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13 Jan 13 - 03:22 AM (#3465303) Subject: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Jack the Sailor Are they now Italian? |
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13 Jan 13 - 04:56 AM (#3465325) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: gnu I thought they were "US". Willys Jeep? |
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13 Jan 13 - 05:03 AM (#3465327) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: John MacKenzie The name Jeep derives from the initials GP, which stood for General Purpose. I believe they were American in origin, but not 100% sure. |
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13 Jan 13 - 05:04 AM (#3465328) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: MartinRyan Click here |
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13 Jan 13 - 07:26 AM (#3465377) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Charmion That Wikipedia article certainly covers the map, Martin. I learned to drive in a 1949 Willys "four by four" as it was known in the Canadian army. The word Jeep was too American for our taste. |
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13 Jan 13 - 07:34 AM (#3465380) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: kendall Anyone remember the cartoon character "Gerald the Jeep"? A strange little being in the Popeye cartoons. American Bantam came up with the first Jeep, but they were screwed out of the contract because it was feared that the company wasn't big enough to produce the number of vehicles that Uncle Sam needed. |
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13 Jan 13 - 08:42 AM (#3465414) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Rapparee You mean the Truck, Utility, 1/4 Ton, M---. When I first went in was the M38A1, by 1968 it was the M151 - made by Ford and subject to rolling over at the worst possible moment. You might use a "jeep" in the US military, but after that you took a "3/4" (refers to tonnage) or a "five quarter" (M715, 1.25 tons). For heavier loads there were "deuce and halfs" which were can "six bys" or "six by sixes" by the Marines (referring to six wheels getting drive traction) or "five tons" or "draggin' wagons" (10 tons). |
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13 Jan 13 - 09:03 AM (#3465422) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Bee-dubya-ell Jeeps have never been dependable enough to be German, but not quite undependable enough to be Italian. |
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13 Jan 13 - 09:09 AM (#3465427) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: GUEST,Lighter Eugene the Jeep. I remember him well - though only from later comic books. |
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13 Jan 13 - 09:18 AM (#3465430) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Bobert Thread drift: The Germans built Kueblewagens during WW II which were the early Volkswagens and designed by Dr. Ferdinand Porsche... They looked very much like the VW Thing... B~ |
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13 Jan 13 - 10:01 AM (#3465440) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: JohnInKansas Related to another thread, possibly the "doggiest" vehicle I ever drove was an M38A1 jeep. (The link to the other thread is that the second was a 1951 Plymouth Valiant.) The Army had started an "endurance test of a modified brake fluid" and about a third of the way through the test the M38A1, according to regulations**, was "required to be scrapped." The only way to keep it in the test was for me to "volunteer" to take it as an "administrative vehicle" in place of the Scout I had been assigned to share. I was somewhat reluctantly declared to be a volunteer. It required a rather exotic starting procedure, but never failed to start for me. It was incredibly reliable, in that despite my warnings to the dozen or so associates who asked to "borrow it to run up to the track" I could rely 100% on my expectation that NOBODY WOULD EVER DRIVE IT BACK, even after I'd explained the starting procedure required before letting them take it. (Only a couple of them actually walked back the 7.5 miles to the office. I usually had to hitch a ride to get them and it.) The shop refused to work on it, but out of curiosity I pulled the plugs and did a compression check once. MAXIMUM compression I could squeeze it up to was about 18 psi on one cylinder. The others were lower. Fortunately I only had to drive it for about 4 months. The others quit asking for the loan after about the first month, so I did have my own "private" vehicle for a while. ** Regulations at the time required that when the cost of parts replaced equalled the original cost of the vehicle the vehicle had to be scrapped. Now you have some idea of what kind of shape all those real "Army Surplus" ones you drooled over were likely to be in? John |
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13 Jan 13 - 10:01 AM (#3465441) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: number 6 The VW thing was a later version of the Kueblewagen ... unlike the Willy's jeep they were not a 4 x 4. The current Jeep is now just a brand under the Chrysler Corp, Fiat is another division within that family ... The Jeep as we remember it basically disappeared when Chrysler took over AMC, the CJ turned into the TJ, YJ or whatever they became, even though they still have retained that AMC straight inline 6. I have had 2 CJ's in the past and fondly remember them. They were extremely easy to work on and the bodies could take a beating. The carbs sucked on them, but then again easy to repair and replace. biLL |
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13 Jan 13 - 12:18 PM (#3465493) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Ebbie Nah. They were never German cars. We would be calling them 'Yeeps'. :) |
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13 Jan 13 - 12:32 PM (#3465501) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Bobert If I am not mistaken the Jeeps used in WW II were made by Willis... No??? B~ |
