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02 Nov 13 - 11:04 AM (#3572208) Subject: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,FloraG I'm feeling that mudcat is becoming a palce to advertise commercial events rather than have discussions of interest. OK - some events are of interest - a one off perhaps- but most people know the local folk club and follow their favourite performers in other ways. FloraG |
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02 Nov 13 - 11:08 AM (#3572209) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Willie-O What makes you so sure of this? |
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02 Nov 13 - 11:55 AM (#3572215) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,John Foxen Calling a folk club a commercial event seems a bit of a contradiction in terms. Organisers who take a salary for running one must be few and far between. Most of us often end up dipping into our own pockets to keep them going. And while local people may follow their local club newcomers to the area might want to find out what's going on where. For example, did you know, FloraG, that my club HaverFolk is hosting the wonderful Vicki Swan and Jonny Dyer on Wednesday November 27? I hope you find that interesting |
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02 Nov 13 - 12:38 PM (#3572229) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,Stim Some of us wouldn't know anything about what was going on in the folk music world if it wasn't for what's posted here, FloraG. I couldn't even begin to make a list of all the wonderful folk artists that I've learned about because someone took the trouble to mention that they were playing somewhere, or that they'd released a new album, or that there was a clip of them on YouTube. And of course, these postings often remind me that artists that I like are still out there and making music, even when they are, say, in Alaska, which is ten thousand miles away, and which wouldn't hear about otherwise. I suspect that it helpful for those who schedule their local clubs to know who is out and performing, as well. As to the part about having more discussion, all you have to do is start a thread..,oh, wait, you did;-) |
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02 Nov 13 - 01:08 PM (#3572235) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Richard Bridge I find the information here about who is folking what where most useful. I'd like to see more collated info about what is on where, by region, not least in that I keep thinking about going to Haverfolk but I never know when the sinarounds (which is what I'd like to go for) are on. |
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02 Nov 13 - 01:38 PM (#3572242) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Vic Smith Richard Bridge wrote:- "the sinarounds (which is what I'd like to go for)" Would Richard like to tell us which particular sins he would like to indulge in, in his friendly circle, bearing in mind, that this is a public forum and minors may be taking a peek. |
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02 Nov 13 - 02:06 PM (#3572245) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,John Foxen We were planning singarounds at HaverFolk for the next three Wednesdays (November 6, 13 and 20) but Richard's suggestion sounds much more interesting. |
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02 Nov 13 - 02:16 PM (#3572248) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Phil Edwards Don't know what you're on about - can't see the appeal myself. I mean, you don't tend to get much Avarice among folkies, or Wrath (although there was that time when a fight broke out in the corridor...). Pride and Envy are far from unknown, it's true, as is Sloth - and I've been guilty of Gluttony myself (there's just something about sandwiches cut into triangles). I think that's the full list, unless there's one that's slipped my mind... |
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02 Nov 13 - 02:40 PM (#3572251) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: alex s Referring to me, GuestFloraG? I "advertise" (ie inform) here because I can reach people who may not check our website regularly or indeed at all. It would be a shame for them to miss someone they'd like to see and I can't afford to advertise in newspapers as we are a non-profitmaking club. I expect the same goes for many other organisers too. |
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02 Nov 13 - 03:02 PM (#3572257) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,Brian Peters Yep, bring on more slanging matches! I would think that the 'Events Grapevine' role of Mudcat brings more people to, say, the ballad discussions. |
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02 Nov 13 - 03:03 PM (#3572258) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: WindhoverWeaver You missed one, Phil: Lust. Of course there is always plenty of that at folk clubs, though mostly in the songs, I'm afraid (or am I missing something????). |
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02 Nov 13 - 05:32 PM (#3572282) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Steve Gardham A free-for-all forum like this is open to all and sundry so the odd advert is bound to turn up. I occasionally use the forum for this myself and often an advert can turn into a discussion. Many thread titles either have prefixes or are obvious as to content so you can avoid the ones you don't want. I also enjoy the discussions I feel I can contribute to but I wouldn't want to burden a Mudelf with the task of sifting out all the ads. You can only have as many discussion threads as people want to put on! If there were more discussion threads the ads would soon fall off the end. |
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02 Nov 13 - 08:35 PM (#3572320) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,Gerry All the important topics (what is folk music? what did Ewan MacColl do during the war? who put the bop in the bop-shebop-shebop?) have already been discussed to death, so we are reduced to reading each others' advertisements. |
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02 Nov 13 - 08:56 PM (#3572327) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: JohnInKansas I would have thought that the frequent displays of GAS here were a suffient overt display of LUST to suggest that it's amply displayed. If that's the case, we seem to cover all the bases(?). John |
