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07 Mar 13 - 09:00 AM (#3487496) Subject: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Muttley Desperate to find the chords to this one - can anyone help If so just a verse and a chorus with the chords placed where the changes occur, please ie: [A]xxxx xxxxx xxxx[D] xxxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxxx [G] etc |
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07 Mar 13 - 09:59 AM (#3487522) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 Perhaps this will help someone who reads notation. #################################3 Traditional Written by Robert Tannahill (1774-1810), a Paisley weaver. Balquhidder is part of MacGregor lands near Loch Lomond. Rob Roy's grave lies in the churchyard there. Let us go, lassie go tae the braes o' Balquhidder Where the blaeberries grow 'mang the bonnie Highland heather Where the deer and the roe lightly bounding together Sport the lang summer day 'mang the braes o' Balquhidder I will twine thee a bower by the clear siller fountain, And I'll cover it o'er wi' the flowers o' the mountain; I will range through the wilds and the deep glens sae dreary, And return wi' the spoils tae the bower o' my dearie. When the rude wintry win' idly raves round our dwelling, And the roar of the linn on the night-breeze is swelling; Sae merrily we'll sing as the storm rattles o'er us, Till the dear shieling rings wi' the light lilting chorus. Now the summer's in prime, wi' the flowers richly blooming, And the wild mountain thyme a' the moorlands perfuming; To our dear native scenes let us journey together, Where glad innocence reigns 'mang the braes o' Balquhidder. Glossary a': all blaeberries: blueberries brae: hill bonnie: beautiful bower: leafy shelter linn: waterfall 'mang: among o': of o'er: over sae: so siller: silver shieling: hut tae: to wi': with win': wind The above lyrics are from http://www.darachweb.net/SongLyrics/BraesOBalquhidder.html |
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07 Mar 13 - 10:07 AM (#3487523) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,leeneia 1. Look at this web page. Does this look like it? http://www.folktunefinder.com/tune/71663/ 2. If you are doing the chords, who's doing the melody? I ask because most instruments could play this, but most singers would find it too high. 3. See the third note of the song, which is on the middle line? That's a B. Wherever a measure is mostly B, play a Bm. The second space from the bottom is an A. Wherever a measure is mostly A, play a D chord. Those two chords will get you through almost all of the song. There's one funny bit, but before we work on it, get back to us. |
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07 Mar 13 - 10:07 AM (#3487524) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 Tannahill Weavers' version on YouTube. |
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07 Mar 13 - 12:07 PM (#3487571) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,leeneia Thanks, 999. I enjoyed the song. The version I mentioned and the Tannahill Weavers' tune are just different enough to make things difficult. |
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07 Mar 13 - 12:39 PM (#3487580) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 Ain't that the truth, Leeneia. They are using runs to get from one main chord to another. Makes it a bear to get the chords as they have done them w/o having a guitar in standard tuning. I certainly see similarities between this and McPeake's 'Go, Lassie, Go' but not enough in the melody to give the chords from memory. However, I'm sure someone will be along . . . |
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07 Mar 13 - 12:50 PM (#3487585) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Ignore the Tannahill Weaver's version as it strays away from the melody in the second part of the tune, (I don't think the singer had the range). In all the old, Victorian, printed versions of this melody it is written in D major and finishes on the 3rd, i.e. F#. If you play in this key, just switch between D and G and the "funny" bit I suspect is the second half of the penultimate bar where a G minor fits .. it does on the piano. |
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07 Mar 13 - 05:33 PM (#3487714) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Muttley Thanks guys - however if you could include the required chords WITH the lyrics it would be easier; my ABI makes it difficult to work out what chords are required even when I know a song is played in a specific key. I just can't equate which chords go where anymore - I can play them when I know them - I just can't work out what and where they're supposed to be |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:22 PM (#3487749) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 I need a version to listen to and I think I could help with that. |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:31 PM (#3487754) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 My apologies, Muttley. Just found out what ABI means. If I could hear the song you want chords for I will do my best to get that done for you. |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:36 PM (#3487757) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jeri Here's a YouTube of the Tannahill Weavers doing it |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:38 PM (#3487759) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jeri Of course, 9, you can probably figure out where to put Jim's chords after listening to the YouTube of the T-Weavers with the strayed melody... |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:42 PM (#3487760) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 Jeri, I linked to the TW's version already. If that's the version Muttley wants I'll get the chords posted before 5:00 pm GMT tomorrow. |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:46 PM (#3487763) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jeri sorry |
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07 Mar 13 - 07:52 PM (#3487768) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,999 S'ok, Jeri. I need to know whether that would be ok for Muttley. |
