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25 Sep 02 - 10:22 AM (#790966) Subject: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Kim C I couldn't get SuperSearch to work this morning! Anyway, I was watching Ken Burns' Civil War, and heard a tune that was almost exactly like the Foggy Dew melody (that would be the Easter Uprising of 1916 Foggy Dew, not the Burl Ives one). The only difference was, it was in waltz time, and the chorus part was a little different. As I understand it, the words were written by Francis O'Neill, who was a tune collector himself. Was this an older tune he had collected? What is it? Any ideas? Thanks -------------- KFC |
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25 Sep 02 - 10:44 AM (#790981) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Alice See the earlier thread The Foggy Dew
Subject: RE: The Foggy Dew
....snip.... The air "belonged to an old love song, recorded in 1913 by John McCormack". I'm not sure what that last refers to - although the air is certainly used (with slight differences) for "The Banks of the Moorlough Shore" - which is a beautiful love song!
Subject: RE: The Foggy Dew
The tune is traditional, almost certainly taken by Fr O'Neill from the very popular "Moorlough Shore". The origins of this song and the location of "Moorlough" or "moor lough" are uncertain but generally taken to be Moorlough Bay on the north Antrim coast, not a million miles from Portglenone where Fr O'Neill was born and raised. There was a very scholarly thread on "Moorlough Shore", last year I think. |
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25 Sep 02 - 11:59 AM (#791048) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Kim You had me puzzled for a moment..... That "Fr" is an abbreviation for "Father" i.e. a Catholic Priest, in this case. Regards p.s. It should, of course, be "Fr." |
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25 Sep 02 - 12:14 PM (#791061) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Kim C I believe it's supposed to stand for Francis... |
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25 Sep 02 - 12:21 PM (#791067) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Noreen Not that I've come across, Kim, whereas it does commonly stand for Father. |
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25 Sep 02 - 12:23 PM (#791070) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Noreen Captain Francis O'Neill, on the other hand, did collect a few tunes... |
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25 Sep 02 - 12:32 PM (#791078) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Kim C As stated in the original post, it was Francis O'Neill who wrote the Foggy Dew lyrics, and I'm sure that's what the other poster meant by "Fr". Now, does anyone have any more information on the tune? I'm not finding anything about it except that it's "old." |
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25 Sep 02 - 02:50 PM (#791180) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Big Tim FATHER O'Neill wrote the lyrics in 1919 after being disapointed at some of the bickering among republicans in the Provisional Dail (Parliament) of 1919. He saw it as being in sharp contrast with the heroic sacrifice made by the rebels of the 1916 Rising against British rule who had given their lives for a pure, independent republic. |
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25 Sep 02 - 02:56 PM (#791185) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Big Tim PS: I got the info by writing to the librarian of the Catholic Church in Northern Ireland. |
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25 Sep 02 - 04:30 PM (#791241) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: MartinRyan Aaaaaaaaaagh...... Regards |
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25 Sep 02 - 07:42 PM (#791363) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Noreen The tune is traditional, almost certainly taken by Fr O'Neill from the very popular "Moorlough Shore". (Big Tim, quoted by Alice, above) You want more, Kim? :0) |
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26 Sep 02 - 03:59 AM (#791526) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Big Tim Fr. Charles O'Neill (1887-1963) is sometimes confused with his brother Patrick, who was also a priest, regarding authorship of FD. Charles spent all of his clerical life in the north, at Belfast, Kilcoo and Newcastle where he is buried. I don't know any more about him but the librarian referred to above sent me a photo of Fr. Charles, smiling and relaxed, in the company of De Valera and Frank Aiken (Chief of Staff IRA in 1923, later Free State government minister). This, it seems to me, would imply that the good priest was well quoted in the highest of Irish government circles. |
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26 Sep 02 - 10:34 AM (#791737) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Kim C All right, then. I obviously had erroneous information about which O'Neill wrote the song. My mistake. Yes, I do want more. "Traditional" and "much older" are too vague. I need a date, if one can be found. Thanks. :-) |
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26 Sep 02 - 11:12 AM (#791763) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Alice Kim, did you look at the threads on "Moorlough Shore" as quoted above? For history of the tune you need to read about Moorlough Shore, not Foggy Dew. |
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26 Sep 02 - 12:07 PM (#791806) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Kim C Yes, I did, once I finally got the Super Search to work. The only dates given are for when the song was recorded, none for when it first appeared. |
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29 Nov 02 - 11:21 AM (#837196) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: GUEST,Chanter The tune used in the Foggy Dew (Moorlough shore) can also be heard in a number of other Irish/Gaelic/Celtic songs. A Breton song (recorded by Alain Stivell I think - who sings in Breton, English and possibly French) called St. Malo uses a very similar air. |
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29 Nov 02 - 11:35 AM (#837212) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Big Tim Alain Stivell also recorded "The Foggy Dew" so maybe he borrowed the melody: love his pronunciation of "squadrons" in the song: "squiedrons"! |
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29 Nov 02 - 03:49 PM (#837358) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Big Tim Check out Alain Stivell folks, if you haven't already. |
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27 Jun 07 - 07:06 AM (#2088117) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: GUEST,J V M WHERE CAN I FIND THE SONG. I NEED IT |
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27 Jun 07 - 07:23 AM (#2088123) Subject: RE: Help: Foggy Dew (1916) Tune From: Keith A of Hertford Links at top of this thread? |
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20 Sep 16 - 07:29 AM (#3810556) Subject: RE: Help: The Foggy Dew (Fr. O'Neill): tune? From: GUEST Can anyone tell me where I can get a photograph of Eamon de Valera standing with Canon Charles O'Neill and Frank Aiken? |
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20 Sep 16 - 02:40 PM (#3810608) Subject: RE: Help: The Foggy Dew (Fr. O'Neill): tune? From: GUEST,Martin Ryan Hi GUEST Any reason to believe such exists? If so, your best bet is probably to check out the websites of the National Museum of Ireland and The Irish Traditional Music Archive, for openers. Regards |
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21 Sep 16 - 12:01 PM (#3810713) Subject: RE: Help: The Foggy Dew (Fr. O'Neill): tune? From: mayomick Martin, see Big Tim's post from 2 sept ."the librarian referred to above sent me a photo of Fr. Charles, smiling and relaxed, in the company of De Valera and Frank Aiken" |
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21 Sep 16 - 01:59 PM (#3810728) Subject: RE: Help: The Foggy Dew (Fr. O'Neill): tune? From: Seamus Kennedy I believe he ended up as Canon Charles O'Neill. |
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26 Apr 21 - 06:36 PM (#4103627) Subject: RE: Help: The Foggy Dew (Fr. O'Neill): tune? From: Lighter In spite of the excellence otherwise of Ken Burns's Civil War, there seems to be no record of the "O'Neill" "Foggy Dew" tune having been known in America in the 1860s. Not that it's impossible, but rather few people would likely have been familiar with it. |
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26 Apr 21 - 07:05 PM (#4103633) Subject: RE: Help: The Foggy Dew (Fr. O'Neill): tune? From: Lighter See also my post just now to this thread: /mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=84794&messages=16 |