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03 Nov 13 - 12:18 AM (#3572357) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Joe Offer In general, I appreciate the gig announcements. I've learned a lot about performers and venues in the process of reading them. We have PermaThreads* for performers and venues that post often - but they don't always get used. I do find it tedious where there are three or more threads advertising the same performance, or when people go overboard in self-promotion. I wonder if some people don't understand that they can bring an older thread back to life by retrieving it with the Filter on our Forum Menu, and then simply posting a message with the word "refresh" in the text box if they have nothing new to say. Our threads are active on the Forum Menu for 24 hours after the most recent post - but they can always be refreshed for additional 24-hour periods. -Joe Offer, Mudcat Archivist- *If you need an edited PermaThread for recurring announcements or special projects, contact me by personal message or joe@mudcat.org |
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03 Nov 13 - 05:06 AM (#3572392) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Richard Bridge Thank you John Foxen |
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03 Nov 13 - 05:18 AM (#3572397) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Will Fly I like the Shameless Promotion and similar threads on Mudcat - nice to get a bit of an oversight of who and what's going on - even if it may be a partial view. |
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03 Nov 13 - 06:22 AM (#3572410) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: alex s Right on, Will |
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03 Nov 13 - 07:19 AM (#3572421) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,John from Kemsing I would have thought that the "Who`s Performing Where" thread is the obvious place to inform readers of events and venues leaving the rest for search, music info, discussion, etc. |
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03 Nov 13 - 07:47 AM (#3572426) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST Snap-shot: 25% of postings 'who's/what's on'. Is that too many????? Suppose it depends what you're looking for. Rog |
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03 Nov 13 - 07:53 AM (#3572429) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: artbrooks To me, "concert in Paulsbo on November 15th" is more useful than sifting through a long Permathread called "Who's Performing Where". BTW, has anyone heard from the OP, or is this another 'start a fight' troll thread? |
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03 Nov 13 - 08:49 AM (#3572441) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Richard Bridge FloraG is known, at least in parts of South-East England, and a reasonably frequent guest. |
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03 Nov 13 - 02:26 PM (#3572504) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: ChanteyLass Does this thread belong below the line? |
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03 Nov 13 - 03:16 PM (#3572519) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,FloraG Since following Mudcat it semed to me that the number of adverts had increased - and some with very long time perspectives. My concern was that if this trend continues that might be all this discussion forum becomes. FloraG |
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03 Nov 13 - 03:46 PM (#3572526) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Joe Offer The "What's On (Who's Performing Where)" Permathread was a good idea, but it proved to be a lot of work to maintain it. I've tried to find volunteers to keep it going, but all of the volunteers lost heart within short order. I clean out old messages from the thread every now and then, but I would rather spend my time on song research. The PermaThreads for individual performers and venues seem to work best, as long as there's somebody to maintain them. One problem with PermaThreads, is that the editors don't have the ability to alter the thread title to fit the upcoming event. -Joe- ChanteyLass, this thread could go below the line, but threads discussing ideas for changes at Mudcat, usually go up top. It's discussing adverts for music events, after all. |
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03 Nov 13 - 03:49 PM (#3572527) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST if this trend continues that might be all this discussion forum becomes And? I don't believe that you have any stake in this place any more than I do. It becomes what it becomes. Shut up |
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03 Nov 13 - 03:50 PM (#3572528) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Charmion This is the Internet, not a corkboard outside the village hall, so there's room for the adverts as well as any God's quantity of discussion threads. If you would like to see more discussions, Flora, you're free to start some whenever you'd like. |
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03 Nov 13 - 03:54 PM (#3572531) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Jeri The presence of one thing doesn't mean other things can't exist here. I like that people post about events in their area. Festivals, concerts, singarounds, recordings and people coming together because of those things is a big reason Mudcat is here. I have to skip over the UK events because it's not likely I'll get to any, but I think it's great they're publicized here. If you have ideas you'd like to see discussed here, please start threads. Forcing ANYTHING doesn't make for a good environment. |
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03 Nov 13 - 03:56 PM (#3572533) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Mo the caller Nameless guests are not allowed to tell named guests/members to shut up. |
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03 Nov 13 - 06:37 PM (#3572568) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,Ed Nameless guests are not allowed to tell named guests/members to shut up. I think that you'll find that they are... And since when did you become a Mudcat moderator? |
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03 Nov 13 - 08:57 PM (#3572596) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Elmore For those of you who like throat singing from Tuva, don't miss Alash at Club Passim in Cambridge, Ma. Wed, Nov 6. If you live someplace else you can see them live online via Concert Window for 5 bucks, or check their website for other concerts. |