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08 Mar 13 - 04:14 AM (#3487882) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Guest, 999, The Tannahill Weavers don't stick to the traditional tune due, I think, to the singer not being able to reach the full range of the song. I will look on line for a "correct" trad version .... I have lots on LP. By the way, I should have said Eminor for the second half of the penultimate verse, not Gm, assuming the key of D major has been chosen. |
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08 Mar 13 - 04:24 AM (#3487884) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Alma Gluck This is the very first recording of the Braes, although the pronunciation should be ignored! The tune has been consistently sung this way from about 1807 to the present day as this was how it was printed. The bass line was, say in the key of Dmajor, just a D chord drone more or less all the time. PS in 2008 I did a MSc on this very tune and its roots. It wasn't the tune Tannahill originally chose but it was the version printed hence its take up. |
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08 Mar 13 - 04:33 AM (#3487886) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Please, oh please, don't sing/copy the Tannahill Weavers version as I noticed someone else on YouTube doing. This is how traditional melodies are corrupted and copied by singers who think they'e are singing the original and mistakes are perpetuated. I don't recommend the 'bel canto' style of Alma Gluck but the melody is correct and, to my ears anyway, more melodic than the sort of whining, slipping in and out of the original tune. |
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08 Mar 13 - 10:48 AM (#3488044) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,leeneia Hi, Jim. Thanks for the link to the recording by Alma Gluck. I've heard her name for many years, and now I know how she sounded. I compared her singing to the notes on my piano keyboard, and she is indeed singing it in the key of D, and her high note is the F# at the top of the staff, a note we mere mortals probably never sing. I suspect the tune was not written to be sung to; it was a dance tune and somebody borrowed it way back when. |
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08 Mar 13 - 12:41 PM (#3488095) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jeri On the Tannahill Weavers' version: I suspect the chords work. That's all Muttley wanted. On Alma Gluck's version: I can hit that note, but the paint starts coming off the ceiling. Move it an octave down, and it's easy as pie. It doesn't sound like a dance tune to me, although I can hear it as a march. |
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08 Mar 13 - 02:52 PM (#3488148) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Hi Jeri/Leeneia, it was originally a dance tune but was used by Burns and others before it was set to Tannahill's lyrics. I know a few 'folkies' who sing to this tune, in fact Norman Buchanan reproduced this in his wee red book of 101 Scottish songs, used by many in the Scottish folk scene for info. |
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08 Mar 13 - 03:35 PM (#3488157) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jeri Thanks! Glad to learn something I didn't know before. I don't know this song, but I can remember doing a midi of it from sheet music. ...and later... The lyrics and dots are in the DT. (No chords.) |
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08 Mar 13 - 07:48 PM (#3488238) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Tattie Bogle Thanks for the link, Jeri. After all this discussion about chords and accompaniment, could I just whisper that most times I have heard it, it has been sung a capella, and it's very nice all on its own! |
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09 Mar 13 - 03:50 AM (#3488298) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean The words in the DT are not Tannahill's but a mixture of his poem and other verses from a different song. |
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13 Dec 13 - 06:53 AM (#3583800) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,Muttley Sorry folks - been on the go a lot, last few months. Apart from a family bereavement we've had a few 'hassles'! As well, my ABI, tends to "fold time" so to speak, in that, something I think I have told myself to do, 'drops out' and resurfaces a day or so later in the mental inbox only for me to find that the 'day or so, is actually 6 months or so! Short Term memory Loss is a bitch! I believe the version I have been listening to is sung by ?Les Wilson?? I really appreciate your help, so if you can work out the chords and place them for me, I'd appreciate it: I tend to transcript my songs thus: (Wild Mountain Thyme) G C G O the summer time has come C G And the trees are sweetly bloomin' |
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13 Dec 13 - 10:47 AM (#3583811) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Bill D Even though Muttley and others have mostly dealt with what they need, I remember that I... and Jim McLean... posted about this song in an older thread: http://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=3417 that started in 1999 and continued off & on till 2007. You must read carefully to figure out exactly which words and especially which TUNES are 'original' and which are sung by whom. In that older thread, Jim notes: "Did you compare the air sung by McDonald to that printed in your scan? They are entirely different as I posted previously. McDonald sings McPeake." This is 'almost' the case.... but John McDonald uses a slightly different tune than the one the McPeakes made popular for "Wild Mountain Thyme". McDonald's tune is a bit harder to carry and though pretty, is repetitive, since he doesn't do it with a chorus added. The McPeakes, I feel, made that basic tune more 'singable', though I prefer McDonald's for Braes o Balquhidder. Now... I recently got a machine that will play an LP and convert it to MP3s, and I shall endeavor to create an MP3 version of the LP...in the relatively near future...(like after Xmas..or January?)... and make Braes o Balquhidder available to those who'd like to hear the Topic records version. If I get distracted & forget, PM me or refresh this, though I WILL put the LP in plain sight to jog my memory. |
