How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?

26 Sep 03 - 06:15 AM (#1025104)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: tuggy mac

i still feel strange,my shrink said id get used to it!

tuggy mac

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26 Sep 03 - 06:18 AM (#1025112)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: fat B****rd

I was pleasantly surprised to find so many people who not only liked Leadbelly's music but had lots of information about him.
Since then I've constantly been amazed at the variety of topics on here.
In answer to your question: Fine, just fine.
All the best from the fB and good luck with your degree.

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26 Sep 03 - 06:18 AM (#1025113)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: kendall

I felt like a clam digger at a Mensa convention.

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26 Sep 03 - 06:19 AM (#1025115)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: tuggy mac

its like scitzo phreania(Spelt wrong) some times your just talking to yourself and then at other times you hear hundreds of other voices! Do you get where im coming from.

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26 Sep 03 - 06:48 AM (#1025132)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: VIN

Sometimes its nice to chat without somebody analyzing your body language - if you see wot i mean.

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26 Sep 03 - 07:03 AM (#1025142)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

I was amazed and delighted, and confused. I never had any sense of it being difficult to break in, or of it being a stand-offish clique.

Here's a link to a song I wrote soon after I started mudcatting, which sums it up - The Blue Clicky Thing. And I still feel the same way, only more so, especially the last verse and chorus.

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26 Sep 03 - 12:04 PM (#1025145)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: tuggy mac

resistance is tactile! borg fan.

Tuggy mac.

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26 Sep 03 - 12:48 PM (#1025164)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,MMario

When I first started I was:

1) amazed at the wealth of knowledge already available

2) astounded by the wealth of knowledge offered in answer to questions (and the speed at which it was offered)

3) awed at the expertise of many of the posters

4) totally floored when people took me and my responses seriously.

Not my first experience with an online community. One of which was welcoming - three or four of which I backed out of because they were definately clique-ish and one which was hostile to newcomers.

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26 Sep 03 - 01:17 PM (#1025173)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

I'm a member and can anyone tell me what a newbie is please, as I am new to this new language.
I can only speak English and I don't understand gobbledigook like this.

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26 Sep 03 - 01:29 PM (#1025181)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Mr Red

Q When you first started being a member of mudcat, how did it feel?

A 1999 I think. Like the first folk club after the lean years of marriage (lean folkwise and in all the usual wedded bliss ways). The light had finally been switched-on.

Q Were you scared? Did it take a while to find your way around?

A No. Not overly but then I just dived-in and asked questions - and you could see that generally in those days.

Q Was it your first experience of being in an online community?

A Yes

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26 Sep 03 - 01:40 PM (#1025196)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: nutty

I was new to computers as well as new to mudcat. The advice and information so generously given helped me to navigate through the vast amount of knowledge I needed.

I found that whatever I needed to know, someone here on mudcat had the answer and that answer would be one that I could act on with confidence.

It was like finding that I had a new and amazingly large, set of friends. In my early days, we regularly met for internet singarounds, first on "hear me" and later on "Pal talk".
I discovered that like all communities differences of opinion occur and I regret that this resulted in some people leaving Mudcat.
One of the best spin-offs for me has been the Mudcat gatherings and more recently Mudchat.

Mudcat is still growing and I am still discovering new things but the internet (or the world) will never be a scary place with the strength, knowledge and friendship of a multitude of mudcatters to support me

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26 Sep 03 - 01:42 PM (#1025199)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Sorcha

When I found it, I read a bunch of threads, did my homework basically, and after I felt I knew enough just jumped right in. It felt like home the first day. It never felt 'cliquie' to me and I was welcomed warmly. In fact, I did my homework soo well that another member was convincd I was really katlaughing in disguise.......it was pretty funny to us.

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26 Sep 03 - 01:58 PM (#1025214)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Clinton Hammond

Ya know, I think I had more broad respect for Mudcat, when it was just a tool for me... I'd come from time to time looking for lyrics... sometimes I'd find 'em... some times not...

Slowly I kinda stated digging deeper into the 'community' (I use quotes, cxause I don't really know that it is... just cause you call it that, don't make it so...) and the further in I got I found more and more warts...

For the most part now I try to ignore the warts, and use mudcat as a side-line communication tool with some of the good folks i've met here...

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26 Sep 03 - 03:02 PM (#1025250)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Charley Noble

I remember one of my friends encouraged me for over a year to check in here back in 2000. I thought he was wasting a whole lot of time on his "Mudcat addiction." Finally, I gave it a try, scrolled through some old threads, checked out what people had to say about obscure folk music topics, got familar with the interface, and decided it was very intersting. I was able to recover some songs from fragments that I'd been working with for years. As a songwriter I had fun responding to song challenges, and received some good advice on other song projects. I love some of the outrageous stories that are periodically generated, and the outrageous puns. Initially, I felt wary about posting my own comments, and only did so as a "guest" for about a year. Now I'm confident enough to post under my assumed Mudcat name.

When traveling, Mudcat has been an outstanding resource for locating music contacts in unfamilar cities, something which was often impossible to do before Mudcat. I can now put faces to some of the friendly talented members who frequent this site.

I probably don't post as much as I used to do during my initial "I'm in a candy store and look at everything that's here" period but I still feel it's the most satisfying community website I've ever experienced, warts and all!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

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26 Sep 03 - 03:48 PM (#1025269)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

I can't see how anyone posting as "Busbitter frae Saltcoats Scotland" can assert "I can only speak English"...

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26 Sep 03 - 03:57 PM (#1025274)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: izzy

Amazed to find there were other people with interests like mine in the world. So many kindred spirits on Mudcat it's mindboggling.

I got nervous once when I encountered a troll, however --(you can put that in the "cons" area of your paper:;)

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26 Sep 03 - 04:03 PM (#1025278)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Jack the Sailor

I thought "this is a cool site" It was one of my first binternet experiences so I lurked for a bit looking for crazies. I found lots of them then jumped write in to the song concerts and the Welcome back Spaw Tavern. some time later I encountered my wife toe be. THe charming and beautiful loveable eccentric known as Carolc.

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26 Sep 03 - 04:18 PM (#1025287)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,MMario

???? you are doing study of online communities and this is the *only* place you've encountered the term 'troll'?

Please! You have to be kidding - or trolling yourself! I think I learned about "trolls" withing about 30 seconds of getting on the internet. (humerous exageration)

And the mudcat - for all that people gripe - is for it's activity one of the lesser troll gathering spots I've encountered - and certainly there are less flames here then in many forums I read.

'troll' in internet terms is someone who deliberatley baits others or posts inflammatory remarks. 'to troll/trolling' is to try to get others to respond to such remarks.

and 'flaming' is unjustified/gratuitious critiscism and/or derogatory comments regarding a poster.

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26 Sep 03 - 04:35 PM (#1025292)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Justa Picker

Consistently insignificant.
Such a pity I don't sing. :-)

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26 Sep 03 - 04:51 PM (#1025298)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: kitchen piper

lol, I'm not a singer either!
Nope never heard the word troll. Yes heard the word flame.

Either trolling is an American term, or because I generally am in educational communities involving children, I've not heard the term.
I have come across trolls though, just never heard the term.

hey ho!

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26 Sep 03 - 05:20 PM (#1025319)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: katlaughing

JP, take off that hair shirt!:-)

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26 Sep 03 - 05:59 PM (#1025339)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

I've visited a fair nunber of sites people where people argue and sound off and exchange information - but this is the only one I've come across that I'd think of classing as a community based within the Internet.

The shared, if varied, interest in folkmusic (and certain qualities about folk music, especially it's collective aspect, and the absence of boundaries between performers and listeners) provides a basis which allows differences about other things to be aired without breaking things irreparably.

What brings us together and holds us together is more important than what pulls us apart, and I think that is necessaary for anything that can really be deemed a community in any setting.

