|
06 Sep 04 - 09:56 AM (#1265228) Subject: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Our 1-year-old shepherd mix Faulkner seems to require the smell of real human food in order to realize he needs to eat. Dry food alone just does not interest him, and trying to let his hunger change this resulted in a way-too-thin dog. How thin? Well, WAY too thin, even according to the latest chart at the vet's. And winter here in the mountains comes soon. So I started by adding doggie-tea to the kibble. The first try was a small amount of canned dog food and an equal amount of water, mixed, and poured over the kibble. Yumping yiminy, doggie-dancing till I set it down, and SCARF! All gone. Burrrppp. Realizing that could get pretty expensive, I cast about for another tea. An egg, thinned with water, is working. Not quite the same enthusiasm, but enough for him to eat as much kibble as he should be eating. And the remains of last night's sausage-spaghetti sauce sticking to the empty pot, swished with water, did OK too. OK, dog fiends, am I on the wrong track? Am I killing the dog? :~) Photo: WHERE'S THE BEEF? ~Susan |
|
06 Sep 04 - 09:57 AM (#1265229) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Sorry, forgot the BS tag. The photo, BTW, is Faulkner WITH flesh, not as he looks now. ~S~ |
|
06 Sep 04 - 10:44 AM (#1265254) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha Well, you aren't killing the dog, but eggs can cause gas......try a teaspoon or so of plain yogurt (extra calcium-low fat) or cottage cheese (more calories than yogurt) and a teaspoon or so of plain canned pumpkin (Vitamin A) with a tad of hot water. Also, a tablespoon or so of Safflower oil (Vitamin E and shiny coat). Are you feeding once or twice a day? I reccomned twice. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 10:56 AM (#1265262) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: GUEST,Jess A awww... in our family we used to make gravy for the dog food out beef stock cube dissolved in boling water, (plus a little bit of cold so it wan't too hot to eat). You only need to use part of the stock cube each time, so works out pretty cheap... or even just using hot water alone might well be enough to soften the dried food and release some of the smell & flavour to whet the dog's appetite. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:05 AM (#1265270) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Oh we tried water-- it worked once or twice, then the mess laid there till it stank up the room. Yogurt, yes, we usually have. Stock cubes in the US are pretty salty..... but what I am hearing is that there are numerous choices likely to be on hand so I don't have to shop specially, and maybe just swishing the dinner plate with water plus a little oil will do the trick? Really prefer not to add too much nutritional tinkering to what ought to be a good kibble mix... And yes, twice a day, with water available at all times. Tell ya what he really likes is for Hardi (our alpha "wolf") to pretend to eat it and growl protectively over it and then give F his "share" of the "kill." :~) Dog eats for me in the AM cuz he's hungry, but for H in the evening cuz it's H. :~) ~S~ |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:13 AM (#1265277) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha LOL! What brand of kibble are you using? Some are better than others....don't trust the labels. How old (about) is the pup? |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:17 AM (#1265282) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg LOL back atcha-- we've tried all kinds of kibbles. Once I get him EATING them I'll shop for the best one nutritionally, and if he catches on I may eliminate the doggie tea gradually! There are multiple half-eaten bags here to finish up first! :~) How old? ONE, as I said in the first post. :~) ~S~ |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:41 AM (#1265304) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha Sorry, missed that.....IMO, and my breeder's...the best kibble is Eagle Lamb and Rice (no corn, beef or wheat), next best is Iam's Lamb and Rice. Iam's is easier to find than Eagle. Pedigree is known for putting on weight and Come and Get It goes rancid pretty fast. I feed as I do on my breeder's advice....she says NO kibble really has quite enough vitamins in it. You also might try raw fruits and veggies...apple, broccoli, carrot, etc. Anything EXCEPT onion and grapes. Ours love them all; they'll eat anything I give them (but we know they are spoilt rotten) You gave your kids extra vitamins, why not the critters? |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:56 AM (#1265317) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Jeri Have you tried Gravy Train brand dog food. The dry bits have a coating that makes a gravy. When I was a kid, we had a dog, and that stuff smelled pretty good. (It didn't taste nearly as good as it smelled, but I think dogs focus on the smell.) You can mix the Gravy Train with your dog's usual food if it's not enough, nutritionally. Eggs: you take your chances with raw eggs. I don't think dogs are immune to salmonella. Most eggs are fine, but all it would take would be one...ovum roulette. Maybe the pasteurised egg stuff in a carton? |
|
06 Sep 04 - 12:13 PM (#1265327) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Little Hawk If the plate of kibble was put in front of you at the breakfast table, Susan, you'd realize immediately why the dog does not want to eat it. He is clearly more intelligent than the average dog. I recommend feeding him a full human diet without delay. Then try teaching him Math and English. You may have a canine prodigy in your house. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 12:18 PM (#1265330) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha LOL.....Jeri, is it yolks that dogs are never supposed to get? I think so....whites are OK. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 12:29 PM (#1265333) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg LOL, Hardi's preferred brekky is people-kibble.... at least I got HIM to eat brekky! So far not fart/loose-poopies action on what I'm doing... ~S~ |
|
