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29 Jul 01 - 08:55 PM (#517422) Subject: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Don Firth My wife, Barbara, works at the Seattle Public Library. She received this in her e-mail at work. Does this make anybody nervous besides me? Don Firth
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 12:41:55 |
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29 Jul 01 - 09:42 PM (#517444) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Greg F. What makes me nervous is that the sole purpose of the E-Book scam is to screw more money out of the consumer- as with music CD's the production costs for publishers will go way down, the price of the product will go up, the life span of the product will be less (yes, CD's degrade faster than vinyl and/or paper)so sales will increase over time and most authors will continue to receive relatively small sums for their efforts. As the article points out, with the new format costs to libraries- most already way underfunded- to simply stay even will increase. Ditto school libraries, which have virtually no funds at all. How many folks on low and moderate incomes will be able to shell out for an E-Book reader or computer? Who comes out ahead in all this? Only the publishers- and the computer manufacturers, perhaps- what better way to boost lagging PC sales? If you want to worry about a conspiracy, THAT'S the one to be concerned about. |
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29 Jul 01 - 10:27 PM (#517454) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Brendy Controlling the information, eh? Look out for the Bladerunners, next. B. |
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30 Jul 01 - 12:28 PM (#517728) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Don Firth Greg, I pretty much agree with what you say. But the one thing that really bothers me about this is not so much the E-Book aspect, but the implication it has for libraries in general. Perhaps I was pre-set to react to this article and took a leap forward, beyond the current issue. I know a couple of successful writers (ones whose books sell consistently and who are making a good living at writing) and I have met and talked with many writers at science fiction conventions and writer's conferences. Not all, by any means, but a disturbingly high percentage of these writers react like scalded cats it you mention public libraries in their presence. Their objection? "People can check out my books and read them for free! Every time someone checks out a book, that's one I don't get paid for." And if some authors feel that way, what do you think the publishers might be thinking? Now that the recording industry has pretty much unhorsed Napster, the publishing industry is following their example by going after ways of distributing books, especially ways that don't run a book through the cash-register as many times as possible. The issue is not the welfare of the author (although they will give lip-service to this), it is maximizing their own profits. Perhaps I should have titled this thread "Napster's dead. Who's next afterwho's next?" The current target is E-Books. It would not surprise me in the least if the next target is libraries themselves. Don Firth |
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30 Jul 01 - 01:24 PM (#517778) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: John Kidder Napster may be dead, but the new means of music distribution will still be the Web, at least until the next poly-connected hyperlink medium arrives (mental MIDI?). This is the beginning of a new era in what we have always called "property". Remember that in our western system of politics there were really very few laws or customs dealling with even real hard stuff like rocks and trees until the Magna Carta in 1215 - before that everything just belonged to the King. We have had 800 years of common law developed about real property, and for the last 100 years or so we have been trying to apply the same techniques to "intellectual" property, works of art and the like. Now we think we can copyright even little bits of software, and ideas like using rainbows in corporate logos. Hoo Ha. Copyrights in physical materials like books and tapes will soon be impossible to enforce. Check out the successors to Napster like WinMX, look at the threads all over the great MUDCAT - there is simply no way to put this genie back in the bottle. The corporations, as always, are fighting to develop new standards, new encryption techniques, new ways to maintain their commercial power (which I'm sure we all agree has little to do with the welfare of the artists or authors). But they are behind the curve, and I suggest that they wil not catch up, any more than various kings could have re-appropriated their ownership of damn near everything. So how do artists and authors get due reward from this new and vastly expanded market, which they should now be able to get to without the intervening distributors and middlers? Ay, there's the rub. Do we users have a kind of checkoff fee, a nickel a song or some such (that's way more than artist get now, of course)? Can we bank some form of e-credits against downloads? Maybe Mudcat would be a good forum to begin something like this - here we have a community which has a strong connetion to the shared experiences of the collective. Anyway, just ramblin'. johnk
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30 Jul 01 - 03:45 PM (#517871) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Don Firth New technologies take a while to shake out, and if there is money to be made, it can turn into a real can of worms. My concern at this point, though, is the 3-D world bricks-and-mortar public libraries. I got my first library card when I was six years old and I've had one ever since. A lot my love of reading -- and writing -- came from hanging out in libraries when I was a kid. They were quiet and kind of holy. All that knowledge, all that information, all those wonderful adventures, just for the price of taking a book off a shelf! I've used libraries a lot. But I've also bought a lot of books. And Barbara, too. My God, the books! You can hardly see the walls for the bookshelves! So our heavy use of the library certainly doesn't mean we haven't spent a substantial portion of our incomes supporting authors and their publishers. From a few things I've picked up from writer's magazines and at writer's conferences, some higher-ups in publishing would like to shut public libraries down. They'll use them to promote books, but they hate the idea that someone can walk in, check out a book, and read it without having to pay them some kind of royalty. At the very least, they want the libraries to charge patrons for checking out books and pay them a fee, like radio stations have to pay ASCAP or BMI for records they play. Maybe I'm paranoid, but I think what the publishing companies really have in the cross-hairs is the public libraries themselves. If not now, then soon. Just keep watching. Don Firth |
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30 Jul 01 - 03:53 PM (#517874) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Greg F. Scary?