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26 Sep 03 - 06:39 PM (#1025352)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bill D

well, I had been a member of a 'folk community' for years before the WWW/Internet (they are NOT the same thing) came along, and I knew how wide ranging the interests of folkies were, so when the database was expanded and made part of the Mudcat Cafe, I was ready. It was like opening a BIG window.

I think it is VERY important to understand that people's minds work differently and that not everyone 'sees' these names in the threads as having the same degree of reality. Some folks are much slower to interact and respond to names as real people, and have difficulty dealing with issues without voice and body language to help define what is happening.

Yes...as an 'open' forum, this place is sometimes a target for craziness that you might not see in a group where we only met face-to-face, but it has led to LOTS of **real** interaction and a community that encompasses the world now....With all these positive benefits, the little blips of malcontents and critics have been 'relatively' minor hassles, no matter how tedious they are at the time.

We almost ALWAYS greet obvious newcomers with friendliness and we fret when someone does NOT feel welcome. We are people, and subject to the same faults and the same virtues as people you meet every day...some are more to your liking than others. But here, they are in many ways easier to deal with (if you think carefully before typing..*grin*

I'm in my 7th year, and hope to be around for many more.

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26 Sep 03 - 07:00 PM (#1025360)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: artbrooks

I've moved around a lot because of my (former-now retired) job, so I've cultivated the habit of becoming at home quickly. I was comfortable here very soon after I began, I guess primarily because my opinions, when I ventured to express them, were either welcomed or, at the minimum, not put down. I did have to be told several times about feeding the trolls, but I think I've mostly gotten over that. This is generally a very pleasant place to spend a couple of hours each day.

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26 Sep 03 - 08:39 PM (#1025413)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Nancy King

I was a "lurker" for a long time before actually signing up, partly because I tended to look at Mudcat at work (during slow times on duty in the library) but couldn't join from there because of the cookie thing. When I found myself wanting to post from home, I signed up, and haven't looked back.

Early on, when I was still posting as a GUEST, I received a rather sharp answer to a wrong guess I made in answer to a query. Jeez, I thought, no need to be snotty about it! I soon discovered, however, that most 'Catters are not only knowledgeable and helpful, but also patient and funny. I've learned a lot, gotten some great advice, found words to many songs, laughed a lot, and made some real friends.

Thanks, Folks!
Nancy

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26 Sep 03 - 08:43 PM (#1025419)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Ebbie

JP, someone who plays like you doesn't need to sing! What? You want it all?

Incidentally, there is a local Juneau boy - just turned 13, a shy, quiet kid almost 6 feet tall who has had an acoustic guitar for almost a year now and he's fingerpicking up a storm, things like (ah ha!) 'Don't Think Twice'. So I lent him one of the CDs I got from JP. He is enthralled. I have every expectation of hearing him play 'Buckdancer's Choice' one of these days, and a lot of the other cuts. If he continues as he is, he's going to be remarkably good. His phrasing and his control already are. (And no. He doesn't sing.)

By the way, my own favorites on that CD have shifted somewhat- I love the arrangements in your covers. (Who is *your* Joanne Shaw? Is that Joanne Shaw Taylor?)

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26 Sep 03 - 08:44 PM (#1025420)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Nancy King

P. S. --

JustaPicker -- You may not sing, but you sure can pick! Your cuts on the Mudcat CDs are anything BUT insignificant!

And to those who haven't bought their Mudcat CDs yet -- do it now! They really are terrific, and each sale helps keep the Mudcat going!

Cheers, Nancy

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26 Sep 03 - 08:52 PM (#1025423)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

The first Mensa convention, I went to, what with all the finest minds gathered, nobody had remembered to buy the milk for the coffee... :-)

And yes, Mensa even has Clam diggers and housewives!

I find internet communities useful.

Usage of the terms Trolling & Flames started off in the usenet newsgroups, about 2 decades ago.

No offence intended kitchenpiper but,
If you are doing formal study "for a masters, this module I am studying online communities and online learning" I am appalled - unless that sort of basic material has yet not been covered, but it is so basic that it should have been supplied within the first week or two - at the standards of the Instution initiating your study process...

Also, I am rather bemused that one is allowed to do a Masters level in an area of technical expertise with no relevant previous background... no wonder we had the rather volatile thread here about Academics recently, and no wonder some people were rather excited...

Many years ago, I once received a phone call from someone who had been given my name as some sort of "expert". He was doing a first year Uni subject on comparing the uses, pros & cons, etc of several computing languages. Now the students had not used (written code in!) most of those languages, and for some of them included in the assignment, that Uni did not even have the ability to run the code such as things like Smalltalk , which at the time was a rather esoteric language... I had the reputation of being able to read and make sense of code for over 30 prog languages at the time (I called that interest part of my 'hobby'), and I was very ready to admit that I had not had access to run code for some of them... most of my "knowledge" was gained by reading reference texts, the existence of which had not even been given to the students as "background material"...

Sorry, I'll get orf me soapbox nnnnow...

Robin

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26 Sep 03 - 09:15 PM (#1025430)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: kendall

Foolstroup, you take me too literally. I've known a hundred clam diggers and not one was a member of Mensa. It was an exaggeration, that all.

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26 Sep 03 - 09:29 PM (#1025436)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

I was jesting, a bit - I don't know any clam diggers - at least not any male ones ... :-)

Getting REALLY SERIOUS! the ability to pass the test to get into Mensa has no realtion to what employment one has....

and, please, the name is not "Foolstroup" but "Foolstroupe" with the last "e" -

The correct spelling is important for copyright reasons...

My friends often tell me that I am not serious enough... :-)

but I am a very literal person... :-)

Robin
Author of The Fooles Troupe

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26 Sep 03 - 09:31 PM (#1025437)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

Damn! it's really "Foolestroupe"

with the internal "e" as well

can't even type properly myself at times... :-)

Robin

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26 Sep 03 - 09:34 PM (#1025439)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bee-dubya-ell

I first visited The Mudcat Cafe about three years ago. I was made to feel so unwelcome that I became severely depressed, quit my job, left my wife, and drank myself to death. Then I learned that it's not how much you know about music that counts, it's how much you know about farts. Now that I've become reasonably adept at talking about farts I find that I'm very welcome and can even get by with posting remarkably stupid shit like this message and nobody asks me to leave. Bet it would be a lot of fun if I just weren't dead.

Bruce

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27 Sep 03 - 02:49 AM (#1025520)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Gurney

I felt a bit like Kendall, from reading the erudite posts.
Then I remembered a certain near-genius who couldn't keep his shoelaces tied... so I lurked a while..
Then I requested words, and got a reply immediately (I didn't thank him/her, but thanks now)..
Then I did a few tentative posts, when I was sure I was right...
Then I had some disagreements with other members, which inhibited me somewhat..
Then I replied to a troller (I'd never heard the term, but as an angler recognised the reference).. And enjoyed the barney..
Now I feel that the members here are a good bunch, and I feel as if I'm in a BIG community. And I miss MC when I can't get on.

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27 Sep 03 - 04:25 AM (#1025530)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Liz the Squeak

I just jumped straight in... Fools rush in where angels fear to tread, and find I'm there first eating all the chocolate. I was a bit nervous at first, because this was my first ever forum and my first ever chat room.

I enjoyed it because it discusses the things I know about - music, literature, farts, cats, the abolition of the melodeon, that sort of thing. But then I got into some of the more personal stuff, people asking for help on certain issues, things I'd had experience with, and it was good to a) share my knowledge and suggestions and b) know that there was someone out there who had gone through the same as me and survived it. Those experiences ranged from abusive partners to writers' block, via knitting and garden design.

It took me a while to start my first thread, but it rapidly became popular and that encouraged me to post more and more ludicrous items. From being nervous and tentative at the beginning, I now find I can be my real self and as outspoken as I am in person. My interests are shared, my opinion sought and my beliefs respected.