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13 Dec 13 - 02:20 PM (#3583862) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean McDonald definitely uses the McPeake tune and no chorus melody as Bill D says. It is not The Three Carles o Buchanan as noted by Hamish Henderson nor is is the "standard", tune printed in Johnson's museum and ever after. |
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13 Dec 13 - 02:40 PM (#3583864) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean The Braes o Balquhidder Here's a link to John McDonald's version. It is number 8. |
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13 Dec 13 - 03:20 PM (#3583870) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,jim bainbridge Original version??-how do you find that 200 years after it was written? Tim Lyons did a lovely version about 20 years ago on a cassette - he credited Bess Cronin of Macroom, Co Cork as his source- it got about, that song |
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13 Dec 13 - 05:02 PM (#3583895) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Bill D well, thanks, Jim McLean. I looked all over for a possible link to the tune, and didn't find that one...and when I first loaded the page in one browser, it didn't show the play buttons. I had to go to a different browser (Palemoon, a Firefox clone)and "allow scripts" that were disabled by default. They sure go to a lot of trouble to protect a 15 second clip! Ah well, it's good that I don't have to rip that LP immediately... but I will anyway for my own benefit, and if anyone wants tunes or info on other tracks, I'll try to help. |
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13 Dec 13 - 06:04 PM (#3583905) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Jim Bainbridge, in this case it's easy to define the original version. Tannahill printed his lyrics before he died in 1810. It was reprinted a few times after that but his friend R A Smith set it to the tune recorded by Elma Gluck and recorded many times later ... it is the tune in Johnson's Musical Museum and in Norman Buchan's wee red book so the original version is there for all to see. When I was researching Tannahill's poem/song about 10 years ago I looked at Elizabeth Cronin's version in a book in the British library but it was a hybrid version .... many appeared in the early 19th century onwards as Tannahill's song was conflated with Northern Irishman Hugh McWilliam's "Lass among the heather". many versions were collected in the North East of Scotland under the title of "The fair of Ballymena", a mixter maxter of Tannahill, McWilliams and Trad. Some well know Traditional singers sometimes called their version the Braes o Balquhidder hence so much confusion. |
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13 Dec 13 - 10:27 PM (#3583943) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,leeneia Hello, Muttley. I tried to figure this out, but it's just too compicated. There are different versions of the song, and I don't know which version you know. The MIDI version in the Digital Tradition is screwy, changing from 2/4 to 3/4 in a most unlikely way. It's basically the same thing Alma Gluck is singing (see mentions of her above), but that tune changes chords on almost every beat. It is not guitar friendly. Can you find a new song to perform? ======== Jim, what's a mixter maxter? |
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14 Dec 13 - 03:31 PM (#3584127) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Leeneia, it means a hotchpotch , a hybrid, as in Jeannie Robertson's version which has one verse of McWilliams and one verse of Tannahill, and some of the Ballamena versions in Grieg Duncan. As far as chords go, if it is played in D major, then just switching between D major and E minor (G's relative) works. Where to use them should be obvious to a guitar/singer using his/her ear. |
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14 Dec 13 - 05:21 PM (#3584151) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean By the way, Leeneia, those three four bars in the Digital Traditional are wrong. There should be semi quavers and dotted quavers instead of a quaver followed by a dotted crotchet. All bars are two four. This is based on very printed version of the tune since 1824. |
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23 Dec 13 - 08:01 PM (#3586157) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Muttley Guys I don't wish to be rude but this discussiobn is starting to look like a printed version of a social work meeting. I appreciate the 'different versions' arguments, but as I posted - the Les Wilson version is the one with which I am familiar. It's on You Tube. If someone who still HAS the ability to listen to a song being sung and work out the chords could please do so to this version, writing them down (one verse should do as I believe they're all sung the same way?) in the manner I've already outlined: ie " I tend to transcript my songs thus: (Wild Mountain Thyme) G C G O the summer time has come C G And the trees are sweetly bloomin'" Thank you all for your comments thus far |
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24 Dec 13 - 06:59 PM (#3586392) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Tattie Bogle Nice version by Geordie McIntyre and Alison McMorland on YouTube (unaccompanied!) in the fairly recent release of various Scottish singers performing songs from the Greig-Duncan collection. You can also find it by Googling Greig-Duncan collection. It is hosted on the Edinburgh University website. |
