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22 Sep 03 - 08:31 PM (#1023264) Subject: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: black walnut Someone emailed me today for information about a dulcimer they heard recently. I play fretted (Appalachian) dulcimer, so that's how the contact was made, but it turns out that the person is interested in finding out about/purchasing/taking lessons for an Iraq hammered dulcimer. I came up with something (Google search) called a Santur, which may be the item in question, or it may be a related instrument: Santur (Dulcimer) Abstract: Dulcimer (Santour) is an Iranian musical instrument which for the first time was recorded in Assyrian and Babylonian stone inscriptions in 669 B.S. Santour was christened dulcimer in English literature since 1400 A.D. and nowadays more than 10 types of Iraqi, Egyptian, Indian and Turkish dulcimers and are made and played in other countries. Does anyone here know if I'm getting warm? ~b.walnut |
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22 Sep 03 - 08:51 PM (#1023274) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Malcolm Douglas That's probably the one. I take it you're in the USA? Here's a start: http://www.santur.com/ |
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22 Sep 03 - 09:18 PM (#1023283) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Phil Cooper I agree with Malcolm, it's most likely a santour. Our former hammer dulcimer bandmate, Paul Goelz I believe recorded one when he was living in the Chicago area. If you want, I can pursue that further. I need to get a hold of him anyway. |
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22 Sep 03 - 09:23 PM (#1023287) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: open mike there is a concert on that page recorded yesterday. which you can listen to..an hour long i think-realaudio |
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22 Sep 03 - 09:26 PM (#1023291) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: open mike the real audio fiile is of musicians form iran who call their music persian. |
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23 Sep 03 - 06:07 AM (#1023423) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Wilfried Schaum You're not only getting warm - it's really hot! It's a long time ago I saw Santurs played, but the oriental versions didn't differ much. The word santur is common in Arabic, Persian, and Turkic for the hammered dulcimer Wilfried |
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23 Sep 03 - 06:54 AM (#1023442) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: black walnut This is great! Thank you all so much. I will pass on this information to the person who asked me about it. She'll be really pleased. (Oh, and by the way Malcolm, I'm Canadian.) ~b. walnut |
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23 Sep 03 - 07:22 AM (#1023446) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: greg stephens Alas there is no dulcimer player among the Iraqi Kurdish people who have recently settled here in Stoke(England), but I've seen a lot of good players on videos that a lot of people have,taken from Kurdish TV programmes, and also made at private parties. Some of the music is rhytmic dance music, but there is also some very intricate and embellished slow-air type playing, which I find absolutely lovely.The instrument looks pretty much similar to an English hammer dulcimer: I'm not sure about the tuning. |
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23 Sep 03 - 07:33 AM (#1023452) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Malcolm Douglas Whoops. Sorry about that! I know how annoying it can be when people assume, as I did. There was a very impressive Iranian santur player attached to the Music dept. at Sheffield University for a while, and I had the opportunity of hearing him play a few times. He did a concert with Pauline Cato the Northumbrian piper on one occasion; unfortunately I missed that. A combination of the two instruments would have been very interesting indeed. |
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23 Sep 03 - 11:22 AM (#1023518) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy the santur (santoor, santour) is common throughout Northern India, Iran, Iraq, Turkey etc. In eastern Europe it becomes the cymbalom, in china and the east it's called yangqin (yang-chin, yang-chen). one of the widest ranging instruments in the world, and adaptable to all the modes & styles of music played on it. |
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23 Sep 03 - 03:31 PM (#1023715) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: open mike i believe the language otherwise known as Persian might also be calle Farsi. |
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23 Sep 03 - 03:39 PM (#1023720) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Thomas the Rhymer I'm wondering if it matters, ...but the santur predates "Iraq" by about two thousand years... ttr |
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24 Sep 03 - 01:06 AM (#1024119) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: LadyJean Diderot's Encycolpedia includes, as near as I can figure it, pictures of just about every instrument known in his time, including several that looked like a dulcimer. I think you can find facsimiles translated into English. If that's any help. OH! There's a lot of Iraqis in the Detroit area. Do you know anyone up there. I do. |
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24 Sep 03 - 02:51 AM (#1024137) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Wilfried Schaum Bill - the dulcimer is still hammered in the Bavarian Alps, where it is called Hackbrett = chopping board. Greg - Oriental and Western tunings differ in one important aspect: Oriental music knows and uses additional quarter tones, Western not. open mike - names of people and their languages seem to be only different when you consider the languages they use them. E. g. European Persian is Iranian Parsî and Arabic Farsî, since the Arabs don't know the sound P in their system. Wilfried |
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26 Sep 03 - 03:44 AM (#1025042) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Roger the Skiffler Is that a weapon of musical destruction? RtS |
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28 Sep 03 - 04:40 PM (#1025930) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Wilfried Schaum Oh Roger - definitely not, but an instrument of musical edification. Wilfried |
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28 Sep 03 - 10:40 PM (#1026097) Subject: RE: Anyone familiar with an Iraq dulcimer? From: Bert I have a santur. It has four strings per course and is tuned in octaves. Each course has it's own bridge so that the tuning can be changed to accomodate odd quarter notes when they occur. |