06 Sep 04 - 01:01 PM (#1265355) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Little Hawk My dog never gets the yolks I tell him. He's probably not as smart as Susan's dog. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 01:02 PM (#1265356) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Mudlark Hmmm....my recollection is that feeding raw egg white (w/o the yolk) regularly causes a defficiency, maybe in the B vitamins?...anyway, check before separating. Eggs, cooked or raw, are traditionally given to add lustre to coat, ditto good quality veg. oil. All my guys are chow hounds, but if any finickyness comes up, even a 1/2 teaspoon of oil + warm water usually fixes. An egg a day is pretty rich, I think. And I agree, that raw eggs every day over long period may be taking a salmonella chance. Also agree with Sorcha about kibble ingredients. Dogs are not able to sufficiently digest corn (prime ingredient in most kibble) to get good niutrition. Wheat and rice based kibble much better...since they are better utilized you need to feed less for same wt maintenance (or gain), and there is less, um, waste. And rice based kibble least likely to cause allergic (usually skin) problems. I know that establishment wisdom says don't feed dogs human food. Rubbish, I say. I feed mine leftover veg (and the water veg cooked in), leftover gravy and meat juices in small amounts, anything that is considered healthy human food (except, of course, chocolate). I also give them "PetTabs" supplements. They are never sick, their coats are self-cleanng and lush, and they are not overweight (tho Emily would like to be). One other easy additive you might try is the low salt canned (or boxed) broth (chicken, beef, veg.) now available and not expensive. I bet even a tablespoon of that, w/additional water, would pep up Faulkner's appetite. Good dog! |
|
06 Sep 04 - 04:40 PM (#1265506) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: GUEST,GROK Susan, Rice with egg white--lotsa bad stuff in the yolk. Boil lotsa bones. Should be able to get them fairly inexpensively from the butcher. Use the liquid to make the rice. Add small amounts of cheap meat. Some fats also--oil is good for the coat. Twice a week give a vegetable/rice/meat mix. The dog probably won't like peas. Mine didn't. But she loved everything else. Begin to work the kibble into the mixture at a ratio of food to kibble of 5 to 1. Gradually increase the kibble. Too much dairy is not good for dogs. The pooch should be taking a good vitamin/mineral supplement during this time. Pop the pill into his throat and stroke the throat while holding the jaws closed. Also, it won't hurt to give a cod liver oil gel capsule every day or two. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 04:54 PM (#1265516) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: MaineDog I eat ***ANYTHING*** and everything except ginger. When I am on the shore, I eat mussels, crabs, snails whatever whole, raw. When I am in the yard I eat grasshoppers and that which I ate yesterday if they don't clean up after me. I eat lamb bones, steak bones, t-rex bones, but for some reason they won't let me have cooked chicken bones. I am a lab-shepard mix and I can outswim anything. MD |
|
06 Sep 04 - 08:04 PM (#1265631) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: LilyFestre Hey Susan, A sure fire trick around here is to nuke some peanut butter and water...stir it up and add to the dog food. Unless you have an ultra fussy pooch, cheapy PB works just fine....ours prefer smooth PB. :) It's great protein and higher in calories. Michelle |
|
06 Sep 04 - 08:41 PM (#1265649) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha PB is a great idea. Smells good, adds calories. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 08:50 PM (#1265652) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Qoute="I finally got the dog to eat", i suggest you serve it with a selection of vegetables, though I prefer lamb to eat myself. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 08:57 PM (#1265658) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha Oh dear gods, Sir jOhn...LOL! |
|
06 Sep 04 - 09:01 PM (#1265660) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: GUEST,GROK www.road-kill-cafe.com/roadkill.html or google roadkill cafe menu |
|
06 Sep 04 - 10:27 PM (#1265712) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Joybell My cousin's little dog refuses to eat unless a fluffy, pink toy rabbit it put in the dish and told it can have the food. Then Little Dog flies into a rage, throws the rabbit out of the way and gobbles up the meal quickly. Just a thought. Joy |
|
06 Sep 04 - 10:32 PM (#1265716) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: GUEST,GROK Make it a real rabbit and you'll solve the problem. Just need add a little oil to the diet. |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:05 PM (#1265733) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Our original plan was to feed him on leftover Mudcatter visitors, but the beer fumes put him off, and then we ran out of bodies. ~S~ |
|
06 Sep 04 - 11:09 PM (#1265737) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: SINSULL When Seamus visits, he ignores his dry food until Fred the cat goes over and takes a bit of it. Competition makes the food a lot more palatable. I have put in chicken broth, not buillion (too salty), to make it more interesting. |
|
07 Sep 04 - 12:03 AM (#1265766) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Little Hawk Yes! The toy rabbit idea is apt, because most dogs will develop a very strong appetite the moment there's any competition for their food. So, Susan, you have to get someone else to play the role of attempting to "steal" the dog's food! A cat, another dog, your husband, your cousin, whoever...must appear to be interested in eating the dog's food. Dog will suddenly become ravenous. Problem solved. :-) Either that or improve the quality of the dog's rations, cos like I said, that dog is not stupid. |
|
07 Sep 04 - 12:26 AM (#1265775) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: open mike my dog gets a scoop of each type of Wal;mart dog food: lamb and rice and meaty chunks...(which makes it's own grabvy when moistened.) inever thiught i'd be onewho recommends Mall Wart! |
|
