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03 May 04 - 08:24 PM (#1177304) Subject: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: GUEST,hobbitfoot Does anyone know the music to the gravedigger clown's song in Hamlet, or where I might find it? Thanks. |
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03 May 04 - 10:08 PM (#1177383) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: masato sakurai The original for the first song ("In youth, when I did love, did love") is Thomas Lord Vaux's "The Aged Lover Renounceth Love". However, there is no entry of this poem in Cyrus Lawrence Day and Eleanore Boswell Murrie's English Song-Books 1651-1702: A Bibliography (1940). See also: The Lied and Art Song Texts Page: Grave-digger's song Teaching Shakespeare Lesson Plan - Songes and Sonnets: The aged lover renounceth love (with pdf images). According to William Chappell (Popular Music of the Olden Time, vol. 1, p. 200), "The traditions of the stage also give this ["The Children in the Wood" (Now Ponder Well)] as the air of the Gravedigger's Song in Hamlet, 'A pick-axe and a spade'." |
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03 May 04 - 11:10 PM (#1177416) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: GUEST,.gargoyle masato sakurai ....THANK YOU!!!
Sincerely, |
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04 May 04 - 12:11 AM (#1177437) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: Bob Bolton G'day masato, I wonder if ["The Children in the Wood" (Now Ponder Well)] is the same tune which has come down to the present day (well, in some of the rural parts of Australia) as Babes in the Woods - a popular tune for the dance The Varsovienne - something that had it's great fad period more than a hundred years ago ... but remains popular with the better dancers among bush communities. I know that some form of the Babes in the Woods song, which is said to date back to the Mediaeval era, must remain known in parts of the US, as Garrison Keillor used it as the base for a parody on his "Songs of the Cat" CD, a few years back. I must dig out the words from Hamlet tonight and see how well they fit! Regards, Bob Bolton |
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04 May 04 - 02:11 AM (#1177461) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: masato sakurai Two tunes to "I Loathe That I Did Love" (Thomas Lord Vaux's "The Aged Lover Renounceth Love") are given in Chappell's Popular Music, vol. 1 (1859, p. 217). Chappell says: "Three stanzas from the poem are sung by the grave-digger in Hamlet; but they are much corrupted, and in all probability designedly, to suit the character of an illiterate clown. On the stage the grave-digger now sing them to the tune of The Children in the Wood." X:1 T:I Loathe That I Did Love (First Tune) M:C L:1/4 K:C A|A3/2 A/ c B|A3 G|c3/2 c/ d B|c3 A| w:I loathe that I did love! In youth that I thought sweet, (As c3/2 c/ B A|c3/2 c/B A|A3/2 ^G/ G A|A3|| w:time re-quires for my be-hove,) Me-thinks it is not meet. X:2 T:I Loathe That I Did Love (Second Tune) M:C L:1/4 K:C G|G3/2 G/ G (F/E/)|G3 G|G G c c|B3 G| w:I loathe that I did_ love! In youth that I thought sweet, (As c B A G|G D E (^F/G/)|A G2 ^F|G3 (G/A/)| w:time re-quires for my be-hove, for_ my_ be-hove), Me - B c d G|c c B e|d c c B|c3|| w:thinks it is not meet, Me-thinks, me-thinks, it is not meet. |
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04 May 04 - 07:02 PM (#1177912) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: Bob Bolton G'day masato, Thanks for the tune notations ... now I just have to master decoding from ABC - and I can listen to them! (I'm sure there are a host of freeware / cheapware / shareware apps out there to do it!) Regards, Bob Bolton |
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04 May 04 - 08:11 PM (#1177957) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: Malcolm Douglas Concertina.net: ABC Convert-A-Matic |
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04 May 04 - 11:36 PM (#1178117) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: Bob Bolton Thank you Malcolm, That's a very neat and convenient site - I dowloaded both the PDF images and the MIDI files ... so I can both see and hear that neither of these tunes really relates to the one I mentioned (a pity - I was hoping for a 4-century link!). I must go get a decent ABC app. onto my own computer - I think I've dodged ABC too long - due to an undue degree of "dots" fixation, and it is a very handy, lean, format that can produce very tidy results! (But I don't think I'm going to start playing from it!) Regards, Bob |
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05 May 04 - 12:08 AM (#1178127) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: Malcolm Douglas I don't bother with the old abc-reading programs I used to use any more, except for their indexing functions; the online facility is better, at least while I have an "always on" connection. I suspect that the Babes in the Woods tune you know derives from the 19th century William Gardiner song based on the old story. The Coppers, for example, have a "processed" form of it (with the melody improved, to my ear). You can see Gardiner's song at The Lester Levy Sheet Music Collection: Sweet Babes in the Wood. A Ballad. Founded on the well known Legend. Philadelphia: B. Carr's Musical Repository, n.d. |
