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05 Dec 04 - 05:09 AM (#1347849) Subject: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST,Ian P I am a lute player who has conme across a small smattering of Morris-related titles in Renaissance lute manuscripts (including a couple of pieces just called 'The Moris' (sic)). Thomas Robinson (nothing to do with 2-4-6-8-Motorway) composed a tune called 'Robinson's May' which has a small half-speed section like a caper, so it got me to thinking: Is this connected with Morris? Is the title significant? Are there 'other'(?) Morris pieces with May in the title? Does this signify Maying customs or a particular style of dancing? Morris dancers please help. Thanks. |
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05 Dec 04 - 06:40 AM (#1347876) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Dead Horse Cotswold style Morris centres its 'eathen practises around this time of year. Something to do with fertility they tell me, but I reckon its got more to do with fleecing the tourists! Mayhap a Cotswold dancer will enlighten further? Dead Horse, (who danced Molly & Longsword & only comes out at xmastide) |
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05 Dec 04 - 06:48 AM (#1347878) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: AllisonA(Animaterra) May is the "sacred" month for morris dancers- traditionally, it's THE month for morris dancing in most traditions. I went to JC's ABC Tunefinder and typed May into the search engine. There are lots of tunes with May in the title; not all I recognize as morris tunes. The ABC library of morris tunes lists some tunes with May in the title: 17th of May 29th of May Not much else in the way of current tunes being used for morris these days. I would be very interested to see/hear the tunes you've found, Ian P! Allison |
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05 Dec 04 - 06:56 AM (#1347882) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST,Ian P I don't know if I can find any sound files of these tunes, Allison, but I will look. I have them in lute tablature, which is similar to guitar tab but with letters instead of numbers (a = open, b = 1st fret etc.) and the rhythm flags are different, needing to be x4 to understand (i.e. a crotchet above the note looks like a semi-quaver, etc.). A lot of lute tab is available nowadays in a progamme called Fromino, which is freely available on the net. I'll go searching now. |
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05 Dec 04 - 07:00 AM (#1347884) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Dead Horse ...it's THE month for morris dancing in most traditions. In Cotswold it is. In Molly, North-West, Rapper & Longsword it aint. Border? Dunno........ "I Dont know about them with bells on, but them with clogs on is Morris Dancers!" |
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05 Dec 04 - 07:29 AM (#1347893) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: treewind Fleecing the tourists? I've never participated in dancing the sun up on Mayday (at about 6am) as many morris teams do, but I doubt if there's many tourists of any description around at that time. Maybe a few bleary-eyed clubbers on the way home, but even that's unlikely in the typical location for a May morning dance out. (e.g. white Rose Morris on the top a a hill in the Pennines at dawn) Not many morris tunes have the month of May in the title, but it is a tradition associated with that time of year. The Whitsun holiday, at the end of May, in particular, is sometimes considered the official start of the season but of course many start well before that - in fact Angel Morris used to dance out on new year's day, but at the more sensible hour of lunchtime pub opening. Anahata |
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05 Dec 04 - 07:34 AM (#1347895) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST,Ian P Here are some links to tunes (sorry, I can't do blue clickies). All pages have midi files and lute tab. 'Robinson's May', Thomas Robinson, from Cambridge University MS Dd 9.33 http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=5224#5224 'The Moris', anon., from the Mynshall Lute Book http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=4110#4110 'Joan to the maypole', anon., from the Margaret Board Lute Book, c. 1630 http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=4037#4037 'Scottish Hunt's Up', anon., from Jane Pickering Lute Book http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=4105#4105 'Kemp's Jig' http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=4036#4036 'Scottish Hunt's Up', anon., from Mynshall Lute Book http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=4103#4103 'Monk's March', anon., Balcarres Lute Book, c. 1690 (?associated with Morris tune?) http://www.internetlutesociety.com/read/messages?id=4088#4088 |
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05 Dec 04 - 10:28 AM (#1347973) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Tradsinger The only one I can think of in Cotswold Morris is "29th of May - a dance from Headington. |
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05 Dec 04 - 11:34 PM (#1348510) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: dianavan I always though Morris dancers were associated with the rites of May which begin on May Eve (The Beltain). |