07 Sep 04 - 12:30 AM (#1265777) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Stilly River Sage We had a game we played with our German shorthaired pointer. Her dish sat there with dry food in it, but if you picked up a handful and, one at a time, scooted them across the floor for the cats to chase the dog would always rush in and gobble them up. Even if the cats caught them, they only kicked them until the dog caught the food. Everyone was happy. For a while I used to put some powdered brewer's yeast over the top of her food. It has lots of B vitamins, and those are apparently good in humans (for discouraging mosquitoes) and in dogs (for discouraging fleas). And though I never liked the taste of Brewer's yeast (even orange juice barely masks the taste) the dog loved the stuff. A teaspoon of the powder is probably plenty, as I recall. SRS |
|
07 Sep 04 - 09:17 AM (#1265899) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: The Fooles Troupe A friend had a Rotty. The dog would sit on his own special dog bed in the lounge room with company. When he got bored, he would getup and quietly walk out to the kitchen, take ONE doggie chunk (about the size of the first joint of my thumb) from the dry food bowl, bring it back to his spot, then spend several minutes carefully chewing it. Then he would go back and repeat the process, and again, and again, and again... |
|
07 Sep 04 - 09:54 AM (#1265930) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: jeffp A roommate of mine once had a beagle that was off his feed. His vet told him to give him a squirt of liquid vitamins. That did the trick. I don't remember if he used special doggy vitamins or something like pediacare (children's liquid vitamins). I would definitely suggest clearing it with your vet first before trying it. |
|
07 Sep 04 - 09:59 AM (#1265935) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha There is a dog vitamin product called Fast Start....check it out too. |
|
07 Sep 04 - 10:43 AM (#1265970) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Thanks, everyone. Yes, we tried competition. IMO it's not a question of smarts. It's an instinct array having to do with his perception of his place in the pack. He takes great joy in being given part of our share, even if it's just a crumb of bread, and even greater joy if it's Hardi who gives it to him, cuz he's Hardi's dog. You see this in other behavior as well. It took him awhile to realize that in our pack, I'm #2, not himself.... he had to realize he's sort of perpetually the puppy and I'm the mommy-- he comes to me for comfort but to Hardi for esteem. And Hardi is not usually at home when it's dog supper time, or dog brekky either, and if he is home, he's in need of respite, not dog chores. The SMELL of the food seems to override all the other considerations. Last night I gave him a rinse of the dinner plates. It was too thin and almost didn't work. I'm going to continue to try a variety and combination of the above suggestions to get him into a consistent pattern and then I think habit will keep it going. Thanks, all. ~S~ |
|
07 Sep 04 - 11:43 AM (#1266019) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Uncle_DaveO Susan, when we were at your place last year you had a dog barricaded away from the kitchen, and I understood that he/she/it was rather fierce with strangers. Is this the same dog? Dave Oesterreich |
|
07 Sep 04 - 12:13 PM (#1266037) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg No, Unc, that's Ruby. She's not barricaded exactly-- just has a kennel space (larger than a huge crate) with outdoor access, for times she's not under our supervision in the main part of the house. She's only nippy with people thrusting too-quick friendly hands at her, thanks to early kennel abuse reinforced by overly-friendly children left unsupervised during a Mudcat gathering. She likes her corner, and she eats just fine! Ruby was an adolescent rescue from a puppy mill, had never seen a door or gate swing open in her life, very traumatized, very needy. And a Dalmatian on top of that. (Her picture is with F's in the above link.) She's been socialized to the extent she can be, and spends time with us daily, but we don't put her in situations that make her unhappier. As she ages she's calmer in some respects but less predictable in others. MMario is a special friend of hers and when she makes friends like that, she lets us know how much interaction she wants. In some ways Faulkner is Ruby's dog-- her puppy. She relates better to dogs than to people, and they play and wrestle and sleep together very happily-- both of them grieve if apart for long. Her Dalmatian bounciness works off F's need to run, so they are a great match. But stay out of her corner when it's food time, or she doesn't handle it well-- she likes to be alone with her food or will ignore it-- won't even approach it if someone else is in earshot. So they eat separately. I think the abuse was connected to feding time-- that she was locked in a pen and fed over the gate that never opened. She's so obsessively fastidious that I concluded she must have been forced to pick a pooping-corner in that pen to avoid being awash in filth. She was the runt of her litter-- she's almost toy size, and her spots are liver-color, not black. Her destiny would have been to be the milk-dog for an endless stream of better dogs' litters-- so the better dogs could be re-bred immediately for more litters per year, giving more puppy sales per year. We got her just before her first pregnancy/milk cycle-- she was an adolescent in heat a week after arriving. But by then her mind was pretty warped. ~Susan |
|
07 Sep 04 - 01:22 PM (#1266071) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: GUEST,MMario Ruby-doo is not warped - she's just - eccentric. yea - eccentric. she lets us know how much interaction she wants about 110% of available time under normal circumstances. *grin* |
|
07 Sep 04 - 01:41 PM (#1266084) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Till she's had enough then it's back to the corner! ~S~ |
|
