makes me feel slightly uncomfortable, especially when sung with such gusto and even big smiles on the face of the singer, in case there should be a victim of domestic abuse in the room.
Eric Bogle's "Glasgow Lullaby", also looks at the association between drunkenness and domestic violence.You'll find the words in the DT or on his website: www.ericbogle.net.
"Don't get married girls" by Leon Rosselson.
And slightly off your specification, but a great song by a man poking fun at men's uselessness,
"I'm a man, I'm a man, i'm only a man" by Davie Spittal of Fife group, Kinrick.

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17 Jun 10 - 01:50 PM (#2929959)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Uncle_DaveO

GUEST,Ed posted:

cowards who try to control female partners

aren't very likely to write songs about the situation, methinks...

You've missed an important part of the initial request, methinks.

What was wanted was songs by men, contemptuous of other men, who are cowards etc.

Dave Oesterreich

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17 Jun 10 - 01:59 PM (#2929965)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Midchuck

If someone posted the same request with the sexes switched, the screams of protest would be so loud and widespread that it would probably shut down the site.

And liberals claim to believe in fairness!

Peter.

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18 Jun 10 - 12:13 AM (#2930273)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Larry The Radio Guy

Midchuck, it has to do with a long tradition of masculine control of the feminine--much of which is rampant in folk songs (and pop/country songs) throughout the ages. It was only in the 20th century that women were even considered "persons". And British law allowed men to beat their women so long as the object of assault was no wider than their thumb (that's the origin of the term "rule of thumb". Hence, for me, "fairness" is attempting to right those wrongs. And I think there's a lot of great music out there that is genuinely working at doing that. The first step is to identify songs that acknowledge how inappropriately men have treated women throughout history--and how this treatment has been sanctioned by society.

When songs were about women taking power over or physically abusing men, they were considered "novelty" songs. (Eg. Bald Headed End of A Broom").

(This isn't to ever justify cruel treatment of men by women--or by other men).

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18 Jun 10 - 02:32 AM (#2930297)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Dave Hanson

Larry, if you look at traditional English and Scottish ballads it's mostly a catalogue of womens treachery to men.

Dave H

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18 Jun 10 - 02:33 AM (#2930298)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Bert

If you want to learn try try this one

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18 Jun 10 - 03:44 AM (#2930304)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Jim Carroll

"If someone posted the same request with the sexes switched, the screams of protest......"
Our traditions are full of songs and stories that vilify the opposite sex, whichever you are, and by taking offence with them, you run the risk of losing a large part of our repertoires.
In today's climate, with more awareness of the questions of gender, it is possible that the real 'narsties' will filter themselves out.
Where do you go next; whaling songs, ageist, hunting, songs that take the piss out of religion and clergymen, political songs, ones that would give offence to pacifists, vegetarians, royalists, republicans..... the list is endless, and, taken to it's logical conclusion, we would be left with a repertoire so anodyne that we might as well sing 'Polly Put The Kettle On' (whoops, sorry, that one's a bit sexist).
We used to have feature evenings in The Singers Club in London and one of the most successful subjects was 'The Battle of the Sexes', where a mixed gender group of residents would present balanced evenings and give as good as they got; they were the sessions when you got the 'flytings' - wonderful.
The sexist songs, presented thoughtfully, can do much to underline and ridicule the injustice of gender domination rather than confirm it - and long may they continue to do so.
Don't be a Mrs (or Mr) Grundy.
Jim Carroll

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18 Jun 10 - 04:51 AM (#2930326)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: GUEST,MC Fat (at work)

Don't Get Married Girls by Leon Rosselson and I particulary like Blue Bleezing Drunk (Just to give Micky a warning)

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18 Jun 10 - 11:33 AM (#2930567)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Larry The Radio Guy

Rob Naylor, thanks for the added info. re. "rule of thumb". I do have some awareness of that debate around the origins of that term--and I'm certainly not a historian. However, as you stated, "moderate correction" was allowed by men toward their women--and women were certainly considered "possessions". That's the main point I'm trying to make.

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18 Jun 10 - 01:14 PM (#2930622)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Joe_F

I'm gonna wash that man...
I hate men
That's what you get for loving me

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18 Jun 10 - 02:29 PM (#2930677)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: kendall

Liverpool Lullaby

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18 Jun 10 - 03:31 PM (#2930708)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: Art Thieme

Sung by a woman about a man------or---the other way around...

God don't like ugly,
Baby, your soul is in hell,
God don't like ugly,
Baby, your soul is in hell,
You sit around the house with your moth in a pout,
All you need to be a beast is a tail and a snout,
God don't like ugly,
Baby, your soul is in hell.

Art

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18 Jun 10 - 04:22 PM (#2930729)
Subject: RE: Songs of contempt about men
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego

In my non-profit work, from which I am finally about to retire, I have encountered many abused women through agencies and shelters. The stories of some are horrific, from physical beatings and torture to emotional and spiritual abuse or constant browbeating. It is a systematic destruction of the spirit.

The saddest thing is that so many return for more of the same because, as one lady told me, "I'd rather the devil I know than the one I haven't met." These songs, especially by those who have direct knowledge, are - and should be - powerful. There is no weaker or more detestable man than one who abuses women and children.

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