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05 Apr 01 - 04:51 PM (#434103) Subject: Time Signature From: death by whisky I've never thought about it untill someone asked me what the lower figure on a time signature means.According to the New Everyman Dictionary of Music "..showing in the lower figure the unit of the note-values into which each bar is divided..".I,M almost there.Would anyone like to help fit this piece of the puzzle?Gratefully yours,dbw. |
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05 Apr 01 - 05:06 PM (#434114) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Jon Freeman I think I have got this right, take the following:
Semibreve = Whole note So for example 6/8 time = 6 x 1/8 note or 6 quavers per bar. Jon |
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05 Apr 01 - 05:07 PM (#434116) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: AllisonA(Animaterra) The top number gives the number of beats per bar (measure). The bottom number works sort of like a fraction: if it's a 4, then the quarter note is the one that gets the beat. So 4/4 time means 4 beats to the measure, using the quarter note to count the beats. For fast music, the eighth note might be used: so in 6/8 time, it's six beats to the measure, the eighth note gets the beat. Of course, you can also count 6/8 time in sets of 2, 9/8 time in 3s, and stuff like that. But that's the gist of it. |
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05 Apr 01 - 05:08 PM (#434118) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: AllisonA(Animaterra) Double posted! But dbw, I hope one of the above explanations helps. |
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05 Apr 01 - 05:17 PM (#434129) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: nutty The top figure shows how many notes in each bar and the bottom figure shows the value of those notes. So 3/4 time has three QUARTER NOTES in each bar 4/4 has four QUARTER NOTES in each bar. 6/8 has six EIGHTH NOTES 2/2 has two HALF NOTES So the value of the notes (QUARTER NOTES , HALF NOTES OR CROTCHETS , QUAVERS , MINIMS ETC etc) in the lower figure set the tempo of any piece of music. Hope that helps |
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05 Apr 01 - 06:11 PM (#434177) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Rick Fielding So if you want to master 5/4 time, just sing "Raindrops are fallin' on m'friggin' head". |
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05 Apr 01 - 07:11 PM (#434213) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: GUEST,Bruce O. But note there's a lot of variation. "Sheila na Guira" in the 18th century was a popular Irish tune, and I have half a dozen copies as 3/4 and half a dozen as 6/8. Also note that most 17th century 6/4 tunes and all 17th century 9/4 tunes became 6/8 and 9/8 later, the conversion being completed by about 1725-30. 5/4 are most common from southeast England, where singers tended to hold the first note of 4/4 tunes. In southeast USA they often held 1st and 3rd notes to stretch them to 6/4.
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05 Apr 01 - 08:02 PM (#434250) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: McGrath of Harlow And the idea that a tune should have the same time signature all the way through doesn't work when you're dealing with music in many traditions.
It's the kind of misunderstanding that used to involve collectors adjusting the tunes to impose a single time signature, and assuming the people they were collecting from were just making mistakes.
Nowadays it isn't the collectors that do that, but we do it a lot of the time, because we've developed cloth ears from listening to too much canned music. |
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05 Apr 01 - 08:26 PM (#434260) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Noreen Is that ok, dbw? Easier with actual examples maybe- come back if you need more. (Rick- I like your example!) |
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05 Apr 01 - 11:39 PM (#434370) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: wysiwyg A good way to get to know them lil buggers without the distraction of pitch and words is to pick up a percussion book at your music store... leaf through the drumming pattern books till you find a book that is set up so that it makes SENSE to you. Pick it out yourself-- don't let anyone HELP you. And then take the book to a quiet private spot and use your hands to slap a table with what is written. They usually start out quite simple and then get trickier. We had a good thread on rhythm in the last year, but I can't recall the name. Maybe someone can find it and refresh it. Anyway beneath the time signature is another whole layer of rhythm which is the pulse of the piece... where the signature may read 4/4 but you can feel those quarter notes vibrating in smaller units. If you are a guitar player this study will be invaluable to your strumming and picking patterns, and if you sing it will help you with expression when you can see how the time and pulse fit together. ~Susan |
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06 Apr 01 - 12:47 AM (#434402) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: wysiwyg dbw, I found and refreshed it, though now I have re-read it I am not sure it will help at all! It was called, "Help for rhythmicly challenged?". Not saying you are. Reading and feeling rhythm, thank God, are not the same. ~Susan |
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07 Apr 01 - 09:39 PM (#435523) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: death by whisky Thanks for the explanatiions,seems to fit,although this knowledge wont affect my playing.Seems to be more of a theory thing.I remember playing rythm to Spillanes "Tolka Polka"The third part has 4 bars of 5and 3 of 4.there were a few wll woked signals I can tell you !!!.Thanks again.Any more stories of challenging pieces? |
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08 Apr 01 - 12:46 AM (#435591) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Joe Offer Well, as long as we're talking time signatures, what's Common Time and Cut Time and "Alla Breve"? How does 3/4 time differ from 6/8? -Joe Offer- |
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08 Apr 01 - 07:57 AM (#435680) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: nutty Joe common time is 4/4 or 4 quarter notes in each bar and is counted 1-2-3-4 3/4 has 3 quarter notes in each bar and is counted 1-2-3 6/8 has 6 eighth notes and is counted 1-2-3-4-5-6 If you clap those rhythms you will hear/feel the difference Sorry can't help with the others |
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08 Apr 01 - 08:32 AM (#435688) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Snuffy Joe 3/4 has three beats to the bar, each a 1/4 note 6/8 has TWO beats to the bar, each of 3 1/8 notes - 1-2-3 2-2-3, |
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08 Apr 01 - 11:56 PM (#436128) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Bob Bolton G'day Joe, You will like this: C does not stand for "common" time ... at least, it didn't when it was first used. Perfect time (musically ... theologically ...?) was 3/4 because it reflected the Trinity. The so-called C is, in fact, a gapped circle, indicating that the perfect circle has been broken by an additional (fourth) beat. None of this has any application in these modern times, but you might find some theological interest therein. Regards, Bob Bolton |
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09 Apr 01 - 04:30 AM (#436196) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: Joe Offer You're right, Bob - theological quirks fascinate me, and that one is a classic. So, I take it "Common time" and 4/4 time are exactly the same? I thought they were, but wasn't quite sure. "Cut time" still has me confused. -Joe Offer- |
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09 Apr 01 - 09:15 AM (#436293) Subject: RE: Help: Time Signature From: jeffp Cut time (also called alla breve) is 2/2 time. Two beats to the bar, the half note is one beat. It's common in march music, probably to avoid eighth notes with their beams and flags. Those can be hard to distinguish from sixteenth notes when you are marching down the street. jeffp |