18 Sep 04 - 12:19 PM (#1274997) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Well, what ended up working was: Lamb/rice kibble, with hot water and: Dinner broth from leftovers when possible Sometimes plain fat free yogurt Sometimes tomato juice Rarely, cat-kibble tea Rarely, egg wash Rarely, pulverized-dog-chew tea ... and about half the time, especially at brekky when there are no dinner leftovers left, GRAVY TRAIN! I should mention that most of the weight loss occurred while we were away and he was boarded. Jean runs a great kennel, but F was upset at being there so long-- first time on a stay longer than a weekend-- and didn't eat enough. He came home thin, but not so thin a kennel manager would have spotted it. It took another week, once we were home, before I was sure he was truly not going to eat enough--- looking back on it now, I think the dry kibble just reminded him of the kennel food too much, and along with it, the kennel loneliness/ hunger. His entire demeanor was changed post-boarding too-- needing constant reassurance. Now he's back to his old Big Puppy self, except the cat has taught him how to play with string on a fishing pole without wrestling for it or running off with the pole ("stick!!!"). Faulkner once again looks like a normal, healthy, slender yearling. He sleeps better, is easier to get along with, and enjoys the friendly competition over his bowl, with the cat who joined us about a month ago. The kitty is his brekky inspiration, and Hardi remains his evening inspiration. F has nearly stopped raiding the litterbox, too, and empties his bowl most meals-- after a nice long puppy-burpppp. He's very grateful, too-- comes over to thank me spontaneously at odd moments. Cold weather is rolling down the mountain, so this is solved just in time, and since I leave at the end of October for several weeks, there is also plenty of time for Hardi to pick up the new feeding pattern. Thanks, everyone, for all the options! ~Susan |
|
18 Sep 04 - 08:17 PM (#1275241) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Sorcha Sounds real good, Susan. Glad he's doing OK now. IF he still needs to gain a bit of weight, use low fat cottage cheese instead of the yogurt. Few more calories in it. |
|
18 Sep 04 - 09:39 PM (#1275287) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg OK. But I never buy it. The idea is, he's gotta eat what's already here, because the stores are far away and the paychecks seldom. ~Susan |
|
19 Sep 04 - 09:38 AM (#1275518) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: LilyFestre Hey Susan, Glad to hear that your pup is back and track and eating for you. If he still needs some extra calories, pick up a small jar of peanut butter (cheapy, $1.00 a jar, store brand works just fine)....take maybe 2T, double the water and throw it in the microwave for a minute or so until it gets soft and warm...stir it up and pour it over his food...PB GRAVY! It's the one thing NONE of our 9 dogs EVER refuses....course then you have PB breath kisses...but at least they eat! Our newest pup (9 months old) no longer raids the kitty box either...THANK GOD!!!! He does sneak in to the kitty food when he thinks no one is looking...sometimes no one is looking and he sucks down the entire bowl (big bowl, 6 kitties)! Better that than the cat box! :) Lily |
|
05 Jul 05 - 08:37 PM (#1515618) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg A dog that loves beer can't be ALL stupid-- NA of course. Any harm in this? Next we'll have to try him on Guinness. He BEGS for the last drops of the bottle! ~S~ |
|
05 Jul 05 - 11:24 PM (#1515724) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: dick greenhaus Egg-eating dogs---or "Aig-suckin' dawgs"---were known, in rural American tradition, as "biscuit-eaters". They were generally shot. |
|
06 Jul 05 - 12:53 AM (#1515774) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Ebbie As you may further recall, Dick, an aig-suckin' dawg is a dog that raids the henhouse nests, not one that loves eggs that get broken over his kibbles. And bits. :) |
|
06 Jul 05 - 11:37 AM (#1516226) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Mr Red Did he tell you when he had had une oeuf? |
|
05 Nov 05 - 10:28 AM (#1598015) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg AN UPDATE FOR FRIENDS OF RUBY, A.K.A."Little Ruby Hoobie-Doobie" I noticed, after the Traveling Getaway Gang's recent visit, that Ruby had decided that her corner is no longer enough. Obsessively defensive about the corner, snappy mean to Faulkner, whining when he's out getting attention from people like Leadfingers, and sleeping too much for a dog of her age. Option A: She's got a screw loosened by age; time to go to for the Big Sleep before she hurts someone or gets Faulkner so riled he hurts her, especially when we are not at home. Option B: She's jealous enough to be willing to change. Option B it was, to everyone's relief. So we've been working with her again (as we have many, many times in the past). Techniques that were to no avail, earlier in her life, suddenly work. And I'm only a few months behind her trying to show us. She's up to two hours of nearly calm, continuous presence in the living room, now. I have to keep the connecting door shut or she's gone, running to the familiar corner in 10 minutes. But Faulkner and Atticus (our entirely unflappable cat) are making a fine pack to show her how to chill out. This could not have happened till Faulkner decided the living room is HIS domain (as are we two humans), but she's becoming a DOG, at last. It's gone amazingly easily now that she is motivated. The Pack effect is entirely responsible-- no work really unless I am trying to move about and do chores (which sets her off). The first week was the only rough one-- constantly telling her to sit, and enforcing it. Now she's caught the idea and can copy Faulkner, who is extraordinarily sensitive to whatever tone I set. If I am chilled out, especially under a blanket, the Atticus and Faulkner follow suit. Ruby tries to get Faulkner into her crazy bouncing around, but he ignores her; soon she goes to sit next to him and eventually lies down to enjoy just BEING in a pool of sunshine. Ruby also is no longer paralyzingly fearful when a cat is present, thanks to Atticus' complete calm when she's encountered him unexpectedly, and thanks to witnessing Faulkner nosing him about with no painful response. BUT-- she can remember not to jump all over ME when Atticus is on my lap, and she is learning, because he has slowed her down enough TO learn, that even when he is not there, 50 lbs. of insistent Dalmation is NOT wanted under my chin. Ruby's young enough that