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05 May 04 - 07:30 AM (#1178359) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: GUEST,MCP Sternfeld in Music In Shakespearean Tragedy devotes a 5 page appendix (+plate) to a chapter entirely to 'In Youth when I did Love' - 'I Loathe that I did Love', with references to the known versions and transcriptions. I haven't time at the moment, but I'll try and put up the relevant information this evening (UK time). Mick |
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05 May 04 - 03:05 PM (#1178744) Subject: RE: Tune Req: Hamlet Gravedigger's song From: GUEST,MCP With regard to I loathe that I did love Sternfeld gives the only two tunes known as those given from Chappell above (also given in Simpson - The British Broadside Ballad and its Music). The first was a written marginal annotation to a copy of Songs and Sonnets (1557) copied down in Nott's edition of 1814. The original MS is no longer extant and only one copy of Nott's edition with the tune is extant (in library of the Duke of Norfolk at Arundel). The original was given without regular barring as Tune 1 below. Tunes 3 and 4 below are the versions as barred and set to the words by Chappell and by Wooldridge. (note values doubled compared to the version as actually give in Chappell, shown above). Sternfeld gives his own revision of the tune in bars of 3 or 4 beats as Tune 2, requiring only 2 changes to the original. Tune 5 below shows the original words set to Sternfeld's revision. The Shakespeare words are shown with it, and Sternfeld notes: "In the latter case a good deal of rhythmical freedom would be required in performance." The second tune is from British Museum Additional MS 4900 and dates from the early 17th century, it has a voice part and a lute accompaniment on facing pages. Tune 6 below shows the melody line only (transposed by Sternfeld from C to A). Of this version Sternfeld says: "This version is not suitable for performance by the gravedigger for several reasons. The lute accompaniment is out of place, as are also the elaborate melismas on the words 'behove' and 'methink'. Accordingly, a simplified voice part has been prepared and is given in Example 7" (Tune 7 below). He also notes: Chappell gives the tune, harmonized by GA Macfarren. Chappell changed a few accidentals , and allotted the text differently to the notes, to avoid the melismas" Mick X: 1 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 1 (Nott) M:none L:1/4 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N:From Nott's (1814) copy (tr Crotch) of marginal addition to Songs and Sonnets (1557) K:A Aeo A2 A A c2 B2 A4|G2 c3 c d B2 c4| A2 c3 c B A c2 c2 B2 A2 A3 G G A2 HA4|| X: 2 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 2 (Nott rev Sternfeld) M:4/2 L:1/2 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N:From Nott's version revise by Sternfeld K:A Aeo A A/ A/ c B|[M:3/2][L:1/2]A2 G|[M:4/2][L:1/2] c> c d< B|[M:3/2][L:1/2] c2 A|c> c B/ A/|[M:4/2][L:1/2] c c B A| A> G G< A|HA2|| X: 3 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 3 (Nott rev Chappell) M:4/2 L:1/2 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N:Chappell's PMOT transcription K:Am A|A> A c B|A3 G|c> c d B|c3 A|c> c B A|c> c B A|A> ^G G A|A3|| X: 4 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 4 (Nott rev Wooldridge) M:4/2 L:1/2 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N:Chappell's PMOT transcription N:The 2 penultimate Gs have optional #s indicated K: A Aeo A A/ A/ c B|A3 G|c2 c/ d/ B|c4| A c> c B/ A/|c c B A|A G/ G/ A|A4|| X: 5 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 5 (Nott rev Sternfeld) M:4/2 L:1/2 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N:From Nott's version revise by Sternfeld K:A Aeo A A/ A/ c B|[M:3/2][L:1/2]A2 w:I loathe that I did love G|[M:4/2][L:1/2] c> c d< B|[M:3/2][L:1/2] c2 w:in youth that I thought sweet A|c> c B/ A/|[M:4/2][L:1/2] c c B w:as time re-quires for my be-hove A| A> G G< A|HA2|| w:me-thinks they are not meet. W: SHAKESPEARE'S WORDS W: In youth when I did love, did love W:Methought it was very sweet W:To contract o the time for a my behove W:O me thought there a was nothing a meet X: 6 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 6 (BM Add Ms 4900) M:4/4 L:1/4 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N: the D at the end of Bar 7 has optional # shown K:A % original in C E|E> E E (^D/C/)|E2 z w:I loathe that I did_ love E|E E A A|G2 z w:in youth that I thought sweet E|E G F E-|E B, C D/E/|F E2 D|E3 w:as time re-qui-red_ for my be____ hove |:(E/F/|G A) B E|A A G c| B A A G|A3:| w:me___ think they are not meet, me think they are not meet. X: 7 T:I Loathe That I Do Love 7 (BM Add Ms 4900 rev Sternfeld) M:4/4 L:1/4 S:FW Sternfeld: Music In Shakespearean Tragedy N:From BM Add Ms 4900 version revised by Sternfeld K:A % original in C E|E> E E (^D/C/)|E2 z w:I loathe that I did_ love E|E E A A|G2 z w:in youth that I thought sweet E|A G F E| C D E w:as time re-quir'd for my be-hove E| B E A A G2 z w:me think they are not meet c|B A A G|A3|| w:me think they are not meet. |