Seeking Will Holt

17 Oct 10 - 01:18 AM (#3008841)
Subject: Origins: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Those of you who know Will Holt's music already know how precious it is and how important that it not disappear forever. There is one seller at Amazon, offering Holt's best known volume, "The Exciting Artistry of Will Holt," on vinyl, for $50. Fortunately, I recently found a cassette tape my late ex-husband had made for me, a collection of Bobby Short, Helen Merrill, but mostly Will Holt." I'd like to be able to put the collection on CD (it's on metal tape, so the first big task was finding one of our many components that could read metal tape. We finally found a fairly old Koss player that can read the tape. The next task will be to move it to the computer, then download onto CDs.

It would be nice if I could get in touch with Will Holt himself, to discuss distribiution rights, royalties, etc.. So, if anyone knows him, or knows someone who knows someone who knows someone (etc.) who knows Will Holt could you please get me in touch with him. Apparently, he no longer has even a copy of that brilliant album, and Elektra, the music publishers for the best of 50s and 60s folksong, jazz, and whatnot, is now defunct.

So I'm sending out this request to any and all who might have ideas about contacting Will Holt to discuss the issues. He's already in his 80's and his work much be preserved for the future.

So let me know if you have any ideas or contacts. I and a number of others on this forum, will be very grateful.

Thanks very much.

Reliza

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17 Oct 10 - 02:04 AM (#3008847)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: beeliner

Mr. Holt's Wikipedia article is amazingly sparse.

As a young man, I went to see Will perform, alone or with Dolly, whenever he was in Chicago. He never disappointed.

I have the Elektra album and also Will Holt and Dolly Jonah on the Brink on Atlantic, which I suspect is even rarer.

Dolly Jonah died in 1983.

I have no idea what Mr. Holt is doing today, hopefully enjoying his retirement just as I am. He would be, I believe, about 81 or 82.

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17 Oct 10 - 11:59 AM (#3009169)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Thomas Stern

1. Elektra Records is far from defunct. They are now part of WEA (Warner-Elektra-Atlantic), and actively license their older albums
to companies such as Collector's Choice Music, or market through
subsidiary RHINO Records.

2. I am aware of the following WILL HOLT albums - please let me know if there are others. Thanks!

CORAL CRL 57114 The World of Will Holt
STINSON SLP 65 A Will Holt Concert (Folk Songs and Ballad)
STINSON SLP 78 Pills To Purge Melancholy
ELEKTRA EKL 181 Exciting Artistry of Will Holt
ATLANTIC 8051 On The BrinK - Will Holt & Dolly Jonah (Hungry I)
MGM 4180 A KURT WEILL CABARET - Martha Schlamme & Will Holt

Best wishes, Thomas.

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18 Oct 10 - 01:31 AM (#3009599)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Robin Wolfson (Reliza)

Dear Thomas,

Thanks so much for the plethora of information. I'll contact Rhino Records and see if they'll re-release the albums or come to some other arrangement.

My sister and I used to sing Will Holt songs from the Exciting Artistry album for years. Actually, I still do.

I'd love to hear the other albums, especially since I'm a big Kurt Weill fan as well. Do you have equipment to copy them to CD, in case I can't get them through Rhino. I'd like Mr. Holt to get the royalties he so richly deserves.

And thanks again for the info. I had no idea I'd get such a complete response so soon. I love the Internet, despite the den of liars, thieves, and scoundrels who flourish there.

Off to query Rhino.

rew

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23 Oct 10 - 07:08 AM (#3013605)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Rhino negotiations, finding recordings

Thomas,

I seem to have taken on the collection, conversion to CDs, and distributing what I hope will be a complete Will Holt collection. For the last few days, I've been negotiating with Rhino records about the collection of LPs and distribution, hope to get their agreement in writing. So far I've gotten as far as the following from one of the Rhino staff:

"I can not advise you in this area. I can appreciate your dedication to a complete collection I am also a music collector. However I can not give approval to any of these things due to copy right restrictions. That being said you are free to do what you like with your physical product."

I'm very suspicious of that "do what you like with your physical produce." Does that mean cconversion to CDs? I hate it when lawyers put out little statements. You know there's a restriction in there somewhere. So, got any pull with Rhino?

I've just realized this evening that, in addition to the cassette mix, I also have Pills to Purge Melancholy. I desperately want the Brecht/Weill Cabaret album, so, if you want a complete collection, we have to start a sort of chain mail (sorry, that would be mail-chain, querying everyone you know to see if they have any Will Holt recordings. And, by the way, thanks very much for the list of recordings. At least now I can tell people what we're looking for. If I can get a complete collection, I figure on selling the CDs for cost (CDs, a small portion for the price of disks, and postage. I'm trying to get Rhino to consent to creating the consolidated collection, but (a) don't want to make the price too high and (b) get enough from each sale to pay royalties to Mr. Holt.

