Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio

21 Oct 05 - 11:22 PM (#1588159)
Subject: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

I am limited to dial-up service where I live and enjoy tuning in to internet radio. I can listen to those stations that broadcast via Real Audio with no problem but not to those using WMP, they keep cutting out.
I've looked but cannot find any place to manually change settings in WMP, I believe it is supposed to make the settings automatically for you. Is this the problem? Any ideas?

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22 Oct 05 - 01:49 AM (#1588216)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

Real Audio SUCKS!

Then again, so does WMP...

Get JetAudio

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22 Oct 05 - 08:23 AM (#1588352)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

Clinton

If the station is broadcasting in a particular format aren't I limited to receiving in that format.

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22 Oct 05 - 12:07 PM (#1588459)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: JohnInKansas

"If the station is broadcasting in a particular format aren't I limited to receiving in that format."

The answer to this one is a sort of "yes or no" but mostly "yes."

The broadcast server can use any of several "encoding codecs" to translate the audio/vidio into a file format that's sent to you. You use any of several "decoding codecs" to translate the file(s) received into something that's played by your computer.

A broadcaster that says it's sending Real Audio (RA) usually will encode to the standard Real Audio file type(s), usually .ra for audio, and Windows Media Player can't play those files. The broadcaster could encode to any other filetype that Real Audio can play and one of these might also be decoded by other players; but there are extremely limited choices of "overlapping" file types, and they don't often deliver as good a sound/video quality as the dedicated filetypes.

The same sort of situation exists for a Windows Media Player (WMP) broadcaster. There are a number of choices for WMP encoding codecs, but few of these produce files that are readily decoded by RA decoding codecs.

Media Advice Archive for Windows Media Player includes comment:

RealNetworks. The Player can't play files with .ra, .rm, and .ram file name extensions. RealPlayer from RealNetworks is required to play these files.

This web page also includes a summary of which filetypes WMP can and cannot play, so you might want to take a look at it or tag it for future reference. I haven't looked to see whether RA has similar information easily available.

Either player, RA or WMP, should be able to look automatically for any playback codec that's compatible, that doesn't happen to be present on your machine, and that's available on the player's preferred download site(s). Rarely one of the players will download a codec that interferes with the other player. Usually any such interference will be "repaired" (or replaced by some other interference) when the other player pushes an update on you.

Since the file types the players are designed to use are proprietary, any other player that wants to let you play them has to pay money in order to (legally) include the codecs to read them. This is an immense technological barrier to development of any one player that plays everything.

John

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22 Oct 05 - 12:26 PM (#1588468)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

I've yet to find a streaming format that JetAudio won't play...

:-)

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22 Oct 05 - 01:56 PM (#1588508)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

OK I'll try JetAudio, thanks for your input.

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22 Oct 05 - 02:50 PM (#1588536)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Bill D

also!! Real Alternative

and

Media Player Classic are free, **open source** ways to play these files and avoid Real and Microsoft altogether.

I have those PLUS Jet Audio that Clinton recommends, and I haven't needed those others for years!

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22 Oct 05 - 06:51 PM (#1588642)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

Jet Audio playes Real Streams, so what need Real Alternative?

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22 Oct 05 - 08:56 PM (#1588704)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: The Fooles Troupe

It does more?

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22 Oct 05 - 09:09 PM (#1588710)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

More than what?

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22 Oct 05 - 11:43 PM (#1588791)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Bill D

I must say that although Jet Audio plays about anything you need, the learning curve thru the interface 'can' be a bit confusing...you gotta remember what teeny little spots to click for different processes, and they don't label 'em clearly.....but with a little practice, it WILL do amazing tricks....and if you make it your default player, a lot of the stuff just happen automatically.

Me, I'm crazy.....I like playing with different programs with different looks, and sometimes I use a different one just to SEE all the different looks! But I will say, that with Media Player Classic and Jet Audio, you can play almost anything. Now if you want to SAVE songs and have a database you can browse, there are several other programs that are sorta better for RE-playing stuff.....details by request.

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23 Oct 05 - 02:43 AM (#1588830)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: The Fooles Troupe

So why stop there, as the Actress said to the Bishop?

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23 Oct 05 - 10:30 AM (#1588980)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

"the learning curve thru the interface 'can' be a bit confusing..."

Looks like a typical stereo faceplate to me...

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23 Oct 05 - 10:39 AM (#1588982)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

I got JetAudio but am running into the same situation ,a couple of seconds of reception then buffering. My assumption is that this is happening because these stations are broadcasting at high speed, because JetAudio is working OK with those stations that play with RealAudio.

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23 Oct 05 - 11:07 AM (#1588990)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

Yes... it sound like your main problem is that you are as you said above, "limited to dial-up service"....

Is there a reason you can't get broadband?

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23 Oct 05 - 12:00 PM (#1589011)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

DSL is not available in the rural area where I live I suppose I could get wireless broadband but can't afford it.