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13 Jan 13 - 01:16 PM (#3465524) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: number 6 Willys ... or Willys-Overland Motors ... and it was American. biLL |
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13 Jan 13 - 01:20 PM (#3465526) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: pdq The name Jeep is a protected trademark owned by Chrysler. It definitely came from the Popeye comic book and cartoon character which debuted in 1936. "A Jeep is an animal living in a three dimensional world—in this case our world—but really belonging to a fourth dimensional world. Here's what happened. A number of Jeep life cells were somehow forced through the dimensional barrier into our world. They combined at a favorable time with free life cells of the African Hooey Hound. The electrical vibrations of the Hooey Hound cell and the foreign cell were the same. They were kindred cells. In fact, all things are, to some extent, relative, whether they be of this or some other world, now you see. The extremely favorable conditions of germination in Africa caused a fusion of these life cells. So the uniting of kindred cells caused a transmutation. The result, a mysterious strange animal." |
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13 Jan 13 - 01:21 PM (#3465527) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: number 6 Willys in Toledo Ohio ... I remember driving through Toledo on the freeway seeing the big smoke stack at the factory with Willys painted on it. biLL |
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13 Jan 13 - 01:51 PM (#3465541) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: pdq Cast of characters from Popeye comic strip, late 1930s: including Jeep |
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13 Jan 13 - 02:33 PM (#3465554) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Don Firth Cross-posted, but I'll post it anyway. ====== Eugene the Jeep was a little character in the "Popeye" comic strip way back in the late Thirties and Forties. I think most people were under the impression that American soldiers called the rough-riding vehicle a "jeep," after the little critter, for purely whimsical reasons, then learned that it was derived from "GP" for "general purpose vehicle." The jeep (vehicle) was legendary for being bouncy and rough, but that was probably because of its relatively short wheel-base and the fact that it was often driven off-road over rough terrain. There were lots of cartoons about the vehicle during World War II. Probably most famously, Bill Mauldin's cartoon about an old time cavalry office dealing with a broken front axle. BANG!! Don Firth |
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13 Jan 13 - 02:40 PM (#3465559) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Don Firth Before someone jumps my case, let me correct my own boo-boo: He's a non-commissioned office. Looks like Master Seargeant as far as I can tell. Don Firth |
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13 Jan 13 - 03:18 PM (#3465570) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: kendall Eugene the Jeep is right. |
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13 Jan 13 - 03:25 PM (#3465574) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: pdq American Bantam version: BRC (Bantam Reconnaissance Vehicle) Willys-Overland version: MA (Military and Model "A"), later improved version was MB Ford Motor Company version: GPW NOTE: nobody called it the GP. All the others mentioned are internal designations anyway. It was formally the Truck, 1/4 ton, 4x4 according to the military. The name Jeep was given to it by soldiers and came from the Popeye comic character. |
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13 Jan 13 - 04:02 PM (#3465598) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: ChanteyLass Perhaps the thread title question comes from the fact that during World Wars I and II Heinie (short for Heinrich) was used to mock Germans, and US soldiers during WW II referred to Volkswagens as Heinie Jeeps. |
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13 Jan 13 - 04:07 PM (#3465601) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: JohnInKansas The last incarnation of the military jeep in widespread use was probably the M38A1 or possibly M38A3(?), which had solid axles, three speed tranny with a two speed transfer box. Excellent ability to get through rough stuff, but pretty mediocre on a decent road. ca. 1965 when I had my love afair with the M38 beast (see above) the "replacement" M151 was being phased in. The M151 was made by Ford, with four wheel independent suspension, four speed gearbox, and no transfer case. The elimination of the need to swap back and forth in the transfer case, and the independent suspension, made the M151 a more fun (i.e. didn't shock your kidneys quite as much) but eliminating the transfer box, in the opinion of most of the test drivers, made it a little less able in the rough stuff. On a good road, the M151 was a better ride, faster and more responsive than the M38, and agile enough ... ... ... to flip you into a ditch even better than an early Corvair. (But maybe that impression was just because it was new and people weren't used to it ...?) The troops still called it a jeep, even at the risk of the (DRM?) lawsuits. That name has probably faded (tarnished?) some since, simply because the US military uses so many kinds of specialized/different vehicles that all look a lot alike that one has to be pretty specific, so the Model Numbers or individualized nicknames (NATO names?) are more used - at least by those I've talked to since. John |
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13 Jan 13 - 04:20 PM (#3465613) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Jack the Sailor The thread title comes from the fact that a few years ago Daimler owned Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep. Now Fiat does. |
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13 Jan 13 - 05:15 PM (#3465639) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: number 6 I guess in retrospect, the Jeep was a German vehicle for a rather short period of time (in it's history) ... as of now they are an Italian vehicle ... and about the same crappy quality of a Fiat 500. biLL |
