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19 Jul 00 - 01:30 PM (#260843) Subject: Is Steve Earl folk From: GUEST,Den at work (lunch hour) I've often pondered this. I know its hard to classify Steve and I hate catagories anyway (just play) but a lot of the stuff he does has a real rootsy feel to it. I grew up in Ireland but I recognize the people Steve is talking about. I listened to Guy Clark a lot before I heard Steve Earl and I can see where he (Steve)was influenced. I only heard about Townes Van Zandt recently and have not heard any of his material, why? I know I'm rambling a bit here but I thought this might open up a little discussion and I might learn a little more. Oh what about Lyle Lovett...OK I'll stop now. Den |
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19 Jul 00 - 01:35 PM (#260852) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Songster Bob This is the sort of question that tends to start that favorite old Mudcat thread, "What is folk?" so I'll stop it now by saying, "Are you kidding?" Bob Clayton |
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19 Jul 00 - 01:42 PM (#260858) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: dwditty Nope, to the original question. |
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19 Jul 00 - 01:45 PM (#260860) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Mbo In my book he's alternative country/rock. Right in there with Kevin Welch, Lyle Lovett, Lucinda Williams, and BR5-89. Good stuff. --Mbo |
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19 Jul 00 - 01:54 PM (#260868) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Clinton Hammond2 Folk music is whatever anyone wants it to be.... :-P |
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19 Jul 00 - 01:56 PM (#260870) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Jim the Bart Maybe we can derail the "What is folk" discussion by reframing the question. Rather than asking if Steve Earle is "folk", what would you call his dominant style of music. I know he has written some songs, particularly lately, that are specifically "bluegrass". But the type of song that he wrote with the Dukes and that writers like Towns Van Zant, Guy Clark, Billy Joe Shaver, Kevin Welch and a bunch of those old Texas boys (and girls, lest we forget Gillian Welsh, Lucinda Williams, and others) are producing are sans genre. They aren't strictly country, whether you attach "and Western" or "alt-" to it. It has a lot of country in it (small "c", thank you very much) and is highly blues influenced. I kind of like "roots" music, but that ties it to cajun, zydeco, reggae and a bunch of other stuff that it ain't. There is a radio show from the College of DuPage in the Northwest Chicago suburbs called "American Back Roads" that plays all of this kind of music. Hearing Otis Redding or Rufus Thomas back to back with early Elvis, or Hank Williams and then hearing how modern writers incorporate and build on all of those traditions makes the connections quite clear. Another place to hear the connections between styles and forms is on the Chieftain's "Long Black Veil" album (they did another one in that vein, but the title escapes me). That's the "musical real estate" that I find most interesting these days. You can keep the top 40 - I'll take the back 40 everytime. |
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19 Jul 00 - 01:58 PM (#260874) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Dharmabum I'll 2nd that Clinton.