I've had my share of flames and trolls, if you don't feed the trolls they shut up, but the flamers are different. They get personal. Were I made of fainter hearted stuff, that would have put me off. One particular GUEST has the ability to turn any inoccuous comment into a personal diatribe, but occasionally they expose themselves for the sad, 'Mensa' reject that they are.

One thing that has particularly impressed me is the chat room. People actually chat about stuff other than sexual organs. Whether this is because they "knew" each other beforehand, or not I don't know, but it does seem that every other chatroom I've frequented is nothing but a forum for asking for, or advertising sexual favours and tendencies. Mudchatters and catters flirt outrageously but they don't all push it in your face (unless you pay extra). The humour is earthy and irreverent, but manages to stay mostly on the inoffensive side of the line (just). It may be that it's because it's a members only chat room and that if you are a member of Mudcat, it's because you want to talk about the same things. I'm on other forums that deal with one subject, but that's all they deal with. They are a tool, a means to an end; whereas, with all the sharing of common experiences and music, discussions on life, the universe and bodhrains, Mudcat is a proper community. The fact that we have had gatherings proves this. Many of us have gathered together in one place and shared what we have in common.

I've found some great new friends here, I'm not sorry that MSN is closing their chatrooms, I've never liked 'wet pussies' that much any way - they smell funny and leave muddy footprints over the kitchen floor.

But like others, I miss 'talking' with my 'virtual' friends when the site is down, just like I miss talking to the people I spend my reality life with. The fact that I've met many of those 'virtual' friends, makes it more frustrating that I can't chat with them via the 'Cat.

Max has created the most amazing place here. I don't think he ever envisaged this when he started it. Life would be duller and blander were it to disappear.

LTS

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27 Sep 03 - 05:54 AM (#1025548)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: C-flat

Because at first you only notice the extremes of Mudcat it can take a while to settle into it. There are some extremely clever and academic regulars, some outrageously funny regulars and the occassional outrageously unpleasant regular but, because this site has a common theme, one which most of us here share a passion for, you keep returning and, in doing so, begin to recognise and be familiar with dozens of names. After a while you begin to feel that you know these people, their views, and wether you'd enjoy an evening in their company.
I know there are those who would be happy to lose the BS element from this site but I do think it's instrumental in building a sense of community here and is a shortcut to getting to know one another.
I've never been a member of an on-line community before or ever visited a chat-room and I now realise how lucky I was to stumble across Mudcat having since had a look around at what else is out there.
There's rarely a day now that I don't look in and I get twitchy when the site is down for any length of time.

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27 Sep 03 - 06:07 AM (#1025549)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: katlaughing

There's a new diagnosis going round...St. Mudcatitus Dance...usually brought about in a state of withdrawal exhibited by twitching...this seems to be a *disorder* exclusive to the phenonmenon known simply as the "Mudcat" hence the "St. Mudcatitus Dance" appellation.:-)

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27 Sep 03 - 06:09 AM (#1025550)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: tartan babe

My first experience of the internet and chatting was awsome. I was bowled over by being able to talk to people from all over the world. Then along came mudcat and I was truly stunned at being able to talk about music with like minded people.

Once it's in your mind, being in a virtual community for me feels no different to being in a real one. I love Mudcat and feel a sense of loss everytime it's down. I have friends that are as real to me here as in my non virtual life.

It took a day or so to become familiar with mudcat and the navigation system, but it's quite simple really. I do get slightly scared of posting sometimes. Some posts make me quite mad and I really just want to post back, but I know that it's just not worth the agro.

I love the BS threads, they make the community more real. If it were just about music, things would become stilted and samey. This means that people can bring their real lives into their virtual one.

I've wittered on for long enough now, thanks Max you're great!!!!

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27 Sep 03 - 06:37 AM (#1025554)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bassic

My sentiments exactly C-flat, I think I have made some very good friends here. To the academics I say thanks for sharing your knowlege and please be patient with those of us whoes enjoyment in life comes from slightley less rarified heights! To the comedians amongst us, I say thank you for keeping a smile on our faces, especially when times are hard. To the permanently disgruntled and grumpy, I am sorry for your loss (of humour!) and I hope you feel better soon!

To answer your questions KP,

Though I quite understand C-flats points about noticing the extreems first, I have to say that I felt comfortable very quickly. It did help knowing one or two Mudcat "regulars" in person before I started looking on the site but I think I would have been an easy process anyway. I started looking on the site just over a year ago and came in right in the middle of the "Twillinsgate" Sagas and was completely hooked, just from the sheer entertainment value!!
I have explored most areas of the site now and found my way round fairly easily, but I have yet to explore the DT as I am not a singer. (I want online tunes, in standard notation, with sound please :-)
I enjoy the "local" element of the Cat, the fact that we have so many members in my part of the world (Yorks)and it makes organising local events and exchanging information SO much easier. However, I also greatly enjoy the international aspect of the Mudcat and I feel I have to consult now on matters of importance,(visits to the Doctor, Dentist, PC world, Music Shops etc etc) otherwise I would upset a great many people!! *grin*.
So, is it a community? It certainly feels like one to me. Its like walking down an "old fashioned" terrace of houses, front doors always open, conversations drifting out of open windows, kettle always "on the boil", jumpers for goal posts...................aaaaahhhhhhhhhh

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27 Sep 03 - 08:01 AM (#1025574)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Leadfingers

Having been reccomended to the Cat by Folk Club Friends, I rapidly found that I was more into the Cat than any of the people who had reccomended it.Like many others I started off lurking, and occasionally poking my nose in as Guest,But soon decided to take the plunge.I have had my wrist slapped in the past for stepping out of line,but in general seem to get on well with most of the people in here. Actually meeting Catters in the flesh is SO easy! it really seems as though we are part of a HUGE extended family,and a few P M's and a bit of time in Mudchat makes every body sem like an old friend.
More power to Mudcat and Max, Keep up the good work.

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27 Sep 03 - 08:17 AM (#1025578)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bassic

A rather ill thought out and rash statement I thought.... for an academically trained mind. To be "appalled" based on such a tiny piece of information, not only seems a very imprecise use of language, but to show an almost irresponsible (for such a high mind) lack of thought about possible reasons for the situation.

I was also SUPRISED (and I use that word with great thought and care) that KP had not come across the term "troll" in connection with internet usage.

But I would give her credit for being able to come across the term for herself, recognise its importance, have the initiative to solicit a definition, prime happy guitar to feed the flames (only joking:-), generate sufficient debate to produce examples and in the process LEARN. And all without having to be spoon fed the "basics" during freshers week!! Also this is just one module of the Masters, how much of the rest of it has anything to do with the Internet?

To use the driving analogy again, I would excuse the institution for failing to explain that gasoline in the US is the same as petrol in the UK, especially if the purpose of the main study is Transport Policy not comparative US/UK Fuel use. You would soon find out for yourself on your first visit to the US anyway, and if a student wasn't able to find that out, then I think a start back in primary school would be the order of the day.

Does "appalled" happen to live in Tonbridge Wells by any chance? I bet I know what newspaper he reads:-)

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27 Sep 03 - 08:21 AM (#1025579)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bobert

Ahhh, well Mudcat was (and still is) only the second joint I found on this pdder thing. I like it here but I feel more at home over in Tweedsburg (tweedsblues) which is like Mayberry, RFD compared to this big ol' city.

But like a city... It's higher energy here in the Catbox and people act more like folks that is stuck in Skinner's Box, You know, a little less patient. Now that ain't all bad. If I need lyrics to a song, I can get 'em generally in 5 minutes. Back at Tweeds it might be 3 or 4 hours, or days, or never. But being city cats and somewhat couped up, this impatience can lead to rude behavior. Some folks get downright testy. Now, I've been know to walk 'round rantin' over stuff my own self but I try not to be personal 'er rude 'bout it. Just loud. They won't let be do that at Tweedsburg so I come over here and get it out of my system. Is it scarey? Well, no. Sometimes a little embarassin' but I just go and do it anyway.