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13 Jan 13 - 08:28 PM (#3465733) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: MarkS Rap "When I first went in was the M38A1, by 1968 it was the M151 - made by Ford and subject to rolling over at the worst possible moment" Right on Been there, done that, got the scars. Also busted the windshield of one of these with my head after being thrown forward following hitting a rut. Fortunately I was wearing a steel helmet at the time. Say, maybe that explains a lot of my later in life stuff!! Mark |
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13 Jan 13 - 08:40 PM (#3465740) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: gnu "and about the same crappy quality" Yeah. No auto tranny, no AC... not even a cover over the gas cap! Yet Yuppies still pay FAR more for a Jeep than they are worth and I'll bet half of them never see an alder. |
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13 Jan 13 - 08:48 PM (#3465747) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Bee-dubya-ell I got the Daimler/Fiat allusion. But I don't think the "nationality" of a car is determined by the nationality of the parent corporation. Were Volvos American cars when Ford owned the company? And are they Chinese now? Nah! They're Swedish, have always been Swedish, and will remain Swedish unless their Chinese parent company chooses to close the Swedish plant(s) and move 100% of production elsewhere. Conversely, "nationality" is also not determined by the actual place of manufacture. A KIA made in Lagrange, Georgia or a Hyundai made in Montgomery, Alabama is still a Korean car, not an American car. For the last couple of years the original Volkswagen Beetle was in production, they were all made in Mexico. Not a one was made in Germany, but they were still German cars, not Mexican. |
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13 Jan 13 - 09:26 PM (#3465758) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Jack the Sailor Well BWL that is a legit opinion. But I never got used to German men being introduced on TV as "The President of Chrysler." Certainly Jeeps became slightly more German and Volvos more American as technologies and management ideas were shared. |
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13 Jan 13 - 10:19 PM (#3465767) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Bee-dubya-ell The idea that some of Daimler's engineering excellence would rub off on Chrysler was touted as being one of the big advantages of the merger. But I don't think it really panned out. There's only so much that goes into a $60,000 car that can be applied to a $20,000 car and still have it be a $20,000 car. The engineers who design and build Jeep Liberties may have a thorough understanding of how Mercedes G-Class SUVs are built, but that knowledge doesn't do them much good if their job is to build Jeeps that sell for Jeep prices, not Mercedes prices. |
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14 Jan 13 - 02:49 AM (#3465792) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Jack the Sailor I saw some news coverage on how they built Crossfires with Mercedes designed drive trains and suspensions. They reportedly modernized manufacturing methods and managements. But I guess that could have just been a culture change. High end Chryslers and Jeeps are not cheap. I think they could have been made competitively. The problem I see is are the Chrysler Dodge and Jeep brands. "Jeeps that sell for Jeep prices, not Mercedes prices. " According to this article. There is one such Car. "Despite the fact it had been nearly four years after the Daimler/Chrysler split, the fourth-generation Jeep Grand Cherokee shares a platform with the Mercedes-Benz M-Class .[9]" So I guess that the answer to my OP id that one model of Jeep is still German, partly. |
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14 Jan 13 - 09:24 AM (#3465899) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: number 6 The Mercedes-Benz M-Class first generation which was produced and launched during the Chrysler era was an over priced, substandard Mercedes ... in fact I think it was even built in Alabama ... anyway the quality and standards of the latest M-Class (non Chrysler) has improved significantly. biLL |
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14 Jan 13 - 02:49 PM (#3466041) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Catherine Jayne We have a 1955 Willys Jeep, still in working order. |
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14 Jan 13 - 03:05 PM (#3466048) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Little Hawk The Jeep is American in origin. The Germans used the Kubelwagen (as Bobert noted earlier...it closely resembled the Volkswagen "Thing"...but sometimes was mounted with a flexible machine gun). It's sort of similar to a jeep in concept. And the Germans also used the early Volkswagen bug as a personnel car for chaufferring officers around. There were numerous French and German civilian autos used for the latter purpose, often repainted in military colours and insignia. |
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14 Jan 13 - 03:48 PM (#3466063) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Jack the Sailor A fun vw-kubelwagen article It seems that that car, the Type 82 version, was partly American. " And it received a more substantial body, which was built by Ambi-Budd, an American-owned company." |
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14 Jan 13 - 04:06 PM (#3466068) Subject: RE: BS: Were Jeeps German cars? From: Little Hawk Great article! And I forgot about the Schwimmwagen, Germany's amphibious VW. It was a real masterpiece of innovative design. My father told me that he and the rest of his tank crew got hold of one at the end of the war and drove it around for the afternoon, taking it directly across a local river and back again. They were well impressed with its abilities, and hoped to use it to charm the local girls (the main thing on their minds at the time). |