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06 Dec 04 - 05:25 AM (#1348640) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Liz the Squeak 29th May is Oakapple day, commemorating the preservation of the Monarchy in Britain (Charles II, Roundheads, Cavaliers and spaniels and all that), when Charles hid from Cromwell's forces in an oak tree. It's one of the tunes used for 'All things bright and beautiful'... It's also Manitas' birthday, but don't tell him I said. In Tudor times, for the court and gentry, the whole of May was a holiday. Every day there were activities, hunting, dances, masques and banquets held. High born ladies had a new dress for every day and green was a common colour - it's supposed to mean you are up for a 'romp in the hay' as it were..... It was a good time to get pregnant, because the 1st semester (with the morning sickness & greatest danger of miscarriage) would be over by harvest time so you could help out. You'd be living off the harvest for the next semester and by the final semester, you'd have little heavy work to be done, lots of dark nights to rest up in, and by the birth, it would be Feb/March. After that, the baby would be living off your milk and you would be getting the best of what was left, but, with Spring just around the corner, the food was increasing again, and when the baby was ready for solids, it would be summer again with lots of good, healthy food around. All part of lifes' rich wossname and today's pointless information. LTS |
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06 Dec 04 - 06:50 AM (#1348675) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST Dancing on the top of a hill at 6am? What woosses. In Bedfordshire we're waiting for sunrise & are up the top of the hill at Katherine's Cross Ampthill, by 5.20am ready for the sunrise. Seriously though, the tradition of dancing the May in of course has now been 'rationalised', like so many other things we do that we do in folk today, there must be a traditional reason for doing something, instead of just going & doing it because you simply enjoy it & it is there to be done. Why not just go out & do whatever is your enjoyment. If we have a team we go out more or less any time we're asked, next weekend it's for a local Xmas fair, then we usually do Boxing Day with the Mummers, then Plough Monday as well. Do we care about not being 'Cotswold Morris PC'? Not on your Nellie. We don't do it for academic reasons I'm afraid but for the enjoyment. As for fleecing the tourists, the usual audience we have are all the usual stalwarts from the area, partners & a few bemused early morning dog walkers & joggers. |
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06 Dec 04 - 07:20 AM (#1348689) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: manitas_at_work The Month of May aka Follow the Drum is a tune used in the Brackley tradition (I think!). |
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06 Dec 04 - 07:43 AM (#1348699) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST,T-boy LIZ - very informative and not pointless. But ... 'semester' ? This comes from the latin for 6 months. An 18 month pregnancy ? Sooner you than me. |
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06 Dec 04 - 08:15 AM (#1348718) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Liz the Squeak I meant Trimester.. I was trying to put it in words the Yoosas would understand and that us Yookers are familiar with.. but being as how I'm a bit fragile (absolutely nothing to do with the grand session yesterday), I got it wrong. However, as anyone who has ever been pregnant will tell you, it bloody feels that long! (Especially if, like me, you get the morning sickness all day long and for all 9 months!) LTS |
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06 Dec 04 - 12:05 PM (#1348912) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Folkiedave For a picture of Sheffield City Morris fleecing the tourists as only they can, take a look at the third picture down on: http://www.citymorris.f9.co.uk/Gallery.htm Best regards, Dave Eyre |
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06 Dec 04 - 02:24 PM (#1349045) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Tradsinger In the Cotswolds, the Morris Tradition is very much at the end of May. It used to be that all the teams danced on Whit Monday, but that has now transmogrified to the "Late May Bank Holiday", i.e the last Monday in May when most of the Cotswold sides turn out. That's according to tradition but these days of course, they turn out all the summer, roughly coinciding with the cricket season. A lot of teams now turn out on 1st May, but that's a new tradition. Nothing to do with Beltane, which I believe is something Celtic. Gwilym |
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06 Dec 04 - 02:42 PM (#1349055) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: McGrath of Harlow Elephants have pregnancies lasting 18 to 22 months. You don't get many Elephant Morris Dance Sides, which is rather a pity. I think they'd be good, though they'd have to miss out the leaping bits, since they don't go in for humping. There is this side though - Elephant Up A Pole, from Coventry. |
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06 Dec 04 - 02:45 PM (#1349059) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: McGrath of Harlow "Humping"? I meant "jumping". (Otherwise the 18-month pregnancy issue would not arise.) |
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06 Dec 04 - 03:18 PM (#1349091) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: dianavan Tradsinger - You're right about English Morris Dancing. From the English Folk Dance site, I found this: "It came to England in the late 1400s, probably from Spain, but it's history up to that point is another separate topic." |