As fir how I was treated? Well, the folks here who have agree with my rants have treated me purdy danged good and those who don't, fir the most part, have treated me between good *minus* and bad *plus*...

Don't know if that helps at all, but good luck with yer research. It's a very interestin' subject and I hope you will put a link to yer final paper.

Bobert

---

27 Sep 03 - 11:27 AM (#1025632)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

KP and I have chatted via PM.

Just a few quick points...

***
> Are suggesting that there is a universally recognised paper about mudcat?

NO, but that is a good troll of yours mate! :-) Good red herring too!

There ARE some universally recognised things (by the experienced) about OLC's, (if you don't know WHAT they are, then Are You Experienced? as Jimmy asked!) - one would expect that the Experienced in a Formal Institute of Training would not turn the total newbies loose without some sort of basic guide - or even a basic Bibliographical list ... I am grateful that this forum doesn't allow the quoting of previous posts in the response to a post, Max would probably gave run out of storage space by now... :-)


***
> Should this "basic material" remain gospel ... or can it be challenged by new research?

Oh, that was well covered in the thread on Academics! And in the one on Ullillellelen, er whatever, pipes!

***
> How do you know KP doesn't have the allegedly requisite technical expertise or background?

If one KNEW what a Troll was in this sort of environment, why would one say one didn't, unless one was trolling?

Wait on, my head hurts now.. <:-O

***
> "technical" infers that an understanding of on-line communities depends upon primary knowledge of programming et al

NO. NO. NO.

Doesn't even _imply_ it either :-)

Red herring!

***
BASIC MATERIAL - "Appalled" is an emotional response, not amenable to intellectual analysis... :-)

However, I _am_ surprised at the new US Marines Training manual. It seems that they are going to cut costs by not wasting time training marines about gun safety - they can pick that up as they go along - those that survive... :-)

***
The driving analogy is not really good. We drive on the other side of the road - I suppose I would find that out sooner or later if I drove in the US, after I figured out where the steering wheel was... As an Aussie I know more about US culture than most Americans know about Aussie culture (What! no kangaroos in the main street?) - we get it shoved into our faces on Aussie TV all the time... :-)

***
Who said I was an academically trained mind? I'm just a Fool! I'm insulted!

***
The Fooles Troupe lives in Gotham, I live in Brisbane... :-)
And yes, we do have toilet paper on a roll here ... :-)

***
> In the same way .... in order to drive my car ... I need to know how to interact with all the other people on the road ... and know how to control my car to do that. I don't really need to know what that red wire under the dashboard does.

So if it's loose, just pull it out - if it's really important, you'll soon learn about it... :-)

Was chatting with an ex-SAS guy the other day. He was _bemused_ when the US forces guy was astonished at the Aussie forces knowing how to change a tyre. The US guy said he was not a "specialist" in that area, had to wait for the tyre changing guy to come along... I was _appalled_ - but still laughed!

***
It's a pity that the polite statement that one does not wish to cause offence is automatically taken as meaning that the poster MUST be a Troll. Trolls like to start fights among others not calm them down. You could always check my past behaviour by clicking on my name to get all my past postings, rather than just jump to hasty conclusions to ASS-U-ME that I was Trolling... :-)

Ah the cynicsm of the modern age...



Robin

---

27 Sep 03 - 12:35 PM (#1025657)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Rick Fielding

Well, I went to a Mensa meeting one time and found it to be just about the dullest evening I've ever spent. The people (AS A GROUP) were tedious, dumb and dull. Individually I'm sure they'd be as interesting as anyone else.

I've never been to a clam diggers convention, but if Kendall was there I'm sure there'd at least be incomprehensible humour!

If you have manners you'll be welcomed into Mudcat so fast it'll make your head spin. If you have attitude, it'll take longer.......but you'll still be welcomed......'cuz folkies are like that.

Cheers

Rick

---

27 Sep 03 - 12:47 PM (#1025661)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bassic

Hook, line, sinker, copy of the "Angling Times"

---

27 Sep 03 - 12:56 PM (#1025663)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

There does seem to be a certain tendency for the mildest conversation to be sidetracked into quarrels. I think it's   a characteristic of the Internet as a medium, rather than the Mudcat in particular.

I think the jargon of "trolling" and "flaming" sometimes gets in the way of communication, because these are words which are used in a number of different senses. I think when we want to accuse people of being unfriendly or frivolous or provocative or whatever it's better to spell it out in old-fashioned English.

For checking out how the Mudcat has developed over the years, here is the place to go - the Mudcat archives on the Wayback Machine, all the way back to ancient history in 1998...

---

27 Sep 03 - 12:58 PM (#1025664)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Amergin

well i'm sure you would hear better jokes at a clamdiggers convention anyways...

---

27 Sep 03 - 11:32 PM (#1025681)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Ebbie

St. Mudcatter's Dance

Approach with a smile
Reach out and touch
CLICK
Whirl around and depart

Put on a hopeful smile
Sneak back, lean forward
CLICK
Whirl around and depart

Whirl around, whirl around
Perhaps t'will change your luck
CLICK
Whirl around, dance away

Put on a wistful smile
Reach out and touch
CLICK (HUZZAH!)
Leap straight up and land on chair

Any other moves? These are the ones I tend to use. :)

---

28 Sep 03 - 12:25 AM (#1025690)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Amos

I tried Mensa twice, a few years apart -- went through the whole "test-and-join-and go to meetin'" loop twice...they were really good and counting backwards by sevens and finding all the little words hidden inside the full name of Millard Fillmore. But for ordinary intelligence they were, by and large, highly uninspiring. The biggest thing they were missing in general was a sense of humor. That was my experience, anyway. The Mudcat has it all over Mensa, in my humble opinion.

A

---

28 Sep 03 - 03:53 AM (#1025709)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Menolly

When you first started being a member of mudcat, how did it feel?
I first visited about a year ago, had a little look round, knew I was not very interested in the blues side of things, found it very American that day and so left.
Were you scared? Did it take a while to find your way around?
Yes, everyone seemed much more knowledgable.Also they all seemed to instrumentalists, many of whom also sang and/or wrote their own music. As just a singer doing occational floorspots, I felt very lowly. I did have difficulty finding my way arround. I wasn't sure where to go.
Some months later I started realising how many people were mudcatters and that tempted me back in.
Was it your first experience of being in an online community?
Yes, and it still is. I feel no desire to roam. I have found it very adictive. Is there a cure?
I read quite a few of the threads but rarely feel I have anything to contribute. I think I have started 2 threads and my question was very quickly solved. Does make me feel I should learn more!

---

28 Sep 03 - 03:55 AM (#1025710)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Liz the Squeak

I knew a former Mensa chairman. He's as dull as sterilised water. Ditchwater is quite interesting, it has millions of little things flapping round in it. Talking to this guy gave you, to paraphrase from 'To kill a Mockingbird' "the sensation of slowly settling to the bottom of the sea".

Mudcat is made of real people who like to interact with each other and learn about what makes the other person tick. Most other chatrooms are just full of people who want to get into your pants or show you their private parts. At least on here, the sex maniacs wait until they've been introduced.

LTS

---

28 Sep 03 - 06:12 AM (#1025733)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

The reason why I wrote 'I can only understand English' is because I don't know any other languages, espeically the Computer one, because I'm still new to it all.
I am a simple man, I just like things to simple, I also like it when people explain thinngs to me in a nice simple way.
I don't like smart asses who think that I am stupid, who think that everyone on this website can understand what is written.
Because some people aren't as smart as others.