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03 Nov 13 - 09:10 PM (#3572601) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: wysiwyg GUEST,FloraG, why just drop a criticism instead of starting or contributing to the kind of discussions you wish Mudcat was having? ~Susan |
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04 Nov 13 - 03:16 AM (#3572640) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Acorn4 I've never found this a problem on Mudcat, in total contrast to Myspace which was effectively killed off by adverts and hype. |
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04 Nov 13 - 04:31 AM (#3572657) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,FloraG Acorn4 - it may not be a problem at the moment - but I thought it was an increasing trend - so thanks for the example of what could happen. Wysiwyg - its more of a concern than a criticism. Elmore - throat singing is great - but on the same night I'm involved with an anti capitalist do at Cambridge England. You might know of the USA lady who is the main guest. Mo - thanks for the comment. Supportive and helpful as usual. I think it is important that we individually and collectively complain about any deviance of behavoiur from what we would expect face to face. I don't think you just have to ' put up with it because its the internet'. Joe - my understanding of how the site is constructed may mean its not possible to do but is it worth considering having a section of the top for whats on that does not roll down but dies after 7 days? FloraG |
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04 Nov 13 - 05:07 AM (#3572665) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Nigel Parsons Too many adverts; not enough discussion Does this count as a 'discussion' & help to redress the balance? Or is it merely a 'bitching' session? |
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04 Nov 13 - 05:51 AM (#3572677) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Nigel Parsons Sorry, cross-posted. Now we have a constructive suggestion. What about a couple of new thread 'prefixes'? "What's On?" (a general category) "What's On - UK" "What's On - US" (possibly too broad a category as US is much bigger than UK) This may then help people 'filter' what they're reading. |
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04 Nov 13 - 05:57 AM (#3572678) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: SteveMansfield I'd really like to think Elmore was being ironic when they posted the throat-singing concert advert into this thread rather than starting one of their own ... As regards the main theme I can't say as I'd even noticed that there was a growing preponderance of adverts over discussion threads, it all looks like Mudcat as usual to me (in both the good and bad senses of 'Mudcat as usual'). Blocking all posts from un-logged-in GUESTs would go a long way to fixing a bunch of the bad stuff as ably illustrated by 03 Nov 13 - 03:49 PM: Mudcat has a long tradition of tolerating pseudonyms for those who wish to hide their true identity. |
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04 Nov 13 - 08:14 AM (#3572704) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Mr Happy IMO, for any forum to have worthwhile/interesting/stimulating etc content, it's necessary for OP's to initiate such topics - simples! |
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04 Nov 13 - 10:49 AM (#3572737) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: Elmore SteveMansfield: Maybe I was being semi-ironic. Still love that throat singing. |
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04 Nov 13 - 11:00 AM (#3572740) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,John Foxen FloraG, I appreciate your concern but gig announcements are very useful. In your last post it would have been more helpful if instead of saying "but on the same night I'm involved with an anti capitalist do at Cambridge England. You might know of the USA lady who is the main guest" you had said: "On Wednesday 6 Nov I'll be at Cambridge folk club for The Anti-Capitalist Roadshow: Frankie Armstrong, Reem Kelani, Grace Petrie, Leon Rosselson, Ian Saville and Peggy Seeger." Then those of us who weren't in the loop would have thought: "That sounds good- I'll try that." I'd be tempted to trek up to Cambridge myself but I'll be running special night at HzverFolk for Richard Bridge: a sinaround kicking off with Sid Kipper's fine song on the Seven Deadly Sins. |
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04 Nov 13 - 11:42 AM (#3572747) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,Jim Knowledge I `ad that FloraG in my cab last night. She was going shopping at Tescos for some clobber to wear to a do in Cambridge during the week. I said, "Morning Flo. What`s this event you`re going to then?" She said, "It`s a special one, Jim. It`s the Anti-Capitalist Roadshow at the Cambridge Folk Club. There`s loads of singers there, even some come in by airline from the U.S. We`ll let all them greedy sods know we can do without `em." I said, "That sounds like quite a night Flo. You gonna stand on your principles and go by Shanksy`s Pony, then?". She said, "Oh no, Jim. That Richard Branson runs a smashing coach service. It only costs £8.50 return from Victoria!!" Whaddam I Like?? |
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05 Nov 13 - 04:08 AM (#3572946) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,FloraG I hesitated about advertising an anti capitalist do on a web site ( Most people have to pay for their link.). Taxi jim - why walk when I can use my bus pass. A and B getting C to pay for D. I'm now a D. I sit at home ( in vain )waiting for my harvest festival parcel to arrive. FloraG. |
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05 Nov 13 - 05:19 AM (#3572960) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,John Foxen It is a thorny problem, FloraG. Indeed should an anti-capitalist show charge an entrance fee? The answer is yes. The artists have to eat and have to travel to the show. But if Mudcat exists to disseminate information then news about concerts, clubs etc is a vital part of it. I notice that I have been shamelessly plugging my club HaverFolk on this thread so I have donated £5 (not much but we are a small club) to the Mudcat Fund. If everyone who used Mudcat for promotion coughed up a couple of quid -- or dollars -- every time, it might ease Max's situation. |
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06 Nov 13 - 03:24 AM (#3573241) Subject: RE: Too many adverts; not enough discussion From: GUEST,FloraG Good idea John - nice one. FloraG |