given good health, she can look forward to a long and happy second life. We've also expanded their corner in the kitchen, mainly out of the need to winterize to an extreme, this year. Yesterday, Hardi enclosed their approximately 4' square, covered porch, leaving an opening the size of a large doghouse entrance in the leeward wall and closing off the north wind and the howling west wind. It doubles their corner space when the exterior door is left open, as it is left for 9 months of the year. Their water bucket can now be out in the new space, making much more room in the shared corner. The enclosure converts what had been a sunning platform, into the upper floor of a doggie townhouse, since they also enjoy going under the tall porch on hot or rainy days. But the enclosure means that now they can be left outside when we go off all day, except for the coldest days, and get entirely out of the rain, wind, and snow without our leaving their outer door tied open with the wind whistling in. This space also provides shelter for any stray dog I take off the road. These are usually held here for a day or two till the owner can be located (with the county dog warden's happy cooperation). Faulkner and Ruby are always quite happy to host these visiting dogs-- go figure-- but I do need to separate them overnight or if we step out. Still to come in the enclosed space-- openings for glass so they (and we) continue to get the wonderful west and south sunlight we all need. I'll add a walk-off mat as well, and this should greatly reduce the mud/dust tracking in with the dogs (and blowing in from the adjoining dirt road). We thought we were just winterizing, but now that it's up, it's so much more. No more flashing my skimpy jammies at morning motorists when I fill up the water bucket?!? Power to the Pack! ~Susan |
|
05 May 06 - 09:10 PM (#1733710) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Well, the thread is all out of date order now; if you're new to it, it starts with my post of 06 Sep 04 - 09:56 AM. Click printer-friendly up top to sort it out. Anyhoo, it's been on again-off again with Faulkner's eating habits. For awhile I was quite the short-order chef. He'd eat for a day or so and then knock it off again, and I ain't THAT bad a cook. He's gotten very thin again since I found a safe place I can let him run free outdoors for the amount of exercise and exploring he needs. Today saw one more effort to get him to eat regularly, and by God, I may actually HAVE it this time. When he plays with Ruby, he can never seem to hang onto a rope for more than a small tug-- jaws congenitally a bit out of alignment. Well, so I wondered if the big meal every three days is about not wanting to chew up all the kibbles, even wet kibbles. He likes to lap up the meat juice ANY time though. I wish I could put him on wet canned food.... I just can't lug all the cans home to put him on canned meat, never mind the cost and the long trip to the store with today's gas prices. So what I did was, I ground up his Gravy Train and THEN added the water, to make a slurry (not unlike fresh cat-barf in texture which he LOVES; you know, when they eat too fast and toss it back up?). He's lapped up about three servings of it since about 4 PM and has eaten more since then than he ate most of this week! Hell, I can make THAT a week at a time and spoon it out. Hell, I'd even nuke it for him just to see him hold a healthy weight AND get his exercise in. He's sleeping now like a sated snake. ~Susan |
|
05 May 06 - 10:42 PM (#1733759) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg There went another meal of slurry! He's burped happily off to bed-- and I left a batch softening overnight in a crockpot for the morning. That's a total of more than 4 cups of kibble in the last 6 hours plus the water to soften it up. The small, frequent meals have gone down quite nicely. It's like having a growth-spurting teen back under our roof-- except he cleans the plates afterwards. ~Susan (relieved) |
|
06 May 06 - 01:04 AM (#1733844) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Stilly River Sage Don't overdo on the food or you'll give him diarrhea. How much does he weigh now, and what do you consider "normal" for him? SRS |
|
06 May 06 - 10:46 AM (#1734015) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Overdoing-- yes, I know. A few weeks ago at a regular vet visit he was at a good weight for him-- clocked in at 67 pounds. Sparkling, well muscled, bones well covered, but not overweight. He'd been at that state all winter, so we thought we had the problem solved. We'd adjusted calories and quantities for both dogs all winter, to keep up with the cold both outside and in their cool corner. We gave them an extra night time heater for the nights it was needed, cushy dog beds, insulated the floor even more-- they were quite comfortable and happy doggies. But since the outdoor running program started, he'd lost so much and not eaten to keep up with the increased energy demand that his ribs were clearly too visible, spine quite sharply felt, and hips beginning to show through the flesh and fur. But happy, sparkly, playful, and eating what he had been eating-- eating a really big meal about every third day and picking in between despite being offered more to compensate for the increased exercise. We (and the vet) were proceeding on the idea he was simply a picky eater-- but my farm management experience kept telling me there was more to it and that it was a management issue, not a health or temperament issue. We adjusted some of the management issues-- eating alone or in company, cutting out treats, letting him eat when hungry and trusting he'd pick up, adding special sauce, and the like. Each change helped, for a day or two, and then it would be back to the pattern. By this week, he had just gotten too thin-- no smart dog will do that unless there's a reason. He is a smart one, and not otherwise high-maintenance or picky. So-- it had to be the nature of the food, because we had tried everything else suggested here, by the vet, and by our friend who runs the SPCA here. Faulkner agrees. He inhaled a third of the morning crockpot, looking for more-- he'll wait till he digests this lot. A bigger crockpot is going now, for tomorrow and maybe even to store a little. Hopefully, feeding the dog will now become a routine chore instead of the daily circus and worry. And for the summer vacay boarding I should have a working daily ration and not bring home a too-skinny dog. So good! When he's back up to a fighting weight, the running can resume. ~Susan |