Ron. |
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19 Jul 00 - 02:12 PM (#260889) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Willie-O I don't care what you call him. He's great driving music! And for a "country music bad boy" he's got some damn solid politics of the type usually associated with leftist folkies. "Come Back, Emma Goldman
One caution, though: don't play his songs to biker audiences unless you've got them down cold. (Especially "Copperhead Road".) Bikers are kind of proprietary about old Steve. Willie-O |
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19 Jul 00 - 02:14 PM (#260894) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Marymac90 I agree with the majority opinion that Steve Earl is not folk. He rocks TOO much, imho. They had a recording of a live session he and his band did on the World Cafe radio program last week, in prep for a concert he gave in town last night. The World Cafe originates from a staion here in Phila, but it's syndicated and webcast < xpn.org >, so you may be able to catch it where you are. However, a bunch of the other folks mentioned above DO get categorized in my mind as folk or country/folk-Guy Clark, the late Townes Van Zandt, Lucinda Williams, as well as Nancy Griffith, Iris DeMent, etc. I realize a lot of Lyle Lovett's large band stuff has a pretty "thick", produced sound to be close to folk, but listen to If I had a Boat, on Pontiac, to hear the folky side of Lyle. Marymac |
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19 Jul 00 - 02:16 PM (#260896) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Lonesome EJ I think Steve fits fairly cleanly into the No Depression Rock-Country-Roots Movement, along with Townes, Dwight Yoakam,Gram Parsons, Allison Moorer, Emmylou Harris, and others. It's country, but not Nashville. It's roots, but not traditional. It's rock when it wants to be. Most of these folks cover songs by people like Woody, Merle, Buck and Hank, stuff with too much honest grit for Top 40 Country and CMT. Unfortunately, it's also too country and not trendy enough for Rock stations,VH1, or MTV. I do think it represents the cutting edge of Folk today, however. |
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19 Jul 00 - 02:23 PM (#260907) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Midchuck On which record? Most of the time, he's Alternative Country-Rock, like Mbo says. But when he does a pure acoustic album, like "Train A'Comin," he's a lot more folk than your average sensitive singer-songwriter. And if it weren't for Steve, we might never have had Norman's guitar break on "Tom Ames' Prayer," and life would be empty and meaningless. Peter. |
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19 Jul 00 - 02:45 PM (#260932) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: GUEST,Den at work Bob it wasn't my intention to redefine folk or regurgitate old dried-up material. Maybe in retrospect I would have phrased my question better. Could some of what Steve Earl does be classified as folk? As in "Christmas Time in Washington, Fort Worth Blues, Nothing but a Child," etc and before you go stopping it right there its kind of nice to be talking about music for a change. Den |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:04 PM (#260937) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Willie-O "El Corazon" is the album I have listened to the most. A review made an interesting point about it--he plays in some quite different styles, and you pretty much pick the ones you like on that basis. Some of it is hard-core country--"The Other Side of Town", some roots-rock like "Telegraph Road", "Christmas Time In Washington" depressed leftist sentimentality, and my fave "Taneytown" sounds like Lynyrd-Skynyrd-with-a-brain. (Much like Copperhead Road) He can't be all those styles for real can he? Guess I don't really care. I think he's someone who understands how to produce good, sometimes great work within his technical limitations. Willie-O |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:24 PM (#260945) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Whistle Stop I don't care if he's folk or not, the man puts out some seriously good music. I think the best stuff tends to fall through the cracks between the categories anyway. Steve Earle is a very gifted songwriter and performer, who doesn't allow himself to be confined to any one genre. Good for him. |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:32 PM (#260952) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Whistle Stop By the way, if you haven't yet heard his new album (Transcendental Blues), give it a listen. It's among his best, which is saying a lot in my book (big fan -- could you tell?). |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:36 PM (#260955) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: SDShad Midchuck, you nailed it right on the head with your commentary about "Train A' Comin'." As chance would have it, my copy of "Train A' Comin'" just happens to be in my office right now, so thanks to you I'm listening to it right now! You're right about Norman's break on "Tom Ames' Prayer," but also: Norman's wonderful but short "Northern Winds." As the liner notes say, "shut up and learn something." And, "Ben McCulloch" is one of the best story songs I've heard in a long, long time. I know a lot of Steve Earle's work is very rock 'n' roll, but this album is pretty darned folky. It's my favorite of his, and that's saying something, as much as I like his other albums. Den, if you have heard this album then you've heard at least one Townes Van Zandt song: "Tecumseh Valley." Others you may have heard but not realized were his are "If I Needed You" and "Pancho and Lefty." My breath as hard as kerosene, Chris |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:36 PM (#260956) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Lonesome EJ El Corazon is a very good album, Willie-O. My favorites are Poison Lovers with the dynamite duet work (what is her name by the way?) and If You Fall in Love. My favorite Steve Earle song ever though has got to be The Devil's Right Hand
