|
06 Jan 04 - 12:33 PM (#1087169) Subject: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,JB Just started reading my Christmas present "Hey Dude, Where`s My Country?" by Michael Moore-somewhat late I will admit. I am absolutely fascinated with the way Moore has challenged all of the Bush political elite and especially his Daddy and all of his cronies. It is incredible to ascertain the close relations they had with Bin Laden, and all those other most dubious Saudies. I am particularly impreseed by the way he has backed up all of his statements and articles with references to the various written articles and reports on each topic. This beats "Stupid white men" by a long shot. Surely if the American people read this book and are willing to comprehend the seriousness of these reports, then Bush II can never have any chance of re-election! JB |
|
06 Jan 04 - 01:04 PM (#1087179) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Peg I think his next film (Fahrenheit 911) will open some peoples' eyes, too...or at least, I hope so. |
|
06 Jan 04 - 01:42 PM (#1087200) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST This Moore dude aint worth shit |
|
06 Jan 04 - 01:54 PM (#1087207) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Don Firth Now there's a well articulated argument. . . . At least when Moore says something, you know who's saying it. Don Firth |
|
06 Jan 04 - 02:58 PM (#1087251) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Clinton Hammond I like Mike Moore... and Bill Maher... and John Stewert... Some of the most intelligent Americans I've ever heard... :-) |
|
06 Jan 04 - 05:02 PM (#1087336) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: The Fooles Troupe I thought Mike Moore had to be Canadian - didn't think Americans like him existed. SBS brought out his show for a while here - was actually very popular here in Oz. That was long before he made "Columbine". Robin |
|
06 Jan 04 - 06:21 PM (#1087407) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: McGrath of Harlow "...if the American people read this book" That's a pretty big if in 2004. |
|
06 Jan 04 - 06:43 PM (#1087434) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: DougR I would be suspect of anything Michael Moore wrote, said or produced (film). DougR |
|
06 Jan 04 - 06:53 PM (#1087448) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,guest from NW just curious dougR. have you ever read or watched anything written or produced by mr. moore or just heard other people's opinions about him? |
|
06 Jan 04 - 06:55 PM (#1087449) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: freda underhill At the web site Rumor Mill News (www.RumorMillNews.com), a journalist named "Phoenix" has laid out business links that tie Enron to the bin Laden family. These connections, which have been independently verified by Michael Ruppert (www.copvcia.com), play out as follows: Osama bin Laden's family business, the Saudi Binladin Group, is a major construction company. Saudi Binladin Group was an investor in the Carlyle Group. Carlyle's directors include George H.W. Bush, and James Baker. George W. Bush's firm Arbusto Energy was funded by an investment from Texas investment banker James Bath, who was also the investment counselor for the bin Laden family. Bath had connections to the CIA, and was involved with the Iran-Contra, savings and loan, and BCCI scandals. One of Saudi Binladen's joint venture partners is H.C. Price Company. H.C. Price is a major builder of pipelines, and is involved in large projects, including two projects for Enron: the Florida Gas Pipeline and the Northern Border Pipeline running from the US/Canadian border from Montana to Illinois. In 1996, Dresser Industries and Shaw Industries merged their pipecoating businesses to form Bredaro-Shaw Group. H.C. Price became part of Bredaro-Shaw. Halliburton acquired Dresser in 1998. George H.W. Bush's father, Prescott, was the managing director of Brown Brothers Harriman, which previously owned Dresser. Dresser Industries gave George H.W. Bush his first job in 1948. Dick Cheney orchestrated the Dresser and Bredaro-Shaw acquisitions. Both Halliburton, and its subsidiary Brown & Root, have deep ties to the CIA and the military. The company has been involved in US military conflicts in Vietnam, Bosnia, Kosovo, Macedonia, Chechnya, Pakistan, Colombia and Rwanda. Brown & Root builds oil rigs, pipelines, wells, and nuclear reactors. It does not appear to be a simple case of coincidence that Saudi Binladin, a long time business partner with the Bush family, also has a partnership with a Dick Cheney-affiliated Halliburton that works with Enron. The cover-up begins In their book The Outlaw Bank, Jonathan Beaty and S.C. Gwynne wrote of BCCI, "It was a conspiratorialist's conspiracy, a plot so byzantine, so thoroughly corrupt, so exquisitely private, reaching so deeply into the political and intelligence establishments of so many countries, that it seemed to have its only precedent in the more hallucinogenic fiction of Ian Fleming, Kurt Vonnegut or Thomas Pynchon. As tales of its global predations were splattered across headlines all over the world, its apparent influence reached almost absurd proportions." The scope of Enron's influence has reached well into the absurd, if not beyond. And there are many more Enrons out there, waiting to be blow open. In describing the system that breeds Enrons, professor Michel Chossudovsky of the University of Ottawa (CovertAction, Fall 1996) wrote: "Global crime has become an integral part of an economic system, with far reaching social, economic and geopolitical ramifications . . . the relationship among criminals, politicians, and members of the intelligence establishment has tainted