|
06 May 06 - 11:46 AM (#1734050) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Stilly River Sage I feed my dog a food called Muenster Natural, but I don't know how widely it is distributed. When I started the pitbull on it she wouldn't eat it all at once and then the ants would get into it so she didn't want it at all. The consistency of the food was that of small pieces, about half the size of a dime. When they came out with the "Big Chunk" in the same variety I tried that and it made a huge difference. These are more along the size of a quarter, and she picks them up easily and would inhale them, nothing left to tempt ants. We feed the dogs once a day, in the morning, after they've gone for a walk. I started the walk because Poppy the Catahoula was barking to be fed, and I needed to condition her to expect something other than food as soon as she saw movement in the house. She loves a walk, but doesn't bark to go for one, so this has worked very well. Then this spring I caught the new season of Cesar Millan's Dog Whisperer and one of the dogs he worked with was a picky eater. He insists that exercise before they eat is a very natural approach to feeding, making them "work for their food." I got there through a different avenue, but I got there, and it works great. When I feed the dogs we've returned from the walk, they're back in their Invisible Fence collars, and they sit on the porch outside the open door while I measure food into their bowls (they get different amounts). They have different shaped bowls and each know their own. I walk out the door and they sit and wait for me to put it down. Once food is on the ground I kneel there and take a handful of food from each dish and I give little muzzle or ear scratches on occasion in a sort of modified hand-feeding. The food is gone in about 90 seconds, then each dog sits and knows the drill--we do a few tricks for the remaining food. This means they're paying attention to me, not the other dog's bowl if one is slower that day. I reinforce the few commands we're working on (mostly "sit" and "stay" and "down" and for Cinnamon "catch" as I toss them into her mouth). After they eat and do their tricks they wag and wiggle and lick and congratulate each other that another day has started and they've had a walk and a good meal. SRS |
|
06 May 06 - 11:51 AM (#1734056) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Hawker Our dog stole a dozen eggs off the kitchen worktop once, I thought we were going to have to move out till he stopped farting, I am sure I could have sold it as a deadly weapon!!!!!!!!! NOOOOOO eggs for mr Hawker! Cheers, Lucy |
|
08 May 06 - 11:44 AM (#1735378) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Well, it was an interesting weekend. Faulkner and I experimented, and I cleaned. I needed to find out how much he would/should eat and how thin the mix needed to be-- too thin was taking too much processing time and stank up the house so bad the people got barfy! And we never got to true doggie-diarhhea, but there was one night of very loose stool to discover yesterday AM.... nice surprise for Hardi at 6 AM on a Sunday morning getting ready to go do church, eh? It took all day to get their corner, the dog beds, the dog rugs, and the cleaning implements all cleaned up, eeeewwwww. Results of various prep approaches and dog reactions-- I'm making a rice-cooker full a day and running a potato masher through it when it's hot and loose, and giving it to him in two divided batches. It amounts to 5 cups kibble steamed in 2-1/2 cups water a day for regaining the weight (4 cups more likely for daily maintenance). This "picky" eater is now wolfing down food as soon as I set it down, looking for more, sleeping like a fat snake, and no more loose stools. The boarding kennel has OKd using this as a daily ration when we vacation, and I can start making extra for the freezer. I think I made it 4 different ways yesterday to see which worked best-- now that I have to down to a reasonable system, I've thrown out the unnecessarily yucky ones! ~Susan |
|
03 Jun 06 - 09:54 AM (#1752139) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg DINNER Rounds!!!!!!!! (Happy doggie!) (Happy mommie and daddie, too) But-- in Googling around for info on them I discovered that one brand of it contains pentobarbital???? What is up with THAT? Also found mixed reviews on the form and content of the food-- so yes I know about that-- ranging from "garbage" to "highly recommended" from breeders and others. (Sans pento.) Also discovered (late) that the vet recommends trying a child-dose of Dramamine for dogs that fret in cars. Says it's a symptom of motion-sickness ("LemmeoutNOWIneedtoBARFoutsidetheCAVE!!!") Says they often give up the fretting on short trips when they've had a couple of good long ones. I guess we'll start to find out tomorrow morning! (No food or water before, and give pill an hour before departure.) I hope he'll be able to walk, and hop by himself into the car he just helped me load all his dog-smelly stuff into.... beds, food, treats, bowls, etc. All Things Faulkner he's been nervously watching me collect for several days. Also hope he's not totally comatose on the 8-hour ride. ~Susan |
|
03 Jun 06 - 10:06 AM (#1752143) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: MaineDog I find that lots of short trips tend to reduce the anxiety that builds on a long trip, especially if the long trip begins in the direction of the vet! So, frequent short trips past the vet without torture are a good learning experience. MD |
|
03 Jun 06 - 10:20 AM (#1752148) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Right-- it was the fact that technique never worked for Faulkner that helped form the possible-motion-sickness picture. It's the short rides everywhere else scare him, especially our hilly and twisty roads here, so WE have never been able to stomach trying a longer trip until now (hopefully!). Actually he's a very lucky dog-- he LIKES going to the vet! He has never had a really bad experience there (yet) and as he likes the people there. And a good thing, because one thing he likes to do in his spare time is visit people at medicine-smelly nursing homes with slippery floors and noises behind closed doors not unlike yelping dogs being hurt. ~Susan |