...a disturbingly high percentage of these writers react like scalded cats it you mention public libraries in their presence. Their objection? "People can check out my books and read them for free!"... |
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30 Jul 01 - 04:02 PM (#517882) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: rea I wonder if one could counter sue on the basis of classism or some such -- limiting the access of those who can't afford it. a sure way to keep the ignorant ignorant. |
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30 Jul 01 - 04:04 PM (#517885) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Jande I feel the need to mention here that I tend to go out and purchase books that I have originally checked out on library loan ~~when the book is so well written that I want to own it and read it over and over again~~ (That is my impulse toward music I find on the web, and also toward software. If the author is generous enough to provide a FULLY functional demo version, that is not ADware, for a limited time period, I will normally purchase that software IF it meets my needs and functions as predicted on my system.) I'm sure I'm not alone in this. So as far as I'm concerned, the Libraries are responsible for increased sales! ~ Jande |
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30 Jul 01 - 04:12 PM (#517891) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Don Firth Right, rea. I was born in the middle of the Depression, and although we weren't destitute, money was really tight. My sisters and I had maybe half a dozen children's books, and two major purchases my Dad made was a dictionary and later a set of encyclopedia. The first "real" book I had was a copy of Treasure Island that a neighbor gave me on my ninth birthday. That was a prized possession, and I still have it. I was a voracious reader. I was able to be, because the library was free. Don Firth |
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30 Jul 01 - 06:46 PM (#517944) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Rich(bodhránai gan ciall) I would think fair-use would entitle one who had purchased a book the right to lend it. What's next? If you lend a guitar to somebody whose is being repaired, can Martin Guitars sue you for cutting into a potential sale? If you order a pay-per-view concert or sporting event on cable, does the cable provider have a right to show up at your door and count heads to see how many people are watching? If you learn a tune from your fiddle teacher, must you never teach it to another fiddler? Rich |
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30 Jul 01 - 07:16 PM (#517979) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Deckman I can't help but wonder what Dale Carnegie (sp?) would say! CHEERS, BOB(deckan)NELSON |
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30 Jul 01 - 10:45 PM (#518117) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: SeanM Rich, hate to say it, but if anyone besides you or "the immediate members of your household" view the pay per view, you've broken the law with a 'public viewing'. Let's just give up. Let the publishers draft 'singers' against their will, force them to perform, and then kill them when finished (less residuals that way). Let's make it so that any use of any word automatically results in a deduction from the offending speaker's bank account to the publisher who first filed claim on that word. M |
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31 Jul 01 - 06:41 AM (#518251) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Brendy I have heard it said the Dick Fosbury would be an incredibly wealthy man today, were it possible to patent a style. Professional soccer players, are also talking about some sort of artistic control over their performances. Let's make it so that any use of any word automatically results in a deduction from the offending speaker's bank account to the publisher who first filed claim on that word. Then the Bladerunners! B |
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01 Aug 01 - 05:46 AM (#518897) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: Fiolar As far as I am aware libraries are not free in the strict sense. They are supported at least in the UK by the rates which every householder pays to their local Council. If I want to own a book, I buy it. Other than that I am a keen supporter of library facilities and if necessary would be prepared to pay a certain amount for their upkeep rather than see them closed. |
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01 Aug 01 - 09:46 AM (#519011) Subject: RE: Copyright: Napster is dead. Who's next? From: GUEST For information on Dmitry Sklyarov, who was arrested under the anti-trafficking provisions of the DMCA because (1) he wrote a program that can convert encrypted e-book files to plain PDF and (2) the company he works for, Elcomsoft, for a short time offered the program for sale to U.S. customers, click here. |