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28 Jan 11 - 05:46 PM (#3084337) Subject: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does is again! From: Stringsinger Tom does it again! Our great songwriting troubadour is once again doing what a folksinger is supposed to do. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7VXxZgpK3U http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7VXxZgpK3U |
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28 Jan 11 - 09:31 PM (#3084423) Subject: RE: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does is again! From: Charley Noble Excellent! Charley Noble |
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29 Jan 11 - 03:24 AM (#3084512) Subject: RE: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does is again! From: Anne Neilson Thank you so much for that -- a very necessary clarification of all the arguments. |
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29 Jan 11 - 07:23 AM (#3084588) Subject: RE: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does is again! From: bradfordian This is one that needs more prominance. Hope we can put the word around. Very singable. Hope to hear it in the folk clubs and other places soon |
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29 Jan 11 - 07:43 AM (#3084595) Subject: RE: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does is again! From: bobad Good "topical" message there, one not likely to be espoused by those who think that more guns is the solution -- I'm up with Tom's message. |
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29 Jan 11 - 09:57 AM (#3084649) Subject: RE: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does it again! From: Taconicus Well gee, what if no one had hands, nails, or teeth, and we were all roly-poly teletubbies living in a padded wall world with no beasties or sharp edges. Then we'd all be safe, by golly! Typical fat-headed simple-minded solution pontificating "folk song." |
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29 Jan 11 - 10:02 AM (#3084652) Subject: RE: Review: No Matter What--Paxton does it again! From: topical tom Class this one under "Songs That Need to be Sung".Who better to do so than Tom, who has "preached "this lesson for so many years. |
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29 Jan 11 - 11:07 AM (#3084693) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Desert Dancer Here it is with lyrics from Tom Paxton's web site. Perhaps a clone could just go ahead and delete the other lyric sets here... http://www.tompaxton.com/video_what_if.html WHAT IF, NO MATTER... By Tom Paxton What if, no matter how angry he was, How outraged he was, How furious he was, What if, no matter how angry he was, He couldn't lay hands on a gun, He couldn't lay hands on a gun? What if, no matter how right he was, How wrong they were, How evil they were, What if, no matter how right he was, He couldn't lay hands on a gun, He couldn't lay hands on a gun? No rifle, no pistol, No shotgun in sight, No revolver, automatic, No assault gun tonight, No clips crammed with bullets Anywhere to be found, No weapons just laying around? What if, no matter how outraged he was, How furious he was, How murderous he was, What if, no matter how outraged he was, He couldn't lay hands on a gun, He couldn't lay hands on a gun. If he dug through his pickup, The back seat, the trunk, The attic, the basement, And piles of old junk, And came up empty-handed, Again and again, Tell me, what would he do then? What if, no matter how angry he was, How outraged he was, How furious he was, What if, no matter how angry he was, He couldn't lay hands on a gun, He couldn't lay hands on a gun? ©2011 Pax Music, ASCAP |
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29 Jan 11 - 12:42 PM (#3084741) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: GUEST The first & only time I saw Tom Paxton performing live was in the Royal Albert Hall c1966. He was supporting The Dubliers who were at their height. I thought he was great then & I have not changed my mind since. By the way, the compere was the actor John Gregson (1919-1975) known to British & Irish audiences for the movie 'Rooney' & also the role of Commander Gideon, Scotland Yard. |
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29 Jan 11 - 12:46 PM (#3084743) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: GUEST,Gealt. re Albert Hall concert I forgot to add my moniker. I remain, Gealt. |
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30 Jan 11 - 12:22 AM (#3085062) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: GUEST If he couldn't lay hands on a gun, he'd probably use a guitar, like this guy: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/915829/Charge-is-filed-in-death-by-guitar-beating.html Maybe there should be a three-day waiting period and a background check for hopelessly clueless "folksingers" who want to buy a Martin, especially the Paxton signature model. |
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30 Jan 11 - 03:16 AM (#3085094) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: stallion I think Jeri and Taciwhatsit,that the message might be if weapons were harder to find the time searching might cool tempers, there will always be nutters but easy access makes people blase(?)about the things. It would be interesting to the stats on injuries a deaths due to accidental discharge and mistaken identities (humans for bears) whilst our family were farmers for years and reared animals for slaughter I have issues with killing things you can't eat for pleasure. I have a friend who's late father shot pheasants and gave them to us because he didn't like pheasant, on the other hand when the hunters were duck shooting on our land my father stopped them as soon as they had a bird each (before freezers and fridges....uk!)he claimed it was his larder, better live than dead. i remember a visiting canadian relative, also a farmer, telling us that his most important job on the farm was to paint in large letters C O W on the side of his beasts before the hunting season began! |
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30 Jan 11 - 05:14 AM (#3085123) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: DMcG This is all fanciful thinking. Even if guns were more difficult to get, he could lay hands on a pipe bomb, Molotov cocktail, or just drive a truck into the crowd. Guns could be flat-out illegal, and I think a determined wannabe mass murderer could still find one. That's true enough, but its not as straightforward as that. If the intention is merely mass murder, that argument holds. But there are lots of other circumstances where the emotional/psychological position of power over the each individual victim seems to have been important and those weapons don't do that. I'd put Columbine in that group, for example. |
