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26 Apr 01 - 12:37 PM (#449903) Subject: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Fiolar An article in the British newspaper The Guardian today suggests that Sherlock Holmes and Professor Moriarty were one and the same. Holmes apparently turned to crime when he got bored. The "death" at the Reichenbach Falls was all a ploy to fool the police. That should put the cat among the pigeons I would think. |
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26 Apr 01 - 01:02 PM (#449924) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Wavestar Umm.. *ponders fictional characters* Sort of along these lines, I would recommend to anyone who likes intellectually interesting and sometimes challenging stories Laurie King's Mary Russell series, about the adventures of Holmes after retirement, and his new apprentice/partner. She does absolute justice to the legendary detective, while adding the interesting element of a new character. Okay, I think she's interesting. -J |
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26 Apr 01 - 01:07 PM (#449930) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: catspaw49 ......Right then...................... Spaw |
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26 Apr 01 - 01:53 PM (#449978) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Rick Fielding Watson: Holmes old boy, how far did you go in school? Holmes: Elementary, my dear Watson. I'm sorry. Rick |
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26 Apr 01 - 01:54 PM (#449982) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: catspaw49 ...........and you should be. Spaw |
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26 Apr 01 - 01:59 PM (#449988) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Long Firm Freddie Watson: Holmes, I see Mrs Hudson has has the hall painted yellow!
Holmes: A lemon entry, my dear Watson... LFF (Just come over from the pun thread) |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:00 PM (#449989) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Big Mick Damn...............hurt yourself with that one, old boy...........LOL. Mick |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:01 PM (#449991) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Big Mick That was directed at Rick, but Freddy...........phew........ Mick |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:07 PM (#450001) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Rick Fielding Watson: Homlmes, what do you make of this paste residue? Holmes: Alimentary, my dear Watson.......by the way Watson, have I ever told you what an attractive man you are? I have this little pied a terre over on Baker street, and..... Really sorry Rick P.S. I don't remember what "alimentary paste" is either, but I saw it once in a Japanese Grocery store. |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:15 PM (#450016) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: zander (inactive) Is there anything you wish to draw to my attention Holmes ? only the curious incident of the Mudcatter my dear Watson, but the mudcatter did nothing Holmes, yes that was the curious incident.
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26 Apr 01 - 02:18 PM (#450019) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: catspaw49 Whatever ta' hell it is, it couldn't possibly smell worse than the puns on this thread................... Why do I get the feeling that this isn't what poor old Fiolar was expecting? Then again, what could anyone expect from the original post? Spaw |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:20 PM (#450022) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#1 If Conan Doyle really wrote it (which has been seriously questioned recently) he was probably in an opium stupor, so just about anything's possible. |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:26 PM (#450035) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#2 Bruce, don't leave us hanging. What's the story on who MIGHT have written it? |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:32 PM (#450042) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Rick Fielding Yeah, I want to know too. I already wasted about 12 hours of my life plumbing the Earl of Oxford's Fan sites, so I might as well do the same with A.C.D. By the way, the original premise WOULD make an interesting story. I'm a bit surprised nobody's written it yet...or are they about to, after reading the article? Rick |
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26 Apr 01 - 02:44 PM (#450058) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Wavestar I think someonw has, Rick, it rings bells, but at the moment I couldn't tell you who. -J |
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26 Apr 01 - 03:02 PM (#450076) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: catspaw49 Doesn't really matter...........Its all water over the falls now. Spaw |
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26 Apr 01 - 03:13 PM (#450085) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#1 Can't relocate the one I saw first. Here's a bit along those lines.