I'm assuming you know a lot more people th at I do. Just about everybody does. So I'll start the conversion from cassette and vinyl and see if I can find some more of the albums. Let me know if you find anything.

Regards,
r

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23 Oct 10 - 06:25 PM (#3013927)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Thomas Stern

Discussions on various lists leads me to think the copyright on sound recordings allows you to make a single copy for yourself, but you MUST retain the original album otherwise it is infringing on the copyright.
Most of Holts records are easily found at the usual sources - Ebay,
Gemm, Musicstack, used record dealers etc. etc. If you live in/near
NY, Boston, Chicago, LA, SF, probably many others, these records should be easily located. A quick check of eBay lists 22 albums!
Best wishes, Thomas.

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24 Oct 10 - 12:31 AM (#3014021)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Dear Beeliner,

I just re-read your post and noticed the two albums you have. I know this is a lot to ask, but would you be willing to loan them to me so I can transfer them to CD as part of my "Save Will Holt" project. All participants will receive free copies of the final CD collection, as well as CD versions of their own recordings. All shipping to be FedEx'd, charged to my account number and insured. All shipments to contain only one recording at a time to minimize risk of damage. Or, if you have the equipment, could you make me a cassette or CD copy of the two albums.

For a personal reference, please check my resumé at www.datastep.com and click on the resumés link. I'm the Robin at DataStep.

Please consider and let me know what you think. If you want better insurance, I'll send you my copy of "Pills to Purge Melancholy," as a sort of hostage. I look forward to hearing from you.

Thanks,
Reliza
Reliza Books

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24 Oct 10 - 02:20 AM (#3014044)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

If you would like to discuss the Will Holt project less publicly, you can contact me at 916-508-3310, my name is Robin Wolfson. If anyone else reads this and wants to contribute to the project or receive the final collection, please feel free to contact me at the number above or by e-mail at [e-mail].

C'mon, all. We can do this. We can preserve the music of this amazing American master for future generations.

Thanks,
r

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25 Oct 10 - 05:23 AM (#3014783)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Dear Beeliner,

Please come and join the Wave Hill Holt campaign. A child of the late fifties and the sixties, I have this deep unshakable belief in the power of grass roots movements. Now that we have the Internet, one person no longer needs to go house to house or shop to shop to unionize (or whatever), instead, just like in the old days, we recruit one friend at a time, and that friend, we hope, brings in more friends and more friends still. No, it's not a multi-level marketing scheme, just plain ol' folks making their voices heard. So maybe you know someone who has some Will Holt albums or maybe some friend further down the road knows someone. But, as I'm sure you know, this kind of campaign lives solely on word-of-mouth, or blog on the Internet. I am absolutely no one, except a passionate fan of Mr. Holt's (and, of course, the most beautiful song ever written: Leonard Cohen's "Hallelujah."

So, please pass the baton and see how many people you can get to sign on. With enough voices, we can overrule the lawyers at wmg (Warner Music Group, currently holders of the Rhino discography) who say you can haven't something, even though they're not now and, as far as anyone can tell, no plans in the future for re-releasing these recording on any format whatsoever.

r

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25 Oct 10 - 06:02 AM (#3014789)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Deckman

Back about the mid 1960's, I was staying with some friends in California. In going through the family record collection, I came across a Will Holt album. I'd not heard of him before, but I listened a bit. Ever since then, I've been somewhat "haunted" by one song. I remember not the title, but I well remember the "story." It had to do with a sailor who fell off the stern of a steamer, and his thoughts as he treaded water and watched the night lights of the ship dissapear beyond him.

Am I nuts, did I dream this story, or is it a real Will Holt ballad. I'd appreciate it if anyone can answer my questions. bob(deckman)nelson

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25 Oct 10 - 07:54 AM (#3014848)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Charley Noble

Thomas Starn-

I've been thinking there was some connection between this Will Holt and Richard Dyer-Bennet, that Holt was one of Dyer-Bennet's favorite music students, or maybe Holt considered Dyer-Bennet a mentor. Would I be correct?

Charley Noble

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25 Oct 10 - 08:30 AM (#3014866)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Charley Noble

Mudcat can be a great resource for folk music research, song-writing, finding new friends (and enemies), and learning about different parts of the world. I certainly had no experience like this with a website until my friend Brett directed me here back in 2001, back when glaciers ruled the world!

Of course there are times when even the best threads implode or die for lack of interest. But I find that these times are more than made up for by the occasional flashes of brilliance, humor, or just plain information.

My grateful thanks to Max, Joe, and the Joe Clones for their perseverance.