My very first pistol was a cap n ball colt Pretty good writing. Pretty folky too. |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:44 PM (#260962) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: GUEST,Den Thanks Chris. I haven't heard Train A Comin but I will certainly look out for it. I have Guitar Town, Copperhead Road, The Hard Way, I feel alright and El Corazon. Your right Lej that's a great song actually can't think of a bad track on that whole album. Thanks for keeping this going guys like I mentioned in my original post I learned more. Den |
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19 Jul 00 - 03:50 PM (#260971) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Kim C I would not necessarily say that Steve Earle is a folk artist, but I would go out on a limb and say that Copperhead Road could be a folk song, from the standpoint that it tells a story. I sold him a futon once. |
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20 Jul 00 - 08:06 AM (#261457) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: mactheturk He has said that his main influences have been: Townes Van Zandt Bruce Springsteen Bob Dylan
In turn, the following name HIM as one of their main influences: for what that's worth.... |
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20 Jul 00 - 09:34 AM (#261502) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: GUEST,Den Some more thoughts: From an Interview with Bob Gulla CD Now He's also writing music at a vicious rate and within a number of new genres: first, the heartwarming, old-time folk aura of Train a Comin', From the man himself: Yeah, I'm doing a TV special in Dublin, playing with [Celtic accordionist] Sharon Shannon and Donal Lunny. Sharon and I are also getting ready to make a record together.There's a single coming out on her new album, which is a song I wrote. We may release some of the stuff we'll record together as an EP, probably some time next year.
From music critic Michael McCall talking about the new release "mountain," |
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20 Jul 00 - 10:19 AM (#261518) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Midchuck And nobody's mentioned him as a bluegrass singer. His album with the Del McCoury band, The Mountain, is worth having whether or not you're into bluegrass. "Dixieland" is one of my favorite new songs in the last couple of years. Peter. |
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20 Jul 00 - 05:33 PM (#261732) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: GUEST,Arkie Steve Earl surely is classified as folk. His music is another story. |
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20 Jul 00 - 07:33 PM (#261846) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Susan from California I flat out love to listen to Steve Earle. His song "Billy Austin" is one of the best anti-death penalty songs I have ever heard. The last part..."Could you take that long walk with me/knowing hell is waitin' there/Could you pull the switch yourself sir/With a sure and steady hand/Could you still tell yourself sir/That you're better than I am..." slays me everytime. Right up there with that Elvis Costello song that I can't remember the title of right now... (Oh--it's "Let 'em Dangle") The first time my husband heard "Nothing But a Child" he thought it was an otherworldly experience, the way it is just sort of tagged on there, and it is so sparse and beautiful, quite brilliant. I must admit that I could care less how (or why) music is categorized. What matters to me is the heart and soul of the music, (both lyrics and tune) and that can be found in every style and every category. |
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20 Jul 00 - 09:58 PM (#261917) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Bill D Clinton..."Folk music is whatever anyone wants it to be....".....pooh! given rules like that, I can pour Ragu sauce over sauerkraut and call it "Italian".... you may LIKE any durn thing you please, but a word has to mean something similar to those in the discussion or it is essentially useless...and 'folk' has just about been mis-used into oblivion now..(and they are working on 'trad') |
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21 Jul 00 - 08:37 AM (#262053) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Whistle Stop It's all in what you care about. There's a fine line between "DEfining" and CONfining, and I care more about the music, and the creative freedom, than I do about the categories. But feel free to have another "what is folk?" discussion if you like. |
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21 Jul 00 - 09:53 AM (#262098) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Susan from California mactheturk--I once gave my brother a Steve Earle cd as a gift and told him that Steve Earle was what Bruce Soringsteen would be if Springsteen had been from Texas. Last time I looked, the cd was still in it's shrink wrap...oh well, I tried :-) |
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22 Jul 00 - 04:05 PM (#262743) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: SDShad Steve Earle is going to record with Sharon Shannon? That's like-you've-died-and-gone-to-heaven news. Thanks, Den. Chris |
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13 Feb 02 - 06:10 PM (#649446) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Clinton Hammond " 'folk' has just about been mis-used (sic.) into oblivion now.." Well, thanks gods for that... For instance, the smartest thing the Calgary FOLK festival EVER did was change it's name to The Calgary MUSIC Festival... Away with divisions and categories! As for Steve... listen to "Fortworth Blues" or "It Doesn't Get Any Lonlier Than This"... If that stuff ain't folk, I don't wanna know what you call folk...