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06 Dec 04 - 03:22 PM (#1349095) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: dianavan ...and from the History of Morris: "Three origin theories have been proffered: It is derived from pre-Christian "fertility" dancers. A late 19th century theory based on a rationalization of the dance form (comparative studies of ritual and myth by the likes of Sir James Frazer and supported by Mary Neal, Cecil Sharp, and D'Arcy Ferris). (e.g. Handkerchief ward off evil, high jumps make crops grow, etc.). It derives from Spain or the "Moors", hence Morisco or Moorish dancing. A theory dating to at least 1730 or earlier, but no evidence to support this, it seems to be just be a link in names. It is from France or Flanders and was introduced during the reign of Edward III (1327-1377) or Henry V or VI, when many English lords and soldiers were in those countries. The first reference to this idea is in the mid 1800s. |
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07 Dec 04 - 02:10 PM (#1350110) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Little Robyn dianavan, all these theories seem to date from 18th and 19th C. So where does William Kemp fit in? href="http://www.mtsn.org.uk/staff/staffpages/cer/hamlet/theMorris.html">Here? Robyn |
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07 Dec 04 - 02:47 PM (#1350164) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST,Ian P Liz the Squeek - thanks a lot, the info you gave is most likely to be what was on Thomas Robinson's mind. William Kemp was definitely a Morris dancer. We know that as he called himself one. The Elizabethan tune Kemp's Jig, most known now for its appareance in lute mss., though some Morris sides also play it. |
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08 Dec 04 - 06:04 AM (#1350774) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Little Robyn Try again http://www.kichu.com/kemp/morris.html" I can't make the blue clickies work today! Robyn |
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08 Dec 04 - 05:49 PM (#1351344) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: TheBigPinkLad The May in 'Robinson's May' could have the little-used poetic meaning of 'maiden.' It's still listed in the Oxford E.D. |
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08 Dec 04 - 06:36 PM (#1351385) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: GUEST,Claymore It's interesting to hear that the end of May is the Morris dancing period for some locations. Here in Shepherdstown, WV, it is definitiely the 1st of May that is celebrated. There is a parade of the visiting Morris teams and the procession is lead by the Town's Mayor holding a giant flowered staff with the God and Goddesses of Fertility (who by tradition in the Town, are the oldest residents to never have had offspring - the Town is noted for such quirks). The rest of the parade is made up of college girls dressed up as the Muses, the Green Man and the Unicorn, the Maypole Bearers and several bands. Once the Maypole is set and danced, the Green Man examines the weave of the Pole and pronounces whether the coming year will be good or not, depending on the quality of the weave. Then the day is set for Morris dancing almost all day, with Stands being held all over the Town and the major roads to the Town being blocked off, by the State Police. There are even several teams of young girls (called naturally, the Morris Mini's) who dance with flowered garlands. It is truely interesting to see how the various traditions of May and Morris dancing are set out. |
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08 Dec 04 - 08:06 PM (#1351452) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Azizi I have regret that I never had the pleasure of seeing actual or even videotape of Morris dancers, but I find your discussion interesting. Last year in one of my scavenger hunts at a used book store, I was pleased to find a 1935 book "The Traditional Dance" {Violet Alford & Rodney Gallop: London; Methuen & Co.} I believe that excerpts from this book may add to the discussion. "The Traditional Dance" starts out with a discussion on the three "arms" of the authors' journey to witness traditional dances. They write that "The first arm points to a snowy landscape and said 'Mummers and Sword dances" The second is marked 'Morris' and indicates a lane green with the greenery of May. The third, marked 'Country dances', points to no lane at all, but to a long hall lit with candles and lined with red rout seats. But at the end of {the room? page torn} you can see through an open window a tall Maypole with a rowdy throng about it, farther off people stepping {? page torn} Hornpipes, Jigs and Reels to the sound of Irish popes, ndbeyond again, on short Scottish turf, men treading Sthrathspeys, Reels, and swaggering solos, swinging their kilts like the skirts of a ballerina. {pps xiv-xv}. end of quote "The Traditional Dance" also includes a number of passages on the origin of the term "Morris". I will quote rather extensively from one of these passages: "When we were speculating on the origin of the Morris dance in the last chapter we saw that Cecil Sharp, having accepted the theory of Moorish orign [i.e. from the Moors], came later to reject it. His principal reason for doing so was that by 1912 he had come to realize that all over Europe the dance does not satnad by itself, but is associated with 'certain strange customswhich are apparently quite independent of the dance itself.'