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30 Jan 11 - 05:48 AM (#3085129) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: stallion excellent point |
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30 Jan 11 - 11:14 AM (#3085263) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Oremus [i]That's true enough, but its not as straightforward as that. If the intention is merely mass murder, that argument holds. But there are lots of other circumstances where the emotional/psychological position of power over the each individual victim seems to have been important and those weapons don't do that. I'd put Columbine in that group, for example.[/i] Armchair pop-psych aside, there are countless instances in which bombs of varying type have been used as the weapon of choice in assassinating specific individuals. |
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30 Jan 11 - 11:20 AM (#3085267) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: DMcG I quite agree, Oremus, but that's again a slightly different case. That's an attack against an individual, not a series of perhaps a dozen attacks against a dozen individuals by one person over a period of minutes, which is the pattern for Columbine/Dunblane/Port Arthur ... In any case, the song is, in my view, less about the mass murder cases, than individual acts between one or two people. |
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30 Jan 11 - 12:12 PM (#3085282) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Jeri Stalliwhatsit, my point is that it wasn't a spur-of-the-moment decision on the part of Loughner, nor of the Columbine shooters. These guys PLANNED. Loughner did research. They didn't just wake up one morning and think "Gee--I guess I'll kill some people today. Now, I KNOW I got a gun here somewhere..." They, HE, had the time to get a gun if he didn't just happen to have one in his back seat, and he had the time to make a bomb. |
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30 Jan 11 - 12:45 PM (#3085303) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Amos Jaysus, guys--c'mon! It is a rhetorical question driven under a poetic license!! It makes a clear, simple point. A |
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30 Jan 11 - 01:48 PM (#3085348) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Jeri Sorry Amos, poetic license only works for me when it doesn't look like someone had plowed his rhetorical question into the concrete abutment of reality. In short, it doesn't make sense to me. I understand it DOES make sense to others, and they can believe what their senses and brains lead them to believe. |
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30 Jan 11 - 01:55 PM (#3085350) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Lonesome EJ "He's still got an axe in the barn" might also work as a last line. Again, the issue is much more complicated than Paxton's song, but I give him credit for provoking discussion with it. |
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31 Jan 11 - 12:24 AM (#3085672) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: J-boy I'm not advocating the banning of guns but a 30 round magazine in a semi-auto Glock is very far from what our founding fathers could have even imagined. They lived in the age of flintlocks. Draw your own conclusions. |
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31 Jan 11 - 12:59 AM (#3085687) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: J-boy I'm a gun-owner for what it's worth. |
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31 Jan 11 - 02:58 AM (#3085709) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Ebbie Here is what he says about it: The Latest Song As I slowly became aware of the tragedy in Tucson, once again I felt a deep anger and disgust at the sheer senselessness of it all. Still, I thought, I'm not going to try to write anything about this because I'd probably just go incoherent. So, no song, I thought; then, a question kept coming up in my head––not for the first time––and I finally decided that it was a song unto itself, What If, No Matter ... Peace, Tom Paxton Alexandria, VA Jan 26, 2011 |
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31 Jan 11 - 10:56 AM (#3085897) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Newport Boy And it's a topic which Tom has always addressed - see his 1965 'Buy a gun for your son' on the Pete Seeger programme. |
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31 Jan 11 - 11:20 AM (#3085917) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Wesley S That's one of the great things about Tom Paxton. He can take an issue and boil it down to a 2 or 3 minute song that says volumes. That's why he's one of the greats. Thanks Tom. |
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31 Jan 11 - 11:31 AM (#3085923) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Lonesome EJ J-boy, I agree with you. I'm saying Paxton's song is less a brilliant summation and distillation of the gun control argument, and more an emotional reaction. But good music works primarily on an emotional level, and that's what generally stimulates reasonable discussion and action. On this topic, however, we in the US may be incapable of taking a reasonable approach. The argument generally breaks down between "you'll get my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead hands", and "guns are evil." |
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31 Jan 11 - 05:44 PM (#3086173) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Oremus "But good music works primarily on an emotional level, and that's what generally stimulates reasonable discussion and action." I think you have it exactly wrong. With subjects like gun rights, "reasonable discussion and action" can only happen by taking emotion OUT of the equation. Screeds such as Paxton spews in the song at hand tend to inflame rather than inform. Luckily, his audience is relatively small. |
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31 Jan 11 - 06:10 PM (#3086198) Subject: RE: What If, No Matter--Paxton does it again! From: Tattie Bogle Much as I love TP and his music, I don't think this is one of his best songs. "Buy a Gun for your Son" (slightly different context maybe) was much more powerful IMHO. There was an outcry in Scotland when some folk wrote songs after the Hamilton shootings at Dunblane. The only one that worked was Eric Bogle's "One Small Star" - which doesn't mention guns at all. |