the structures of the state and the role of its institutions . . . this system of global trade and finance has fostered an unprecedented accumulation of private wealth alongside the impoverishment of large sectors of the world population, and the prospects for change are dim. Meanwhile, the international community turns a blind eye until some scandal momentarily breaks through the gilded surface." In light of congressional "investigations" headed exclusively by committee chairmen who have received Enron monies, weeks of FBI foot-dragging, continued White House secrecy, no independent counsel, and media complicity in White House damage control efforts, the Enron trail has already begun to grow cold. The American corporate media has done its best to look the other way. This is no surprise, since Enron dumped handsome sums into the pockets of media moguls, and conservative journalists such as Lawrence Kudlow, Peggy Noonan, William Kristol and others. Cronies and cohorts are meeting. Patsies and fall guys have been designated. Lies are being fabricated. Fifth Amendment mantras will be repeated. As was the case with Watergate, BCCI, Iran-Contra, and the savings and loan scandals, it is not too cynical to expect the Enron hearings to expose only enough malfeasance to silence the public, while leaving the massive system intact. The masterminds and the largest beneficiaries are about to slip into the shadows. The American empire is built on a thousand Enrons. It will exhaust every means to avoid implicating itself, even as it drowns in the cesspool of its own creation, dragging thousands of innocent people down with it. Larry Chin is a freelance journalist and an Online Journal Contributing Editor. Copyright © 2002 Online Journal[tm]. All rights reserved. Reprinted for Fair Use Only. |
|
06 Jan 04 - 07:20 PM (#1087470) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Bobert I love Michael's writing. Yeah, he sticks it to the crooks purdy good but he also has a humility that makes him likable. I haven't gotten the latest book but certainly enjoyed "Stupid White Men". But realisticly speaking, Bush folks won't read books that talk about the links of the Bush's to the bin Laden's or grand-daddy Bush, ties to the Nazi's or even the infiltration of former Nazi's into high ranking positions within the Republican Party. But why would they want to know about these *facts*? Bobert |
|
06 Jan 04 - 08:37 PM (#1087532) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: McGrath of Harlow Michael Moore makes it a lot harder for people outside Amererica to fall into the trap of hating the USA. He's a reminder that there's another USA out there. |
|
06 Jan 04 - 11:29 PM (#1087597) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Clinton Hammond It's important to be suspect of ANYTHING ANYONE says, writes or produces.... |
|
07 Jan 04 - 12:39 AM (#1087632) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,guest from NW i'll remember that when i read your posts ClintonHammond. |
|
07 Jan 04 - 10:35 AM (#1087964) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: DMcG The Introduction to 'Dude' is quite interesting in the UK edition. (It may be different in other countries.) Basically he sets the British reader up for an excellent 'sting' by a couple of paragraphs playing up the sneering-stereotype of Americans as not very interested in life outside the US, fairly ignorant of politics, over-trusting and so on, and then "This, I suppose, explains why we have been behaving the way we have. But here's my question: What is your excuse? You know better. You are well-read. Your news reports stories beyond the cliffs of Dover or the Opera House in your harbor. You travel. ... So what happened?" |
|
07 Jan 04 - 11:35 AM (#1087996) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST Mr Moore is just another asshole with an agenda, and the ability to procreate media. http://www.revoketheoscar.com/ |
|
07 Jan 04 - 11:58 AM (#1088007) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Scabby Douglas He is a self-publicist. That is undeniable. And he does stage stunts, sometimes heavy-handedly, to make his points. And yet, he does back up what he says with source material. I note that no-one so far has attempted to refute his arguments with any facts. |
|
07 Jan 04 - 12:18 PM (#1088032) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Clinton Hammond ESPECIALLY when you read my posts! When you read ANYONES posts... |
|
07 Jan 04 - 02:43 PM (#1088088) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,guest from NW still curious, dougR, if you've ever actually read or watched any of mr. moore's productions or if you get your opinion second-hand. and, strangely enough, ClintonHammond, i have found your postings suspect for sometime now, even before your admonition. |
|
07 Jan 04 - 02:51 PM (#1088094) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Clinton Hammond It's not self-admonition... It's called critical thinking... you should be suspect of EVERYTHING... especially anyone claiming to have "The Answers" Nothing wrong with listening to someone else... but do your own thinking... :-) |
|
07 Jan 04 - 03:32 PM (#1088128) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,JB Well Guest, To the cowardly Mr Guest, Firstly it stinks that you don`t even have the balls to introduce yourself as anything other than guest. Regarding your comment: " Moore is just another asshole with an agenda, and the ability to procreate media. Unfortunately it will be people like you who will probably ensure that GW Bush will be re-elected. Did you actually ever read any of his books or are you chancing your arm here. If you have something concrete to protest about his writings, then spit it out son, otherwise I will have to assume you are another one of those Americans who know so much but have read so little. JB Come out of your hole you Mr guest and proclaim yourself. |