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23 Oct 05 - 01:00 PM (#1589039)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Bill D

ahhh..too bad. I remember trying to do music and streaming on dial up, and 'sometimes' getting it to buffer enough......and I had a pretty good dial-up that gave me near 56 baud.

eventually they will get to you...

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23 Oct 05 - 01:28 PM (#1589051)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: GUEST,.gargoyle

They are reviewing placing broadband on power-lines - however, there are problems with radio interference - Motorola may have solved the problem.

However, until that day comes may I suggest modem on shortwave radio... it is excellent for remote parts of the world and those that want to stay online. A friend used it on the "junk steamer trip around the world."

PACKET RADIO is one option: Wikipedia def http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Packet_radio

WIN LINK was a useful tool during hurrican Katrina in NO - http://winlink.org/

Sincerely,
Gargoyle

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23 Oct 05 - 05:19 PM (#1589189)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

"DSL is not available in the rural area where I live I suppose I could get wireless broadband but can't afford it."

I feel your pain chum....

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23 Oct 05 - 06:35 PM (#1589252)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: The Fooles Troupe

After some time testing, they are now rolling out Broadband Over Power in Tasmania.

It is rumoured that the more technically difficult Broadband Over Gas is still in the testing stage.

I'm not making this up you know. Well, not all of it...

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23 Oct 05 - 07:49 PM (#1589300)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

Being curious, I asked my son-in-law who is in the boondocks beyond broadband service. His satellite charges are Canadian $85/mo. and installation of his equipment was $900 Can.
He says if one is in reach of cellphones (he is about a mile from reception), wireless with them is much cheaper.

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23 Oct 05 - 09:45 PM (#1589389)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: GUEST

In short = line up your requests - go to bed - read a leasure in the morning.

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23 Oct 05 - 09:49 PM (#1589390)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

What's a leasure?

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24 Oct 05 - 12:08 AM (#1589423)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Q (Frank Staplin)

Line up requests? Put my request for a single malt at the head of the list.
Short wave- I retired my old National HRO, which did yeoman service in WW2. Should I hook it up again, Gargoyle? All those tubes to check!

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24 Oct 05 - 02:12 AM (#1589438)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

"Should I hook it up again"

doubtful....

One'd have to be pretty hard up to worry about getting internet over shortwave for personal use...

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24 Oct 05 - 02:19 AM (#1589440)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: GUEST

Before I had broadband I was in much the same position, there were internet stations on
Real Audio which I couldn't get at all and some on WMA which dropped out frequently. I always
record anyway because most of the broadcasts from Europe or the USA are at the wrong time for
me to listen 'live.' My software displays the recording as a waveform and the dropout portions
show up as flatlines so, with a little care, it is possible to eliminate those sections by
highlighting and deleting them as one does with text. Of course, if the dropouts are VERY frequent
it can be a real pain to get rid of them all, but it IS possible and I did it for several years.

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24 Oct 05 - 02:17 PM (#1589829)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: bobad

This is the explanation I got from Bell, my ISP, as to why I can't get broadband. Can anyone translate it.


It appears that at the moment, we are unable to provide DSL to your home. Unfortunately, your line is on loaded plant. The load coils are required on extra long run of telephone cable (local loops exceeding 18,000 feet in length) to improve and ensure the voice quality of a phone line. What this loading does is to insert inductance in a local loop circuit to offset the effect of capacitance in the cable. This prohibits digital signals and ADSL signals from passing through the load coils. Unfortunately, we can't remove the loading in this case because of the way the network is designed. This affects a number of lines within your area. Given the distance along the line from our serving point, the provisioning of ADSL would have provided only marginal signal strength at best

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24 Oct 05 - 02:25 PM (#1589834)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: Clinton Hammond

In basic plain english... You live to far away from the main junction box to get a decent DSL signal....

No cable TV I assume?

You might be SOL for now...

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24 Oct 05 - 04:30 PM (#1589946)
Subject: RE: Tech: Internet Radio WMP vs. Real Audio
From: JohnInKansas

At Demo Overview the WMP guys offer several "demos" purported to demonstrate the superiority of Windows Media Player over other audio/video players and formats.

The intent here strikes me sort of as a "who cares" kind of thing, however -

If you really are using WMP and are having trouble, the demos might help you sort out which kinds of downloads might work and which ones won't work on your setup. Be aware that most, but not all, of the demos carry the note "requires a high speed connection." The demos also are intended to show the latest (WMP 9 and later) doing "really great" stuff, so they may not be fully representative of "ordinary sources."

Those using alternative programs/codecs might be able to try out the demos there to see whether their program really does do "everything" that WMP claims to do. Of course they may have rigged them to play only with WMP. I have no idea whether the demos may look only for your WMP or whether they'll work with another player.

Not a recommendation. Just a note that it's there.

John

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