The indefatigable may want to search through those turned up by Google on 'Sherlock Holmes' and 'Conan Doyle' |
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26 Apr 01 - 03:27 PM (#450103) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Giac@Brian's Watson: Holmes! I've just crossed two plants to create sweet smelling shade. Holmes: And what is that my dear Watson? Watson: Elm-Mint Tree. (Be nice now. Remember I live in the South and don't know no better) |
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26 Apr 01 - 03:32 PM (#450107) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Peter T. "What are you listening to, Holmes?" "Ella Fitzgerald, my dear Watson. And how is your leg?" "Is there something wrong with my leg?" "Elephantiasis, my dear Watson." "Eh?" "Come Watson, your gamey foot!" "Holmes, you continue to baffle me. As the Inspector said, Be he never so humble, there's no police like Holmes." |
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26 Apr 01 - 04:02 PM (#450128) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: LR Mole Watson, the alimentary paste," said Holmes, as the cabs rattled by handsomly,"I feel positively Baker Street irregular." Shortly thereafter, after consuming a briar well charged with shag (equal parts tobacco and carpet), he interrupted our walk,"Watson," he inquired, "Do you know of a bog hereabout?" "Take this left,"said I,"Up l'estrade." |
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26 Apr 01 - 04:15 PM (#450133) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#1 Rick, are you one of those Oxfordian Shakespeare believers? Try Sam Shoenbaum's 'Shakespeare's Lives' to see how many others were Shakespeare, too. Mark Twain (also know as Clem something or other) got it right. Shakespeare was written by another man of the same name. I think this tread has hit bottom. It was almost there to start with. |
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27 Apr 01 - 01:23 PM (#450499) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Fiolar Some of this thread reminds me of the old story about the man who was paranoid about aliens and when he got home one evening found that all his possesions had been replaced by exact copies. When he metioned the fact to his wife, she said "do I know you?" Nothing to do with Holmes by the way. |
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27 Apr 01 - 02:11 PM (#450556) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Rick Fielding Guest #1. I said: "Yeah, I want to know too. I already wasted about 12 hours of my life plumbing the Earl of Oxford's Fan sites, so I might as well do the same with A.C.D." Believe me, 12 hours of entertainment (so my idea of entertainment is a bit off the beaten track) is a mere heartbeat to those questioning folks who've devoted their whole lives to proving that a "tennis match" and a "coat of arms" are irrefutable proof of Oxford's claim! Although, to be fair, I have to say that I've never met a playright who was much of a grain merchant. But being a bear for punishment, I've also spent a couple of cozy evenings with the "Richard 111 was a sweetheart" folks. Perkin Warbeck anyone? Rick |
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27 Apr 01 - 02:43 PM (#450583) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: CarolC I don't think Holmes and Moriarty could have been one and the same. And for the same reason the article suggests he was/they were. Holmes would have been bored to tears solving crimes he committed himself. Don't you think? |
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27 Apr 01 - 03:17 PM (#450610) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#1 Anyone have a program that lets you see how deep you can pile hyphotheticals before the whole collapses. |
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27 Apr 01 - 07:24 PM (#450768) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Sarah2 Well, on a more Holmes-fan note: My own favorite pastiche is The Whitechapel Horrors by Edward Hanna. I'm sure you can deduce the crimes involved. Wonderful, with great footnotes concerning both Holmes and the events in London during the autumn of 1888. Good "Conan Doyle style," too. Anyway, excellent light (hah!) reading. Sarah |
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27 Apr 01 - 07:26 PM (#450770) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#2 Bet someone here does. |
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27 Apr 01 - 08:43 PM (#450795) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Extra Stout " Arthur Conan Doyle" was a nom-de-plume coined by Shakespeare and Bacon. |
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27 Apr 01 - 09:29 PM (#450819) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#1 That of BaCon and EGS? |
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28 Apr 01 - 09:37 PM (#451344) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Irish sergeant Eggs are a momentary painfull incident Bacon is a lifetime commitment ask any pig, it's true. Intriguing idea that Arthur Conan Doyle didn't write Holmes. I can guarentee, Alistair Crowley didn't Kindest Reguards, Neil |
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29 Apr 01 - 01:38 AM (#451445) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Crazy Eddie Watson "I say Holmes, what is that peculiar looking fish?" Holmes "A yellow manta-ray my dear Watson" |
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29 Apr 01 - 01:47 AM (#451454) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,Pete Peterson Some awful puns here-- and how did Mr. Crowley come into the conversation? My enemies, who treat me foully Pronounce my name as if 'twere Crowley But since I know that I am holy I say it as Alastair CROWLEY Sabine Baring-Gould deduced that Moriarty had been Holmes' mathematics tutor during childhood-- Nicholas Meyer took that and ran with it (in the Seven-percent Solution) in one of the most enjoyable Holmes pastiches IMHO. Carol, accepting the premise of the Baker Street Irregulars, (Holmes is real, and the stories are internally consistent) I agree with you that Holmes could not have been Moriarty, or he would have been very bored solving his own crimes. |