Time to ante up with another donation!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble, who like most Mudcatters is only the fleeting figment of a deranged mind

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25 Oct 10 - 08:31 AM (#3014867)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Charley Noble

Whoops, posted to the wrong thread!

Charley

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25 Oct 10 - 06:50 PM (#3015341)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Nope, you're not losing your mind. The song you remember was part of the musical "Happy End" composed by Kurt Weill with lyrics by Bertolt Brecht. The song title is "The Sailor's Song." Will Holt included it on the LP "The Exciting Artistry of Will Holt" and probably (although I don't have the album, so I can't be sure) on the album "A Kurt Weill Cabaret."

Want to ask your friends if they'd loan me their record for a couple of days so I can convert it to CD, a copy of which would be sent back along with their album.

Thanks for contacting the "Save Will Holt" campaign.

Seek on!

Reliza
[e-mail]

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25 Oct 10 - 06:54 PM (#3015345)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Deckman

Thanks ... bob nelson

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25 Oct 10 - 07:07 PM (#3015349)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Okay, sorry about the previous reference which seems to have gone out without the Paul Woodford contact. His e-mail is [e-mail]. His very extensive blog is at http://pwoodford.net/blog/.

I hope to hear from you.

Regards,
r

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25 Oct 10 - 08:04 PM (#3015389)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Thomas, I am an utter, complete, and totally witless idiot. I re-read your earlier post, the one where I hadn't noticed eBay and felt suddenly more witless than usual. Of course they're at e-Bay. So I've bought "The Exciting Artistry" and "A Kurt Weill Cabaret," at the cost of resetting prices to fire-sale levels at Reliza Books at Alibris Books. And, I think, that's the end of the money for the year. So, head on over to Alibris and check the new, much cheaper catalog for Reliza Books so we can make some money and buy the remaining records.

Seek on!

r

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Link fixed - you have to include "http://" as part of the target URL in your link. Handy-dandy lessons here (click)
-Joe Offer-

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02 Nov 10 - 08:01 AM (#3021494)
Subject: RE: Tech: Seeking Will Holt recordings
From: GUEST,Reliza

Dear MudCatters, one and all,

As a result of the nearly total lack of response to my request to borrow Will Holt albums (and far too many "Who's Will Holt?"), I've decided to change the campaign strategy. Instead of borrowing, I'll just buy the existing albums available at eBay and various vinyl shops, make the recordings, and sell the entire collection on CD, or CDs of the individual albums. The upside of this strategy, maybe we can earn some royalties for Mr. Holt. The downside, of course, is that it will involve contracts and, therefore, contract lawyers. Which means the price of the collection will increase. I have yet to come up with a distribution strategy or prices yet. I thought first I'd focus on getting everything on CDs, and then going from there. Thank you Thomas Stern for the contact to Will Holt. Your copy will be free.

Once we're sure I won't end up in prison or penniless from fines, I start putting bits of sample cuts up on what will probably be a WordPress site, under Reliza Books. I've already got three of the albums and will start purchasing again in the New Year. I'll let you know when there's something to know. I'll post an announcement of what's available as soon as I get past the lawyers. Anyone out there a contract lawyer will a couple of pro bono hours on your hands?

Regards to all,
r

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02 Nov 10 - 08:05 AM (#3021496)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Dear MudCatters, one and all,

There seem to be three locations for this post, so I'm updating it to all three threads.


Thanks to you all for the inspiration to make a definitive Will Holt collection. You have a delightful forum that I'm very glad I found.

Regards to all,
r

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Hi, Reliza- we try to discourage multiple postings of the same message. I deleted two of the three copies of the message you posted today.
-Joe Offer, Forum Moderator-

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03 Nov 10 - 05:19 AM (#3022340)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Joe Offer

You'll find liner notes for a couple of Will Holt albums at http://www.lazyka.com/linernotes/personel/HoltWill.htm. The only Will Holt recording I could find on CD was a single cut, "Three Jovial Huntsmen," on a compilation album. And I think that's the only Will Holt recording I've ever heard. Too bad the Elektra folk catalog is being reissued at such a slow pace.

-Joe-

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03 Nov 10 - 05:43 AM (#3022354)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Dear Beeliner:

Would you consider loaning me the Will Holt and Dolly Jonah for a couple of days. I found both the "Exciting Artistry of Will Holt," as well as the "Kurt Weill Cabaret" album he did with Martha Schlammer. I will pay all Fedex charges, including insurance, both ways. As soon as I receive it, I'll run it through the mixer (with a brand new diamond stylus, of course, on the turntable) and will then return the album to you, with CDs for each of the four albums. I already have "Pills to Purge Melancholy," so we're making progress. Just think, you could have four Will Holt albums by Christmas.