All I did was ask a simple question that's all, and then I told the truth, I just can't understand all this computer talk.
Tom

---

28 Sep 03 - 06:24 AM (#1025737)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST

Nicely put but you know its a cultural thing.....talking down to those unfortunate enough not to be English. They just can't help it!

---

28 Sep 03 - 07:29 AM (#1025756)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

Yes,
Rick, Amos, Liz,

I left Mensa quite a while ago... Your stories say you know why... :-)


Robin

---

28 Sep 03 - 07:38 AM (#1025760)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Liz the Squeak

Fooles - I don't think it was you - you've posted some quite erudite things. He couldn't even spell erudite. And he had the common sense of the average hedgehog. Years of book learning and being able to spot the mean prime number don't mean diddly if you can't understand the simple concept of coming in out of the rain.

Welcome to the "real" world at last though!

LTS

---

28 Sep 03 - 09:07 AM (#1025777)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

Thanks Liz -

Getting the score 135 on the mensa test means just that you did just that! It means Sweet Fanny Adams in the realities of life!

Why would I want to come out of the rain? Saves having to wash!

I have graduated from the SCA too... :-) I grew up!

I'm a Wordsmith (my main field of expertise - look for the BS thread on Toby Day Afternoon ), who is also highly competent in technical and mechanical and engineering areas, as long as it does not involve hand-eye coordination. But I do have an extreme sense of humour, and I no longer care if others can see the humurous links I make or not - if you do, hang on and enjoy the ride!

In Blacksmithing, for example, I have difficulty in striking accurately with the hammer (so the hammered work always looks like "a dog's breakfast"), but I can build a welding fire in the forge in my sleep, and I can temper tool steel (a visual controlled skill) exceptionally well - a natural at it. But I couldn't make a living at Blacksmithing. I could also do the acid/base titrations in Analyl Chem better than anyone else - so much that the lecturer used to get me to do the demo to demonstrate that any klutz (taking into account my performance in the rest of the lab practice!) could do the titrations - where you have to get that last drop to just faintly colour the whole flask... :-)

So I have kept trying many things...
many many things,
many many many things...
(get the British Comedy reference?)

And that's the problems with Formal Education. Because of the physical damage in some very small areas of the brain, I have difficulty remembering cold facts - I have to remember them in a relational frame, which is why I am a natural at seeing relationships among many apparently unrelated fields - a "specialising generalist"... For open book exams I get near 100% - for things like calculus, where you need to remember the magic formulae to do the derivations/integration, I am too slow to pass the exams in the time allotted. But I am exceptional in Spherical Geometry - doing 10 years of Amateur Theatre Lighting, before getting involved in other interests. I could read the play, watch the rehersal, then see the lighting hang plot in my head... and it worked...

Same reason why I am not a Classical concert pianist - but I am good at improvising and sight reading, but hopeless at remembering more than three tunes at once... they also tend to run together, which produces some amusing results at times... :-)

The problem with those who are above average is that they tend to think that they are smarter than every body else. The ego gets in the way. I know my limitations, and am always ready to acknowledge those who are my betters, but not those who just think they are. I am happy to let them have the last word, since they need it for their ego's sake...

The old saying "Those who think they are smarter than everybody else just annoy those of us who are" is true.

I hope others, especially teachers, these days do not treat children the way I was treated at school in the 1950's.

I was abused, put down, humiliated in front of classes and the whole school, given endless "cuts" - hits on the hand with a flexible piece of cane, hundreds of hours of "handwriting practice" after school (imagine wht the result was like - we used a nib and ink in those days!)

for two main reasons -
a) my micro-motor control problem meant that handwriting and any other task involving hand-eye coordination was a disaster (I can't even read my own "chicken scratches" sometimes - makes Lecture Notes a pain! and I generate hundreds of typos, and typos while correcting the typos while doing data entry like this!),

b) and I often could complete the sentence of an average teacher, before they finished it, so I had my answer ready before they expected it, so I must have been a smart-arse too!

I was labelled as a "Problem Child". I also was treated to the "labelling as a non-person" thing, as well as nothing I did, no matter how creative, produced nothing but a put down, never any praise.

In fact the more creative I am the more hostile cloth heads are, so now I know when I get attacked, I am most likely on the right track! Only when amongst really competent people in any particular field am I given respect.

When I did the Mensa test - I failed (about 120 - below 135 - the entry point!) - but when I did the Wasir - I got Plus 5 SD!!!

Simple - because of the micromotor "clerical skills" being factored out in the Wasir, but smeared all through the Mensa style tests. I am bloody hopless at those mensa tests they publish every where. But the mensa psychologist who evaluated my results said, "unusual, but perfectly normal - that's why the Wasir was invented!"

:-)

So much for Thread Creep...

Robin
The Thread Creep! :-)

---

28 Sep 03 - 09:16 AM (#1025778)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

So back to the orignal thread concept question ... :-)

Apart from a few W******, I have been treated well by those who really know well what they are talking about, and don't need to play "put-down" games for the sake of their ego.

It's a terrific resource! Thanks Max, Joe, et. al. ...

Robin

---

28 Sep 03 - 02:11 PM (#1025841)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Amos

Robin:

Not to encourage your self-absorption or anything, but what could "unusual but normal" possibly mean? Statistically rare, but still tolerable to the expert for subjective reasons?

A

---

28 Sep 03 - 02:30 PM (#1025849)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

frae is nae English, busbitter

---

28 Sep 03 - 03:14 PM (#1025879)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,Gimpy

Ignored. That's how I feel. Spurned, scorned, and rejected. I had thought that people would rally to my cause and see that horses were forthwith banned from all public thoroughfares, but No! A bland silence is all I get from you philistines! Very well. Be heartless. I shall persist and endure, and in the end I shall triumph over equine perfidy and corrupt law enforcement officials!

Arthur

---

28 Sep 03 - 03:38 PM (#1025899)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Amos

Geeze, Gimpy,

You're not supposed to bring horses to this kind of a forum!!

Are we supposed to know what you're on about? These truncated references waving in the breeze -- is that a form of English humour?


A

---

28 Sep 03 - 06:20 PM (#1025984)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

Got to be careful bringing horses here. There are a lot of people prejudiced against the idea that they can sing.

---

28 Sep 03 - 06:39 PM (#1025997)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bassic

Amos, do the click on Gimpys name, look at his previous postings, add them together and it makes sence, honest!

---

28 Sep 03 - 06:42 PM (#1025998)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,Gimpy

I had thought that the entire civilized world was already well aware of the indignities I have suffered recently, but apparently not. Very well, Amos, I shall repeat my story for your benefit:

(first posted on 26th September, 2003 on September Punch the Horse thread)

Hello, mates. I'm a big fan of Punch the Horse, having seen the band perform on several occasions. I have always been fascinated by the name of the band, and wondered what inspired it. Last night, whilst ruminating on these matters at the pub, I decided around 1 AM to take decisive action and find out for myself what was the significance of the words "Punch the Horse".

Later that night on my way home I spotted an individual of the equine persuasion (a horse, that is) lounging about in a suspicious manner in the common. I determined that I would set him right (it was a stallion, quite obviously) by giving him a smart punch on the nose. However, on approaching said stallion, and he was a big one, I noted the evil look in his eye and became wary. I also noted that he was tethered securely to a bicycle rack. Very good. Instead of punching the horse from in front where the treacherous creature might bite me, I would approach from behind, where the beast would not be so well appraised of my intentions.

In due course I had maneuvered nonchalantly to the rear of the horse, not without I think arousing some suspicion though, because he nickered at least twice and kept glancing at me nervously over his shoulder.

Still, so far so good. Now it doesn't make much sense to actually punch a horse from behind, because they are so tall, so I decided to kick the nasty blighter instead. Taking a deep breath I let him have one good solid kick to the goolies!

