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02 Nov 10 - 05:09 AM (#3021402) Subject: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: MGM·Lion An American singer, who shall remain nameless, once included a track on an LP which she called an old English song, under title "The Brown and Yellow Earl", appending a learned note purporting to explain the state of the English nation at the time of that said Earl,(who mayhap, she thought, got that cognomen due to colours in his armorial bearings?). The point is, the song she was singing was actually that Irish song with the burden "Oh, the brown and the yellow ALE"; which she had clearly misheard and misunderstood and worked from there. I don't know if Americans are unaware that ALE is a kind of beer brewed from malted barley. But, however it came about, I found this an oddly charming miscomprehension. Any other examples of such? ~Michael~ |
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02 Nov 10 - 06:00 AM (#3021424) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Hesk That rousing chorus song by Andy Barnes, called "When All Men Sing" went into my brain as "When Old Men Sing" for some time. Strangely appropriate given the age of most of the singers! |
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02 Nov 10 - 06:52 AM (#3021449) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: doc.tom Actually, When All Men Sing is a poem by Keith Scowcroft set to a tune by Derek Gifford - although Andy would be chuffed to have been credited with it! |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:02 AM (#3021459) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: MGM·Lion Slight drift [my thread so I'm allowed, so yah-sucks] ··· Part of the title of an ongoing thread below the line is ····resend to Pinch Hitter···· which I read every time my eye flips down the menu as "resent to Pinch Hitler". ~M~ & yes, I might be a mere Yooker, but I do know what a pinch-hitter is, so please don't trouble to explain... |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:03 AM (#3021461) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Leadfingers Michael - I DONT find such errors endearing as they simply show a TOTAL lack of interest in the background of a song - It seems for a LOT of singers , its the 'Pretty Noise' that matters NOT the song ! |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:37 AM (#3021480) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: GUEST,Desi C It could also be the rather poor diction of many singers, many top ones too, I often find myself straining to understand lyrics at gigs, anyone else have that problem? |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:40 AM (#3021482) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Les in Chorlton Is it true that some people have been searching 'The Shores of Erin' for fish? L in C# |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:41 AM (#3021483) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: MGM·Lion LF ~ I don't always either, by any means. It's just that some are imo: as e.g. my example of an American mishearing "ale" and so creating a whole scenario from the concept of an Earl associated with autumnal colours in a particular point of history. I did find that one 'endearing', though YMMV; and was only seeking examples of others which other people might have found so. This is not one of those threads where all that is sought are crass errors. We have had enough of such in the past. ~Michael~ |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:45 AM (#3021485) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Hesk Doc Tom. Thanks for the correction. I was just repeating info found elsewhere on Mudcat. Obviously a bad move! And Terry, what's the background behind that unusually critical remark from you? Howard. |
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02 Nov 10 - 07:47 AM (#3021486) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: The Doctor I came across an American book of world folk songs, which included Uncle Tom Cobbleigh, listed as a Scottish song with the opening line 'Tam Pierce, Tam Pierce...' I wonder who they'd been listening to. |
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02 Nov 10 - 08:18 AM (#3021499) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Brian Peters One version of 'Lord Randal' was collected in America, in which the cause of his poisoning was not given as 'eels' but 'ale'. Been there, done that. |
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02 Nov 10 - 08:22 AM (#3021500) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Les in Chorlton Living Tradition? L in C# |
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02 Nov 10 - 08:25 AM (#3021501) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: bubblyrat I remember mis-hearing many things in folk-songs as a boy ; for years,I wondered not only about "Jimmy Crackcorn", but also as to what sort of insect a "shoefly" was. |
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02 Nov 10 - 08:43 AM (#3021508) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Dead Horse Reputedly, Bob Copper believed his most famous opening line in song was "Here's a Jew, my dearest Nancy, 10,000 times a Jew" :-) |