I understand if you dodn't want to loan something as precious as your Will Holt album. I should be able to start buying again early next year. Let me know what you think.

r

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03 Nov 10 - 05:51 AM (#3022357)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Joe Offer,

Thanks for cleaning the redundancy probm with my posts. As you may have figured out, despite having been in the software side of the computer industry for forty years, I'm still using the old-point-click-see what happens approach to Mudcat.

But what I mostly wanted to tell you was to thank you for the link to the site with WH lyrics. I'll bookmark it now and then it out later today go through it carefully. I appreciate your effort.

Sincerely,
r

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07 Nov 10 - 11:59 PM (#3026381)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Reliza

Hi, guys. As you can tell from the subject, I've had to abandon my campaign to revitalize or at least repopularize the music of Will Holt. I have finally received a knowledgeable response from a contact for Will Holt and the answer is, predictably, no, we can't make copies and distribute them for free or otherwise. Given that Mr. Holt's copyrights are all still in force, there shalt be no unlicensed distribution. Which is fair. What I really wanted as in the movie, "Disclosure," was "to stir the grass to startle the snakes." The very nice person who agreed to serve as a contact for Mr. Holt at least conveyed to him my love and gratitude for his music and agreed to contact the Elektra/WEA/WMG conglomerate. I suspect we'll never hear from them, however, having already tried a total of five times.

What puzzles me is why the music companies have never gone into the print-on-demand business. Amazon has shown it's profitable with books, so all the music people need do is digitize their existing inventory (think of bringing back all those wonderful Odetta recordings, and yes, I know some are available, I have them) and other great recordings back into circulation. They could even send files for printing covers and liner notes on CD liners. But, apparently, such is not to be. Or at least not in my lifetime.

But for those of you interested in Will Holt, there are still plenty of copies selling at eBay and whatnot. At reasonable prices, even.

Special thanks to Thomas Stern for finding a Will Holt contact for me. If nothing else, it's nice to be able to convey to your favorite artists how much their music/writing/art/etc. has enriched your life.

Thanks to one and all for your comments and support. It's been a real joy discovering MudCat Café. I'll drop in from time to time; I've already passed the URL to my music-maven step-son.

Best to all of you and the MudCat management. Sing on!

r

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08 Nov 10 - 12:34 AM (#3026398)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: Joe Offer

Hi, Reliza-
I removed the "RIP" from your message title. Here at Mudcat, "Obit" and "RIP" have a very specific meaning - that the person you're talking about is dead. There is no indication that is the case.
I figured you wouldn't get very far in your quest to reissue the Elektra albums. Warner Brothers owns that label, and reissues are coming very slowly. I guess they figure that slow reissues will make more money than flooding the market with the Entire Elektra folk catalog. In ways, I'm surprised. My understanding is that Elektra founder Jac Holzman is a Warner executive. One would think Holzman would want his catalog reissued.

-Joe-

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26 Mar 12 - 03:15 PM (#3329237)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: GUEST,Harriet

I am soooooo desparate to get a copy of Will Holt singing "The First Time We Went Waltzing"!!!!!!!!!!!! Never heard anything like it in my entire lifetime. Is there anyone out there who has a copy that I can put onto a CD????

Thanks,
Harriet

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26 Mar 12 - 05:29 PM (#3329317)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: dick greenhaus

Will wrote "Lemon Tree"--and retired on residuals from the Lemon Pledge commercials.

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27 Mar 12 - 04:22 PM (#3329788)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: John on the Sunset Coast

I found this site which may provide a lead to finding Mr. Holt. It affirms that he was still performing about 2-1/2 or 3 years ago, and has photos (do we still use that term?) from that time. Good Luck.

http://beecherphoto.com/deertrees/WillHoltandCharlesStrouse/WillandCharles.htm

JotSC

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19 Sep 12 - 11:35 AM (#3407340)
Subject: RE: Seeking Will Holt
From: maeve

From John-o-t-Sunset Coast's link:

"Will Holt and Charles Strouse presented an evening of remembrance at Deertrees Theatre on July 21 and 22, 2006. The performances were a benefit for the Seeds of Peace Camp in Otisfield, Maine. Will Holt is a Maine native who wrote "Lemon Tree" and "Raspberries, Strawberries". Charles Strouse is the composer of "Bye, Bye, Birdie" and "Annie". The evening was filled with song and remembrances of their lives as composers."

Charles Strause has his contact information as well as an email address posted on his webpage; perhaps he would be willing to help folks make contact with Will Holt.
http://charlesstrouse.com/

In addition, the linked article mentions Aaron Hagan, "musical director for Will and Charles for years"...I wonder if he might be willing to assist?

All three friends have ties to Maine and may indeed live here now.

The Deerfield Theater event took place in 2006.
*****
I know Leeneia is wanting to communicate with Mr. Holt regarding his song, 'Adieu Madras'. I hope something here might allow her to do so.

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