I regret to say that things went somewhat awry at that point. I did indeed land the kick, but the horse, although quite discomfited, had the presence of mind to kick me back, not just with one foot, but with both hind feet! It was a horrific double impact which I should not wish to ever experience again, and it propelled me a good fifteen feet, landing me upsidedown in a waste disposal container which was full of nasty, smelly trash, and sharp objects. I sustained severe and possibly permanent damage to my own personal nether parts, if you follow me, a sprained knee, a wrenched Achilles tendon, and a lacerated left nostril, as well as an acute shortage of breath for some time afterward.

Not only that. The horse turned out to be a police horse, and the constable, who had been making a phone call, arrested me as soon as he had extricated me from the aforementioned waste disposal container.

I am now charged with assaulting a police horse, resisting arrest, and disturbing the peace.

I intend to sue them for all they've got and take it all the way to Buckingham Palace if I must, until justice is done!

Arthur "Gimpy" Starling

---

28 Sep 03 - 07:12 PM (#1026008)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Guy Wolff

I think I found the mudcat the first or the second day on line. I did a search on Robert Johnson and found Max's museum. My eyes are not the best so I dont read a ton and so I have awful spelling . My interest in comunicating with others who have played music for years was larger than my inbarasment at my tecknicks ( see what I mean)as a typer .I think in bigger words then I can spell! Owch. Everyone has been great to me about it. A few jokes .I guess my passion for the subject matter has always been larger then my worry about looking a fool !
       What is realy amazing though was brought up by Charley Noble. I have met more musicians in my travels then I ever thought possable ! The best moment of the last few years was starting a thread on the idea of going to Yorkshire and playing music. THe invitations were amazing and the people I met and the music we played will be with me for the rest on my life.I have met and played at sesions I never would have known about !. When an information system can transend to that kind of Human place we all gain.! Are there any mudcat Marrages? Mudcat couples ? Children !
               THere are tons of very close friends here. When I miss my youth all I have to do is go to the chat room (at 6 eastern time ) and talk to all the brits there about towns I did aprenticships and Jouneymanships in Wales and England.
             On all Four of my CD's I have looked through the data bace for corrections on words to songs I was doing. I even started a thread on a early 19th century tune to see if anyone had heard it. Everyone came back with a boat load of information .
            Anyway the point is this particular spot on the intenet draws real people playing real music and so has a very close nit HUMAN community . All the best and thanks for asking the question.

---

28 Sep 03 - 07:13 PM (#1026009)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: smallpiper

Hey Kitchenpiper I object to your appology! It is never above anyones station to make a request for info on the cat. Some times you get answers that you don't expect but that's got to be ok, hasn't it? All part of this slightly demented community and that has to inform your subject. Also I have never understood the tendency of some people to wear soggy over cooked potato products as apparel - buyt fully respect their right to do so (even if they probably just deserve a slap).

---

28 Sep 03 - 07:55 PM (#1026028)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Amos

Gimpy:

I can withdraw the charges of resorting to obscure referents, and thanks. I would like to replace them with charges of irresponsibility for one's own actions in the first degree, whinging with the intent to Ignore Facts, and emotional vulcanism in public places with a blunt instrument, viz., a British sense of humour. However, in light of your cooperative attitude, all charges shall be dropped forthwith.

A

---

28 Sep 03 - 08:16 PM (#1026037)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bill D

Guy Wolff--there are at least two Mudcat marriages and MANY close friendships...and musical get-togethers without number! Add to that the advice proffered on everything under the sun (including spell checkers! *grin*), and you can only be awed...

---

28 Sep 03 - 08:18 PM (#1026038)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Ebbie

C-Flat: There are some extremely clever and academic regulars, some outrageously funny regulars and the occassional outrageously unpleasant regular but, because this site has a common theme, one which most of us here share a passion for, you keep returning and, in doing so, begin to recognise and be familiar with dozens of names.
I agree. At the very beginning, I tended to feel that these names/people were fictional personas but it wasn't long before I was - and remain - in awe of the talent, heart and brain of so very many people.   


(Gimpy, I imagine both you and the equine will find life simpler, if not as full, without your nether bits. Be grateful.)

---

28 Sep 03 - 08:28 PM (#1026048)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Guy Wolff

Thanks Bill I thought so(about the marrages ) but didnt follow closly enough to say so ! So how do you get a spell check in here. I could go out to my Appleworks and write something and Paiste i guess but Im to into it to go that route. Anyway i like lettinmg my hair down here.. YAHOOY .. All the best , Guy

---

28 Sep 03 - 10:34 PM (#1026094)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Lyrical Lady

When i first started to "Mudcat"...I was totally intimated...I don't play an instrument....I don't know very much about folkmusic..and I don't have very much to offer as a "Catter". BUT... I do sing...and I do think that musicians are godlike and I do check in everyday and I do read most of the threads. Yes...everyday! ... for the past 4 years! Call me crazy...whatever... this place is my community... and I know without a doubt that if needs ever be.. someone from this place will be there for me.
LL

---

28 Sep 03 - 10:44 PM (#1026098)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bill D

well, Guy, if you can install a little program, you can have a little spell checker running for everything you do..

TinySpell will check for you as you type and *ding* at you if it sees something 'wrong'. You can teach it special words, too!

---

29 Sep 03 - 12:04 AM (#1026128)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Mickey191

I came on this great site about 3 years ago, but have been more or less absent for the last year. Was given a webtv set up & somehow lucked out and found Mudcat and all it's wonderful inhabitants. I was welcomed warmly, shared my love of music, given advice on the following troubling issues: my barking pomeranion, my cousin whom I was thinking of suing for a bad debt, breast cancer, cremation, lyrics to 7 or 8 Irish songs, some words in Spanish to welcome a neighbor's baby, and lastly the model number of a good sound flush toilet. Oh yes, and the news that our northern neighbor (Canada) may be a good source if I wanted to smuggle said porcelain fixture in to N.Y.

I've felt a warm welcome from day one. I'm back with a few tales to tell. Slainté, Mickey 191

---

29 Sep 03 - 04:17 AM (#1026164)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: smallpiper

spelling is a mere convention .. one which I do not always choose to follow, and am very often being got at by people who take spelling personally. To almost (its not actually possible because he changes by the minute)jOhn from hull "this is not a spullung site this is a music site so f you don't like it you can get lost" But he's only almost right this is a music site but that is just an excuse for one of the best community sites on the net. I love it 'ere and am being edumucated and amused every day by my fellow catters and our estimed visitors.

---

29 Sep 03 - 06:39 AM (#1026201)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,just a guest

I loved mudcat as a newbie & had a name etc, but am jaded now & just mostly post as a guest - mainly because I don't like to trip across my former selves.
I find it all a bit too "noisy" now & try not to get too drawn into the chit-chat side.
As a newbie though - it was a very welcoming place with plenty of advice offered & no ridicule if I posted a stupid question. As in life, some characters you take to & some you don't. Didn't take long to find my way around - because being new you are full of enthusiasm & like to poke about & see what everything does. Was first experience of online comunity, & not at all scarey. More scarey nowadays probably since querulousness became so popular!
As a newbie I was curious about other members in real life & made effort to meet some. Not so sure now that that really works for me though.

---

29 Sep 03 - 06:41 AM (#1026202)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

A good spellchecker - http://www.hotlingo.com/

The evaluation download version lasts as long as you want it, and the FAQ on the site says it's fine not to pay anything, so long as you recommend it to other people. Which I do.

Like any spellchecker, it's not just for mispellings, it picks up the mis-typings as well. For me that is a lot more important, because I am very prone to doing those.

---

29 Sep 03 - 07:01 AM (#1026210)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,catsPhiddle sans biscuit @ work!

I first used mudcat when I was at university and it proved to be a valuable tool for research and help. I graduated firm uni 2 years ago and decided to stay on mudcat and got myself a name. I have always felt welcome and at home here apart from a run in or two with a certain GUEST but in the whole it has been a wonderful experience.