. Drom this he concluded that 'the Morris dance is a development of a pan-European or even more widely extended custom', and that 'faces were not blackened because the dancers represented Moors, but rather the dancers represented Moors because their faces were blackened'. It never occured to Sharp to connect the Mooris dance with the numerous cermonial combats between 'Christains' and 'Moors', all more or less choreographic in form, which are found throughout southrn Europe, from Dalmatia in the east to Portugal in the west. Perhaps he had no opportunity of hearing of them, but a connection with the Morris is evident from their appelation of Morisca,,Morisma, Moreska, Mouriscada or some similar name. The Moreska, performed every year in September in the Dalmatian island of Korcula {Curzola}, consists of a play and Sword dance prepresenting a combat between two groups of dancers, a White King {Christain] contendeing with a Black King {Moorish} for the hand of a beautiful slave called Bula. Needless to say, as in all such mock battles, the Christians emerge victorious. In Spain, the battle of Moors and Christains goes back at least to the twelfth century, one such having been performed in 1137 at the betrothal of Count Ramon Berebguer of Barcelona and Queen Petronila of Aragon. Aragon, as has already been stated, is still to-day [1935] a land of Morisca dances, and a few more striking performances could be found than the Morisma of Ainsa. This takes place in the middle of September every year...." end of quote. Well! As I said this is all new to me, but I would love to know more about it. For instance, do some Morris dancers still blacken their faces? As an aside, there is a group of African Americans who call themselves "Moors" and believe that "Moors" is the proper referent for all African Americans. If I understand their statement of beliefs correctly, members of that group, The "Moorish Science Temple", say that their nationality is "Moors" and their religion is Islam. Traditionally, members of that group adopt Arabic names for themselves if they were not raised in that culture, and give their children Arabic names. Befire divorce and other cultural adaptations, and non-adherance to tradition, members could be recognized by those who were aware of the group by the fact that the suffix "El" or "Bey" or "Ali" was either affixed to their "European" surname {such as Johnson-El} or used alone. Note: this was not the same group that Muhammad Ali or Malcolm X {El Hajj Malik Shabazz} belonged to. Before I sign off, can anyone recommend any videos on Morris dancing? Thanks, Azizi |
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08 Dec 04 - 08:18 PM (#1351471) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Azizi Sorry, the first excerpt should read "Irish pipes and about..." I guess there were "Irish popes" but I don't know about that either. |
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08 Dec 04 - 08:28 PM (#1351479) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Azizi After re-reading my first post here, I am simply filled with awe at the number of typos I made. This must be a record. Even what I quoted has typos!! Hopefully, you can make sense out of that post. My intention was honorably, and I can only blame the fact that I've been rushing around all day and need to take time to cool out. Maybe I should learn how to do a Morris dance. I gather from your comments that these dances are quite energetic, but maybe because of that they are good stress reducers... Again, sorry. Azizi |
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09 Dec 04 - 03:22 AM (#1351722) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Manitas_at_home Try http://www.dantzak.com/ for Spanish morris dancing For dances from all over the place try http://www.dancilla.com/search.asp?LANGU=EN It's a bit hard to find morris dances on there but if you search for dances from England and look at the videos there are a few |
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09 Dec 04 - 03:42 AM (#1351728) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: pavane William Kemp, a contemporary of Shakespeare, danced a Morris Jig from London to Norwich in 9 days, and then wrote a book about it. He was accompanied by his pipe & taborer. This is the origin of the phrase 9 day wonder (or 9 daies as he spelled it). This was actually 9 days of dance spread over the period of a month, and he was accompanied for much of the time by spectators and other dancers (including women). He did seem to do it properly, because after accepting a ride into town to lodgings at the end of one day, he returned to resume at the place where he had previously stopped. |
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09 Dec 04 - 04:24 AM (#1351749) Subject: RE: 'May' in Morris dancing? From: Malcolm Douglas Violet Alford's books, though interesting, are now rather outdated in their scholarship. A lot of better documented work has been done in the last 70 years which makes much of her commentary both redundant and misleading. See, for example, Mike Heaney's An Introductory Bibliography on Morris Dancing for references. Historically, "Moors" were the peoples of North Africa. I'm not sure why an African American group would want to extend that to include all Americans of African descent, unless perhaps for ideological and/or religious reasons of their own. |