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02 Nov 10 - 11:23 AM (#3021630) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: The Doctor According to The Copper Family Song Book, which contains a few facsimiles of Brasser's handwriting, including the relevant one here, he wrote 'Here's a dew sweet lovely Nancy ten thousand times a dew', which I suspect was a spelling error resulting from unfamiliarity. He also wrote 'I am goeing round the ocan', and 'Come chaing your ring', though he got that one right the second time. In times past spelling was prone to error, particularly in less common words - much as it is now really. |
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02 Nov 10 - 11:42 AM (#3021646) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: fat B****rd I used to think that Edmund O'Ross was a famous bandleader and that Marry O'Lanzer was an Irish tenor. True! |
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02 Nov 10 - 11:54 AM (#3021654) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Marilyn One that had me chuckling for ages:- I was searching on the internet for the lyrics to a song I know as "Gypsy Woman" - "I recall a gypsy woman ..." and I found it. mmm... Now the line that goes "Oh gentle woman you sleep beside me and little know who haunts my mind" was rendered as "Oh gentle woman you sleep beside me a little gnome who haunts my mind" ROFL! |
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02 Nov 10 - 12:09 PM (#3021672) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: dick greenhaus Oddly enough, this kind of mistake--otherwise known as mondegreens--are part and parcel of the folk process. I'm particularly fond of "Queen Jane was a neighbor" |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:01 PM (#3021730) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Leadfingers Hesk - "My next song is a Christie Moore song" and then do either Black is the Colour , or Ride On , Both SUNG (Very Well)by Mr Moore . but NOT his ! And thats just ONE example ! |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:10 PM (#3021741) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: MGM·Lion Leadfingers ~~ No, that is NOT ANY example: misattribution of a song is NOT the topic of this thread & it is nowhere suggested, by me or anyone else, that it is. So stop introducing irrelevancies, get your temper back ~~ or go back to sleep, please. I am thanking you. ~Michael~ |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:16 PM (#3021748) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: Leadfingers Sorry !! ZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz z z z z z z z z |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:21 PM (#3021752) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: MGM·Lion I am now thanking you double & in ♠♠♠ !!! ~M~ |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:41 PM (#3021782) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: GUEST,Jon Dudley ...and it doesn't stop there Doctor. 'Sportsmen Arouse' is an example where for aeons (well a long time anyway) we've sung 'relope, relope, retiring hare...etc', it wasn't until we'd looked into it and realised that the lyric must be 'elope'...which definition is given as 'to run away'. Of course we'll sing 'relope' until we die. But it's nice to know - sometimes. We can forgive Brasser completely (actually there's nothing to forgive) as he was essentially unletterd and being born before the 1870 Education Act was put to work at 8 years, therefore receiving no formal education. At the age of eighteen or thereabouts he attended a sort of dame school in the evening with his bother Tom where they both learned the rudiments of the three 'R's - rendering, reading and reckoning. It stood them both in good stead and as a result Brasser became the bailiff on the farm and his brother a successful publican. His spelling may be 'free style' but it's absolutely charming and the hours of toil and labour of love that produced his songbook is a hugely cherished document in the family. |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:49 PM (#3021787) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: MGM·Lion But, Jon ~~ "relope, relope, retiring hare" is such a perfect, expressive piece of assonance & alliteration. The word does not indeed occur in my Chambers: but [serious suggestion, I promise I am not being facetious]; a hare has a loping style of run: could it possibly mean "lope away, and continue to do so for as long as necessary"? If one of your Copper ancestors had created such a coinage in such a context, it would indeed have been a piece of true folk poetry! Best regards to you all ~Michael~ |
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02 Nov 10 - 01:55 PM (#3021793) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehensi From: McGrath of Harlow I thought it "When Old Men Sing", for years. And in fact I still prefer it that way, and am likely enough to sing it that way. Sometimes mis-hearings and mondergreens can improve songs. |
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02 Nov 10 - 02:15 PM (#3021812) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: The Sandman dress me up in my oilskins and jodhpurs., as sung by an acquaintance of mine at Stratford folk club years ago.but even beeter was the mondegreen which involved introducing june tabor as jane tuba. |
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02 Nov 10 - 02:35 PM (#3021827) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Little Robyn Not sure if it was lack of interest in the background of a song or simply not understanding - a young lass many years ago singing Dirty old town.... 'Springs a girl of the streets at night' Puts a slightly different colour on it. Robyn |