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13 Feb 02 - 06:32 PM (#649465) Subject: Calgary Folk Music Festival From: GUEST,Calgary Folk Music Festival Clinton shows his ignorance again! |
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13 Feb 02 - 06:40 PM (#649469) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Bill D well, you see what careless use of the 'refresh' button can lead to! Tsk! Calgary will have a festival...and I suppose there'll be something for everyone.... |
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13 Feb 02 - 06:47 PM (#649472) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: 53 Steve Earle should be put into the same category as the Outlaws, I guess you know who they are. |
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13 Feb 02 - 07:02 PM (#649482) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: GUEST,Frogmore For Heaven's sake - I couldn't even read more than 4 or 5 pieces of this thread - but: "Is Steve Earle folk?" ? I guarantee you he isn't sitting around wondering. He's probably writing, reading, conversing, or performing. He's damn good at what he does. This tendency to the overly-academic will make you nuts. In the words of Frank Zappa, "Shut up and play yer guitar." Go walk in the woods for a while and ponder whether Chuck Berry is "folk" then get back to me. What I've always liked is what I call "musical expression." |
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14 Feb 02 - 12:39 PM (#650010) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Clinton Hammond Maybe it was Edmonton I was thinking of... Maybe it was Vancouver... I do recall a really good short film on The Calgary Music Fest though, where the constant thread through the interviews of people like Bruce Cockburn, Shawn Colvin, Stephen Fearing, Blue Rodeo, Grievous Angles and others was a shared disdain for the small 'moniker' of 'folk'... See, I call myself a folk musician for the exact opposite reason... 'folk' is a big huge category in my book, that allows one to play a bunch of different styles of music... I'm also with Frogmore... "Shut up and play yer guitar." ^5's mate! |
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14 Feb 02 - 01:35 PM (#650061) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Lonesome EJ "Overly academic"? That's certainly a rare criticism to be leveled on this Forum. |
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14 Feb 02 - 01:58 PM (#650085) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Eric the Viking He's already made one track with Sharron Shannon-on the Diamond mountain sessions-what ever he is-he bloody well rocks and it's good music. Saw him last year with the Del Marcurie? band. love Copperhead road, got a couple of his Cds-even bought guitar town on 12 inch.(C H R- proper bikers music!!) |
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14 Feb 02 - 02:51 PM (#650126) Subject: Hey Clinton Hammond From: GUEST,Folk Festivals Hey Clinton Hammond, You been smoking funny cigarettes, or what? First you say The Calgary FOLK MUSIC Festival doesn't call itself folk anyomore. You were wrong. They do. Strike One. Then you say The Edmonton FOLK MUSIC Festival doesn't call itself folk anyomore. You were wrong. They do. Strike Two. Then you say The Vancouver FOLK MUSIC Festival doesn't call itself folk anyomore. You were wrong. They do. Strike Three. You're Out!
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14 Feb 02 - 03:11 PM (#650144) Subject: RE: Is Steve Earl folk From: Clinton Hammond I said MAYBE... Ya never made a mistake? I KNOW there was a big 'folk' fest that recently (last few years) changed from 'folk' to 'music'... And that their revenue went through the roof when they did... More importantly, I think, is the prevailing opinions from artists such as I mentioned above, that 'folk' is a term that is all too often used to be exclusionary (-I- won't play THAT because THAT'S NOT Folk!) rather than in an "inclusionary" sense... Capital "F" folkies are just as bothersome as, say capital "P" pagans... indicative of people who take themselves WAY too seriously... especially when they get to thinkin' that their "OPINIONS" are somehow even relevant to anyone but themselves... I don't expect anyone to agree with me, full of the knowledge that this is just my opinion... |