I have made some very good and close friends here on mudcat. I have met many of them at gatherings all over the UK. The furthest I have travelled for a Gathering is to Northern Ireland and it was great. I am aiming to get to the Getaway next year.....still saving the pennies as I would like to spend 2 weeks or so over in the US and meet up with some people I have spoken to so much in the chat room and feel I know really well.

The Mudcat is a great tool for finding music and song words and sessions and gatherings. It is also a great support network. The catter population will always be there for you to support you through the hard times we all have and they are there to celebrate with you all your successes and happinesses!

Bright Blessings

Khatt

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29 Sep 03 - 06:56 PM (#1026412)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Guy Wolff

Bill D and McGrath of Harlow thanks for the spell check. Having a mac we will see. THanks anyway and with people like John fron Hull around I am much more at ease about the whole thing !! Also in the chat roon just try spelling ..HA                                 
                                     All the best , Guy
                What a great place though . More soon

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29 Sep 03 - 09:43 PM (#1026469)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bill D

ah, McGrath, that HotLingo program says it is ONLY for Microsoft products...particularly IE5 or above. I hate to see this trend where M$ wants only programs that conform to their specs and require their products. I guess I will stick with TinySpell, which works by monitoring my keyboard no matter where I am typing...in the chat room, in the reply box, in Opera, in Netscape...

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29 Sep 03 - 09:50 PM (#1026471)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Amos

Guy Wolfe:

IE5.x running under OS X for the Mac will spellcheck in real time as you go along and recommend corrections.

A

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29 Sep 03 - 10:35 PM (#1026487)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: katlaughing

Guydarlin'...I love seeing your own take on spelling, don't worry about it; besides, you're in good company...there are others whose minds get ahead of their fingers!:-)

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30 Sep 03 - 01:19 PM (#1026724)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

I was going to explain why I can only understand English/Scots and how Some people think that Scots isn't an official language, then I thought why should I, it's a wast of time.
Because there are people who just don't undesrtand, or don't want to understand, so Goodbye.
Tom

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30 Sep 03 - 01:20 PM (#1026726)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

PS.
Oh before I go thanks Kitchen Piper for the answer.

Tom
Goodbye.

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30 Sep 03 - 01:41 PM (#1026747)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

I see "Busbitter frae Saltcoats Scotland" is now retrospectively renamed as "Crabbit from Saltcoats Scotland". I didn't know you could do that.

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30 Sep 03 - 01:47 PM (#1026753)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: katlaughing

Give it a rest, McGrath, eh? If I remember correctly, busbiter posted as a guest, always. Now he's chosen a membership name. So what? I'm glad to see another join up and able to receive PMs.

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30 Sep 03 - 03:57 PM (#1026754)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,MMario

McGrath - anyone posting as a member can go in and change their name - and when they do all their posts change name with it.

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30 Sep 03 - 06:21 PM (#1026796)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,Woody

How do I feel? How do you think I feel? I am in a prolonged state of Freudian/Jungian angst that has me eating shrimps at 3 in the morning and chewing my nails to the quick! None of my friends understand me in the least, and they probably wouldn't like me any better if they did. I'm surrounded by insensitive cretins who like playing squash and watching NASCAR and jabbering on videophones. Women still attract me, but I can't deal with the complications. Yesterday my dog peed on my slippers! Other men's dogs fetch their slippers, mine pees on them. My analyst says that the dog is simply responding to my own unexpressed violence in the only way he knows how! This is what I get for 35 years of analysis at a cost which is now exceeding $23,000 a year...a dog who responds to my unexpressed violence. The little bastard is going to have to respond to my fully expressed violence if he keeps it up.

I am bereft. I feel like a guy trying to sell snow in Inuktitut. I've made a series of brilliant films, absolutely brilliant, but no one really understands them, least of all the Academy. There's an anti-Semitic thing going on out there that you just wouldn't believe, and I am one of its key recipients. There's no reason, none whatsoever, that I shouldn't be as big as Cher right now...well, not if you discount the fact that I'm shorter than anyone except Danny De Vito and have thinning hair and a potbelly...but look, if I had had even half the plastic surgery in my life that that horse-faced virago has had in her life I would look pretty good. Okay, I wouldn't be an adonis, but I'd look good, at least what I'd call "good".

I'd look okay, all right?

I could go on about this at some length, but I'm not under any illusions about how much you all care. Genius is never appreciated in its own time. I'm going to go and drown myself in Kirkegard and listen to obscure jazz records that you people probably never even heard of. Then I'm going to write another screenplay that will be so brilliant that no one will understand it, not even my analyst. That'll teach him. He thinks he's so detached and objective. Ha!

In another time and place they'd have put him out on the ice as unfit for survival.

Woody

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30 Sep 03 - 07:12 PM (#1026826)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: smallpiper

GUEST Woody you're a feckin genius man, a feckin genius!

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30 Sep 03 - 08:11 PM (#1026850)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

I wasn't trying to harass busbitter/crabbit - my point was that, in saying he or she only understood English, while having a name in Scots, on the face of it, this implied that Scots is not a language distinct from English. But it is.

"..anyone posting as a member can go in and change their name - and when they do all their posts change name with it."

I never knew that. It could get rather confusing - any other posts using the old name would become pretty hard to make sense of. The reason I raised it in my last post was because otherwise my earlier posts referring to the former name would be needlessly puzzling.

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30 Sep 03 - 08:24 PM (#1026856)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: katlaughing

McGrath, thanks for explaining, but I took his posting to mean he understood English as opposed to "computerese" of which there is a fair bit in this thread.

kat

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01 Oct 03 - 03:44 AM (#1027002)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Roger the Skiffler

I joined to find some half-remembered lyrics, before I knew what had happened, a snake-oil salesman called Catspaw had got me a job emptying virtual bedpans in the NYCFTTS. This job was so demanding I had to eventually retire from my day job. I don't post as much (cries of "Thank God") or read as many posts now, but someone has to represent the voice of the non-performing audience, and defend the washboard & kazoo!

RtS
(PS a singer in a UK blues band last night played a shaky egg!)

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01 Oct 03 - 04:53 AM (#1027020)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: The Fooles Troupe

Prayer - Author Unknown

Dear Lord

Every evening as I'm lying here in bed
This tiny little prayer
Keeps running through my head.

God bless my Mom and Dad and
Bless my little pup
And look out for my sister
When things aren't looking up.

And God, there's one more thing
I wish that you could do
I hope you don't mind me asking
But please bless my computer too.

Now I know that's not normal
To bless a mother board
But just listen a second while I
Explain to you My Lord.

You see, that little metal box
Holds more to me than odds & ends
Inside those small compartments
Rest a hundred of my BEST FRIENDS

I know for sure they like me
By the kindness that they give
And this little scrap of metal
Is how I travel to where they live.

My faith is how I know them
Much the same as you
I share in what life brings them
From that our friendship grew.

PLEASE take an extra minute
From your duties up above
To bless this scrap of metal
That's filled with so much love!

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01 Oct 03 - 11:15 AM (#1027273)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

The reason why I keep changing my mudcat name is because after a while I get bored by usiong the same name, I just like change.
And after a while I might get fed up with this name and choose something else instead.

TOM

PS.
I've been known as Bustter, Tam the bam frae Saltcoats Scotland, Tam the bam and now Crabbit frae Saltcoats Scotland. And As I say, I might change this one after a while because I get bored with the same mudcat name all the time.

I hope you understand.

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01 Oct 03 - 11:18 AM (#1027276)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST

i truly like it here and thought the people were real friendly, at least with each other. later i came to realise how cliquish and egofilled alot of the people here are.