|
03 Jun 06 - 08:22 PM (#1752422) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: The Fooles Troupe My two cats are now well able to cope with fairly regular 2 hour trips. The spray bottle was a great training aid... :-) When I got the second kitten, both settled easier - they lie curled up together (in the one cane cage which is put on the other front seat, the open weave style door facing me) - the older one likes to reach out and put a paw on either my knee, or the floor gear stick lever! |
|
04 Jun 06 - 10:05 PM (#1753063) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Bonecruncher WYSIWYG:- Regarding your dog's eating habits, I have had a similar experience with a dog so perhaps I may be able to offer some suggestions. After many months of dog weight-loss and many trips to the Vet, stool (turd) samples analysed and blood tests, eventually the dog was diagnosed with partial pancreas failure. As you probably know, the pancreas produces insulin, which regulates blood sugar, and the digestive enzymes lipase, protease and amylase. These last three enzymes are responsible for the breakdown, respectively, of fats, proteins and carbohydrates into substances which can be assimilated through the gut wall, into the blood stream and thence nourish the body. It might be an idea to ensure that your Vet actually HAS done these blood tests at a time when the dog is either off its' food or when it's eating ravenously. If it is off its' food then it might be in pain and when eating ravenously it is probably starving, as any food eaten will pass straight through undigested, affording no nutrition to the body. Usually the production of insulin will be unaffected, so the dog will not be diabetic, although it might be as well for the Vet to check for this at the same time. If partial pancreatic failure should be the cause of the dog's problem this might account for any irrational behaviour in the dog. Poor nutrition can have wide-ranging effects, not just on the body with vitamins, the lack of which caused diseases such as scurvy, rickets and night blindness, but also on the regulation and production of hormones which control behaviour. Studies on young people with a poor diet show that problematic behaviour such as lassitude, aggressiveness, Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder and other anti-social attitudes can be greatly modified by a properly balanced diet. I am not for one moment suggesting that there is fault in the way you feed your dog, just that there is a strong relationship between diet and health. If your dog cannot digest the food you give it there must be an effect on its' health. In particular, it has been shown that if a diet is short in one particular element, usually a "trace element" needed in only minute quantities, the body will ask for some food containing that element. Hence our cravings for particular foods on occasion, especially during pregnancy or recuperation from accident or disease. A dog cannot ask, only by displaying that need as being "picky" over its' food. If it does turn out that your dog has a pancreatic insufficiency the cure is simple. Your Vet can provide you with an enzyme in powder form that you mix with the dog's food. However, you may find you need to try various makes before you find one that is suitable for your particular dog. In other words, some makes will have little or no effect on the dog. The reason for this is that all enzymes in the natural state are made to either a right-handed or a left-handed form, i.e. like a pair of gloves. One form will work while the other, although appearing to be a similar molecule, will not. As an example, Glucose, a natural sugar, is a right-handed molecule (D-Glucose, or Dextro-Glucose) while Sorbitol, an artificial sweetener, is the L (or Laevo) form. Both sweeten tea or coffee but a large dose of Sorbitol (L-Glucose) is given by medics to empty a person's bowels. This it does with remarkable efficiency! I hope the above is helpful to you and to others. Colyn. |
|
05 Jun 06 - 04:53 PM (#1753517) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Scoville My ex-boss/vet's advice has always been to steer clear of foods with cute names (Gravy Train, Kibbles N Bits, Mighty Dog, etc.)--she calls them "McDonald's for pets" and says a lot of them have too much sodium. She tells me Iams is the best brand sold in the grocery store. Purina One comes in second. Mine does really well on Nutro (Senior now that she's old). It's low-filler so her poops aren't as big, but it's not cheap so that may be a problem if you're feeding multiple dogs (I have one 35-lb. dog. Doesn't eat much). I've never heard of a *good-quality* dry food being vitamin-deficient. I'm sure this was true at one time but pet foods have come a long way. However, if a dog will eat them, vegetables (apart from grapes, onions, and garlic) are good. Mine doesn't like plain veggies but loves frozen broccoli and green beans--sort of like chewy ice cubes. We always fed white rice and boiled chicken for GI problems--bland but most dogs will still eat it. Mine spent a week on it a while back when she got a messy spirochete problem, until the antibiotics and Imodium kicked in. LOw-sodium broth over the regular food sometimes works, and there are special "sauces" sold just for dogs. I don't know if they're OK for dogs with sensitive tummies, though. |
|
05 Jun 06 - 04:53 PM (#1753520) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: GUEST My dog has always ate eggs, sadly the wind he releases is foul |
|