|
07 Jan 04 - 05:55 PM (#1088268) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST Actually i'm not American, and Yes I read his "shit" |
|
07 Jan 04 - 06:14 PM (#1088292) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Cluin Not necessary to go that far, GUEST. Just his books will do. |
|
07 Jan 04 - 06:29 PM (#1088303) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST I would not dignify the crap he produces by refering to them as books at all, therefore his "written shit" is what I refer to. |
|
07 Jan 04 - 06:57 PM (#1088330) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Bobert Yo, GUEST, how do you really feal. Ahhhh, BTW, did you read "Stupid White Men" as well? What did you think about the chapter about how Jeb Bush and Katherine Harris manipulated th4e Florida election ands subsequesnt returns? Did you know that Michael's take was completely backed up in the fcats that Greg Palist presented in his book "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy"? And lastly, do you have problems with facts? Sure it's easy to hide behind your big and brave GUEST sheild and lob what ever you feel like lobing... Big dumb GUEST as far as I can see... Yeah, go lob some dumb GUEST stuff at me. Heck, knock your dumb GUEST out. What other four letter words do you have ready to lob from the safety of GUESTdom? Bobert |
|
07 Jan 04 - 07:04 PM (#1088336) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Don Firth Wow!! GUEST is right in there with the old one-two! Brilliant reasoning, but to be expected considering the tenor of the times. I posted THIS on another thread. Have a look. Don Firth |
|
07 Jan 04 - 09:17 PM (#1088421) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Bobert I read this one, Don, and posted behind you... Great writing! And historically correct and factual in every respect. Unfortunately, we have some moron GUEST's who never met a fact that they liked. They got bumper sticker mentalities. For the most part they are not worth the time. But, I still respect a thoughtfull post, GUEST or not... And I still have no respect fir morons who won't take the time to consider actual facts before they start trying to impress the cyberworld with their vast knowledge of four letter words... But very well written, Don, but these moron won't read your post. Too long fir their narrow minds. If it don't fit on a bumper sticker, it's too long fir them... They're too busy... Bobert |
|
08 Jan 04 - 01:37 AM (#1088491) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST "It is easy in the world to live after the world's opinion; it is easy in solitude to live after our own; but the great man is he who in the midst of the crowd keeps with perfect sweetness the independence of solitude." – Ralph Waldo Emerson |
|
08 Jan 04 - 04:51 AM (#1088527) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: McGrath of Harlow Same GUEST or different GUEST this time? ie, does that last quote have any rekation to any other posts on the thread, and if so, which? |
|
08 Jan 04 - 04:54 AM (#1088529) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: sledge So the "guest" can cut and paste, whoopee! Sledge |
|
08 Jan 04 - 05:23 AM (#1088542) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,JB May I suggest to our so-called "GUEST" that he have a look at a parallel thread entitled "On the cowardly nature of GUEST posting". Ah, but if he can`t come to grips with Michael Moore, then perhaps this stuff might be slightly beyond his comprehension. Let`s not tax him too much. I can see the day coming anyway when all Mudcat guests will have to identify themselves by electronic fingerprints and photographs and then we in no time we can trace them. Maybe Bush is not so dumb after all. JB |
|
08 Jan 04 - 02:33 PM (#1088845) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: GUEST,guest from NW still curious several days later dougR. |
|
08 Jan 04 - 04:31 PM (#1088926) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: DougR Bobert: this is the second thread in which you charge that after WW2, prominent Nazis were given leadership positions in the Republican Party. Perhaps you would be good enough to identify who said Nazis were? GUEST: I normally don't respond to Guest's posts but I will make an exception. I did attempt to watch "Bowling for Columbine" but when he admitted to faking portions of what was advertised as a documentary, I didn't finish it. DougR |
|
09 Jan 04 - 02:10 AM (#1089223) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: sledge Was that Faking or re-enacting, sounds like an excuse NOT to watch it. In my book faking is a deliberately misleading act, re-enacting gives a visual cue for something that was not filmed in the first place. If it was fake, would he then admit it? The re-enactment is now commonly used in documentary making so big deal! Sledge. |
|
09 Jan 04 - 09:55 AM (#1089386) Subject: RE: BS: Michael Moore 'Dude' From: Bobert Dougie, Like plenty of them. The founder of what would evolve into the Heritage Foundation, Laszlo Pastor, was the leader of the pro-fascist Arrow Cross in Hungary and was wirking with Hitler in 1944... Also finding their ways into the Heritage Council, Radi Slavoff and Ivan Docheff, both from the Bulgarian National Front allied with Hitler, Valerian Trifta of the Iron Guard in Romania which was also allied with Hoitler and the fascists, etc, etc... If you'd like to read page after page of folks who ended up in your party a must read is "Old Nazis, the New Right and the Republican Party" written by Russ Bellant... Bobert |