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01 Oct 03 - 04:19 PM (#1027492)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: CarolC

I felt that the Mudcat was just like my high school (which was a pretty damn amazing and wonderful place - it was an experimental school back in the early 1970s, modeled a bit after Summerhill); a hyper-enriched environment full of amazingly creative, intelligent, and interesting people.

I had a little trepidation about posting to the BS type threads at first, but that didn't seem to stop me from jumping in with both feet and having a fantastic time right from the start.

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01 Oct 03 - 07:56 PM (#1027629)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST

Seriously unwelcome - that's how I felt and it's why I never post anymore. The only members who were at all nice were Sorcha, Big Mick, and Carol C. When I first discovered the site, people were lovely about finding music and lyrics for me and some even expressed appreciation when I, wanting to return the favour, was able to find stuff. So, overcoming my natural reserve and timidity, I became a member. I feel very bad because I recommended the site to some of my friends and they all said that they felt uncomfortable. Although I still use mudcat as a resource, I never mention the site to anyone. I guess if I ever met anyone I really hated, I'd let them know about you. Most people from Jeri to [up]yours, Peter T. have been gratuitously hateful. I'm replying as a Guest, because in addition to despising you for your insults, I honestly feel threatened by some of you.

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02 Oct 03 - 01:01 PM (#1028089)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,DB

Gosh guest, I'm sorry you feel that way, but surely over five years Peter T and Jeri have proven themselves to be fine people. Peter has given us some of the best writing you're ever going to see, and I can assure you that Jeri is close to the top of the heap when it comes to Catters who've earned the respect and friendship of many.

The sheer number of people who've been complimentary here about the forum really makes me wonder if all these friends of yours REALLY felt uncomfortable or were just saying that because you felt so negative.

One Mucatter who seems very unimpressed has left out the times at the beginning when under another name he was very insulting to the forum and to members in general, so I'm rather suspicious of his complaints.

Did you ever send a PM to either Jeri or Peter trying to clear up any misunderstandings? Believe me it can't help and feeling THAT negative about a general group isn't helpful.

Hope you try again.

DB

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02 Oct 03 - 01:26 PM (#1028104)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Bill D

"Most people from Jeri to [up]yours, Peter T. have been gratuitously hateful."

pooh!...anything remotely like 'hate' from those two, or 'most' others was earned! I have no idea exactly what would cause anyone to say that about some of our nicest members, but I know the quietest of dogs will snap at you if tormented enough.

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02 Oct 03 - 01:59 PM (#1028129)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

I suppose it's very subjectve. What feels friendly and welcoming to some people feels hostile and cliquish to others. Story of every pub and every folk club and every workplace.

I've never felt in the least threatened here, even when I've been picked out by some of the passing trolls for a bit of a flaming from time to time.

Anyway Good Luck, GUEST, in finding a more friendly place than this - and if you ever do, drop in back here and let us know, because that would be quite a find.

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02 Oct 03 - 02:01 PM (#1028131)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: akenaton

Well Iv only been on mudcat for a few months but feel very inhibited about expressing my half baked opinions to all you intelligent folks ,but I must say youve all been very understanding about grammar ,spelling ect....and even the grumpiest turn out to be pussy cats if you PM them. The trolls are great fun ,and mostly very witty. The forum needs these people to keep everyone from going to sleep,and to make us see the alternative way (there always is one).I dont know why you all get so upset about them. Any way I quite like it here so I think i'll stay around for a while..   Ake

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02 Oct 03 - 10:29 PM (#1028481)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull

Hello, i just read this anfd i think guest is just trying to make trubble, abd we should ingore them.john

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03 Oct 03 - 08:16 AM (#1028712)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Beverley Barton

bewildered!!! that's how i feel mr piper. this thing is full of surreal nutcases, but very amusing nutcases. and no, i don,t feel intimidated or threatened because it,s only a plastic box sat in my office.i can,t wait until i can use this machine properly

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03 Oct 03 - 08:35 AM (#1028730)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: GUEST,MMario

el ted! wait until you meet some of them in person! be afraid; be very afraid....

on second thought - don't be afraid - just carry a large stick.

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03 Oct 03 - 12:13 PM (#1028922)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: smallpiper

too late he already has!

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03 Oct 03 - 01:04 PM (#1028966)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

I hope that mudcatter isn't me and if it is then I'm sorry Guest.

Tom

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03 Oct 03 - 01:12 PM (#1028974)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)

Mind you there are some people who get hurt very easy, including myself, however I try to understnad and then I get angry and write things at the time, and then I relise how bad they sound, so I write I'm sorry afterwards, when I know that I'm in the wrong, unlike some people who can't admit that they are wrong.
Or don't like people like me saying sorry.

Tom

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03 Oct 03 - 01:16 PM (#1028977)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: McGrath of Harlow

That's one of the problems with people who post as GUESTs - you can't PM them and say sorry if you feel you might have overstepped the line in a comment. Or sort out a misunderstanding that threatens to lead to an avoidable quarrel.

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03 Oct 03 - 04:40 PM (#1029146)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: nancyjo

Well, I'm still a newbie I guess - 3 or 4 months. I am not a newbie to being part of a mailing list on the Internet. I think it'd be very intersting to see what other "lists" these folks belong to/post to. I've been a part of the Neil Young list (rust) for almost 10 years. (And by the way, "troll" is very often used there.) I also belong to a mystery book list, a Rawhide list (which frequently side-tracks to other cowoby shows) and three lists related to my job (reference librarian).

I'd say this list is not as clique-ish as some, more so than others. I don't feel I belong - yet. I've been frustrated in my request for song lyrics for all 3 songs I've asked for, with no success. And also frustrated when I contributed the correct lyrics to a song and got no response. I did make a goof in the discussion on the list of best guitar players and asked about George Harrison when it turned out he WAS on the list, so maybe I have a reputation of being an air-head??

Also on a few occasions I've responded off-list to someone, always with a compliment (e.g. liked their humor) and have yet to have anyone answer me. This makes me feel rebuffed.

On the technical side, I have a question. On more than one occasion, I've searched the lyric database for a song and gotten zero hits. But when I do the advanced search with key words, I find the song in an email. And it has the same title that I searched for when I searched the list. This puzzles me. When a message is title "Lyr. added", I guess it doesn't necessarily mean it's in the database, just that someone is posting the lyrics in an email?

On the totally plus side, I have answered reference questions from the database, and so am very appreciative.

nancyjo

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03 Oct 03 - 05:23 PM (#1029184)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: nancyjo

Oh my gosh!!! I just realized they ALL answered me and I never knew it!! For some reason, I thought it would be sent as email. I didn't figure out the pm page. Now THEY must think that I'M the rebuffer because I never acknowledged their response!!!

Oh, I feel soooo much better!!! (even if I do have egg on my face)

nancyjo

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03 Oct 03 - 05:35 PM (#1029196)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: Charley Noble

Nancyjo-

Don't feel embarrassed. There are parts of the Mudcat I don't understand or utilize even after three years. But what I do use I generally enjoy.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

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03 Oct 03 - 05:39 PM (#1029199)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: katlaughing

LOL, glad to hear you found your PM's, nancyjo, so you know you weren't being rebuffed. Good for you for sticking with us and letting us know how things have been for you.

Re' your search, yes, when one adds lyrics, they are simply in that thread. Throughout the year, Dick Greenhaus and Susan of the DT (Digital Tradition), as well as other volunteers, *harvest* those added lyrics, then Dick and Susan decide which ones actually get put in the database. Regarless, they remain in the threads for anyone who happens to need them.

As we say, "hope this is clear as Mud." **big Grin** And, welcome to the Mudcat!

kat

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03 Oct 03 - 06:46 PM (#1029240)
Subject: RE: How did you feel as a newbie on Mudcat?
From: LilyFestre

I'm still a newbie on Mudcat and learning new things everyday! Seriously, there is so much that I just never have been exposed to....very interesting indeed!

Michelle

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