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25 Dec 13 - 04:19 AM (#3586487) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Geordie told me (years ago) he got the melody from Andrew Tannahill who was a great-great grandson of Robert Tannahill. He said that Andrew Tannahill chanted the tune to him, ".... if you can class a half spoken rendition as a chant. I've been singing it for so long it may be be that I have modified it". I think therefor that his melody owes much to his inventiveness rather than tradition. I agree, however, it is a beautiful version they sing. |
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25 Dec 13 - 04:31 AM (#3586492) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean PS Muttley, I have tried to find Les Wilson on YouTube singing this but can't find him. Have you a link to it? |
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25 Dec 13 - 01:58 PM (#3586582) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Tattie Bogle Me neither. (Les Wilson) Might depend on how the YouTube clip is titled however! |
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26 Dec 13 - 08:47 AM (#3586705) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,jim bainbridge Jim McLean- think what I was trying to say was that discussion of what is an 'original version' of anything in the tradition is just daft, as well as sterile. Let's accept that Mr Tannahill did produce a printed copy in 1810, and also that many of the consequent versions('hybrid' or not!) are excellent, and may be even better than the alleged original... However, there is no guarantee at this distance that Tannahill was not, at worst, plagiarising a traditional song heard in the street just as Len Graham says WB Yeats probably did when he 'wrote' the 'Sally Gardens'. They have no shame these poets- look at the way the great Rabbie Burns ripped off (and claimed!) traditional material! Why should Tannahill be any different? Think what you mean is that Tannahill produced the firsrt printed version, but that is not necessarily the 'original'. We should be very grateful to Tannahill for what he did, but in a traditional context, surely a search for the 'original' is pointless- what price the 'folk process? Maybe this discussion should return to its original theme? |
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26 Dec 13 - 10:26 AM (#3586733) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Jim Bainbridge, As far as this song by Tannahill is concerned, we are not talking about the tradition. Tannahill was a nineteenth centuary published poet. He wrote a poem which he set to the tune The Three Carles o' Buchannan. About ten years after he died his friend R A Smith set it to another tune, a well know traditional version of a dance tune called The Braes o' Balquhidder. Burns was different in that if you read his letters and notes to his songs he makes it clear that he was mainly rescuing old tunes and fragments of verses. There was no question of claiming traditional material was his own ... quite the contrary. The "folk traditional" as far as Tannahill's original lyrics is concerned is that travellers like Jeannie Roberston conflated a poem by Hugh McWilliams, another published nineteenth centuary poet, with Tannahill's hence the many hybrid versions which occur from works by two non traditional poets who were writing in the nineteenth centuary. I am still looking for Muttley's/Les Wilson's version to help with the chords. |
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28 Dec 13 - 08:28 AM (#3587096) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST Jim McLean- my last word is that we ARE talking about the tradition- the poem/song in question has BECOME part of the tradition in its many variants, and we are all the richer for that! You cannot possibly know for sure that Tannahill's 'original' (your word) poem was totally his own- I am not impugning the quality of his work, nor that of Burns, but at a distance of 200 years, it is not reasonable to claim accept there is any way we can KNOW that this particular work is 'original' on your terms. It doesn't matter a damn anyway, splitting hairs comes to mind, and really, can we just accept that it has been a real asset to the 'tradition', also that it's a bloody good song/poem? |
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28 Dec 13 - 12:47 PM (#3587138) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Tattie Bogle The Les Wilson mystery is solved, I think: he was the vocalist, bouzouki and keyboard player, on the Tannahill Weavers' version on their 1994 CD Capernaum, so we're back to that one and last March! |
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28 Dec 13 - 01:05 PM (#3587142) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Tattie Bogle Have now compared the various versions linked to on this thread: the notation posted by Guest 99 on 7th March is pretty much exactly as in the Youtube of Alma Gluck singing it: the are various was you could chord it, from a straight "3-chord trick" - D G and A, or add a few minors in places, Bm or Bm7, Em for a bit more interest. The Tannahill Weavers (Les Wilson) have strayed quite a long way from that tune, and the McMorland/McIntyre version is entirely different. I'm guessing Muttley is after chords for the Tannies' version, as we now know who Les Wilson is! |
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28 Dec 13 - 01:07 PM (#3587145) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Jim McLean Guest, I assume you are Jim Bainbridge, I think we had better just to agree to differ on this one. Tattie Bogle, Muttley must be be thinking of the Tannahill Weavers' version. I transcribed it a few years back when I was doing my Scottish Erhnology degree so I'll look at it again re chords. |
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28 Dec 13 - 06:26 PM (#3587209) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: Tattie Bogle Thanks Jim: I might do something for the other versions as I like both of them (and I think my vocal range can just about stretch too!) |
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01 Nov 14 - 09:24 AM (#3673597) Subject: RE: Chord Req: Braes o Balquhidder From: GUEST,Les Wilson Just found this. I played the song using open G tuning with a capo on fairly high. Remember that all Tannahill Weaver songs are a semitone higher to accommodate the pipes. |