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02 Nov 10 - 02:42 PM (#3021832) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: GUEST,mg in foggy dew I always heard to a city pharoah eyes or something like that...always had an image of a sphinx in the middle of Ireland but never occured to me to question it. mg |
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02 Nov 10 - 06:03 PM (#3022032) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Joe_F I think I may have mentioned this elsethread, but for many years I heard the line There's folk that's independent o' ither tradesmen's wark, from Ewan MacColl's singing of "The Wark of the Weavers", as There's folk that's independent -- a' ither trades must wark. Delightful pawky humor, I thought: Being (financially) independent is just another trade, except for one detail. |
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03 Nov 10 - 08:29 AM (#3022426) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: GUEST,AlanG at work Oooops fingures too quick for my brain! I wish I was back in Liverpool, Liverpool town where I belong Where the aint no tres no centipedes....... |
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03 Nov 10 - 09:11 AM (#3022454) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Mr Happy As McG of H remarked above, 'Sometimes mis-hearings and mondergreens can improve songs. ' Last week at a session, I sang 'Bold Riley'. When I'd finished, someone said, 'What's the part about wife swapping?' Seems they'd misheard 'Cheer up Mary, don't look glum Come White Stocking Day, you'll be drinking rum' Possibly these days, 'Wife Swapping Day' could be more meaningful! |
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03 Nov 10 - 09:32 AM (#3022463) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: GUEST,AlanG at work I had a similar experience when singing The Ranter and in the line "me husband he's gone for a week" Perhaps I didn't sound the K loud enogh in week, but someone said afterwards that either the husband must have had a medical problem or the Ranter was a very fast worker. |
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03 Nov 10 - 10:33 AM (#3022500) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Dave Sutherland Once heard a young lady singing "Bonny At Morn" with the chorus line "thas ower lang in diapers" (Thas ower lang in thy bed) |
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03 Nov 10 - 11:40 AM (#3022549) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: GUEST,Gail Years ago I heard a floor singer singing what he'd heard but obviously not seen written down: oooooh my dear, don't come any nearer me instead of: Cúnla dear, don't come any nearer me He made it sound like Widow Twankey in pantomime rather than a cheeky seduction attempt. |
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03 Nov 10 - 04:43 PM (#3022831) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: andrew e We'll drink a drink a drink to Willy the pig, the pig, the pig. Our Lips are Sealed became Alex The Seal! |
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03 Nov 10 - 04:52 PM (#3022846) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Herga Kitty Of course there's Karine Polwart's "Follow the herring home"... And thanks to Trayton, "When some men sing"! Kitty |
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03 Nov 10 - 05:31 PM (#3022866) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: bubblyrat It may not be "folk", but there's always "The Reverend Bluejeans" and,of course, "Five Hundred Children and a Cop in The Fields". |
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03 Nov 10 - 06:44 PM (#3022943) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: oldstrings A very experienced singer, performing The Banks of Newfoundland, sang: "Scrub the blood off the dead man's face", which sounds very dramatic, and perhaps reinforces the notion that it was a hard life at sea, me hearties. I had to convince him that the line should be Scrub the MUD off the deadman's face. (A deadman was simply an anchor. Mountaineers still use the term for any kind of anchor which can be buried in the snow, where no trees or rocks are available to belay to.) Not nearly as exciting an image, but the anchor had to be washed clean before stowing it for the trip. |
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04 Nov 10 - 12:05 AM (#3023119) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Dave Hunt I refer you all to the superb collection of Mondegreens in Musical Traditions That should keep you going for a while!! Dave |
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04 Nov 10 - 01:13 AM (#3023130) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: Dave Hunt AND - just come across this - on Mudcat! - ________________________________ Subject: RE: Need Info: Proper Cup of Coffee From: poet - PM Date: 07 Oct 99 - 07:30 PM Definitely talk to COSMO THE CAR the greatest and funniest Music Hall act you could ever book............ _________________________________ Cosmo The Car = Cosmotheka ! |
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04 Nov 10 - 07:36 AM (#3023259) Subject: RE: Endearing mistakes due to incomprehension From: GUEST,Guest, Mark Bluemel "introducing june tabor as jane tuba" More a spoonerism than a mondegreen, I'd have thought. I think Brian Hooper at the Foc'sle in Southampton used to refer to the lady in that manner. I also remember him reading aloud from a record or CD sleeve (possibly a raffle prize) - "some other time June Tabor" :-) |