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29 Apr 01 - 01:57 AM (#451460) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Blackcatter As to "Did Shakespeare write all that?" One of my old profs said that "If Shakespere didn't write them, someone named Shakespere did." I doubt it was the same with ACD - While he probably wasn't above the use of opium (I don't really know), much of his life is rather well documented as he was not one to shy away from the eye of the "Victorian Paparazzi." His forays into Spiritualism being one example. As to Holmes and Moriarty being one and the same - I guess there is the possiblity of a "Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde" thing that went on. What about Dr. Watson and Mrs. Hudson being one and the same? Pax yall |
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29 Apr 01 - 02:24 AM (#451461) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,#1 Blackcatter, Mark Twain beat your professor to it on Shakespeare's [sic] works. |
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30 Apr 01 - 05:58 AM (#451948) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler There is a series of books (I think the author is R.L. Trow) about Inspector Lestrade, trying to show he's not as stupid as Holmes/Doyle makes him out (police are baffled!). Others have tried to construct stories based on the cases Watson only mentions in passing. RtS |
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30 Apr 01 - 06:17 AM (#451951) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler Correction M.J. Trow about 2 dozen published so far (I've only read a couple) RtS |
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30 Apr 01 - 10:13 AM (#452044) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler As early as the 1950s, detective writer John Dickson Carr and Adrian Conan Doyle (some relation) wrote the Exploits of SH which covered several of the cases mentioned as asides. Still in print according to Amazon. RtS |
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30 Apr 01 - 10:45 AM (#452075) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,Matt_R Adrian was Doyle's youngest son. Oldest son Denis was killed in WWI. His death is often seen as the breaking point for Doyle's delving into spiritualism. Lol, I know all this stuff because my sister is a highly-regarded member of the International Arthur Conan Doyle Society. |
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30 Apr 01 - 11:57 AM (#452134) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: LR Mole No, my dear Whatsit, it was OXO WHITNEY!!! |
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30 Apr 01 - 12:00 PM (#452140) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,Matt_R Don't you mean Isah Whitney, from "The Twisted Lip"? |
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30 Apr 01 - 01:00 PM (#452203) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Noreen Maybe Holmes can work out why GUEST,#2 above referred to GUEST,#1 as Bruce? I think we should be told. |
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30 Apr 01 - 01:30 PM (#452224) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: CarolC Noreen, regarding your question, I just hope someone (GUEST, #2, perhaps) isn't being a little too hasty in their assessment of the situation. Maybe GUEST #2 is right, but I feel a little uneasy about this approach. Maybe it's just nerves. |
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30 Apr 01 - 01:59 PM (#452248) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: Noreen Oh I see- I think Guest#2 is totally inaccurate. But perhaps someone who signs themselves as "GUEST# whatever" thinks they have an insight into a personality who signs themselves a similar way? It's beyond me. Holmes? |
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30 Apr 01 - 02:40 PM (#452278) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: lady penelope From the Goon Show " Moriarty, where are you?" " I'm in the piano, I'm hidin' " " Don't be silly, he's been dead for years!" I believe that the above rumour to be a fiendish plan to incurr work and therefore monies accrued by a lowley fleet street Hack! Ladies and gentlemen, I'm afraid you have allowed yourselves to be duped by that worst of criminals ...... The Free Lance Writer! I thank you. TTFN M'Lady P. |
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01 May 01 - 11:37 AM (#452924) Subject: RE: Holmes versus Moriarty From: GUEST,C-BO Mudcatters, I am C-Bo (M-Bo's sister). Because he mentioned that the Mudcat Forum was discussing ACD, I had to stop by and see what was being said. As a member of the Arthur Conan Doyle Society, I can fill you all in on the details. 1.) Doyle did NOT at any time ever take opium or any other narcotic. He did make Sherlock Holmes addicted to cocaine and morphine, greatly to Watson's horror. 2.) Sorry, M-Bo Doyle did not get involved in spiritualism because of Denis' (his son's death). He attended his first seance when he was in his early 20's. Before he had even met his first wife. It was Denis' death that allowed him to understand his path as a spiritualist missionary 3.) Any claims that Doyle did not invent Holmes are LIES!!!! There has been a nasty rumor circulated of late that Doyle did not write "The Hound of the Baskervilles." This claim is made by someone who is pretending to be a scholar in order to get a book published. He claims the ghost of the REAL author of the HOUND contacted him and told him the truth. No self-respecting publisher will print the drivel. Even if there was the remote chance that Doyle didn't write HOUND, however, that book was published in 1901. The first Sherlock Holmes story was printed in 1887. Doyle clearly invented Holmes. 4.) Have you guys ever heard of the Holmes Tent Joke? It's pretty bad (along the lines of these puns). Shall I post it? |