11 Jun 06 - 12:35 PM (#1757270) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Thanks for the continued input. Bonecruncher, thanks, but I doubt pancreatic involvement-- it doesn't quite fit the pattern we're observing. F. did quite well on his trip outbound with the Dramamine, and we had a GREAT trip all the way around. The Dramamine took about an hour longer to kick in fully than I had been told, but he was quite peaceful throughout the drive without being knocked out. He mostly slept, but wakened easily and alertly any time there was cause or an opportunity to get out and stretch his legs. But no travel fretting. He did sleep a lot the next day and seemed also to be constipated, but this soon cleared with no ill effect. While we were gone he didn't have much of an appetite, but we let him decide how much he needed to eat. He mostly drank water and played with his hosts a lot. He adjusted very quickly to the new household rules and expectations of his hostess. The first few days he was reluctant to let me out of his sight, but he settled down each night quite happily in his dog bed and awoke eager to go downstairs without me as early as his hosts got up. He hung out and played with them, and he was happy to take a short walk with them each day and to patrol (and visit with me) in their enclosed patio. He didn't treat his "new" quarters as "home" exactly-- didn't bark at passers-by as he would have here at home. He happily rode along (sans Dramamine) on short trips around the neighborhood, even settling down calmly on the sleeping mat (in the van he'd arrived in), whenever we left him parked for a restaurant meal, etc. (And YES he was left ONLY in cool shade with open windows, and checked on often, for these short times.) The trip back home was uneventful except that he was told he was going HOME (a word he knows), and every once in awhile he'd pop up and ask, "Are we THERE yet?!?!?!?" He slept a lot the next day again, and then set to eating lots of Dinner Rounds quite happily. He brought back a few balls and a brush the hosts gave him, as well as a bag of VERY special treats, and through the smells of these he seems to have connected the whole experience up as having had an interesting time. Just having his familiar bed along seemed to be very, very reassuring. Me, I travel with about a dozen various pillows. What's one more (dog bed), and a little doggy suitcase for treats, bowls, etc.-- no big deal, and he now has a whole new diminsion to his life. And I am very pleased to know he is as calm when traveling as he is at home-- there will be motels where he will be very welcome all along our usual routes. Overall, a GREAT training experience. Just long enough, but not too long for him. ~S~ |
|
20 Nov 06 - 07:35 PM (#1889426) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Update Faulkner has held his weight on the Dinner Rounds so well, I can't believe he ever was deemed finicky or underweight, though he was. He still has the same big-eat-every-third-day habit, but eats in between, too. On those hungry days we add a big measure of dry, crunchy stuff and he gobbles it up with the rest (SMALL kibbles). Funny thing, though, now he's developed the ungraceful habit of lounging to eat-- plunks himself down in front of his bowl, paws on either side like a hungry teenage boy, and dines. We tried raising the bowl, but no-- prefers the lounging mode! ~Susan |
|
20 Nov 06 - 07:47 PM (#1889437) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: jeffp Glad to hear he's doing well. I've got a great mental picture of Faulkner taking up entirely too much floor space chowing down. |
|
20 Nov 06 - 08:06 PM (#1889453) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: The Fooles Troupe My two black cats - Spqueak and Bpubble (all cats have a silent 'p') are now so used to travelling regularly - about a 2 hour trip - that they mostly sleep all the time. Only recent hassle was when I woke up Bpubbles and didn't give her time to attend to nature - lucky I had just left my friend's place, and could turn back to fix the smell... They love the chance to visit their mum (& the place where they were born), and she seems to now enjoy their company, as she now seems to prefer not being alone. When I slow down they occasionally ask "are we there yet?" - I cured the original constant howling with the water spray bottle (just the sound and sight is enough if you train them properly!). They travel on the other front seat in their cane cage, and often push their paws out to just touch my leg - until they fall asleep. They are now VERY calm about the whole thing. I think it's better than leaving them home alone - with the neighbour feeding them - they run up to me mewling every time I come home from shopping - and often come onto the house during the day calling to see where I am. I think that once the original fear is overcome, and pleasant memories are attached with the journeys and anticipated destinations, most pets can cope well with comfortable travel. They just need to get used to it - and some mild sedatives at first may be a good idea - travel sickness I'm not an expert on, but MAYBE it could be aggravated by stress. |
|
20 Nov 06 - 08:38 PM (#1889483) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: wysiwyg Jeff, he does like the small spot of clear floor space where we enter or leave the room. Black dog on a dark rug in the dark, like we like it for hockey, often nearly results in pizza on floor. And he don't get no pizza! ~S~ |
|
20 Nov 06 - 09:32 PM (#1889528) Subject: RE: Finally Got the Dog to Eat-- Eggs OK? From: Q (Frank Staplin) Well, I might as well add our practice. Both the breeder and our vet recommended two meals at first for a young puppy, then shifting to one-a day. Our 10-month old is getting one meal now. The recommended 'dry' food is Natural Balance Potato and Duck (21% protein, 10% fat as Canola, with a raft of supplements and vitamins, and the usual fiber). The taste until recently was improved with a couple of spoons of Science Diet Mix-it, again as suggested by the vet, but he is now weaned off that. We have an older dog, who receives a quality dry food balanced for adult dogs (similar to "Science-Diet" brands, but cheaper, not the 'MacDonald's for dogs," as Scoville calls them). Iams is recommended by our vet, but a superstore chain here makes a 'President's Choice' that is very good. Our dogs get an egg once week, when I cook my once-weekly eggs sunny-side up. A little chicken from time to time which they love. Only beef shank bones to chew on. They get cooked broccoli and asparagus, green beans, etc., the part not eaten by us. Yes, this increases gas volume and potency, but smaller amounts are not harmful. If you have noticed, many dogs get their greens by chomping on grass. After all, the animal is an omnivore. |